*** Vince Young Thread *** (1 Viewer)

[Carnifex]

I'm pretty sure that some scouts will come down on Vince Young. At least one of the on-line scouting scouting reports will report something like:

"The team drafting Young will need to re-work his passing mechanics to bring his release point and delivery to an NFL level"

This might scare off some of the teams that are in a position to draft him.

It is amazing how many NFL GMs place scouting reports and combine numbers ahead of actual on-field results at times. This may hurt Young.

He will be drafted high in my opinion, but don't be surprised if he slides one or two spots due to this.

 

[BeTheMatch]

I simply asked why we're assuming he'll be a QB.

Because for as high as he'll be drafted, a coaching staff would be crucified for switching his position.

A good coaching staff wouldn't care if they'd be crucified. All the talk about Houston taking Young because he's from Texas and that fans will want Young because of what they saw is stupid. If a coaching staff made decisions based on anything other than winning, they are a bad coaching staff. I don't think there is a single NFL GM that woke up this morning with Young as their clear #1 player who didn't have him as their #1, or 1b, player when he sat down to watch the game last night.

I don't think Young would give any team a better chance of winning if he were a WR as opposed to a QB.It wasn't the physical game that impressed me last night as much as it was his mental game. He looked so incredibly poised last night. As if he knew what the rest of us were going to find out.

That's exactly right. That's what separates. Anyone who can't see that is just not looking.

 

[BeTheMatch]

Ok Vince Young could either be a huge player in the pros, or fail miserably. If some teams tries to force him into being a WCO QB like Michael Vick, he's going to fail. If a team runs a "run and gun" offense or an offense based less on timing and more on playmaking, Vince Young will THRIVE. He needs to be able to make the decision on whether to run or throw, instead of being forced to throw on a 5 step drop, for example.

he'll need a offensive line that is lights out the *best* in the business. he had the luxury of time that most NFL qb's don't. he'd get mauled behind, say, the Texans line.

How do you know that if he always had the time?

 

[BeTheMatch]

4-6 here.  He could go 3rd, but we;ll see.

If he drops to sixth, unlikely to happen, 9ers draft him and then trade Alex Smith to the lions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Make sure you save your game after making that transaction.

 

[BigJim®]

I'm pretty sure that some scouts will come down on Vince Young. At least one of the on-line scouting scouting reports will report something like:

"The team drafting Young will need to re-work his passing mechanics to bring his release point and delivery to an NFL level"

This might scare off some of the teams that are in a position to draft him.

Maybe, but I doubt it. Along the lines of what Joe said previously in this thread or elsewhere, I think there is a difference reading this type of report related to a guy who was merely productive against marginal competition vs. a guy who engineered winning drives in a national championship game for the world to see. I think the intangibles he showed in a boiler pot last night will make mechanic nits fall by the wayside. If I was an NFL personnel guy, I'd look at the mechanic nit and say "You mean he can get better than he was in that game? Wow."

 

[Da Guru]

Is Young smart enough for the NFL. From what I have read Texas runs a very scaled back offense for him, using a basic set of plays because Young is going to run half of the time anyway. Will he be able to pick up a big NFL playbook and have command of it?

 

[CravenM]

If I was an NFL personnel guy, I'd look at the mechanic nit and say "You mean he can get better than he was in that game? Wow."

And he could get worse. Changing a throwing motion is about as difficult as changing a golf swing, I'd guess. It takes a long time, there's some seriously ugly growing pains and sometimes it's a fruitless exercise.

 

[Red Apples]

USC has no defense.some nfl team is going to get a huge bust.

 

[mbuehner]

THere are 7 players in my lifetime that when they played in college, they were clearly the best player on the field most every snap.

1. Hershel Walker

2. Barry Sanders

3. Bo Jackson

4. Peyton Manning

5. Vince Young

6. Ricky Williams

7. Reggie Bush*

Only 7 including 4 surefire HOFers and 2 were playing last night? No offense Col, but the thing about college football is every year there are a handful of guys that everyone is sure are special. As in really special, first ballot HOF prospects. Then they play a year in the NFL and are just rookies for a year (or forever). Last year Cadillac, Ronny Brown, and Cedric Benson were said to be equal prospects coming out to Kevin Jones and Steven Jackson, and those two came out supposedly as the best rated RBs ever. This year Reggie Bush is that cant miss guy, and after yesterday apparently Young is as a QB. Thats all fine and it adds excitement but looking at things objectively none of these guys looked any more impressive than a David Carr or Carson Palmer or Willis McGahee (pre-injury), etc. Great players, men amongst boys in college. But human in the NFL. Good, perhaps excellent developing players, but not showing signs of going down as guys who define the position for the next 20 years. Anyway, thats my opinion. It was a good game last night and there are some definite prospects there, but nothing you dont see every year.

