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Ronnie Brown Situation? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter AJ1
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avoiding injuries
Footballguy
How many RB's would you take ahead of Ronnie Brown if you were starting a team but for only one year(to eliminate age differences)? Would you take Henry above him, Addai? How about Benson or Maroney?
I think Ronnie is a top 12 back in the league on a bad offense. Maybe(big maybe) the offense wouldn't be as bad if you used Ronnie more.
I think Ronnie is a top 12 back in the league on a bad offense. Maybe(big maybe) the offense wouldn't be as bad if you used Ronnie more.
Anonymous Internet User
Footballguy
IMHO, in terms of talent as a RB (all inclusive running, catching, blocking) relative to Brown:superior
LT2
SJax
LJ
Gore
Westbrook
Fred Taylor
SA
Portis
roughly the same level
Henry
Addai
McGahee
Bush
McAllister
Ahman Green
FWP
Edge
MBIII
inferior
Caddie
Jamal Lewis
Rudi
Benson
Maroney
Jordan
Foster
DeAngelo Williams
Chester Taylor
Brandon Jackson
Dunn
Norwood
JJ
Tatum Bell
Betts
unknown
Peterson
Lynch
KJ
Turner
Jacobs
probably missed a couple
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twitch
Footballguy
he's done nothing at all in 3 years to prove he's a top 12 RB. Im not saying he's bad. But top 12 production or evidence are yet to be displayed. Most impressive about Brown to this point has to be his #2 overall draft position. As RBs relative to their draft position go, I hate to say it about the guy, but he's been by far the biggest bust. Again, not saying he's the worst. But a stud or top 12 overall? Nowhere near that. He doesnt run angry. Doesnt run with an attitude or edge. Id probably be thinking about him somewhere in the 20s.
avoiding injuries
Footballguy
Brown?He was drafted #2 because of his performance in college, and times and stats at the combine. He's been in a bad situation down in MIA with different coaches, systems, Ricky Williams etc. He has a good YPC and not a lot of mileage. If you gave me the entire 49ers team except for RB and told me to pick anyone, Ronnie is around 12 for me.
Anonymous Internet User
Footballguy
that list was all relative to Brown. ie - superior/equal to/inferior to Brown
az_prof
Footballguy
Some RBs can't be effective on only a handful of carries. They need to get the ball 20-25 times. Usually, they are bigger backs and they wear a defense down and gain confidence and strength as the game progresses. Brown is one of those guys. He hasn't done that badly the past two years--not all world like LT, but very serviceable.Banger said:I know it seems ridiculous that Chatman is even mentioned in the same sentence but that was in the preseason where Cam was trying to motivate Brown into elevating his game. So what has he done in the 1st two starts? 11-32, 11-33. Very yawn inspiring #'s and not indicative that Cam was/is nuts to try and push him harder. Chatman got 7 carries in game 1 and 3 in game 2, Chatman isn't the problem, Brown is.
az_prof
Footballguy
ChuckLiddell
Footballguy
I just wonder what would have happened if you put Ronnie in KC for the past 2 seasons (not this one) as the featured back. That offensive system and personnel made Derrick Blaylock look like a stud. It also took a journeyman (Priest Holmes) and turned him into one of the most dominant rushers of the decade. It is a question than can never be answered, but I just wonder if LJ would even be in the top 20 if he was a Dolphin and not a Chief. Same for a few of the others that are listed as "superior". They deserve to be listed as superior based upon their accomplishments, but you have to wonder how much the system makes or breaks the player. If the system and personnel is a big part of it, then Ronnie got a very raw deal.
I totally agree with your assessment.
az_prof
Footballguy
The system is a huge part of success. Most fantasy players just look at stats and judge a player by that, which is the bottom line in fantasy, but says little about the player as a real player. I have watched Brown turn a loss into a two yard gain many times. I also saw Blaylock look like superman in KC and then look like minimouse in New York.
I just wonder what would have happened if you put Ronnie in KC for the past 2 seasons (not this one) as the featured back. That offensive system and personnel made Derrick Blaylock look like a stud. It also took a journeyman (Priest Holmes) and turned him into one of the most dominant rushers of the decade. It is a question than can never be answered, but I just wonder if LJ would even be in the top 20 if he was a Dolphin and not a Chief. Same for a few of the others that are listed as "superior". They deserve to be listed as superior based upon their accomplishments, but you have to wonder how much the system makes or breaks the player. If the system and personnel is a big part of it, then Ronnie got a very raw deal.
