Should there be a Men's Rights movement? (1 Viewer)

[rockaction]

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Bring the kilos.

I also enjoy when the feminist left and the evangelicals get together and tell everybody how to run their lives and manage their business. It works well.

As far as syntax…we can obsess about speaking in tongues…well, that's what both of the aforementioned are great at.

 

[Ilov80s]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school. They are more likely to stay out of trouble, complete their work, participate in class and as a result get better grades on average. I would love to hsve a class of all girls. Teenage boys are obnoxious and generally unmotivated. I would say in most every class I have ever taught, 7 of the top 10 final grades are female.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Yep, this discussion seems typically feminist.

Dismissal of rape and battery by women. Check.

Useless citations toward representative make-up of government. Check.

Painting the intellectual positions of your opponents as crazy. Check.

Temperance movement and evangelicals checking in. Check.

We've got the idiot left (Lutherman2112, who Godwinned the thread) and the evangelical right (Jayrod the porn aficionado) working together to ensure us all that the proper and personal result is being reached. Working well.

I'm convinced more than ever there's time for a movement.

You might want to check the meaning of terms before using them, jr.

But here is a helpful hint:

Mens Rights Movement‏@MensMrm
@alta_aydin Nazis were far more better than feminists.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys’ tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

 

[Jayrod]

Yep, this discussion seems typically feminist.

Dismissal of rape and battery by women. Check.

Useless citations toward representative make-up of government. Check.

Painting the intellectual positions of your opponents as crazy. Check.

Temperance movement and evangelicals checking in. Check.

We've got the idiot left (Lutherman2112, who Godwinned the thread) and the evangelical right (Jayrod the porn aficionado) working together to ensure us all that the proper and personal result is being reached. Working well.

I'm convinced more than ever there's time for a movement.

The only thing I'm arguing is that your post was rambling and contained typos. Outside of that, I haven't expressed any opinion on the subject.

At least if your writing career falls apart, you can fall back on your reading comprehension skills.

And again, sick burn, brah.

 

[Jayrod]

For the record, if I were to choose, I would support a Men's Rights Movement rather than not.

I think it is a little bit early to be panicking about the decline of men's rights, but I'm 100% wholeheartedly in agreement with the problems in the rights of fathers during custody battles. And I have no reason to believe that rockaction's friends weren't raped by women. I've never seen such things, but I don't think it is outside of the realm of possibility.

 

[chauncey]

Man in the yellow hat?!?!?!

Ahemm, update please?

 

[popsecret]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school. They are more likely to stay out of trouble, complete their work, participate in class and as a result get better grades on average. I would love to hsve a class of all girls. Teenage boys are obnoxious and generally unmotivated. I would say in most every class I have ever taught, 7 of the top 10 final grades are female.

oh really?

 

[Rick James]

Men receive heavier prison sentences than women for the same crimes

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html

 

[Ilov80s]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

 

[tdoss]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

Boys have more testosterone and are more hands on learners. Today's teachers and students are more geared towards the ways girls learn. A boy has too much energy...we label him ADHD and put him on drugs. Nevermind the constant feminization of everything in our society lately. You can't have competition for boys without someone wanting to do away with scoring. Everyone gets a trophy. EVERYTHING is labeled bullying behavior nowadays and does anyone even know where to get a damned dodgeball anymore?

 

[Jayrod]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

Boys have more testosterone and are more hands on learners. Today's teachers and students are more geared towards the ways girls learn. A boy has too much energy...we label him ADHD and put him on drugs. Nevermind the constant feminization of everything in our society lately. You can't have competition for boys without someone wanting to do away with scoring. Everyone gets a trophy. EVERYTHING is labeled bullying behavior nowadays and does anyone even know where to get a damned dodgeball anymore?

This may be a slight overreaction, but I personally believe the elimination of dodgeball from American Physical Education programs will ultimately lead to our downfall as a civilization.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

Boys have more testosterone and are more hands on learners. Today's teachers and students are more geared towards the ways girls learn. A boy has too much energy...we label him ADHD and put him on drugs. Nevermind the constant feminization of everything in our society lately. You can't have competition for boys without someone wanting to do away with scoring. Everyone gets a trophy. EVERYTHING is labeled bullying behavior nowadays and does anyone even know where to get a damned dodgeball anymore?

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

 

[Ilov80s]

Almost every chronic illness affects men more often than women.

