Thurman Munson...HOF career? (1 Viewer)

[ThisGuy]

Watched the August 7th 1979 game on YES last night and it got me to thinking.

I was 6 when Thurman died and was enamored with Graig Nettles from the 1978 Series still. I remember Munson as a player and remember the way my Dad spoke of him.

If he didn't die at 32, would he have been a HOFer? ROY, MVP, 7-time All-Star, 3-time GG winner, revered by his teammates and foes alike, great postseasons... If he played into his late 30's, he would most likely have finished his career with over 2,000 hits and 1,000 RBI.

Thoughts? And can we keep the "I hate the Yankees" chat to a minimum? Thanks!

 

[ooofffaaa]

I was fortunate enough to be old enough (10-13) to watch Munson back in the day

One of my favorite all time players and YES if his life wasn't cut short IMO he would have been a HOFer.

He was clutch.

He was the captain and a tremendous leader for the Yankees.

Hard nosed type of player.

I'll never forget exactly where and what I was doing when I heard the news of his death. I was devastated.

ThisGuy - Did you enjoy watching Nettles after the Yankess dumped him off to the Padrs and he had to wear that ridiculous looking jersey. I'l never get over that one either.

 

[The Man from Laramie]

Yes, he would've been. His stats compare favorably to Gary Carter, Carlton Fisk, and others at the point in his career when he passed. He made a bunch of All-Star games. He won a few gold gloves.

 

[JoeSteeler]

I think he would have been a HOF for sure.

7 AS games in 9 seasons (not counting rookie or last season)

MVP

Would have had over 2000hits/1000 RBI from the C position

First Yankee captain since Gehrig

.339 post season avg

He is a fellow Kent State grad and crashed about 20 minutes from where I live. I was young then (11) but I remember everyone talking about it.

 

[ooofffaaa]

(1) Thurman Munson was the American League Rookie of the Year

award in 1970 when he batted .302.

(2) Munson was the 1976 American League Most Valuable Player.

(3) Thurman Munson was in three World Series: 1976, 1977, and

1978. Munson hit .529,.320 and .320 in those World Series

respectively for an overall World Series average of .373.

(4) Thurman was the first Yankee player since "The Yankee

Clipper" Joe DiMaggio to hit .300 or more and have 100 or more

RBI's three years in a row:

1975: .318 BA, 102 RBI

1976: .302 BA, 105 RBI

1977: .308 BA, 100 RBI

(5) Thurman Munson was an American League All-Star catcher seven

times.

(6) Munson hit over the .300 mark five times in his career.

(7) Thurman Munson won 3 Gold Glove Awards in 1973, 1974, and

1975.

(8) Thurman became the Captain of the New York Yankees in 1976,

the first captain of the Yankees since Lou Gehrig in the 1930's.

(9) Thurman Munson had a Lifetime Batting Average of .292.

 

[ThisGuy]

I was fortunate enough to be old enough (10-13) to watch Munson back in the dayOne of my favorite all time players and YES if his life wasn't cut short IMO he would have been a HOFer.He was clutch.He was the captain and a tremendous leader for the Yankees.Hard nosed type of player.I'll never forget exactly where and what I was doing when I heard the news of his death. I was devastated.ThisGuy - Did you enjoy watching Nettles after the Yankess dumped him off to the Padrs and he had to wear that ridiculous looking jersey. I'l never get over that one either.

Thanks, bud. I wish I was older, I'm sure I would have appreciated him more. Nettles made my Uncle cry during the 78 series (he was a HUGE Dodger fan from the Brooklyn days). I went with my Dad and my uncle and cousin to Game 5 and Nettles put on a show. I still play 3rd base and it's because after that game, I didn't want to play another position!I cried the day he was traded, but looking back I understand why the Yanks did it. They had Pags waiting in the wings and got Rasmussen for him. Watching the game last night and seeing the Young Willie Randolph, and Guidry firing strikes and Reggie stumbling around RF sure brought back a ton of memories. Yanks fans - Whatever happened to Bobby Brown?!? He turned a linedrive single into CF, into a double. That guy was amazingly fast!

