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Game of Thrones, tv only, books don't exist, no backstory


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so 2 other quick notes:

1) i was warming up to the Hound too, but i think he was a goner no matter what happened. i think they hinted last week that he got a nasty infection from that guy who bit him and he was hurting from that anyway

2)and what the hell was Jon Snow's plan? if Stannis didn't come he was pretty much dead because of how he looked at that knife right? So was that his big strategic plan to defend the kingdoms against this huge wildling army? I understand his options were limited, but i think Snow will not win any strategy battles soon

It's amazing how people don't pick up on things that are laid out before them. Snow left the wall knowing it was a suicide mission. He explained that last week. When he looked at the knife, Mance told Snow he knew he was fast enough to kill him but Mance's men would kill him too. If Mance died the wildlings would break apart. That was Snow's strategy--give his life for the kingdom.

do you really think he could have grabbed that cutting knife and killed Mance before the 4 or 5 dudes standing right next to them would have reacted. And did Jon Snow prepare to have dinner cooked beside him as he sat at the table with Mance? You guys are silly, the plan was dopey. but i do understand, like Snow said to Sam, nobody has a better plan. But still, i think i would have tried something else, like at least seal the tunnel

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How big is Stannis's army? I mean damn the wildlings are a 100,000 strong with giants, mammoths etc and they laid down like a bunch of pansies.

They are trained soldiers, with armor, superior weapons, superior tactics, on horses and had surprise on their side. Plus, there wasn't 100,000 soldiers with Mance in that camp.

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If Tywin really is dead then Tommen will need to name a new Hand of the King. Who will it be?

If? He's dead. Now I'm sure there will be more people brought back to life as that's been a reoccurring motif, but I really doubt Tywin gets resurrected.

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Any reason to think the Margery/Tommen marriage happens? Cersei isn't keeping up her part of the bargain and no Tywin to push it. Obviously the lannisters still need money but will that be enough?

good question. it will be weird if the king is not betrothed to somebody, but cersei wants nothing to do with Margery.

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How big is Stannis's army? I mean damn the wildlings are a 100,000 strong with giants, mammoths etc and they laid down like a bunch of pansies.

Sure they're pansies. They wanted to get to the other side of he wall to escape the White Walkers. Waving one more white flag is no big deal.

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How big is Stannis's army? I mean damn the wildlings are a 100,000 strong with giants, mammoths etc and they laid down like a bunch of pansies.

Was it 100,000 or 10,000?

100,000, but that included women and kids I think.

I hope they can squeeze the mammoths through the tunnel.

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If Tywin really is dead then Tommen will need to name a new Hand of the King. Who will it be?

The Tyrell dad is still around. He could make a power play for his family.

I think they've kind of shown again and again that he's a bit of a jabroni.

Exactly who Cersei would want as a hand to the king.

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If Tywin really is dead then Tommen will need to name a new Hand of the King. Who will it be?

The Tyrell dad is still around. He could make a power play for his family.

I think they've kind of shown again and again that he's a bit of a jabroni.

Exactly who Cersei would want as a hand to the king.

That's a bit different than making a power play though.

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Well, obviously that point was much more debatable than I thought, and I (most likely) took it the wrong way. I admit that I was (most likely) wrong. Having said that, I thought it was obvious that Tywin was dead, and that the dragons weren't left to die.

You win. Good job

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Not really a spoiler, but because it's 'book' related, I'll put it in spoilers. Basically for those that wonder where the show is in relation to the books.

Someone did some work to coorelate the book chapters to the TV show episodes: (no book chapters not yet shown on the show are listed)

http://i.imgur.com/lceExOP.jpg

Edited by Maelstrom
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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

Tyrion was acting out of character from the moment he saw Shae. Him being in shock and not talking to Varys is perfectly plausible in that situation.

And breaking out the convicted murderer of the prior king was risky enough, breaking out someone showed up bloodied and caused the alarm to be sounded was probably more than even Varys could cover up.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

I dont think that tyrion told him.

my question is what changed so much that varys decided to get on the boat? if he wasn't at first, it meant that he was confident he wouldn't be blamed for tyrion escaping. so if it isn't him getting caught is it because the stakes were ramped up with tywin biting it, he know cersei will be in control and go ape ####, or something else?