Of the top 15 leading causes of death...men lead in 12 categories, tie in 2 categories and trail in only 1. Based on some of that knowledge...the California Department of Health suggested the creation of a Men's Health Office...but it was never formed. Conversely, there are numerous Federal offices for Women's Health and similar offices at every level of government. Breast Cancer is a vacuum for Cancer research funds. The National Cancer Institute spent about four times more on breast cancer research than prostate cancer research for decades. All other sources, including the Dept. of Defense, fund breast cancer at far higher and disproportionate rates compared to prostate cancer. Maybe women are dying four times as much? Nope...about 39K die of breast cancer...30K men die of prostate cancer every year. But no teams are wearing brown jerseys or whatever alternative to pink in order to promote research for prostate cancer.

Equality is BS...it's just a token trotted out by whatever group in order to try to get an unfair advantage. People are up in arms in order to have women in the trenches...out there fighting alongside men...but those same groups aren't saying anything about including women in the Selective Service.

To be fair, women don't really care about the a guy's prostate. Men care care more than even women do about ####. Saving boobs is good for both genders.

 

[Ilov80s]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

Boys have more testosterone and are more hands on learners. Today's teachers and students are more geared towards the ways girls learn. A boy has too much energy...we label him ADHD and put him on drugs. Nevermind the constant feminization of everything in our society lately. You can't have competition for boys without someone wanting to do away with scoring. Everyone gets a trophy. EVERYTHING is labeled bullying behavior nowadays and does anyone even know where to get a damned dodgeball anymore?

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

There is truth to this, but I don't think it it has as much to do with women taking over the role as primary teachers (that has always been the case). The biggest issues are the standards and unification of standards across broader boundaries. You can't have individualized education plans and at the same time say every kid must learn all the same things at the same time. This is one of the areas that special education is really struggling with. The idea behind special ed. is that each student has an IEP (ind. ed. plan) that is updated annually and it essentially is suppose to create an individual pathway so that by the end of their time in public schools, that student can be as productive and independent of a person as possible. However, it doesn't work when the kids have to now follow all the same curriculum, meet the same objectives and take the same standardized tests as everyone else. Schools are under growing pressure to ramp up academics at an earlier and earlier age. There is little time for recess or playing or having anyone disrupt the learning. Kindergartens are canceling school plays so that more time can be devoted to college prep. Elementary schools are replacing music with more reading and writing. I don't believe it is the fault of women, it is the fault of the legislators crafting these policies in the first place. They are mostly men.

 

[popsecret]

Almost every chronic illness affects men more often than women.

Of the top 15 leading causes of death...men lead in 12 categories, tie in 2 categories and trail in only 1. Based on some of that knowledge...the California Department of Health suggested the creation of a Men's Health Office...but it was never formed. Conversely, there are numerous Federal offices for Women's Health and similar offices at every level of government. Breast Cancer is a vacuum for Cancer research funds. The National Cancer Institute spent about four times more on breast cancer research than prostate cancer research for decades. All other sources, including the Dept. of Defense, fund breast cancer at far higher and disproportionate rates compared to prostate cancer. Maybe women are dying four times as much? Nope...about 39K die of breast cancer...30K men die of prostate cancer every year. But no teams are wearing brown jerseys or whatever alternative to pink in order to promote research for prostate cancer.

Equality is BS...it's just a token trotted out by whatever group in order to try to get an unfair advantage. People are up in arms in order to have women in the trenches...out there fighting alongside men...but those same groups aren't saying anything about including women in the Selective Service.

To be fair, women don't really care about the a guy's prostate. Men care care more than even women do about ####. Saving boobs is good for both genders.

actually you aren't being fair. But this is coming from a teacher that only wants to teach females, so how could I expect you to be fair

 

[Lutherman2112]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

Boys have more testosterone and are more hands on learners. Today's teachers and students are more geared towards the ways girls learn. A boy has too much energy...we label him ADHD and put him on drugs. Nevermind the constant feminization of everything in our society lately. You can't have competition for boys without someone wanting to do away with scoring. Everyone gets a trophy. EVERYTHING is labeled bullying behavior nowadays and does anyone even know where to get a damned dodgeball anymore?

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

Prager University

 

[Lutherman2112]

Would like to hear from some Men's Rights advocates regarding what the movement is doing about prison rape.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

One thing that seems off is if you have a son and a daughter your daughter is 50% more likely to go to college than your son. I know college isn't everything, but it's a pretty good indicator of future success.

