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Official Johnny Manziel Thread (5 Viewers)

Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.

 
MAC_32 said:
dhockster said:
I don't know if Manziel is the answer or not, but if the Browns keep swapping out first round QB's so quickly, they will never find out.

If I were the Browns owner: Fire Pettine, Fire Farmer. Bring in a coach or wants to and can work with Johnny, someone who is not tied to a system, but will tailor a system around Johnny's strengths. Draft some help for Johnny on Offense. Give him a full season to prove himself (unless off the field problems continue to re-surface).
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Browns haven't used many 1st round QB's. Tim Couch withstanding, they all needed to be replaced too.
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That is the thing that most people miss. The only high pick the Browns have used drafting a QB was Tim Couch back in 1999. The other 'first round' QBs drafted, Brady Quinn, Brandon Weeden, and Johnny Manziel, were all late first round picks taken with 22nd picks.

Add Tim Couch had no chance to succeed with an expansion roster that lacked, OT Joe Thomas, C Alex Mack, TE Gary Barnidge, or even viable RBs like Crow/Duke or a speed WR like Travis Benjamin who can take the top off a D before factoring in the likely return of an NFL leading receiver like JG. Couch's starting WRs in 1999:

- Kevin Johnson

- Darrin Chiaverini

At tight end he had an old broken down.

- Irv Smith

His starting RB was:

- Abdul-Karim Al-Jabbar

I don't know if the QBs in this upcoming draft class hold legit franchise QB potential but the Browns haven't had franchise QB play since the return and even if Johnny has that sort of potential the ever present risk of an off-field incident means the team has to consider a QB with the top pick.

 
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dhockster said:
Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.
Click to expand...
I make this argument too, but there's a very strong counter - when the Browns don't pick QB they pick Justin Gilbert, Barkevious Mingo, Phil Taylor, etc. Joe Thomas, Joe Haden, and Alex Mack* are the only meaningful players to make it to their second contract in the last 10 years or so of drafting. When you draft badly your team will suck. When you draft badly and don't have a QB then you're the Browns.

 
MAC_32 said:
dhockster said:
Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.
Click to expand...
I make this argument too, but there's a very strong counter - when the Browns don't pick QB they pick Justin Gilbert, Barkevious Mingo, Phil Taylor, etc. Joe Thomas, Joe Haden, and Alex Mack* are the only meaningful players to make it to their second contract in the last 10 years or so of drafting. When you draft badly your team will suck. When you draft badly and don't have a QB then you're the Browns.
Click to expand...
Reasonable point. I guess if they do bring in a new GM, he just needs to evaluate what kind of QB the Browns can get where they pick, and whether he wants to give Johnny some more time or start fresh with someone new. Out of curiousity, when Cleveland traded the 4th pick 2 years ago, would they have taken Bortles if he fell to number 4?

 
MAC_32 said:
dhockster said:
Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.
Click to expand...
I make this argument too, but there's a very strong counter - when the Browns don't pick QB they pick Justin Gilbert, Barkevious Mingo, Phil Taylor, etc. Joe Thomas, Joe Haden, and Alex Mack* are the only meaningful players to make it to their second contract in the last 10 years or so of drafting. When you draft badly your team will suck. When you draft badly and don't have a QB then you're the Browns.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, but if they are unable to draft other positions what makes you think that they will get a QB right?

 
dhockster said:
I don't know if Manziel is the answer or not, but if the Browns keep swapping out first round QB's so quickly, they will never find out.

If I were the Browns owner: Fire Pettine, Fire Farmer. Bring in a coach or wants to and can work with Johnny, someone who is not tied to a system, but will tailor a system around Johnny's strengths. Draft some help for Johnny on Offense. Give him a full season to prove himself (unless off the field problems continue to re-surface).
Click to expand...
I have warmed up enough to Johnny to share this view.

 
tone1oc said:
MAC_32 said:
dhockster said:
Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.
Click to expand...
I make this argument too, but there's a very strong counter - when the Browns don't pick QB they pick Justin Gilbert, Barkevious Mingo, Phil Taylor, etc. Joe Thomas, Joe Haden, and Alex Mack* are the only meaningful players to make it to their second contract in the last 10 years or so of drafting. When you draft badly your team will suck. When you draft badly and don't have a QB then you're the Browns.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, but if they are unable to draft other positions what makes you think that they will get a QB right?
Click to expand...
I expect everything they do to not work.
 
