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Ranking the rooks -- 2004 vs 2005 vs 2006 (1 Viewer)

purplehaze67

Footballguy
I've got both the 2004 and 2005 draft guides here, and here is how the top-10 at each position both years stacks up. 2005 rooks in bold:

QB

Overall grade 2004 B

Overall grade 2005 C

8.9 Ben Roethlisberger, Miami OH

8.8 Eli Manning, Mississippi

8.8 Aaron Rodgers, Cal

8.6 Alex Smith, Utah

8.4 Philip Rivers, NC St

8.0 J.P. Losman, Tulane

7.9 Charlie Frye, Akron

7.8 Andrew Walter, Arizona St

7.4 Jason Campbell, Auburn

6.8 Dan Orlovsky, Connecticut

6.8 Matt Schaub, Virginia

6.7 Derek Anderson, Oregon St

6.4 Kyle Orton, Purdue

6.1 John Navarre, Michigan

5.9 David Greene, Georgia

5.7 Josh Harris, Bowling Green

5.4 Walter Washington, Temple

5.2 Cody Pickett, Washington

4.9 Matt Mauck, LSU

4.6 Ryan Dinwiddie, Boise St

RB

Overall grade 2004 B

Overall grade 2005 A-

8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004 ranking)

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St

7.1 Eric Shelton, Louisville

7.0 T.A. McClendon, NC St

6.9 Cedric Cobbs, Arkansas

6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame

6.6 Walter Reyes, Syracuse

6.5 Anthony Davis, Wisconsin

6.4 Quincy Wilson, W Virginia (says 3.4, but I'm assuming that's a typo)

6.2 Marion Barber, Minnesota

6.1 Michael Turner, N Illinois

5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St

WR

Overall grade 2004 A

Overall grade 2005 B+

8.9 Mike Williams, USC (2004 rating)

8.9 Larry Fitzgerald, Pittsburgh

8.7 Braylon Edwards, Michigan

8.7 Roy Williams, Texas

8.6 Mike Williams, USC (2005 rating)

8.5 Troy Williamson, S Carolina

8.4 Reggie Williams, Washington

8.4 Michael Clayton, LSU

8.2 Mark Clayton, Oklahoma

8.1 Lee Evans, Wisconsin

7.9 Chris Henry, W Virginia

7.9 Michael Jenkins, Ohio St

7.6 Devery Henderson, LSU

7.5 Roddy White, UAB

7.4 Fred Gibson, Georgia

7.2 Bernard Berrien, Fresno St

7.2 Craphonso Thorpe, Florida St.

7.1 Terrence Murphy, Texas A&M

7.0 Reggie Brown, Georgia

TE

Overall grade 2004 C+

Overall grade 2005 C

8.7 Kellen Winslow, Miami

8.5 Heath Miler, Virginia

8.3 Ben Troupe, Florida

7.8 Ben Watson, Georgia

7.6 Alex Smith, Stanford

6.6 Ben Utecht, Minnesota

6.5 Kevin Everett, Miami

6.2 Garrett Cross, Cal

6.1 Jason Peters, Arkansas

5.9 Joel Dreessen, Colorado St

5.7 Steve Fleming, Arizona

5.7 Ben Hartsock, Ohio St

5.5 Chris Cooley, Utah St

5.4 Adam Bergen, Lehigh

5.2 Ronnie Ghent, Louisville

5.1 David Kashetta, Boston College

4.8 Alex Holmes, USC

4.8 Sean Ryan, Boston College

4.4 Eric Knott, Michigan St

4.4 Keith Willis, Virginia Tech

Here is what the numerical grades mean:

9.0 - 8.0 = Franchise player.

7.9 - 7.0 = Potential Pro Bowl player.

6.9 - 6.0 = Could start as a rookie.

5.9 - 5.0 = Eventual starter.

4.9 - 4.0 = Quality backup.

3.9 - 3.0 = Chance to make roster.

