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RB Dynasty Rankings (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter travdogg
- Start date
Same story as last season... same mistake.
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
We'll see. I would take Peterson, Jackson, MJD, Gore, Lynch, and MB3 before Addai. I know you have always been a huge fan, Switz, but I just don't see the upside of the other players. His value is based on his situation, and I don't see him ever being capable of handling the full load.
Addai's stats from 2007:
261 carries for 1072 yards and 12 scores, 4.1 YPC
41 catches for 364 yards and 3 scores, 8.9 YPR
Mind you, these stats were compiled in one of the best offensive systems in the NFL, with one of the best QBs, and one of the best lines. The situation can only get worse for Addai, and he really wasn't all that impressive last year.
http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...02007&st=50
In this thread you state that a floor for him is 289 carries, 4.5 YPC, and 1300 rushing yards. Oops.
You also stated that Edge carried the ball 360 times in his last season with the Colts, and followed it with, "I don't see how Addai will carry it less." You predicted 2000 total yards and 12 scores. He clearly isn't that kind of player, so technically you made the mistake, not me. Have you changed your stance regarding Addai?
Addai's stats from 2007:
261 carries for 1072 yards and 12 scores, 4.1 YPC
41 catches for 364 yards and 3 scores, 8.9 YPR
Mind you, these stats were compiled in one of the best offensive systems in the NFL, with one of the best QBs, and one of the best lines. The situation can only get worse for Addai, and he really wasn't all that impressive last year.
http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...02007&st=50
In this thread you state that a floor for him is 289 carries, 4.5 YPC, and 1300 rushing yards. Oops.
You also stated that Edge carried the ball 360 times in his last season with the Colts, and followed it with, "I don't see how Addai will carry it less." You predicted 2000 total yards and 12 scores. He clearly isn't that kind of player, so technically you made the mistake, not me. Have you changed your stance regarding Addai?
RB is a very volatile position. LT and Westbrook might not have much value 3 years from now... but then again, outside of Addai, Jackson, and MJD, the same is true about pretty much everyone else on that list.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
I agree. IMO, McGahee never looked comfortable in the Ravens offense. He never impress me with his play and I would have a hard time taking him in the 1st round of a dynasty league.
redman
Footballguy
MB3 before Addai?
Honestly, what is the big difference for fantasy purposes between MB3 and Brandon Jacobs? They're both good to be sure, but Addai's team has produced elite fantasy RB numbers time and again when they haven't had injuries or the RBBC during Addai's rookie season. I just don't see it.Addai's "merely" good, but he's in as good of a fantasy RB situation as it gets, and to me that's everything.
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Jedimaster21
Footballguy
The big difference between Jacobs and Barber is the dramatic difference in talent level. Weak comparison, IMO.I would consider Addai due to the reliability of his numbers, but when it comes down to it, I think Marion is more talented. Talent is everything, not situation. Now Addai's case is a little different because his situation is more stable, but I just see him as a replaceable player. I would guess that Barber's best 3 seasons of his career will be better than Addai's best three. I just see Addai as a long term low #1/high #2 back and nothing more. Marion could easily be a top 3 player if he gets a full time job in Dallas.MB3 before Addai?Honestly, what is the big difference for fantasy purposes between MB3 and Brandon Jacobs? They're both good to be sure, but Addai's team has produced elite fantasy RB numbers time and again when they haven't had injuries or the RBBC during Addai's rookie season. I just don't see it.
Addai's "merely" good, but he's in as good of a fantasy RB situation as it gets, and to me that's everything.
redman
Footballguy
This is no doubt the source of our disagreement. I don't disagree that Barber is more talented in NFL terms than is Jacobs; my statement was one related to fantasy value. The problem is that I'm not confident that either guy can withstand the wear and tear of 300+ carries over time, and the way that they've been used implies to me that their teams are thinking the same way. Unless you're averaging well into the fives in the ypc category, that's just not enough to make you an elite fantasy back the way you're saying.The big difference between Jacobs and Barber is the dramatic difference in talent level. Weak comparison, IMO.I would consider Addai due to the reliability of his numbers, but when it comes down to it, I think Marion is more talented. Talent is everything, not situation. Now Addai's case is a little different because his situation is more stable, but I just see him as a replaceable player. I would guess that Barber's best 3 seasons of his career will be better than Addai's best three. I just see Addai as a long term low #1/high #2 back and nothing more. Marion could easily be a top 3 player if he gets a full time job in Dallas.MB3 before Addai?Honestly, what is the big difference for fantasy purposes between MB3 and Brandon Jacobs? They're both good to be sure, but Addai's team has produced elite fantasy RB numbers time and again when they haven't had injuries or the RBBC during Addai's rookie season. I just don't see it.
