What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Christine Michael Volume 3: Inevitable Greatness Soon Achieved (5 Viewers)

I disagree (respectfully) with the idea that Rawls is automatically the lead back.  The numbers you left our Hoop were the actual yardage.  I realize the touches do mean something here, but I think the only thing they really mean to me is that they are using week 1 (and probably week 2) to get Rawls additional work.  He ran hard but that didn't translate into actual production.  Yes, Michael had a few bad plays but overall I'm not going to moan about his production.  The Rawls stuff looked forced as evident by having 12 touches in 22 snaps.

We're going to need to rely even more on the running game with Russell being banged up.  I'm hoping we have a heavy dose of Michael and Rawls instead of the 43 passes we saw from Wilson last Sunday.  I think this is going to be a nightmare game for us, as is all Rams games.

And to be perfectly clear, I really hope I'm wrong and that Rawls is all that everyone thinks he is.  I just can't assume that last year's stats will be automatic since Rawls didn't start the season.  There's something to coming in fresh after everyone else is worn down.  Again, I hope I'm wrong.

 
Rawls is the man.  I don't doubt it.  The question is, how much he is recovered from that injury and can he still be as productive as we have seen.  If he falters or re-aggravates or loses a step, the situation could evolve.

 
Hooper31 said:
Chew on this: 

Michael was in game for 52 snaps. Got 15 carries and 2 receptions.
Rawls was in game for 22 snaps. Got 12 carries and 3 receptions. 

Michael got 2 more touches in 30 more snaps. Rawls is the man in Seattle when fully healthy. Coach Pete said this last week that this game was sort of like preseason week 2 for Rawls. 
Click to expand...
I think it's way too early to tell how this is going to shake out, particularly because Rawls missed almost the entire offseason program.  It is very easy to envision Rawls carving out a bigger role as he rounds into shape (no guys getting into football shape doesn't happen in the last two weeks of TC after missing the rest of the offseason program).

However I think you are making a spurious conclusion about what you asked us to chew on.  Seems to me it means that the Seahawks showed a surprising amount of faith in Michael to act as the pass protector/outlet on many, most, of those extra snaps.  Personally I view it as a positive indicator for Michael and how the team views him.

 
Hooper31 said:
I don't disagree. My opinion and what the stats say are meaningless in comparison to the words and actions coach Pete. 
Click to expand...
Haven't most of the words and actions coming out of Seattle this off-season, particularly since TC, been glowing in regards to Michael?  I rarely take comments from coaches with too much seriousness but the entire staff was positively gushing about Michael once training camp started.

 
Chaka said:
I think it's way too early to tell how this is going to shake out, particularly because Rawls missed almost the entire offseason program.  It is very easy to envision Rawls carving out a bigger role as he rounds into shape (no guys getting into football shape doesn't happen in the last two weeks of TC after missing the rest of the offseason program).

However I think you are making a spurious conclusion about what you asked us to chew on.  Seems to me it means that the Seahawks showed a surprising amount of faith in Michael to act as the pass protector/outlet on many, most, of those extra snaps.  Personally I view it as a positive indicator for Michael and how the team views him.
Click to expand...
I don't see it this way. Who were they going to rely on for pass protection/outlet besides Michael, if Rawls isn't yet in "football shape"? Rookie RBs?

 
As a Michael owner, I have been in the camp that the job is wide open that Carroll wasn't 100% married to the idea that Rawls had to be his starter. But that being said, I think that Michael needs to show that he is the better back and that the 'Hawks can't afford to keep him on the bench.  Although I thought he played well against Miami, I don't think that 71 yards on 17 touches is enough to convince anyone that he needs to be in there. I believe that Rawls was #1 on the depth chart going into the season and Michael is going to have to make a bigger statement than that if he intends to change that.

 
Just Win Baby said:
I don't see it this way. Who were they going to rely on for pass protection/outlet besides Michael, if Rawls isn't yet in "football shape"? Rookie RBs?
Click to expand...
The argument is that Rawls touched the ball on a higher percentage of his snaps therefore they like him more.  Seems to me that pass protection requires less football shape and more football smarts.  So why didn't they use Rawls more in those situations?  Not necessarily because they don't trust him, it might even be because they want to ease him back so they have him for the long haul. But regardless of the why he was limited there it seems like an obvious statement that they do trust Michael.

Again, I absolutely see Rawls snap counts and touches increasing going forward but it isn't out of the realm of possibility to see Michael not only capping Rawls upside but maybe turning this into a legitimate timeshare where we don't know who will see more action from week to week.  All the reports going into this season were positively effusive about Michael and now we have some solid on field production to back that up.

 
While it's possible this turns into a timeshare, I don't expect it. That was more touches than I expected Rawls to get coming back from a serious injury, missed preseason, and an illness.

