*** 2012 Official Philadelphia Eagles Post Mortem Thread *** (1 Viewer)

[CentralPA]

Looks like Reid is going down with the ship. I agree that if he was sticking with Juan the whole time then he should've endorsed him. this doesn't look good at all unless Reid had someone totally different in mind to be D Coordiantor.

 

[unckeyherb]

Nolan and Spags hired. I thought the Eagles were looking for a D-Coordinator. Am I wrong?

FANS were looking for a new DC, Andy apparently was not.

Here's a couple of Philly bloggers' opinion on the subject:If Reid was dead set on bringing back Castillo, there was no reason not to say so by now. The team’s silence points strongly to them considering a change. Why let their coach twist in the wind for no reason?Reid was offered several chances during the season to endorse Castillo, and didn’t. Jeffrey Lurie gave us a list of people who would be back. It included Reid, Joe Banner and Howie Roseman. He allowed that DeSean Jackson might return under the right circumstances. But when he was asked if Castillo would return, he punted.That says something. When a boss in any field – sports, business, politics – is asked to give a vote of confidence to an employee, the only move is to give it, unless you’re actually considering a switch. Declining to back your own people undermines their standing. The Eagles know that. That's why, within days of the season’s end, Lurie put to rest the speculation about Reid.Again, if Castillo was back no matter what, there was zero upside in refusing to say so. But there have been questions around Castillo since midway through the season, and the Eagles have never dispelled them.http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/blogs/Is-Castillo-now-safe.html#ixzz1k1dFTiO6

True, but the Eagles have shown a history of not giving two shts about how they come off regarding their backing of coaches. Reid stepped up and adamantly stated McDermott was his DC going forward, not more than a week before McDermott was canned. I fully expect Castillo to be back at this point, right or wrong.

 

[Amused to Death]

Nolan and Spags hired. I thought the Eagles were looking for a D-Coordinator. Am I wrong?

FANS were looking for a new DC, Andy apparently was not.

Here's a couple of Philly bloggers' opinion on the subject:If Reid was dead set on bringing back Castillo, there was no reason not to say so by now. The team’s silence points strongly to them considering a change. Why let their coach twist in the wind for no reason?Reid was offered several chances during the season to endorse Castillo, and didn’t. Jeffrey Lurie gave us a list of people who would be back. It included Reid, Joe Banner and Howie Roseman. He allowed that DeSean Jackson might return under the right circumstances. But when he was asked if Castillo would return, he punted.That says something. When a boss in any field – sports, business, politics – is asked to give a vote of confidence to an employee, the only move is to give it, unless you’re actually considering a switch. Declining to back your own people undermines their standing. The Eagles know that. That's why, within days of the season’s end, Lurie put to rest the speculation about Reid.Again, if Castillo was back no matter what, there was zero upside in refusing to say so. But there have been questions around Castillo since midway through the season, and the Eagles have never dispelled them.http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/blogs/Is-Castillo-now-safe.html#ixzz1k1dFTiO6

True, but the Eagles have shown a history of not giving two shts about how they come off regarding their backing of coaches. Reid stepped up and adamantly stated McDermott was his DC going forward, not more than a week before McDermott was canned. I fully expect Castillo to be back at this point, right or wrong.

I'm not doubting JC comes back, I'm addressing Jason's opinion that Andy never intended to replace Juan. IMO, Andy's painted himself into a corner. He should have just hired a qualified DC last year and who knows how this year's playoffs would have ended for the Eagles. Let's face it, the team was loaded with talent (even on defense) and Andy's decisions led to a train wreck of a season. From coaches needing to be separated on the sidelines to star players sulking and getting benched.But yeah....bring back both the DC and OC and let's see what happens. For better or worse, its all Andy's guys. He has to show they can win or let someone else get a chance.

 

[delusional]

I cant believe the green tinted glasses alot of people wear by trying to jusitfy bringing Juan back. It was one of the main reasons the season tanked last year, which was at the hands of Reid. Cant believe no one in the national media is calling him out on this, seriously, he isnt some coaching genius. Its not like he won the superbowl the past 5 years.

You go all in dealing your used-to-be franchise qb ( kolb ) bring in one of the best corners in the game, a DE & DT that are pretty damn beastly....then you flake on coaching. Its like nothing changes. He did this all the way back to McNabb. Had a QB that could run and toss deep so he runs a offense that relied on short passes & slowly turned said QB into a pocket passer. Had an offensive line that could run blocking....forgot to run. Had a QB with a strong arm & relied on WRs for YAC....had WRs of JuCo talent. Bring in top talent FA on the defensive side of the ball...have a coach who never coached defense try and coach them.

 

[Jedimaster21]

I have an idea. Let's try to look at this logically for once. It was risky to put Castillo on that side of the ball. He did have a learning curve, as did the defense due to all the new faces. However, take a look at the facts:

1. Castillo hadn't coached defense for years, and an adjustment period was expected.

2. Castillo is one of the best teachers in the game, and understands that practice, repetition, and muscle memory are the ingredients to "playing fast."

3. The Eagles were #1 in sacks.

4. The Eagles were #8 in total defense.

5. They didn't have an off-season to gel considering all the new coaching and players.

6. They showed A LOT of improvement as the season progressed.

You see poor decisions and bad performance through your pessimistic view. I see taking a risk on Castillo, when he knew he would be heavy criticized and even laughed at, as good leadership and guts. I see potential in Castlo and this defense, and if you look at the facts you should be able to see it as well.

 

[Jason Wood]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

 

[renesauz]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

Delusional is, well...delusional (as usual).I'm not ecstatic about the Castillo promotion, and I have no clue whether it will pay off, but it's simply unreasonable to call the experiment a failure at this point. That's not "green tinted glasses", it's simply common sense. If Reid believed in him in July, there's no reason he wouldn't continue to do so now.

 

[Jason Wood]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

Delusional is, well...delusional (as usual).I'm not ecstatic about the Castillo promotion, and I have no clue whether it will pay off, but it's simply unreasonable to call the experiment a failure at this point. That's not "green tinted glasses", it's simply common sense. If Reid believed in him in July, there's no reason he wouldn't continue to do so now.

Exactly. Am I thrilled with things? No. But I'm hopeful, and this team needs a lot fewer break to go all the way than many teams. So I will let it play out, not condemn things before they happen.

 

[Amused to Death]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

I will be entering 2012 with extreme optimism. How can we not? They will be starting a new season with no significant coaching changes and a boatload of talent. Its Andy's magical 14th season (the one we've all been waiting for because that's how long it took Cowher) so a deep playoff run is practically guaranteed.And if they fall short of a deep post season run, I am optimistic Laurie will go in another direction. After all, he said anything less will not be tolerated and is unacceptable. It will be Andy's 8th season to try to get back to the SB. It only took him 6 the first time, and that was after inheriting a 3-win team. Most HC's don't get 9 years with nothing to show for it.