Addai's "merely" good, but he's in as good of a fantasy RB situation as it gets, and to me that's everything.
As for Addai, I don't see where the doubt comes from. I don't see the Colts being in any sort of rush to replace him. He fits their offense to a "T", and in fantasy terms he has everything you'd want- no RBBC; catches well; gets goalline work; good team; great offense; is young. I think Barber runs harder than he does, but Addai's a better receiver and Barber's running style has me concerned that he won't last long and his explosiveness will deteriorate over time.
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
No doubt Addai is valuable, and should give whoever owns him about 5 years of steady numbers. But I disagree with the fact that he doesn't split time. If you look at his history, he has never been able to carry the full load. That trend continued last season, and he is definitely a 300 touch player, while Barber could be a 400 touch player. I think Barber is just as effective as a receiver...he actually had more catches last season. It is definitely questionable whether Barber can carry such a work load, but the question is already answered when it comes to Addai. I would be willing to bet that Barber has more touches than Addai next season, and even if he has about the same amount, he is a lot more effective on a per touch basis.This is no doubt the source of our disagreement. I don't disagree that Barber is more talented in NFL terms than is Jacobs; my statement was one related to fantasy value. The problem is that I'm not confident that either guy can withstand the wear and tear of 300+ carries over time, and the way that they've been used implies to me that their teams are thinking the same way. Unless you're averaging well into the fives in the ypc category, that's just not enough to make you an elite fantasy back the way you're saying.The big difference between Jacobs and Barber is the dramatic difference in talent level. Weak comparison, IMO.I would consider Addai due to the reliability of his numbers, but when it comes down to it, I think Marion is more talented. Talent is everything, not situation. Now Addai's case is a little different because his situation is more stable, but I just see him as a replaceable player. I would guess that Barber's best 3 seasons of his career will be better than Addai's best three. I just see Addai as a long term low #1/high #2 back and nothing more. Marion could easily be a top 3 player if he gets a full time job in Dallas.MB3 before Addai?
Addai's "merely" good, but he's in as good of a fantasy RB situation as it gets, and to me that's everything.
As for Addai, I don't see where the doubt comes from. I don't see the Colts being in any sort of rush to replace him. He fits their offense to a "T", and in fantasy terms he has everything you'd want- no RBBC; catches well; gets goalline work; good team; great offense; is young. I think Barber runs harder than he does, but Addai's a better receiver and Barber's running style has me concerned that he won't last long and his explosiveness will deteriorate over time.
switz
Footballguy
No, he just didn't live up to my expectations this past season, and part of that was due to the Colts injury situation in general, with Harrison down, and Addai getting hurt early in the year. They were conservative in how they used him for most of the season. I don't see that practice continuing. Interestingly he had more TDs than I predicted overall, but missed the floor of his yardage by 118 yards, mostly due to 27 fewer rushing attempts than I predicted for his floor. Seeing that he missed a game and had couple games in which he barely played, I can't see how you can find fault with that.
I still see him as one of the best dynasty picks out there, and definitely top-5 in a redraft, top-2 or 3 in dynasty.
The guys you listed as higher picks than him in your opinion, I would be very surprised if all of them finished statistically above him over the course of their career, or even next season.
As for him "never carrying the whole load", what makes you say that? Due to his one missed game? His 8 games of 20 plus carries? The fact they rested him in blowouts? Just wondering...