 

[ThisGuy]

Another question..

Is there a chance that the Veterans Committee puts him in at some point?

 

[JoeSteeler]

VoteThurmanin.com

 

[Workhorse]

Sorry Yankees fans but even if Munson had lived, he's not even remotely close to making the Hall of Fame.

Munson was declining pretty rapidly as a hitter and most of his power was gone by age 32. He never had anywhere close to as much power as Carter or Fisk at any point in his career. He was a singles hitter who grounded into a TON of double plays.

I know he's a sentimental choice for Yankee fans but when you really break it down, he probably wouldn't have made it barring a total turnaround at age 33 for about a 5-10 year stretch - VERY unlikely for a catcher. Munson would have needed to go a long ways even to be as good a candidate as Lance Parrish, and Parrish isn't close to a Hall of Famer either.

 

[ooofffaaa]

Another question..

Is there a chance that the Veterans Committee puts him in at some point?

Rock the vote . . .http://www.votethurmanin.com/HallofFame.html

 

[ThisGuy]

VoteThurmanin.com

Never knew that site existed.

 

[Workhorse]

I never realized until just now that Munson won two gold gloves in the 70s during years where he made more than TWENTY errors each season. That's pretty staggering. 20 errors in a season from a catcher is almost unheard of. In fact, if you look back at every GG winning catcher in AL History, the 1974 and 1975 seasons where Munson won the award look positively HORRIBLE in comparison to every other Gold Glove winning season by a catcher.

 

[The Man from Laramie]

Sorry Yankees fans but even if Munson had lived, he's not even remotely close to making the Hall of Fame.Munson was declining pretty rapidly as a hitter and most of his power was gone by age 32. He never had anywhere close to as much power as Carter or Fisk at any point in his career. He was a singles hitter who grounded into a TON of double plays. I know he's a sentimental choice for Yankee fans but when you really break it down, he probably wouldn't have made it barring a total turnaround at age 33 for about a 5-10 year stretch - VERY unlikely for a catcher. Munson would have needed to go a long ways even to be as good a candidate as Lance Parrish, and Parrish isn't close to a Hall of Famer either.

 

[The Man from Laramie]

I cried the day he was traded, but looking back I understand why the Yanks did it. They had Pags waiting in the wings and got Rasmussen for him.

Pags, while a sentimental favorite, was a pretty abysmal ballplayer.

 

[ThisGuy]

I cried the day he was traded, but looking back I understand why the Yanks did it. They had Pags waiting in the wings and got Rasmussen for him.

Pags, while a sentimental favorite, was a pretty abysmal ballplayer.

True, but they thought they had younger Nettles lined up.

 

[Workhorse]

I cried the day he was traded, but looking back I understand why the Yanks did it. They had Pags waiting in the wings and got Rasmussen for him.

Pags, while a sentimental favorite, was a pretty abysmal ballplayer.

And that "abysmal ballplayer" had almost the same career slugging percentage as Thurman Munson.Just sayin'....

 

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

I cried the day he was traded, but looking back I understand why the Yanks did it. They had Pags waiting in the wings and got Rasmussen for him.

Pags, while a sentimental favorite, was a pretty abysmal ballplayer.

And that "abysmal ballplayer" had almost the same career slugging percentage as Thurman Munson.Just sayin'....

Maybe you can appreciate the concepts of offense being more valuable at certain positions. And you are also talking about a guy who "lacked power" playing in a stadium that was 400 feet to straightway left, and 457 to 430 feet to left center for much of his career. Put Pudge on the Stadium and lets see what he does. Thurman is a Hall of Fame player, though the voters have deemed him not to have a Hall of Fame career. This is where Puckett ruins everything, because he didn't have an HOF career either but not only did he go in, but he goes in on the first ballot. Madness.

 

[Capella]

I always thought he was in the Hall for some reason.

 

[The Man from Laramie]

I cried the day he was traded, but looking back I understand why the Yanks did it. They had Pags waiting in the wings and got Rasmussen for him.

Pags, while a sentimental favorite, was a pretty abysmal ballplayer.