 

[BigJim®]

If I was an NFL personnel guy, I'd look at the mechanic nit and say "You mean he can get better than he was in that game? Wow."

And he could get worse. Changing a throwing motion is about as difficult as changing a golf swing, I'd guess. It takes a long time, there's some seriously ugly growing pains and sometimes it's a fruitless exercise.

I don't doubt there could be an adjustment period, but I do highly doubt changing a throwing motion is as volatile as changing a golf swing since even the slightest shift in a golf swing can make all hell break loose in how you hit a golf ball. I'd use baseball pitching delivery as a better analogy and pitchers are often able to adjust arm mechanics without too much trouble. However, I think there had better be a good reason to change Young's mechanics when he is seemingly productive how he throws. I don't see people trying to change Chi Chi Rodriguez's golf swing.

 

[Colin Dowling]

Is Young smart enough for the NFL. From what I have read Texas runs a very scaled back offense for him, using a basic set of plays because Young is going to run half of the time anyway. Will he be able to pick up a big NFL playbook and have command of it?

Link? It's not a pro-set offense, but I'm not sure what makes you think it's "scaled back."

THere are 7 players in my lifetime that when they played in college, they were clearly the best player on the field most every snap.

1. Hershel Walker

2. Barry Sanders

3. Bo Jackson

4. Peyton Manning

5. Vince Young

6. Ricky Williams

7. Reggie Bush*

Only 7 including 4 surefire HOFers and 2 were playing last night? No offense Col, but the thing about college football is every year there are a handful of guys that everyone is sure are special. As in really special, first ballot HOF prospects. Then they play a year in the NFL and are just rookies for a year (or forever). Last year Cadillac, Ronny Brown, and Cedric Benson were said to be equal prospects coming out to Kevin Jones and Steven Jackson, and those two came out supposedly as the best rated RBs ever. This year Reggie Bush is that cant miss guy, and after yesterday apparently Young is as a QB. Thats all fine and it adds excitement but looking at things objectively none of these guys looked any more impressive than a David Carr or Carson Palmer or Willis McGahee (pre-injury), etc. Great players, men amongst boys in college. But human in the NFL. Good, perhaps excellent developing players, but not showing signs of going down as guys who define the position for the next 20 years. Anyway, thats my opinion. It was a good game last night and there are some definite prospects there, but nothing you dont see every year.

I disagree almost completely with your post. I don't know anyone who though SJax/Jones were "equal" prospects to Williams, Brown, or Benson. As for your last sentence, I'd be interested to know what "you see every year" that is on par with what happened last night as well as during the season. Best I can tell, even without Young, last night's game was one for the ages, not seen in a long time.

 

[WhoDat]

QUOTE(Da Guru @ Jan 5 2006, 10:44 PM)Is Young smart enough for the NFL. From what I have read Texas runs a very scaled back offense for him, using a basic set of plays because Young is going to run half of the time anyway. Will he be able to pick up a big NFL playbook and have command of it? Link? It's not a pro-set offense, but I'm not sure what makes you think it's "scaled back."QUOTE(mbuehner @ Jan 5 2006, 10:58 PM)QUOTETHere are 7 players in my lifetime that when they played in college, they were clearly the best player on the field most every snap.1. Hershel Walker2. Barry Sanders3. Bo Jackson4. Peyton Manning5. Vince Young6. Ricky Williams7. Reggie Bush*Only 7 including 4 surefire HOFers and 2 were playing last night? No offense Col, but the thing about college football is every year there are a handful of guys that everyone is sure are special. As in really special, first ballot HOF prospects. Then they play a year in the NFL and are just rookies for a year (or forever). Last year Cadillac, Ronny Brown, and Cedric Benson were said to be equal prospects coming out to Kevin Jones and Steven Jackson, and those two came out supposedly as the best rated RBs ever. This year Reggie Bush is that cant miss guy, and after yesterday apparently Young is as a QB. Thats all fine and it adds excitement but looking at things objectively none of these guys looked any more impressive than a David Carr or Carson Palmer or Willis McGahee (pre-injury), etc. Great players, men amongst boys in college. But human in the NFL. Good, perhaps excellent developing players, but not showing signs of going down as guys who define the position for the next 20 years. Anyway, thats my opinion. It was a good game last night and there are some definite prospects there, but nothing you dont see every year.I disagree almost completely with your post. I don't know anyone who though SJax/Jones were "equal" prospects to Williams, Brown, or Benson. As for your last sentence, I'd be interested to know what "you see every year" that is on par with what happened last night as well as during the season. Best I can tell, even without Young, last night's game was one for the ages, not seen in a long time.

