To Financial Coach... a coach is gonna coach (1 Viewer)

[Chadstroma]

Fee structure would be the interesting concept to me for this.  Like, taking a percentage of what you've saved someone reducing interest on credit cards, avoiding fees and/or late payments through organization/ideas you provide.  When to refinance a mortgage to save them $X a month.  The possibilities are endless really.    

You could start as a coach and then parlay that into being an advisor once you get someone financially healthy.  I've dabbled with the idea of a financial advisement company that actually only pulls commissions when their clients make money.  There's an initial start up fee of course.  But, you can actually look your client in the face and tell them you're working in their best interest, because if their investments don't move in a positive direction you don't charge them.  Portfolio was down this quarter, sorry, we get bupkis.  This "we do better when YOU do better!" line is such BS to me.  Yeah, you still got your percentage even though my portfolio took a dive.

This isn't a new concept though, and anyone who is actually interested in being "coached," can find that information rather easily for free.  The important factor will be you differentiating yourself somehow.  Good luck.

I think I would lean toward fee based but that is interesting. The mortgage part of that is a no go zone though as it would be a RESPA violation for me to get paid on any loan in which I did not actually work on. 

It is true... people can get the information for free. You can get in Google, Youtube, etc. I mean, literally, Dave Ramsey is a millionaire and his entire advice is "don't spend money and don't use debt..... the end" I send info to people all the time about improving their credit and people still want that personal direction. Also, coaching, just like in sports, isn't just about the objective numbers but helping with the mindset and discovery of bad to turn to good habits, etc. There is a market for sure. How much I could grow this? I don't know. I think that would largely depend on my writing skills (books) and speaking skills and charisma (shows like Ramsey and Suzy). 

 

[Chadstroma]

This would be my response.  Low capital costs, so the price for failure is low.  If you're willing to invest the time and accept that risk, then why not?  You obviously have the experience and chops for it.

When you say risk.... what do you mean by that? 

 

[Sand]

When you say risk.... what do you mean by that? 

Risk in this case is pretty much just a time sink that doesn't pay off.  I don't see much other downside.

 

[-OZ-]

I have not registered yet. I was looking on Google domain. It looks like the cost is about $12 a month I think. 

I seem to remember you wanting to do a FA, right?

Yep.

For me, it will be a 3rd "career". Probably starting in my mid 50s.  Not really a career in that I don't plan to make much $$ doing it. But won't need to.

 

[-OZ-]

Risk in this case is pretty much just a time sink that doesn't pay off.  I don't see much other downside.

Right. Pretty much a hobby unless it takes off.

 

[Chadstroma]

Pros:

1. You’re good at it

2. Small startup cost so very little risk to see if you can make this work.

Cons:

1. Any conflict of interest with your current job? I would be a little suspicious of hearing from a mortgage broker: You don’t qualify right now but pay me $100 bucks and I’ll show you how you can.

2. The way you described it, it sounds like pretty low revenue and not much repeat business. If you charge $100 and help someone, how likely will they be to come back? You need a LOT of those clients to build a business.

3. Can people in a bad state afford to pay someone to help them? While we FBG’s can all afford it, the average joe out there is struggling and may not want to spend more money on something that’s intangible.

Overall, to me it sounds like a good side gig that you could start and see how it progresses. If it grows, great! If not, you haven’t lost much.

How come you have more cons and than pros?! 

Thoughts on the cons: 

1. Running through my thinking on this, I don't think there would be any issues but when it comes to mortgages it is heavily regulated so before I did anything I would need to run it up the flagpole to make sure. The only possible issue I can see is if I was charging money directly for mortgage related business but first niche (I am thinking likely target two or three niche customers) would be first time homebuyers, it really isn't about doing a mortgage. I am thinking of this actually more so for people I can not do loans for (states that my brokerage is not licensed in) which I am very confident there is no issue. For my mortgage clients, I was thinking of giving a refund of like half or something their fees after closing a loan. 

2. The likely route to go is a program structure 1 month, 3 month, 5 month etc. I will need to really get into pricing in more detail. The $100 was literally a one off thing when a guy asked me to help and I allowed him to come up with the payment amount. Thanks to the total failure of school to teach any personal finance skills/knowledge there are millions in need of this type of stuff. Word of mouth of "Hey, this guy helped me- call him!" has always been my biggest asset in all that I have done. 