2.9 - 2.0 = Not likely to make roster.

1.9 - 1.0 = Free agent possibility.

 
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Boone22

Footballguy
8.7 Kellen Winslow, Miami8.5 Heath Miler, Virginia
Is Heath Miller rated that highly? Since I don't follow college football I'm curious as to how he'd rank against the TEs of the last few years (Winslow, Shockey, Troupe, Heap, etc...). I didn't think he'd rank that high...
 

ILoveMyLions

Footballguy
Going along with the theme here, I was curious what the backs would rate going back even further. I have the TSN books back to 2001 and here's how the RBs rated. (The 2001 draft guide rates on a 8 point scale instead of 9 so I added nine points to make the grades more comparable)2001-2005 combined (top five for each year)8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas (2005)8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn (2005)8.6 Duece McAllister, Mississippi (2001)8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn (2005)8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St (2004)8.4 William Green, Boston College (2002)8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech (2004)8.1 Larry Johnson, Penn State (2003)8.1 T.J Duckett, Michigan State (2002)8.1 Michael Bennett, Wisconsin (2001)8.1 Clinton Portis, Miami (2002)8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida (2005)8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan (2004)7.9 Lee Suggs, Virginia Tech (2003)7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St (2005)7.8 LaDanian Tomlinson, TCU (2001)7.8 Deshaun Foster, UCLA (2002)7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004)7.6 Lamont Jordan, Maryland (2001)7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St (2004)7.5 Onterrio Smith, Oregon (2003)7.4 Travis Henry, Tennessee (2001)7.2 Chris Brown, Colorado (2003)7.0 Lamar Gordon, North Dakato St. (2002)6.5 Musa Smith, Georgia (2003)Other Top Notables:7.1 Kevan Barlow, Pittsburgh (2001, Ranked #7)6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame (2004, Ranked #7)6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St. (2004, Ranked #10)5.7 Brian Westbrook, Villanova (2002, Ranked #10)5.3 Rudi Johnson, Auburn (2001, Ranked #11)4.5 Domanick Davis, LSU (2002, Ranked #13)Benson and Brown are the highest rated back in the last five years by the Sporting News and Willilams is tied with Duece...interesting... :shock:

 

Finatic

Footballguy
8.7 Kellen Winslow, Miami

8.5 Heath Miler, Virginia
Is Heath Miller rated that highly? Since I don't follow college football I'm curious as to how he'd rank against the TEs of the last few years (Winslow, Shockey, Troupe, Heap, etc...). I didn't think he'd rank that high...
I think from a talent perspective he is right where he belongs,Not as good as KW2,but a notch above Troupe and Watson.....
 

Crazy8s

Footballguy
8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas (2005)

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn (2005)

8.6 Duece McAllister, Mississippi (2001)

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn (2005)

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St (2004)

8.4 William Green, Boston College (2002) Franchise player

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech (2004)

8.1 Larry Johnson, Penn State (2003)

8.1 T.J Duckett, Michigan State (2002)

8.1 Michael Bennett, Wisconsin (2001)

8.1 Clinton Portis, Miami (2002)

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida (2005)

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan (2004) Franchise player

7.9 Lee Suggs, Virginia Tech (2003) Potential Pro Bowl player

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St (2005)

7.8 LaDanian Tomlinson, TCU (2001)

7.8 Deshaun Foster, UCLA (2002)

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004)

7.6 Lamont Jordan, Maryland (2001) Potential Pro Bowl player

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St (2004)

7.5 Onterrio Smith, Oregon (2003)

7.4 Travis Henry, Tennessee (2001)

7.2 Chris Brown, Colorado (2003)

WOW...with this list you would think that I should feel ALOT more confident with my RBs :( :( :no:

 
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placeholder10391

Footballguy
Can someone add in the guys from the couple years before. I want to see how this year's backs rate with respect to guys like Edge, Ricky, Jamal, etc.Thanks.

