Vick dog adopter interviews with NBC in Atlanta (1 Viewer)

[two_dollars]

And the penalties for crimes against animals shouldn't be barbaric either.

I like how you toss out the word "barbaric" for the two year prison sentence Vick received, but you're uncomfortable using that word for the actions Vick performed to receive that sentence.I'm sympathetic to your views on the disparity of how we treat different animals in this culture. We shoot deer for entertainment, and then we criticize Vick for killing dogs for entertainment. Despite that, Michael needs to own up to accountability and, for the most part, he has.

I won't argue a legal vs. illegal position with regard to killing dogs instead of, say, deer. Those laws are generally drafted by affluent white males who may be for deer hunting and against dog fighting. But there still remains a difference between deer hunting and what Vick did. Even if done for sport and not consumption, deer hunting is limited by laws of where it can be done, how it can be done, and when it can be done. Vick, on the other hand, cultivated his dog ring year round and in a particularly brutal manner. It's easy to equate Vick's actions to hunting, but when you delve further into the "how" and "when" you see that Vick's action's are much more grievous. Barbaric even.

I'm willling to give Vick a second chance, but certainly not because some guy on a video tells me that, "Vick's dogs are getting a second chance, so Michael Vick should, too." That guy is missing the point that Vick's dogs did nothing wrong and Michael Vick did.

To be honest man. I honestly believe the excuse that deer hunting and killing dogs is different is just a RACIAL EXCUSE. Think about how stupid it sounds. Its hypocritical. Ok Vick tortured dogs , Hunters shoot deers and stab boars while they squeal to death. BUT YEA SURE THATS DIFFERENT RIGHT? Do you know how stupid that excuse sounds? ITS THE SAME THING NO MATTER HOW YOU LOOK AT IT OR HOW THE ANIMALS WERE KILLED. First of all they are animals so lets keep that in mind. When Jeffrey Dhamer was killing and eating people do you think people were saying " Well what he did, is different than what Charles Manson done, Charles should be a free man"

Vick killed dogs allegedly, funny thing is everyone keeps saying he electrocuted dogs, but if you go back and look at his 60 minute interview he clearly said he wasnt the one that electrocuted the dogs. The Racist just put words in his mouth.

Pretty easy to tell who the racist is here.. Those who keep bringing it up usually use it because it's in the front of their mind. All they see is race. That's what's racist today.

 

[two_dollars]

doesn't killing pit bulls actually save human lives?

No. You are a sad and confused ignorant soul.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

Al Capone went to jail for not paying his taxes, but was that the reason they really went after him?Can you really not read between the lines or do you really think what he did to all of those dogs didn't have anything to do with why he went behind bars?

 

[Chaka]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

Al Capone went to jail for not paying his taxes, but was that the reason they really went after him?Can you really not read between the lines or do you really think what he did to all of those dogs didn't have anything to do with why he went behind bars?

I think what he is saying is that the punishment he received was for the crime for which he was committed (interstate commerce violation) not dog fighting which carries less severe penalties.So to say he got a raw deal because of the punishment he received for dog fighting is incorrect. The punishment was dictated by the actual conviction.

 

[two_dollars]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

Al Capone went to jail for not paying his taxes, but was that the reason they really went after him?Can you really not read between the lines or do you really think what he did to all of those dogs didn't have anything to do with why he went behind bars?

Are you serious? You think the federal government gave a crap about what he did to the dogs?Or do you think maybe the federal government (remember, he went to FEDERAL prison here) cared more about running an illegal gambling ring that crossed state lines?

The public out roar was over the dogs, but the feds cared about the gambling ring and lying to federal prosecutors. THAT'S why he went to jail.

 

[Snotbubbles]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

He pled guilty to "Conspiracy to Travel in Interstate Commerce in Aid of Unlawful Activities and to Sponsor a Dog in an Animal Fighting Venture". What he did to the dogs was an aggravating factor and a huge motivational factor for his plea agreement. In fact, it played a major role in his decision making and was a reason why he spent so much time in jail.Mike Vick Plea Agreement

 

[Jewell]

What about understanding the difference between intent and ignorance?

I think that description fits Vick spot on. Vick seemed legitimately ignorant to the notion that you shouldn't torture and murder a companion animal.

Then why did he hide it? If he honestly didn't believe there was anything wrong with his actions, wouldn't he have been more open about them? He must have known at some level, either morally or legally, that he was committing a wrong or why keep it on the down low.