3. You might be surprised. Sure, there are people out there that do not have two dimes to rub together but there are a lot of people that have disposable income that just are in a bad spot or don't know what to do or are scared or whatever else. Price point will be important though. I don't want to devalue my services but I also don't want to price out the target audience. 

I am in agreement with you on the overall summary. 

 

[Chadstroma]

I have a question that relates to financial planning that I’m uncertain about. Figure this is a good spot. 

Related to the stimulus checks. My brother’s income the last 2 years was above the 80k threshold to get a stimulus check. This past year however his income was just above the 80k number, he hasn’t filled yet and asked if he sets up an IRA which he hasn’t done if he puts in enough can he get this stimulus? 

I told him to do it regardless but wasn’t sure if that impacts his income in how it relates to qualifying for a stimulus check.

Anyone know?

My understanding: The stimulus money is based on AGI (Adjusted Gross Income) and then if you have not filed taxes yet, will be based on your 2019 AGI. If you fill before disbursement then it would be based on the 2020 AGI on the taxes. If his income was lower for 2020 than 2019 then he would want to hurry up and file. If reverse then he would want to hold off filing. A traditional IRA contribution would lower the AGI. 

 

[Chadstroma]

Can someone sign their wife up anonymously?  Asking for a friend.

Maybe I could put together a special package for an intervention. 

 

[Chadstroma]

If it's like the last stimulus the answer is yes.  I'd get the IRA going, get income where he wants it.  He *should* be able to claim those credits when filing next year if he doesn't get them this year.  It has to be a traditional IRA to drive the income level down.  Roth won't work.

Absolutely worth it.

Yup. Missed stimulus money can be claimed in taxes. 

 

[Chadstroma]

All could be pieces to the puzzle and I like the sessions idea too. I've been on Ramit Sethi's mailing list for over a decade, it seems what he has been cashing in off of his successful book (I Will Teach You to Be Rich).  Ultimately though, I think a lot of it will depend on the community you end up attracting. Doing it in addition to your broker role will allow time to evaluate and iterate.

I am actually not familiar with Ramit but one of his books (pretty sure it is the one you listed... I don't know if he has more than one book or not) is on a suggested reading list on this book I just got for starting financial coaching. 

 

[Chadstroma]

I'm on the fence with this.   It's like the RE agents that put on "first time buyer" seminars and maybe one person shows up.

Also, you're kinda already doing this and you get paid when you get to do a loan for them.

Hey, I got 6 people to show with the RE agent that wanted to do one a few years back! 

Yea, there is the people I can do loans for but I literally have people asking me for help now that I can't do loans with and I am torn. I can't pour time and energy for free into people all the time though I want to and and enjoy it. I have to make money for my family. If I get some money out of it, then I can happily help those people. 

 

[The General]

I don't know what the roll off is for what just passed, but he theoretically can drop income 6k - should be easy enough to plot up contribution vs. benefits.  If he has kids that goes into it, too.

BTW, my 21 year old, for some reason, never got a stimulus check from either round, despite the fact that I emancipated him on my taxes before the pandemic started.  On his taxes, which we just completed, we were able to claim both stimuli payments.  (His scholarship was dependent on him being emancipated - it cost me a bit, but man did it end up paying off for him!)

Sorry to hijack @Chadstroma (but thanks again for your mortgage advice a few weeks back!)

Wanted to thank @Sand. My little bro put in about 3K into a IRA and will get back an extra 1K on the stimmy check because of that if he calculated correctly and read the rules. 

 

[Chadstroma]

Chad...I'm leaning no.  People don't pay Dave Ramsey outside of some books or seminars.  He makes his money selling advertising and sponsoring stuff.  If you do go this route, to be successful you'll have to prioritize monetizing you efforts over helping people.  Personally I think you would be better off expanding your current model of hawking wares while offering free advice and good customer service.  If you want to help people with money then I'd go all in as a financial advisor.  Otherwise I do think you could make a boatload helping people with their insurance needs.

Actually they do. Ramsey even has financial coaches under his banner and people pay over $200 a pop for the group session seminars to be told in a bunch of different ways, don't spend money and don't use credit oh and here is some really piss poor advice on mortgages and investing too. 