As a high school teacher, that is easy to explain and has nothing to do with discrimination. Females are vastly more mature and are simply better students in high school.

There is absolutely no evidence to backup this statement. At all.

Females perform better because classrooms and curriculum are geared toward female learning styles. Girls are far more likely to sit quietly and stay on task. That's not a maturity issue. That's just the nature of it it.

-------

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/02/the-boys-at-the-back/?_r=0

WHAT might we do to help boys improve? For one thing, we can follow the example of the British, the Canadians and the Australians. They have openly addressed the problem of male underachievement. They are not indulging boys tendency to be inattentive. Instead, they are experimenting with programs to help them become more organized, focused and engaged. These include more boy-friendly reading assignments (science fiction, fantasy, sports, espionage, battles); more recess (where boys can engage in rough-and-tumble as a respite from classroom routine); campaigns to encourage male literacy; more single-sex classes; and more male teachers (and female teachers interested in the pedagogical challenges boys pose).

It's a fact that female brains reach maturity earlier than male brains. there's a lot of research on this.

Boys have more testosterone and are more hands on learners. Today's teachers and students are more geared towards the ways girls learn. A boy has too much energy...we label him ADHD and put him on drugs. Nevermind the constant feminization of everything in our society lately. You can't have competition for boys without someone wanting to do away with scoring. Everyone gets a trophy. EVERYTHING is labeled bullying behavior nowadays and does anyone even know where to get a damned dodgeball anymore?

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

Prager University

Anything to actually add to the conversation? That talk is by someone that studies this particular area.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina_Hoff_Sommers

Occupation - Author, university professor, scholar at The American Enterprise Institute.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

Prager University

Anything to actually add to the conversation? That talk is by someone that studies this particular area.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina_Hoff_Sommers

Occupation - Author, university professor, scholar at The American Enterprise Institute.

I'll let the "about" description explain it all:

What We Do

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If you're ready to grow intellectually, we're ready for you.

Click on a course and let's get started!

It's a shot of espresso for your brain!

 

[AAAll-Stars]

Men receive heavier prison sentences than women for the same crimes

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html

This alone should necessitate a Men's Rights movement. This is beyond unacceptable. Feminism says it's trying to help men as well but when it ignores things like this, it loses credibility in this regard.

It's stuff like this which is why there needs to be some sort of Men's Rights movement. I can understand how an idea like "Men's Rights" sounds crazy with congress being 80% men. Maybe call it a Men's Equality movement?

 

[AAAll-Stars]

Would like to hear from some Men's Rights advocates regarding what the movement is doing about prison rape.

Right now, not much because the movement is just in it's infancy. But it needs to happen.

Really think about what it means to be raped as a man? Think long and hard about that experience and how it would effect you. Then think about how society jokes about it and trivializes it.

Not only is it terrible and it needs to be stopped, but society is complicit in our jocular attitudes toward it. Rape is never acceptable.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

Prager University

Anything to actually add to the conversation? That talk is by someone that studies this particular area.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina_Hoff_Sommers

Occupation - Author, university professor, scholar at The American Enterprise Institute.

I'll let the "about" description explain it all:

What We Do

Prager University is an online resource promoting knowledge and clarity.

We are not an accredited academic institution. And we don't want to be.

All our courses are free.

There are no fees, no tuition, books, homework assignments, or grueling midterms here - just clear, life-changing insights and ideas from world-renowned thinkers on subjects as diverse as political science, economics, history, philosophy, and psychology. There are also no long, boring, can't-keep-my-eyes-open lectures. All our courses are five minutes long. That's right, five minutes.

Our faculty gets right to the point. That point is supported by cutting edge, visually-compelling, entertaining images and animation. Just as a shot of espresso boosts your energy, a shot of Prager University boosts your brain. Because not only will you have more knowledge, you will have more clarity. You'll get one other thing, a true-value added component of a Prager University education – wisdom.

If you're ready to grow intellectually, we're ready for you.

Click on a course and let's get started!

It's a shot of espresso for your brain!

Great point. No need to actually listen to the scholar with real data.

 

[Harry Manback]

All of history has pretty much been a Men's rights movement.

Going from one extreme to the next isn't the right move either.It seems that is how we do things around here.

The middle ground is a nice place, we should try to go there more often.

Get back to me when the pervasive view, in society and the law, is men are essentially property for their wives to do with as they please. Or when men are having their sex organs mutilated and being committed to institutions because they are depressed.Then we will have swung from one extreme to the other.