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

I dont think that tyrion told him.

my question is what changed so much that varys decided to get on the boat? if he wasn't at first, it meant that he was confident he wouldn't be blamed for tyrion escaping. so if it isn't him getting caught is it because the stakes were ramped up with tywin biting it, he know cersei will be in control and go ape ####, or something else?

Good question actually. If he was in the clear on the escape, what changed? Other than maybe Tywin was telling the truth when he said he was never going to have his son executed. Maybe Tywin was in cahoots with Jaime and Varys but Cersei wasn't. With Tywin dead, Cersei would have looked at Varys. :shrug:

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

I dont think that tyrion told him.

my question is what changed so much that varys decided to get on the boat? if he wasn't at first, it meant that he was confident he wouldn't be blamed for tyrion escaping. so if it isn't him getting caught is it because the stakes were ramped up with tywin biting it, he know cersei will be in control and go ape ####, or something else?

Good question actually. If he was in the clear on the escape, what changed? Other than maybe Tywin was telling the truth when he said he was never going to have his son executed. Maybe Tywin was in cahoots with Jaime and Varys but Cersei wasn't. With Tywin dead, Cersei would have looked at Varys. :shrug:

Don't think Tywin was in on the escape. He specifically asked Tyrion who helped break him out. I think the main reason Varys got on the boat was the turmoil he now anticipated. He could predict what would happen with Tyrion escaping but now that Tywin was murdered as well all bets were off and things were impossible to predict.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

I dont think that tyrion told him.

my question is what changed so much that varys decided to get on the boat? if he wasn't at first, it meant that he was confident he wouldn't be blamed for tyrion escaping. so if it isn't him getting caught is it because the stakes were ramped up with tywin biting it, he know cersei will be in control and go ape ####, or something else?

Good question actually. If he was in the clear on the escape, what changed? Other than maybe Tywin was telling the truth when he said he was never going to have his son executed. Maybe Tywin was in cahoots with Jaime and Varys but Cersei wasn't. With Tywin dead, Cersei would have looked at Varys. :shrug:

I think perhaps he either figured that Cersei would look for someone's head. There aren't many people in KL with the capacity to spring Tyrion and it isn't out of the realm of possibilities that Varys knew that Jaime was back in Cersei's good graces and wouldn't look to him. Cersei needs to chop a head. The most likely head would be Varys'.

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Any reason to think the Margery/Tommen marriage happens? Cersei isn't keeping up her part of the bargain and no Tywin to push it. Obviously the lannisters still need money but will that be enough?

good question. it will be weird if the king is not betrothed to somebody, but cersei wants nothing to do with Margery.

At the same time, Cersei met up with Margery in the Throne Room a few episodes back (remember when she kept seeing Tommen checking out Margery) and told Margery that she put her faith in a Margery/Tommen marriage. Whether the death of her ather and her reconciliation with Jaime would change that position or not, I don't know.

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I agree. I was just thinking out loud there a bit.

Varys is probably just as smart as Tyrion. Maybe smarter. He can read a situation as well as anyone. I'm positive he knew about Jaime and Cersei. He knows about everything because he has spies everywhere.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

I dont think that tyrion told him.

my question is what changed so much that varys decided to get on the boat? if he wasn't at first, it meant that he was confident he wouldn't be blamed for tyrion escaping. so if it isn't him getting caught is it because the stakes were ramped up with tywin biting it, he know cersei will be in control and go ape ####, or something else?

Good question actually. If he was in the clear on the escape, what changed? Other than maybe Tywin was telling the truth when he said he was never going to have his son executed. Maybe Tywin was in cahoots with Jaime and Varys but Cersei wasn't. With Tywin dead, Cersei would have looked at Varys. :shrug:

I think perhaps he either figured that Cersei would look for someone's head. There aren't many people in KL with the capacity to spring Tyrion and it isn't out of the realm of possibilities that Varys knew that Jaime was back in Cersei's good graces and wouldn't look to him. Cersei needs to chop a head. The most likely head would be Varys'.

Yup. With Tywin alive the blame would likely fall on Jamie. However with Tywin out of the way Cersei would be willfully blind to Jamie's involvement and the blame would fall on Varys.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

I dont think that tyrion told him.

my question is what changed so much that varys decided to get on the boat? if he wasn't at first, it meant that he was confident he wouldn't be blamed for tyrion escaping. so if it isn't him getting caught is it because the stakes were ramped up with tywin biting it, he know cersei will be in control and go ape ####, or something else?