I could be making more money right now but I am not driven by money primarily. I need to make income of course but that has never been my driving force or else my life would look very different. Now, I am not opposed to making more money but I am kind of semi burnt out on mortgages right now. The enjoyment I get from them is actually helping people. 

I will do the mortgages and the insurance but I do think that doing the coaching will be something I can do to pull in a few extra bucks and enjoy and may pay off in the mortgages and insurance as well at times. 

 

[The General]

My understanding: The stimulus money is based on AGI (Adjusted Gross Income) and then if you have not filed taxes yet, will be based on your 2019 AGI. If you fill before disbursement then it would be based on the 2020 AGI on the taxes. If his income was lower for 2020 than 2019 then he would want to hurry up and file. If reverse then he would want to hold off filing. A traditional IRA contribution would lower the AGI. 

Thanks!! It sounds like they will have a period where they will check all this to make sure you benefit the most. We found this article that seemed clear: Link

If we read that right if he puts in the contribution now, and they have already worked his stimmy check on current numbers then when he files they will send a check later this year.

Worst case is I got him to put money away that he would have spent on dumb stuff

 

[Chadstroma]

Last new vehicle (wife, I don't rate new vehicles) we financed as there was a $500 rebate.  Financed the minimum (10k) and paid it off early.  Pocketed $300 or so on the deal.

These systems can be worked.

There is a huge psychological aspect to money. It is a big reason why I say that when it comes to financial services there is no one size fits all. For some people, the idea of any debt is an emotional weight. For others, leveraging debt to make more money just is what you do because it makes sense by the numbers and they have a higher tolerance for risk. 

Leverage can be a powerful wealth creation tool. A great example to help people understand this is Apple. They have more cash on hand than any other entity on the planet the last time I checked they roughly have about $200 billion of cash on hand but they also carry about $100 billion in debt. 

It makes sense to take the deal like you did. Even more so if you are a person that is really bothered by debt. 

For me personally I hate to throw $10K into a locked 3.29% return. I have my liquid cash reserves making poo and the rest I want working for me. If I am not getting over 3.29% return on my money, then I am pissed off. I see the interest rate being paid as the same as money I am not getting paid on an investment.

What is a good route for me to go may not be a good route for you to go. At the end of the day, what I call the 'sleep well at night factor' is extremely important and can trump what pure mathematics say. 

 

[Chadstroma]

Thanks!! It sounds like they will have a period where they will have a period where they will check all this to make sure you benefit the most. We found this article that seemed clear: Link

If we read that right if he puts in the contribution now, and they have already worked his stimmy check on current numbers then when he files they will send a check later this year.

Worst case is I got him to put money away that he would have spent on dumb stuff

That is a good article. From a good reputable source (I will need to get a Kiplingers subscription again... hey, tax write off!) easily understood with the calculator. Thanks!

And for the brother.... yea, likely there isn't much of a retirement fund he has built up. It sure will not hurt him!

 

[Chadstroma]

LLC gives you more tax flexibility than S Corp.

That is what I remember (taxes are my weakest area) but was not sure. I was leaning towards LLC.

 

[Chadstroma]

Risk in this case is pretty much just a time sink that doesn't pay off.  I don't see much other downside.

Oh yea.... it isn't like I am betting the home on this or anything. At least not yet.... 

 

[Chadstroma]

Yep.

For me, it will be a 3rd "career". Probably starting in my mid 50s.  Not really a career in that I don't plan to make much $$ doing it. But won't need to.

Who knows, maybe I don't screw this up and grow it into a real business and would be looking to hire when you were looking to make the 3rd career change

 

[Chadstroma]

Ok, I am pretty sure I have moved from should I into I am going to further explore this with the intent of doing it. 

BTW, someone in my FB group just posted this... as if I needed further encouragement in this direction 

Thank you for continuing to prolifically provide highly relevant and accurate information to the group members. You consistently educate and give excellent resources/links to help us be diligent and informed in our financial pursuits. I have received more useful and straightforward assistance from my membership in this group than I would have from many paid services! As always, thank you for your time and professional support.

 

[The General]

That is a good article. From a good reputable source (I will need to get a Kiplingers subscription again... hey, tax write off!) easily understood with the calculator. Thanks!