 

noneother

Footballguy
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
I am no "pro" on the rankings... but I am inclined to believe that EVERYTHING is considered.. which makes the ranking more "iffy" to me..McGahee's injury looks like it WAS considered (never knew if he would come back or not, really, right??)

and this years QBs, still don't come off to me as top notch, but I think scarcity impacts the rankings too..

lotsa RBs in the McGAhee year.. Suggs, Brown, Smith, Johnson et al

just makes me think these 3 backs might be really special, year of the QB... year of the RB...

oh and using my Ipod right now, thanks for the advice... I now check every diet dew bottle cap before purchase :devil:

 

goonsquad

Think different.
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
oh and using my Ipod right now, thanks for the advice... I now check every diet dew bottle cap before purchase :devil:
:hijack:The best was when they had the free songs on the Slurpee cups at 7-11. The free songs really helped me justify my Slurpee addiction! :P

Glad you're digging the iPod! :thumbup:

:/hijack:

 

placeholder10391

Footballguy
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
oh and using my Ipod right now, thanks for the advice... I now check every diet dew bottle cap before purchase :devil:
:hijack:The best was when they had the free songs on the Slurpee cups at 7-11. The free songs really helped me justify my Slurpee addiction! :P

Glad you're digging the iPod! :thumbup:

:/hijack:
:re-hijack:You got a free iPod off a soda bottle?

:/re-hijack:

 

noneother

Footballguy
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
oh and using my Ipod right now, thanks for the advice... I now check every diet dew bottle cap before purchase :devil:
:hijack:The best was when they had the free songs on the Slurpee cups at 7-11. The free songs really helped me justify my Slurpee addiction! :P

Glad you're digging the iPod! :thumbup:

:/hijack:
:re-hijack:You got a free iPod off a soda bottle?

:/re-hijack:
no, just the music
 

ILoveMyLions

Footballguy
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
TSN's draft guide came out only a few months after the surgery he had on his ACL, appeared to be out at least a year to a year and a half and before his workout where he impressed the scouts. They were not able to factor those things in. No question that prior to the injury, he was the number 1 back and would have scored high. I disagree with some of TSN's rankings every year, but that one is difficult to be critical of because McGahee proved in the two months leading to the draft that he was recovering very quickly. By then, the guide had been out for quite some time.
 

ILoveMyLions

Footballguy
Can someone add in the guys from the couple years before. I want to see how this year's backs rate with respect to guys like Edge, Ricky, Jamal, etc.

Thanks.
I had the 2000 draft guide as well but can't find it...anyone else have it?
 

goonsquad

Think different.
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
TSN's draft guide came out only a few months after the surgery he had on his ACL, appeared to be out at least a year to a year and a half and before his workout where he impressed the scouts. They were not able to factor those things in. No question that prior to the injury, he was the number 1 back and would have scored high. I disagree with some of TSN's rankings every year, but that one is difficult to be critical of because McGahee proved in the two months leading to the draft that he was recovering very quickly. By then, the guide had been out for quite some time.
Where do you think he would have ranked before the injury, in comparison to the top backs of the past two years (K. Jones, Jackson, Brown, Williams, Benson). On par with or higher?
 