 

[vinwinephans]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

Delusional is, well...delusional (as usual).I'm not ecstatic about the Castillo promotion, and I have no clue whether it will pay off, but it's simply unreasonable to call the experiment a failure at this point. That's not "green tinted glasses", it's simply common sense. If Reid believed in him in July, there's no reason he wouldn't continue to do so now.

Exactly. Am I thrilled with things? No. But I'm hopeful, and this team needs a lot fewer break to go all the way than many teams. So I will let it play out, not condemn things before they happen.

Sometimes I read this thread and I feel like a kid again listening to my older female cousin's ##### about their soaps... or I just turned on Philly Sports radio...At some point you have to man up, move on and get on board for the ride - be a fan. Or, you can wear the skirt and hold the grudge... your perogative I guess. Just not my style. Don't need constant negativity in my outlet - gets too depressing.Am I thrilled, no. But I hope for the best because, in the end, I have no control over this outcome.

 

[Insein]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

Delusional is, well...delusional (as usual).I'm not ecstatic about the Castillo promotion, and I have no clue whether it will pay off, but it's simply unreasonable to call the experiment a failure at this point. That's not "green tinted glasses", it's simply common sense. If Reid believed in him in July, there's no reason he wouldn't continue to do so now.

Exactly. Am I thrilled with things? No. But I'm hopeful, and this team needs a lot fewer break to go all the way than many teams. So I will let it play out, not condemn things before they happen.

Sometimes I read this thread and I feel like a kid again listening to my older female cousin's ##### about their soaps... or I just turned on Philly Sports radio...At some point you have to man up, move on and get on board for the ride - be a fan. Or, you can wear the skirt and hold the grudge... your perogative I guess. Just not my style. Don't need constant negativity in my outlet - gets too depressing.Am I thrilled, no. But I hope for the best because, in the end, I have no control over this outcome.

What I never get is the fans that ##### about the fans that complain. So we're just supposed to sit back and pretend that we haven't had a mediocre product for the last 7 years with no end in sight? We should thankful for "how good we've had it" because of teams like the Browns and the Rams? You can take your stepford wife road all you want but don't disrespect the rest of us that want to see a change in the way things are done. We're still fans. We'll still watch and root for the team. We just would like to see them, you know, win something for a change.

 

[Amused to Death]

We're still fans. We'll still watch and root for the team. We just would like to see them, you know, win something for a change.

And we do it without calling other fans grudge-holding, skirt-wearing, knuckle headed #######

 

[vinwinephans]

you're not changing my opinion

flame away

 

[Insein]

you're not changing my opinionflame away

From your original post, I see you holding the lighter.

 

[loose circuits]

I have an idea. Let's try to look at this logically for once. It was risky to put Castillo on that side of the ball. He did have a learning curve, as did the defense due to all the new faces. However, take a look at the facts:

1. Castillo hadn't coached defense for years, and an adjustment period was expected.

2. Castillo is one of the best teachers in the game, and understands that practice, repetition, and muscle memory are the ingredients to "playing fast."

3. The Eagles were #1 in sacks.

4. The Eagles were #8 in total defense.

5. They didn't have an off-season to gel considering all the new coaching and players.

6. They showed A LOT of improvement as the season progressed.

You see poor decisions and bad performance through your pessimistic view. I see taking a risk on Castillo, when he knew he would be heavy criticized and even laughed at, as good leadership and guts. I see potential in Castlo and this defense, and if you look at the facts you should be able to see it as well.

this pretty much sums up my thoughts as well.It is what it is for those that want to cry...they'll have to get over themselves. To try to place the blame strictly on Castillo is absurd in my opinion. Many of those games at the beginning of the year could have been one had one play or another went the right way. Juan wasn't responsible for tackling Victor Cruz or able to kick that FG against San Fran. Vick looked horrible against the Cards and should have probably sat out the game if he was hurt early. The D was not put in good positions, but we should have had a game plan to stop Fitz. We caught a lot of teams when they were hot. Obviously the SanFran game looks a little better now considering where they are...it's over now and another defensive overhaul is not in the best interest of this team. Nobody in the front office needs to come out and say the coaches under contract are staying, that's not how it works...I'm sure they would have made a move by now if there was going to be one otherwise they'd be behind the 8ball

I'm hoping for Lavonte David to shore up that LB core. He is the ideal type of guy we need to add to this defense with his outstanding instincts...with 3 picks in the top 47 they should have plenty of opportunity to add talent at whatever position is necessary. I'm guessing it will be LB this year

 

[Insein]

I have an idea. Let's try to look at this logically for once. It was risky to put Castillo on that side of the ball. He did have a learning curve, as did the defense due to all the new faces. However, take a look at the facts:

1. Castillo hadn't coached defense for years, and an adjustment period was expected.

2. Castillo is one of the best teachers in the game, and understands that practice, repetition, and muscle memory are the ingredients to "playing fast."

3. The Eagles were #1 in sacks.

4. The Eagles were #8 in total defense.

5. They didn't have an off-season to gel considering all the new coaching and players.

6. They showed A LOT of improvement as the season progressed.

You see poor decisions and bad performance through your pessimistic view. I see taking a risk on Castillo, when he knew he would be heavy criticized and even laughed at, as good leadership and guts. I see potential in Castlo and this defense, and if you look at the facts you should be able to see it as well.

this pretty much sums up my thoughts as well.It is what it is for those that want to cry...they'll have to get over themselves. To try to place the blame strictly on Castillo is absurd in my opinion. Many of those games at the beginning of the year could have been one had one play or another went the right way. Juan wasn't responsible for tackling Victor Cruz or able to kick that FG against San Fran. Vick looked horrible against the Cards and should have probably sat out the game if he was hurt early. The D was not put in good positions, but we should have had a game plan to stop Fitz. We caught a lot of teams when they were hot. Obviously the SanFran game looks a little better now considering where they are...it's over now and another defensive overhaul is not in the best interest of this team. Nobody in the front office needs to come out and say the coaches under contract are staying, that's not how it works...I'm sure they would have made a move by now if there was going to be one otherwise they'd be behind the 8ball

I'm hoping for Lavonte David to shore up that LB core. He is the ideal type of guy we need to add to this defense with his outstanding instincts...with 3 picks in the top 47 they should have plenty of opportunity to add talent at whatever position is necessary. I'm guessing it will be LB this year

I'd prefer Luke Kuechly because he'd be a guy you can plug in right away and be able to make plays on athleticism alone. However, that would mean the Eagles would go against 30+ years of draft history. Its not just Andy but some reason, the Eagles refuse to draft LBs in the 1st round. Reid has just taken it to a new level of devaluing the position, using 3rd 4th and 5th round picks to try to find their starting LBs. I get the trying to find a diamond in the rough thing but you usually miss a lot more than hit with that approach. then we're stuck sticking in our 7th round picks trying to fill in as a stop gap when those other picks fail. I don't get why they don't just one time take a shot at a first round LB pick. Whats the worst that can happen? The guy under performs and then we're no worse off. Of course they could get a stud and we'd actually have a playmaker at a key position.