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redman
Footballguy
"Never" been able to carry the load? He's played for two years, one of which he was a rookie with a decent veteran (Rhodes) who shared snaps with him during a Super Bowl run. He's never had fewer than 266 touches in a season, and he's averaged around 280. Barber has never had more than 248 touches in a season, and he's averaged 187 touches in a season, almost 100 less than Addai. Where are you getting this Barber with 400 carries stuff from?Jedimaster21 said:No doubt Addai is valuable, and should give whoever owns him about 5 years of steady numbers. But I disagree with the fact that he doesn't split time. If you look at his history, he has never been able to carry the full load. That trend continued last season, and he is definitely a 300 touch player, while Barber could be a 400 touch player. I think Barber is just as effective as a receiver...he actually had more catches last season. It is definitely questionable whether Barber can carry such a work load, but the question is already answered when it comes to Addai. I would be willing to bet that Barber has more touches than Addai next season, and even if he has about the same amount, he is a lot more effective on a per touch basis.redman said:This is no doubt the source of our disagreement. I don't disagree that Barber is more talented in NFL terms than is Jacobs; my statement was one related to fantasy value. The problem is that I'm not confident that either guy can withstand the wear and tear of 300+ carries over time, and the way that they've been used implies to me that their teams are thinking the same way. Unless you're averaging well into the fives in the ypc category, that's just not enough to make you an elite fantasy back the way you're saying.Jedimaster21 said:The big difference between Jacobs and Barber is the dramatic difference in talent level. Weak comparison, IMO.I would consider Addai due to the reliability of his numbers, but when it comes down to it, I think Marion is more talented. Talent is everything, not situation. Now Addai's case is a little different because his situation is more stable, but I just see him as a replaceable player. I would guess that Barber's best 3 seasons of his career will be better than Addai's best three. I just see Addai as a long term low #1/high #2 back and nothing more. Marion could easily be a top 3 player if he gets a full time job in Dallas.MB3 before Addai?Honestly, what is the big difference for fantasy purposes between MB3 and Brandon Jacobs? They're both good to be sure, but Addai's team has produced elite fantasy RB numbers time and again when they haven't had injuries or the RBBC during Addai's rookie season. I just don't see it.
Addai's "merely" good, but he's in as good of a fantasy RB situation as it gets, and to me that's everything.
As for Addai, I don't see where the doubt comes from. I don't see the Colts being in any sort of rush to replace him. He fits their offense to a "T", and in fantasy terms he has everything you'd want- no RBBC; catches well; gets goalline work; good team; great offense; is young. I think Barber runs harder than he does, but Addai's a better receiver and Barber's running style has me concerned that he won't last long and his explosiveness will deteriorate over time.
switz
Footballguy
Just reviewed Barber's stats. Kevan Barlow anyone?OK - Barlow is a bit extreme... but their situations are very similar, Barber is a much better worker, but I wouldn't be surprised at all to see his stats drop significantly with extended touches.
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Jedimaster21
Footballguy
You said 1300 yards as a floor, so you were 228 off. The situation in Indy this year was perfect for Addai...with Harrison down they should have relied more on the running game. You can make excuses, but he just didn't produce the way he should have considering his situation. IMO, he showed this year exactly what he is. A decent back that will be a good fantasy producer, and nothing more. I want more from a top 5 pick, and all of the players mentioned are a lot more talented. Lynch is probably closest in talent to Addai, but he is much younger...as far as the others, they are in another league when it comes to talent.switz said:
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Jedimaster21
Footballguy
You shouldn't have played this card. 261 for 1072, 12 Tds and 4.1 average (Addai)or204 for 975, 10 Tds and a 4.8 average (Barber)Just quit while your ahead...Barber is a lot more talented, and a lot more effective on a per touch basis.Just reviewed Barber's stats. Kevan Barlow anyone?