Did you miss the part where he asked for middle ground?

No I didn't miss what you said. But here's the thing whiny. We aren't even close to middle ground now. And all this stupid mens right talks is just code for we want the 50's back. Well that ship sailed so get over it.

Didn't the economy improve by 20 percent from the 50s to the 70s? Read that somewhere, just curious.

Anyways, I would say we are passed middle ground and women definitely have an advantage over men and unless people speak up about it and complain it will only get worse.

Middle ground please, that means we as a society don't give women a pass for molesting a boy when they are a teacher.

That means we as a society don't always let women win every divorce.

That means we as a society don't laugh at men that get raped

Those women go to jail who have sex with a 17 year old boy some of us would say he was within his rights to get some why do you hate men? I know plenty of men who "won" their divorce maybe get better lawyers. And very few men get raped. According to the CDC the number is less than 5% men raped by women. Male on male rape is too under reported to get good numbers but it happens. Now on the other hand 20% of women have been raped or attempted to be raped by men.

Wait...you're a smart guy...do you honestly not think female on male rape is not undereported as well? Or do you not think that's something that happens?

 

[chauncey]

Prison rape? Teenage male brain development? Not the direction I thought this thread would go. Any thoughts on male divorce rape? The hysterical (and fictional) "date rape" culture that feminists and the media are pushing? The absolute ####ification and emasculation of men in the media? This country hates men. Most of us have been drinking the kool aid too long to even recognize it.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Exactly right. Girls brains mature based on what? How we want students to learn? How we want female students to learn? There's a lot more to this. For a society that can individualize just about anything, I find it hard to believe we can't adjust education to the individual in way that best sets that student up for success.

This is a nice summary:

http://prageruniversity.com/Political-Science/War-on-Boys.html#.VK2p9SvF98E

Some more reading for you as well:

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

http://www.esquire.com/features/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414

Prager University

Anything to actually add to the conversation? That talk is by someone that studies this particular area.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina_Hoff_Sommers

Occupation - Author, university professor, scholar at The American Enterprise Institute.

I'll let the "about" description explain it all:

What We Do

Prager University is an online resource promoting knowledge and clarity.

We are not an accredited academic institution. And we don't want to be.

All our courses are free.

There are no fees, no tuition, books, homework assignments, or grueling midterms here - just clear, life-changing insights and ideas from world-renowned thinkers on subjects as diverse as political science, economics, history, philosophy, and psychology. There are also no long, boring, can't-keep-my-eyes-open lectures. All our courses are five minutes long. That's right, five minutes.

Our faculty gets right to the point. That point is supported by cutting edge, visually-compelling, entertaining images and animation. Just as a shot of espresso boosts your energy, a shot of Prager University boosts your brain. Because not only will you have more knowledge, you will have more clarity. You'll get one other thing, a true-value added component of a Prager University education – wisdom.

If you're ready to grow intellectually, we're ready for you.

Click on a course and let's get started!

It's a shot of espresso for your brain!

Great point. No need to actually listen to the scholar with real data.

I've read Sommers's book back when the title was War Against Boys; How Misguided Feminism Is Harming Our Young Men. It has since been re-released with a slight title change: War Against Boys; How Misguided Policy Is Harming Our Young Men. It was included as part of the required reading from my adviser when I went back to school to get my teaching certification. I was also required to read Raising Cain: Protecting the Emotional Life of Boys, Real Boys: Rescuing Our Boys From the Myths of Boyhood, and Reviving Ophelia.

For "Prager University" (i am still laughing at it) to boil a 300 page book down to 5 minutes is hilarious. Sommers made some great points in her book, but she seemed to be more detailed in her efforts to take down and discredit the work of psychologist and feminist Carol Gilligan.

A few years ago I left public education to work for a private non-profit child welfare organization as an education coordinator. I decided not to renew my contract as the work was emotionally trying and I fell into depression. I am currently working as a substitute teacher hoping to land a full time position soon. I frequently work at the district's worst performing middle school, as most subs do not want to deal with the unruly students....boys and girls.

Also, I was an under performing student. I was suspended from school on several occasions, with 10 days being the longest "punishment". I struggled in college, and at the age of 20 my parents paid for testing to determine if I had a learning disability. I didn't, but was initially diagnosed as an adult with ADD (it was an undifferentiated diagnosis, and further testing determine a diagnosis of ADHD from a neuropsychologist). At the age of 8, I was molested by the teenage brother of a friend (never got to confront the guy as he killed himself when I was 12) I know what some boys are going through.