 

[vinwinephans]

you're not changing my opinionflame away

From your original post, I see you holding the lighter.

I'm not the only one who feels this way. I've said my piece, I was just not being PC about it and probably a little insulting. That's my frustration coming through. I can see wanting Reid and Castillo gone. Honestly, I can see that viewpoint. I can also see staying the course one more year.But it's getting old hearing the same people drone on about something that isn't going to happen - not this year. Following the Eagles in this forum was a lot more fun when the focus wasn't on wishing Andy Reid fired and constantly ripping the roseman/banner/reid/castillo/etc.That being said, I suppose there isn't much else to talk about right now.

 

[scratcher]

Looks like Reid is going down with the ship. I agree that if he was sticking with Juan the whole time then he should've endorsed him. this doesn't look good at all unless Reid had someone totally different in mind to be D Coordiantor.

To me the silence suggests that they would look to upgrade but stay with Juan if they can't get the guy they want (likely Spags).

 

[Insein]

Again, Coughlin somehow was less secure in his job than Andy was. Go figure. The team that barely made the playoffs from the NFC East is now in the Super Bowl. If only we hadn't blown 5 leads in the 4th quarter this year. Any one of those games turned into W's and that could be us right now. Of course we need to cut Juan some slack with the short off season and never having been a DC before.

 

[CentralPA]

Again, Coughlin somehow was less secure in his job than Andy was. Go figure. The team that barely made the playoffs from the NFC East is now in the Super Bowl. If only we hadn't blown 5 leads in the 4th quarter this year. Any one of those games turned into W's and that could be us right now. Of course we need to cut Juan some slack with the short off season and never having been a DC before.

Nah, even if the Eagles did make the playoffs they would've been one and done. I give the Giants credit but I also think the ball has bounced their way in these few playoff games.

 

[delusional]

I am baffled that some fans around here can go years without a sense of optimism. Why be fans? I get the sense Browns and Bucs fans go into each season feeling more hopeful about their teams than some of you guys do.

Its the same #### different pile. They may act like they are trying to change things up & everything but its essentially the same old same old. If they made honest mistakes, like a player getting hurt that derails the season, thats understandable but things that derailed their seasons are their own doing. Thats why I am pessimistic about them. As long as Reid is here, its going to be the same thing time and time again.

Again, Coughlin somehow was less secure in his job than Andy was. Go figure. The team that barely made the playoffs from the NFC East is now in the Super Bowl. If only we hadn't blown 5 leads in the 4th quarter this year. Any one of those games turned into W's and that could be us right now. Of course we need to cut Juan some slack with the short off season and never having been a DC before.

Nah, even if the Eagles did make the playoffs they would've been one and done. I give the Giants credit but I also think the ball has bounced their way in these few playoff games.

A few times? LOL. Packers baically gave them that game & last night...nuts.

 

[Insein]

Again, Coughlin somehow was less secure in his job than Andy was. Go figure. The team that barely made the playoffs from the NFC East is now in the Super Bowl. If only we hadn't blown 5 leads in the 4th quarter this year. Any one of those games turned into W's and that could be us right now. Of course we need to cut Juan some slack with the short off season and never having been a DC before.

Nah, even if the Eagles did make the playoffs they would've been one and done. I give the Giants credit but I also think the ball has bounced their way in these few playoff games.

We may have but the opportunity was there. Giants only won 3 out of 4 down the stretch and then ripped off 3 straight in the playoffs. Eagles won their last 4. If they only could have held on for 1 of those 4, 4th quarter blown leads (Atl, SF, Chi, Arz), we may be headed to Indy right now. Not saying we definitely would be but the possibility was there for the taking. Giants did.

 

[JetMaxx]

If one is to compare the Giants and Eagles and say "what if", while the Eagle as currently constructed may have the talent to stay competitive, they don't have the character and toughness to win games like the Giants have won the past 2 weeks. From the top down, it just doesn't exist. Head coach, coordinators, QB, defensive personnel, etc.

 

[Insein]

If one is to compare the Giants and Eagles and say "what if", while the Eagle as currently constructed may have the talent to stay competitive, they don't have the character and toughness to win games like the Giants have won the past 2 weeks. From the top down, it just doesn't exist. Head coach, coordinators, QB, defensive personnel, etc.

Which is also part of the reason they did blow those 4th quarter leads and are watching the giants in the Super Bowl.

 

[CentralPA]

If one is to compare the Giants and Eagles and say "what if", while the Eagle as currently constructed may have the talent to stay competitive, they don't have the character and toughness to win games like the Giants have won the past 2 weeks. From the top down, it just doesn't exist. Head coach, coordinators, QB, defensive personnel, etc.

 

[Jason Wood]

Alrighty, well happy or not, it appears we're heading into the 2012 season with the staff virtually intact. We could still lose coaches, particularly if Marty M gets a HC job, or if Grigson recommends coaches to whoever he hires in Indy, but for now let's assume we're not changing any major coaching positions without outside impetus.

So let's turn our attention to the 2012 personnel.

By my count we have the following players hitting free agency:

Victor Abiamiri, DE

Ronnie Brown, RB

Antonio Dixon, DT

King Dunlap, OT

DeSean Jackson, WR

Derek Landri, DT

Trevor Laws, DT

Evan Mathis, OG

Juqua Parker, DE

Owen Schmitt, FB

Steve Smith, WR

Vince Young, QB

The good new is that most of these guys are hardly irreplaceable. Mathis and DJax would be the only presumptive starters of this group if they return, with Dixon playing a key rotation role if he can get back 100% healthy.

The biggest decision is certainly what to do with DJax. I can only presume the team isn't ready to give up on the kid, given what we've seen he can do when he's healthy and happy. He's too young to write off, although I have to say as a fan I would understand parting ways DEPENDING on what they need to pay him. I think he's CLEARLY not someone you can pay Larry Fitz/Megatron money, no matter what he wants. And given his size and unwillingness to play over the middle after his last concussion, you have to factor in longevity into his contract. My best guess is that they take care of him though, and set up the deal so they have an out if he's a disaster but not before he gets a lot of upfront guaranteed money for the next two seasons.

Evan Mathis -- This is a guy that paid off even though he was arguably way down the list of "Dream Team" free agent gets in the frenzied 2011 offseason. I think we have to re-sign him and let him continue to play for us until the wheels come off.

The rest of the guys? History tells us most middling free agents end up re-upping with their current teams unless there's a market for them elsewhere. I assume many of these guys will be back, for very reasonable deals, but if they don't I don't see that it'll matter much as we can backfill through the draft and free agency for equal production.