MAC_32 said:
tone1oc said:
MAC_32 said:
dhockster said:
Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.
Click to expand...
I make this argument too, but there's a very strong counter - when the Browns don't pick QB they pick Justin Gilbert, Barkevious Mingo, Phil Taylor, etc. Joe Thomas, Joe Haden, and Alex Mack* are the only meaningful players to make it to their second contract in the last 10 years or so of drafting. When you draft badly your team will suck. When you draft badly and don't have a QB then you're the Browns.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, but if they are unable to draft other positions what makes you think that they will get a QB right?
Click to expand...
I expect everything they do to not work.
Click to expand...
9/10 Nihilists support Manziel as Browns QB in 2016

 
dhockster said:
MAC_32 said:
dhockster said:
Quinn in 2007 (1st)

McCoy in 2010 (3rd)

Weeden in 2012 (1st)

Manziel in 2014 (1st)

That's a lot of potential talent elsewhere going into the QB position. Throwing another high pick at QB in 2016 further robs the team of talent outside of QB.

Yes, QB is the most important position. But if the QB has bad talent around him that makes it harder for the QB to have success.
Click to expand...
I make this argument too, but there's a very strong counter - when the Browns don't pick QB they pick Justin Gilbert, Barkevious Mingo, Phil Taylor, etc. Joe Thomas, Joe Haden, and Alex Mack* are the only meaningful players to make it to their second contract in the last 10 years or so of drafting. When you draft badly your team will suck. When you draft badly and don't have a QB then you're the Browns.
Click to expand...
Reasonable point. I guess if they do bring in a new GM, he just needs to evaluate what kind of QB the Browns can get where they pick, and whether he wants to give Johnny some more time or start fresh with someone new. Out of curiousity, when Cleveland traded the 4th pick 2 years ago, would they have taken Bortles if he fell to number 4?
Click to expand...
I don't think so. If they stayed put I think it'd have been Sammy.
 
Made my title game despite my awful QB play all year. I have to be the only guy starting Johnny today. Over Ryan and Cutler.

Looking for him to go nuts in catchup mode.

 
dhockster said:
I don't know if Manziel is the answer or not, but if the Browns keep swapping out first round QB's so quickly, they will never find out.

If I were the Browns owner: Fire Pettine, Fire Farmer. Bring in a coach or wants to and can work with Johnny, someone who is not tied to a system, but will tailor a system around Johnny's strengths. Draft some help for Johnny on Offense. Give him a full season to prove himself (unless off the field problems continue to re-surface).
Click to expand...
Or do the Kirk Cousins thing and pick another promising QB to pair up with him. At a minimum Manziel needs the pressure.

 
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He makes real ugly throws but the dude is fun to watch. Chicken with his head cut off a few times today.

Love the rushing yards.

 
pantherclub said:
RBM said:
He makes real ugly throws but the dude is fun to watch. Chicken with his head cut off a few times today.

Love the rushing yards.
Click to expand...
he scored what 13 points?
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The wounded ducks and terrible foot work are a lot more concerning than this. His weapons are no better than what Eli is working with on SNF. This is what happens when you have a front office surrounding their qb with guys that don't score points.
 
Bracie Smathers said:
I don't know if the QBs in this upcoming draft class hold legit franchise QB potential but the Browns haven't had franchise QB play since the return and even if Johnny has that sort of potential the ever present risk of an off-field incident means the team has to consider a QB with the top pick.
Click to expand...
My guess is they're not going to have Joe Thomas and I would be afraid Mack follows him. Ya got that whole trade rumor that was pretty strong with many sources around the deadline and then recently Thomas said "I want to play for a winner." They gotta do something to try and keep Thomas (happy) and then Mack.

McCown seemed to do well with Johnny and I liked a lot of what I read about the two of them. Sometimes Pettine's comments were also favorable. He's under contract til 2017 and costs 2.5 or so to cut next year.