I totally agree with your assessment.
SigEp316
Footballguy
drafted late, Miami should be behind plenty, and Green seems comfortable with Chambers already.
avoiding injuries
Footballguy
I'm a moron. I looked 3 or 4 times to see if I was just skipping over Browns name. I wan't paying attention to the category names. Btw, I agree with most of your positioning on that list. Maybe not Fred though.
Anonymous Internet User
Footballguy
Fred Taylor is one of the most gifted RBs of this generation. He has been playing for the low-powered Jaguars his whole career -- but he is incredibly talented. He's missed time early in his career, but with that notwithstanding, he could have been this generation's Jim Brown if he played for a team where he could be put in the position to score TDs.I'm a moron. I looked 3 or 4 times to see if I was just skipping over Browns name. I wan't paying attention to the category names. Btw, I agree with most of your positioning on that list. Maybe not Fred though.
avoiding injuries
Footballguy
Fair. But dude is closing in on 32. I don't think he is in the superior class this year or ever again.Anonymous Internet User said:Fred Taylor is one of the most gifted RBs of this generation. He has been playing for the low-powered Jaguars his whole career -- but he is incredibly talented. He's missed time early in his career, but with that notwithstanding, he could have been this generation's Jim Brown if he played for a team where he could be put in the position to score TDs.avoiding injuries said:Anonymous Internet User said:I'm a moron. I looked 3 or 4 times to see if I was just skipping over Browns name. I wan't paying attention to the category names. Btw, I agree with most of your positioning on that list. Maybe not Fred though.
Anonymous Internet User
Footballguy
Curtis Martin had one of his best years at age 32. It's not impossible. I think Fred Taylor has one more year of talent-driven productivity.Fair. But dude is closing in on 32. I don't think he is in the superior class this year or ever again.Anonymous Internet User said:Fred Taylor is one of the most gifted RBs of this generation. He has been playing for the low-powered Jaguars his whole career -- but he is incredibly talented. He's missed time early in his career, but with that notwithstanding, he could have been this generation's Jim Brown if he played for a team where he could be put in the position to score TDs.avoiding injuries said:Anonymous Internet User said:
avoiding injuries
Footballguy
Ok, but he only has 72 yards in 2 games. Granted, that's about the same as a lot of the other "superior" RB's but I think his best is well behind him. We'll just have to agree to disagree on him. But like I said earlier, I agree with just about all your other positioning.Curtis Martin had one of his best years at age 32. It's not impossible. I think Fred Taylor has one more year of talent-driven productivity.Fair. But dude is closing in on 32. I don't think he is in the superior class this year or ever again.Anonymous Internet User said:Fred Taylor is one of the most gifted RBs of this generation. He has been playing for the low-powered Jaguars his whole career -- but he is incredibly talented. He's missed time early in his career, but with that notwithstanding, he could have been this generation's Jim Brown if he played for a team where he could be put in the position to score TDs.avoiding injuries said:Anonymous Internet User said:I'm a moron. I looked 3 or 4 times to see if I was just skipping over Browns name. I wan't paying attention to the category names. Btw, I agree with most of your positioning on that list. Maybe not Fred though.
ChuckLiddell
Footballguy
Looks like Cam has acknowledged that he needs to feed Ronnie some more carries. This article is from today's Miami Herald...
Dolphins' Brown hopes to get more attempts
The Dolphins might increase Ronnie Brown's carries against the Jets in the hopes of igniting their rushing attack.
Posted on Thu, Sep. 20, 2007Digg del.icio.us AIM reprint print email
BY JEFF DARLINGTON
jdarlington@MiamiHerald.com
After losing the first two games last season, Dolphins running back Ronnie Brown quietly realized he probably needed more carries if his team was going to win. His coach also realized it, but both pinned the problem on clock management.
''We can sit there and get booed for running the ball, or we can try to throw it, score and try to win the game,'' former coach Nick Saban, who blamed two late deficits for the lack of carries, said last year. ``I don't think this is rocket science.''
Brown answered the challenge, carrying 26 times for 90 yards against the 29th-ranked rushing defense in a 13-10 win against the Titans in Week 3.
Guess what? This year, the Dolphins are 0-2 again. They play the 29th ranked rushing defense (the New York Jets) on Sunday. And the new coach? He's saying the same things -- maybe just a bit nicer.
''You always want to run the ball better,'' Cam Cameron said this week. ``Given a choice against certain defenses, you'd like to run the ball more, but falling behind really contributed to [the first two losses].''