 

[Snotbubbles]

Alrighty, well happy or not, it appears we're heading into the 2012 season with the staff virtually intact. We could still lose coaches, particularly if Marty M gets a HC job, or if Grigson recommends coaches to whoever he hires in Indy, but for now let's assume we're not changing any major coaching positions without outside impetus.

So let's turn our attention to the 2012 personnel.

By my count we have the following players hitting free agency:

Victor Abiamiri, DE

Ronnie Brown, RB

Antonio Dixon, DT

King Dunlap, OT

DeSean Jackson, WR

Derek Landri, DT

Trevor Laws, DT

Evan Mathis, OG

Juqua Parker, DE

Owen Schmitt, FB

Steve Smith, WR

Vince Young, QB

The good new is that most of these guys are hardly irreplaceable. Mathis and DJax would be the only presumptive starters of this group if they return, with Dixon playing a key rotation role if he can get back 100% healthy.

The biggest decision is certainly what to do with DJax. I can only presume the team isn't ready to give up on the kid, given what we've seen he can do when he's healthy and happy. He's too young to write off, although I have to say as a fan I would understand parting ways DEPENDING on what they need to pay him. I think he's CLEARLY not someone you can pay Larry Fitz/Megatron money, no matter what he wants. And given his size and unwillingness to play over the middle after his last concussion, you have to factor in longevity into his contract. My best guess is that they take care of him though, and set up the deal so they have an out if he's a disaster but not before he gets a lot of upfront guaranteed money for the next two seasons.

Evan Mathis -- This is a guy that paid off even though he was arguably way down the list of "Dream Team" free agent gets in the frenzied 2011 offseason. I think we have to re-sign him and let him continue to play for us until the wheels come off.

The rest of the guys? History tells us most middling free agents end up re-upping with their current teams unless there's a market for them elsewhere. I assume many of these guys will be back, for very reasonable deals, but if they don't I don't see that it'll matter much as we can backfill through the draft and free agency for equal production.

Can't say I disagree with any of your assessments. Dixon, Jackson and Mathis are the only guys I feel they should definitely bring back if the price is right.

 

[CentralPA]

I think Landri, Mathis, and Dixon will be resigned. I have a gut feeling DeSean is gone and they draft for a wideout. Maybe Malcolm Floyd if he drops to them and Kuechly is gone.

 

[Gachi]

What about the guy from Oklahoma State? Can't think of his name...

 

[Jason Wood]

What about the guy from Oklahoma State? Can't think of his name...

Justin Blackmon? He'll be long gone before we pick.

 

[scratcher]

Landri was beasting it by the end of the season.

 

[Insein]

Alrighty, well happy or not, it appears we're heading into the 2012 season with the staff virtually intact. We could still lose coaches, particularly if Marty M gets a HC job, or if Grigson recommends coaches to whoever he hires in Indy, but for now let's assume we're not changing any major coaching positions without outside impetus.

So let's turn our attention to the 2012 personnel.

By my count we have the following players hitting free agency:

Victor Abiamiri, DE

Ronnie Brown, RB

Antonio Dixon, DT

King Dunlap, OT

DeSean Jackson, WR

Derek Landri, DT

Trevor Laws, DT

Evan Mathis, OG

Juqua Parker, DE

Owen Schmitt, FB

Steve Smith, WR

Vince Young, QB

The good new is that most of these guys are hardly irreplaceable. Mathis and DJax would be the only presumptive starters of this group if they return, with Dixon playing a key rotation role if he can get back 100% healthy.

The biggest decision is certainly what to do with DJax. I can only presume the team isn't ready to give up on the kid, given what we've seen he can do when he's healthy and happy. He's too young to write off, although I have to say as a fan I would understand parting ways DEPENDING on what they need to pay him. I think he's CLEARLY not someone you can pay Larry Fitz/Megatron money, no matter what he wants. And given his size and unwillingness to play over the middle after his last concussion, you have to factor in longevity into his contract. My best guess is that they take care of him though, and set up the deal so they have an out if he's a disaster but not before he gets a lot of upfront guaranteed money for the next two seasons.

Evan Mathis -- This is a guy that paid off even though he was arguably way down the list of "Dream Team" free agent gets in the frenzied 2011 offseason. I think we have to re-sign him and let him continue to play for us until the wheels come off.

The rest of the guys? History tells us most middling free agents end up re-upping with their current teams unless there's a market for them elsewhere. I assume many of these guys will be back, for very reasonable deals, but if they don't I don't see that it'll matter much as we can backfill through the draft and free agency for equal production.

Agree with the assessment. I feel that Djax should be a priority to resign at a reasonable price. Would be a shame to see him in a Dallas or Wash uni next season. After that, as others have said, Mathis is pretty much the only one I'd definitely bring back. Dixon and Landri are depth but not a necessity.In the draft, I hope LB is the #1 priority. Meaning they take a run a Kuechly. As long as they don't take another first round DL bust again. They just have no talent at evaluating DL players.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

I'll be interested to see how the Mathis situation plays out and if they'll be willing to give him good money...speaking of money, what does our cap situation look like?

 

[Jason Wood]

Alrighty, well happy or not, it appears we're heading into the 2012 season with the staff virtually intact. We could still lose coaches, particularly if Marty M gets a HC job, or if Grigson recommends coaches to whoever he hires in Indy, but for now let's assume we're not changing any major coaching positions without outside impetus.

So let's turn our attention to the 2012 personnel.

By my count we have the following players hitting free agency:

Victor Abiamiri, DE

Ronnie Brown, RB

Antonio Dixon, DT

King Dunlap, OT

DeSean Jackson, WR

Derek Landri, DT

Trevor Laws, DT

Evan Mathis, OG

Juqua Parker, DE

Owen Schmitt, FB

Steve Smith, WR

Vince Young, QB

The good new is that most of these guys are hardly irreplaceable. Mathis and DJax would be the only presumptive starters of this group if they return, with Dixon playing a key rotation role if he can get back 100% healthy.

The biggest decision is certainly what to do with DJax. I can only presume the team isn't ready to give up on the kid, given what we've seen he can do when he's healthy and happy. He's too young to write off, although I have to say as a fan I would understand parting ways DEPENDING on what they need to pay him. I think he's CLEARLY not someone you can pay Larry Fitz/Megatron money, no matter what he wants. And given his size and unwillingness to play over the middle after his last concussion, you have to factor in longevity into his contract. My best guess is that they take care of him though, and set up the deal so they have an out if he's a disaster but not before he gets a lot of upfront guaranteed money for the next two seasons.

Evan Mathis -- This is a guy that paid off even though he was arguably way down the list of "Dream Team" free agent gets in the frenzied 2011 offseason. I think we have to re-sign him and let him continue to play for us until the wheels come off.

