Was the Joe Gibbs experiment successful? (1 Viewer)

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

Pretty simple question here. Did Joe Gibbs have a successful return to the NFL? I'll preface this by saying Gibbs is my favorite all time NFL coach. I remember when his return was announced, it was largely panned by non Redskins fans. He's too old. The game has passed him by. I'm sure you all remember. After the first 6-10 season, the voices got louder. As always, I decided to take a wait and see approach. Well now that he's hanging them up, I think we can finally discuss his tenure.

For your consideration:

6-10

10-6

5-11

9-7

Total record: 30-34 (.468)

1-2 in playoff appearances over that stretch.

Four years previous to Gibbs.

8-8

8-8

7-9

5-11

Total record: 28-36 (.438)

No playoffs

Not a great improvement in overall W-L over the four year stretch, but he never had back to back losing seasons and actually took the team to the playoffs twice.

Discuss.

 

[gman8343]

Was kind of in between IMO. Not a real success, but not a dismal failure. I think more was expected from him, but he did get them to the playoffs twice.

 

[dgreen]

It wasn't a failure, that's for sure.

He did what he said he wanted to do: turn the franchise around. He wanted to get the franchise back to a good level. I wish it could have been better, but I'm okay with where the team is now compared to four years ago.

 

[dudaman]

It wasn't a failure, that's for sure.He did what he said he wanted to do: turn the franchise around. He wanted to get the franchise back to a good level. I wish it could have been better, but I'm okay with where the team is now compared to four years ago.

Perfectly stated. A win this weekend would've made me feel much better. To expect a journeyman like Collins to win in a tough environment was too much to ask.Happy Trails!

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

I guess you have to ask, if Gibbs was a no-name coach, what would the expectations have been with the talent he had? Would he have kept his job? Would he be seen as a good coach?

I think he would have kept his job, and his performance was "good." This was never the most talented team, even in the division. Two winning seasons, three playoff games, one win. I don't know what the fans expected, but I just wanted to see if he could still coach. He can. He certainly didn't have anything else to prove.

I also think he had the team's best interests at heart by stepping down. He accomplished good things, but the team needs to move on and get a coach they can keep for several years. That shows me he cares about the team.

Contrast Gibbs to guys like Saban and Petrino. Big for a class act.

 

[MikeApf]

I agree with the sentiment that it was a mixed bag. Of course, Gibb's own goal was to win the Super Bowl, so anything short of that is not a complete success.

However, with that said, I do agree he stabilized the organization in many ways.

And hopefully over Gibbs' reign they learned that the way to build a good franchise is not necessarily to sign the highest paid FAs every year but rather to identify good talent and give them opportunities. They succeeded down the stretch this year largely off the strength of lower priced backups -- with guys like Collins and Heyer and Doughtery and Godfrey and so forth.

All the indications from the Washington Post is that next year they are looking to keep the core of the guys together and just play moderately in Free Agency. I think this is a bigger, long term strategy that will help the club.

Since Snyder arrived, they have suffered more from poor organization/player management than poor coaching.

As a long time Gibbs fan, I will miss him. He's a classy guy and a tough competitor. With that said, it was probably his time to go. He's not a young man any more and those 100 hour work weeks had to be really hard on him...

M

 

[bez18]

he brought them to the playoffs 2 of his 4 years. He fought through a tumultuous season this year. Give him some credit. I think this team is more of a team than any other Redskins team in the past decade and it showed on the field over the last month. Hopefully that carries over into next season.

 

[redman]

It's a success that unfortunately is not fully reflected in the W/L column.

In 2003 this was a team that was reeling from an embarrassing coaching failure in Spurrier, that had frighteningly little talent on the roster, an owner with the reputation (at that time deserving) of meddling and not even knowing enough about football to know what he didn't know, and no plan for the future. The morale was low and the culture of the team was defeatest. There was not a lot of team toughness.