Tick

Footballguy
Okay, here are the RBs from PFW:Benson 6.75Brown 6.70Jackson 6.70Kevin Jones 6.60CWilliams 6.55Greg Jones 6.00Chris Perry 5.99Fason 5.85Shelton 5.70Julius Jones 5.55Bell 5.50Now TSN:8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004 ranking)7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St7.1 Eric Shelton, Louisville7.0 T.A. McClendon, NC St6.9 Cedric Cobbs, Arkansas6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame6.6 Walter Reyes, Syracuse6.5 Anthony Davis, Wisconsin6.4 Quincy Wilson, W Virginia (says 3.4, but I'm assuming that's a typo)6.2 Marion Barber, Minnesota6.1 Michael Turner, N Illinois5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma StMultiplying the PFW rankings by 8.8/6.75 and averaging, we get:8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas 8.88.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn 8.7174074078.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St 8.6174074078.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn 8.6022222228.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech 8.419629638.0 Chris Perry, Michigan 7.9111111118.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida 7.8633333337.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St 7.8545925937.6 Greg Jones, Florida St 7.5155555567.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004 ranking) 7.4677777787.1 Eric Shelton, Louisville 7.1351851857.0 T.A. McClendon, NC St 76.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame 6.96.9 Cedric Cobbs, Arkansas 6.96.6 Walter Reyes, Syracuse 6.66.5 Anthony Davis, Wisconsin 6.56.4 Quincy Wilson, W Virginia 6.46.2 Marion Barber, Minnesota 6.26.1 Michael Turner, N Illinois 6.16.1 Ryan Moats, Louisania Tech 6.16.1 J.J. Arrington, Cal 6.15.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St 5.9

 
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placeholder10391

Footballguy
Multiplying the PFW rankings by 8.8/6.75 and averaging, we get:

8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas 8.8

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn 8.717407407

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St 8.617407407

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn 8.602222222

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech 8.41962963

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan 7.911111111

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida 7.863333333

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St 7.854592593

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St 7.515555556

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004 ranking) 7.467777778

7.1 Eric Shelton, Louisville 7.135185185

7.0 T.A. McClendon, NC St 7

6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame 6.9

6.9 Cedric Cobbs, Arkansas 6.9

6.6 Walter Reyes, Syracuse 6.6

6.5 Anthony Davis, Wisconsin 6.5

6.4 Quincy Wilson, W Virginia 6.4

6.2 Marion Barber, Minnesota 6.2

6.1 Michael Turner, N Illinois 6.1

6.1 Ryan Moats, Louisania Tech 6.1

6.1 J.J. Arrington, Cal 6.1

5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St 5.9
This thread is awesome. Very nice work.Can someone tell me where the likes of some of the older top backs rated in this system? For example, Edge, Ricky Williams, Shaun Alexander, etc.

Thanks.

 

Bloom

Moderator
Multiplying the PFW rankings by 8.8/6.75 and averaging, we get:

8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas 8.8

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn 8.717407407

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St 8.617407407

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn 8.602222222

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech 8.41962963

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan 7.911111111

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida 7.863333333

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St 7.854592593

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St 7.515555556

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004 ranking) 7.467777778

7.1 Eric Shelton, Louisville 7.135185185

7.0 T.A. McClendon, NC St 7

6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame 6.9

6.9 Cedric Cobbs, Arkansas 6.9

6.6 Walter Reyes, Syracuse 6.6

6.5 Anthony Davis, Wisconsin 6.5

6.4 Quincy Wilson, W Virginia 6.4

6.2 Marion Barber, Minnesota 6.2

6.1 Michael Turner, N Illinois 6.1

6.1 Ryan Moats, Louisania Tech 6.1

6.1 J.J. Arrington, Cal 6.1

5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St 5.9
This thread is awesome. Very nice work.Can someone tell me where the likes of some of the older top backs rated in this system? For example, Edge, Ricky Williams, Shaun Alexander, etc.

Thanks.
i can tell you right off the bat that edge, ricky, and LT would rank above benson. i would imagine that they are 3 of the top 10 RBs coming out of college in the last 20 years.
 