The rest of the guys? History tells us most middling free agents end up re-upping with their current teams unless there's a market for them elsewhere. I assume many of these guys will be back, for very reasonable deals, but if they don't I don't see that it'll matter much as we can backfill through the draft and free agency for equal production.

Agree with the assessment. I feel that Djax should be a priority to resign at a reasonable price. Would be a shame to see him in a Dallas or Wash uni next season. After that, as others have said, Mathis is pretty much the only one I'd definitely bring back. Dixon and Landri are depth but not a necessity.In the draft, I hope LB is the #1 priority. Meaning they take a run a Kuechly. As long as they don't take another first round DL bust again. They just have no talent at evaluating DL players.

Agree that it would be awesome to see them go heavy on LB in the draft, even though I always hope that and it never happens One thing I have to respond to though is your claim about DL.

The Reid era has done a pretty awesome job at finding defensive lineman in all sorts of ways, from Cole to Babin to Simon to Bunkley to Patterson, etc... Graham got hurt, not sure how anyone can be blamed for that. Everyone was gushing about that choice when it was made, and there were even stories that Bill Belichick coveted Graham as one of the few impact players in that draft.

 

[Shane Falco]

Alrighty, well happy or not, it appears we're heading into the 2012 season with the staff virtually intact. We could still lose coaches, particularly if Marty M gets a HC job, or if Grigson recommends coaches to whoever he hires in Indy, but for now let's assume we're not changing any major coaching positions without outside impetus.

So let's turn our attention to the 2012 personnel.

By my count we have the following players hitting free agency:

Victor Abiamiri, DE

Ronnie Brown, RB

Antonio Dixon, DT

King Dunlap, OT

DeSean Jackson, WR

Derek Landri, DT

Trevor Laws, DT

Evan Mathis, OG

Juqua Parker, DE

Owen Schmitt, FB

Steve Smith, WR

Vince Young, QB

The good new is that most of these guys are hardly irreplaceable. Mathis and DJax would be the only presumptive starters of this group if they return, with Dixon playing a key rotation role if he can get back 100% healthy.

The biggest decision is certainly what to do with DJax. I can only presume the team isn't ready to give up on the kid, given what we've seen he can do when he's healthy and happy. He's too young to write off, although I have to say as a fan I would understand parting ways DEPENDING on what they need to pay him. I think he's CLEARLY not someone you can pay Larry Fitz/Megatron money, no matter what he wants. And given his size and unwillingness to play over the middle after his last concussion, you have to factor in longevity into his contract. My best guess is that they take care of him though, and set up the deal so they have an out if he's a disaster but not before he gets a lot of upfront guaranteed money for the next two seasons.

Evan Mathis -- This is a guy that paid off even though he was arguably way down the list of "Dream Team" free agent gets in the frenzied 2011 offseason. I think we have to re-sign him and let him continue to play for us until the wheels come off.

The rest of the guys? History tells us most middling free agents end up re-upping with their current teams unless there's a market for them elsewhere. I assume many of these guys will be back, for very reasonable deals, but if they don't I don't see that it'll matter much as we can backfill through the draft and free agency for equal production.

Agree with the assessment. I feel that Djax should be a priority to resign at a reasonable price. Would be a shame to see him in a Dallas or Wash uni next season. After that, as others have said, Mathis is pretty much the only one I'd definitely bring back. Dixon and Landri are depth but not a necessity.In the draft, I hope LB is the #1 priority. Meaning they take a run a Kuechly. As long as they don't take another first round DL bust again. They just have no talent at evaluating DL players.

Agree that it would be awesome to see them go heavy on LB in the draft, even though I always hope that and it never happens One thing I have to respond to though is your claim about DL.

The Reid era has done a pretty awesome job at finding defensive lineman in all sorts of ways, from Cole to Babin to Simon to Bunkley to Patterson, etc... Graham got hurt, not sure how anyone can be blamed for that. Everyone was gushing about that choice when it was made, and there were even stories that Bill Belichick coveted Graham as one of the few impact players in that draft.

ummm, when you draft 4 DL every year, you're gonna hit every now and then. I'm curious how many DL the Giants draft every season

 

[Jason Wood]

ummm, when you draft 4 DL every year, you're gonna hit every now and then. I'm curious how many DL the Giants draft every season

And if we did draft 4 DL every year, you might have a point. But in 13 seasons, Andy and his crew have drafted 20 defensive lineman (and that includes college LBs that we converted to DE):Year No. Round Pick Player Name Position College2010 1 1 13 13 Brandon Graham DE Michigan2010 3 3 22 86 Daniel Te'p-Nesheim DE Washington2010 8 5 3 134 Ricky Sapp DE Clemson2010 12 7 36 243 Jeffrey Owens DT Georgia2008 1 2 16 47 Trevor Laws DT Notre Dame2008 3 3 17 80 Bryan Smith DE McNeese State2008 9 6 37 203 Andrew Studebaker DE Wheaton2007 2 2 25 57 Victor Abiamiri DE Notre Dame2006 1 1 14 14 Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida State2006 8 6 35 204 LaJuan Ramsey DT USC2005 1 1 31 31 Mike Patterson DT USC2005 7 5 10 146 Trent Cole DE Cincinnati2005 10 7 33 247 Keyonta Marshall DT Grand Valley State2003 1 1 15 15 Jerome McDougle DE Miami (FL)2003 4 4 34 131 Jamaal Green DE Miami (FL)2002 8 7 27 238 Raheem Brock DE Temple2001 3 3 1 63 Derrick Burgess DE Mississippi2000 1 1 6 6 Corey Simon DT Florida State2000 6 6 12 178 John Frank DE Utah1999 10 7 45 251 Pernell Davis DE Alabama-BirminghamWhen you consider how consistent our line play has been, and that we've also used free agency to bolster our production, I don't see how DL becomes an area of criticism.Fans get too caught up in selective memory because of the moves to get Graham and, years before, McDougle. But both guys got hurt right out of the gate (McDougle got shot for goodness sake), so I can't fathom how we would use that against Reid and his personnel department.

