What does the "establishment" mean to you? (1 Viewer)

[timschochet]

It seems like at least 75% of the political discussion these days is centered on the "establishment". It's ill-defined.

Among conservatives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Republican in office who is open to some sort of amnesty for illegals.

2. Any Republican in office who is willing to compromise and negotiate with Democrats.

3. The Republican National Committee

Among progressives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Democrat in office (or prominent Dem like Hillary Clinton) who accepts corporate donations.

2. The Democratic National Committee.

What's it mean to you? And if you're one of those that wants to defeat or destroy it, why? What's your beef?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Look up the Rothchilds and the Central Banks if you really want to know what's up. Much like you Tim, I plan on a thread where I start to house all my crazy and people can sift thru it without derailing some of this well intended but misguided political threads.

 

[timschochet]

Look up the Rothchilds and the Central Banks if you really want to know what's up. Much like you Tim, I plan on a thread where I start to house all my crazy and people can sift thru it without derailing some of this well intended but misguided political threads.

Are you a Lyndon LaRouche guy?

 

[Higgs]

Anyone who is bought out by a special interest group, which is just about everyone in Washington.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Look up the Rothchilds and the Central Banks if you really want to know what's up. Much like you Tim, I plan on a thread where I start to house all my crazy and people can sift thru it without derailing some of this well intended but misguided political threads.

Are you a Lyndon LaRouche guy?

That name sounds like the name a bunch of activists were hyping on the LACC campus back when I attended in '02-'04. The answer Tim is honestly I don't know that guy enough to say yes or no but I would say no.

We can roll back to 1913 or we can go even further to when Andrew Jackson could see the future and wanted to put a stop to a Central Bank. In 1913 I believe, that's when the system we run now was initially set up.

Establishment to me is the super elite wealthy, I've heard there are 5 people who run the world essentially. I think that's a red herring but I do believe there were something like 5 banks at one time and then along come the Rothchilds.

They have all the money and there are 5 of them, we have none of the money and there are millions of us. Seems like an easy victory, needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

I'm one of those Spock types if you really want to know. But I bite like Tiberius Kirk so be forewarned.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Anyone who is bought out by a special interest group, which is just about everyone in Washington.

Out of likes but Higgs has hit a lot of them today. Special interest groups have crippled the system.

 

[squistion]

It seems like at least 75% of the political discussion these days is centered on the "establishment". It's ill-defined.

Among conservatives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Republican in office who is open to some sort of amnesty for illegals.

2. Any Republican in office who is willing to compromise and negotiate with Democrats.

3. The Republican National Committee

Among progressives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Democrat in office (or prominent Dem like Hillary Clinton) who accepts corporate donations.

2. The Democratic National Committee.

What's it mean to you? And if you're one of those that wants to defeat or destroy it, why? What's your beef?

The status quo, usually represented by the National Committee of either party. Hillary would certainly qualify as the Democratic Party establishment candidate (as she was in 2008) but I am not certain that is defined by accepting corporate donations (although I can't come up with anything better) Jeb! is probably as close as you can get to the establishment candidate on the GOP side (which hasn't done him much good) and in the prior presidential elections, both Romney and McCain (to a lesser extent) would have qualified.

 

[Slapdash]

 

[timschochet]

It seems like at least 75% of the political discussion these days is centered on the "establishment". It's ill-defined.

Among conservatives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Republican in office who is open to some sort of amnesty for illegals.

2. Any Republican in office who is willing to compromise and negotiate with Democrats.

3. The Republican National Committee

Among progressives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Democrat in office (or prominent Dem like Hillary Clinton) who accepts corporate donations.

2. The Democratic National Committee.

What's it mean to you? And if you're one of those that wants to defeat or destroy it, why? What's your beef?

The status quo, usually represented by the National Committee of either party. Hillary would certainly qualify as the Democratic Party establishment candidate (as she was in 2008) but I am not certain that is defined by accepting corporate donations (although I can't come up with anything better) Jeb! is probably as close as you can get to the establishment candidate on the GOP side (which hasn't done him much good) and in the prior presidential elections, both Romney and McCain (to a lesser extent) would have qualified.