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
In Addai's case, he is clearly a 300 touch player. His upside is limited. He was "the guy" there last season and still didn't even manage 300 carries. Do you consider that a workhorse performance. Barber has been part of a RBBC, but Jones is leaving and he should be getting more carries this year than Addai will ever get. There are few players that excel in all areas, including blocking, running, receiving, and short yardage. When the player is elite in all these areas, there is a good possibility that they will receive 400 touches if they are capable. I could be wrong, but I see that kind of season for Barber. I suppose that Dallas could draft someone else or bring in a FA to continue the RBBC, but Barber has shown his talent repeatedly, and they will be giving him a lot of money."Never" been able to carry the load? He's played for two years, one of which he was a rookie with a decent veteran (Rhodes) who shared snaps with him during a Super Bowl run. He's never had fewer than 266 touches in a season, and he's averaged around 280. Barber has never had more than 248 touches in a season, and he's averaged 187 touches in a season, almost 100 less than Addai. Where are you getting this Barber with 400 carries stuff from?Jedimaster21 said:No doubt Addai is valuable, and should give whoever owns him about 5 years of steady numbers. But I disagree with the fact that he doesn't split time. If you look at his history, he has never been able to carry the full load. That trend continued last season, and he is definitely a 300 touch player, while Barber could be a 400 touch player. I think Barber is just as effective as a receiver...he actually had more catches last season. It is definitely questionable whether Barber can carry such a work load, but the question is already answered when it comes to Addai. I would be willing to bet that Barber has more touches than Addai next season, and even if he has about the same amount, he is a lot more effective on a per touch basis.redman said:This is no doubt the source of our disagreement. I don't disagree that Barber is more talented in NFL terms than is Jacobs; my statement was one related to fantasy value. The problem is that I'm not confident that either guy can withstand the wear and tear of 300+ carries over time, and the way that they've been used implies to me that their teams are thinking the same way. Unless you're averaging well into the fives in the ypc category, that's just not enough to make you an elite fantasy back the way you're saying.Jedimaster21 said:The big difference between Jacobs and Barber is the dramatic difference in talent level. Weak comparison, IMO.I would consider Addai due to the reliability of his numbers, but when it comes down to it, I think Marion is more talented. Talent is everything, not situation. Now Addai's case is a little different because his situation is more stable, but I just see him as a replaceable player. I would guess that Barber's best 3 seasons of his career will be better than Addai's best three. I just see Addai as a long term low #1/high #2 back and nothing more. Marion could easily be a top 3 player if he gets a full time job in Dallas.MB3 before Addai?
Addai's "merely" good, but he's in as good of a fantasy RB situation as it gets, and to me that's everything.
As for Addai, I don't see where the doubt comes from. I don't see the Colts being in any sort of rush to replace him. He fits their offense to a "T", and in fantasy terms he has everything you'd want- no RBBC; catches well; gets goalline work; good team; great offense; is young. I think Barber runs harder than he does, but Addai's a better receiver and Barber's running style has me concerned that he won't last long and his explosiveness will deteriorate over time.
The bottom line...Addai has already shown me what he is, Barber has a lot more upside. Besides, we have also seen that Barber is almost as effective in an RBBC as Addai is in the lead role, so his floor is limited.
switz
Footballguy
How about career statsYou shouldn't have played this card. 261 for 1072, 12 Tds and 4.1 average (Addai)or204 for 975, 10 Tds and a 4.8 average (Barber)Just quit while your ahead...Barber is a lot more talented, and a lot more effective on a per touch basis.
Addai - 31 gamesRUSHING487 atts |15.7 att/gm | 2,153 | 4.4 YPC | 69.5 YPG | 19 TDsRECEIVING81 rec | 689 yards | 8.5 YPC | 22.2 YPG | 4 TDsBarber - 45 gamesRUSHING477 atts | 10.6 att/gm | 2,167 | 4.5 YPC | 48.2 YPG | 29 TDsRECEIVING85 rec | 593 yards | 7.0 YPC | 13.2 YPG | 4 TDsCompletely ignoring that it took Barber an extra year to put up those numbers - Yard per carry is a difference of 0.1 in Barber's favorYard per reception is much better for AddaiBarber has far more rushing TDs, but their rush TD/season is nearly identical. And Barber has received almost every goalline attempt for DAL the last three seasons, it's not likely is TDs would increase much if given the whole job.For as much as you want to say that Barber is so much more productive per touch,568 touches for 2842 yards = Addai (82 more yards on 6 more touches)562 touches for 2760 yards = BarberAnd there is still the question of WHY Barber has been in a RBBC, whereas when the Colts took Addai, after the first season they got rid of his sharing partner and made him the clear #1.
switz
Footballguy
I love how you state as fact, things you are only guessing. Especially considering that all the talk is that DAL is going to make a play for a first round RB, that sure doesn't mean Barber is going to see a lot more carries. This was the first season he saw more than 140 carries in fact.And again, you ignore that Addai missed one game, and was spelled in blowouts and rested quite a bit toward the end of the season, as the Colts often do. He had twice as many carries as his backup. The team was struggling with some injuries, and shuffling it's OLine.But continue to disregard all of that. And I hope everyone else does too, so I can get Addai lower than he should go...
