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Tony Gonzalez is the greatest TE in NFL history (1 Viewer)

RhymesMcJuice

RhymesMcJuice

Footballguy
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
That is incredible.
 
Found this interesting...

Tony G's first 8 seasons (97-04) compared to Jason Witten's first 8 (03-10):

Catches:

Gonzalez - 570

Witten - 617

Yards:

Gonzalez - 6905

Witten - 6967

TDs:

Gonzalez - 54

Witten - 54

Gates has better numbers in yards and TDs than either Gates or Witten through his first 8 years (also 03-10), but given the fact he's a full 2 years older than Witten, I think his chance of catching Gonzalez is less likely.

 
First 8 seasons.

Gates: 529, 7005, 69

Gonzalez: 570, 6905, 54

Pretty similar. Gates with a pretty big lead in TDs and Y/R.

After 9 seasons for Gonzalez: 648, 7810, 56.

Gates is still 2 seasons worth of TDs ahead even if he doesn't play another down this year. I don't think Gates catches him though, since he started his career 2 years later than Gonzalez.

 
'Sandeman said:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
That is incredible.
Click to expand...
Receptions are somewhat overrated as a stat, but it is amazing that he's going to wind up so high on the all-time list--and not only are the other TEs way below, it doesn't look like any of the active WRs are threats to catch him any time soon. (Best bet is Andre Johnson with just under 700 at age 30). Unlike some of the pass-catching TEs (Witten and Clark, for example), Gonzo is also an outstanding blocker (Gates blocks well, too). It's no coincidence that Priest Holmes and Ladanian Tomlinson had their huge seasons with great pass-catching and blocking TEs.

Gonzo redefined the position; the success of guys like Gates and Witten was made possible by his contributions. The "first N years" arguments don't really hold water, because Gonzo started younger and also came first. After Gonzo's success, people were looking for "Gonzo-type" players, so the TEs who are entering the league now have a lot more opportunity to catch passes than Gonzo did as a rookie.

 
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely. Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
Additionally, he was a significant part of one of the greatest OLs in history. This was an OL that included Brian Waters, Will Shields and Willie Roaf made Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson's careers and records.
 
'CalBear said:
The "first N years" arguments don't really hold water, because Gonzo started younger and also came first. After Gonzo's success, people were looking for "Gonzo-type" players, so the TEs who are entering the league now have a lot more opportunity to catch passes than Gonzo did as a rookie.
Click to expand...
Not sure how you can say this considering guys like Ozzie Newsome, Kellen Winslow Sr and Shannon Sharpe came well before Tony Gonzalez. We can probably include Keith Jackson and Mark Bavaro here too.
 
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'SacramentoBob said:
'CalBear said:
The "first N years" arguments don't really hold water, because Gonzo started younger and also came first. After Gonzo's success, people were looking for "Gonzo-type" players, so the TEs who are entering the league now have a lot more opportunity to catch passes than Gonzo did as a rookie.
Click to expand...
Not sure how you can say this considering guys like Ozzie Newsome, Kellen Winslow Sr and Shannon Sharpe came well before Tony Gonzalez. We can probably include Keith Jackson and Mark Bavaro here too.
Click to expand...
There are ways that Gonzalez is a throwback to guys like Newsome and Winslow Sr. Sharpe was basically a big WR; he didn't really block. Between 1987 and 2000, only one TE other than Sharpe had 1000 yards receiving (Ben Coates in 1994); the position had been thought obsolete with the plethora of West Coast offenses.
 
'AmosMoses said:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
Additionally, he was a significant part of one of the greatest OLs in history. This was an OL that included Brian Waters, Will Shields and Willie Roaf made Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson's careers and records.
Click to expand...
the flip side is the great OL allowed him to go out as a receiver and set these records. When the line had injuries, he had to stay in more which led to less receptions. Not to diminish his accomplishments or his talent as a blocker, but if not for that great line, he would not have quite the stats he does.
 
'FUBAR said:
'AmosMoses said:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
Additionally, he was a significant part of one of the greatest OLs in history. This was an OL that included Brian Waters, Will Shields and Willie Roaf made Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson's careers and records.
Click to expand...
the flip side is the great OL allowed him to go out as a receiver and set these records. When the line had injuries, he had to stay in more which led to less receptions. Not to diminish his accomplishments or his talent as a blocker, but if not for that great line, he would not have quite the stats he does.
Click to expand...
Of course, we can say that about just about anyone with great stats.
 
