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USA Shootings (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter randall146
- Start date
Stealthycat
Footballguy
did you not say you feel so safe that you don't have anything in place to protect you or your family or your property ?
if this country is so safe, why would anyone need any defense against crime at all ?
-fish-
Footballguy
You just lied about Chicago's gun laws. When you lie, you should be called out. If your position has merit, you don't need to lie about the facts. Stop lying.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
spamming
posting useless crap on forums over and over
If you think the numbers on violence against women is span, if you think the hard facts on who is committing crimes and what needs done to protect our kids at school .... if you think all that is spamming, don't click this thread and don't read it
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
That is such an extreme leap. All I said was that I should be thankful that I live where I personally don't feel the need for that.
please?
-fish-
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
Why are you saying this to a person who has never suggested banning all guns? If you haven't figured it out yet, your elementary talking points don't apply to my positions. I don't know why you keep quoting me and spouting them.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
Chicago doesn't have tough gun laws ?
City residents can own firearms but with several conditions: You must be 21 years old and possess a firearm owner's identification (FOID) card and concealed carry license, both issued by Illinois State Police.
Prior to getting a concealed carry license, residents must complete a 16-hour training course, which includes a gun range test that residents must pass, as well as coursework on gun safety. They are also subject to a background check and must pay a $150 application fee. Applicants may be denied a concealed carry license, or have law enforcement agencies object to their applications, if they have particular criminal convictions.
Those who keep guns in the home must hold only a valid FOID card. Gun owners who carry a firearm outside the home must have an FOID and a concealed carry permit.
also
That's tough, on top of IL gun laws. can't have AR15's either right ? how many run stores and gun ranges in Chicago ? The Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence, which tracks gun laws nationwide, has given the state a B+ for its gun laws. Right ?
maybe your idea of tough is 100% ban - but I certainly didn't lie.
You have no room in your world to admit it though, that's ok.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
so you do lock doors ?
security system ?
why ? if there isn't a risk of crime, why would you take measure of self defense / protection ?
According to this, they had really strict gun laws.
http://www.encyclopedia.chicagohistory.org/pages/557.html
What happened if they aren't as strict now?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
as I posted before, Chicago and IL still has tough gun laws
admit it - you called me a liar and don't even know the facts
Stealthycat
Footballguy
court rulings
crimes went down, spiked up ..... all that crimes is centered in certain inner cities - drugs/crime/gangs ..... the Chicago problem centers around those things
stop the drugs, stop the gangs .... the gun violence stops
ignore that, focus on law abiding people, and guess what? the drugs and gangs will still be going strong
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
Do you not read my posts? (Probably not all, or just don't want to address some of my questions in certain posts)
I posted above that I don't do those things.
-fish-
Footballguy
No, you continue to repeat NRA lies. I posted the facts. Chicago's gun laws have gotten weaker, not stronger, since 2008. Although Illinois as a whole has relatively strong laws--among the top 10 in the country, its neighboring states have some of the weakest. The studies showing the number of guns used in crimes that flow from neighboring states have been posted here, but you ignore them.
The argument that Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws in the country is false. The argument that the gun laws themselves are the problem in Chicago is false. The argument that the laws that remain don't prevent higher rates of gun injuries and deaths is false.
The fact that you need to lie so much shows how weak your positions are.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
do you think that everyone lives in such a safe place as you ?
I've posted links and data on just how often crimes happen in the US ..... I'm curious why you think you might never be a victim or any of your family ?
seriously
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I think you just like to name call at this point and continue saying the same false information over and over.
I noticed you ignored the good guy with a gun article above ..... any reason why ?
Dickies
Footballguy
Not sure why you would prefer trained professionals protecting you over a Walmart open-carry militia
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
No, why would I think that? I just said I should be thankful I live where I do.
I can't give you a specific reason why. I know what the %s are but if you grow up in an area where you don't know anybody who's had their car, house, whatever broken into it's not something that comes to mind often.
-fish-
Footballguy
What information did I post that was false? Unlike you, I posted facts.
For every anecdotal good guy with a gun article I could post one of these:
More children dead due to gun violence.