Seriously? Because it's illegal and he knew that.

So you admit Vick knew it was illegal and he did it intentionally? Then why are you arguing about Vick's intent? I was talking legal intent vs. legal negligence. That's why I went into that other crap about mitigating factors, investigators, etc.But if Vick knew it was illegal, then he must have known that it was illegal because some people object to it. Why else would it be illegal? And if Vick knew other people objected, he must have considered his view compared to those objections. Vick may have concluded that he didn't have a problem with dog fighting, but I don't know how you can conclude that he was "legitimately ignorant".

So you admit Vick Drunk Driver knew it was illegal and he did it intentionally? Then why are you arguing about Vick Drunk Driver's intent? I was talking about your forgiveness of drunk driving in terms of legal intent vs. legal negligence while ignoring that one can know something is illegal and be ignorant as to why.But if Vick Drunk Driver knew it was illegal, then he must have known that it was illegal because some people object to it. Why else would it be illegal? And if Vick Drunk Driver knew other people objected, he must have considered his view compared to those objections. Vick Drunk Driver may have concluded that he didn't have a problem with dog fighting drunk driving, but I don't know how you can conclude that he was lacking intent.

Because when people compare Vick to Stallworth, they're not comparing Vick to Stallworth the drunk driver. They're comparing Vick to Stallworth the murderer. Stallworth intended to drive drunk. Stallworth didn't intend to kill anybody. That's why he was charged with negligent homicide, and that's not even getting into the mitigating factors that weigh in Stallworth's favor.Vick, on the other hand, intended his abusive actions and, in some cases, he intended for those abusive actions to result in death. Stallworth intended to drink-and-drive. Stallworth didn't intend the unfortunate death that resulted.

 

[two_dollars]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

He pled guilty to "Conspiracy to Travel in Interstate Commerce in Aid of Unlawful Activities and to Sponsor a Dog in an Animal Fighting Venture". What he did to the dogs was an aggravating factor and a huge motivational factor for his plea agreement. In fact, it played a major role in his decision making and was a reason why he spent so much time in jail.Mike Vick Plea Agreement

Yes, of course it was "aggravated." Just like there is a difference between battery and aggravated battery. This took it up to a level 15 and because of the plea was dropped to a level 13. AND the sentencing was recommended on the low end. Do you even know what it would have been without the "aggravated" part? Take that out completely and send him to trial. Let's say he gets found guilty. He likely ends up spending as much or more time behind bars.My point is, they didn't put him in jail for what he did to the dogs. That much is evident.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

1) The intent is absolutely, 100 percent better with drunk drivers, even if the act is irresponsible, as you said. Again, this is about "intent." That word means something. If you told a drunk driver that they would hit someone if they got in the car...none of them would get in the car. But if you told Vick that his actions would result in killing dogs, his response would have been "Of course it would. I'm trying to kill these dogs. That's why I'm doing this." Totally different mindset.

Stop with this. Everyone knows the potential consequences of drinking and driving and when they do it they deserve no forgiveness because it wasn't their intent to hurt someone. Getting behind the wheel while drunk is giving specific consent to the fact that the driver believes his convenience is more important than life of someone else.The punishment should be far stricter. Alcohol lobby probably has something to do with the light sentences.

Please re-read my post and find where I suggested "forgiveness." Let me know when you give up.When you drive drunk, you know you could hurt someone but you're not saying "I'm getting in this car to hurt someone." When Vick killed the dogs he was saying "I'm electrocuting this dog, I'm bashing this dog on the ground because I'm trying to kill it."

That's the difference in intent. It doesn't "forgive" one, it doesn't mean one deserves no punishment. It means that one person was negligent and irresponsible to the point of committing a crime that should be punished severely and the other intentionally killed dogs in a cruel way on purpose. Not only did he know it *could* happen...he was trying to make it happen. You can't say the same for a drunk driver. The mindset and intent is what makes them different. It does not mean one isn't important or I'm trying to excuse it.

 

[switz]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

Then I compare what he did with Donte Stallworth and Leonard Little, and I have a hard time hating him. Just my though

What did Stallworth do?Also, someone putting themselves in a stupid situation, and accidentally killing someone is still different than intentionally killing a living animal. It's all about intent, all of us could accidentally kill someone just by driving. It doesn't mean we want people to die, or think their lives have no value. It's called accidental or involuntary for a reason.