 

[Jason Wood]

Now if you want to assail Andy & Company's LINEBACKER choices, that's another thing entirely:



Year No. Round Pick Player Name Position College

2011 4 4 19 116 Casey Matthews LB Oregon

2011 8 6 28 193 Brian Rolle LB Ohio State

2011 9 7 34 237 Greg Lloyd LB Connecticut

2010 5 4 23 121 Keenan Clayton LB Oklahoma

2010 11 7 13 220 Jamar Chaney LB Mississippi State

2009 8 7 21 230 Moise Fokou LB Maryland

2008 8 6 34 200 Joe Mays LB North Dakota State

2007 3 3 24 87 Stewart Bradley LB Nebraska

2006 3 3 7 71 Chris Gocong LB Cal Poly

2006 7 5 36 168 Omar Gaither LB Tennessee

2005 3 2 31 63 Matt McCoy LB San Diego State

2005 11 7 38 252 David Bergeron LB Stanford

2002 7 6 26 198 Tyreo Harrison LB Notre Dame

2001 2 2 24 55 Quinton Caver LB Arkansas

1999 2 2 4 35 Barry Gardner LB Northwestern

 

[Shane Falco]

maybe it just feels like 4 every year (except 2010)

I just think there should be more hits than there were. They are the Dave Kingman of drafting DL. Lots of Strikouts to homeruns

see below

ummm, when you draft 4 DL every year, you're gonna hit every now and then. I'm curious how many DL the Giants draft every season

And if we did draft 4 DL every year, you might have a point. But in 13 seasons, Andy and his crew have drafted 20 defensive lineman (and that includes college LBs that we converted to DE):Year No. Round Pick Player Name Position College

2010 1 1 13 13 Brandon Graham DE Michigan- Pass since he was hurt

2010 3 3 22 86 Daniel Te'p-Nesheim DE Washington reach and poor pick, out of the league?

2010 8 5 3 134 Ricky Sapp DE Clemson reach, wrong position (3-4 OLB) and hurt at the time

2010 12 7 36 243 Jeffrey Owens DT Georgia pass, I'll give passes to all the 7ths

2008 1 2 16 47 Trevor Laws DT Notre Dame been very good, hit

2008 3 3 17 80 Bryan Smith DE McNeese State reach, wrong position (3-4 OLB)

2008 9 6 37 203 Andrew Studebaker DE Wheaton one good season with KC, another 3-4 OLB, we don't run a 3-4

2007 2 2 25 57 Victor Abiamiri DE Notre Dame I guess he should get a pass too since he was never healthy?

2006 1 1 14 14 Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida State another guy that was OK but really dominated AFTER leaving the team (for 1 year so far)

2006 8 6 35 204 LaJuan Ramsey DT USC contributed a little

2005 1 1 31 31 Mike Patterson DT USC excellent player, not a pro-bowler

2005 7 5 10 146 Trent Cole DE Cincinnati Home-run

2005 10 7 33 247 Keyonta Marshall DT Grand Valley State pass, I'll give passes to all the 7ths

2003 1 1 15 15 Jerome McDougle DE Miami (FL) Pass since he was hurt

2003 4 4 34 131 Jamaal Green DE Miami (FL)nothing

2002 8 7 27 238 Raheem Brock DE Temple pass, but was a damn good player for another team when the decided to not sign him

2001 3 3 1 63 Derrick Burgess DE Mississippi developed late, played well for the Raiders but not much value for a 3rd

2000 1 1 6 6 Corey Simon DT Florida State had some very good, not great seasons

2000 6 6 12 178 John Frank DE Utah nothing

1999 10 7 45 251 Pernell Davis DE Alabama-Birmingham pass, I'll give passes to all the 7ths

When you consider how consistent our line play has been, and that we've also used free agency to bolster our production, I don't see how DL becomes an area of criticism.

Fans get too caught up in selective memory because of the moves to get Graham and, years before, McDougle. But both guys got hurt right out of the gate (McDougle got shot for goodness sake), so I can't fathom how we would use that against Reid and his personnel department.

 

[Shane Falco]

Now if you want to assail Andy & Company's LINEBACKER choices, that's another thing entirely:Year No. Round Pick Player Name Position College2011 4 4 19 116 Casey Matthews LB Oregon2011 8 6 28 193 Brian Rolle LB Ohio State2011 9 7 34 237 Greg Lloyd LB Connecticut2010 5 4 23 121 Keenan Clayton LB Oklahoma2010 11 7 13 220 Jamar Chaney LB Mississippi State2009 8 7 21 230 Moise Fokou LB Maryland2008 8 6 34 200 Joe Mays LB North Dakota State2007 3 3 24 87 Stewart Bradley LB Nebraska2006 3 3 7 71 Chris Gocong LB Cal Poly2006 7 5 36 168 Omar Gaither LB Tennessee2005 3 2 31 63 Matt McCoy LB San Diego State2005 11 7 38 252 David Bergeron LB Stanford2002 7 6 26 198 Tyreo Harrison LB Notre Dame2001 2 2 24 55 Quinton Caver LB Arkansas1999 2 2 4 35 Barry Gardner LB Northwestern

they do OK in the 3rd. Its the other rounds...

 

[Skeletore Eh]

Alrighty, well happy or not, it appears we're heading into the 2012 season with the staff virtually intact. We could still lose coaches, particularly if Marty M gets a HC job, or if Grigson recommends coaches to whoever he hires in Indy, but for now let's assume we're not changing any major coaching positions without outside impetus.

So let's turn our attention to the 2012 personnel.

By my count we have the following players hitting free agency:

Victor Abiamiri, DE

Ronnie Brown, RB

Antonio Dixon, DT

King Dunlap, OT

DeSean Jackson, WR

Derek Landri, DT

Trevor Laws, DT

Evan Mathis, OG

Juqua Parker, DE

Owen Schmitt, FB

Steve Smith, WR

Vince Young, QB

The good new is that most of these guys are hardly irreplaceable. Mathis and DJax would be the only presumptive starters of this group if they return, with Dixon playing a key rotation role if he can get back 100% healthy.

The biggest decision is certainly what to do with DJax. I can only presume the team isn't ready to give up on the kid, given what we've seen he can do when he's healthy and happy. He's too young to write off, although I have to say as a fan I would understand parting ways DEPENDING on what they need to pay him. I think he's CLEARLY not someone you can pay Larry Fitz/Megatron money, no matter what he wants. And given his size and unwillingness to play over the middle after his last concussion, you have to factor in longevity into his contract. My best guess is that they take care of him though, and set up the deal so they have an out if he's a disaster but not before he gets a lot of upfront guaranteed money for the next two seasons.

Evan Mathis -- This is a guy that paid off even though he was arguably way down the list of "Dream Team" free agent gets in the frenzied 2011 offseason. I think we have to re-sign him and let him continue to play for us until the wheels come off.

The rest of the guys? History tells us most middling free agents end up re-upping with their current teams unless there's a market for them elsewhere. I assume many of these guys will be back, for very reasonable deals, but if they don't I don't see that it'll matter much as we can backfill through the draft and free agency for equal production.

Agree with the assessment. I feel that Djax should be a priority to resign at a reasonable price. Would be a shame to see him in a Dallas or Wash uni next season. After that, as others have said, Mathis is pretty much the only one I'd definitely bring back. Dixon and Landri are depth but not a necessity.In the draft, I hope LB is the #1 priority. Meaning they take a run a Kuechly. As long as they don't take another first round DL bust again. They just have no talent at evaluating DL players.

