The Right to Self Defense (1 Viewer)

[dkp993]

I just feel that far too often the simplest of things are bloated in terms of importance.  We see people fighting in the street, or at fast food, or just anywhere really. The short fuse temper of folks to want to fight each other is sorta sinister I think.

Oh I don’t disagree, I just don’t think it new or unique, it ebbs and flows. It’s flowing now. And while I’m pro 2A I don’t believe more citizens arming themselves is the solution.  

 

[KarmaPolice]

Oh I don’t disagree, I just don’t think it new or unique, it ebbs and flows. It’s flowing now. And while I’m pro 2A I don’t believe more citizens arming themselves is the solution.  

I am in agreement here.    IMO what we are seeing more and more is the ramifications of having a decent portion of the populace armed.   It's making policing a lot harder and deadly as they have to assume every encounter means the other person is also carrying a gun.   It's making self-defense a grey area as you descibe, again as everybody has to assume the other person also has a gun.   It increases the tension of already difficult moments and makes every movement life threatening.    It's an odd phenomenon.  

Hell, I vividly remember one poster here citing a case of "self-defense" and it was an article about two guys getting into a fight, separating, getting in a fight again, separating, then one guy went to get his gun out of his car and went back and shot the other.  

 

[ekbeats]

I have wavered between both extremes on the gun control issue.  Back when Sandy Hook happened I was on full tilt talking about the need for more gun control.  Maybe it’s because it hit so close to home.  I live a few towns over from Newtown and I had a close personal friend whose daughter was at SHE that day and hid in a closet.  Scared the hell out of me and sent me into an emotional tailspin that lasted for a long period of time.  I’m open minded on this issue, but I keep coming back to the reality that there are too many guns in America to make any wholesale changes.  Plus I have since moved to a rural area and totally appreciate the value of feeling safe.  Totally torn on this issue to be honest.

 

[dkp993]

I have wavered between both extremes on the gun control issue.  Back when Sandy Hook happened I was on full tilt talking about the need for more gun control.  Maybe it’s because it hit so close to home.  I live a few towns over from Newtown and I had a close personal friend whose daughter was at SHE that day and hid in a closet.  Scared the hell out of me and sent me into an emotional tailspin that lasted for a long period of time.  I’m open minded on this issue, but I keep coming back to the reality that there are too many guns in America to make any wholesale changes.  Plus I have since moved to a rural area and totally appreciate the value of feeling safe.  Totally torn on this issue to be honest.

This is a pretty good summary (minus the personal closeness to Sandy Hook) of my position.  I believe in 2A and fully support gun ownership, but the propensity of guns and the extreme nature of some of the gun culture is too much for me.  As usual I think the answer is often somewhere in the middle.  

 

[ekbeats]

This is a pretty good summary (minus the personal closeness to Sandy Hook) of my position.  I believe in 2A and fully support gun ownership, but the propensity of guns and the extreme nature of some of the gun culture is too much for me.  As usual I think the answer is often somewhere in the middle.  

Same.  But I always defer to personal freedom on these issues.  Freedom is always my guiding principle.

 

[quick-hands]

I am in agreement here.    

Hell, I vividly remember one poster here citing a case of "self-defense" and it was an article about two guys getting into a fight, separating, getting in a fight again, separating, then one guy went to get his gun out of his car and went back and shot the other.  

Which poster.   Updating my notebook.

 

[quick-hands]

Nothing can stop a bad guy with a gun except a good guy with a gun.

 

[the moops]

Here’s one that happened earlier this month. The dad was upset his ex-wife wouldn’t let him see his son, but he probably should have left when the gun came out. I wouldn’t expect any charges in this case.

https://twitter.com/LiberTea176/status/1464118602425065473?s=20

This whole situation is so ####ed. 

1) How do you dare someone to use a gun when they go inside and grab it?

2) Who goes and grabs a gun when a minor argument ensues?

3) Who the #### just so calmly videotapes the shooting and continues to film and not go see if the guy is OK?

4) People need to chill out. So angry

 

[dkp993]

Nothing can stop a bad guy with a gun except a good guy with a gun.

Chuck Norris could.  He could do it with one hand while cooking a perfect egg in the other.  

 

[quick-hands]

Chuck Norris could.  He could do it with one hand while cooking a perfect egg in the other.  

I saw him once scramble  an egg while still in the shell

 

[Chaz McNulty]

Really?  I would think there is a good case that the dad was provoked.  Depends on the state, but say Wisconsin an illegal act for the purpose of provocation includes tortious acts.  I would think keeping a child a way from a father would qualify.  In that case the guy has the duty to exhaust all means of retreat.  He did not.  

If this guy gets off for self defense because he got pushed, it will really open up a can of worms.  

 

[Chaz McNulty]

This whole situation is so ####ed. 

1) How do you dare someone to use a gun when they go inside and grab it?

2) Who goes and grabs a gun when a minor argument ensues?

3) Who the #### just so calmly videotapes the shooting and continues to film and not go see if the guy is OK?