In addition to subbing, I have had several teachers refer parents to me as a tutor. I have worked with 5 students since September; still working with 2. In each case, these students were not given to tools to succede (discipline, organizational skills, value of education). All the parents of my students did not attend college, and the two single mothers dropped out of school; one has her GED. While I have helped these boys become better students, but the biggest difference has been the parental involvement. With a few exceptions (extreme trauma, behavior disorders, autism, etc) I believe boys and young men can thrive in school, regardless of the "feminist" policies.

That's my two cents.

 

[Lutherman2112]

This country hates men. Most of us have been drinking the kool aid too long to even recognize it.

No, this country hates whiny men that blame others for their own shortcomings.

 

[tdoss]

This country hates men. Most of us have been drinking the kool aid too long to even recognize it.

No, this country hates whiny men that blame others for their own shortcomings.

Huh?

How does someone point out the issues with child custody, healthcare, justice in the court system equate to someone blaming someone for some supposed shortcomings? No one here is saying they lost their damned kids, died of cancer or is posting from jail right now.

Guys are just pointing out issues and inconsistencies within the "equal rights" movement.

Equal rights for everyone...Unless you're talking about males.

Rape is a concern...Unless you're talking about prison rape.

Black Lives matter...Unless you're talking about black on black violence.

I swear...I don't understand how some people resolve this circular way of thinking.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Child custody is a result of fathers giving up.

Healthcare and disease? Women participate in preventative care at higher rates than men.

Justice/sentencing? Check out the recidivism rates by gender.

Rape? Men's movement show great concern about false reporting of women, yet doesn't do crap for jailed men.

Don't know where this black lives matter falls on men's rights.

So what are we to do? Force men into custody? Would that be good for the children?

Force men to participate in preventative care? How do we do that? Fine them? Prison?

 

[Ignoramus]

Men receive heavier prison sentences than women for the same crimes

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html

This alone should necessitate a Men's Rights movement. This is beyond unacceptable. Feminism says it's trying to help men as well but when it ignores things like this, it loses credibility in this regard.It's stuff like this which is why there needs to be some sort of Men's Rights movement. I can understand how an idea like "Men's Rights" sounds crazy with congress being 80% men. Maybe call it a Men's Equality movement?

Wait! I don't want equality; I'm pretty happy with the status quo, thank you very much.

 

[tdoss]

Child custody is a result of fathers giving up.

Healthcare and disease? Women participate in preventative care at higher rates than men.

Justice/sentencing? Check out the recidivism rates by gender.

Rape? Men's movement show great concern about false reporting of women, yet doesn't do crap for jailed men.

Don't know where this black lives matter falls on men's rights.

So what are we to do? Force men into custody? Would that be good for the children?

Force men to participate in preventative care? How do we do that? Fine them? Prison?

How does forcing men to do preventative care cause the Cancer Institute to supply equal funds for prostate cancer as it does breast cancer research?

Maybe if there was a men's health initiative and men's health offices at every level of government, men might get the idea at a young age to start preventative care.

The problem is not simply men not caring...it's that even when men show concern it gets met with the type of derision you're showing now.

 

[tdoss]

Child custody is a result of fathers giving up.

Healthcare and disease? Women participate in preventative care at higher rates than men.

Justice/sentencing? Check out the recidivism rates by gender.

Rape? Men's movement show great concern about false reporting of women, yet doesn't do crap for jailed men.

Don't know where this black lives matter falls on men's rights.

So what are we to do? Force men into custody? Would that be good for the children?

Force men to participate in preventative care? How do we do that? Fine them? Prison?

Conversely...do you take the same stance when women bring up equality?

Do you deride them for wanting to be on the front lines but not fighting to be included in the Selective Service?

When women talk about equal pay, do you point out:

Greater percentage of women work part time?

Greater percentage of women leave workforce for child birth, child care and elder care?

Women with children typically look for more "family friendly" workplaces (instead of competitive pay)?

Pay gap doesn't typically separate overtime, of which 90% is done by men?

Studies show that men generally prioritize money, while women prioritize flexibility, shorter hours, shorter commutes, less physical risk...and other factors that are conducive to them being the primary parents (something that you've already explained as men "making a choice to not be the guardian")

Hazard pay...of which men typically do the more hazardous jobs.

