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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (18 Viewers)

gianmarco said:
You're clearly not the only one. 

All I can tell you is this.  When going in to evaluate someone that has actual respiratory illness (cough/fever) and possible/suspected COVID, I'm not wearing an N95 mask.  That's in an enclosed space with likely infection and active coughing and right next to them (< 6 ft).  Simple surgical mask and eye protection along with gown and gloves.  And it's not due to lack of N95 where I am as I have it available. 

And it's certainly not because I'm taking COVID lightly.  If medical providers aren't even using N95 masks during actual interactions with this disease, then not sure how else you'd be convinced that you just don't need it walking down the aisle of a grocery store, even if someone just sneezed or coughed near you (i.e. > 6 ft away).  If you're that concerned about someone sneezing near you, just walk in the other direction for a few minutes (even though it's not necessary). 
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Thank you for your work with patients - anyone working in the health field has chosen an important and meaningful career and has my respect.

One good thing that will come out of this is that for the rest of our lives, everyone experiencing this event right now will have a heightened respect and appreciation for medical professionals.

In regards to mask guidance and C19, we've already seen steadily evolving guidance from the Federal Government and from the CDC, and I'm quite sure that guidance will continue to change as we go forward and learn more.

Sneezes in particular are my greatest concern; some people (e.g. my wife :hot: ) sneeze suddenly and unexpectedly. 

While out in public, you often don't know if someone has recently sneezed in the space you are now occupying, e.g. a grocery store aisle.

How much risk is there in walking down an aisle 30 seconds (or 60, or 120) after someone sneezed in that space?... for me, the answer is: I don't know, but I do know it's not zero and it may well be a higher risk than people currently realize.

This is literally the first search result I got when I googled Sneeze Aerosol :  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4676262/

The abstract of their results are below, I highlighted the parts that indicate to me that it is not unreasonable to wear an N95 mask while shopping in a supermarket during a pandemic.

The question of whether influenza is transmitted to a significant degree by aerosols remains controversial, in part, because little is known about the quantity and size of potentially infectious airborne particles produced by people with influenza. In this study, the size and amount of aerosol particles produced by nine subjects during coughing were measured while they had influenza and after they had recovered, using a laser aerosol particle spectrometer with a size range of 0.35 to 10 μm. Individuals with influenza produce a significantly greater volume of aerosol when ill compared with afterward (p = 0.0143). When the patients had influenza, their average cough aerosol volume was 38.3 picoliters (pL) of particles per cough (SD 43.7); after patients recovered, the average volume was 26.4 pL per cough (SD 45.6). The number of particles produced per cough was also higher when subjects had influenza (average 75,400 particles/cough, SD 97,300) compared with afterward (average 52,200, SD 98,600), although the difference did not reach statistical significance (p = 0.1042). The average number of particles expelled per cough varied widely from patient to patient, ranging from 900 to 302,200 particles/cough while subjects had influenza and 1100 to 308,600 particles/cough after recovery. When the subjects had influenza, an average of 63% of each subject's cough aerosol particle volume in the detection range was in the respirable size fraction (SD 22%), indicating that these particles could reach the alveolar region of the lungs if inhaled by another person. This enhancement in aerosol generation during illness may play an important role in influenza transmission and suggests that a better understanding of this phenomenon is needed to predict the production and dissemination of influenza-laden aerosols by people infected with this virus.

 
waiver wire said:
Best case scenario for Canada is July from a government document

This is the 1st timeline I have heard from any federal government source 
Trudeau has been avoiding answering this question directly 
Click to expand...
No modern economy could handle that type of shut down I just don’t see how that’s possible. And I’ve been a guy who’s been a head of the information curve on this and a big fan of social distancing but you literally can’t shut down an economy for four months. 