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
Dickies
Footballguy
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
All these questions about my knowing the %s and safety, I am curious why SC thinks he or a family member might not be the victim of a firearm accident in the house or while hunting.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Stealthycat
Footballguy
crime is literally everywhere - some places are far worse than others absolutelyKarmaPolice said:
because your bubble area is immune to crime doesn't mean other places are - look at Chicago.
what do you think about the concealed weapon guy in Florida (linked above) ..... he stopped a bad shooting, he is the example of what happens when good lad abiding people have the ability to defend against wacko's
the super restrictive gun laws Chicago had were overturned by courts in 2010 right ? gun crimes/violence didn't go up when they were reversed ... they HAVE went up in 2016/17 numbers ..... the reasons pro-gun people will point to as gangs and drugs, anti-gun people will say its the guns even though the first few years after the repeal doesn't show that at all
Chicago was ultra violent when guns were not allowed - because criminals didn't obey laws
Homicides in Chicago
YEAR First six months / full year
1957 – 131 296
1958 – 149 305
1959 – 138 331
1960 – 181 372
1961 – 189 362
1962 – 186 385
1963 – 159 361
1964 – 186 391
1965 – 180 395
1966 – 195 510
1967 – 275 552
1968 – 288 647
1969 – 316 716
1970 – 417 811
1971 – 410 824
1972 – 326 711
1973 – 434 864
1974 – 431 970
1975 – 408 818
1976 – 423 814
1977 – 380 823
1978 – 360 787
1979 – 421 857
1980 – 378 863
1981 – 409 877
1982 – 335 670
1983 – 320 729
1984 – 363 748
1985 – 291 667
1986 – 344 747
1987 – 327 692
1988 – 303 664
1989 – 356 749
1990 – 407 854
1991 – 422 928
1992 – 451 943
1993 – 373 855
1994 – 477 931
1995 – 393 828
1996 – 379 796
1997 – 333 761
1998 – 334 704
1999 – 319 643
2000 – 266 633
2001 – 276 667
2002 – 279 656
2003 – 288 601
2004 – 218 453
2005 – 210 451
2006 – 201 471
2007 – 206 448
2008 – 228 513
2009 – 202 459
2010 – 216 437
2011 – 188 435
2012 – 260 506
2013 – 184 ___
(Source, Chicago Police Dept.)
From Chicago Police Dept. -
Jan 1 – July 14, 2013:
Criminal Sexual Assault – down 5% from 2012, down 5% from 2011
Robbery – down 10% from 2012, down 13% from 2011
Aggravated Battery – down 16% from 2012, down 21% from 2011
Burglary – down 21% from 2012, down 31% from 2011
Felony Theft – down 9% from 2012, down 9% from 2011
Motor Vehicle Theft – down 18% from 2012, down 34% from 2011
Overall crime – down 15% from 2012, down 23% from 2011
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I posted it - and you of course ignored it (check page 210 )-fish- said:
Dickies
Footballguy
That's not logical when he says he needs a gun to feel safe, but that car accidents are a far greater risk.
Dickies
Footballguy
What happened in the mid-nineties that suddenly caused gun violence to consistently drop?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I have guns in my home, have always had guns in my home. My kids have never touched them without permission, there has never been any incidents because I taught them both to shoot and handle guns safely.KarmaPolice said:
Could an accident happen? any of us could handle a gun incorrectly and discharge it in an unsafe way, not any different than any other accidents that can happen
I'm 49 years old, I've never been almost shot.
I've been in 4 car wrecks, one bad one. I avoided being killed one night on a car, so that's 5 instances.
I almost drowned once, seconds from it in a river.
I was in a bad way once in the Wemincuhe wilderness area (hehydration/hypoglycemia)
those things almost killed me .... a gun has been far less dangerous in my life.
I've avoided bad situations, I'm 5'8" and 165# ... I'm not a big guy that fights. Violent crime happens every day, assaults, rapes, murders ... with a lot of weapons. I will not be a victim, I will not sit on my thumbs waiting for someone else to act. That's my responsibility.
I know some people are too weak - acknowledge that, own it and allow someone else to be that, people can understand that.