A 3rd QB can be picked up in week 1 usually and there's always Pryor.

They're gonna have to sit down with Joe T and since Tackles are at the top of the draft, I figure they are drafting one. Either he gets replaced or he gets a rook to teach.

I like the trenches in this draft and think all the lesser teams in the NFL need to try and figure out how to trade for more picks in round 1 and 2 to get as many as possible. It could be a very boring and big impact draft for the right team. Most every bad team seems to spend too much time rotating skill position players and never the all important linemen that pave the way for their success.

Adding a top CB, for the Browns version of Cro n Revis, with Haden would be interesting.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
dhockster said:
I don't know if Manziel is the answer or not, but if the Browns keep swapping out first round QB's so quickly, they will never find out.

If I were the Browns owner: Fire Pettine, Fire Farmer. Bring in a coach or wants to and can work with Johnny, someone who is not tied to a system, but will tailor a system around Johnny's strengths. Draft some help for Johnny on Offense. Give him a full season to prove himself (unless off the field problems continue to re-surface).
Click to expand...
Or do the Kirk Cousins thing and pick another promising QB to pair up with him. At a minimum Manziel needs the pressure.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure a rook is going to do a thing to McCown. If he can't beat out Manziel then that's a high pick spent for a 3rd stringer and then I'd be onto "Is Pryor better than him now as a panic QB?"

Browns can't afford to miss.

I think they get way more mileage out of a top T or DL

 
Bri said:
Bracie Smathers said:
I don't know if the QBs in this upcoming draft class hold legit franchise QB potential but the Browns haven't had franchise QB play since the return and even if Johnny has that sort of potential the ever present risk of an off-field incident means the team has to consider a QB with the top pick.
Click to expand...
My guess is they're not going to have Joe Thomas and I would be afraid Mack follows him. Ya got that whole trade rumor that was pretty strong with many sources around the deadline and then recently Thomas said "I want to play for a winner." They gotta do something to try and keep Thomas (happy) and then Mack.

McCown seemed to do well with Johnny and I liked a lot of what I read about the two of them. Sometimes Pettine's comments were also favorable. He's under contract til 2017 and costs 2.5 or so to cut next year.

A 3rd QB can be picked up in week 1 usually and there's always Pryor.

They're gonna have to sit down with Joe T and since Tackles are at the top of the draft, I figure they are drafting one. Either he gets replaced or he gets a rook to teach.

I like the trenches in this draft and think all the lesser teams in the NFL need to try and figure out how to trade for more picks in round 1 and 2 to get as many as possible. It could be a very boring and big impact draft for the right team. Most every bad team seems to spend too much time rotating skill position players and never the all important linemen that pave the way for their success.

Adding a top CB, for the Browns version of Cro n Revis, with Haden would be interesting.
Click to expand...
- Mack is the one whose contract is on a yearly basis that has a no-trade clause meaning we are completely at his mercy and he recently was asked if he would be back and he said 'He wanted to play for a winner.' Joe Thomas has said he wanted to stay with the team and be here when it turns around because he wanted to play for a winner but the emphasis was that he wanted to be with the Browns when they won.

- McCown has done well but he's in his mid thirties so you can't build around him. Pryor isn't an NFL QB, he's had multiple shots at it with different teams. Heck he's not an NFL WR but he's only been doing that for less than one year.

- Their isn't any quick fix for the team. They've blown the last six of seven first round picks. They need a legitimate blue chip GM first and foremost.

- The press-man scheme that Pettine learned from Rex isn't working. See Buffalo and their defensive meltdown this year but Rex is better at running the scheme than Pettine/O'Neil and Rex has far better personnel so its the scheme. It doesn't work in todays NFL.

 
Ohh I see, yeah I mixed the two up. Still losing Mack would be a blow to that OL

I just mean Pryor over a 3rd stringer

 
Who is taking these videos????? And why is it 10 seconds long?

So he went out with his texas family and friends on a bye week, and had a drink on xmas eve. That *******.

Maybe Pettine should just shut up and go out drinking with him instead.