'FUBAR said:
'AmosMoses said:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
Additionally, he was a significant part of one of the greatest OLs in history. This was an OL that included Brian Waters, Will Shields and Willie Roaf made Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson's careers and records.
Click to expand...
the flip side is the great OL allowed him to go out as a receiver and set these records. When the line had injuries, he had to stay in more which led to less receptions. Not to diminish his accomplishments or his talent as a blocker, but if not for that great line, he would not have quite the stats he does.
Click to expand...
Nah. Not really.
 
Anyone think Graham with the start to his career and how he has Brees tied to him for a long time has a chance to catch him? lol :popcorn:

 
'Hendo said:
Anyone think Graham with the start to his career and how he has Brees tied to him for a long time has a chance to catch him? lol :popcorn:
Click to expand...
The key will be how he preforms when Brees is gone in about 5 years. Gonzalez was steady regardless of QB.
 
'SacramentoBob said:
'FUBAR said:
'AmosMoses said:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
Additionally, he was a significant part of one of the greatest OLs in history. This was an OL that included Brian Waters, Will Shields and Willie Roaf made Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson's careers and records.
Click to expand...
the flip side is the great OL allowed him to go out as a receiver and set these records. When the line had injuries, he had to stay in more which led to less receptions. Not to diminish his accomplishments or his talent as a blocker, but if not for that great line, he would not have quite the stats he does.
Click to expand...
Of course, we can say that about just about anyone with great stats.
Click to expand...
Certainly. Gonzo is lucky enough to have been in a spot where his stats are in line with his talent. Others haven't been.
 
I would think calling him the best TE ever is an understatement. Really the discussion should be how high he ranks among all receivers at any position. I personally think there is an pretty decent argument that he's one of the best 10 or 12 to ever play.

 
Receiving tight end, I definitely think he is the best. I remember in his prime teams were triple teaming him. The fact he has been successful for so long is also impressive. But I also feel like to be judged as the greatest you have to be a great receiver and a great blocker. Gonzalez was a woeful blcoker early in his career and has developed into a good blocker. My vote for best tight end of all time would be Ozzie Newsome.

 
'CalBear said:
'Sandeman said:
'RhymesMcJuice said:
Until recently, I thought that Gates was a challenger to that title yet with his foot problems it's becoming unlikely.

Career TD's by a TE: 92 - next closest is Gates at 69, followed by Sharpe at 62.

Career Yards by a TE: 12,781 - next closest is Sharpe at 10,060.

Career Receptions by a TE: 1099 - next closest is Sharpe at 815. With 4 more receptions he will be #2 in career receptions behind Jerry Rice.

The crazy thing is that he's not done yet and if he plays next year he could pass the 100 TD mark which would place him #6 on the all-time receiving TD list - ahead of Tim Brown and Steve Largent. He's also 1200 yards from #7 in career receiving yards.
Click to expand...
That is incredible.
Click to expand...
Receptions are somewhat overrated as a stat, but it is amazing that he's going to wind up so high on the all-time list--and not only are the other TEs way below, it doesn't look like any of the active WRs are threats to catch him any time soon. (Best bet is Andre Johnson with just under 700 at age 30). Unlike some of the pass-catching TEs (Witten and Clark, for example), Gonzo is also an outstanding blocker (Gates blocks well, too). It's no coincidence that Priest Holmes and Ladanian Tomlinson had their huge seasons with great pass-catching and blocking TEs.

Gonzo redefined the position; the success of guys like Gates and Witten was made possible by his contributions. The "first N years" arguments don't really hold water, because Gonzo started younger and also came first. After Gonzo's success, people were looking for "Gonzo-type" players, so the TEs who are entering the league now have a lot more opportunity to catch passes than Gonzo did as a rookie.
Click to expand...
How did I know you would chime in on this. :rolleyes: BTW, LeBron says hello. :bye:

 
'Hendo said:
Anyone think Graham with the start to his career and how he has Brees tied to him for a long time has a chance to catch him? lol :popcorn:
Click to expand...
No chance - Gonzo has 3000 receiving yards by age 24, Jimmy had 0. That's a long way to catch up even with Brees as his QB.
 
I think Gonzo is the best receiving TE in NFL history as the TE position has changed dramatically in the last 10-15 years.

 
You know you're getting old when guys that you watched in high school and college start coming to the end of Hall of Fame professional careers. A lot of memories from watching Gonzales and Jason Kidd at Cal back in the day. With Rodgers, Lynch and Nnamdi carrying the flame...go Bears

 
'Barry said:
Gonzalez will have better career than Gates, but Gates is a superior player.
Click to expand...
The thing that amazed me about Gates were his ability to get in position and his velcro hands. Used to catch everything thrown his way...not anymore
 
'cracKer said:
You know you're getting old when guys that you watched in high school and college start coming to the end of Hall of Fame professional careers. A lot of memories from watching Gonzales and Jason Kidd at Cal back in the day. With Rodgers, Lynch and Nnamdi carrying the flame...go Bears
Click to expand...
His rookie year was my first year of FF so I hear ya.
 