McCain is now called an establishment guy. But in both 2000 and 2008 he was the "maverick"; a guy who spoke his mind no matter what his party thought, etc That's certainly not what one would think of as establishment.

 

[Mr. Pickles]

Look up the Rothchilds and the Central Banks if you really want to know what's up. Much like you Tim, I plan on a thread where I start to house all my crazy and people can sift thru it without derailing some of this well intended but misguided political threads.

"The Rand Corporation, in conjunction with the saucer people..."

 

[timschochet]

Marco Rubio is now called an establishment guy. But he ran as a Tea Party candidate and was elected running against a moderate Republican who truly could be called part of the establishment. So what makes Rubio an establishment guy now? His positions on many issues are as conservative as they get. For instance, he is opposed to abortion even in the cases of rape and incest.

It seems like the only reason that Rubio is grouped as part of the establishment (as an insult) is because as part of his immigration bill he supported an eventual path to citizenship for illegal immigrants. That's it, that's the only thing. But it's enough to condemn him and for the Republican base to dismiss him as part of the ruling elite.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Marco Rubio is now called an establishment guy. But he ran as a Tea Party candidate and was elected running against a moderate Republican who truly could be called part of the establishment. So what makes Rubio an establishment guy now? His positions on many issues are as conservative as they get. For instance, he is opposed to abortion even in the cases of rape and incest.

It seems like the only reason that Rubio is grouped as part of the establishment (as an insult) is because as part of his immigration bill he supported an eventual path to citizenship for illegal immigrants. That's it, that's the only thing. But it's enough to condemn him and for the Republican base to dismiss him as part of the ruling elite.

I think GOP supporters are simply smart enough to see thru his BS. He also stumbles a lot with his words. He looks 35, is actually 45 and whines a lot. He is a Miami guy, Miami Grad and I still don't like him and I was born there and also carry a prestigious UM degree.

"So what makes Rubio an establishment guy now? His positions on many issues are as conservative as they get"

-Answered your own question Tim.

 

[timschochet]

Marco Rubio is now called an establishment guy. But he ran as a Tea Party candidate and was elected running against a moderate Republican who truly could be called part of the establishment. So what makes Rubio an establishment guy now? His positions on many issues are as conservative as they get. For instance, he is opposed to abortion even in the cases of rape and incest.

It seems like the only reason that Rubio is grouped as part of the establishment (as an insult) is because as part of his immigration bill he supported an eventual path to citizenship for illegal immigrants. That's it, that's the only thing. But it's enough to condemn him and for the Republican base to dismiss him as part of the ruling elite.

I think GOP supporters are simply smart enough to see thru his BS. He also stumbles a lot with his words. He looks 35, is actually 45 and whines a lot. He is a Miami guy, Miami Grad and I still don't like him and I was born there and also carry a prestigious UM degree.

"So what makes Rubio an establishment guy now? His positions on many issues are as conservative as they get"

-Answered your own question Tim.

The bolded is an odd and unusual criticism. When I've watched him, he's sounded somewhat rehearsed, but I haven't noticed him stumble.

 

[squistion]

It seems like at least 75% of the political discussion these days is centered on the "establishment". It's ill-defined.

Among conservatives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Republican in office who is open to some sort of amnesty for illegals.

2. Any Republican in office who is willing to compromise and negotiate with Democrats.

3. The Republican National Committee

Among progressives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Democrat in office (or prominent Dem like Hillary Clinton) who accepts corporate donations.

2. The Democratic National Committee.

What's it mean to you? And if you're one of those that wants to defeat or destroy it, why? What's your beef?

The status quo, usually represented by the National Committee of either party. Hillary would certainly qualify as the Democratic Party establishment candidate (as she was in 2008) but I am not certain that is defined by accepting corporate donations (although I can't come up with anything better) Jeb! is probably as close as you can get to the establishment candidate on the GOP side (which hasn't done him much good) and in the prior presidential elections, both Romney and McCain (to a lesser extent) would have qualified.

McCain is now called an establishment guy. But in both 2000 and 2008 he was the "maverick"; a guy who spoke his mind no matter what his party thought, etc That's certainly not what one would think of as establishment.