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ILoveMyLions

Footballguy
Multiplying the PFW rankings by 8.8/6.75 and averaging, we get:

8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas 8.8

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn 8.717407407

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St 8.617407407

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn 8.602222222

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech 8.41962963

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan 7.911111111

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida 7.863333333

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St 7.854592593

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St 7.515555556

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004 ranking) 7.467777778

7.1 Eric Shelton, Louisville 7.135185185

7.0 T.A. McClendon, NC St 7

6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame 6.9

6.9 Cedric Cobbs, Arkansas 6.9

6.6 Walter Reyes, Syracuse 6.6

6.5 Anthony Davis, Wisconsin 6.5

6.4 Quincy Wilson, W Virginia 6.4

6.2 Marion Barber, Minnesota 6.2

6.1 Michael Turner, N Illinois 6.1

6.1 Ryan Moats, Louisania Tech 6.1

6.1 J.J. Arrington, Cal 6.1

5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St 5.9
This thread is awesome. Very nice work.Can someone tell me where the likes of some of the older top backs rated in this system? For example, Edge, Ricky Williams, Shaun Alexander, etc.

Thanks.
i can tell you right off the bat that edge, ricky, and LT would rank above benson. i would imagine that they are 3 of the top 10 RBs coming out of college in the last 20 years.
I agree that when LT was drafted he was the #1 pick in all the dynasty drafts, but like I stated earlier, LT was the 3rd ranked RB in TSN that year...
 

ILoveMyLions

Footballguy
6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)
Why was McGahee so low? I thought he was highly regarded coming out. Do these ratings take his injury into consideration?
TSN's draft guide came out only a few months after the surgery he had on his ACL, appeared to be out at least a year to a year and a half and before his workout where he impressed the scouts. They were not able to factor those things in. No question that prior to the injury, he was the number 1 back and would have scored high. I disagree with some of TSN's rankings every year, but that one is difficult to be critical of because McGahee proved in the two months leading to the draft that he was recovering very quickly. By then, the guide had been out for quite some time.
Where do you think he would have ranked before the injury, in comparison to the top backs of the past two years (K. Jones, Jackson, Brown, Williams, Benson). On par with or higher?
I think he would have been the highest ranking RB coming out since Barry Sanders. Now, that is a bold statement, but the year he had at Miami was sick and he had power, speed, stamina, quickness, explosion, hands, ie. the total package. Again, my opinion...
 

EBF

Footballguy
I think McGahee was a lock to go #3 to Houston before he tore up his knee. He and Kevin Jones are the two best RB prospects I've seen since the LT class.

 

ILoveMyLions

Footballguy
I think McGahee was a lock to go #3 to Houston before he tore up his knee. He and Kevin Jones are the two best RB prospects I've seen since the LT class.
I disagree, he would have gone to Detroit at #2...
 

loqutis

Footballguy
I would love to see the other positions as well? Do you think you could list them? I'm sue others would love this information.

ILoveMyLions I have the TSN books back to 2001
 
From TSN 2000-Chad Pennington 30.0Chris Redman 27.5Marc Bulger 25.0Giovanni Carmazzi 24.0Tom Brady 22.0Tee Martin 21.0Tim Rattay 20.0Joe Hamilton 19.5Todd Husak 18.5Kevin Feterek 17.0Notables-Billy Volek 14.5, Doug Johnson 14.0Thomas Jones 31.5Shaun Alexander 31.0Ron Dayne 28.5Jamal Lewis 27.0Travis Prentiss 26.0J.R. Redmond 25.5Reuben Droughns 24.0Michael Wiley 23.0Rondell Mealey 22.5Chrys Chukwuma 22.5Sammy Morris 22.0a nobody 21.0Trung Canidate 21.0Doug Chapman 20.5Mike Anderson 19.0ranked 23rd- Dante Hall Texas A&MPeter Warrick 34.0Travis Taylor 31.5Plaxico Burress 30.5Dez White 30.5Laveranues Coles 30.5Sylvester Morris 30.0R. Jay Soward 29.0Ron Dugans 28.5Kwame Kavil 28.5Darrell Jackson 27.013th- dennis Northcut 24.017th- Jerry Porter 22.019th- Todd Pinkston 20.0The 1999 guide has no grades, just rankings and synopsis.