Being just a little bit older, I would have to add T. Dorsett, E. Campbell and the great B. Simms to the list. Simms was really something special in college and the NFL prior to the knee injuries. True, there are players each year that appear to be men among boys at the D1 level. Those are your 1-2 players per team on average that get a sniff of the NFL. However, Young's performance last night transcends that maxim, opinion. I played for OU and have a hard time praising anything Longhorn but Young played one of the best games, if not best game, I have ever seen played at any level of football, which includes the few times I was lucky enough to chase around B. Sanders. Speaking as a former player that played at that level for a premiere program at the time, what Young did last night was absolutely mind blowing. I am sorry but those types of games do not happen every season and they rarely happen when the stakes are so high. Carroll, who can be argued as one of the best tacticians in college football today, had a month to prepare for Young. Look what he did to my poor Sooners last season. Young hung nearly 500 yards of total offense on the Trojan defense. Are you kidding me? 500 yards? That peformance last night was one for the ages. Single games like that do not happen every season in that type of situation at that level of competition. It is one thing to go hang 500 yards of offense on the Weak Sisters of Mercy or Rice during early September. It is something completely different to take on the defending national champion in the final game of the season and absolutely beat ### from whistle to whistle the way Young did. It just does not happen. I am speaking strictly about last night's game. My feelings about Young's entire career at UT, which is impressive, are not nearly as strong nor are my feelings about his long-term prospects in the NFL. However, I will agree with Colin that last night, as a single game, was amazing.

 

[Mungo Burrows]

THere are 7 players in my lifetime that when they played in college, they were clearly the best player on the field most every snap.

1. Hershel Walker

2. Barry Sanders

3. Bo Jackson

4. Peyton Manning

5. Vince Young

6. Ricky Williams

7. Reggie Bush*

Bush gets a * b/c he wasn't even the 2nd best player on the field last night.

Never saw Tim Brown? Marshall Faulk? I think they were the best players on the field when they played. Because of the turnover in college, there are lots of guys who were better than anyone else they faced.

 

[BigJim®]

Is Young smart enough for the NFL. From what I have read Texas runs a very scaled back offense for him, using a basic set of plays because Young is going to run half of the time anyway. Will he be able to pick up a big NFL playbook and have command of it?

Link? It's not a pro-set offense, but I'm not sure what makes you think it's "scaled back."

THere are 7 players in my lifetime that when they played in college, they were clearly the best player on the field most every snap.

1. Hershel Walker

2. Barry Sanders

3. Bo Jackson

4. Peyton Manning

5. Vince Young

6. Ricky Williams

7. Reggie Bush*

Only 7 including 4 surefire HOFers and 2 were playing last night? No offense Col, but the thing about college football is every year there are a handful of guys that everyone is sure are special. As in really special, first ballot HOF prospects. Then they play a year in the NFL and are just rookies for a year (or forever). Last year Cadillac, Ronny Brown, and Cedric Benson were said to be equal prospects coming out to Kevin Jones and Steven Jackson, and those two came out supposedly as the best rated RBs ever. This year Reggie Bush is that cant miss guy, and after yesterday apparently Young is as a QB. Thats all fine and it adds excitement but looking at things objectively none of these guys looked any more impressive than a David Carr or Carson Palmer or Willis McGahee (pre-injury), etc. Great players, men amongst boys in college. But human in the NFL. Good, perhaps excellent developing players, but not showing signs of going down as guys who define the position for the next 20 years. Anyway, thats my opinion. It was a good game last night and there are some definite prospects there, but nothing you dont see every year.

