Rumor - Brandon Marshall to Green Bay (1 Viewer)

[Sabertooth]

I think Marshall is 150% better than Driver, Yes.

I can honestly say I have NO idea what you are even talking about right now.

I will repeat here, one more time for you the bullet points of what I have stated. if you still dont get it, then please dont respond again.

Driver has no trade value for Denver.

Marshall is 10X the receiver Driver is today.The broncos want picks and youth if they trade their stud WR.

Driver would be a good clubhouse guy like Troy Brown.

I never compared the two players ability (brown vs. driver). I compared their likely role on a team. Which is RELEVANT, even though you dont want to admit it.

being a good clubhouse guy isnt a reason to trade your best player no matter what you think.

i never disagreed that clubhouse presence wasnt inportant. I said it wasnt a priority. please look up the difference.

It's all about reading comprehension James the Scot. Get some!!

I see why you have no idea what I am saying. Because you apparently have no idea what you are saying.Is Marshall 10x better than Driver or 150% better? I'm no math whiz but I understand that those are not the same. So apparently you have difficulty in articulating in the written word those thoughts that rattle around in your brain. Since the nuances of the English language are lost on you, I'd suggest communicating in something less flexible like...numbers. Oh, but you've already shown you don't do well with those either.

So this is another example of you saying one thing first and then changing it later on. Which, since you can't seem to understand me, is what I was accusing you of.

Remember, you compared Brown to Driver, got called on it, and then claimed you were "clearly" not comparing them ability wise even though nothing in your post said you were excluding their respective abilities.

But the funniest thing you posted was:

"I never compared the two players ability (brown vs. driver). I compared their likely role on a team. Which is RELEVANT, even though you dont want to admit it.

being a good clubhouse guy isnt a reason to trade your best player no matter what you think.

i never disagreed that clubhouse presence wasnt inportant. I said it wasnt a priority. please look up the difference."

So clubhouse presence isn't a reason, but it's important, but it isn't a priority? Again, you post things that don't make sense. If it weren't a reason, then it couldn't be important, by definition.

It sounds like what you were trying to say is that while clubhouse presence is important, it isn't as important as ability, which makes it a lower priority than ability. If that's what you were trying to say with that convoluted torture of the English language you posted, I can only say "Thank you Captain Obvious".

But back to Brown v. Driver...

If you have no idea what I am talking about, I'll say this slow and concise so you'll understand...

It was stupid to compare Brown to Driver in a trade value discussion because ability IS a critical part of the equation and Driver's ability is greater than Brown's, thus rendering the two incomparable.

You know, it's amazing to me that you go on a rant about how ability trumps locker room presence in a post trying to justify how Brown is a fair comparison to Driver by...get this...ignoring their ability. Rich. Consistency is so under-rated these days.

 

[sho nuff]

vegas disagrees quite a bit. vikes are about 1.5x as likely to win the division despite playing a tougher schedule according to most sites. some have them closer to 2x. bears are close to pack but 3 of the 5 sites i checked had the bears as favorites over pack.

Well lets just call the season now. I mean thats what Vegas said...and they have never been wrong on the odds to win right?Just a tip...the odds to win...are not always who they think will win. They design things to make money...to influence how betting will go to best make them a profit.

heres a tip for you, just bc a team beat the odds, just bc the "books lost," doesnt mean they were wrong.and i do think its pertinent what the odds are. you are random guy on message board saying the pack are the best team. sportsbooks are billion dollar industry with millions riding on finding the proper odds. with a team of researchers and analyzers working to find the best lines. i dont think its unreasonable to side with them.

now, maybe you do your own analysis and have layed boatloads on this. in that case, i would take what you say quite a bit more seriosly.

Blah blah blah.Again...I guess they should cancel the NFL season...I mean Vegas has spoken. They told us who is the best.