Joe changed all of that. This roster is stocked with talent, and I'm not talking about fantasy football talent but real NFL talent that includes role players, special teams guys, etc. Lorenzo Alexander is a former college OG who they converted to DT before using on both sides of the ball and on special teams as injuries accumulated, and he played well and looks like a good prospect going forward. Outside of occasional guys who came along like that seemingly by chance, those types of players just weren't being found and put onto the roster before Gibbs, and those are the kinds of guys who make the difference in closely contested ball games. Reed Doughty, Mike Sellers, Jason Fabini, Stephon Heyer, Ryan Clark, Fred Smoot, Todd Wade, James Thrash, Demetric Evans, Khary Campbell, Pierson Priolieu, Leigh Torrance, all were either castoffs from other teams or unheralded rookies who the team had the foresight to either acquire or retain, and all played important roles.

Yeah, they had a few flops - Archuleta and Lloyd being the most prominent - but the body of work in rebuilding and restocking that roster is far greater on the success side than on the failure side. Credit for that has to go to Joe.

 

[Warhogs]

I fall into that sort of in between category. Not great success but not a failure either. This is only my opinion but sneaking into the playoffs in the NFC this year is not really a great accomplishment. It certainly does not indicate failure either.

 

[redman]

I fall into that sort of in between category. Not great success but not a failure either. This is only my opinion but sneaking into the playoffs in the NFC this year is not really a great accomplishment. It certainly does not indicate failure either.

The sneaking into the playoffs is a double edged sword IMHO, but is mostly impressive. On the one hand, you certainly want a team that has secured the inside track to the playoffs before December, but OTOH to twice put together 4+ game winning streaks in December when the team is tired, injuries have accumulated, etc. is very impressive. You can't do that unless your team is unified and believes it can win despite some rough spots. Again, it wasn't the ideal, but to reject it as "luck" or happenstance doesn't do it justice.

 

[buster c]

if nothing else, it was beneficial for the owner to have been exposed to the man. hopefully, he will be better for it.

as for the product on the field, all you need to do is list the last Redskin clubs to advance to post season play 2 out of 4 years. And you'd be back in Gibbs I.

curious how many clubs have been in the playoffs 2 out of the last 3 years, as the Skins have been.

 

[milo66]

It seems to me the Redskins were a rebuilding project that was (at best) two or three years away from being a legitimate Super Bowl contender when Gibbs returned. Now he's leaving, and the Redskins are (at best) two or three years away from being a legitimate Super Bowl contender.

If they were any closer to contending, Gibbs would have stayed. They're too old, brittle (Moss, Portis) and slow on offense; and the front office (i.e. Gibbs with input from Snyder) saddled the roster with too many inexplicable roster moves (Lloyd, Archuleta, Brunell, Randle El). Every year, this team is a non-factor on Draft Day.

Add in a few weird sideline coaching decisions and the behind-the-scenes jostling among the offensive and defensive staffs, and what grade can you really give Gibbs?

A C+?

Maybe a B-

Go Giants!

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

It seems to me the Redskins were a rebuilding project that was (at best) two or three years away from being a legitimate Super Bowl contender when Gibbs returned. Now he's leaving, and the Redskins are (at best) two or three years away from being a legitimate Super Bowl contender.If they were any closer to contending, Gibbs would have stayed. They're too old, brittle (Moss, Portis) and slow on offense; and the front office (i.e. Gibbs with input from Snyder) saddled the roster with too many inexplicable roster moves (Lloyd, Archuleta, Brunell, Randle El). Every year, this team is a non-factor on Draft Day.Add in a few weird sideline coaching decisions and the behind-the-scenes jostling among the offensive and defensive staffs, and what grade can you really give Gibbs?A C+?Maybe a B-Go Giants!

You think Randle El hasn't panned out? I can understand Lloyd and Archuleta but Randle El?

 

[teamroc]

For those voting yes, successful at what?

It's the NFC. Everyone sucks in the NFC. Yet they never won jack, never sniffed the SB.

It took Gibbs 2 years just to get back in the flow of the NFL. The team is more or less a mess.

Not to mention the whole never drafting players thing. Yeah that's genius.

He was largely overrated, didn't accomplish jack, and loves to use timeouts (most times incorrectly).

 

[dgreen]

The team is more or less a mess.

Please explain.