I disagree almost completely with your post. I don't know anyone who though SJax/Jones were "equal" prospects to Williams, Brown, or Benson. As for your last sentence, I'd be interested to know what "you see every year" that is on par with what happened last night as well as during the season. Best I can tell, even without Young, last night's game was one for the ages, not seen in a long time.

Are Bush/Young historic players? I don't consider myself a great NCAA mind but I was blown away by V.Young last night and most people were blown away by Bush all season. IMHO I don't think Colin is alone or even in the minority having his opinion. The anticipation of seeing Bush/V.Young as pros is easily greater than that surrounding recent top RBs/QBs such as W.Green, Roethisberger, Onterrio Smith, S.Jackson, Carr, Kevin Jones, etc., etc. Last year's class was perceived to have great RB talent, but I don't remember seeing anyone doing sick trades like the ones we've seen re: rights to Bush. What's amazing to me is Bush/V.Young are turning some very good talent into virtual FF afterthoughts. I think Leinart, Deangelo Williams and LenDale White are well above average prospects and a couple more Juniors could yet declare to make this easily my most anticipated rookie draft (real and FF dynasty).

 

[valhallan]

Great players, men amongst boys in college. But human in the NFL.

DING DING DING!!!

 

[mbuehner]

As for your last sentence, I'd be interested to know what "you see every year" that is on par with what happened last night as well as during the season. Best I can tell, even without Young, last night's game was one for the ages, not seen in a long time.

Two great offenses playing two bad defenses. I've seen KC play Oakland before. It was an exciting game because of what was at stake, im not as blown away by anyone involved like you guys are. Vince Young looked great, he's a great prospect, isnt that enough? Was it more impressive than Leinart toasting a great Michigan D or throwing 5 tds against OU? Personally i think the drama of the game is destroying some impartiality.

 

[Colin Dowling]

As for your last sentence, I'd be interested to know what "you see every year" that is on par with what happened last night as well as during the season. Best I can tell, even without Young, last night's game was one for the ages, not seen in a long time.

Two great offenses playing two bad defenses. I've seen KC play Oakland before. It was an exciting game because of what was at stake, im not as blown away by anyone involved like you guys are. Vince Young looked great, he's a great prospect, isnt that enough? Was it more impressive than Leinart toasting a great Michigan D or throwing 5 tds against OU? Personally i think the drama of the game is destroying some impartiality.

Texas's defense is far from bad. FAR.

 

[B Maverick]

LINK

Will he be the No. 1 pick? Only if the Texans can find room on their 2-14 roster for a quarterback as big as Carson Palmer who can run like Michael Vick, pass like Peyton Manning, lead like Tom Brady and have as much fun as Brett Favre.

This is how crazy people are going over Young after 1 GAME. USC's def isnt that good. UT's def is top 10 and Leinart, White and Bush all did well. Young ran over a subpar def and everyone is drooling.

Leinart will be a better pro QB, ESPECIALLY if VY comes out this year and not next.

 

[Loomba]

People have been all over, I've always said no lower than the top 10.

Guys a freaking stud. He's Vick jr., and might just be a better QB.

Any chance he just plays RB?

He's already a better QB than Vick.

 

[Pat Patriot]

I was very surprised at the defense that Pete Carroll and USC used the other night. The USC secondary gave Texas receivers PLENTY of room. I actually dont know what they were doing out there. Every receiver Young threw to was WIDE open. Especially his TE. I didnt see a single NFL caliber pass by Young where he had to zip it into a small window. I think his passes looked soft and have to wonder about his throwing motion and arm strength.I dont see Young as much of a scrambling QB as he is a running QB. Most of his runs looked at least semi-planned. On the run to win the game, USC blitzed both MLB's up the middle. The Texas RB circled out of the backfield and cut towards the middle of the field. The USC left DE went with the RB (I guess USC had a zone blitz on). The LB's got caught in the middle and Vince just ran to the right which was WIDE OPEN. I didnt see Young have to avoid a hit in the pocket much (his line was great). It seemed that the Ends would just get too far upfield due to the great work of the Texas tackles and Vince would just stup up inside of it and run away from the LB's.Young still needs to impress in his personal workout. Can he throw the 15 yard out and 18 yard in. We will see.

 

[tattoofan]

Here is a link to Vince Young on a local Houston Radio show this morning.

http://www.sportsradio610.com/goout.asp?u=...tmtx/610am.html