Carroll seems to like leaning on one guy.  And Rawls has been the better back in all phases. Christine Michael looked much IMPROVED from late last year and this preseason but I don't think he's looked as good as Rawls did last year.  And Rawls hasn't had to "regain that trust".  

 
btemp said:
While it's possible this turns into a timeshare, I don't expect it. That was more touches than I expected Rawls to get coming back from a serious injury, missed preseason, and an illness.

Carroll seems to like leaning on one guy.  And Rawls has been the better back in all phases. Christine Michael looked much IMPROVED from late last year and this preseason but I don't think he's looked as good as Rawls did last year.  And Rawls hasn't had to "regain that trust".  
Click to expand...
MOP's tea leaves fall in line with some of your thoughts in this post. 

-Rawls had at least 1 big game last season, he was doing to Lynch what Ware is doing to Charles in a way. Different but some similarities. Rawls though is young and I think he just isn't quite back 100% or in real football shape just yet.  I don't own him, no dog in the fight. 

-Michael was cut, signed, cut, signed, then back to Seattle after a Dallas team desperate for an injection last season got nothing. I like him but we still haven't seen that signature game where he can carry the load and make people forget about others in uniform, he doesn't really do that. 

It's an RBBC for sure right now, anyone who breaks a big gain or has a hot hand finding the holes will see more touches on a week to week basis but I feel like we are seeing the best Michael will give you, not the best that Rawls can give so I am thinking the ceiling on Rawls by Week 4-5 should be higher. I would trade 4 RAWLS and try to trade away Michael and that's exactly what a savvy owner in my league did this past week.

Good post, interesting thread, try and keep an open mind, I don't think I have a firm grip on this situation though. 

 
LT-Okung...downgrade Seattle, upgrade for Denver, seems like a big piece went to another team and while I am sure you all have some great prospects coming along and you can point to a few things but IMO his absence is being felt so far. 

The pot'o'gold at the end of the rainbow might not be there, don't chase the situation is all I'm saying. Might be RBBC or even RB1/50-60% of the touches but still just get a so so return is all I'm saying. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
LT-Okung...downgrade Seattle, upgrade for Denver, seems like a big piece went to another team and while I am sure you all have some great prospects coming along and you can point to a few things but IMO his absence is being felt so far. 

The pot'o'gold at the end of the rainbow might not be there, don't chase the situation is all I'm saying. Might be RBBC or even RB1/50-60% of the touches but still just get a so so return is all I'm saying. 
Click to expand...
Agreed, but I can all but guarantee Okung will get injured exactly when Denver needs him most.  The bigger issue for the line was Germain Ifedi going down three days before the game.  Things will get better when he's back in the lineup.  Not perfect, better.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
-Michael was cut, signed, cut, signed, then back to Seattle after a Dallas team desperate for an injection last season got nothing. I like him but we still haven't seen that signature game where he can carry the load
Click to expand...
Last season 
at  Arizona  17-102, 6.0 ypc.
And in the Playoff game at Minnesota had 21 carries for 70 yards.

That's 2 games where he "carried the load". They won both games



 


 


 


 






 
Last edited by a moderator:
The Man With No Name said:
Last season 
at  Arizona  17-102, 6.0 ypc.
And in the Playoff game at Minnesota had 21 carries for 70 yards.

They won both games



 


 


 


 
Click to expand...
Good points, they were more towards the end of the season, I'm always a little nervous about stats in the last few weeks of the season when a lot of different players are earning snaps thru injuries and such. 

Still, MN and AZ are good teams, not sure 21/70 does much for me though. He isn't tearing it up to the point they have to put him on the field the way some backs push for playing time. 

Still a little more sizzle than steak for me. 

 
Prosise also got injured. He would have received a few of those snaps/carries. 

I think we did not see the full game plan due to his injury. 

 
I've been trying to trade him for two weeks. No takers. I knew this was coming......now he's just a handcuff. If he keeps out playing Rawls he'll eat into his workload but that's a lot to ask. 

 
Good bye again old friend. I look forward to when your career is over so this thread only gets bumped when you're coaching your old high school team after years of on the field mediocrity.

 
Milkman said:
I've been trying to trade him for two weeks. No takers. I knew this was coming......now he's just a handcuff. If he keeps out playing Rawls he'll eat into his workload but that's a lot to ask. 
Click to expand...
a valuable handcuff worth rostering though.  seattle cut him last year in favor of Rawls, i'm not surprised Rawls is being named starter over him this year too.

 
LaFours said:
Rawls owner, bought Michael, not really on the cheap. Cost me Emmanuel Sanders. 
Click to expand...
I bought for Jay Ajayi before season started. I felt like the guy in the Sopranos who thought to borrow $10k from Vito when he came back to town following his stint with Johnny Cakes in Vermont. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Seahawks OC Darrell Bevell said Thomas Rawls "embodies who we want to be" on offense.
"He's a physical runner. He's got the style that we look for, the tenacity that we look for," Bevell said. "As long as he's healthy, he's that guy." The strong comments explain why Rawls will start this week despite being outplayed by Christine Michael in the season opener. Both players should have a role moving forward, but it looks like Rawls will be the clear starter.
Click to expand...
Tried to tell you guys this.