I dunno, I would say that he was the establishment choice (as evidenced by how he is viewed now by the Tea Party crowd) and once he started running he was not that "mavericky" (to use a Palinism) anymore. And does anyone remember how he kissed the butt of George Bush who had been responsible for the false rumors in 2000 that he had a black illegitimate child?

 

[timschochet]

It seems like at least 75% of the political discussion these days is centered on the "establishment". It's ill-defined.

Among conservatives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Republican in office who is open to some sort of amnesty for illegals.

2. Any Republican in office who is willing to compromise and negotiate with Democrats.

3. The Republican National Committee

Among progressives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Democrat in office (or prominent Dem like Hillary Clinton) who accepts corporate donations.

2. The Democratic National Committee.

What's it mean to you? And if you're one of those that wants to defeat or destroy it, why? What's your beef?

The status quo, usually represented by the National Committee of either party. Hillary would certainly qualify as the Democratic Party establishment candidate (as she was in 2008) but I am not certain that is defined by accepting corporate donations (although I can't come up with anything better) Jeb! is probably as close as you can get to the establishment candidate on the GOP side (which hasn't done him much good) and in the prior presidential elections, both Romney and McCain (to a lesser extent) would have qualified.

McCain is now called an establishment guy. But in both 2000 and 2008 he was the "maverick"; a guy who spoke his mind no matter what his party thought, etc That's certainly not what one would think of as establishment.

I dunno, I would say that he was the establishment choice (as evidenced by how he is viewed now by the Tea Party crowd) and once he started running he was not that "mavericky" (to use a Palinism) anymore. And does anyone remember how he kissed the butt of George Bush who had been responsible for the false rumors in 1980 that he had a black illegitimate child?

In 2000. But your comment about how the Tea Party views him fits into my idea that the Republican base's view about the establishment is skewed. To the Tea Party, John McCain is establishment because he was pro-amnesty and at times sought compromise with Democrats. The fact that he has a stellar conservative voting record, that he challenged the leadership of his own party time and again is completely ignored. Illegal immigration is the litmus test just as abortion used to be the litmus test.

But I think you're correct that the definition of establishment changes over time, sometimes over a very short time. In 1976 Ronald Reagan ran as the anti-establishment candidate and lost to Gerald Ford, the establishment candidate. Four years later Reagan ran on exactly the same program, but this time he was the establishment candidate.

 

[squistion]

Nate Silver's rather, um, odd tweet about the establishment (looks like something Em might write):

Nate Silver ‏@NateSilver538

"The establishment" never really had a strategy to take on Trump.

Anyone can seem invincible if no one tries to vince him.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

 

[eoMMan]

The Establishment were an 80's wrestling tag team duo, right?

 

[Daywalker]

Establishment means the 10 or so banks along with big oil, defense, healthcare/pharmaceutical.

Like 50 guys I'd say. Who basically determine our House/Senate/Governors all the way down.

 

[Plorfu]

It seems like the only reason that Rubio is grouped as part of the establishment (as an insult) is because as part of his immigration bill he supported an eventual path to citizenship for illegal immigrants.

It's because he's currently sharing a stage with a Cheeto-colored idiot who thinks China invented global warming, a guy who thinks the pyramids were built to hold Bible-era grain, and a creepy serpent who wraps bacon around guns.

 

[Sabertooth]

Look up the Rothchilds and the Central Banks if you really want to know what's up. Much like you Tim, I plan on a thread where I start to house all my crazy and people can sift thru it without derailing some of this well intended but misguided political threads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKRFlNryaWw

 

[timschochet]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure. For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Everyone is at fault including us keyboard warriors, the media, and the pundits. What the principled Trump people and the newer Sanders fans have in common is a sense that the US government doesn't follow the laws of the rules and isn't responsive to the people. People have lost faith in the process, in the honesty of their leaders and that's a bad place for a democracy to be. I'm afraid Little Finger though will make deals with the establishment in a second while the High Sparrow means business.

 

[timschochet]

Everyone is at fault including us keyboard warriors, the media, and the pundits. What the principled Trump people and the newer Sanders fans have in common is a sense that the US government doesn't follow the laws of the rules and isn't responsive to the people. People have lost faith in the process, in the honesty of their leaders and that's a bad place for a democracy to be. I'm afraid Little Finger though will make deals with the establishment in a second while the High Sparrow means business.