Women typically choose careers and degrees that are lower in pay.

When women say there's not enough women in power...do you tell them there's nothing stopping them from running for office?

 

[proninja]

I guess some group needed to be the new white power

 

[tdoss]

Since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, there have been over 1,200 executions in the United States.

Eleven of them, or less than 1%, were women.

This stands in stark contrast considering women commit, by DOJ estimates, 10% of all murders, are involved in 35% of all domestic homicides (are involved often means they get other people to kill for them) and nearly 30% of murders where the victim was another family member.

 

[tdoss]

[SIZE=11pt]Men pay the majority of social security taxes and are outlived by six years by women, but the government makes no fair adjustment to how/when those funds are distributed.[/SIZE]

 

[Jayrod]

[SIZE=11pt]Men pay the majority of social security taxes and are outlived by six years by women, but the government makes no fair adjustment to how/when those funds are distributed.[/SIZE]

Social security benefits take into account actual earnings throughout your life.

 

[tdoss]

Men pay the majority of social security taxes and are outlived by six years by women, but the government makes no fair adjustment to how/when those funds are distributed.

Social security benefits take into account actual earnings throughout your life.

Sure...but we're dead already while women get to collect theirs.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Looks like it's spoon feeding time: Why does breast cancer research receive more research funding than prostate cancer?

Summary

A few take home messages:

Breast cancer and prostate cancer affect different people, not only in terms of gender but also in terms of age.

Breast cancer kills young women and kills mothers while their children are young. The reason for our fear (and, as a result, our funding) of breast cancer is that it can strike at almost any time and poses a considerable risk when women do suffer from it.

Prostate cancer, by and large, kills older men. While no less of a tragedy, these men have lived long lives and are at greatly increased risk from a range of other ailments (heart disease among them). The theory of more aggressive prostate cancers in younger (whatever that means) men is poorly supported.

The MRA movement cites statistics that do not reveal these important differences.

Finally, the priorities of funding agencies are not simply the number of people dying from a particular condition. The funding landscape is complex, designed around current advances, where the best researchers are located, the best proposals for funding, political will, and a host of other variables.

Data sourced and cited at link.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, there have been over 1,200 executions in the United States.

Eleven of them, or less than 1%, were women.

This stands in stark contrast considering women commit, by DOJ estimates, 10% of all murders, are involved in 35% of all domestic homicides (are involved often means they get other people to kill for them) and nearly 30% of murders where the victim was another family member.

You are correct, there is a huge gender bias with regard to the application of the death penalty. The problem is not one of of law, but of perception by prosecutors and juries that women are weak, passive, and in need of male protection.

The change this, one must change society's views because mandatory death sentences were deemed unconstitutional in Woodson v. North Carolina.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, there have been over 1,200 executions in the United States.

Eleven of them, or less than 1%, were women.

This stands in stark contrast considering women commit, by DOJ estimates, 10% of all murders, are involved in 35% of all domestic homicides (are involved often means they get other people to kill for them) and nearly 30% of murders where the victim was another family member.

You are correct, there is a huge gender bias with regard to the application of the death penalty. The problem is not one of of law, but of perception by prosecutors and juries that women are weak, passive, and in need of male protection.

The change this, one must change society's views because mandatory death sentences were deemed unconstitutional in Woodson v. North Carolina.

Or we could just eliminate the death penalty for everyone. That would even things out nicely.

 

[tdoss]

Looks like it's spoon feeding time: Why does breast cancer research receive more research funding than prostate cancer?

Summary

A few take home messages:

Breast cancer and prostate cancer affect different people, not only in terms of gender but also in terms of age.

Breast cancer kills young women and kills mothers while their children are young. The reason for our fear (and, as a result, our funding) of breast cancer is that it can strike at almost any time and poses a considerable risk when women do suffer from it.

Prostate cancer, by and large, kills older men. While no less of a tragedy, these men have lived long lives and are at greatly increased risk from a range of other ailments (heart disease among them). The theory of more aggressive prostate cancers in younger (whatever that means) men is poorly supported.

The MRA movement cites statistics that do not reveal these important differences.

Finally, the priorities of funding agencies are not simply the number of people dying from a particular condition. The funding landscape is complex, designed around current advances, where the best researchers are located, the best proposals for funding, political will, and a host of other variables.

Data sourced and cited at link.

So...you're admitting that the practice is not only sexist...but age-ist?How the hell is that a viable defense in today's "equality seeking" society?