 
IvanKaramazov said:
I can't believe we're still doing the "I had this in November" thing.  No you didn't.  For hell's sake, people.
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I "think" I had it in the third week of Feb. Had a flu that started in the lungs, was all aches and fever for 4 days, with a semi-dry cough (slight congestion, but not that much). Then I started feeling better, but my lungs didn't feel right for two weeks afterwards. To cap it off, two days before I started feeling sick, I went to a concert (2/21) with a friend who was in South Korea the day before (right before it exploded there). Somewhat oddly, my wife did not catch whatever I had. 

 
mr roboto said:
No modern economy could handle that type of shut down I just don’t see how that’s possible. And I’ve been a guy who’s been a head of the information curve on this and a big fan of social distancing but you literally can’t shut down an economy for four months. 
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I don't disagree with anything you wrote 
from what I have heard from the federal and provincial governments press conferences I assumed 100% April definitely shutdown and was 80% sure May would be closed up as well so June would be best case scenario IMHO 
With Ford announcing no public events in Ontario until July and now this article makes me way more concerned 

 
[icon] said:
I have no doubt we are looking at 4th of July at the earliest for things to even begin to really loosen here 
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I assumed June

but with the announcement out of Ontario , no public events until july and now this article 

a logical assumption is now July is more likely for a somewhat normal life with still many precautions and rules in place  

 
mr roboto said:
When do people start thinking about forgetting whatever they used to do and focusing on what the world may look like after the fact?
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Yea even if we get some kind of all-clear I’m just gonna be sitting here. Can’t imagine when I get back to go out to restaurants or my god sporting events. 

 
cosjobs said:
So sorry. I meant to click on the sad emoji. 

Funny, I just sent a PM to another poster had obviously made the same error reacting to a different tragic post, yesterday. 

He was as embarrassed as I am now.
Click to expand...
Might already have been posted, but you can change an emoji after you’ve posted it. Just click back on it and change it to what was intended.

 
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Capella said:
Yea even if we get some kind of all-clear I’m just gonna be sitting here. Can’t imagine when I get back to go out to restaurants or my god sporting events. 
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I’ve got second row GnR tickets at Met Life in July. Wondering if that may not even happen at this point. 
:sadbanana:

 
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Capella said:
I’m on my phone and can’t read that — too small. Would you mind summarizing?
Click to expand...
Key findings: For the 62 COVID-19 patients, 46.8% (29 of 62) were male and 53.2% (33 of 62) were female, the mean age was 44.7 (15.3) years.
 

No difference in the age and sex distribution between the control group and the HCQ group. But for TTCR, the body temperature recovery time and the cough remission time were significantly shortened in the HCQ treatment group.

Besides, a larger proportion of patients with improved pneumonia in the HCQ treatment group (80.6%, 25 of 31) compared with the control group (54.8%, 17 of 31).

Notably, all 4 patients progressed to severe illness that occurred in the control group. However, there were 2 patients with mild adverse reactions in the HCQ treatment group.

 
Politician Spock said:
I think a lot of people on unemployment are already thinking that.

It's the people that haven't been laid off yet that aren't... but should be. 
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I mean societally. Not just vocationally. 
 

Like we are possibly entering a completely different economy if we shut down for 90 days. Totally different buying patterns. Completely different consumer demands. 

 
Capella said:
I’m on my phone and can’t read that — too small. Would you mind summarizing?
Click to expand...
Shortened the duration of symptoms of cough and fever, as well as pulmonary inflammation: cut from study:
 

The data in this study revealed that after 5 days of HCQ treatment, the symptoms of patients with COVID-19 were significantly relieved, manifesting as shorten in the recovery time for cough and fever. At the same time, a larger proportion of patients with pulmonary inflammatory has been partially absorbed in the HCQ treatment group, indicating the immune modulation and anti-inflammatory properties of HCQ in non-malarial diseases [17]. At present, the multiple actions of HCQ such as regulation in pro-inflammatory cytokines [e.g. Tumor necrosis factor- (TNF- ), interleukin-1 (IL-1), interleukin-1 (IL-6)], antioxidant activities, also promote it widely performed in rheumatic diseases such as SLE [11,17]. According to current research, a higher pro-inflammatory cytokine storm existed in COVID-19 patients with a severe or critical illness, eventually affected the prognosis [18]. For this, IL-6 antibody blocker, transfusion of convalescent plasma, and other therapies have been applied to counteract the cytokine storm [19,20]. Therefore, with antiviral and autoimmune regulation effects, HCQ should be a protector in SARS-CoV-2 infection. In the present study, the reduced risk of progression to severe illness in patients with HCQ treatment also explained the intervention effect of HCQ on the pathological process of the COVID-19