Guys I share way more than most, because this is a subject that means something to me. Guns are not toys, no more so than any number of things we can list. Guns are very good self defense weapons, proven over and over. A handgun will give a woman or man a chance if a bad thing ever happens to them, and bad things happen, every few seconds of the day.
Nobody thought that Peace demonstration in Florida would go bad - it did .... thank God a guy was there to stop that wacko, right ?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
cars are horribly unsafe if you base it on the same things you base guns being unsafe on - are they not ?
far more people are killed and injured in cars ..... right ?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
1982 was the gun ban right ?
why do you think ?
understand, gang violence is the reason Chicago has killing, its the #1 reason
Stealthycat
Footballguy
who ever said anti-regulation ?
can you show me ?
no ... you can't
I've said a thousand times we have common sense gun laws, right now ... as well as common sense auto laws and drinking laws ......... we need very strict prosecution and me? I'd triple the punishment for DUI's and gun crimes right now if I could
But the laws we have right now are good, we don't need to take cars away from people because of the small % that wreck, we don't need to take alcohol from people because of th small % that DUI and we don't need to take guns from people for the small % that commit gun crimes
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I can show you where you've been anti- many different regulations. You're not honestly denying that you're against many of the proposed regulations, right?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
anti-more regulations I don't agree with sure
NEVER anti-regulation and in fact, I've said multiple times better background checks, even raising age limits on things like guns and voting because 18 year olds these days simply are not maybe capable .... I'm semi-intrigued with smart guns
but I've never said nor indicated we don't need common sense gun laws, and we got 'em right now
Henry Ford
Footballguy
KCitons
Footballguy
Feelings aren't always logical.
He's trying to protect something he enjoys with his son. About 10 years ago I was black powder hunting during a special season on a local wildlife preserve. I was hunting with one of my sons. There was another father and son hunting about 500 yards from us. The son's gun accidentally went off and killed the father. That could have been me. It didn't make me want to stop hunting with my sons. I used it as a learning experience and discussed hunters safety with them.
There may have been posters here that would have given up their guns and hunting all together. I see it as a fluke accident. I've enjoyed a lot of time hunting with my kids in the last 10 years.
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
Stealthycat
Footballguy
and you'd be wrong
an·ti
ˈan(t)ē,ˈanˌtī/
preposition
preposition: anti
1.
opposed to; against.
I am not against regulations, I'm all for military weapons not being sold to public, I'm all in for background checks (better than we have now even), I'm in favor f fully auto bans that we have
those are good solid common sense gun laws, I'm for them
Dickies
Footballguy
Stealthycat
Footballguy
explain accidentally ?
a friend of mine was killed on day with a muzzleloader - which was so rare because it was one of the Knight guns. It had double safeties.
story was, snow was on, he had taken the safety off (both) to shoot a deer and didn't shoot. He was negligent, and didn't put the safeties back on. Then, he used the gun as a walking stick, and he slipped and rammed the butt down hard onto a rock ... and that cause the firing
accident? well he certainly didn't mean to, but there were multiple mistakes he made - damn sad day, left his wife and 3 kids . Does it make me want to turn in all my guns? no
but I lost a good class mate in high school who got drunk and killed himself in a car wreck - doesn't make me want to stop driving and I almost drowned, I still swim and boat
Stealthycat
Footballguy
how come ya'll aren't commenting on the Florida concealed carry guy stopping the shooting ?
KCitons
Footballguy
I wasn't at the scene of the shooting. The only info I found was that the father was walking in front of the son when the gun went off. I don't know what type of muzzleloader was being used. Could have been an older model without multiple safeties.
KCitons
Footballguy
Unless the son meant to kill his father, It was an accident. Thus the gun accidentally went off.
The General
Footballguy
-fish-
Footballguy
I responded by posting about a woman who killed a child with a gun yesterday He ignored it.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
What's there to comment on?
Why haven't you responded to a few of my posts commenting on your links or to my questions about the party you support not addressing the problems you state are the reasons behind the violence?
Dickies
Footballguy
I thought that data on people killing themselves and/or family members accidentally with guns is being "tweaked"?
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
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