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Titans ask NFL to consider tampering charges against Redskins (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter GregR_2
- Start date
T Bell
Footballguy
What was likely sent and agreed upon was an offer sheet with only the essential terms upon it. The full contract and any particulars are determined later. In the span a six lines you could define a five year contract (each year + the salary for that year, plus an additional line for the guaranteed money). The fact that it was $100M was irrelevant (not least because a great bulk of that number, approaching half of it, is fluff anyway that will never get paid before Haynesworth is either cut or renegotiates) given that those are simply the tools of the trade and Haynesworth was targeted and the money was decided upon long before they began to negotiate. This wasn't a five hour deal - the team on its end and Haynesworth and his agent on their end likely determined over the course of weeks what they'd be willing to spend on the one hand, and what they'd require to reach an agreement on the other. Not that hard to figure out, guys.Chase Stuart said:
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I think you're missing the point. The titans are immune here, he was theoretically their player at the time. They can negotiate with him, no one else can.
In theory, one could argue that Haynesworth's agent did him a dis-service by not (actually) letting him hit the open market. While I realize it's the biggest deal ever and all, it's just the whole point (for the players and NFLPA) is for the market to drive the price up as teams compete. Clearly there was no competing here, the Redskins had this "in the bag".
With no cap next year, suppose Jerry Jones knew for sure the Redskins would get him. Would his ego have made an offer for 101 mil just to raise the bidding on Snyder? Would the Giants not have one of the best DLs (possibly ever) if Haynesworth was their DT?
One could absolutely argue that the price would have gone down and the agent did a great job that's just not as fun though.
With no cap next year, suppose Jerry Jones knew for sure the Redskins would get him. Would his ego have made an offer for 101 mil just to raise the bidding on Snyder? Would the Giants not have one of the best DLs (possibly ever) if Haynesworth was their DT?
One could absolutely argue that the price would have gone down and the agent did a great job that's just not as fun though.
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but, tampering would indicate that Haynesworth MAY not negotiate in good faith because he knew what Wash was offering ... this is the big issue with tampering, imo.
fatness
Footballguy
I'm not sure I follow that reasoning Jeff. You're saying that, if Haynesworth thought he was getting X bucks from the Redskins it would make him try to not get more than X bucks from the Titans?
Talking more in general that his instance. I have no idea if there was tampering. But, for this example IF he had an idea what Wash would offer, his agent could use that against Tenn. Tenn sends over an offer, and instead of responding (countering) in good faith, he counters knowing the Wash offer. Tenn balks and talks break down. I assume Tenn's first offer was much, much less than what Wash gave. As soon as Haynesworth knew that there would be little chance Tenn meets that number, he had no reason to negotiate with Tenn. If this is true (as stated in the post above), then an outsider cannot assume that Tenn had all of this time to negotiate. That was really my point.
fatness
Footballguy
I assume that the Titans offer was considerably less than Haynesworth's agent told him he could get on the open market, which is what happens with some other teams who make offers to players who then decide to become free agents. I'm not sure how the dynamic would be any different.
How many other teams made an offer in that little of time? If none, then how did agent know what "open market" would bring and why did he take the 'Skins offer instead of waiting a week or so to see if more offers would come in? Like I said, I do not know if this is tampering, or if it even matters. Just saying that it would affect the negotiating with the Titans.
PFT's opinion (no recent article, but Florio has always said this):
tampering happens all the time. In fact, when a player tries to get cut or traded, it is the agent's job to know how much he can get on the open market. And the only way he can do this is to talk to owners and GM and find out what type of contract they may be offered. For instance, Laverneous Coles paid $6M to get out of his contract. His agent must know that he can get more than the $6 if he is a free agent. Anything short of that is incompetence on the agent's part.
Haynesworth's agent must have already discussed general contract parameters with many clubs and he knew no one would beat the Redskin's offer. That is how he knows to go with the Redskins offer by 5 am. This same process probably happened with every other free agent that signed on day 1.
tampering happens all the time. In fact, when a player tries to get cut or traded, it is the agent's job to know how much he can get on the open market. And the only way he can do this is to talk to owners and GM and find out what type of contract they may be offered. For instance, Laverneous Coles paid $6M to get out of his contract. His agent must know that he can get more than the $6 if he is a free agent. Anything short of that is incompetence on the agent's part.
Haynesworth's agent must have already discussed general contract parameters with many clubs and he knew no one would beat the Redskin's offer. That is how he knows to go with the Redskins offer by 5 am. This same process probably happened with every other free agent that signed on day 1.
This, I agree with. Why else would the agent not wait for a potentially bigger offer?
-baller
Footballguy
dude.....you can't tamper with YOUR OWN PLAYER.do you understand?it is against the rules to do this sort of thing with someone else's player.that is tampering.which is against the rules and clearly what happened.doing it with your own player is simply negotiating, and obviously well within the rules.they cheated.how can you possibly not see this when the rest of the world does?go ahead and tell me how the team called up his agent at midnight and negotiated a 100 million dollar deal between 12 am and 5 am.......
T Bell
Footballguy
Time to learn another trick, pony.
GregR_2
Footballguy
No you said the opposite of what Jeff is saying. If Haynesworth knows he can get X from the Redskins, he likely won't accept less than X from the Titans. That hurts the Titans because otherwise he might have thought the Titans offer was as good as he was likely to get from anyone else.There's some risk to players in turning down the original club's offer. It might turn out to be the best they'll get, and if they turn it down and hit free agency and the club sees no one else is going to pay him as much, they may offer less, or may already spend their money elsewhere. If teams tamper though, the player's risk lessens so it hurts the original team, the only one with the rights to negotiate.
T Bell
Footballguy
Please don't obstruct baller when he's grinding his axe. TIA.
-baller
Footballguy
apparently, that's not quite true.....
fatness
Footballguy
Sam Quentin
Footballguy
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Bizkiteer
Footballguy
You really think that this commish would not impose a penalty of some sort if there was any evidence? Maybe old commish, but not Goodell.
sho nuff
Footballguy
I think the real point is that it was obvious tampering...but not enough evidence to really do anything about it.Its hard as hell to prove.You really think that this commish would not impose a penalty of some sort if there was any evidence? Maybe old commish, but not Goodell.
fatness
Footballguy
The Patriots were penalized for cheating.
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