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
Here are Addai's career stats... Rushing Receiving Year Age Tm Pos G GS Att Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G YScm RRTD Fmb 2006 23 IND rb 16 0 226 1081 7 41 4.8 67.6 14.1 40 325 8.1 1 21 2.5 20.3 1406 8 2 2007* 24 IND 15 261 1072 12 4.1 71.5 17.4 41 364 8.9 3 2.7 24.3 1436 15 0 Career 31 0 487 2153 19 41 4.4 69.5 15.7 81 689 8.5 4 21 2.6 22.2 2842 23 2 Here are Barbers... Rushing Receiving Year Age Tm Pos G GS Att Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G YScm RRTD Fmb 2005 22 DAL 13 2 138 538 5 28 3.9 41.4 10.6 18 115 6.4 0 21 1.4 8.8 653 5 3 2006 23 DAL 16 1 135 654 14 25 4.8 40.9 8.4 23 196 8.5 2 26 1.4 12.3 850 16 0 2007* 24 DAL 16 204 975 10 4.8 60.9 12.8 44 282 6.4 2 2.8 17.6 1257 12 2 Career 45 3 477 2167 29 28 4.5 48.2 10.6 85 593 7.0 4 26 1.9 13.2 2760 33 5 Addai's numbers for both years were pretty consistent...why would his touches all of a sudden take a huge jump? Why would he all of a sudden improve his effectiveness? Barber has averaged 4.8 yards a carry for two straight years, and Addai's has dropped from 4.8 to 4.1 after became the feature back. In 562 touches, Barber has 34 TDs. In 568 touches, Addai has 23 TDs. Pulling out the stats only does one thing...it shows that Barber is better. He has a better career YPC, and scores more TDs. He also has had limited opportunities and still done that. If Addai is so much better than Barber, why has he scored less TDs despite a lot more opportunities? Why is Barber less of a player when their YPC are very similar? Sorry, everything you are stating just confirms to me that Barber is a better player.How about career statsYou shouldn't have played this card. 261 for 1072, 12 Tds and 4.1 average (Addai)or204 for 975, 10 Tds and a 4.8 average (Barber)Just quit while your ahead...Barber is a lot more talented, and a lot more effective on a per touch basis.Just reviewed Barber's stats. Kevan Barlow anyone?
Addai - 31 gamesRUSHING487 atts |15.7 att/gm | 2,153 | 4.4 YPC | 69.5 YPG | 19 TDsRECEIVING81 rec | 689 yards | 8.5 YPC | 22.2 YPG | 4 TDsBarber - 45 gamesRUSHING477 atts | 10.6 att/gm | 2,167 | 4.5 YPC | 48.2 YPG | 29 TDsRECEIVING85 rec | 593 yards | 7.0 YPC | 13.2 YPG | 4 TDsCompletely ignoring that it took Barber an extra year to put up those numbers - Yard per carry is a difference of 0.1 in Barber's favorYard per reception is much better for AddaiBarber has far more rushing TDs, but their rush TD/season is nearly identical. And Barber has received almost every goalline attempt for DAL the last three seasons, it's not likely is TDs would increase much if given the whole job.For as much as you want to say that Barber is so much more productive per touch,568 touches for 2842 yards = Addai (82 more yards on 6 more touches)562 touches for 2760 yards = BarberAnd there is still the question of WHY Barber has been in a RBBC, whereas when the Colts took Addai, after the first season they got rid of his sharing partner and made him the clear #1.
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
You're just making excuses for Addai. He is just a 300 touch player...face it. He has never been able to carry a huge load, and he never will. We shall see if Dallas drafts a RB in the first. I am pretty sure they plan on giving Barber a pretty big contract, so I would be extremely surprised if they bring in a serious threat to his touches. However, even if he only gets as many carries/catches as Addai, he should outperform him based on what I have seen the last two years.
I'd give Addai another year before you claim he is only a 300-touch guy. Indy seemed to rest everybody other than Manning and Wayne down the stretch and look where it got them. Addai essentially only played 13 games this year. I think he could easily get 300 carries next year and he'll possibly chip in 50 catches.Jedimaster21 said:
switz
Footballguy
Interestingly in Barber's first two seasons, his touches were pretty consistent. One could ask why anyone would've expected his number to take a jump going into the third year as well. However, we knew he was sharing some carries with Julius Jones, and that he was the more talented of those two. The same situation applies with Addai. In '06 he split with Rhodes, and we knew in '07 he'd see more carries, which he did. In '07 though, Keith took some of his carries, and he missed a game, but he's still the most talented back on their roster by far. So it's reasonable to conclude he'll see more carries in '08.Jedimaster21 said:
Interestingly in Barber's first two seasons his YPCs were 3.9 and 4.8, Addai's were 4.8 and 4.1. Of course Addai's sample size is much larger in his first two seasons, so you'd expect his YPC to be lower than a player who played less. However in their first two seasons, Addai has a higher overall YPC. And of course, his YPC may have declined this year due to his lingering injury - just maybe?Jedimaster21 said:
Barber is used almost exclusively at the GL in DAL, whereas the Colts pass extensively at the GL. The TDs are a result of a scheme and not an indication of a talent difference.As for TD/touch, Addai and Barber had almost identical TD/rush within the oppoonents 10 yard line. About 1 TD in every 3 carries. Despite Barber logging fewer overall carries, he had 21 attempts within the 10 yard line, to Addai's 29. Addai scored 2 more TDs.Jedimaster21 said:
From within the red zone, Addai is better than Barber at scoring TDs.