And that "abysmal ballplayer" had almost the same career slugging percentage as Thurman Munson.Just sayin'....

1) He's a catcher.2) He compensated for low power with a good eye and decent average. Career EqA of .282, while not HOF-impressive, compares favorably with guys like Gary Carter and even Fisk. And while they're careers were longer, which makes things a bit unfair, Munson compares favorably in terms of WARP.Had he had a few more seasons, he likely would have made the Hall.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Watched the August 7th 1979 game on YES last night and it got me to thinking.

Is that the first game after his death against the Orioles? I remember thinking in '79 that this game was so obviously fixed to get the "correct results". Sure I was an Oriole homer, but I remember the Orioles cruising along with the lead and then suddenly for 1/2 an inning the strike zone squeezed to non-existent so the "right team" could catch up and take the lead for the win - do I remember it correctly? Or was I as bad as many of you in '79?

 

[The Man from Laramie]

Watched the August 7th 1979 game on YES last night and it got me to thinking.

Is that the first game after his death against the Orioles? I remember thinking in '79 that this game was so obviously fixed to get the "correct results". Sure I was an Oriole homer, but I remember the Orioles cruising along with the lead and then suddenly for 1/2 an inning the strike zone squeezed to non-existent so the "right team" could catch up and take the lead for the win - do I remember it correctly? Or was I as bad as many of you in '79?

I was too young to remember, grandpa.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

If he didn't die at 32, would he have been a HOFer? ROY, MVP, 7-time All-Star, 3-time GG winner, revered by his teammates and foes alike, great postseasons... If he played into his late 30's, he would most likely have finished his career with over 2,000 hits and 1,000 RBI.

Thoughts? And can we keep the "I hate the Yankees" chat to a minimum? Thanks!

I think he needed three or four more seasons with 10+ HR and he would have been in. I think his career had the quality stats, but not the quantity or counting stats that seem to matter disproportionately to the BBWAA members.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

I was too young to remember, grandpa.

I'll just chalk up any disagreements we might have in the future to the ignorance of youth.Oh, and respect your elders!

 

[The Man from Laramie]

I was too young to remember, grandpa.

I'll just chalk up any disagreements we might have in the future to the ignorance of youth.Oh, and respect your elders!

And I'll recall that you have other things on your mind when you post, like the loss of control of your bodily functions.

 

[redman]

Comare Munson's stats side by side with Roy Campanella's. They played the same position for almost the exact same length of time, but Campy's stats bury Munson's in all respects except batting average.

Munson was a very solid player to be sure, but I just don't see where he'd be a Hall of Famer short of perhaps playing long enough to compile 3000 hits, which would have been a longshot anyway.

 

[The Man from Laramie]

except perhaps the most important:

WARP3

Campanella: 71.6

Munson: 71.5

EqA

Campanella: .293

Munson: .282

OPS+

Campanella: 124

Munson: 116

MVPs

Campanella: 3

Munson: 1 (+ ROY)

All Star Games

Campanella: 8 (5 time captain)

Munson: 7 (3 time captain)

Gold Gloves

Campanella: 0 (not awarded during Campanella's career)

Munson: 3

I don't think they differ substantially along a number of important dimensions

 

[TommyGilmore]

Sorry Yankees fans but even if Munson had lived, he's not even remotely close to making the Hall of Fame.Munson was declining pretty rapidly as a hitter and most of his power was gone by age 32. He never had anywhere close to as much power as Carter or Fisk at any point in his career. He was a singles hitter who grounded into a TON of double plays. I know he's a sentimental choice for Yankee fans but when you really break it down, he probably wouldn't have made it barring a total turnaround at age 33 for about a 5-10 year stretch - VERY unlikely for a catcher. Munson would have needed to go a long ways even to be as good a candidate as Lance Parrish, and Parrish isn't close to a Hall of Famer either.

Parrish - 8 All-Star games, 3 GGs, 0 MVPs, .252 averageMunson - 7 All-Star games, 3 GGs, 1 MVP, .292 averageHow exactly is Munson "a long way" from Parrish?