4) People need to chill out. So angry

The guy needs to be off the streets and locked up.  This is crazy.

 

[BladeRunner]

This whole situation is so ####ed. 

1) How do you dare someone to use a gun when they go inside and grab it?

2) Who goes and grabs a gun when a minor argument ensues?

3) Who the #### just so calmly videotapes the shooting and continues to film and not go see if the guy is OK?

4) People need to chill out. So angry

I agree.  I see no case of self-defense here.  The shooter had an avenue of escape (go inside and close the door and call the police) and not only did NOT take it, but went inside to go get a gun.

This seems to be nothing more than an upset father yelling at his ex-wife for - what appears to be - violating the custody orders.  Probably happens 10 thousand times a day across the US.  IF that is the case, I wonder if the ex can be charged too.

 

[Dickies]

Here’s one that happened earlier this month. The dad was upset his ex-wife wouldn’t let him see his son, but he probably should have left when the gun came out. I wouldn’t expect any charges in this case.

https://twitter.com/LiberTea176/status/1464118602425065473?s=20

Good ####### lord. How on earth does this guy not get charged?

 

[HellToupee]

If I’ve learned anything from these instances is never grab the gun 

 

[the moops]

If I’ve learned anything from these instances is never grab the gun 

I've learned that if someone has a gun just let them be. Live and fight a different day and way

 

[The Big Donkey]

Good ####### lord. How on earth does this guy not get charged?

"No charges or arrests have been made yet in the Nov. 5 shooting death of 54-year-old Chad Read at a home in the in the 2100 block of 90th Street. 

Meanwhile, investigators have turned over their files to the Texas Attorney General's Office, who is handling any potential prosecution in the case after the Lubbock County District Attorney Sunshine Stanek recused her office from the case, citing that the suspect in the shooting was related to a local elected official who could be called as a witness.....

.... records filed in civil court have identified the shooter as land developer William Kyle Carruth, the ex-husband of Anne Marie Carruth, the judge of the 72nd District Court in Lubbock and Crosby counties.".....

link

this guy should be charged.

 

[Chaz McNulty]

"No charges or arrests have been made yet in the Nov. 5 shooting death of 54-year-old Chad Read at a home in the in the 2100 block of 90th Street. 

Meanwhile, investigators have turned over their files to the Texas Attorney General's Office, who is handling any potential prosecution in the case after the Lubbock County District Attorney Sunshine Stanek recused her office from the case, citing that the suspect in the shooting was related to a local elected official who could be called as a witness.....

.... records filed in civil court have identified the shooter as land developer William Kyle Carruth, the ex-husband of Anne Marie Carruth, the judge of the 72nd District Court in Lubbock and Crosby counties.".....

link

this guy should be charged.

This happened Nov. 5th and he is still on the streets 3 weeks later.

 

[-fish-]

Retired cop shoots and kills a guy because he threw a bag of popcorn at him.

Claims self-defense under stand your ground law.

He argues that because he is old and the guy may have followed up the thrown popcorn with punching him, he had the right to shoot and kill him.   Another murderer claiming self-defense.  

 

[KarmaPolice]

Retired cop shoots and kills a guy because he threw a bag of popcorn at him.

Claims self-defense under stand your ground law.

He argues that because he is old and the guy may have followed up the thrown popcorn with punching him, he had the right to shoot and kill him.   Another murderer claiming self-defense.  

I mean, who hasn't want to shoot somebody for looking at their phone in the middle of a movie.   Justifiable just for that offense.   

(obviously kidding and that defense is silly)

 

[FairWarning]

Retired cop shoots and kills a guy because he threw a bag of popcorn at him.

Claims self-defense under stand your ground law.

He argues that because he is old and the guy may have followed up the thrown popcorn with punching him, he had the right to shoot and kill him.   Another murderer claiming self-defense.  

Mental illness?  How much was the shooter’s bond?  Seriously though, that’s pretty messed up. And why is the person throwing popcorn?  

 

[KarmaPolice]

Mental illness?  How much was the shooter’s bond?  Seriously though, that’s pretty messed up. And why is the person throwing popcorn?  

Some people don't react well when confronted and told what to do? 

 

[FairWarning]

Some people don't react well when confronted and told what to do? 

No excuse for any of it.    I always wondered how many people are carrying guns in a casino.  Maybe I really don’t want to know that anwwer.

 

[KarmaPolice]

No excuse for any of it.    I always wondered how many people are carrying guns in a casino.  Maybe I really don’t want to know that anwwer.

Of course not.   I have just seen how pissed off people get over little things at our store - ie I have also seen a customer through food at an employee.  One of many reasons I don't like the idea of guns outside the house.  

 

[FairWarning]

Of course not.   I have just seen how pissed off people get over little things at our store - ie I have also seen a customer through food at an employee.  One of many reasons I don't like the idea of guns outside the house.  

I will say for a carry and conceal shooting, there are 100 that are not.  I’m surprised there hasn’t been more of it involving essential jobs like yours and the unhinged public.