What Vick did was neither accidental nor involuntary, and just because they weren't human doesn't diminish anything.

 

[switz]

doesn't killing pit bulls actually save human lives?

No. You are a sad and confused ignorant soul.

in this regard.Dogs are all about pleasing their master. Any, and I mean ANY breed of dog can be aggressive or timid. It all depends on what they think their master wants them to do. Want to save people from the big bad pit bulls? Execute all the people who train them to fight - including Mr. Vick. Oh you think that's cruel?

 

[PolishNorbi]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

Then I compare what he did with Donte Stallworth and Leonard Little, and I have a hard time hating him. Just my though

What did Stallworth do?Also, someone putting themselves in a stupid situation, and accidentally killing someone is still different than intentionally killing a living animal. It's all about intent, all of us could accidentally kill someone just by driving. It doesn't mean we want people to die, or think their lives have no value. It's called accidental or involuntary for a reason.

What Vick did was neither accidental nor involuntary, and just because they weren't human doesn't diminish anything.

Wow. So someone intentionally kills a dog should serve the same amount of time someone who kills a human? I guess we should execute Vick, since he killed more dogs than John Allen Muhammad (DC Serial Sniper)

 

[two_dollars]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

Then I compare what he did with Donte Stallworth and Leonard Little, and I have a hard time hating him. Just my though

What did Stallworth do?Also, someone putting themselves in a stupid situation, and accidentally killing someone is still different than intentionally killing a living animal. It's all about intent, all of us could accidentally kill someone just by driving. It doesn't mean we want people to die, or think their lives have no value. It's called accidental or involuntary for a reason.

What Vick did was neither accidental nor involuntary, and just because they weren't human doesn't diminish anything.

Wow. So someone intentionally kills a dog should serve the same amount of time someone who kills a human? I guess we should execute Vick, since he killed more dogs than John Allen Muhammad (DC Serial Sniper)

You're hopeless.

 

[PolishNorbi]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

Then I compare what he did with Donte Stallworth and Leonard Little, and I have a hard time hating him. Just my though

What did Stallworth do?Also, someone putting themselves in a stupid situation, and accidentally killing someone is still different than intentionally killing a living animal. It's all about intent, all of us could accidentally kill someone just by driving. It doesn't mean we want people to die, or think their lives have no value. It's called accidental or involuntary for a reason.

What Vick did was neither accidental nor involuntary, and just because they weren't human doesn't diminish anything.

Wow. So someone intentionally kills a dog should serve the same amount of time someone who kills a human? I guess we should execute Vick, since he killed more dogs than John Allen Muhammad (DC Serial Sniper)

You're hopeless.

How so? Only my second post, first one was about severity of the punishment without a stance which way I stand. And in response to a post that says Vick intentionally killed dogs, and since it wasn't a human it shouldn't make anything less. So I simply asked should he have been executed?We are not talking about what vick got sentenced for in this case. I understand what you have been preaching along that what vick got jail time for was not for killing dogs.

 

[redskins08]

I never got emotionally invested in the Vick story either supporting or hating on him. But I can not ignore the amazingness of the story of Vick. He doesn't just come back and get a starting position again. He comes back and dominates. He comes back WAY better than he was before. WHAT A STORY. love it. Very inspiring.

Now, I absolutely despise the fact that he plays for the Eagles. If he played any other team (except the Cowboys and Giants too) then I would love the story even more.

 

[cobalt_27]

Can we move this to the FFA, already?

 

[Otis]

FAA please.as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

I just can't.

 

[two_dollars]

How so? Only my second post, first one was about severity of the punishment without a stance which way I stand. And in response to a post that says Vick intentionally killed dogs, and since it wasn't a human it shouldn't make anything less. So I simply asked should he have been executed?We are not talking about what vick got sentenced for in this case. I understand what you have been preaching along that what vick got jail time for was not for killing dogs.

If someone unintentionally hits a dog and kills it, it's not even reportable. If someone unintentionally hits and kills and human, you spend some time in jail in most cases. I reread what you said and I apologize for my response.I don't think anyone is arguing that there shouldn't be a difference between intent and no intent, as well as between canine and human. Vick intentionally killed dogs. If that's all he did, he wouldn't have spent much time in jail. The DC sniper is being executed because he intentionally killed humans.

