"Suck for ______" ...... who? (1 Viewer)

[cstu]

#1 pick will likely be Luke Joeckel, LT - Texas A&M

Would you like to bet on that?/Otis

 

[QuizGuy66]

#1 pick will likely be Luke Joeckel, LT - Texas A&M

So Suck For Luke?-QG

 

[QuizGuy66]

From NFL.com :

TIE-BREAKING PROCEDURE FOR SELECTION MEETING

1. Clubs not participating in the playoffs shall select in the first through 20th positions in reverse standings order.

2. The Super Bowl winner is last and Super Bowl loser is next-to-last.

3. The losers of the Conference Championship games shall select 29th and 30th based on won-lost-tied percentage.

4. The losers of the Divisional playoff games shall select 25th through 28th based on won-lost-tied percentage.

5. The losers of the Wild Card games shall select 21st through 24th based on won-lost-tied percentage.

If ties exist in any grouping except (2) above, such ties shall be broken by strength-of-schedule. If any ties cannot be broken by strength-of-schedule, the divisional or conference tie-breakers, if applicable, shall be applied. Any ties that still exist shall be broken by a coin flip.

----------------------------------

Strength of schedule rules over all.

It's clear from the above that if the Chiefs and Jags end up with the same strength of schedule, the Chiefs have the inside track over the Jags (since the Jags have 1 conference win and KC has 0).

The phrase "if applicable" seems to indicate that such tie-breakers are not used across the conference. That is the head-to-head game b/w Carolina and Kansas City does not matter in terms of the draft order.

-QG

 

[cstu]

It's clear from the above that if the Chiefs and Jags end up with the same strength of schedule, the Chiefs have the inside track over the Jags (since the Jags have 1 conference win and KC has 0).

What's their current SOS?

 

[QuizGuy66]

Let's see:

Jax plays Indy (6), Houston (8), and Tennessee (4) twice, the whole AFC East (16), NFC North (23), Cincy (4), and Oakland (3)

82 wins so far

KC plays Denver (6), Oakland (3), and San Diego (4)twice, the whole AFC North (19), NFC South (19), Buffalo (3), and Indy (6)

73 wins so far

Carolina plays Atlanta (8), NO (4), and TB (5) twice, the whole AFC West (14), NFC East (16), Seattle (6) and Chicago (7)

77 wins so far

Cleveland plays Cincy (4), Pitt (6), and Balt (7) twice, the whole AFC West (14), NFC East (16), Buffalo (3), and Indy (6)

73 wins so far

Cleveland is more of a player in this than I originally thought. Yeah I know a few teams have played 1 extra game, but that'll be worked out by next week and we'll have a "true" count.

-QG

 

[MAC_32]

Here's the thing though... if the Jags or Panthers end up first, they're not likely to draft another QB (Panthers less likely), and is anyone really going to trade up for Barkley or Smith? I'm not so sure...If Carolina ended up first, I could easily see Star Loutilie (SP definitely wrong) being the first pick.

If Carolina ends up #1 they won't be drafting a QB, but I also doubt they end up in that spot. They will find a way to take a couple of games. If Jax is #1 they are taking a QB though.

You may be underestimating Carolina's coaching staff's inability to win games they should...

If they're drafting first then cam is in trouble. Not losing his job trouble, yet anyway, but backup plans will be made

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Let's see:Jax plays Indy (6), Houston (8), and Tennessee (4) twice, the whole AFC East (16), NFC North (23), Cincy (4), and Oakland (3)82 wins so farKC plays Denver (6), Oakland (3), and San Diego (4)twice, the whole AFC North (19), NFC South (19), Buffalo (3), and Indy (6)73 wins so farCarolina plays Atlanta (8), NO (4), and TB (5) twice, the whole AFC West (14), NFC East (16), Seattle (6) and Chicago (7)77 wins so farCleveland plays Cincy (4), Pitt (6), and Balt (7) twice, the whole AFC West (14), NFC East (16), Buffalo (3), and Indy (6)73 wins so farCleveland is more of a player in this than I originally thought. Yeah I know a few teams have played 1 extra game, but that'll be worked out by next week and we'll have a "true" count.-QG

Well of the above teams who needs a QB? I think a case can be made for every team but Cleveland just took a QB in the first round and likely would stick with Weeden. I actually think that Carolina is a player for drafting a QB and the primary reason is they just hired former Browns and Giants GM Ernie Accorsi as a team consultant. Accorsi is a hired gun. His primary directive is to get the QB and build the team from the quarterback position. He wouldn't come in for any other reason in my humble opinion so I find the hiring of Accorsi to be VERY INTERESTING for Carolina and his hiring puts them in the market to draft or trade-up to draft a QB. Accorsi's history speaks for itself. He got a QB in Cleveland when he pulled off a bold trade to land Bernie Kosar and he also did the same thing in New York when he pulled off the bold trade to land Eli Manning. He retired five years ago till Carolina came calling.Carolina has Cam Newton. Cam Newton has incredible physical skills but he has reacted peculiar ways recently after losses and that sends up a red flag IMHO on whether or not he's 'thee-guy' to build a Super Bowl contending team around. The odd behavior by Newton and the hiring of Accorsi not long afterwards are not coincidental IMHO.I would put Carolina in the market for a QB.Oh and what to do with Cam? Well either trade-bait to move-up if need be or see what he'd fetch on the open market. Vince Young started out hot, Pro Bowler as a rookie, looked amazing. He went to a place where they currently have an older-injured QB. The 'Iggles' probably would love a crack at Cam if Accorsi put him up for auction and had his sites set on a young QB in the upcoming draft.I honestly don't know a thing about Geno or the other QB prospects yet but I saw the hiring of Ernie Accorsi by Carolina and I have noticed the odd and peculiar ways that Cam Newton has been acting and think it means they are players for a QB in next year's draft.

 

[cstu]

Let's see:Jax plays Indy (6), Houston (8), and Tennessee (4) twice, the whole AFC East (16), NFC North (23), Cincy (4), and Oakland (3)82 wins so farKC plays Denver (6), Oakland (3), and San Diego (4)twice, the whole AFC North (19), NFC South (19), Buffalo (3), and Indy (6)73 wins so farCarolina plays Atlanta (8), NO (4), and TB (5) twice, the whole AFC West (14), NFC East (16), Seattle (6) and Chicago (7)77 wins so farCleveland plays Cincy (4), Pitt (6), and Balt (7) twice, the whole AFC West (14), NFC East (16), Buffalo (3), and Indy (6)73 wins so farCleveland is more of a player in this than I originally thought. Yeah I know a few teams have played 1 extra game, but that'll be worked out by next week and we'll have a "true" count.-QG

Thanks, QG. Looks like the Chiefs are the heavy favorite and the Browns are the dark horse. Unless the Jags end up with the worst record outright they are going to be #2 at best.

 

[Donnybrook]

I can't see the Jets going with Sanchez for another season. I can't shake the feeling that they will be trading up again to get a QB.

 

[Time Kibitzer]

I think the idea that the Panthers are in the market for taking a QB in the 1st round are absurd. Newton's only a 2nd year player and his on field struggles are not out of the norm at all for a young QB. Sure he has more off field struggles than your average QB, but his talent level is so incredibly high he's easily worth keeping; especially when you take into account how weak the top of the QB class is this year. Carolina would be infinitely better off taking a DT, WR, or safety.

 

[JFS171]

Well of the above teams who needs a QB? I think a case can be made for every team but Cleveland just took a QB in the first round and likely would stick with Weeden.

I actually think that Carolina is a player for drafting a QB and the primary reason is they just hired former Browns and Giants GM Ernie Accorsi as a team consultant.

Accorsi is a hired gun. His primary directive is to get the QB and build the team from the quarterback position. He wouldn't come in for any other reason in my humble opinion so I find the hiring of Accorsi to be VERY INTERESTING for Carolina and his hiring puts them in the market to draft or trade-up to draft a QB.

Accorsi's history speaks for itself. He got a QB in Cleveland when he pulled off a bold trade to land Bernie Kosar and he also did the same thing in New York when he pulled off the bold trade to land Eli Manning. He retired five years ago till Carolina came calling.

Carolina has Cam Newton. Cam Newton has incredible physical skills but he has reacted peculiar ways recently after losses and that sends up a red flag IMHO on whether or not he's 'thee-guy' to build a Super Bowl contending team around. The odd behavior by Newton and the hiring of Accorsi not long afterwards are not coincidental IMHO.

I would put Carolina in the market for a QB.

Oh and what to do with Cam?

Well either trade-bait to move-up if need be or see what he'd fetch on the open market.

Vince Young started out hot, Pro Bowler as a rookie, looked amazing. He went to a place where they currently have an older-injured QB. The 'Iggles' probably would love a crack at Cam if Accorsi put him up for auction and had his sites set on a young QB in the upcoming draft.

I honestly don't know a thing about Geno or the other QB prospects yet but I saw the hiring of Ernie Accorsi by Carolina and I have noticed the odd and peculiar ways that Cam Newton has been acting and think it means they are players for a QB in next year's draft.

Franchise-long Carolina fan here, and while I agree with you about their being legitimate concerns regarding whether or not Cam is the long-term future of the franchise at QB, there's a couple of major flaws with your argument.First - Accorsi is NOT the new GM. Accorsi was brought in as a consultant on the search for a new General Manager, fueled in large part by his long-time friendship with Jerry Richardson. Accorsi wouldn't take the GM job if offered... he has no interest in investing the kind of time it takes to effectively handle that job. What he is good at, however, is identifying the next wave of GM talent. He recommended Dimitroff in Atlanta, and I believe had a hand in selecting Jerry Reece in New York before he retired. At this point, he's a hired gun to find the new GM for Carolina (which thrills me as a fan that they're taking this seriously and not looking for another schmuck like Hurney).

Second - The QBs Accorsi traded up to acquire were extremely talented, high-ceiling players. While Eli certainly wasn't the next Peyton, he had the pedigree, and had college production in a tough SEC, plus all the tools. And he was incredibly marketable as a Manning in NYC. Kosar's draft situation was a giant mess and he actually ended up going in the supplemental draft - check this out for further reading.

Third - Cam isn't going anywhere for the time being. Given the lack of elite signal callers in this draft, and the current coaching staff's inability to execute a well-reasoned game plan, Cam's going to be given at least 2013 to prove himself with a new regime. IF that doesn't go as well as hoped, I could see the Panthers looking to move on, and given the physical tools of Newton, I could see another coaching staff and general manager more than willing to make a play for him (can you imagine what a creative offensive mind like Chan Gailey could do with Cam? After what he's done with pop-gun armed Fitzpatrick, and before him with Tyler Thigpen...).

I agree that Cam has questions to answer, and his future as the long-term foundation QB for the Panthers isn't as lock-tight as it was a year ago... but there's nothing in this draft to replace him with, and they're not going to just move on from him after a season where everything seems to be imploding, from the GM on down. He'll get one more year, and the skills are still there.

 

[Concept Coop]

You don't dump a player a year after the best rookie season ever. The you fix the offense, get it to where it was a year ago, and re-invest in the team and Cam.

If Carolina were to end up with the 1st pick, someone would be willing to move up for a QB, in my opinion. There are 2 potential franchise guys in this draft, and teams needing a QB can't afford to wait a year. Matt Ryan wasn't thought to be an elite prospect, and the teams that passed on him are kicking themselves now.

After moving down, Star seems like the best option. He's an elite level player at an area of need. Watching the game against USC was eye opening. Too bad the Utes are awful this year and this kid didn't get the attention he should.

 

[Concept Coop]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

 

[cstu]

I can't see the Jets going with Sanchez for another season. I can't shake the feeling that they will be trading up again to get a QB.

If the draft ends up with the Chiefs/Jags being #1/2 there's little chance of that working out.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Well of the above teams who needs a QB? I think a case can be made for every team but Cleveland just took a QB in the first round and likely would stick with Weeden.

I actually think that Carolina is a player for drafting a QB and the primary reason is they just hired former Browns and Giants GM Ernie Accorsi as a team consultant.

Accorsi is a hired gun. His primary directive is to get the QB and build the team from the quarterback position. He wouldn't come in for any other reason in my humble opinion so I find the hiring of Accorsi to be VERY INTERESTING for Carolina and his hiring puts them in the market to draft or trade-up to draft a QB.

Accorsi's history speaks for itself. He got a QB in Cleveland when he pulled off a bold trade to land Bernie Kosar and he also did the same thing in New York when he pulled off the bold trade to land Eli Manning. He retired five years ago till Carolina came calling.

Carolina has Cam Newton. Cam Newton has incredible physical skills but he has reacted peculiar ways recently after losses and that sends up a red flag IMHO on whether or not he's 'thee-guy' to build a Super Bowl contending team around. The odd behavior by Newton and the hiring of Accorsi not long afterwards are not coincidental IMHO.

I would put Carolina in the market for a QB.

Oh and what to do with Cam?

Well either trade-bait to move-up if need be or see what he'd fetch on the open market.

Vince Young started out hot, Pro Bowler as a rookie, looked amazing. He went to a place where they currently have an older-injured QB. The 'Iggles' probably would love a crack at Cam if Accorsi put him up for auction and had his sites set on a young QB in the upcoming draft.

I honestly don't know a thing about Geno or the other QB prospects yet but I saw the hiring of Ernie Accorsi by Carolina and I have noticed the odd and peculiar ways that Cam Newton has been acting and think it means they are players for a QB in next year's draft.

Franchise-long Carolina fan here, and while I agree with you about their being legitimate concerns regarding whether or not Cam is the long-term future of the franchise at QB, there's a couple of major flaws with your argument.First - Accorsi is NOT the new GM. Accorsi was brought in as a consultant on the search for a new General Manager, fueled in large part by his long-time friendship with Jerry Richardson. Accorsi wouldn't take the GM job if offered... he has no interest in investing the kind of time it takes to effectively handle that job. What he is good at, however, is identifying the next wave of GM talent. He recommended Dimitroff in Atlanta, and I believe had a hand in selecting Jerry Reece in New York before he retired. At this point, he's a hired gun to find the new GM for Carolina (which thrills me as a fan that they're taking this seriously and not looking for another schmuck like Hurney).

Second - The QBs Accorsi traded up to acquire were extremely talented, high-ceiling players. While Eli certainly wasn't the next Peyton, he had the pedigree, and had college production in a tough SEC, plus all the tools. And he was incredibly marketable as a Manning in NYC. Kosar's draft situation was a giant mess and he actually ended up going in the supplemental draft - check this out for further reading.

Third - Cam isn't going anywhere for the time being. Given the lack of elite signal callers in this draft, and the current coaching staff's inability to execute a well-reasoned game plan, Cam's going to be given at least 2013 to prove himself with a new regime. IF that doesn't go as well as hoped, I could see the Panthers looking to move on, and given the physical tools of Newton, I could see another coaching staff and general manager more than willing to make a play for him (can you imagine what a creative offensive mind like Chan Gailey could do with Cam? After what he's done with pop-gun armed Fitzpatrick, and before him with Tyler Thigpen...).

I agree that Cam has questions to answer, and his future as the long-term foundation QB for the Panthers isn't as lock-tight as it was a year ago... but there's nothing in this draft to replace him with, and they're not going to just move on from him after a season where everything seems to be imploding, from the GM on down. He'll get one more year, and the skills are still there.

To be fair, I said they hired FORMER GM of the Browns and GM of the Giants as a TEAM CONSULTANT. No problem because you probably read it fast and missed that key point.Secondly, I'm a huge Browns fan and could tell you the story of BK openly stating he wanted to play for his home-town Cleveland Browns and fill you in on the details of the trade with Buffalo but I won't bore you.

Thirdly, you make a great point about Accorsi being involved in GM hiring decisions in the past in addition to him being a key man in landing franchise QBs for two NFL teams.

I just feel the timing of Cam's odd statements and the hiring Ernie Accorsi are very interesting. I guess I read more into the odd way Cam has handled losing. I think he would be great on a winning team but it seems he has folded his tent early on a few games this year and then those bizzare post-game comments stick out like sore thumbs.

I don't think Ernie Accorsi would be hired as a consultant and not corner the Panthers owner and express his concerns over those statements.

I have already said I don't know a thing about the QBs in the upcoming draft yet so you could be right that its a weak QB class but at this time I don't know but I do know Accorsi's past MO of making bold trades to draft franchise QBs.

 

[Wadsworth]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

Should we start the "Take a Knee for Clowney" thread?

 

[cstu]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

I'm not impressed by the 2014 QB class and think a team would be hard pressed to pass on Clowney at #1. If the Jags and Chiefs get QB's then looking at the likely candidates for the #1 pick in 2014 I don't see a need to take QB #1. The Jets and Cardinals have the biggest need at QB but they aren't bad enough to pick #1.

 

[JFS171]

You're right on me reading it fast - missed the consultant statement.

However, I'd be surprised if Accorsi had that kind of power in Carolina - to evaluate players and influence draft plans/strategy. I think his role there is clearly defined from everything I've read - and I read a lot when it comes to my team as I'm sure we all do. His job is to find the new GM. Rumor had it after Accorsi's hiring as a consultant was announced that the Director of College Scouting from the Giants, Marc Ross, was a front runner. Also have heard the name Dave Gettleman (who Accorsi recommended to Cleveland last time they changed GMs) and Kevin Abrams.

Point being, Accorsi's role is clear. And regardless, this team could have a pretty solid defense with a guy like Star at DT and a playmaker in the secondary. QB won't be a need, not until Cam either pouts his way out of town or fails miserably with a new regime.

Like ConceptCoop said, you don't just toss a guy that had a record-breaking rookie season to the curb after he struggles in his sophomore season. And, dare I say, there have also been rumors in Charlotte about the team pursuing Chip Kelly. Then rumors out of Oregon about how it's a foregone conclusion he'll eventually end up in the NFL. Give an offensive mind like Chip Kelly players like Cam, JStew, Steve Smith, Olsen... they'd put up some points.

 

[cstu]

Anyone thinking the Panthers would draft a QB now is The Panthers have no choice but to stick with him until the end of his contract and then decide what to do about him.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

You're right on me reading it fast - missed the consultant statement.

However, I'd be surprised if Accorsi had that kind of power in Carolina - to evaluate players and influence draft plans/strategy. I think his role there is clearly defined from everything I've read - and I read a lot when it comes to my team as I'm sure we all do. His job is to find the new GM. Rumor had it after Accorsi's hiring as a consultant was announced that the Director of College Scouting from the Giants, Marc Ross, was a front runner. Also have heard the name Dave Gettleman (who Accorsi recommended to Cleveland last time they changed GMs) and Kevin Abrams.

Point being, Accorsi's role is clear. And regardless, this team could have a pretty solid defense with a guy like Star at DT and a playmaker in the secondary. QB won't be a need, not until Cam either pouts his way out of town or fails miserably with a new regime.

Like ConceptCoop said, you don't just toss a guy that had a record-breaking rookie season to the curb after he struggles in his sophomore season. And, dare I say, there have also been rumors in Charlotte about the team pursuing Chip Kelly. Then rumors out of Oregon about how it's a foregone conclusion he'll eventually end up in the NFL. Give an offensive mind like Chip Kelly players like Cam, JStew, Steve Smith, Olsen... they'd put up some points.

No problem on an honest mistake of misreading something.I think you are right that Accorsi will provide imput into hiring a new GM but his title is 'consultant' and he has played siginificant roles in landing franchise QBs so I am positive he'll provide his take on Cam Newtwon to Jerry Richardson and their are some things to discuss other than just how Great played his rookie season. He will probably be asked or share his thoughts on the maturity that Cam displayed at the end of last year and this season.

If he isn't consulted after being hired as a consultant then the issue is with Richardson but I think this is more of the problem that will be discussed.

My link

... Toward the end of last season, the rookie Newton was given a talking-to by Panthers vets, who told him not to sulk so obviously when things don't go well. It was blown off, because very little hadn't gone well for Newton that season. But last month, when cameras caught receiver Steve Smith getting in his face on the sidelines during a blowout loss against the Giants, the narrative changed. The brooding Newton was no longer an aberration, but the norm. And as Carolina losses pile up, Newton's increasingly pointed postgame statements have become ripe for dissection and psychoanalysis.

... a flustered Newton was at a loss for answers, but not a loss for words.

"The past couple of games have been the same script, by the same director. It's kind of getting boring. This taste, this vibe—I'm not buying it, man. And I don't know what it is, but something's going to have to change. Something's going to have to change real fast."

"I'm going to leave this room and I'm going to bring in a suggestion box and I want your suggestions to be in that suggestion box because I sure don't know. I really don't. I wish I could tell you. But the only thing I control, sweetheart, is myself. Offensively, I am the leader of this bunch and we haven't been getting the job done."

... There haven't yet been whispers of a divided locker room, but GM Marty Hurney was fired this morning. Coach Ron Rivera is probably next. Most other quarterbacks would be viewed with patience if, after just 22 career starts, the front office was still struggling to build a team around them. The scrutiny of Newton, the venom as he appears to live up to the worst perceptions, shows he's not going to get that leeway. He can wave away all character concerns by returning to his improbably high standards of play, but he's not about to receive a lot of sympathy as he tries.

My link

... Steve Smith Unhappy With Cam Newton: Panthers WR Says He Called Out QB During Loss To Giants

CHARLOTTE, N.C. — Panthers receiver Steve Smith says he" lit into" Cam Newton about his actions on the sideline when the young quarterback was replaced late in the fourth quarter of Thursday night's 36-7 blowout loss to the New York Giants.

Smith said he was upset when Newton sat sulking on the bench instead of getting up to watch backup Derek Anderson and trying to learn from his own mistakes.

As a team captain and the elder statesman of the team, Smith felt something needed to be said to the 23-year old Newton about the importance of remaining positive and better handling adversity.

"I don't want to be passive and not do it because if I don't do it, who will?" Smith said. "The same way with my son, I can't expect somebody else (to do that). So yeah, I lit into him because I thought it was an opportunity for him to see and understand what was going on. This is more than about playing football. It's about becoming a man and understanding what this is."

Newton declined comment through the team's public relations staff. The team said he isn't speaking until next Wednesday.

... After Newton was replaced by Anderson, Smith spoke to Newton on the bench because he felt he was sulking over the impending loss.

"I said, `Get up and learn from this,'" Smith said. "I watched DA (Anderson) and Jimmy (Clausen) observe from the sidelines the last 20-something games and try to get mental reps. This is an opportunity for you to get some mental reps. Don't just sit on the bench and sulk. I know you feel bad, but that isn't going to help us."

It's the second straight year teammates have questioned Newton's demeanor on the sideline.

Last year offensive linemen Ryan Kalil and Jordan Gross both spoke to Newton in private about the importance of not getting down during a game.

... Rivera said he'll probably have a talk with Newton but wouldn't discuss what the conversation will be about.

Rivera knows Newton is an emotional player and said there's a "fine line" to walk between maintaining his burning desire to win and keeping his emotions in check.

"You look at things like, well, if something positive happens do you want to hide the emotions? And if something negative happens do we want to hide the emotions?" Rivera said.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Anyone thinking the Panthers would draft a QB now is The Panthers have no choice but to stick with him until the end of his contract and then decide what to do about him.

Yeah I mean what kind of team would spend so many picks at that position. It'd be like a team spending a first, second, third, and fourth round pick at the QB position...(no I don't think the Panthers really would draft a QB though)-QG

 

[MAC_32]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

Depends how the QB crop looks, if it's like this year I expect Clowney to go #1, if a guy or two emerges that's anywhere close to RG3 or Luck then probably not. I wouldn't dismiss Marquise Lee and Sammy Watkins from the discussion either, the former is showing he is on par with AJ Green only with more physical upside and Sammy has the ability to develop into the same.

 

[Concept Coop]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

Depends how the QB crop looks, if it's like this year I expect Clowney to go #1, if a guy or two emerges that's anywhere close to RG3 or Luck then probably not. I wouldn't dismiss Marquise Lee and Sammy Watkins from the discussion either, the former is showing he is on par with AJ Green only with more physical upside and Sammy has the ability to develop into the same.

I can't see a WR going #1 anytime soon. I don't think they go top 5, even, myself.

 

[MAC_32]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

Depends how the QB crop looks, if it's like this year I expect Clowney to go #1, if a guy or two emerges that's anywhere close to RG3 or Luck then probably not. I wouldn't dismiss Marquise Lee and Sammy Watkins from the discussion either, the former is showing he is on par with AJ Green only with more physical upside and Sammy has the ability to develop into the same.

I can't see a WR going #1 anytime soon. I don't think they go top 5, even, myself.

WR's are becoming more and more valuable as the league goes pass-happy and the best ones have already gone early in the past. Calvin, 2. Green, 4. Julio, 6. Looking at the contracts being given to good, not even great, wide receivers and you're seeing where the money is going. The money trails go to QB's, DL's, CB's, and WR's. Those are the premier positions, those are the ones teams are trying to get the best of the best of so if the talent is there they will be top 5 and top 10 picks. Lee is a top 10 pick and likely top 5, won't rule out 1 or 2. A lot can and will change but he really doesn't have much more proving to do at the college level, he's just not eligible for the draft yet. Sammy is a top 5 talent but he needs to put it together on the field next year, he's got as big of a ceiling as anyone but there's a lot of warts in his game.

 

[treat88]

I won't pretend to be an expert, by any means, and I have only followed the draft for 12 years or so. But Jadeveon Clowney might be the best prospect I have ever seen. This thread next year will be interesting. Would a team needing a QB pass on one for Clowney? Just something fun to ponder.

Kid is a stud.I'm not sure he is quite in the Julius peppers class of DE prospects, but there's no doubt he's elite.For 2012, wouldn't surprise me to see Joeckel or Hankins go #1. Not much of a class at the top end. Will all come down to team needs once the dust is settled.

 

[donkshow]

Chiefs should just grab Vick. He's got the potential to at least be adequate if the Coach lets him run sometimes..

 

[Concept Coop]

Kid is a stud.I'm not sure he is quite in the Julius peppers class of DE prospects, but there's no doubt he's elite.For 2012, wouldn't surprise me to see Joeckel or Hankins go #1. Not much of a class at the top end. Will all come down to team needs once the dust is settled.

When I think of the prospects who measure up there with Clowney, in my opinion, Peppers is there. Peppers, Suh, Luck, and Calvin come to mind.

 

[treat88]

Kid is a stud.I'm not sure he is quite in the Julius peppers class of DE prospects, but there's no doubt he's elite.For 2012, wouldn't surprise me to see Joeckel or Hankins go #1. Not much of a class at the top end. Will all come down to team needs once the dust is settled.

When I think of the prospects who measure up there with Clowney, in my opinion, Peppers is there. Peppers, Suh, Luck, and Calvin come to mind.

Clowneys got about 25 pounds and some arm length to add before draft day 2014 for me to see him as quite the freak Peppers was/is. It's certainly possible, so we will see.Hopefully, Clowney puts himself in the rare air of the company you mentioned by that time.Amazing talent no matter how you slice it. Seems like a great kid off the field as well.

 

[Concept Coop]

Clowneys got about 25 pounds and some arm length to add before draft day 2014 for me to see him as quite the freak Peppers was/is. It's certainly possible, so we will see.Hopefully, Clowney puts himself in the rare air of the company you mentioned by that time.Amazing talent no matter how you slice it. Seems like a great kid off the field as well.

He's got a frame for it, and is more lean than skinny. But, I agree, he does seem like a great kid, and an easy guy to root for. And additional lbs would help.

 

[Bad_Mo]

Too bad this wasn't 2009 and Casey **** were a better player.

 

[cheese]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

 

[Concept Coop]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

I just don't see a 6' WR being in the race for the #1 pick. If Calvin, Fitz, AJ, Rodgers didn't do it, neither will Lee.

 

[JFS171]

Here's the thing though... if the Jags or Panthers end up first, they're not likely to draft another QB (Panthers less likely), and is anyone really going to trade up for Barkley or Smith? I'm not so sure...

If Carolina ended up first, I could easily see Star Loutilie (SP definitely wrong) being the first pick.

If Carolina ends up #1 they won't be drafting a QB, but I also doubt they end up in that spot. They will find a way to take a couple of games. If Jax is #1 they are taking a QB though.

You may be underestimating Carolina's coaching staff's inability to win games they should...

After yesterday's game... ugh. Just reinforces what I previously said. They've got a legit shot at the #1 pick, and sadly, it looks like the players are quitting. 2/3 of that game was filled with pure apathy from Panthers' players. Lost season for sure...

 

[Lehigh98]

for an Eagles fan.

 

[JFS171]

for an Eagles fan.

Showdown of Suck next Monday Night!!!

 

[cheese]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

I just don't see a 6' WR being in the race for the #1 pick. If Calvin, Fitz, AJ, Rodgers didn't do it, neither will Lee.

Everyone is relative to their class though and this class sucks. Put AJG in this class and he should go #1 even if he doesn't.

 

[Concept Coop]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

I just don't see a 6' WR being in the race for the #1 pick. If Calvin, Fitz, AJ, Rodgers didn't do it, neither will Lee.

Everyone is relative to their class though and this class sucks. Put AJG in this class and he should go #1 even if he doesn't.

I could be wrong. But I just can't see selling a flanker as a top pick. Obviously the team would have to be awful - I can't see a GM willing to tie his name to a flanker, rather than a second level QB prospect, like Matt Ryan or Ben Roethlisberger (at the time, of course. And those two panned out, not all do, I know).

 

[cheese]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

I just don't see a 6' WR being in the race for the #1 pick. If Calvin, Fitz, AJ, Rodgers didn't do it, neither will Lee.

Everyone is relative to their class though and this class sucks. Put AJG in this class and he should go #1 even if he doesn't.

I could be wrong. But I just can't see selling a flanker as a top pick. Obviously the team would have to be awful - I can't see a GM willing to tie his name to a flanker, rather than a second level QB prospect, like Matt Ryan or Ben Roethlisberger (at the time, of course. And those two panned out, not all do, I know).