So perhaps that's good news. If the pattern continues, the Dolphins are bound to win Sunday's game against the Jets behind a solid performance from Brown. Because once again, Brown wants -- and should probably get -- more carries.
The Dolphins are ranked last in the NFL in rushing. Brown has had 11 carries each of the past two games for 65 yards at 3 yards per carry.
''It'd be a great game to improve our running game,'' left tackle Vernon Carey said. ``We've been struggling a little bit on the offensive line and getting the ball moved. But hopefully this week, we can start it back up.''
It also probably helps that two of Brown's best games have been against the Jets. Last year, he had 22 carries for 127 yards in the first game and 18 carries for 110 yards in the second game.
But even if Brown does manage to succeed this week -- even if last year repeats itself -- the questions about if this running game has rid itself of its flaws shouldn't go away.
Despite Brown's success in Week 3 last season, the Dolphins abandoned the run in three of the next four games. And they lost all of them. Cameron said he understands this, and he realizes the team has to find a way to run.
`NEED TO RUN'
''We need to run the ball more,'' he said. ``We need to run the ball better, and I think it's very obvious. It's no fault of anybody. It's the way the [first] two games have played out.''
Cameron probably would be smart to live up to those words. Because even if Brown has yet to prove he is anything but average, the amount he has been used during games has a correlation to whether the team wins.
During the past three seasons, the Dolphins are 6-2 when Brown has 20 or more carries. And they are 7-15 when Brown gets less than 20 carries. When you consider Ricky Williams had more than 10 carries in five of those seven wins during games with less than 20 carries, the statistics are clear: Run more, win more.
Brown's upcoming opponent, Jets safety Kerry Rhodes, agrees the Dolphins would be better off giving the ball to Brown.
''We have the same agent [Todd France] and they were telling me he wasn't really getting the ball,'' Rhodes said. ``It would be great -- don't give it to him. It will be fine for us.''
Rhodes said it's clear what kind of back Brown is, and it's also clear which situations he'll see the most success.
STRAIGHT FORWARD
''What I've seen is that he's better when he has a clear-cut decision where he wants to go with the ball and he doesn't stutter,'' Rhodes said. ``If he has a clear-cut decision where he's going, he's tough.
``If he has to wait a little bit and shimmy around in the backfield he's not a little scat back. He's not Reggie Bush.''
Because Brown said his decision-making and lack of hesitation usually gets better as the game goes on, it's yet another reason the Dolphins believe more opportunity will translate into more success.
Then again, if the Dolphins do start giving their featured back more carries, it will be up to Brown to prove he deserves it. As of now, his lack of success can be pinned on a lack of opportunity.
If that changes, the excuses could run out, too.
So will this be the game Brown gets it going?
''I wish I could answer that and really know,'' Brown said. ``I hope so. I look forward to another opportunity to get the running game going and help things fall our way.''
Dolphins' Brown hopes to get more attempts
The Dolphins might increase Ronnie Brown's carries against the Jets in the hopes of igniting their rushing attack.
Posted on Thu, Sep. 20, 2007Digg del.icio.us AIM reprint print email
BY JEFF DARLINGTON
jdarlington@MiamiHerald.com
After losing the first two games last season, Dolphins running back Ronnie Brown quietly realized he probably needed more carries if his team was going to win. His coach also realized it, but both pinned the problem on clock management.
''We can sit there and get booed for running the ball, or we can try to throw it, score and try to win the game,'' former coach Nick Saban, who blamed two late deficits for the lack of carries, said last year. ``I don't think this is rocket science.''
Brown answered the challenge, carrying 26 times for 90 yards against the 29th-ranked rushing defense in a 13-10 win against the Titans in Week 3.
Guess what? This year, the Dolphins are 0-2 again. They play the 29th ranked rushing defense (the New York Jets) on Sunday. And the new coach? He's saying the same things -- maybe just a bit nicer.
''You always want to run the ball better,'' Cam Cameron said this week. ``Given a choice against certain defenses, you'd like to run the ball more, but falling behind really contributed to [the first two losses].''
So perhaps that's good news. If the pattern continues, the Dolphins are bound to win Sunday's game against the Jets behind a solid performance from Brown. Because once again, Brown wants -- and should probably get -- more carries.
The Dolphins are ranked last in the NFL in rushing. Brown has had 11 carries each of the past two games for 65 yards at 3 yards per carry.