I guess we should be happy that you're moving your argument from "whiny men blaming others" to "Yes...This policy is sexist and age-ist".

That's progress.

 

[tdoss]

What about the practice of women getting cheaper car insurance policies?

They're involved in less accidents?

Says who?!

Men drive disproportionately more than women. Even if you take out all of the truck drivers, construction and medical/emergency driving...men drive way more than women.

If you factored in time behind the wheel...there's NO way women can be considered better drivers.

Hell...I challenge you right now to go to lunch or go pick up some wine at Trader Joes and not be bombarded by horrible women drivers making turns with no signals or turning across lanes last second because they JUST made their mind up that moment, texting while putting on makeup or pulling 21 point turns just to back out of a parking spot.

Be honest...Most of us have wives...you've got a car in your driveway right now that has a dent on it somewhere that your wife put on it.

 

[Lutherman2112]

What about the practice of women getting cheaper car insurance policies?

They're involved in less accidents?

Says who?!

Men drive disproportionately more than women. Even if you take out all of the truck drivers, construction and medical/emergency driving...men drive way more than women.

If you factored in time behind the wheel...there's NO way women can be considered better drivers.

Hell...I challenge you right now to go to lunch or go pick up some wine at Trader Joes and not be bombarded by horrible women drivers making turns with no signals or turning across lanes last second because they JUST made their mind up that moment, texting while putting on makeup or pulling 21 point turns just to back out of a parking spot.

Be honest...Most of us have wives...you've got a car in your driveway right now that has a dent on it somewhere that your wife put on it.

You think that actuaries for multibillion dollar industry are going to risk state and federal penalties for fudging their numbers just to make money off men?

You are dense.

 

[tdoss]

What about the practice of women getting cheaper car insurance policies?

They're involved in less accidents?

Says who?!

Men drive disproportionately more than women. Even if you take out all of the truck drivers, construction and medical/emergency driving...men drive way more than women.

If you factored in time behind the wheel...there's NO way women can be considered better drivers.

Hell...I challenge you right now to go to lunch or go pick up some wine at Trader Joes and not be bombarded by horrible women drivers making turns with no signals or turning across lanes last second because they JUST made their mind up that moment, texting while putting on makeup or pulling 21 point turns just to back out of a parking spot.

Be honest...Most of us have wives...you've got a car in your driveway right now that has a dent on it somewhere that your wife put on it.

You think that actuaries for multibillion dollar industry are going to risk state and federal penalties for fudging their numbers just to make money off men?

You are dense.

Who said fudging?

What's with you, guy?

You're antagonistic as f**k.

What alias is this? No one with this level of schmuckitude could go unnoticed for very long.

It's real simple...I'll use you're spoon feeding reference to show you how it's done.

Insurance companies look at X number of men and women. They find that men are in more accidents. Slam dunk...charge them more.

Do they take into account the time behind the wheel? Guy #1 is behind the wheel 4 hours per day on average. Girl #1 is behind the wheel 1 hour per day.

Guy #1 has been in two accidents in five years. Girl #1 has been in one accident within that same timeframe.

Guy traveled 7304 hours with 2 accidents.

Girl traveled 1826 hours with one accident.

Even though he is getting into an accident once in 3652 hours versus her getting into an accident once in 1826 hours...he gets higher rate.

Be honest...Your car has a dent your wife put into it backing up...

 

[Lutherman2112]

What about the practice of women getting cheaper car insurance policies?

They're involved in less accidents?

Says who?!

Men drive disproportionately more than women. Even if you take out all of the truck drivers, construction and medical/emergency driving...men drive way more than women.

If you factored in time behind the wheel...there's NO way women can be considered better drivers.

Hell...I challenge you right now to go to lunch or go pick up some wine at Trader Joes and not be bombarded by horrible women drivers making turns with no signals or turning across lanes last second because they JUST made their mind up that moment, texting while putting on makeup or pulling 21 point turns just to back out of a parking spot.

Be honest...Most of us have wives...you've got a car in your driveway right now that has a dent on it somewhere that your wife put on it.

You think that actuaries for multibillion dollar industry are going to risk state and federal penalties for fudging their numbers just to make money off men?

You are dense.

Who said fudging?

What's with you, guy?

You're antagonistic as f**k.

What alias is this? No one with this level of schmuckitude could go unnoticed for very long.

It's real simple...I'll use you're spoon feeding reference to show you how it's done.