Good question actually. If he was in the clear on the escape, what changed? Other than maybe Tywin was telling the truth when he said he was never going to have his son executed. Maybe Tywin was in cahoots with Jaime and Varys but Cersei wasn't. With Tywin dead, Cersei would have looked at Varys. :shrug:

I think perhaps he either figured that Cersei would look for someone's head. There aren't many people in KL with the capacity to spring Tyrion and it isn't out of the realm of possibilities that Varys knew that Jaime was back in Cersei's good graces and wouldn't look to him. Cersei needs to chop a head. The most likely head would be Varys'.

Yup. With Tywin alive the blame would likely fall on Jamie. However with Tywin out of the way Cersei would be willfully blind to Jamie's involvement and the blame would fall on Varys.

Makes sense.

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I was surprised Arya didn't do the Hound a solid and put him out of his misery. They must have developed some sort of bound being together that long. He saved her on numerous occasions and could say died trying to protect her from what he considered a threat in Brienne. She wasn't worth anything to him any longer yet they continued to travel together. He saved her sister a couple times as well. I wouldn't leave my worst enemy to die in the sun like that. Guess thats what makes the show great. Nobody is completely good or bad, just varying degrees of both.

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I dont think Tywin gave two ####s if Tyrion was executed or not. Even if he knew Varys let Tyrion escape that doesnt necessarily mean he wouldve killed Varys. He still thought Varys was important to his cause (with all his spies). But with Tywin dead, Varys KNOWS Cersei would be out for revenge and would take down anyone and everyone possible.

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Also, I hope you jerks are starting to respect Stannis. He is the rightful king. Tommen needs to step down.

Well, actually whomever marries Daenerys Targaryen is the rightful king. Robert Baratheon usurped the Throne, but the true, rightful heir is Daenerys.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

He knew when he heard the bells that Tywin had been found, and that there was no way he could get back into King's Landing without looking guilty. Resigned to his new fate, he turned around and got on the boat. Brilliantly acted.

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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

Lotta of the B - - - readers ddn't think the way they presented it made sense.

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Tyrion killed tywins wife. Tywin threatened to kill the love of tyrions life, stole her, made her betray him by testifying against him in the cruellest way, then started sleeping with her. A lannister pays his debts, I suppose.

Tyrion knew none of this, but he clearly planned on killing tywin immediately on his escape. Then when he saw shae there, he realized that he had to kill the woman who had tried to have him killed, before killing, bullying and humiliating the man who had bullied, humiliated and tried to kill him. Another lannister repaying debts.

Cersei chose her allegiance to tywin and joffrey over a one handed jamie when he returned. But when joffrey died, and tywin asked her to do more than she could take, she spurned her father and told him the truth about jamie and tommen. She was still choosing family over all else, just a different branch of the family tree.

Jamie is the only one who protected tyrion, protected joffrey as kings guard, loved his sister in every wah, and also agreed to his fathers demand that he go back to casterly rock and sire children with the last name lannister. He was and still is the true head of this disfunctional family. He seems like the logical choice as hand of the king, which is funny because he only has one hand.

Tommen is the king, and yet his one real act as king was to recuse himself from the tyrion trial. He doesn't know that jamie is his father, and he doesn't seem to mind the idea of banging his dead brothers widow. So I guess he inherited the ####ed up gene pretty good.

Margaery has the love of the people and she has the tyrell family money, but she has no claim to the throne or tommen except if cersei keeps up her end of the bargain they struck a couple episodes ago. Keeping bargains isn't really cerseis thing, but she needs the tyrell money, and margaery wants the throne, so negotiations should be ongoing. But if cersei ever figures out that it was grandma tyrell who offed joffrey, that could be bad, bad news.

Sir flower is now a free agent, and theres a recent vacancy in the bisexual swordsmen position in kings landing, so expect him to make a run at tommen. Just kidding, tim.

Brienne is pretty well worthless. arya doesn't want her, so now she's looking for sansa, but sansa has already picked her poison, too. So she's just roaming the countryside with her donkeyhogged serf acting serious and fighting with the best swordsmen in westeros.

Littlefinger offered to marry his high school crush's sister in return for her murdering jon arryn which brought ned stark to the capital, then worked with cersei to get robert killed, so ned would be named temporary guardian of the realm, and littlefinger could nakedly betray him so joffrey would kill him. Littlefinger also pushed for the murder of dany, before she became powerful, and arranged the murder of joffrey. Now he has sansa stark, plus a lot of money and whores. So, basically what tyrion had a season ago.