Agree that it would be awesome to see them go heavy on LB in the draft, even though I always hope that and it never happens One thing I have to respond to though is your claim about DL.

The Reid era has done a pretty awesome job at finding defensive lineman in all sorts of ways, from Cole to Babin to Simon to Bunkley to Patterson, etc... Graham got hurt, not sure how anyone can be blamed for that. Everyone was gushing about that choice when it was made, and there were even stories that Bill Belichick coveted Graham as one of the few impact players in that draft.

Yet another laughable post from you Wood.

Yes cole was a great pick. In 13 years that's gonna happen (probably should happen more than once). But to try and defend their evaluation and drafting of DL is futile.

Babin is a product of Jim Washburn. Yeah the eagles signed him, but two years ago they would have told you he stunk.

Patterson and Bunkley were first round picks that amounted to very little. They are average at best making no impact on games. I remember at one point they collectively had like 2 sacks over three full seasons, something that was almost unbelievable.

And I don't remember people gushing about graham. What I remember is everyone being baffled as to why they didn't draft earl Thomas and instead took yet another question mark undersized DL.

Then you look at their picks from 2006 on and it's a bunch of stiffs that couldn't get on the field. My favorite being teo nesheim of course. A reach by two rounds atleast and a year later he's not in the league. That's six drafts with nothing to show for it

Obviously their drafting of DL pales in comparison to their drafting of LB

 

[Jason Wood]

Yet another laughable post from you Wood. Yes cole was a great pick. In 13 years that's gonna happen (probably should happen more than once). But to try and defend their evaluation and drafting of DL is futile. Babin is a product of Jim Washburn. Yeah the eagles signed him, but two years ago they would have told you he stunk. Patterson and Bunkley were first round picks that amounted to very little. They are average at best making no impact on games. I remember at one point they collectively had like 2 sacks over three full seasons, something that was almost unbelievable. And I don't remember people gushing about graham. What I remember is everyone being baffled as to why they didn't draft earl Thomas and instead took yet another question mark undersized DL. Then you look at their picks from 2006 on and it's a bunch of stiffs that couldn't get on the field. My favorite being teo nesheim of course. A reach by two rounds atleast and a year later he's not in the league. That's six drafts with nothing to show for itObviously their drafting of DL pales in comparison to their drafting of LB

The OP said the Eagles weren't good at evaluating DL talent...it wasn't limited to the draft. Shane then made a comment about our drafting 4 or 5 DL each year, which is factually inaccurate, to say the least. This organization has certainly showed an ability to evaluate the DL position. Our front 4 has rarely been a problem spot for this team, and our ability to add players like Kearse and Babin in free agency are a part of that reason. Knowing who will fit into your scheme and whether they're worth the money.Look, every team has holes in their team that you could start to ask questions. I think the Eagles have had mind-bogglingly bad track records with other aspects of the team, linebacker included. But DL? It's not one of them.

 

[Skeletore Eh]

Yet another laughable post from you Wood. Yes cole was a great pick. In 13 years that's gonna happen (probably should happen more than once). But to try and defend their evaluation and drafting of DL is futile. Babin is a product of Jim Washburn. Yeah the eagles signed him, but two years ago they would have told you he stunk. Patterson and Bunkley were first round picks that amounted to very little. They are average at best making no impact on games. I remember at one point they collectively had like 2 sacks over three full seasons, something that was almost unbelievable. And I don't remember people gushing about graham. What I remember is everyone being baffled as to why they didn't draft earl Thomas and instead took yet another question mark undersized DL. Then you look at their picks from 2006 on and it's a bunch of stiffs that couldn't get on the field. My favorite being teo nesheim of course. A reach by two rounds atleast and a year later he's not in the league. That's six drafts with nothing to show for itObviously their drafting of DL pales in comparison to their drafting of LB

The OP said the Eagles weren't good at evaluating DL talent...it wasn't limited to the draft. Shane then made a comment about our drafting 4 or 5 DL each year, which is factually inaccurate, to say the least. This organization has certainly showed an ability to evaluate the DL position. Our front 4 has rarely been a problem spot for this team, and our ability to add players like Kearse and Babin in free agency are a part of that reason. Knowing who will fit into your scheme and whether they're worth the money.Look, every team has holes in their team that you could start to ask questions. I think the Eagles have had mind-bogglingly bad track records with other aspects of the team, linebacker included. But DL? It's not one of them.

Comparing the eagles evaluation of DL to their evaluation of LB is going to make their evaluation of DL look better. Maybe you should go back over that list of drafted DL you posted. The kearse signing was a good one? He got hurt so I'd give them a pass, but I wouldn't use it to support your argument. IMO he was a guy that made his career off his rookie season and an SI cover

 

[Shane Falco]

The OP said the Eagles weren't good at evaluating DL talent...it wasn't limited to the draft. Shane then made a comment about our drafting 4 or 5 DL each year, which is factually inaccurate, to say the least. This organization has certainly showed an ability to evaluate the DL position. Our front 4 has rarely been a problem spot for this team, and our ability to add players like Kearse and Babin in free agency are a part of that reason. Knowing who will fit into your scheme and whether they're worth the money.Look, every team has holes in their team that you could start to ask questions. I think the Eagles have had mind-bogglingly bad track records with other aspects of the team, linebacker included. But DL? It's not one of them.

to say the least? what's the rest? LOLAnd wasn't last off-season everyone screaming how we needed help on the DL because we couldn't stop the run?. Sometimes its a case of a blind squirrel finding a nut. Like getting lucky with Landri.The DL may not have been a problem spot but they sure haven't been a strength either.

 

[Insein]

Yet another laughable post from you Wood. Yes cole was a great pick. In 13 years that's gonna happen (probably should happen more than once). But to try and defend their evaluation and drafting of DL is futile. Babin is a product of Jim Washburn. Yeah the eagles signed him, but two years ago they would have told you he stunk. Patterson and Bunkley were first round picks that amounted to very little. They are average at best making no impact on games. I remember at one point they collectively had like 2 sacks over three full seasons, something that was almost unbelievable. And I don't remember people gushing about graham. What I remember is everyone being baffled as to why they didn't draft earl Thomas and instead took yet another question mark undersized DL. Then you look at their picks from 2006 on and it's a bunch of stiffs that couldn't get on the field. My favorite being teo nesheim of course. A reach by two rounds atleast and a year later he's not in the league. That's six drafts with nothing to show for itObviously their drafting of DL pales in comparison to their drafting of LB

The OP said the Eagles weren't good at evaluating DL talent...it wasn't limited to the draft. Shane then made a comment about our drafting 4 or 5 DL each year, which is factually inaccurate, to say the least. This organization has certainly showed an ability to evaluate the DL position. Our front 4 has rarely been a problem spot for this team, and our ability to add players like Kearse and Babin in free agency are a part of that reason. Knowing who will fit into your scheme and whether they're worth the money.Look, every team has holes in their team that you could start to ask questions. I think the Eagles have had mind-bogglingly bad track records with other aspects of the team, linebacker included. But DL? It's not one of them.