'cstu said:
'cracKer said:
You know you're getting old when guys that you watched in high school and college start coming to the end of Hall of Fame professional careers. A lot of memories from watching Gonzales and Jason Kidd at Cal back in the day. With Rodgers, Lynch and Nnamdi carrying the flame...go Bears
Click to expand...
His rookie year was my first year of FF so I hear ya.
Click to expand...
I'll say this: He is by far and away the best TE of his era. The problem I have with these "best of ALL time" discussions is that each era has it's own unique qualifications. Way back when, TE's only blocked. Then as football (or most sports)evolved, so did the position. Ditka and Mackey began to make the TE position an offensive weapon, rather than just another lineman. Gonzo could not have played TE in 1964 IMO. While in his era TG has been a pretty good blocking TE, he would have been a WR in the Ditka era. Then Casper and Newsome came along, and they began to redifine the TE position. The next era, came Winslow and Sharpe, and on some teams, the TE became a primary passing target. In this era, when TE became more of pass catching position vs. a blocking position, TG is by far the best. Gonzo rewrote how a TE can be used. He paved the way for offensive coordinators to implement game plans for TE's whose primary job was pass catching, not blocking. Then came Gates, Witten and now a slew of very good pass catching TE's. I think Bavarro may have been the last of the outstanding blocking TE's that could also catch and run routes, a near Ditka-like throwback. He never was the reciever these other players are, but capable of pancake blocking D linemen. None of these present era TE's can do that. Of this group, I think Celek may be the best blocking TE of the bunch, but even he can't block the way Ditka, Casper and Bavarro could.Basketball hasn't eveolved the way most other sports have, so MJ IMO is arguably the best of all time in the NBA. The only clear cut best of all time for me, is answering who is the best HR hitter of all time. When Ruth hit 60, that was more than any other TEAM in baseball. He out homered every other entire roster in MLB! That is about the only way to compare one era to another. I'm no big fan of D Sanders, but he made a great point about Brees' new NFL consequtive game TD record. Unitas did it in an age of no indoor stadiums, and no PI calls. DB's could hit recievers at will back then. While Brees may have the record, is it as impressive as Unitas' streak? Different eras. Hard to compare.
 
'Rovers said:
'cstu said:
'cracKer said:
You know you're getting old when guys that you watched in high school and college start coming to the end of Hall of Fame professional careers. A lot of memories from watching Gonzales and Jason Kidd at Cal back in the day. With Rodgers, Lynch and Nnamdi carrying the flame...go Bears
Click to expand...
His rookie year was my first year of FF so I hear ya.
Click to expand...
I'll say this: He is by far and away the best TE of his era. The problem I have with these "best of ALL time" discussions is that each era has it's own unique qualifications. Way back when, TE's only blocked. Then as football (or most sports)evolved, so did the position. Ditka and Mackey began to make the TE position an offensive weapon, rather than just another lineman. Gonzo could not have played TE in 1964 IMO. While in his era TG has been a pretty good blocking TE, he would have been a WR in the Ditka era. Then Casper and Newsome came along, and they began to redifine the TE position. The next era, came Winslow and Sharpe, and on some teams, the TE became a primary passing target. In this era, when TE became more of pass catching position vs. a blocking position, TG is by far the best. Gonzo rewrote how a TE can be used. He paved the way for offensive coordinators to implement game plans for TE's whose primary job was pass catching, not blocking. Then came Gates, Witten and now a slew of very good pass catching TE's. I think Bavarro may have been the last of the outstanding blocking TE's that could also catch and run routes, a near Ditka-like throwback. He never was the reciever these other players are, but capable of pancake blocking D linemen. None of these present era TE's can do that. Of this group, I think Celek may be the best blocking TE of the bunch, but even he can't block the way Ditka, Casper and Bavarro could.
Click to expand...
:goodposting: I'd add that Bavaro was a very good receiver as well and the Giants were not afraid to call his number when they needed a big play/1st down. He may not have the numbers of some of the TE's of this era but he's very much HOF worthy IMO.
 
He has said this is his final year, correct? If so, that's crazy. He looks almost like he's in his prime.

I hope he reconsiders and takes it on a year-by-year basis.

 
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