 

[sho nuff]

I'm pretty sure almost everyone is in agreement that Marshall to the Pack for Driver and Lee isn't going to happen, so I pose this question. As a wishful Broncos fan, would any team give up a QB for Marshall? I know there would have to be other pieces to the puzzle, but could it happen? How about Marshall for Tavarius Jackson? Derrick Anderson? Jon Kitna? Any of these guys would be an upgrade over Orton/Simms, and at least 2 if not all 3 of those teams could use an upgrade at WR. I know McDoosh's ego is too big and he backed himself into a corner with Orton, and none of these scenarios is likely to happen, but a guy can have some wishful thinking can't he? I figured since this whole thread is about a crazy trade scenario involving Marshall that I'd just throw some more craziness into the fire.

We will give you Brohm right now...?Stopped laughing yet?

 

[Buffaloes]

I think FFers aren't realizing Marshall can't fetch as much in a trade as you think. He needs a new contract and he's another slip on a McDonalds wrapper away from a lengthy league suspension. Teams aren't going to break out 1st round picks and hot young talent to acquire him. I think the Broncos would be doing about as well as they could if they get a legit veteran WR like Driver.

A Disgruntled Jay Cutler for Kyle Orton.

Why do so many people insist on making the Cutler trade sound like a straight up deal for Orton?

 

[Ray_T]

I think FFers aren't realizing Marshall can't fetch as much in a trade as you think. He needs a new contract and he's another slip on a McDonalds wrapper away from a lengthy league suspension. Teams aren't going to break out 1st round picks and hot young talent to acquire him. I think the Broncos would be doing about as well as they could if they get a legit veteran WR like Driver.

A Disgruntled Jay Cutler for Kyle Orton.

Why do so many people insist on making the Cutler trade sound like a straight up deal for Orton?

People hear what they want to hear when it comes to making a point.there are a lot of people who are dissatisfied with the trade and say cutler for Orton was a terrible trade.... but the fact remains they got 2 first round picks along with Orton, and they have not received full benefit for the cutler deal as yet. Cutler is a fine talent, but not as good as what everyone here would make him out to be. They are saying he is a franchise player. I'm saying he's good, but no franchise player. he had actually lost everywhere he played prior to coming to the NFL. This to me was concerning. either way, if he was a franchise player, he would have actually had a winning record in one of the places he played. I could be wrong, but I think Denver actually got the better end of the deal in that trade. I just dont think people will realize what they got until 3 years from now when those draft picks are turned into NFL players.

 

[Banger]

I think FFers aren't realizing Marshall can't fetch as much in a trade as you think. He needs a new contract and he's another slip on a McDonalds wrapper away from a lengthy league suspension. Teams aren't going to break out 1st round picks and hot young talent to acquire him. I think the Broncos would be doing about as well as they could if they get a legit veteran WR like Driver.

A Disgruntled Jay Cutler for Kyle Orton.

Why do so many people insist on making the Cutler trade sound like a straight up deal for Orton?

People hear what they want to hear when it comes to making a point.there are a lot of people who are dissatisfied with the trade and say cutler for Orton was a terrible trade.... but the fact remains they got 2 first round picks along with Orton, and they have not received full benefit for the cutler deal as yet. Cutler is a fine talent, but not as good as what everyone here would make him out to be. They are saying he is a franchise player. I'm saying he's good, but no franchise player. he had actually lost everywhere he played prior to coming to the NFL. This to me was concerning. either way, if he was a franchise player, he would have actually had a winning record in one of the places he played. I could be wrong, but I think Denver actually got the better end of the deal in that trade. I just dont think people will realize what they got until 3 years from now when those draft picks are turned into NFL players.

So you're going to make a determination on his career as a franchise QB based on records of 7-9 and 8-8 in his first 2 years as a full time starting QB (2nd and 3rd year). Forget the fact that he's thrown for 9,000+ yards, 62% completion rate, 54 tds in 37 games, it's the fact that he hasn't had a winning season that's the determining factor? So if the Denver defense doesn't implode last year in the 4th qtr vs Buffalo (Cutler had 359 yards and 2 rush tds) and the Broncos go 9-7 and win their division, that makes him a better QB?When he goes 9-7, 10-6 this year will he then be a "winner" and your opinion change?

 

[TobiasFunke]

vegas disagrees quite a bit. vikes are about 1.5x as likely to win the division despite playing a tougher schedule according to most sites. some have them closer to 2x. bears are close to pack but 3 of the 5 sites i checked had the bears as favorites over pack.