 

[teamroc]

The team is more or less a mess.

Please explain.

Washington Redskins are $20 million over the projected '08 cap.Average offense.Average defense.Two overpaid coordinators. I see them gutting most of the team and starting over. They need DRAFT picks. They keep bringing in overpaid overhyped FA signings. Is Al Saunders going to stay? His offense has disappointed. Defense? Lots of hype. Lots of talk. It's decent. But not for what they are paying. The skins are not an up and coming team. They are a maxed out team (literally and cap wise) with aging talent, and now a new coaching system. This isn't a Parcells leaving Dallas they go 13-3 team next year.

 

[Koya]

Successful? Yes. Mildly.

Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.

Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

 

[Jason Wood]

I'm sorry, but a sub-.500 record in four seasons with one playoff win was NOT what Redskins fans, Daniel Snyder, Joe Gibbs and football pundits wanted to see. While it wasn't an outright failure, bringing back the franchise's hero out of retirement and having him shuffle off with zero division titles wasn't "successful" IMHO. Just look at it from the perspective of his division:

In the four seasons:

Philadelphia (37-27: 0.578), 2 Playoff Appearances, 2 Division Titles, 1 Super Bowl Appearance

New York (35-29: 0.547), 3 Playoff Appearances, 0 Division Titles, 0 Super Bowl Appearances but still alive in '07

Dallas (37-27: 0.578), 2 Playoff Appearances, 1 Division Title, 0 Super Bowl Appearances but 1 seed in '07

Washington (30-34: 0.469), 2 Playoff Appearances, 0 Division Titles, 0 Super Bowl Appearances

 

[redman]

Successful? Yes. Mildly. Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

 

[teamroc]

Successful? Yes. Mildly. Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

You paid that much for "stability"? Uh yah. He was a steady force, at almost getting to .500. Great. The team is still just as much of a mess they were 4 years ago. Now they have no coach. You better hope for Cower.

 

[dgreen]

Washington Redskins are $20 million over the projected '08 cap.

We say this every year at this time, yet they always work things out. We'll see how 2008 works out, cap-wise.

Average offense.

Okay.

Average defense.

Wrong. They've been a top 10 defense in 3 of Gibbs' 4 years. I see no reason RIGHT NOW to think they won't be top 10 again next year.

Two overpaid coordinators.

How does that make the team a mess?

I see them gutting most of the team and starting over.

Depends on who they hire. But, "gutting most of the team" would be a mistake. There's some good, young talent on this team that a new coach would love to build with.

They need DRAFT picks.

They have all but one 2007 pick and all but one 2008 pick. So, they have draft picks.

They keep bringing in overpaid overhyped FA signings.

Since Gibbs arrived, they haven't done this as much as you probably think they have.

Is Al Saunders going to stay? His offense has disappointed.

Maybe. Maybe not.

Defense? Lots of hype. Lots of talk. It's decent. But not for what they are paying.

It's better than decent and most of their money is in the offense, not the defense.

The skins are not an up and coming team. They are a maxed out team (literally and cap wise) with aging talent, and now a new coaching system.

The core group is not that old and you don't know that there will be a new coaching system.

 

[redman]

Successful? Yes. Mildly.

Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.

Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

You paid that much for "stability"? Uh yah. He was a steady force, at almost getting to .500. Great.

The team is still just as much of a mess they were 4 years ago. Now they have no coach. You better hope for Cower.

Defend this comment. I'm tired of you throwing it around with zero to back it up.

 

[dgreen]

I'm sorry, but a sub-.500 record in four seasons with one playoff win was NOT what Redskins fans, Daniel Snyder, Joe Gibbs and football pundits wanted to see. While it wasn't an outright failure, bringing back the franchise's hero out of retirement and having him shuffle off with zero division titles wasn't "successful" IMHO. Just look at it from the perspective of his division:In the four seasonshiladelphia (37-27: 0.578), 2 Playoff Appearances, 2 Division Titles, 1 Super Bowl AppearanceNew York (35-29: 0.547), 3 Playoff Appearances, 0 Division Titles, 0 Super Bowl Appearances but still alive in '07Dallas (37-27: 0.578), 2 Playoff Appearances, 1 Division Title, 0 Super Bowl Appearances but 1 seed in '07Washington (30-34: 0.469), 2 Playoff Appearances, 0 Division Titles, 0 Super Bowl Appearances

It wasn't as successful as most Skins fans hoped for, but it wasn't nearly the failure many said it would be either. I think most Skins fans hoped for 5 years with 3 playoff appearances and a solid SB run. Many others figured he'd coach maybe two years, be lucky to play a meaningful December game, and retire as an old fart who knows nothing about "today's game."