 
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loqutis

Footballguy
I take it they changes the way they scored players. Since all the other scores had a maximum of 9

 
I take it they changes the way they scored players. Since all the other scores had a maximum of 9
My guess would be they rated the players on four 1-10 scales and totaled the scores whereas now they average 5 categories.Divide by four and it might make sense. :dunno:

 

cstu

Footballguy
Going along with the theme here, I was curious what the backs would rate going back even further. I have the TSN books back to 2001 and here's how the RBs rated. (The 2001 draft guide rates on a 8 point scale instead of 9 so I added nine points to make the grades more comparable)

2001-2005 combined (top five for each year)

8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas (2005)

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn (2005)

8.6 Duece McAllister, Mississippi (2001)

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn (2005)

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St (2004)

8.4 William Green, Boston College (2002)

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech (2004)

8.1 Larry Johnson, Penn State (2003)

8.1 T.J Duckett, Michigan State (2002)

8.1 Michael Bennett, Wisconsin (2001)

8.1 Clinton Portis, Miami (2002)

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida (2005)

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan (2004)

7.9 Lee Suggs, Virginia Tech (2003)

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St (2005)

7.8 LaDanian Tomlinson, TCU (2001)

7.8 Deshaun Foster, UCLA (2002)

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004)

7.6 Lamont Jordan, Maryland (2001)

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St (2004)

7.5 Onterrio Smith, Oregon (2003)

7.4 Travis Henry, Tennessee (2001)

7.2 Chris Brown, Colorado (2003)

7.0 Lamar Gordon, North Dakato St. (2002)

6.5 Musa Smith, Georgia (2003)

Other Top Notables:

7.1 Kevan Barlow, Pittsburgh (2001, Ranked #7)

6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame (2004, Ranked #7)

6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)

5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St. (2004, Ranked #10)

5.7 Brian Westbrook, Villanova (2002, Ranked #10)

5.3 Rudi Johnson, Auburn (2001, Ranked #11)

4.5 Domanick Davis, LSU (2002, Ranked #13)

Benson and Brown are the highest rated back in the last five years by the Sporting News and Willilams is tied with Duece...interesting... :shock:
This strengthens my view that the rankings on this year's RB's are too high. Bell was a 5.9 while Morency is a 7.8? That's just ridiculous.
 

-OZ-

Footballguy
Going along with the theme here, I was curious what the backs would rate going back even further. I have the TSN books back to 2001 and here's how the RBs rated. (The 2001 draft guide rates on a 8 point scale instead of 9 so I added nine points to make the grades more comparable)

2001-2005 combined (top five for each year)

8.8 Cedric Benson, Texas (2005)

8.7 Ronnie Brown, Auburn (2005)

8.6 Duece McAllister, Mississippi (2001)

8.6 Carnell Williams, Auburn (2005)

8.5 Steven Jackson, Oregon St (2004)

8.4 William Green, Boston College (2002)

8.3 Kevin Jones, Virginia Tech (2004)

8.1 Larry Johnson, Penn State (2003)

8.1 T.J Duckett, Michigan State (2002)

8.1 Michael Bennett, Wisconsin (2001)

8.1 Clinton Portis, Miami (2002)

8.1 Ciatrick Fason, Florida (2005)

8.0 Chris Perry, Michigan (2004)

7.9 Lee Suggs, Virginia Tech (2003)

7.9 Verand Morency, Oklahoma St (2005)

7.8 LaDanian Tomlinson, TCU (2001)

7.8 Deshaun Foster, UCLA (2002)

7.7 Maurice Clarett, Ohio St (2004)

7.6 Lamont Jordan, Maryland (2001)

7.6 Greg Jones, Florida St (2004)

7.5 Onterrio Smith, Oregon (2003)

7.4 Travis Henry, Tennessee (2001)

7.2 Chris Brown, Colorado (2003)

7.0 Lamar Gordon, North Dakato St. (2002)

6.5 Musa Smith, Georgia (2003)

Other Top Notables:

7.1 Kevan Barlow, Pittsburgh (2001, Ranked #7)

6.9 Julius Jones, Notre Dame (2004, Ranked #7)

6.1 Willis McGahee, Miami (2003, Ranked #7)

5.9 Tatum Bell, Oklahoma St. (2004, Ranked #10)

5.7 Brian Westbrook, Villanova (2002, Ranked #10)

5.3 Rudi Johnson, Auburn (2001, Ranked #11)

4.5 Domanick Davis, LSU (2002, Ranked #13)

Benson and Brown are the highest rated back in the last five years by the Sporting News and Willilams is tied with Duece...interesting... :shock:
This strengthens my view that the rankings on this year's RB's are too high. Bell was a 5.9 while Morency is a 7.8? That's just ridiculous.
It does seem a bit off, but the best evidence that this system is :loco: is that Tomlinson is ranked 7.8, below Lee Suggs, Morency, Portis, and tied with Foster. Before anyone comments about "hindsight" - remember that LT was taken at the 1.05, and wasn't a reach, while Suggs lasted to the 3rd, Portis and Foster to the 2nd. I find it interesting that aside from William Green (who had one nice year) nobody in the top 10 is a bust. Even Duckett who hasn't performed up to FF expectations, has played a key role with the Falcons.

 

Crippler

IBL Representative
And nobody in the top 10 is a stud either as Jackson/Jones have proven nothing yet and Bennett is a #2 RB and Duckett is a #3, and while Larry may end up being good you have had to wait patiently now for 4 yeas and still really has not proven himself over a year. If last year was one of the best fantasy rookie classes of all-time than going by these rankings this is even better class with the scores the RB's, WR's, QB's and even Miller have gotten.

 

jwvdcw

Footballguy
I think McGahee was a lock to go #3 to Houston before he tore up his knee. He and Kevin Jones are the two best RB prospects I've seen since the LT class.
Just curious as to why you say that KJ, who lasted until the mid 20s iIrC, was such a great prospect?
 

jwvdcw

Footballguy
From TSN 2000-

Chad Pennington 30.0

Chris Redman 27.5

Marc Bulger 25.0

Giovanni Carmazzi 24.0

Tom Brady 22.0

Tee Martin 21.0

Tim Rattay 20.0

Joe Hamilton 19.5

Todd Husak 18.5

Kevin Feterek 17.0

Notables-Billy Volek 14.5, Doug Johnson 14.0

Thomas Jones 31.5

Shaun Alexander 31.0

Ron Dayne 28.5

Jamal Lewis 27.0

Travis Prentiss 26.0

J.R. Redmond 25.5

Reuben Droughns 24.0

Michael Wiley 23.0

Rondell Mealey 22.5

Chrys Chukwuma 22.5

Sammy Morris 22.0

a nobody 21.0

Trung Canidate 21.0

Doug Chapman 20.5

Mike Anderson 19.0

ranked 23rd- Dante Hall Texas A&M

Peter Warrick 34.0

Travis Taylor 31.5

Plaxico Burress 30.5

Dez White 30.5

Laveranues Coles 30.5

Sylvester Morris 30.0

R. Jay Soward 29.0

Ron Dugans 28.5

Kwame Kavil 28.5

Darrell Jackson 27.0

13th- dennis Northcut 24.0

17th- Jerry Porter 22.0

19th- Todd Pinkston 20.0

The 1999 guide has no grades, just rankings and synopsis.
:confused:
 

DeepOut

Footballguy
:goodposting: Rob - Great post. Thanks for starting the topic. This kind of stuff is great. And everybody else who contributed after Rob started it - great job. Some of the ratings are pretty amazing - Fason, Perry, Reggie Williams, Losman - 'franchise player'; Jenkins, Henderson, Greg Jones, Eric Shelton - 'potential Pro Bowl player'. Wow.And an amazing 2005 group of RBs.Thaks again. I'd also say pin it except I'd like to keep it on the down low until my drafts are finished. :ph34r: :lol:
 