 

[Chaka]

When you drive drunk, you know you could hurt someone but you're not saying "I'm getting in this car to hurt someone."

No but you are saying that you are more than willing to kill someone to spare yourself some minor inconvenience.We are way to soft of DUIs in this country. It's a "boys will be boys" attitude towards it. That's the kind of forgiveness I am talking about. The kind that allows us to turn a blind eye, not necessarily to absolve. And it's because most of us have been there and made the same poor decision(and in no small part because there is a lot of big money out there fighting to keep these laws soft so they can peddle their product). We can relate so we go easier on them.I don't care if the drunk driver intended to kill anyone. When he got into that car while drunk he said that he didn't care if he killed anyone.

 

[brett5673]

FAA please.as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

I am a dog lover, better yet a pit lover and treat mine like my kid...I think Vick has paid his debt. U cant have it both ways, if you belive in the system then Vick paid his debt. and if you dont belive in the system, then that just makes you a hipocrate to judge.

I think the point he was trying to make is that what they did was very bad and got away with it. Obviously what Vick did is very bad, but in the realm of football, him (and Plaxico Burress even more) have paid their dues. We rarely talk about Little or Stallworth getting second chances, because they never really had a "second chance" they just got away with it. I think its obvious Vick has changed as a person and if he has done as much to right his wrongs, from a fairly objective standpoint, how can you not root for him?

 

[Chaka]

FAA please.

as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

I am a dog lover, better yet a pit lover and treat mine like my kid...I think Vick has paid his debt. U cant have it both ways, if you belive in the system then Vick paid his debt. and if you dont belive in the system, then that just makes you a hipocrate to judge.

I think the point he was trying to make is that what they did was very bad and got away with it. Obviously what Vick did is very bad, but in the realm of football, him (and Plaxico Burress even more) have paid their dues. We rarely talk about Little or Stallworth getting second chances, because they never really had a "second chance" they just got away with it. I think its obvious Vick has changed as a person and if he has done as much to right his wrongs, from a fairly objective standpoint, how can you not root for him?

This not obvious. Remember there was a shooting at his birthday party earlier this year and one of his co-defendants who he is not allowed to see as a condition of his parole was in attendance.What's obvious is his dedication to football. We know very little about him as a person. All I am hoping for is that he no longer commits crimes. So long as he does that I don't care why it's happening.

 

[phillyphan07]

I was listening to sports talk the other night in philly and there was a 20 minute segment of calls/discussion about how to deal with young kids (lets say 8 years old) seeing vick play and asking for his jersey for christmas...

basically the consensus was to trick the kid into liking someone else because no one wanted to explain dog fighting to an 8-year old..

 

[fatness]

Can we move this to the FFA, already?

No, it's very important to have an unending stream of "NEVER FORGIVE VICK!" topics in the Shark Pool so people can show what hardasses they are.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

Al Capone went to jail for not paying his taxes, but was that the reason they really went after him?Can you really not read between the lines or do you really think what he did to all of those dogs didn't have anything to do with why he went behind bars?

Are you serious? You think the federal government gave a crap about what he did to the dogs?Or do you think maybe the federal government (remember, he went to FEDERAL prison here) cared more about running an illegal gambling ring that crossed state lines?

The public out roar was over the dogs, but the feds cared about the gambling ring and lying to federal prosecutors. THAT'S why he went to jail.

I understand all that, but do you think if he was gambling on checkers the public would have put as much pressure on the conviction compared film crews going in and showing the almost dead dogs that were mangled and the confines in which where they lived and how it all went down. You had animal rights activists all over the place going nuts, and this act was deemed deviant by just about all of America. It was more than just gambling across state lines, those are just terms that the feds all put together to be able to put him in jail as long as they could because of what he did and satisfy the public within reason. I do think because of what he was gambling on, how he treated those dogs had someting to do with how long he went to jail. There was very little if any sympathy for Mike Vick. That's just my .02 on it, you obviously have a different opinion.Anyway, I didn't like Mike Vick before all this, so I certainly don't like him now. I believe everyone deserves a 2nd chance, he seems to be making the most of his I hope he keeps it up. I've made plenty of mistakes in my life so it would be hipocritical to cast stones.

I'm a Giant fan for this game though.

 

[Otis]

I was listening to sports talk the other night in philly and there was a 20 minute segment of calls/discussion about how to deal with young kids (lets say 8 years old) seeing vick play and asking for his jersey for christmas...basically the consensus was to trick the kid into liking someone else because no one wanted to explain dog fighting to an 8-year old..