 

[Jason Wood]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

 

[teamroc]

Successful? Yes. Mildly.

Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.

Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

You paid that much for "stability"? Uh yah. He was a steady force, at almost getting to .500. Great.

The team is still just as much of a mess they were 4 years ago. Now they have no coach. You better hope for Cower.

Defend this comment. I'm tired of you throwing it around with zero to back it up.

You were 5-7. You BARELY made the playoffs with an improbably run, and then got your ### kicked.What have you accomplished in the last 4 years? Nothing.

All this "stability - franchise is stable". huh? You've won nothing, and now you're going to probably bring in a new coaching staff.

You're an average NFC team. You've had almost no draft picks the last two years. How is that not a mess? Check the Pats/Colts. As I said before, you're in the NFL, in cap hell, hugely overpaid coaching staff, and you don't rank in the top half of the NFC in terms of talent.

The skins pulled out all the stops, to end the year 9-7! *lol* WOW! Great job! The culmination of Gibbs 4 years! Then you get your ### handed to you on the road. The coaching staff is old, mostly out of touch, and you need to clean house. The other skins guy is talking about how you NOW have all your draft picks. Wow only took 4 years? Great job Gibbs.

The Skins have been run like a game of 3 card Monte. And what for? 9-7 and out of the playoffs. How much was he making again? 5mil a year? Top 5 in paid coaches, for what? .500 record?

Stability because he was there 4 years. You could go hire LHUCKS for 5 years and have stability. Coaches are there to WIN.

This team isn't poised to make a run next year. It will be 2 years more rebuilting, 3 years wasted of CPs prime, lots of cute FAs, and no wins. Success indeed.

 

[teamroc]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Exactly. All this "stability" under Gibbs is now over. It's OVERHAUL as new people are bought in. Between Gibbs/Saunders/Williams, that's what 9-10mil a year? Sorry either they were grossly overpaid of you have no talent. Take your pick, because the Skins are the 3rd, probably 4th best team in the division.

 

[CalBear]

"Better than Spurrier" is a necessary but not sufficient success criterion.

 

[dgreen]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

 

[Ghost Rider]

Successful? Yes. Mildly.

Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.

Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

You paid that much for "stability"? Uh yah. He was a steady force, at almost getting to .500. Great.

The team is still just as much of a mess they were 4 years ago. Now they have no coach. You better hope for Cower.

Defend this comment. I'm tired of you throwing it around with zero to back it up.

You were 5-7. You BARELY made the playoffs with an improbably run, and then got your ### kicked.What have you accomplished in the last 4 years? Nothing.

All this "stability - franchise is stable". huh? You've won nothing, and now you're going to probably bring in a new coaching staff.

You're an average NFC team. You've had almost no draft picks the last two years. How is that not a mess? Check the Pats/Colts. As I said before, you're in the NFL, in cap hell, hugely overpaid coaching staff, and you don't rank in the top half of the NFC in terms of talent.

The skins pulled out all the stops, to end the year 9-7! *lol* WOW! Great job! The culmination of Gibbs 4 years! Then you get your ### handed to you on the road. The coaching staff is old, mostly out of touch, and you need to clean house. The other skins guy is talking about how you NOW have all your draft picks. Wow only took 4 years? Great job Gibbs.

The Skins have been run like a game of 3 card Monte. And what for? 9-7 and out of the playoffs. How much was he making again? 5mil a year? Top 5 in paid coaches, for what? .500 record?

Stability because he was there 4 years. You could go hire LHUCKS for 5 years and have stability. Coaches are there to WIN.