They can talk about not being on the Browns anymore in a couple weeks

 
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This latest vid seems like the biggest non-story. They're drinking Four Loko listening to a pop song. Given that Mike Evans framed jersey is in the background he's presumably....oh jeebus what a stupid item, not even worth reporting.

 
BobbyLayne said:
This latest vid seems like the biggest non-story. They're drinking Four Loko listening to a pop song. Given that Mike Evans framed jersey is in the background he's presumably....oh jeebus what a stupid item, not even worth reporting.
Click to expand...
crap on a cracker how in sweet Jesus after everything that has happened can you consider this a "non-story"?Apologies if you are being sarcastic.

 
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Gee golly willickers, what in sam hell is that young lad doing videophoning himself talking in cadence to some weird sounding blues number? Johnny Unitas would never do that.

 
I get that there is absolutely nothing in that video that should really rile anybody up.

But at what point does a professional stop and say "I've gotten in so much trouble posting videos that maybe it would be a good idea to stop posting videos. I can keep having fun, just not show the world."

 
tone1oc said:
Gee golly willickers, what in sam hell is that young lad doing videophoning himself talking in cadence to some weird sounding blues number? Johnny Unitas would never do that.
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if you are narrow minded and compartmentalize these things then yeah it's no big deal. But when you look at the big picture and open your mind it's a rather easy situation to see.
 
pantherclub said:
tone1oc said:
Gee golly willickers, what in sam hell is that young lad doing videophoning himself talking in cadence to some weird sounding blues number? Johnny Unitas would never do that.
Click to expand...
if you are narrow minded and compartmentalize these things then yeah it's no big deal. But when you look at the big picture and open your mind it's a rather easy situation to see.
Click to expand...
He should get 10 paddles to his bare behind and then stand in the corner for 15 minutes. I certainly will not condone young adults posting vines of themselves doing nothing wrong.

 
tone1oc said:
pantherclub said:
tone1oc said:
Gee golly willickers, what in sam hell is that young lad doing videophoning himself talking in cadence to some weird sounding blues number? Johnny Unitas would never do that.
Click to expand...
if you are narrow minded and compartmentalize these things then yeah it's no big deal. But when you look at the big picture and open your mind it's a rather easy situation to see.
Click to expand...
He should get 10 paddles to his bare behind and then stand in the corner for 15 minutes. I certainly will not condone young adults posting vines of themselves doing nothing wrong.
Click to expand...
i know you are being obtuse intentionally. If not I question how you tie your shoes.
 
tone1oc said:
pantherclub said:
tone1oc said:
Gee golly willickers, what in sam hell is that young lad doing videophoning himself talking in cadence to some weird sounding blues number? Johnny Unitas would never do that.
Click to expand...
if you are narrow minded and compartmentalize these things then yeah it's no big deal. But when you look at the big picture and open your mind it's a rather easy situation to see.
Click to expand...
He should get 10 paddles to his bare behind and then stand in the corner for 15 minutes. I certainly will not condone young adults posting vines of themselves doing nothing wrong.
Click to expand...
This.

I get that there are a ton of people that are ready to pile on the kid, but this video is a complete non issue. Manziel is by no means perfect, and has had a couple of hiccups along the way. He still needs to mature, but this video in any picture big or small is really not a big deal.

 
Can't believe an adult had an adult beverage during his week off on Christmas Eve. Unbeleivable!!!!

 
13/32/136/0/1/40.6.

Well we can be sure his drinking doesn't affect his on field performance. Pettine just hates people having fun on Christmas Eve. He's a a pro football head coach who has nothing better to do than be a judgmental jerk trying to punish behavior he just doesn't personally like. Yeah that's it.

 
Yet another video of Johnny Manziel partying has emerged, this one apparently taken from Christmas Eve, that would appear to be the kind of thing the Cleveland Browns told him not to do.

Busted Coverage posted the video — all 10 seconds of it — on its Instagram site showing Manziel appearing to drink Four Loko, an alcoholic energy drink, along with a friend, while dancing and rapping.

Browns head coach Mike Pettine hadn't seen the video when he spoke with Cleveland-area media on Monday, and he said that Manziel could be benched in the 2015 season finale and that the "repercussions would be harsh" if his quarterback is found to be in violation of his agreement with the team.