 

[Topes]

I don't know, real tough to suggest that "We are giving the dogs a second chance, so why not give Vick a second chance" is a good point. I really don't think the dogs did anything wrong throughout the whole thing.

<_<

as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

Vegan?

 

[Topes]

FAA please.

as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

<_< Dude, the whole eye for an eye thing doesn't even fly for crimes on humans.

what does this have to do with fantasy football?once were in the FAA I will answer your question about old testament law related to vick and dogs.

Everybody always wants to get the Feds involved.The feds already got him for the dogs thing. The Feds already let him go for the

.So, what's the FAA got to do with Vick now? Danged jackbooted thugs is all!

 

[Sabertooth]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

Then I compare what he did with Donte Stallworth and Leonard Little, and I have a hard time hating him. Just my though

Ray Lewis as well. I agree. It was dogs. Not people that he killed.

 

[cobalt_27]

Make.

This.

Stupid.

Thread.

Die.

Already.

 

[Stealthycat]

had Vick beaten his pregnant girlfriend or committed vehicular manslaughter, most people would have brushed it aside with little afterthought

that says a lot about most doesn't it?

 

[Ranethe]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

Then I compare what he did with Donte Stallworth and Leonard Little, and I have a hard time hating him. Just my though

Ray Lewis as well. I agree. It was dogs. Not people that he killed.

Yeah we know, covered ad nauseum already... DOGS ARE NOT PEOPLE!!!

Of course, that doesn't have much to do with the price of bananas.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Make.This.Stupid.Thread.Die.Already.

if this thread dies 2 more shall rise in it's place.

 

[cobalt_27]

Make.This.Stupid.Thread.Die.Already.

if this thread dies 2 more shall rise in it's place.

I mean, for the tantrums Joe has had about what's appropriate/inappropriate for the Shark Pool, it is absolutely insane this has stuck around. It's not like the mods all took a vacation, either, and just missed this. They know it's here and discussing nothing related to football. Yet, they insist on keeping it alive and well here.

 

[PoolShark]

I despise Vick for what he did and I still question whether he truly understands what he did was wrong.

It is tough for me to watch him succeed let alone at such a high level. However at a bare minimum he understands that society believes what he did was wrong and acts accordingly. Vick received more punishment for his crime and lost more than any person ever convicted of a similar offense.

I don't want to forgive him, on some levels I never will, but I still believe he deserves his second chance and I appreciate the fact that he does not appear to be squandering it...yet.

I didn't even watch the video or get more than 5 or 6 posts into this thread, but here's my 2 cents. (and yea I'm an Eagles fan, and love what Vick is doing on the field, but this was my opinion long ago when he was first charged & convicted). For what it's worth, I'm also an animal lover. More cats than dogs, but I like just about any animal.To me, this entire issue is a matter of culture. Vick & his counterparts grew up in a culture where dog fighting is acceptable. Similar to ####-(chicken)fighting and I'm sure the fighting of other animals elsewhere. Things go on all over this country and the world that many people consider despicable. They eat dogs & cats in other countries. We raise cows & chicken, etc for the sole purpose of killing them for food. We throw live lobsters in boiling water. I'm sure there are even corners of the earth where humans fight to the death for sport or are sacrificed as part of some ritual that one group of people consider normal, while the majority of the world's population is "apalled." People (not animals) are tortured with the support of our government (and others I'm sure) if someone thinks there's a good enough reason for it.

I'm not saying I think what he did was fine with me, but next time you sit down to eat a steak or fried chicken think about the fact that at least Vick's dogs had a fighting chance. By the way, I'm not a vegan or anything either...it's virtually a 100% certainty I'll be eating some form of meat today. But I could go without ever eating a burger or chicken sandwich again in my life and I wouldn't die because of it, so it's obviously not a necessity. So apparently the issue is that what Vick did was for "sport & entertainment," because it's obviously ok to kill everything on the planet that breathes if you're going to eat it, including dogs. A bunch of you Vick bashers probably think abortion is ok too. I'm not saying I do or don't, but that's a human life (and it's not being ended for someone's dinner).

It just seems like everyone is taking this entire incident and blowing it out of proportion. There has to be a double standard in here somewhere. As the poster I quoted said, Vick did his time and undoubtedly paid a higher price for the same crime than anyone else. EVER. Give the guy a break.