This team isn't poised to make a run next year. It will be 2 years more rebuilting, 3 years wasted of CPs prime, lots of cute FAs, and no wins. Success indeed.

You need to get a grip on reality. The Skins got their asses handed to them by the Seahawks last week? Um, no, unless you mean the same Washington team that had a 4th quarter lead and were on the verge of taking a 4 or 8 point lead before being stopped on the 3rd down and then missing an easy FG. Sorry, but the final score is not always an indication of how close a game really was. Two late INTs being returned for TDs is what the score look more lopsided than it really was.

 

[redman]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

 

[redman]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

 

[dgreen]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

Why? What else does Saunders have going?

 

[thayman]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Exactly. All this "stability" under Gibbs is now over. It's OVERHAUL as new people are bought in. Between Gibbs/Saunders/Williams, that's what 9-10mil a year? Sorry either they were grossly overpaid of you have no talent. Take your pick, because the Skins are the 3rd, probably 4th best team in the division.

As a Redskin fan why do I care what they pay anyone? Eagles are always under the cap by quite a bit, do the fans get a check in the mail that I don't know about?? I don't care what the franchise pays anyone, particularly under Snyder, I know this offseason he will put up some signing bonuses to have players restructure. And The Redskins are the 3rd best team in their division this year, right behind Dallas (who they split the season matchups with) and New York (who they split the season matchups with).

 

[thayman]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

If Williams doesn't get the job he gets $1 million.

 

[thayman]

Successful? Yes. Mildly.

Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.

Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

You paid that much for "stability"? Uh yah. He was a steady force, at almost getting to .500. Great.

The team is still just as much of a mess they were 4 years ago. Now they have no coach. You better hope for Cower.

Do you mean Bill Cowher the former Steelers coach?

 

[redman]

"Better than Spurrier" is a necessary but not sufficient success criterion.

That's not what's being argued here. Spurrier put this team into a hole. Gibbs not only filled in the hole he built a good team out of it. Injuries more than anything else IMHO caused this team to falter during his reign. Spurrier is only mentioned as a horrific starting point which Gibbs had to build from.

 

[redman]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

Why? What else does Saunders have going?

Maybe nothing, which is why I won't rule it out, but like Williams he came to Washington primarily because of Gibbs. One thing's for sure - he won't get paid anywhere else to be a coordinator like he is with the Redskins.

 

[Jason Wood]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

Why? What else does Saunders have going?

Saunders would be out of work for zero seconds. Certainly he could want to stay on, but it would also require Williams wanting him to stay on. It's certainly not a foregone conclusion Saunders will leave; but I think the chances are much better than 50%.

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

If Williams doesn't get the job he gets $1 million.

That's actually not true...at least according to Mort today [he said prior reports about this bonus were erroneous.]

 

[Snotbubbles]

I guess you have to ask, if Gibbs was a no-name coach, what would the expectations have been with the talent he had? Would he have kept his job? Would he be seen as a good coach?I think he would have kept his job, and his performance was "good." This was never the most talented team, even in the division. Two winning seasons, three playoff games, one win. I don't know what the fans expected, but I just wanted to see if he could still coach. He can. He certainly didn't have anything else to prove.I also think he had the team's best interests at heart by stepping down. He accomplished good things, but the team needs to move on and get a coach they can keep for several years. That shows me he cares about the team. Contrast Gibbs to guys like Saban and Petrino. Big for a class act.

To answer your question:Jim Mora Jr.11-5 (Playoffs: 1-1)8-87-9Win%: .542How do you view Mora?

 

[redman]

I guess you have to ask, if Gibbs was a no-name coach, what would the expectations have been with the talent he had? Would he have kept his job? Would he be seen as a good coach?

I think he would have kept his job, and his performance was "good." This was never the most talented team, even in the division. Two winning seasons, three playoff games, one win. I don't know what the fans expected, but I just wanted to see if he could still coach. He can. He certainly didn't have anything else to prove.

I also think he had the team's best interests at heart by stepping down. He accomplished good things, but the team needs to move on and get a coach they can keep for several years. That shows me he cares about the team.