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Z-Dog

Footballguy
Wow - I've never seen a bigger pile of horse manure outisde of an actual stable. By my count, 26 offensive players in the last two years are listed as franchise players. That's quite a lot, especially for only the offense.Also, some of these rankings are really odd. Aside from San Diego, who I believe really did prefer Phillip Rivers, I don't know anyone who thought there was a better QB prospect than Eli Manning. I never heard of anyone perferring Roethlisberger. Also, this year, Alex Smith was panned for being not really worth the 1st overall choice, but being the best prospect in a crappy year. And yet he's ranked only .1 points behind Eli Manning.Basically, these rankings look pretty crappy to me, and as the posts that look further back indicate, they are not particularly good at predicting NFL success.

 

Doug Drinen

Moderator
Here is what the numerical grades mean:

9.0 - 8.0 = Franchise player.

7.9 - 7.0 = Potential Pro Bowl player.

6.9 - 6.0 = Could start as a rookie.

5.9 - 5.0 = Eventual starter.

4.9 - 4.0 = Quality backup.

3.9 - 3.0 = Chance to make roster.

2.9 - 2.0 = Not likely to make roster.

1.9 - 1.0 = Free agent possibility.
Did it say how they arrived at their numbers? Were there actual scouts involved, or was it just a writer (or a bunch of writers) throwing out arbitrary numbers?
 

purplehaze67

Footballguy
Here is what the numerical grades mean:

9.0 - 8.0 = Franchise player.

7.9 - 7.0 = Potential Pro Bowl player.

6.9 - 6.0 = Could start as a rookie.

5.9 - 5.0 = Eventual starter.

4.9 - 4.0 = Quality backup.

3.9 - 3.0 = Chance to make roster.

2.9 - 2.0 = Not likely to make roster.

1.9 - 1.0 = Free agent possibility.
Did it say how they arrived at their numbers? Were there actual scouts involved, or was it just a writer (or a bunch of writers) throwing out arbitrary numbers?
According to the '04 mag, these rankings are put together by "The War Room", which is "a scouting organization that has been evaluating draft prospects for years.The evaluation criteria difers by position. For example --

QB:

Arm strength (Velocity, tight spiral, zip on deep out)

Set-up quicks (Feet, smoothness of drop, body position)

Accuracy (Long and short, catchable ball, forces ball)

Field vision (Locates second receiver, sees the whole field)

Running ability (Threat, avoide rush, quick feet)

Delivery (Quick release, high or low, mechanics)

Ball Handling (Good fakes, freezes LBs)

Leadership (Poise under pressure, moves the team)

RB:

Inside (Quick to hole, vision, cuts)

Outside (Speed to corner, makes cuts, threat)

Elusiveness (Avoids tackles, change of direction, moves, vision)

Power (Balance, breaks tackles, short yardage strength, falls forward)

Blocker (Willing, pass protection, run blocking)

Hands/pass routes (Catches ball out of backfield, tendency to fumble)

Durability (Takes a hit, toughness, stays in the game)

Running style (Slasher, darter, power, second gear)

WR/TE:

Hands (Concentration, snatches, soft hands)

Routes (Sharp and crisp, body control)

Catch long and short (Possession, acceleration, can go deep)

Run after catch (Threat, catches in stride, elusive)

Blocker (Willing, good results, sustains, open field)

Release (Can aviod jam, not held up, physical)

Reacts to ball in crowd (Comes over middle, shows toughness)

Initial quickness (Accelerates, gets off ball, has extra gear)

Each player is rated (and commented on) on each of these categories, and a final grade is assigned. Apparently, some are weighted heavier then others (although I can't find any specifics on this) because the total is not necessarily a simple average of the sub-category scores.

 

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