''It'd be a great game to improve our running game,'' left tackle Vernon Carey said. ``We've been struggling a little bit on the offensive line and getting the ball moved. But hopefully this week, we can start it back up.''
It also probably helps that two of Brown's best games have been against the Jets. Last year, he had 22 carries for 127 yards in the first game and 18 carries for 110 yards in the second game.
But even if Brown does manage to succeed this week -- even if last year repeats itself -- the questions about if this running game has rid itself of its flaws shouldn't go away.
Despite Brown's success in Week 3 last season, the Dolphins abandoned the run in three of the next four games. And they lost all of them. Cameron said he understands this, and he realizes the team has to find a way to run.
`NEED TO RUN'
''We need to run the ball more,'' he said. ``We need to run the ball better, and I think it's very obvious. It's no fault of anybody. It's the way the [first] two games have played out.''
Cameron probably would be smart to live up to those words. Because even if Brown has yet to prove he is anything but average, the amount he has been used during games has a correlation to whether the team wins.
During the past three seasons, the Dolphins are 6-2 when Brown has 20 or more carries. And they are 7-15 when Brown gets less than 20 carries. When you consider Ricky Williams had more than 10 carries in five of those seven wins during games with less than 20 carries, the statistics are clear: Run more, win more.
Brown's upcoming opponent, Jets safety Kerry Rhodes, agrees the Dolphins would be better off giving the ball to Brown.
''We have the same agent [Todd France] and they were telling me he wasn't really getting the ball,'' Rhodes said. ``It would be great -- don't give it to him. It will be fine for us.''
Rhodes said it's clear what kind of back Brown is, and it's also clear which situations he'll see the most success.
STRAIGHT FORWARD
''What I've seen is that he's better when he has a clear-cut decision where he wants to go with the ball and he doesn't stutter,'' Rhodes said. ``If he has a clear-cut decision where he's going, he's tough.
``If he has to wait a little bit and shimmy around in the backfield he's not a little scat back. He's not Reggie Bush.''
Because Brown said his decision-making and lack of hesitation usually gets better as the game goes on, it's yet another reason the Dolphins believe more opportunity will translate into more success.
Then again, if the Dolphins do start giving their featured back more carries, it will be up to Brown to prove he deserves it. As of now, his lack of success can be pinned on a lack of opportunity.
If that changes, the excuses could run out, too.
So will this be the game Brown gets it going?
''I wish I could answer that and really know,'' Brown said. ``I hope so. I look forward to another opportunity to get the running game going and help things fall our way.''
hellz_fireflies
Footballguy
It's no fault of anybody. It's the way the [first] two games have played out.'He joking??? It's his fault he's the coach..saying that in week 2..he's a WIMP can't admit it's his fault!
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How does Cam get 2 years to prove himself with his players and system, and Brown gets 2 games with these players in this system?I know what I wrote thanks. The two things are not incongruous. Do you really think Cameron has had enough time to prove himself a bad NFL HC after two games? It takes a couple of years for a coach to get his system and his players in place (at least). It's inadvisable to start making long term decisions about his success or failure in this job prior to that point in most cases.
Raiders Fan
The Black Hole
If you look at most RB's this day in age they are match up RB's.. How many get the rock 75% or more a game?? It seems to be a 2 back system and the trend is growing more and more..
munchkin
Footballguy
Let's see. NE yes, BUFF no, Miami yes, NYJ noINDY no, Houst not really, JAX yes, TENN yesCINN no, BALT no, PIT no, CLEV noSD no, DEN no, OAK no, KC noNYG no, EAG kinda, DAL yes, WASH noCHI no, GB not sure, MIN no, DET 4 carries/gameTB no, CAR yes, ATL yes, NO yesSF no, SEA no, STL no, AZ noMAybe it seems like there's a RBBC but that is not the case.
Synthesizer
Footballguy
I count 10 from your list plus I disagree with your assessment of these...Hou is RBBCWas is RBBCGB is RBBCDet is (probably) RBBCMin is (probably) RBBCBy my count, that's almost half of the league.munchkin said:
Raiders Fan
The Black Hole
Like I said its a growing trend.. Making fantasy a nightmare..
Cookiemonster
Footballguy
He looks PISSED OFF!!! That's the way L.J. looked last year.
Fear & Loathing
Footballguy
He lit up the Raiders safety on that TD run. That's as hard as you'll see a RB hit a defender.
Cookiemonster
Footballguy
.The 60 yarder following that looked like he broke through the arms of a couple defenders @ the LOSFear & Loathing said:
