The Best (1 Viewer)

[timschochet]

QB Peyton Manning

RB Ladanian Tomlinson

RB Adrian Peterson (Vikings)

T Matt Light

T Walter Jones

C Tom Nalen

G Steve Hutchinson

G Alan Faneca

WR Randy Moss

WR Steve Smith

FB Dan Kreider

TE Todd Heap

DT Albert Haynesworth

NT Casey Hampton

DE Richard Seymour

DE Julius Peppers

LB DeMarcus Ware

LB Shawn Merriman

LB Adalius Thomas

SS Troy Polamalu

FS Sean Taylor

CB Champ Bailey

CB Ike Taylor

K Adam Vinatieri

P Daniel Sepulveda

KR Devin Hester

 

[SSOG]

You think that Peterson is the best fullback in the NFL? Or are you trying to say that he's the second best RB, because if so, Brian Westbrook (among others) strongly disagrees. Walter Jones hasn't been the best tackle in the NFL in two years, although he's still the most widely recognized, and Matt Light is a very good tackle, but imo not in line for "best" discussion. Nalen's still one of the better Centers in the league, but he's not in his prime anymore and no longer the "best". Calling Heap the best TE in the league is insane, imo (ummmm... Antonio Gates down? ), Haynesworth probably isn't even a top-5 DT, your team doesn't have a single MLB (Urlacher, anyone?), and Ike Taylor is good, but I don't know if I'd put him in the top 10 among CBs (off the top of my head, you've got Bailey, Pacman when he's playing, Mathis, Nnamdi Asomugha, Ronde Barber, Asante Samuel, Chris McAllister, and Terrence Newman as all slam-dunk better CBs, which means Ike is fighting for 9th with guys like Clements, Winfield, Springs, and a bunch of other guys who I'm forgetting about or haven't seen play recently).

 

[awesomeness]

QB Peyton ManningRB Ladanian TomlinsonRB Adrian Peterson (Vikings)T Matt LightT Walter JonesC Tom NalenG Steve HutchinsonG Alan FanecaWR Randy MossWR Steve SmithFB Dan KreiderTE Todd HeapDT Albert HaynesworthNT Casey HamptonDE Richard SeymourDE Julius PeppersLB DeMarcus WareLB Shawn MerrimanLB Adalius ThomasSS Troy PolamaluFS Sean TaylorCB Champ BaileyCB Ike TaylorK Adam VinatieriP Daniel SepulvedaKR Devin Hester

there are less players that i wouldnt change than players i would change.

 

[timschochet]

You think that Peterson is the best fullback in the NFL? Or are you trying to say that he's the second best RB, because if so, Brian Westbrook (among others) strongly disagrees. Walter Jones hasn't been the best tackle in the NFL in two years, although he's still the most widely recognized, and Matt Light is a very good tackle, but imo not in line for "best" discussion. Nalen's still one of the better Centers in the league, but he's not in his prime anymore and no longer the "best". Calling Heap the best TE in the league is insane, imo (ummmm... Antonio Gates down? ), Haynesworth probably isn't even a top-5 DT, your team doesn't have a single MLB (Urlacher, anyone?), and Ike Taylor is good, but I don't know if I'd put him in the top 10 among CBs (off the top of my head, you've got Bailey, Pacman when he's playing, Mathis, Nnamdi Asomugha, Ronde Barber, Asante Samuel, Chris McAllister, and Terrence Newman as all slam-dunk better CBs, which means Ike is fighting for 9th with guys like Clements, Winfield, Springs, and a bunch of other guys who I'm forgetting about or haven't seen play recently).

Nice to know you agree with me so much!1. From what I've seen, ADP IS the 2nd best RB in the NFL already. If he stays healthy, he will be #1 in a year or so. 2. Jones may have slowed, but who would you take over him?3. Light is the most underrated player at nearly ANY position.4. Again with Nalen, who is better?5. I took Heap because of his ability to catch AND block. Gates is obviously the most prolific, but he's not a true TE.6. Have you watched Haynesworth this year? He is dominating like never before.7. Considered Uhrlacher but I believe the guys I named are slightly better...8. I think several of the CBs you named are overrated, while Taylor is the opposite.Oh well, just my opinion...

 

[timschochet]

QB Peyton ManningRB Ladanian TomlinsonRB Adrian Peterson (Vikings)T Matt LightT Walter JonesC Tom NalenG Steve HutchinsonG Alan FanecaWR Randy MossWR Steve SmithFB Dan KreiderTE Todd HeapDT Albert HaynesworthNT Casey HamptonDE Richard SeymourDE Julius PeppersLB DeMarcus WareLB Shawn MerrimanLB Adalius ThomasSS Troy PolamaluFS Sean TaylorCB Champ BaileyCB Ike TaylorK Adam VinatieriP Daniel SepulvedaKR Devin Hester

there are less players that i wouldnt change than players i would change.Please be my guest. This is only my opinion, and I was hoping to start some discussion.

 

[Chase Stuart]

It seems odd that you have selected zero 4-3 LBs for your 4-3 defense, along with two 3-4 DL.

 

[Bannedman]

I threw up in my mouth when I realized Gates was left off that list

 

[timschochet]

It seems odd that you have selected zero 4-3 LBs for your 4-3 defense, along with two 3-4 DL.

You're probably right. It was less designed to be a team, and more to list the best of the best. Also, at this time there just aren't very many great 4-3 DE's. Not sure why.

 

[Chase Stuart]

It seems odd that you have selected zero 4-3 LBs for your 4-3 defense, along with two 3-4 DL.

You're probably right. It was less designed to be a team, and more to list the best of the best. Also, at this time there just aren't very many great 4-3 DE's. Not sure why.

LB at 3-4 and 4-3 are totally different positions, so I'd either pick 14 different front-seven lineman, or pick a scheme and go with it.

 

[timschochet]

I threw up in my mouth when I realized Gates was left off that list

I love Gates. But what is his position, exactly? You can't really be called a TE if you don't block, can you? And if you move Gates to WR, then he's certainly in the top 10, but not the very best.I admit its the toughest choice I made.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I threw up in my mouth when I realized Gates was left off that list

I love Gates. But what is his position, exactly? You can't really be called a TE if you don't block, can you? And if you move Gates to WR, then he's certainly in the top 10, but not the very best.I admit its the toughest choice I made.

For starters, you absolutely can be called a TE if you don't block. And because Gates draws at least one defender whenever he goes out in coverage, it usually doesn't make sense to leave him in to block -- but it's not like he's Shannon Sharpe or something. He's strong and has a wide frame, and is a good enough blocker. I think you're underestimating his blocking.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Someone has to get this ball rolling , so let me just say that Tom Brady is better than Peyton Manning.

 

[timschochet]

Someone has to get this ball rolling , so let me just say that Tom Brady is better than Peyton Manning.

At the risk of reopening a topic that has been discussed to death in the last five years, they're two of the best ever, but....Manning >> Brady

 

[DoubleG]

Someone has to get this ball rolling , so let me just say that Tom Brady is better than Peyton Manning at commercials.

FYP.Now at QB, I'll take Goober.

 

[Lemmiwinks]

DeMarcus Ware is not as good as DeMeco Ryans or Julian Peterson. Adrian Wilson is better than Sean Taylor. Ike Taylor belongs nowhere near this list... he lost his starting job last year for crying out loud! Nate Clements is my choice opposite Champ Bailey. The interior of the Minnesota defensive line (Pat and Kevin Williams) are also better than Hampton. Haynesworth is having a great year, so I'll give you that.

On offense, I can't put adrian peterson in there until he learns how to pass protect. To me, it's LT and Addai until further notice because they can do everything well. Lorenzo Neal is the best blocking fullback in the league and has been for years.

Good topic for discussion though.

 

[biggoergen]

I sense a little Steeler homerism going on here. Ike Taylor was almost benched last season because of how badly he played, though he has played well for a couple this year, he is not the second best corner in the game. I'd probably put Saturday over Nalen at center. Sepulveda as the top punter in the league after 5 games is a bit of an overstatement, no? I'd go with Moorman in that spot. Faneca might have been the best guard in the league five years ago but now he is a liability in pass protection and hit or miss in the running game.

Overall I'm not too impressed. I think you need to justify your picks.

 

[DoubleG]

I threw up in my mouth when I realized Gates was left off that list

I love Gates. But what is his position, exactly? You can't really be called a TE if you don't block, can you? And if you move Gates to WR, then he's certainly in the top 10, but not the very best.I admit its the toughest choice I made.

I don't see how you can say "I didn't take Gates, because he's not a good blocker" and then pick Randy Moss as one of the top 2 WRs.

 

[Pskov1420]

QB Peyton Manning, IND

RB Ladanian Tomlinson, SD

FB Lorenzo Neal, SD

WR Randy Moss, NE

WR Steve Smith, CAR

TE Antonio Gates, SD

LT Jonathan Ogden, BAL

RT Willie Anderson, CIN

C Jeff Saturday, IND

G Shawn Andrews, PHI

G Steve Hutchinson, MIN

DT Tommie Harris, CHI

DT Richard Seymour, NE

DE Jason Taylor, MIA

DE Julius Peppers, CAR

SLB Adalius Thomas, NE

MLB Brian Urlacher, CHI

WLB DeMarcus Ware, DAL

CB Champ Bailey, DEN

CB Terrance Newman, DAL

SS Troy Polamalu, PIT

FS Sean Taylor, WAS

K Adam Vinatieri, IND

P ???

KR Devin Hester, CHI

ST Chidi Iwuoma, PIT

Near misses: Adrian Wilson at safety, Logan Mankins at guard, Kevin Williams at DT. The WLB spot and the second CB slot alongside Bailey are very, very close each with 6 or 7 possible contenders.

 

[numberSE7EN]

I threw up in my mouth when I realized Gates was left off that list :X

I love Gates. But what is his position, exactly? You can't really be called a TE if you don't block, can you? And if you move Gates to WR, then he's certainly in the top 10, but not the very best.I admit its the toughest choice I made.

I don't see how you can say "I didn't take Gates, because he's not a good blocker" and then pick Randy Moss as one of the top 2 WRs.

TEs blocking comes into effect a lot more than for WR. Yes being a good blocking WR can be huge (Rod Smith and McCaffrey were a big reason TD ran so well for the Broncos, and WR blocking is still stressed in DEN and they still have a good running game), but it think its bigger for TEs. I think gates while very talented is overrated. He just gets a lot of targets in the SD offense. If you put Gates on a team that had two real WRs or two good WR (TJ/Hous, Wayne/Harrison) he would not be putting up such great stats. Like others mentioned he is not a great blocker while other TEs are and they have talent as a reciever (Todd Heap). I don't know much about Winslows blocking ablity but his talent as a WR is up there with Gates.-I agree with Gates not being on the inital list-

 

[SSOG]

Nice to know you agree with me so much!1. From what I've seen, ADP IS the 2nd best RB in the NFL already. If he stays healthy, he will be #1 in a year or so. 2. Jones may have slowed, but who would you take over him?3. Light is the most underrated player at nearly ANY position.4. Again with Nalen, who is better?5. I took Heap because of his ability to catch AND block. Gates is obviously the most prolific, but he's not a true TE.6. Have you watched Haynesworth this year? He is dominating like never before.7. Considered Uhrlacher but I believe the guys I named are slightly better...8. I think several of the CBs you named are overrated, while Taylor is the opposite.Oh well, just my opinion...

1. And you don't have any problems at all with drawing sweeping conclusions based on a 4-game sample size? Heck, if we give Tomlinson the same treatment, he's perhaps the worst starting RB in the league.2. Marcus McNeil is the first name that comes to mind, but I'd also be good with either Bengals tackle (Willie Anderson or Levi Jones), or a couple other potentials.3. Light wasn't even the most underrated player at his OWN position. Prior to his injury last year, some people considered Matt Lepsis the best LT in the entire NFL, and he's never made a pro bowl in his career. At least Light has name recognition.4. Birk or Kreutz.5. I'd argue the point, but if you're dead set on excluding Gates because he can't block (he can block, and he actually ties up more defenders in pass patterns than he does when he stays in to block), there are still much better options than Heap. Sgt. Kellen Williams Jr., for instance, is a better blocker and receiver than Heap, and Gonzo's not quite out to pasture yet.6. Again, I hesitate to crown someone based on 4-5 games of action. I know Haynesworth is a great DT, but I think he'll be hard pressed to pass any of the Williamses (Jamal, Kevin, or Pat), just to get the list started.7. Ware is better than Urlacher? I guess we'll just agree to strongly disagree.8. Which of those CBs do you think are overrated?

 

[timschochet]

Nice to know you agree with me so much!1. From what I've seen, ADP IS the 2nd best RB in the NFL already. If he stays healthy, he will be #1 in a year or so. 2. Jones may have slowed, but who would you take over him?3. Light is the most underrated player at nearly ANY position.4. Again with Nalen, who is better?5. I took Heap because of his ability to catch AND block. Gates is obviously the most prolific, but he's not a true TE.6. Have you watched Haynesworth this year? He is dominating like never before.7. Considered Uhrlacher but I believe the guys I named are slightly better...8. I think several of the CBs you named are overrated, while Taylor is the opposite.Oh well, just my opinion...

1. And you don't have any problems at all with drawing sweeping conclusions based on a 4-game sample size? Heck, if we give Tomlinson the same treatment, he's perhaps the worst starting RB in the league.2. Marcus McNeil is the first name that comes to mind, but I'd also be good with either Bengals tackle (Willie Anderson or Levi Jones), or a couple other potentials.3. Light wasn't even the most underrated player at his OWN position. Prior to his injury last year, some people considered Matt Lepsis the best LT in the entire NFL, and he's never made a pro bowl in his career. At least Light has name recognition.4. Birk or Kreutz.5. I'd argue the point, but if you're dead set on excluding Gates because he can't block (he can block, and he actually ties up more defenders in pass patterns than he does when he stays in to block), there are still much better options than Heap. Sgt. Kellen Williams Jr., for instance, is a better blocker and receiver than Heap, and Gonzo's not quite out to pasture yet.6. Again, I hesitate to crown someone based on 4-5 games of action. I know Haynesworth is a great DT, but I think he'll be hard pressed to pass any of the Williamses (Jamal, Kevin, or Pat), just to get the list started.7. Ware is better than Urlacher? I guess we'll just agree to strongly disagree.8. Which of those CBs do you think are overrated?

8. Mathis, Barber, and ESPECIALLY Terrance NewmanAll fine points, though. You'd really take Winslow over Heap, though? Gonzo I'd put in the same position as Gates. As far as ADP goes, it's not a question of the sample. Heck, after the first 4 weeks of 2005, Caddilac was putting up great numbers that he's never matched since. No, it's a matter of when you watch this guy, you can tell that he's special. Last year, in terms of talent, I ranked LT #1, Gore #2, and Westbrook # 3. ADP is already better than Gore was last year.

 

[ScottNorwood]

Punter: MOORMAN

 

[Bankerguy]

Punter: Mat MacBriar

 

[twitch]

Julius Peppers continues to be the most overrated player in the league. No way is he a 1st team All Pro.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Punter: MOORMAN

 

[Despyzer]

I think gates while very talented is overrated.

This might be the most ridiculous thing I have read all day.... and I teach freshman English.

He just gets a lot of targets in the SD offense. If you put Gates on a team that had two real WRs or two good WR (TJ/Hous, Wayne/Harrison) he would not be putting up such great stats.

1. Name one TE that this wouldn't be true of.2. Tomlinson himself is one heck of a receiving threat.

Like others mentioned he is not a great blocker while other TEs are and they have talent as a reciever (Todd Heap).

One other guy, who also has no idea what he is talking about, said this. This may have been true of Gates earlier in his career, when he was still learning how to play the position, but anyone who watched him last year will tell that it is not true of him now. Gates' improvement as a blocker was one of the reasons that the running game was so productive last year.

I don't know much about Winslows blocking ablity but his talent as a WR is up there with Gates.

Which obviously explains why his production as a receiver is right up there with Gates.

 

[DoubleG]

Nice to know you agree with me so much!7. Considered Uhrlacher but I believe the guys I named are slightly better...Oh well, just my opinion...

7. Ware is better than Urlacher? I guess we'll just agree to strongly disagree.

Sunday night, John Madden said that he thought Urlacher was possibly the best defensive player in the NFL - and yet not even in the top 3 at his position??

 

[Kurt Warner]

I'm the best at QB...anyone who says otherwise is a f'n tool.

 

[SSOG]

8. Mathis, Barber, and ESPECIALLY Terrance NewmanAll fine points, though. You'd really take Winslow over Heap, though? Gonzo I'd put in the same position as Gates. As far as ADP goes, it's not a question of the sample. Heck, after the first 4 weeks of 2005, Caddilac was putting up great numbers that he's never matched since. No, it's a matter of when you watch this guy, you can tell that he's special. Last year, in terms of talent, I ranked LT #1, Gore #2, and Westbrook # 3. ADP is already better than Gore was last year.

Funny, I actually had those three pegged as perhaps the least overrated of the bunch. If you had pegged Samuels or McAllister as overrated, I would have agreed more with you (although they're still better than Ike, in my book). As it stands, Barber has been one of the top 5 CBs in the league for almost a decade now and he never gets his due (although I'll acknowledge that, like Jones and Nalen, he's past his peak), while Mathis and Newman are my choice for the third and fourth best CBs in the entire NFL, behind only Bailey and Pacman. Mathis is an absolute beast, and Newman actually went an entire season without giving up a TD in 2005.And while I agree that Peterson looks extremely talented, I still can't put him above Westbrook. Look at Philadelphia in week 3 vs. Philadelphia in week 4 to see just what a difference Westbrook makes for that team. I don't think a single RB in the entire league has a more dramatic impact. I don't know why you're fielding a 2-RB offense in the first place, though, when you don't give the same consideration to any other position.Also, it's funny that you mentioned Caddy Williams, since he was going to be a point that I brought up. After 4 weeks in his rookie year, I'm sure a bunch of people would have called Caddy one of the three most talented RBs in the NFL, too. Sample size issues are a real concern, especially when you look at the defenses Peterson has faced. According to Football Outsiders, Peterson's opponents rank an average of 20th against the run.

 

[-OZ-]

I think gates while very talented is overrated.

This might be the most ridiculous thing I have read all day.... and I teach freshman English.

He just gets a lot of targets in the SD offense. If you put Gates on a team that had two real WRs or two good WR (TJ/Hous, Wayne/Harrison) he would not be putting up such great stats.

1. Name one TE that this wouldn't be true of.2. Tomlinson himself is one heck of a receiving threat.

Like others mentioned he is not a great blocker while other TEs are and they have talent as a reciever (Todd Heap).

One other guy, who also has no idea what he is talking about, said this. This may have been true of Gates earlier in his career, when he was still learning how to play the position, but anyone who watched him last year will tell that it is not true of him now. Gates' improvement as a blocker was one of the reasons that the running game was so productive last year.

I don't know much about Winslows blocking ablity but his talent as a WR is up there with Gates.

Which obviously explains why his production as a receiver is right up there with Gates.

Maybe he thinks Braylon and Jurevicious are good WRs? His logic isn't flawed there, even if his assessment of talent is.

 

[Barry]

Faneca is now very average. The media seems to think he is still good. His best days are well behind him. He is getting better at helping BenR up though.