Well lets just call the season now. I mean thats what Vegas said...and they have never been wrong on the odds to win right?Just a tip...the odds to win...are not always who they think will win. They design things to make money...to influence how betting will go to best make them a profit.

heres a tip for you, just bc a team beat the odds, just bc the "books lost," doesnt mean they were wrong.and i do think its pertinent what the odds are. you are random guy on message board saying the pack are the best team. sportsbooks are billion dollar industry with millions riding on finding the proper odds. with a team of researchers and analyzers working to find the best lines. i dont think its unreasonable to side with them.

now, maybe you do your own analysis and have layed boatloads on this. in that case, i would take what you say quite a bit more seriosly.

Blah blah blah.Again...I guess they should cancel the NFL season...I mean Vegas has spoken. They told us who is the best.

This is an ignorant and immature post.Vegas odds are relevant to anyone who takes football, including fantasy football, seriously. Very simply, the books are smarter than you are. If you are more knowledgeable than the books when it comes to football, then you should be wealthy beyond your wildest dreams. If you are not, then admit that Vegas knows more than you, and let people offer up bookmaker odds as evidence of the perceived relative strengths and weaknesses of various teams. The rest of us should be able to discuss this stuff in a football forum without having to put up with crybaby nonsense if Vegas doesn't like your team as much as you do.

 

[FUBAR]

Cutler is a fine talent, but not as good as what everyone here would make him out to be. They are saying he is a franchise player. I'm saying he's good, but no franchise player. he had actually lost everywhere he played prior to coming to the NFL. This to me was concerning. either way, if he was a franchise player, he would have actually had a winning record in one of the places he played.

You expect Vanderbilt to win in the SEC? They could have Peyton Manning now and they still wouldn't have a winning record.

 

[Knobs]

Why has this thread yet to be locked?

 

[FUBAR]

vegas disagrees quite a bit. vikes are about 1.5x as likely to win the division despite playing a tougher schedule according to most sites. some have them closer to 2x. bears are close to pack but 3 of the 5 sites i checked had the bears as favorites over pack.

Well lets just call the season now. I mean thats what Vegas said...and they have never been wrong on the odds to win right?Just a tip...the odds to win...are not always who they think will win. They design things to make money...to influence how betting will go to best make them a profit.

heres a tip for you, just bc a team beat the odds, just bc the "books lost," doesnt mean they were wrong.and i do think its pertinent what the odds are. you are random guy on message board saying the pack are the best team. sportsbooks are billion dollar industry with millions riding on finding the proper odds. with a team of researchers and analyzers working to find the best lines. i dont think its unreasonable to side with them.

now, maybe you do your own analysis and have layed boatloads on this. in that case, i would take what you say quite a bit more seriosly.

Blah blah blah.Again...I guess they should cancel the NFL season...I mean Vegas has spoken. They told us who is the best.

This is an ignorant and immature post.Vegas odds are relevant to anyone who takes football, including fantasy football, seriously. Very simply, the books are smarter than you are. If you are more knowledgeable than the books when it comes to football, then you should be wealthy beyond your wildest dreams. If you are not, then admit that Vegas knows more than you, and let people offer up bookmaker odds as evidence of the perceived relative strengths and weaknesses of various teams. The rest of us should be able to discuss this stuff in a football forum without having to put up with crybaby nonsense if Vegas doesn't like your team as much as you do.

The "books are smarter" when it comes to making money, which relies heavily on people's perception of what will happen. They generally aim to balance the $ coming in on each team. Ideally, the same amount of $ will be bet on every team which guarantees the book makes money. That's all the odds represent, the rate needed to get people to bet on each team.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Blah blah blah.Again...I guess they should cancel the NFL season...I mean Vegas has spoken. They told us who is the best.

This is an ignorant and immature post.Vegas odds are relevant to anyone who takes football, including fantasy football, seriously. Very simply, the books are smarter than you are. If you are more knowledgeable than the books when it comes to football, then you should be wealthy beyond your wildest dreams. If you are not, then admit that Vegas knows more than you, and let people offer up bookmaker odds as evidence of the perceived relative strengths and weaknesses of various teams. The rest of us should be able to discuss this stuff in a football forum without having to put up with crybaby nonsense if Vegas doesn't like your team as much as you do.