And for the brother.... yea, likely there isn't much of a retirement fund he has built up. It sure will not hurt him!

He’s a chemical engineer with the Navy, 100 times smarter than me but he also does the dumbest stuff. Two ex-wives by 35 

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

I can tell you that i am absolutely clueless when it comes to the world of insurance.  In terms of the different types of options available, what fits best, how to use them as financial vehicles, etc.

I’m hesitant to contact insurance brokers because most seem to come off as commission-based that would just try to sell me into something I don’t really need or want.

if there was a fee-based fiduciary insurance broker or consultant similar to a mortgage broker, that is something I would absolutely be interested in.

 

[-OZ-]

Who knows, maybe I don't screw this up and grow it into a real business and would be looking to hire when you were looking to make the 3rd career change

Can I use my fbg bannings as my resume?

 

[-OZ-]

I can tell you that i am absolutely clueless when it comes to the world of insurance.  In terms of the different types of options available, what fits best, how to use them as financial vehicles, etc.

I’m hesitant to contact insurance brokers because most seem to come off as commission-based that would just try to sell me into something I don’t really need or want.

if there was a fee-based fiduciary insurance broker or consultant similar to a mortgage broker, that is something I would absolutely be interested in.

You might want fee only. 

 

[Chadstroma]

He’s a chemical engineer with the Navy, 100 times smarter than me but he also does the dumbest stuff. Two ex-wives by 35 

Smart people can be the dumbest ones. 

 

[Chadstroma]

I can tell you that i am absolutely clueless when it comes to the world of insurance.  In terms of the different types of options available, what fits best, how to use them as financial vehicles, etc.

I’m hesitant to contact insurance brokers because most seem to come off as commission-based that would just try to sell me into something I don’t really need or want.

if there was a fee-based fiduciary insurance broker or consultant similar to a mortgage broker, that is something I would absolutely be interested in.

There really isn't a ton of money in insurance commissions. You get a lump sum for the selling of the insurance. With the broker I am going to work with (who was my personal broker first and then I have referred him my mortgage clients as well for a while) I sent over a client that go home and auto with him. I asked how that would break down for commission and the total lump sum for those was $400 (not what will be my cut but total commission). There are annual residuals so it seems to me that you make your money in building a book of business and getting the residuals (paid out on a much smaller commission scale) and by sheer numbers make money. When talking to him I looked into it more and the 90th percentile of insurance brokers make about $120K a year. I mean, that is the top end of the profession and I am sure after years of business. I think this is why he is focusing more on business insurance, I assume there is more commissions there. 

When I shopped him vs about 12 other captured insurance agents, it wasn't a contest. I moved from Liberty Mutual to Allstate because my wife's family worked with the agent and was suppose to be giving us a great deal and extra VIP stuff etc. It was lower than Liberty Mutual but my goodness.... HORRIBLE experience in a claim with Allstate. During my accident, I dug into it more and the conversation I had with the wrecker stood out. I mentioned my issues with fighting with insurance and he asked me "Allstate or State Farm?" and I looked at him like "Wha? How did you..." he went on an explained they always have the worse claims experience. Now, it wasn't a total but I did put in a claim with Liberty Mutual and it was an awesome, easy and pleasant thing. Now, after seeing a lot of policy amounts I further see that Allstate and State Farm ALSO tend to have higher homeowners premiums. 

And one more thing... a captured agent for an insurance is USELESS. When I was dealing with Allstate, my agent basically only apologized and said she could ask them to do more... which meant ZERO. Here is the difference of a captured agent and a broker. If the agent feels their company isn't doing right by the customer there really isn't anything they can do. With the broker, they can basically tell them, "look, if you don't fix this- you are not getting any more of my business" so they actually have more leverage to get things done than a captured agent even though you would think the opposite would be true that the employee of the company could get things done better than the broker. 

 

[Chadstroma]

Ok, so I want to form an LLC to get the ball rolling on a few things which means I need a name. 

My surname is Masters so using that just makes sense to me for branding purposes and it being easily usable. 

The basic things I am thinking are...

Masters Financial Coaching LLC

Financial Coaching Masters LLC

Any feedback on those?

Any other ideas?

 

[Rattle and Hum]

FAM: Financial Andragogy Masters

 

[KGB]

The Stonk Master!