I appreciate the GOT references. But "principled Trump people"???

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I don't want to belabor but if anti-Trumpites (of which I'm one) believe that every one of the 40-50+% of the population who vote for Trump including many a Democrat in the end is a racist white nationalist then they're making a critical mistake. So are the Hillary fans and Hillary herself who go around suggesting all Sanders supporters are closet socialists. They're not.

 

[mr roboto]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure. For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

Oh for ####s sake Tim being anti-big bank isn't antisemitism. That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard you say.

 

[timschochet]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure. For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

Oh for ####s sake Tim being anti-big bank isn't antisemitism. That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard you say.

I never said that. Please read it again.

 

[Fla\/\/ed]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

 

[mr roboto]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure. For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

Oh for ####s sake Tim being anti-big bank isn't antisemitism. That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard you say.

I never said that. Please read it again.

You said 'all too often' big banks were code for big Jews. I must be missing some subtlety here.

 

[timschochet]

MOP asked me to consider his conspiracy diatribe I. Terms of history. Don't forget that he added the Rothschilds to his big bank theory.

What I wrote is accurate. In the last 100 years all too often this theory has been linked to antisemitism. That doesn't mean that today's people who are concerned about Wall

Street and the banks are anti-Semites. But there have been those links in the past, and they are still prevalent among the more crackpot conspiracy theorists, of which I guess MOP is one.

 

[timschochet]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure. For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

Oh for ####s sake Tim being anti-big bank isn't antisemitism. That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard you say.

I never said that. Please read it again.

You said 'all too often' big banks were code for big Jews. I must be missing some subtlety here.

All too often, and hiatorically speaking. That's the subtly you're missing.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I have to say given MOP's post I kind of see where Tim picked up on that. However I don't think that strain is worth considering in the big picture. Sanders himself is Jewish.

 

[timschochet]

I have to say given MOP's post I kind of see where Tim picked up on that. However I don't think that strain is worth considering in the big picture. Sanders himself is Jewish.

I agree. It's got nothing to do with the Occupy/Warren/Sanders movement. My comment was in reference to MOP.

 

[Plorfu]

I have to say given MOP's post I kind of see where Tim picked up on that. However I don't think that strain is worth considering in the big picture. Sanders himself is Jewish.

He's just in it for the jokes.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure.For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

In one post, a person of Jewish faith as you have let everyone know, in one post and one sentence you make a tie from big banks to big jews, why? It almost is an attempt to shut down the conversation over religion which has nothing to do with it.

What's up? How can you be so sure it's a euphemism for big Jews and why would you want to stop discussion about the central banks and the private company known as the Federal Reserve?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wind up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered"

-Thomas Jefferson

There is the establishment Tim. It's echoed throughout history and is still breathing hot n heavy today. What say you Mr History lover? Want to talk Federal Reserve? Is it common knowledge these days that the Federal Reserve is not actually a government institution? No one really uses a phone book much anymore but the Federal Reserve would actually be listed in the White Pages close to where Federal Express would be listed. Those are private companies. I bet a lot of Americans think the Federal Reserve is part of the actual government. What say you?

I say this is a crock of horse manure.For about 100 years, starting with Henry Ford, conspiracy theorists have attempted to expand on Thomas Jefferson's statement and apply it to the "big banks" of the modern era. All too often the "big banks" were merely a euphemism for "big Jews".

I don't believe that most people who are anti-establishment are conspiracy nuts, but some are.

Oh for ####s sake Tim being anti-big bank isn't antisemitism. That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard you say.

I never said that. Please read it again.

Bill#### Bull#### Bull####...I already explained in the previous post but I'm glad others saw it immediately. So any discussion about the Federal Reserve being private and owned by lots of foreigners is going to be the go directly to the A-S card?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

MOP asked me to consider his conspiracy diatribe I. Terms of history. Don't forget that he added the Rothschilds to his big bank theory.

What I wrote is accurate. In the last 100 years all too often this theory has been linked to antisemitism. That doesn't mean that today's people who are concerned about Wall

Street and the banks are anti-Semites. But there have been those links in the past, and they are still prevalent among the more crackpot conspiracy theorists, of which I guess MOP is one.