Jon snow is like the opposite of bo jackson.

Arya has mentored with ned stark, the first sword of bravos, tywin lannister, the assassin who killed three people for her, and the hound, but she blew off brienne in favor of a trip to bravos for some more murder training. Probably for the best as I don't think she has the size to fight like brienne.

Can someone explain how bran controlling hodor makes hodor a skilled fighter when bran was never a skilled fighter?

Please tell me that that little girl wasn't throwing lightning bolts and fireballs and that those were just molotov cocktails or grenades or something.

What was the deal with the little girl from the first scene in s1e1 with the bright blue eyes?

Mance seems like a pretty reasonable dude. Must be pretty loud though because he says enough bloodhed and everyone just stops fighting.

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Also, I hope you jerks are starting to respect Stannis. He is the rightful king. Tommen needs to step down.

Well, actually whomever marries Daenerys Targaryen is the rightful king. Robert Baratheon usurped the Throne, but the true, rightful heir is Daenerys.

but the targaeryns stole the throne by conquering westeros with dragons
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Call me strange in such a great episode but my favorite part was Varys hearing the bells and getting back on the ship and sitting quietly.

Yeah, I too thought that was really well acted and enjoyed it UNTIL I reflected a bit more that it didn't really make much sense. Here's why?

Tyrion kills Shae and Tywin then goes to Varys (who he knows is one of the two people helping him escape)

Varys sees Tyrion and immediately knows that something happened as he says "What have you done?" or something similar

So in order for us to make sense of Varys reaction to the bells we have to assume that Tyrion did NOTtell Varys that he killed Tywin. That doesn't sound like Tyrion to me. Doesn't sound like something he would fail to tell the man helping him escape. And even if Varys doesn't know that Tywin is dead (perhaps just wounded), it seems like Varys would be the first person they'd come find if Tyrion went missing. Interestingly, Tyrion killing Tywin (and thus Varys getting on that boat) is the best thing that could have happened to Jamie as it will point the finger solely/squarely AWAY from Jamie.

He knew when he heard the bells that Tywin had been found, and that there was no way he could get back into King's Landing without looking guilty. Resigned to his new fate, he turned around and got on the boat. Brilliantly acted.

probably right, in the aftermath they would probably have an impromptu small counsel meeting, and look, somebody is not at the castle....

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Tyrion killed tywins wife. Tywin threatened to kill the love of tyrions life, stole her, made her betray him by testifying against him in the cruellest way, then started sleeping with her. A lannister pays his debts, I suppose.

Tyrion knew none of this, but he clearly planned on killing tywin immediately on his escape. Then when he saw shae there, he realized that he had to kill the woman who had tried to have him killed, before killing, bullying and humiliating the man who had bullied, humiliated and tried to kill him. Another lannister repaying debts.

I'm not sure I agree with that. Why did he enter the room without a weapon? If I recall, he got the crossbow after killing Shae and was completely beside himself. I think that was the moment he decided to kill his dad.

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Tyrion killed tywins wife. Tywin threatened to kill the love of tyrions life, stole her, made her betray him by testifying against him in the cruellest way, then started sleeping with her. A lannister pays his debts, I suppose.

Tyrion knew none of this, but he clearly planned on killing tywin immediately on his escape. Then when he saw shae there, he realized that he had to kill the woman who had tried to have him killed, before killing, bullying and humiliating the man who had bullied, humiliated and tried to kill him. Another lannister repaying debts.

I'm not sure I agree with that. Why did he enter the room without a weapon? If I recall, he got the crossbow after killing Shae and was completely beside himself. I think that was the moment he decided to kill his dad.

this is how I read it too

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is it accepted as fact that Tyrion intended to kill Tywin before he saw Shea in his bed? Apologies if this was already explained, I didn't see it and some of you are citing this as fact. It seems the moment he decided to kill Tywin was after killing Shea and he looked at the crossbow on the wall. I have no clue why he went into his father's chamber in the first place, but the great point above from dparker is that everything changed for Tyrion as a character the moment he saw Shea in his father's bed.

had to go back and watch the last 10 minutes of the episode after reading the last few pages of this thread. I completely missed the part where Varys got on the ship after the bell. Nice catch you hounds. :thumbup:

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