Masters Financial Coaching LLC

Buy the domain before you do the LLC.  People scour the records and snag them up to sell it to you later.

In my opinion, I didnt add the LLC to my domain name.  I just did "mastersFinancialcoaching.com"  uppder and lower case dont matter,.

Unless things have changed.  google domains was horrible.  I prefer Godaddy, it's like 12 bucks a year

 

[KGB]

The Stonk Master!

Masters Financial Coaching LLC

Buy the domain before you do the LLC.  People scour the records and snag them up to sell it to you later.

In my opinion, I didnt add the LLC to my domain name.  I just did "mastersFinancialcoaching.com"  uppder and lower case dont matter,.

Unless things have changed.  google domains was horrible.  I prefer Godaddy, it's like 12 bucks a year

Also, buy the "domain privacy" if you dont want people to publicly see your name, address, and phone number.  Like scammers and internet weirdos  

 

[Chadstroma]

FAM: Financial Andragogy Masters

Get your big words that I have to look up to know meaning of out of here!

 

[Chadstroma]

The Stonk Master!

Masters Financial Coaching LLC

Buy the domain before you do the LLC.  People scour the records and snag them up to sell it to you later.

In my opinion, I didnt add the LLC to my domain name.  I just did "mastersFinancialcoaching.com"  uppder and lower case dont matter,.

Unless things have changed.  google domains was horrible.  I prefer Godaddy, it's like 12 bucks a year

Already done. I am pretty sure that was the way I was/am going go... so I bought the domain just to hold it. 

I didn't do the privacy thing I don't think... and did via Google. I am sure that I can add privacy though, ya?

Nevermind... apparently I accidentally got the privacy.

 

[KGB]

Already done. I am pretty sure that was the way I was/am going go... so I bought the domain just to hold it. 

I didn't do the privacy thing I don't think... and did via Google. I am sure that I can add privacy though, ya?

yes, you can add it.  just so you know, anyone can look up any domain to see who owns it.  may not be a bad thing, but maybe you dont want your residential address known assuming you dont have a business address.  OR MAYBE NOT

https://www.godaddy.com/whois

Actually, maybe someone can chime in...

I just looked up a bunch and it doesnt show any private info.

Has something changed?

 

[Desert_Power]

Ok, so I want to form an LLC to get the ball rolling on a few things which means I need a name. 

My surname is Masters so using that just makes sense to me for branding purposes and it being easily usable. 

The basic things I am thinking are...

Masters Financial Coaching LLC

Financial Coaching Masters LLC

Any feedback on those?

Any other ideas?

Someone already has written a poorly reviewed book called: Mastering Money

That was the only semicreative idea.

 

[Chadstroma]

Someone already has written a poorly reviewed book called: Mastering Money

That was the only semicreative idea.

Maybe Mastersing Money? 

I will see myself out...

 

[Shatner!]

Mister Masters Money Matters

 

[Grahamburn]

I think I would lean toward fee based but that is interesting. The mortgage part of that is a no go zone though as it would be a RESPA violation for me to get paid on any loan in which I did not actually work on. 

It is true... people can get the information for free. You can get in Google, Youtube, etc. I mean, literally, Dave Ramsey is a millionaire and his entire advice is "don't spend money and don't use debt..... the end" I send info to people all the time about improving their credit and people still want that personal direction. Also, coaching, just like in sports, isn't just about the objective numbers but helping with the mindset and discovery of bad to turn to good habits, etc. There is a market for sure. How much I could grow this? I don't know. I think that would largely depend on my writing skills (books) and speaking skills and charisma (shows like Ramsey and Suzy). 

I’m thinking the sales aspect of what you’re doing might be easier if you approach it as “let me show you what I can do for you. I’ll save you $X and you pay me $Y% of those savings” versus “Give me $100 and I’ll coach you up.” That way you’re showing your clients immediate value  

Just a thought. 

 

[Chadstroma]

Mister Masters Money Matters

That is loooooooooooooong

 

[Chadstroma]

I’m thinking the sales aspect of what you’re doing might be easier if you approach it as “let me show you what I can do for you. I’ll save you $X and you pay me $Y% of those savings” versus “Give me $100 and I’ll coach you up.” That way you’re showing your clients immediate value  

Just a thought. 

That is tricky for a few reasons.... 