 

[cobalt_27]

I'm making this spaghetti squash recipe this morning. What's yours?

* 1 medium spaghetti squash (about 3 pounds)

* 1/2 cup of parmesan cheese - grated

* 3 tablespoons of butter (or olive oil)

* 1/4 teaspoon of salt

* 1/8 teaspoon of black pepper

Half the squash lengthwise and remove and discard the seeds.

Place the squash, cut side down in a microwave safe baking dish.

Cook the squash on high for approximately 7-10 minutes, depending on the size of your squash and how powerful your microwave is. If you do not have an automatic turntable in your microwave, give the dish a turn every 3 minutes to ensure even cooking.

Using a dinner fork, rake the squash into spaghetti-like strands from the shell.

Toss the squash with parmesan cheese, butter or olive oil, salt and pepper.

Garnish with freshly chopped basil, oregano, or parsley.

 

[Chaka]

Someone get Cobalt a Xanax, stat!

 

[PoolShark]

Someone get Cobalt a Xanax, stat!

I don't know... sounds kind of tasty to me. I'd add a little meat myself... Maybe beagle?

 

[cobalt_27]

Someone get Cobalt a Xanax, stat!

Lorazepam + bourbon Seriously, though, what is this thread doing alive?

 

[cobalt_27]

Someone get Cobalt a Xanax, stat!

I don't know... sounds kind of tasty to me. I'd add a little meat myself... Maybe beagle?

Maybe a golden retriever shank with a basil rub?

 

[jackdubl]

FAA please.as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

Dude, the whole eye for an eye thing doesn't even fly for crimes on humans.

Well, in a way he does, doesn't he? Football is, after all, a violent sport where we all watch to see big plays and big hits. These players pay a major toll that affects them now and affects them greatly later. Not exactly a bloodsport like dog fighting, but it's a difference of degrees.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

Make.This.Stupid.Thread.Die.Already.

if this thread dies 2 more shall rise in it's place.

I mean, for the tantrums Joe has had about what's appropriate/inappropriate for the Shark Pool, it is absolutely insane this has stuck around. It's not like the mods all took a vacation, either, and just missed this. They know it's here and discussing nothing related to football. Yet, they insist on keeping it alive and well here.

If ESPN can talk about it all the time and sports radio can devote hours to it, I don't see a problem with one thread in the SP. The FFA isn't "front page" territory and I think we can all agree that this issue is dominating "front page" space in pretty much every sports outlet. If it was a bunch of threads, I'd agree. But this isn't an obscure topic we're dragging up. It's basically THE big story in the NFL. Most folks who watch the league have some opinion on it. It makes sense to have a thread here, considering the week Vick had and the discussion dominating every media outlet. At least it's limited to one thread here, unlike TV, radio and newspapers.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

FAA please.

as a dog owner I hope Vick can experience the pain that he organized the innocent dogs to have, then he has paid his debt.

Dude, the whole eye for an eye thing doesn't even fly for crimes on humans.

Well, in a way he does, doesn't he? Football is, after all, a violent sport where we all watch to see big plays and big hits. These players pay a major toll that affects them now and affects them greatly later. Not exactly a bloodsport like dog fighting, but it's a difference of degrees.

Like one is doing it voluntarily and the other one is forced? One is paid millions and lives in luxury and the other is starved? One gets guaranteed compensation and can walk away whenever they want and the other is killed? Yeah, a difference of degrees. Maybe 180 of them.

 

[Otis]

I would kick all of your dogs and not feel all that bad about it. HTH

 

[cobalt_27]

Make.This.Stupid.Thread.Die.Already.

if this thread dies 2 more shall rise in it's place.

I mean, for the tantrums Joe has had about what's appropriate/inappropriate for the Shark Pool, it is absolutely insane this has stuck around. It's not like the mods all took a vacation, either, and just missed this. They know it's here and discussing nothing related to football. Yet, they insist on keeping it alive and well here.

If ESPN can talk about it all the time and sports radio can devote hours to it, I don't see a problem with one thread in the SP. The FFA isn't "front page" territory and I think we can all agree that this issue is dominating "front page" space in pretty much every sports outlet. If it was a bunch of threads, I'd agree. But this isn't an obscure topic we're dragging up. It's basically THE big story in the NFL. Most folks who watch the league have some opinion on it. It makes sense to have a thread here, considering the week Vick had and the discussion dominating every media outlet. At least it's limited to one thread here, unlike TV, radio and newspapers.