56 att, 12 TDs for Addai - 1/4.7
44 att, 8 TDs for Barber - 1/5.5 for Barber
Again, the only reason Barber has had more TDs in his career, is because he's had more GL attempts.
Barber
21+31+23 = 75 att within the 10 for 3+9+7 = 19 TDs (1/3.9)
44+51+39 = 134 within the redzone for 4+14+8 = 22 TDs (1/6)
Addai
29+24 = 53 att within the 10 for 9+5 = 14 TDs (1/3.7)
56+56 = 122 att within the redzone for 12+15 = 27TDs (1/4.5)
As you can see, Barber has received over 20 more carries around the goalline than Addai, and 12 more within the redzone. Still, Addai is more effective in those areas. And, while Barber may not receive as many carries overall as Addai, he is used more frequently at the GL. Hence his TD numbers are a result of more opportunity, not a better success rate.
And are you really using a 0.01 difference in YPC as a definitive piece of evidence to claim one player is better than the other? Or do you think Addai's 1.5 YPR is evidence that Addai is better. You can't have it both ways, Addai's Yards per Touch is much higher than Barbers.Jedimaster21 said:
I don't think you understand the word confirm...Fact is Barber was never brought in to be a starter, but Addai was. Barber has never carried the ball in 3 seasons as many times as Addai's lowest number of carries per season. Yet you think he's going to suddenly carry is 400 times. That's unreasonable.Jedimaster21 said:
It's obvious you don't like Addai - I don't think the facts support your point of view at all, but I'm sure you'll continue to argue Barber is better.
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
Nice defense. I have two questions for you: 1. Do you honestly think that Addai is more talented than Barber?
2. Do you honestly think that Addai is more suited to be a workhorse back than Barber?
Maroney=Speed
Footballguy
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
Switz,
1. Barber split carries with Jones, and Jones is leaving while Barber is going to sign a huge contract. I think both of us agree that will equal more opportunity for Barber. However, how are you comparing Kenton Keith's role with Jones'? Jones was drafted to be the feature back, and Barber was a value pick for the Cowboys. As each season passed, he continued to outplay Jones, which will eventually lead to him being the feature back. Kenton Keith was brought in to give Addai relief. Addai is better suited for less carries and he has shown this his whole career. How will keeping the Colt's situation exactly the same result in more touches for Addai? Barber is the player who will be getting more opportunity this season due to a change in situation.
2. Addai's YPC declined this year because defenses were focusing on him, and he just isn't that good. He is a solid, all around back...nothing more. Despite being used in primarily short yardage situations (as your stats show), Barber still managed to crush Addai's YPC last season.
3. What are the numbers about Addai vs Barber at the goal line supposed to prove? Are you honestly saying that Addai is a better short yardage runner? Have you ever seen Barber run before? Barber is a lot more powerful than Addai, and his yards after contact are what makes him great. He is always moving forward, and punishes defenders. Every time the Cowboys are in the red zone the other team knows that he is getting the ball, and he still scores tons of TDs. When the Colts are in the red zone, what do you think defenses focus on, Peyton, Wayne, and Clark or Addai?
I do think Addai has shown that he averages more yards per reception, and I'm not sure why that is the case. Could be the system, or he could just be better at that. I'm not sure, and I think this year Barber will display his talents more than ever. We'll just have to agree to disagree, yet again. What really confirms my belief in Barber is his 4.8 average despite being used in short yardage situations repeatedly, his success around the goal line, his violent running style and talent, and his ability to steadily improve each year with a larger load. When I look at the entire picture, I just think Barber is the better player.
By the way, could you clarify exactly what "confirm" means for me? TIA...