Insurance companies look at X number of men and women. They find that men are in more accidents. Slam dunk...charge them more.

Do they take into account the time behind the wheel? Guy #1 is behind the wheel 4 hours per day on average. Girl #1 is behind the wheel 1 hour per day.

Guy #1 has been in two accidents in five years. Girl #1 has been in one accident within that same timeframe.

Guy traveled 7304 hours with 2 accidents.

Girl traveled 1826 hours with one accident.

Even though he is getting into an accident once in 3652 hours versus her getting into an accident once in 1826 hours...he gets higher rate.

Be honest...Your car has a dent your wife put into it backing up...

You'd have to ask an actuary...which a field dominated by men. You think men are purposefully screwing over men? Jeebus you are such a dolt.

You ask a bunch of questions that are basically cannards that I have shot down with actual stats. You can lead a fool to facts, but you have truly proven that you can't make the fool cognizant.

Carry on with your whiny ### titty baby victimhood. Me? I'd rather thrive regardless of what the world throws at me.

 

[urbanhack]

Men pay the majority of social security taxes and are outlived by six years by women, but the government makes no fair adjustment to how/when those funds are distributed.

Social security benefits take into account actual earnings throughout your life.

Sure...but we're dead already while women get to collect theirs.

We should probably look at this once men and women starting earning the same salary for doing the same job.

 

[Lutherman2112]

For those of you men that aren't insecure dolts that find life easier mimicking others people's thoughts rather than think about issues for yourself, I give you this interesting read:

Armed Conflict Deaths Disaggregated by Gender

 

[tdoss]

What about the practice of women getting cheaper car insurance policies?

They're involved in less accidents?

Says who?!

Men drive disproportionately more than women. Even if you take out all of the truck drivers, construction and medical/emergency driving...men drive way more than women.

If you factored in time behind the wheel...there's NO way women can be considered better drivers.

Hell...I challenge you right now to go to lunch or go pick up some wine at Trader Joes and not be bombarded by horrible women drivers making turns with no signals or turning across lanes last second because they JUST made their mind up that moment, texting while putting on makeup or pulling 21 point turns just to back out of a parking spot.

Be honest...Most of us have wives...you've got a car in your driveway right now that has a dent on it somewhere that your wife put on it.

You think that actuaries for multibillion dollar industry are going to risk state and federal penalties for fudging their numbers just to make money off men?

You are dense.

Who said fudging?What's with you, guy?

You're antagonistic as f**k.

What alias is this? No one with this level of schmuckitude could go unnoticed for very long.

It's real simple...I'll use you're spoon feeding reference to show you how it's done.

Insurance companies look at X number of men and women. They find that men are in more accidents. Slam dunk...charge them more.

Do they take into account the time behind the wheel? Guy #1 is behind the wheel 4 hours per day on average. Girl #1 is behind the wheel 1 hour per day.

Guy #1 has been in two accidents in five years. Girl #1 has been in one accident within that same timeframe.

Guy traveled 7304 hours with 2 accidents.

Girl traveled 1826 hours with one accident.

Even though he is getting into an accident once in 3652 hours versus her getting into an accident once in 1826 hours...he gets higher rate.

Be honest...Your car has a dent your wife put into it backing up...

You'd have to ask an actuary...which a field dominated by men. You think men are purposefully screwing over men? Jeebus you are such a dolt.

You ask a bunch of questions that are basically cannards that I have shot down with actual stats. You can lead a fool to facts, but you have truly proven that you can't make the fool cognizant.

Carry on with your whiny ### titty baby victimhood. Me? I'd rather thrive regardless of what the world throws at me.

Ah...so men won't screw over men for profit.

Gotcha.

Love the world you live in.

I explained my position...you continue to resort to name calling and just sidestep instead of refuting.

I can't understand your position because you won't define it.

My position is that men drive more than women...and their "accident rates" are therefore lower than women when time behind the wheel is considered.

Your position seems to be sidestepping and namecalling.

 

[tdoss]

Men pay the majority of social security taxes and are outlived by six years by women, but the government makes no fair adjustment to how/when those funds are distributed.

Social security benefits take into account actual earnings throughout your life.

Sure...but we're dead already while women get to collect theirs.

We should probably look at this once men and women starting earning the same salary for doing the same job.

The gap isn't as large as advertised when you consider all factors (most are detailed above).

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

If insurance companies charged by the mile, tdoss might have a point.