I don't think the dog adopter interview on NBC has been front page material.Let's face it, Joe and the mods have gotten really sloppy here. Or inconsistent. Or both.

 

[Ranethe]

Make.This.Stupid.Thread.Die.Already.

if this thread dies 2 more shall rise in it's place.

I mean, for the tantrums Joe has had about what's appropriate/inappropriate for the Shark Pool, it is absolutely insane this has stuck around. It's not like the mods all took a vacation, either, and just missed this. They know it's here and discussing nothing related to football. Yet, they insist on keeping it alive and well here.

If ESPN can talk about it all the time and sports radio can devote hours to it, I don't see a problem with one thread in the SP. The FFA isn't "front page" territory and I think we can all agree that this issue is dominating "front page" space in pretty much every sports outlet. If it was a bunch of threads, I'd agree. But this isn't an obscure topic we're dragging up. It's basically THE big story in the NFL. Most folks who watch the league have some opinion on it. It makes sense to have a thread here, considering the week Vick had and the discussion dominating every media outlet. At least it's limited to one thread here, unlike TV, radio and newspapers.

I don't think the dog adopter interview on NBC has been front page material.Let's face it, Joe and the mods have gotten really sloppy here. Or inconsistent. Or both.

Or maybe you should quit bumping the thread.Oh..btw...bump

 

[cobalt_27]

Or maybe you should quit bumping the thread.Oh..btw...bump

Clearly it doesn't matter. People are bumping this thread like it's hot off the FFA presses, which is where it belongs.

 

[Snotbubbles]

Vick harmed dogs and went to jail..Hunters KILL animals: deer, coyotes, ect and it's called a sport. Last I checked dogs are animals, but because they are "pets", most look at it differently.

What Vick did was cruel. It's not even that he was killing dogs, and then eating them like most hunters do. It's that he was doing things that were inhumane and cruel and most importantly against the law.He has paid his price but that doesn't mean I have to like him. In fact, I didn't like Mike Vick BEFORE he went to jail for what he did.

He paid his price, he deserves a 2nd chance. But for those who keep saying this that doesn't mean people have to like him. When Mike Vick came back into the NFL after what he did, didn't you know that at the very least this would happen or did you think 100 percent of the people would just love him for paying his debt.

As far as I'm concerned, things have gone better than expected for Mike Vick in all aspects. The guy is going to have more money than you and I have ever made, so don't lose any sleep over how mistreated MIke Vick is.

I don't want to see Mike Vick petting dogs or rescuing any and taking them for a walk. Just like a pedafile shouldn't be allowed to live near an elemenary school, Mike Vick should never ever be allowed to own a dog.

I believe he's paid his debt but don't believe he loves dogs or will ever treat them the way they should be treated.

AGAIN, why do people keep thinking he went to jail for what he did to the dogs??? There is so much ignorance about this subject it's painful to read!

He pled guilty to "Conspiracy to Travel in Interstate Commerce in Aid of Unlawful Activities and to Sponsor a Dog in an Animal Fighting Venture". What he did to the dogs was an aggravating factor and a huge motivational factor for his plea agreement. In fact, it played a major role in his decision making and was a reason why he spent so much time in jail.Mike Vick Plea Agreement

Yes, of course it was "aggravated." Just like there is a difference between battery and aggravated battery. This took it up to a level 15 and because of the plea was dropped to a level 13. AND the sentencing was recommended on the low end. Do you even know what it would have been without the "aggravated" part? Take that out completely and send him to trial. Let's say he gets found guilty. He likely ends up spending as much or more time behind bars.My point is, they didn't put him in jail for what he did to the dogs. That much is evident.

Federal Guidelines:§2E3.1. Gambling Offenses; Animal Fighting Offenses

(a) Base Offense Level:(Apply the greatest)

(1) 12, if the offense was (A) engaging in a gambling business; (B) transmission of wagering information; or © committed as part of, or to facilitate, a commercial gambling operation; or

(2) 10, if the offense involved an animal fighting venture; or

(3) 6, otherwise.

The "aggravating" part would have taken it to a 15. He pled to a 13, so he got more time then he would have if he hadn't killed the dogs. So a part of his time was for the aggravated part.