Some clients, specially the niche I will be doing mostly starting out, will be hard to quantify.... how much did I really save them in getting their first home loan? The answer is likely a lot but hard to specify and then if I could, the cost savings on a mortgage would be significant. Much more than just paying a set fee. 

 

[ChiefD]

Have your customers pay you $5 for every point their credit score goes up. 

 

[Chadstroma]

So.... I haven't really done anything yet and I have my second (technically second since the one guy before) paying customer. He is part of the FB group I do centered on credit scores. He reached out and basically said he wanted to sign up. I had a conversation with him and explained that I literally had NOTHING set up... and everything is in planning stages but that I have been doing everything informally for years. If he was fine not having everything pretty and efficient then we could figure something out. I told him I would give him a discount from what I expect to charge and gave him to options based on our conversation about what he was looking to do and what it sounded like he would need to achieve. Looking at 3 months with two 30 min calls each month, charging $100 a month. It is lower than what I expect to charge but like I said, I literally will be doing it all on the fly so a discount makes sense. To sum up, $100 from the first client a few months back. $300 from the second one. Total spent on the business so far is like under $30. Not bad for not even trying yet. 

 

[KGB]

So.... I haven't really done anything yet and I have my second (technically second since the one guy before) paying customer. He is part of the FB group I do centered on credit scores. He reached out and basically said he wanted to sign up. I had a conversation with him and explained that I literally had NOTHING set up... and everything is in planning stages but that I have been doing everything informally for years. If he was fine not having everything pretty and efficient then we could figure something out. I told him I would give him a discount from what I expect to charge and gave him to options based on our conversation about what he was looking to do and what it sounded like he would need to achieve. Looking at 3 months with two 30 min calls each month, charging $100 a month. It is lower than what I expect to charge but like I said, I literally will be doing it all on the fly so a discount makes sense. To sum up, $100 from the first client a few months back. $300 from the second one. Total spent on the business so far is like under $30. Not bad for not even trying yet. 

Having a cool test person is great.  I still hook up my first customer because they were so cool while I was still getting everything figured out.

 

[Desert_Power]

So.... I haven't really done anything yet and I have my second (technically second since the one guy before) paying customer. He is part of the FB group I do centered on credit scores. He reached out and basically said he wanted to sign up. I had a conversation with him and explained that I literally had NOTHING set up... and everything is in planning stages but that I have been doing everything informally for years. If he was fine not having everything pretty and efficient then we could figure something out. I told him I would give him a discount from what I expect to charge and gave him to options based on our conversation about what he was looking to do and what it sounded like he would need to achieve. Looking at 3 months with two 30 min calls each month, charging $100 a month. It is lower than what I expect to charge but like I said, I literally will be doing it all on the fly so a discount makes sense. To sum up, $100 from the first client a few months back. $300 from the second one. Total spent on the business so far is like under $30. Not bad for not even trying yet. 

This is obviously difficult to scale, but is a very good minimum viable product.  Record these sessions if possible with permission. It will help you study what works and what doesn't. Make sure to hook up your first customers with whatever book/service/overall product you end up with.

 

[Chadstroma]

Shoot.... I have some concepts for a logo on the Masters Financial Coaching. I wish I could share it and get some feedback. I know I can't post a jpg here. Any ideas on how to do that so you guys can see?

 

[jrt103]

Just upload the image somewhere like HERE  and send the link 

 

[Chadstroma]

I did Instagram because I am an idiot and couldn't figure out that one... 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CM0g9k4Ds1E/?igshid=db5s86rk1d4w

Water color 29d is the design company and not part of logo. These are 5 concepts. I can ask for other direction, changes, color, etc. 

 

[Ron Swanson]

Maybe Mastering Money? 

I will see myself out...

I'd drop the "maybe". Makes you sound unsure.

 

[Chadstroma]

I'd drop the "maybe". Makes you sound unsure.

Maybe Semi-Mastered Money

 

[Chadstroma]

Bummer... I was hoping to get feedback from some of you on the logo options before asking for changes revisions etc. Is Instagram too girlie for you guys or something?

 

[ChiefD]

Bummer... I was hoping to get feedback from some of you on the logo options before asking for changes revisions etc. Is Instagram too girlie for you guys or something?

Hold on, I'll take a look.