 
Whyatt said:
Shortened the duration of symptoms of cough and fever, as well as pulmonary inflammation: cut from study:
 

The data in this study revealed that after 5 days of HCQ treatment, the symptoms of patients with COVID-19 were significantly relieved, manifesting as shorten in the recovery time for cough and fever. At the same time, a larger proportion of patients with pulmonary inflammatory has been partially absorbed in the HCQ treatment group, indicating the immune modulation and anti-inflammatory properties of HCQ in non-malarial diseases [17]. At present, the multiple actions of HCQ such as regulation in pro-inflammatory cytokines [e.g. Tumor necrosis factor- (TNF- ), interleukin-1 (IL-1), interleukin-1 (IL-6)], antioxidant activities, also promote it widely performed in rheumatic diseases such as SLE [11,17]. According to current research, a higher pro-inflammatory cytokine storm existed in COVID-19 patients with a severe or critical illness, eventually affected the prognosis [18]. For this, IL-6 antibody blocker, transfusion of convalescent plasma, and other therapies have been applied to counteract the cytokine storm [19,20]. Therefore, with antiviral and autoimmune regulation effects, HCQ should be a protector in SARS-CoV-2 infection. In the present study, the reduced risk of progression to severe illness in patients with HCQ treatment also explained the intervention effect of HCQ on the pathological process of the COVID-19
Click to expand...
Sounds great. Thanks you and Icon. 

 
mr roboto said:
I mean societally. Not just vocationally. 
 

Like we are possibly entering a completely different economy if we shut down for 90 days. Totally different buying patterns. Completely different consumer demands. 
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Absolutely.

First of all, behavior is going to change. Some people will, like Cappy said, avoid sporting events and other big crowds. What percentage of people? I don't know, but at least 10%, which will be a significant loss for those venues. 

Second of all, even if the stimulus replaces every dollar everyone lost, that doesn't mean people will return to their spending habits. People are more likely to save for a rainy day now, especially given how few people were doing it before. So even shopping on Amazon, where these is no crowds, is going to take a hit as people buy less and save more. 

There is absolutely no way the economy will be anywhere near what it was before when it is turned back on. Could take years to get back to those levels. Many businesses are going to retract their locations, resulting in a ton of empty commercial space, and more importantly the loss of those jobs that were there. 

 
:lol:  FFS

Pentagon says it still hasn't sent ventilators because it hasn't been told where to send them

Washington (CNN)Despite having committed to transferring 2,000 ventilators in military stocks to the Federal Emergency Management Agency and the Department of Health and Human Services to fight the coronavirus outbreak, the Pentagon has not shipped any of them because the agencies have not asked for them or provided a shipping location, the Pentagon's top logistics official said Tuesday.

In order to ship the badly needed equipment, the Defense Department has to be given a location to send them by civilian authorities who have to decide where the items are most needed.

"There was discussion with HHS on where to send them. And then they said hey wait, we're trying to take a look at the demand that's required, and so we were asked to just wait while there was just some sorting through on that. And I won't speak on behalf of them, but we were in a position to provide 2,000," said Lt. General Giovanni Tuck.

Tuck said he had no details on the HHS decisions, but added that "we haven't provided any, because as of last night, we were asked to just hold on the ones that we have, and then we will push them when they're ready for them."

 
Politician Spock said:
Absolutely.

First of all, behavior is going to change. Some people will, like Cappy said, avoid sporting events and other big crowds. What percentage of people? I don't know, but at least 10%, which will be a significant loss for those venues. 

Second of all, even if the stimulus replaces every dollar everyone lost, that doesn't mean people will return to their spending habits. People are more likely to save for a rainy day now, especially given how few people were doing it before. So even shopping on Amazon, where these is no crowds, is going to take a hit as people buy less and save more. 