 
Hooper31 said:
I don't own either, but I watched every snap of every Seattle game since 1981. I think I have a feel for what's going on with this team.

I'm telling you you're wrong. If Rawls is healthy he will lead the Seahawks in carries. Every indication from the coaches backs this up. Everything we're seeing backs this up. Further, I'm wondering if you "watched" the game. Did you see Michael fall asleep and have a pass hit him in the shoulder when Wilson was under pressure? Did you see Rawls finishing runs? Rawls is the man going forward. Michael will get carries, and I'm happy about that. 

Chew on this: 

Michael was in game for 52 snaps. Got 15 carries and 2 receptions.
Rawls was in game for 22 snaps. Got 12 carries and 3 receptions. 

Michael got 2 more touches in 30 more snaps. Rawls is the man in Seattle when fully healthy. Coach Pete said this last week that this game was sort of like preseason week 2 for Rawls. 
Click to expand...
Hooper's been on it.

 
This should come as no surprise.  Based on his performance last season, Rawls seems likes an ideal fit for this offense.  That is no knock on Michael, who has shown he can carry the load if called upon.  Michael may continue to find a role behind Rawls, although Rawls should be the workhorse, and Prosise could carve out a role himself.  It is possible that Rawls does not return to form, so watch this over the next few weeks.  Additionally, Rawls' punishing running style could lead to additional injuries for him, making his handcuff especially valuable.  I really like what we have seen from Michael, and I think he is a definite hold, especially in dynasty, but I am keeping sight of Alex Collins as well.

 
C-Mike had his chance to assert himself as the lead running back and he failed. I'm not surprised the Hawks are going back to Rawls. Once he feels 100%, the job belongs to him again.

 
Wonderllama said:
C-Mike had his chance to assert himself as the lead running back and he failed. I'm not surprised the Hawks are going back to Rawls. Once he feels 100%, the job belongs to him again.
Click to expand...
They didn't really give him the opportunity, between force feeding Rawls and Wilson throwing a career-high 43 times (all while C-Mike was averaging 4.4 a carry).  

 
Wonderllama said:
C-Mike had his chance to assert himself as the lead running back and he failed. I'm not surprised the Hawks are going back to Rawls. Once he feels 100%, the job belongs to him again.
Click to expand...
I don't think he had a chance at all.  Rarely do NFL organizations make decisions based on one game. 

 
This was always Rawls job it seems. There's still a chance C-Mike continues to outplay him but, at least on the surface, it's seems it's Rawls job to lose. 

 
Milkman said:
This was always Rawls job it seems. There's still a chance C-Mike continues to outplay him but, at least on the surface, it's seems it's Rawls job to lose. 
Click to expand...


This is Rawls job no doubt. He is potentially a top-10 NFL RB and we saw clear evidence of that last year. 

As far as CMike. He is who we thought he was. He may be running better but he is still a boneheaded idiot and I think this has contributed to the comments from coaches this week strongly endorsing Rawls as the clear bell-cow. Not surprisingly,  Michael chose the game winning drive to show us all how clearly he thinks on the field. At the 2:14 mark of the 4th quarter, Wilson fades back to pass. Michael is in pass pro and lays a crushing block on a blitzing safety. He is so enamored with his block that he stands and taunts the guy. Meanwhile, Wilson dumps the ball off to Michael and, since Michael isn't interested in the actual play going on (only his block), the ball clangs harmlessly off his helmet. Had he caught the ball he probably could have picked up some good yardage. 

 
ourmanflint said:
This is Rawls job no doubt. He is potentially a top-10 NFL RB and we saw clear evidence of that last year. 

As far as CMike. He is who we thought he was. He may be running better but he is still a boneheaded idiot and I think this has contributed to the comments from coaches this week strongly endorsing Rawls as the clear bell-cow. Not surprisingly,  Michael chose the game winning drive to show us all how clearly he thinks on the field. At the 2:14 mark of the 4th quarter, Wilson fades back to pass. Michael is in pass pro and lays a crushing block on a blitzing safety. He is so enamored with his block that he stands and taunts the guy. Meanwhile, Wilson dumps the ball off to Michael and, since Michael isn't interested in the actual play going on (only his block), the ball clangs harmlessly off his helmet. Had he caught the ball he probably could have picked up some good yardage. 
Click to expand...
Yeah there's enough evidence now that I'm pretty confident in saying he'll never realized his potential. Still think the people in this thread that saw potential greatness on the tape, myself included, weren't wrong. He has the skill set and could be a great RB in this league but he's simply to immature.

I see a scenario where he gets cut soon. He's likely not going to take the demotion lighty and could easily start acting out in frustration. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Won't be popular judging from the last few pages, but Rawls doesn't look right.  He moves like he's running in tar.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 6 (members: 0, guests: 6)
Top