The "books are smarter" when it comes to making money, which relies heavily on people's perception of what will happen. They generally aim to balance the $ coming in on each team. Ideally, the same amount of $ will be bet on every team which guarantees the book makes money. That's all the odds represent, the rate needed to get people to bet on each team.

That is sometimes but not always true.Nevertheless, the point remains. The collective opinion offered by the Vegas odds on future outcomes in the NFL is more valid than the opionion of any poster here. If not, then that poster should be retired and living on their own tropical island somewhere. In any event, to dismiss their value out of hand because they don't think as highly of your team as you do is immature and adds nothing to the conversation.

 

[FUBAR]

Blah blah blah.Again...I guess they should cancel the NFL season...I mean Vegas has spoken. They told us who is the best.

This is an ignorant and immature post.Vegas odds are relevant to anyone who takes football, including fantasy football, seriously. Very simply, the books are smarter than you are. If you are more knowledgeable than the books when it comes to football, then you should be wealthy beyond your wildest dreams. If you are not, then admit that Vegas knows more than you, and let people offer up bookmaker odds as evidence of the perceived relative strengths and weaknesses of various teams. The rest of us should be able to discuss this stuff in a football forum without having to put up with crybaby nonsense if Vegas doesn't like your team as much as you do.

The "books are smarter" when it comes to making money, which relies heavily on people's perception of what will happen. They generally aim to balance the $ coming in on each team. Ideally, the same amount of $ will be bet on every team which guarantees the book makes money. That's all the odds represent, the rate needed to get people to bet on each team.

That is sometimes but not always true.Nevertheless, the point remains. The collective opinion offered by the Vegas odds on future outcomes in the NFL is more valid than the opionion of any poster here. If not, then that poster should be retired and living on their own tropical island somewhere. In any event, to dismiss their value out of hand because they don't think as highly of your team as you do is immature and adds nothing to the conversation.

we could go back and forth on this all day, although I don't think we completely disagree. Perhaps they're relevant, but just like in FF or in life in general, we all have our opinions and Vegas is but a collection of those opinions. That's why we're here, to dismiss a poster simply because he disagrees with the wisdom of Vegas is no better than the opposite.

 

[cvnpoka]

no one dismissed his argument. its simply a counter argument. joe internet from green bay, to paraphrase, said "packers have a sick offense and are the best team in the nfc "

we are saying, well, dudes with a lot riding on it, with a long history of making money on such predictions, do not think the packers are favorites.

joe green bay responded by scoffing "then we should cancel the season."

you tell me who is being dismissive?

 

[grateful zed]

bump

 

[Buffaloes]

Threads that are asking for advice on how you should draft or manage your team belong in The Assistant Coach forum.

 

[sho nuff]

To all that think my statement was ignorant.

Tell me what were Arizona's odds last offseason?

The Giants the year before?

The point is...that those just bringing up Vegas odds and thinking GB has little to no shot because of them are being very shortsighted.

 

[FUBAR]

no one dismissed his argument. its simply a counter argument. joe internet from green bay, to paraphrase, said "packers have a sick offense and are the best team in the nfc "we are saying, well, dudes with a lot riding on it, with a long history of making money on such predictions, do not think the packers are favorites.joe green bay responded by scoffing "then we should cancel the season."you tell me who is being dismissive?

Reading through the comments shows me that one guy stated his opinion, that's all. You disagreed with it by using Vegas, to which he basically said "we'll see". and people wonder why the pool gets a bad rep

 

[Aaronstory]

But this Marshall stuff is getting ridiculous. These guys that refuse to honor their contracts are the scum of the earth. From what I know about Greg Jennings he's a very stand-up guy, so if anyone would be able to handle this it'd be him. But if there's any truth to this I wouldn't blame him for getting pissed about it.

didn't Jennings holdout a couple years back?

Um, no.This whole thing is a made up piece of BS by some hack site. No audio has ever been provided and they won't even say WHAT station this was supposedly said on. Butler, as indicated above, hasn't mentioned it anywhere else. Complete and utter crap.