Let's flesh this statement out. So you freely admit in the last 100 years or 3 generations...1913 would be the date you are eluding to Tim. You are not the only person who studies history buddy, I actually teach it but I never profess to being an expert or throw my knowledge around. In fact I rather enjoy a lot of your posts so I hope you can figure a way to get past the big banks=big jews because it inhibits the strength of your posts. I'm saying you're smarter than this and know better.

Cheers

 

[Jayded]

My own personal opinion would be a career politician on either side of the aisle. I define career politician as those who cannot fathom how Washington had a clear in to a third term and decided his service was up and walked away.

I think it creates stale situations where the same people are arguing for the same things over and over, wasting time and money, along with opening the door to corruption and special interests.

 

[timschochet]

You know what MOP, I started this thread to have a legitimate discussion about the establishment and how people define it and why they're so angry about it. You want to turn in it into a diatribe about the Rothschilds and big banks and how they control everything. I told you what I thought of that nonsense. I'm not going to engage you about it anymore.

For anyone else reading this who might be confused: yes I am aware that big banks are a vital part of this issue, especially from the progressive side, and we can and should have a reasonable discussion about them. But hopefully without the paranoid agenda that MOP is trying to promote.

 

[urbanhack]

It doesn't mean anything to me. It's a bunch of malarkey.

 

[Mister CIA]

Whether or not you are part of The Establishment is determined by the quantity and quality of ###-kissers a person (or other entity) has in tow. "Quality", very loosely, translates to the number of ###-kissers your ###-kissers possess. I cannot provide a mathematical formula, but I'm sure that someone smarter than myself could. Still, it's plain to see that Hillary is the head of our political establishment, in case there were doubts.

 

[timschochet]

My own personal opinion would be a career politician on either side of the aisle. I define career politician as those who cannot fathom how Washington had a clear in to a third term and decided his service was up and walked away.

I think it creates stale situations where the same people are arguing for the same things over and over, wasting time and money, along with opening the door to corruption and special interests.

but the opposite argument is that a lot of our problems are complex and require sophisticated thinking and long term solutions. You bring in newcomers every few years and they're likely to be for instant, ill thought out changes that make things worse.

 

[E-Z Glider]

It's what my one buddy from college calls the tub-n-tugs. He usually uses the finger quote things when he says it too, like "I stopped by my favorite (ahem) "establishment" last night on the way home from the bar."

 

[NREC34]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K3klJvTHGJA

 

[jonessed]

Anyone who is bought out by a special interest group, which is just about everyone in Washington.

Out of likes but Higgs has hit a lot of them today. Special interest groups have crippled the system.

Any collection of people or entities that lobby government on behalf of a cause is a special interest group. They have always existed.

The problem isn't in the special interest groups, it's that the government has the power to give so much away. As long as the government pie continues to expand, the amount of time and money spent on trying to get a piece of that pie will expand.

 

[Politician Spock]

In 1913 I believe, that's when the system we run now was initially set up.

Part of the current system was set up in 1913, but significant changes occurred to the system in 1944 and 1971.

Historically monetary systems live for a few decades before they either die or experience a significant change to keep it going. So we're probably due for a significant change any day now.

 

[PIK95]

$$$

 

[Lutherman2112]

Antidisestablishmentarianism

That's a big word.

.

 

[Riversco]

It seems like at least 75% of the political discussion these days is centered on the "establishment". It's ill-defined.

Among conservatives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Republican in office who is open to some sort of amnesty for illegals.

2. Any Republican in office who is willing to compromise and negotiate with Democrats.

3. The Republican National Committee

Among progressives, it seems to mean:

1. Any Democrat in office (or prominent Dem like Hillary Clinton) who accepts corporate donations.

2. The Democratic National Committee.

What's it mean to you? And if you're one of those that wants to defeat or destroy it, why? What's your beef?

The Establishment will never be defined either. It is fluid. It depends on who in power at the time. Mavericks could take power from the Establishment, but that just makes them the new Establishment.

 

[cstu]

Establishment to me means people who those in power like.