There is absolutely no way the economy will be anywhere near what it was before when it is turned back on. Could take years to get back to those levels. Many businesses are going to retract their locations, resulting in a ton of empty commercial space, and more importantly the loss of those jobs that were there. 
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I predict a flight to quality, local, healthy and family based consumerism. 

 
waiver wire said:
Best case scenario for Canada is July from a government document

This is the 1st timeline I have heard from any federal government source 
Trudeau has been avoiding answering this question directly 
Click to expand...


mr roboto said:
No modern economy could handle that type of shut down I just don’t see how that’s possible. And I’ve been a guy who’s been a head of the information curve on this and a big fan of social distancing but you literally can’t shut down an economy for four months. 
Click to expand...


Why not, most people work in "useless" industries. Energy sector is 4% of the workforce, agriculture is 11%, 1% of the population is truck drivers. A few more small percent for other jobs such as linesmen, water treatment, etc.

In the short term we could survive as a country with only 25% of the workforce.

 
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MTskibum said:
Why not, most people work in "useless" industries. Energy sector is 4% of the workforce, agriculture is 11%, 1% of the population is truck drivers. A few more small percent for other jobs such as linesmen, water treatment, etc.

In the short term we could survive as a country with only 25% of the workforce.
Click to expand...
Um... seriously?

Survive, maybe. But 75% unemployment?

 
mr roboto said:
Um... seriously?

Survive, maybe. But 75% unemployment?
Click to expand...


For the short term, 2-6 months, yeah.

So you do not get the new 4k big screen TV for your second living room, the "old" football stadium in your city will need to do, when your iphone 10 breaks you will need to swap your sim card into an older phone stashed away in your closet, etc.

Most people work in service or in industries that are non-essential for the short term.

 
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MTskibum said:
For the short term, 2-6 months, yeah.

So you do not get the new 4k big screen TV for your second living room, the "old" football stadium in your city will need to do, when your iphone 10 breaks you will need to swap your sim card into an older phone stashed away in your closet, etc.

Most people work in service or in industries that are non-essential for the short term.
Click to expand...
Yeah I get it. 
 

But the 75% spend money on the 25%. I don’t think you understand how a modern economy works. 

 
Capella said:
Yea even if we get some kind of all-clear I’m just gonna be sitting here. Can’t imagine when I get back to go out to restaurants or my god sporting events. 
Click to expand...
South Carolina wanting the cash for season CFB tickets and I'm looking at it like:  we all know this season isn't happening, right?

 
waiver wire said:
Best case scenario for Canada is July from a government document

This is the 1st timeline I have heard from any federal government source 
Trudeau has been avoiding answering this question directly 
Click to expand...
I don’t really see any scenario where we go “back to normal” before there is either a vaccine or a very dependable treatment plan for those infected.  Best case is July.  Without a vaccine or the ability to significantly reduce the death rate, I’m going to continue quarantining as long as it takes.   If it takes 12-18 months, so be it.

 
Non-China Reported Cases

2/7 - 277 reported cases

2/12 - 490 reported cases

2/17 - 893 reported cases -  5 dead 

2/22 - 1,834 reported cases - 19 dead

2/26 - 3,650 reported cases - 57 dead

2/29 - 7,155 reported cases - 109 dead - USA 68 cases - 1 dead

3/5 - 17,353 reported cases - 344 dead - USA 210 cases - 12 dead

3/9 - 33,303 reported cases - 881 dead - USA 628 cases - 26 dead

3/13 - 64,567 reported cases - 2,239 dead - USA 2,269 cases - 48 dead

3/18 - 138,059 reported cases - 5,715 dead - USA 9,301 cases - 152 dead

3/22 - 255,584 reported cases - 11,350 dead - USA 33,346 cases - 414 dead

3/27 - 514,956 reported cases - 24,048 dead - USA 104,126 cases - 1,695 dead

3/28 - 581,528 reported cases - 27,551 dead - USA 123,428 cases - 2,211 dead

3/29 - 640,507 reported cases - 30,666 dead - USA 142,047 cases - 2,484 dead

3/30 - 702,911 reported cases - 34,476 dead - USA 163,479 cases - 3,148 dead

3/31 - 777,151 reported cases - 38,846 dead - USA 188,530 cases - 3,889 dead

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-J_vry7rclLIGooJ-Cu7OFH8rRRjB51lz1iGkwcTETc/edit#gid=0

 
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