Contrast Gibbs to guys like Saban and Petrino. Big for a class act.

To answer your question:Jim Mora Jr.

11-5 (Playoffs: 1-1)

8-8

7-9

Win%: .542

How do you view Mora?

Declining after inheriting a team that he was initially able to improve on defense. I also view him as stupid for opening his mouth about wanting a college job while he was still employed by the Falcons.

I actually generally liked Mora and figure he'll be back in the head coaching ranks pretty soon.

 

[dgreen]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

Why? What else does Saunders have going?

Saunders would be out of work for zero seconds. Certainly he could want to stay on, but it would also require Williams wanting him to stay on. It's certainly not a foregone conclusion Saunders will leave; but I think the chances are much better than 50%.

I guess I never considered Williams wouldn't want him around.

 

[redman]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

Why? What else does Saunders have going?

Saunders would be out of work for zero seconds. Certainly he could want to stay on, but it would also require Williams wanting him to stay on. It's certainly not a foregone conclusion Saunders will leave; but I think the chances are much better than 50%.

I guess I never considered Williams wouldn't want him around.

That's the one thing I don't know either. I've never heard any comment - good or bad - about their relationship, though I've heard/read interview responses where they've praised each other's work, but that could be seen as much as obligatory between colleagues and equals as gratuitous, so

 

[buster c]

Successful? Yes. Mildly.

Mostly because when Gibbs stepped in, the Franchise was in disarray and looked as if it may fall of the NFL cliff of proud, winning franchises for a while. He righted the ship, brought them back to respectability and made the playoffs twice in four years.

Not an astounding success, but more success than failure considering where the franchise is today as compared with 4 years ago.

Well said. I agree.

You paid that much for "stability"? Uh yah. He was a steady force, at almost getting to .500. Great.

The team is still just as much of a mess they were 4 years ago. Now they have no coach. You better hope for Cower.

Defend this comment. I'm tired of you throwing it around with zero to back it up.

You were 5-7. You BARELY made the playoffs with an improbably run, and then got your ### kicked.What have you accomplished in the last 4 years? Nothing.

All this "stability - franchise is stable". huh? You've won nothing, and now you're going to probably bring in a new coaching staff.

You're an average NFC team. You've had almost no draft picks the last two years. How is that not a mess? Check the Pats/Colts. As I said before, you're in the NFL, in cap hell, hugely overpaid coaching staff, and you don't rank in the top half of the NFC in terms of talent.

The skins pulled out all the stops, to end the year 9-7! *lol* WOW! Great job! The culmination of Gibbs 4 years! Then you get your ### handed to you on the road. The coaching staff is old, mostly out of touch, and you need to clean house. The other skins guy is talking about how you NOW have all your draft picks. Wow only took 4 years? Great job Gibbs.

The Skins have been run like a game of 3 card Monte. And what for? 9-7 and out of the playoffs. How much was he making again? 5mil a year? Top 5 in paid coaches, for what? .500 record?

Stability because he was there 4 years. You could go hire LHUCKS for 5 years and have stability. Coaches are there to WIN.

This team isn't poised to make a run next year. It will be 2 years more rebuilting, 3 years wasted of CPs prime, lots of cute FAs, and no wins. Success indeed.

You need to get a grip on reality. The Skins got their asses handed to them by the Seahawks last week? Um, no, unless you mean the same Washington team that had a 4th quarter lead and were on the verge of taking a 4 or 8 point lead before being stopped on the 3rd down and then missing an easy FG. Sorry, but the final score is not always an indication of how close a game really was. Two late INTs being returned for TDs is what the score look more lopsided than it really was.

my guess is that this young boy is new to watching the NFL. nothing to respond to.

moving along

 

[teamroc]

my guess is that this young boy is new to watching the NFL. nothing to respond to. moving along

You're right. The 9-7 season, loss to Seattle, were VERY IMPRESSIVE. The Skins are CLEARLY on the path to a SB.My bad.