The team told Manziel previously it wanted no more social media videos of Manziel partying, and that appears to be exactly what this was.
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I've been pretty supportive of JM and wanted to see him do well. But if the above is true, if the team expressly told him not to do this very thing, and he turned around and did it, then I truly have to believe he has issues. Big issues. Issues that make this a huge red flag.

 
DallasDMac said:
Yet another video of Johnny Manziel partying has emerged, this one apparently taken from Christmas Eve, that would appear to be the kind of thing the Cleveland Browns told him not to do.

Busted Coverage posted the video all 10 seconds of it on its Instagram site showing Manziel appearing to drink Four Loko, an alcoholic energy drink, along with a friend, while dancing and rapping.

Browns head coach Mike Pettine hadn't seen the video when he spoke with Cleveland-area media on Monday, and he said that Manziel could be benched in the 2015 season finale and that the "repercussions would be harsh" if his quarterback is found to be in violation of his agreement with the team.

The team told Manziel previously it wanted no more social media videos of Manziel partying, and that appears to be exactly what this was.
Click to expand...
I've been pretty supportive of JM and wanted to see him do well. But if the above is true, if the team expressly told him not to do this very thing, and he turned around and did it, then I truly have to believe he has issues. Big issues. Issues that make this a huge red flag.
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His biggest issue is that he's not a good quarterback. 40 pp adder rating again and only 13 points. He just doesn't have it. The fact that he's an idiot and can't stop partying and is dumb enough to keep having himself recorded, is just gravy. If he was a decent player, it might be overlooked.
 
Otis said:
Can't believe an adult had an adult beverage during his week off on Christmas Eve. Unbeleivable!!!!
Click to expand...
Agreed, no big deal... unless you have a DRINKING PROBLEM. People that have issues with when-to-say-when and go through rehab for these problems probably should not drink again.

 
Yeah, if he's an addict/alcoholic, which many sources seem to claim. Him being off the wagon is big deal, and one of, if not the biggest reasons he sucks as an NFL QB. A non addict posting this? Absolute non issue, for an addict? Yeah, it's time to go back to rehab Johnn. I think he has what it takes to stick in the league for a long time, but his drinking will pretty much kill any shot at that happening.

Time will tell, of course, but right now, assuming nothing changes and the enabling continues, this is going to be a short ride in the big leagues for this cat. I hope he can prove all the naysayers wrong, but I'm pretty much convinced at this point that everything in his life needs to be changed before that happens.

Edit: I know he has a PR team already churning out the excuses and trying to spin this any way they can, but at some point even the best of the best can't polish a turd. Given what they are being paid, however, they will Damn sure try!

 
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I wonder if he's going to act 12 and lie right to his coach's face again. Maybe tell him that was last Christmas. Or it wasn't him in the video.

Although there's a good chance Petine benches him again for being a moron, I hope he starts this week. He's gotten worse with each of his three starts since his last benching. He's liable to get cut at halftime.

 
pantherclub said:
BobbyLayne said:
This latest vid seems like the biggest non-story. They're drinking Four Loko listening to a pop song. Given that Mike Evans framed jersey is in the background he's presumably....oh jeebus what a stupid item, not even worth reporting.
Click to expand...
crap on a cracker how in sweet Jesus after everything that has happened can you consider this a "non-story"?Apologies if you are being sarcastic.
Click to expand...
Yeah, maybe a smidge. I'll just repost this, it will also hold true in 2016 and any other years he remains in the news before he fades away into obscurity.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/685245-official-manziel-back-as-a-starter-once-again/?p=18575891

 
Dizzy said:
Otis said:
Can't believe an adult had an adult beverage during his week off on Christmas Eve. Unbeleivable!!!!
Click to expand...
Agreed, no big deal... unless you have a DRINKING PROBLEM. People that have issues with when-to-say-when and go through rehab for these problems probably should not drink again.
Click to expand...
first of all, there is no evidence that your conclusion is true. and secondly, its not a certainty that he has a drinking problem. going to rehab does not prove he has a problem.

 
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