You might be right, but look at the 2 examples I gave. You don't think Carolina or Cleveland specifically would do it if they land there? They both have hitched their wagon to young QBs and need weapons. I guess I could understand Carolina going defense instead, but this defensive class isn't that much better from what I can tell and they just spent a top pick on Keuchly at LB.If you give Weeden Lee, Gordon, Little for the next 5 years with TRich at RB and a decent OLine... you've done all you can. If he still fails there, it's on him.

If it's Jax, KC or anyone else though, it won't be Lee regardless. You don't go WR #1 overall with QB unsettled.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Chiefs dominating this now. If not for 3 points, Philly would be right there though.

-QG

 

[Abraham]

If I'm Kansas City, I offer the 1 to Jacksonville for their pick (2 or 3) and gabbert. Jax takes Joekel which is an area of need. Kc gets a quarterback at a reasonable cost that should be better than they have and has a high pick to spend on Moore or jones for defense.

 

[Heatman]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

Cleveland won't take him. they already spent their 2nd rounder on a WR who seems to be working out well. They have too many other needs to go WR 1 and 2.

 

[Time Kibitzer]

If I'm Kansas City, I offer the 1 to Jacksonville for their pick (2 or 3) and gabbert. Jax takes Joekel which is an area of need. Kc gets a quarterback at a reasonable cost that should be better than they have and has a high pick to spend on Moore or jones for defense.

Why on earth would the Chiefs want Gabbert? He has been just as bad, if not worse, than Matt Cassell the past 2 seasons.

 

[MAC_32]

Lee is can't miss at WR, especially if anyone with half a QB can get their hands on him. Would be a great pick for Carolina or Cleveland for sure.

Cleveland won't take him. they already spent their 2nd rounder on a WR who seems to be working out well. They have too many other needs to go WR 1 and 2.

Lee is not draft eligible, he will be a top 5 pick in 2014.

 

[sporthenry]

If I'm Kansas City, I offer the 1 to Jacksonville for their pick (2 or 3) and gabbert. Jax takes Joekel which is an area of need. Kc gets a quarterback at a reasonable cost that should be better than they have and has a high pick to spend on Moore or jones for defense.

Why would Jags do that? Only way they trade up is for Geno and they'd have to be convinced the dude is going to be good. They can just wait at 2-3 and see who falls.

 

[MAC_32]

If I'm Kansas City, I offer the 1 to Jacksonville for their pick (2 or 3) and gabbert. Jax takes Joekel which is an area of need. Kc gets a quarterback at a reasonable cost that should be better than they have and has a high pick to spend on Moore or jones for defense.

Why would Jags do that?

To get the QB they want if they think KC will take him. That is if the Jags even finish behind the Chiefs, still 5 games to play, upsets happen. Both teams will be addressing QB this offseason, who? Good question for February. Vick, Flynn, Alex, among others should be available too. And who knows who will be running both of these teams because it will not be the guys currently in place.

 

[sporthenry]

If I'm Kansas City, I offer the 1 to Jacksonville for their pick (2 or 3) and gabbert. Jax takes Joekel which is an area of need. Kc gets a quarterback at a reasonable cost that should be better than they have and has a high pick to spend on Moore or jones for defense.

Why would Jags do that?

To get the QB they want if they think KC will take him. That is if the Jags even finish behind the Chiefs, still 5 games to play, upsets happen. Both teams will be addressing QB this offseason, who? Good question for February. Vick, Flynn, Alex, among others should be available too. And who knows who will be running both of these teams because it will not be the guys currently in place.

I agree but OP said Jags would trade up for Joeckel? I agree if they feel strongly about Geno, I think you'll probably see a team pull a Red Skins but like you said, it also depends upon who is available. No marquee names but some solid players. Maybe even Flacco.

 

[Concept Coop]

You might be right, but look at the 2 examples I gave. You don't think Carolina or Cleveland specifically would do it if they land there? They both have hitched their wagon to young QBs and need weapons.

Not at all. I honestly don't see we will see a flanker drafted #1 in a very, very, very long time. Clowney will be the first non-QB taken, if I had to guess now. But even if he went back to school, and the teams couldn't trade down, they'd go DE,OT,DT.

 

[EBF]

That LB from Georgia is a beast. I would take that guy.

 

[Concept Coop]

That LB from Georgia is a beast. I would take that guy.

Jones looks like a great prospect. The entire Georgia defense is pretty stacked with NFL talent, actually. I love Star, too, as a potential non-QB top pick.

 

[Lehigh98]

for an Eagles fan.

Showdown of Suck next Monday Night!!!

We're suckier.