1. Barber split carries with Jones, and Jones is leaving while Barber is going to sign a huge contract. I think both of us agree that will equal more opportunity for Barber. However, how are you comparing Kenton Keith's role with Jones'? Jones was drafted to be the feature back, and Barber was a value pick for the Cowboys. As each season passed, he continued to outplay Jones, which will eventually lead to him being the feature back. Kenton Keith was brought in to give Addai relief. Addai is better suited for less carries and he has shown this his whole career. How will keeping the Colt's situation exactly the same result in more touches for Addai? Barber is the player who will be getting more opportunity this season due to a change in situation.
2. Addai's YPC declined this year because defenses were focusing on him, and he just isn't that good. He is a solid, all around back...nothing more. Despite being used in primarily short yardage situations (as your stats show), Barber still managed to crush Addai's YPC last season.
3. What are the numbers about Addai vs Barber at the goal line supposed to prove? Are you honestly saying that Addai is a better short yardage runner? Have you ever seen Barber run before? Barber is a lot more powerful than Addai, and his yards after contact are what makes him great. He is always moving forward, and punishes defenders. Every time the Cowboys are in the red zone the other team knows that he is getting the ball, and he still scores tons of TDs. When the Colts are in the red zone, what do you think defenses focus on, Peyton, Wayne, and Clark or Addai?
I do think Addai has shown that he averages more yards per reception, and I'm not sure why that is the case. Could be the system, or he could just be better at that. I'm not sure, and I think this year Barber will display his talents more than ever. We'll just have to agree to disagree, yet again. What really confirms my belief in Barber is his 4.8 average despite being used in short yardage situations repeatedly, his success around the goal line, his violent running style and talent, and his ability to steadily improve each year with a larger load. When I look at the entire picture, I just think Barber is the better player.
By the way, could you clarify exactly what "confirm" means for me? TIA...
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
We'll see. I think that Barber is more talented, and better suited for more carries.
redman
Footballguy
I can't help but note that you haven't asked whether we expect Addai to outscore Barber in fantasy points, which I do.
stp-d
Footballguy
Probably the most ill-informed statement I've read this year. Comparing Addai to Grant to Graham is ???
switz
Footballguy
Yes, I do... by enough of a margin to make Addai NFL regular starter material, and Barber spot duty starting material...
I think Barber is tougher, Addai is a bit tall IMO. But I disagree with the notion that Addai would wear down more than Barber. In other words, I don't think either fit the Larry Johnson definition of 'workhorse' - they both hold up equally as well.Fair questions, I hope fair answers.
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
I think Addai is more talented than both, but he is closer in talent to Graham/Grant types than MJD/Gore/Peterson/Jackson types. That was my point. If he is so talented, why did he manage a 4.1 YPC on one of the best offenses in the league? Kenton Keith looked just as good as he did in that system. He is a good back in a great system.Probably the most ill-informed statement I've read this year. Comparing Addai to Grant to Graham is ???
switz
Footballguy
This is just silly. He averaged 4.8 in '06, and this past season he battled through an injury nearly all year long. Plus their OL was being reassembled, and they had quite a few OL injuries. We get it, you don't like Addai, but your argument is short of facts, and long in misappropriated stats out of context.I think Addai is more talented than both, but he is closer in talent to Graham/Grant types than MJD/Gore/Peterson/Jackson types. That was my point. If he is so talented, why did he manage a 4.1 YPC on one of the best offenses in the league? Kenton Keith looked just as good as he did in that system. He is a good back in a great system.Probably the most ill-informed statement I've read this year. Comparing Addai to Grant to Graham is ???
Jedimaster21
Footballguy
We'll see if I'm being silly. I just don't see Addai as an elite talent, and think his value is tied to situation. IMO, you're the one who is short on facts and full of excuses.This is just silly. He averaged 4.8 in '06, and this past season he battled through an injury nearly all year long. Plus their OL was being reassembled, and they had quite a few OL injuries. We get it, you don't like Addai, but your argument is short of facts, and long in misappropriated stats out of context.I think Addai is more talented than both, but he is closer in talent to Graham/Grant types than MJD/Gore/Peterson/Jackson types. That was my point. If he is so talented, why did he manage a 4.1 YPC on one of the best offenses in the league? Kenton Keith looked just as good as he did in that system. He is a good back in a great system.Probably the most ill-informed statement I've read this year. Comparing Addai to Grant to Graham is ???