 

[Ghost Rider]

my guess is that this young boy is new to watching the NFL. nothing to respond to. moving along

You're right. The 9-7 season, loss to Seattle, were VERY IMPRESSIVE. The Skins are CLEARLY on the path to a SB.My bad.

No one said it was impressive. Saying that would be as dumb as saying that they got their asses handed to them.

 

[buster c]

Whether or not the team is on good footing is as much about what happens from here as how we view things today. Gregg Williams is the popular choice clearly, but if he gets the job they will need to bring in a new offensive coaching staff almost assuredly. By the same token, if Al Saunders were to shock the world and get the job (I don't expect that), I can't imagine Williams sticking around to run the defense.

Why do you say a new offensive coaching staff would come if Williams gets the job?

I'm not sure Saunders sticks around if Williams gets the head job. If Saunders gets the head job (which I doubt), IMHO Williams is definitely gone.

Why? What else does Saunders have going?

Saunders would be out of work for zero seconds. Certainly he could want to stay on, but it would also require Williams wanting him to stay on. It's certainly not a foregone conclusion Saunders will leave; but I think the chances are much better than 50%.

I guess I never considered Williams wouldn't want him around.

That's the one thing I don't know either. I've never heard any comment - good or bad - about their relationship, though I've heard/read interview responses where they've praised each other's work, but that could be seen as much as obligatory between colleagues and equals as gratuitous, so

this is where moneybags Snyder comes in, giving Big Al $2m reasons why he'd want to continue

 

[stevegamer]

It's a moderate success. The team is deeper and more a team than a collection of players. Going forward, Little Danny Snyder might have grown up -he may not screw everything up by meddling so much.

It's not what they were hoping for, but it's better than what they had.

 

[redman]

This is probably the best overall summary of this tenure, from Thomas Boswell at the Post:

In his first term as Redskins coach, Gibbs became famous for many things, including a cutting-edge offensive system, superlative halftime adjustments and some of the best game management tactics in the NFL. In his second term, all that reversed.In his first year back, one veteran player, meaning no harm, casually referred to Gibbs's "1991 offense." By the 2006 season, Gibbs had fired himself as offensive guru, and the team brought in Al Saunders for that role after years of success in Kansas City and St. Louis.Instead of faring well after intermissions, the Redskins became perhaps the worst team in the NFL at holding second-half leads over the last four seasons. Narrow losses, which Gibbs always called "heartbreaking," became the rule. A shattering 52-7 defeat to the perfect Patriots in New England may also have been a sign to Gibbs that his era as a premiere builder of champions was in the past and that, perhaps, some of his assistants, like Williams or Saunders, might do better with more or complete authority.Despite his shortcomings in his second tour with the Redskins, Gibbs had a glorious final chapter in which his strongest suit -- his character -- was on display to a greater degree than ever before. From his private words and personnel warmth to his players to his public statements and words from the pulpit at Taylor's funeral in Miami, Gibbs struck exactly the right notes to minister to his players as people. And he also helped them to bond behind the memory of their teammate to be a better, closer and more focused football team.All season, Gibbs praised his players' character and said that, in the last month, he even saw groups of players in small team-called meetings do extra work or simply talk about how much they wanted to play their best. When Gibbs came back four years ago, he inherited a team, and an organization, with almost zero cohesion, collective self-esteem or leadership. Steve Spurrier, the most casual and disengaged of NFL coaches, barely seemed to know all his players' first names let alone worry about their character or ability to interact and lead. Gibbs rebuilt the team from the inside out, stressing personal qualities almost as much, at times, as raw athletic ability.

 

[BelichicksRevenge]

I think Gibbs turned the team around and has it set up for future success. I believe he may have taught synder some things about building a team. Time will tell. If Synder goes out and hires a big name college coach then Gibbs' experiment was meaningless.

 

[Jason Wood]

I think Gibbs turned the team around and has it set up for future success. I believe he may have taught synder some things about building a team. Time will tell. If Synder goes out and hires a big name college coach then Gibbs' experiment was meaningless.

The good news is that Snyder will spare no expense in keeping/hiring coaches. The bad news is the Redskins had one of the most impressive collections of assistant coaches because of the allure of working under Gibbs.