To clarify, when I said DL evaluation, I was refering to the draft. Just watching all the hits the Giants get at DL made me think of it the other day. They rarely miss at that position even though they are terrible at LB evaluation.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Yet another laughable post from you Wood. Yes cole was a great pick. In 13 years that's gonna happen (probably should happen more than once). But to try and defend their evaluation and drafting of DL is futile. Babin is a product of Jim Washburn. Yeah the eagles signed him, but two years ago they would have told you he stunk. Patterson and Bunkley were first round picks that amounted to very little. They are average at best making no impact on games. I remember at one point they collectively had like 2 sacks over three full seasons, something that was almost unbelievable. And I don't remember people gushing about graham. What I remember is everyone being baffled as to why they didn't draft earl Thomas and instead took yet another question mark undersized DL. Then you look at their picks from 2006 on and it's a bunch of stiffs that couldn't get on the field. My favorite being teo nesheim of course. A reach by two rounds atleast and a year later he's not in the league. That's six drafts with nothing to show for itObviously their drafting of DL pales in comparison to their drafting of LB

The OP said the Eagles weren't good at evaluating DL talent...it wasn't limited to the draft. Shane then made a comment about our drafting 4 or 5 DL each year, which is factually inaccurate, to say the least. This organization has certainly showed an ability to evaluate the DL position. Our front 4 has rarely been a problem spot for this team, and our ability to add players like Kearse and Babin in free agency are a part of that reason. Knowing who will fit into your scheme and whether they're worth the money.Look, every team has holes in their team that you could start to ask questions. I think the Eagles have had mind-bogglingly bad track records with other aspects of the team, linebacker included. But DL? It's not one of them.

To clarify, when I said DL evaluation, I was refering to the draft. Just watching all the hits the Giants get at DL made me think of it the other day. They rarely miss at that position even though they are terrible at LB evaluation.

Effing Graham over JPP still makes me sick

 

[Insein]

Yet another laughable post from you Wood. Yes cole was a great pick. In 13 years that's gonna happen (probably should happen more than once). But to try and defend their evaluation and drafting of DL is futile. Babin is a product of Jim Washburn. Yeah the eagles signed him, but two years ago they would have told you he stunk. Patterson and Bunkley were first round picks that amounted to very little. They are average at best making no impact on games. I remember at one point they collectively had like 2 sacks over three full seasons, something that was almost unbelievable. And I don't remember people gushing about graham. What I remember is everyone being baffled as to why they didn't draft earl Thomas and instead took yet another question mark undersized DL. Then you look at their picks from 2006 on and it's a bunch of stiffs that couldn't get on the field. My favorite being teo nesheim of course. A reach by two rounds atleast and a year later he's not in the league. That's six drafts with nothing to show for itObviously their drafting of DL pales in comparison to their drafting of LB

The OP said the Eagles weren't good at evaluating DL talent...it wasn't limited to the draft. Shane then made a comment about our drafting 4 or 5 DL each year, which is factually inaccurate, to say the least. This organization has certainly showed an ability to evaluate the DL position. Our front 4 has rarely been a problem spot for this team, and our ability to add players like Kearse and Babin in free agency are a part of that reason. Knowing who will fit into your scheme and whether they're worth the money.Look, every team has holes in their team that you could start to ask questions. I think the Eagles have had mind-bogglingly bad track records with other aspects of the team, linebacker included. But DL? It's not one of them.

To clarify, when I said DL evaluation, I was refering to the draft. Just watching all the hits the Giants get at DL made me think of it the other day. They rarely miss at that position even though they are terrible at LB evaluation.

Effing Graham over JPP still makes me sick

They apparently knew their stuff again. JPP was thought to be a raw talent and now he's a stud. Whether thats talent evaluation or coaching, it still points to the Giants being superior at both over the Eagles.

 

[delusional]

http://bloggingthebe...bowl-practices/

The Eagles, just like every other NFL team, are going to be speaking with hundreds of prospects between now and the draft in April. However, so far here at the Senior Bowl practices, I've seen the Eagles speak with eight prospects after practices. Six of them were pass rushers, and they all spoke with Player Personnel Executive, Phil Savage.

I would officially take a massive dump at the front of the linc if they take a DE in the first 3 picks. You know whoever goes in the 3rd will be a bust ( just by track record ).

As for the above topics, eagles can not draft / produce defensive talent at all really. Most of their defensive picks have been reaches to begin with along with turning into a JAG.

 

[Amused to Death]

http://bloggingthebe...bowl-practices/

The Eagles, just like every other NFL team, are going to be speaking with hundreds of prospects between now and the draft in April. However, so far here at the Senior Bowl practices, I've seen the Eagles speak with eight prospects after practices. Six of them were pass rushers, and they all spoke with Player Personnel Executive, Phil Savage.

I would officially take a massive dump at the front of the linc if they take a DE in the first 3 picks. You know whoever goes in the 3rd will be a bust ( just by track record ).

As for the above topics, eagles can not draft / produce defensive talent at all really. Most of their defensive picks have been reaches to begin with along with turning into a JAG.

Kinda strange that the person who has the final say on all draft picks was in Philly at the Sixers game last night. Some jokes on twitter last night was that since the Sixers are currently the best defensive NBA team, Andy was scouting Doug Collins to be the Eagles next DC.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

http://bloggingthebe...bowl-practices/

The Eagles, just like every other NFL team, are going to be speaking with hundreds of prospects between now and the draft in April. However, so far here at the Senior Bowl practices, I've seen the Eagles speak with eight prospects after practices. Six of them were pass rushers, and they all spoke with Player Personnel Executive, Phil Savage.

I would officially take a massive dump at the front of the linc if they take a DE in the first 3 picks. You know whoever goes in the 3rd will be a bust ( just by track record ).

As for the above topics, eagles can not draft / produce defensive talent at all really. Most of their defensive picks have been reaches to begin with along with turning into a JAG.

Place your bets....Our future LBer is one of them.

 

[thriftyrocker]

Now if you want to assail Andy & Company's LINEBACKER choices, that's another thing entirely:

Not all these choices are bad. There are a lot of good choices in there, they just aren't spending high enough draft picks to get Pro Bowl level players. Chaney was a great pick. Rolle was a good pick. Matthews is not a bad pick; they just ruined him. Bradley just couldn't stay healthy (of course that's part of the reason he wasn't an earlier pick and the Eagles MO is to take injury risks who somehow always get re-injured). But even some of our relative hits were traded for garbage. Mays was traded for JJ Arrington (!). Gocong was a throw-in when we cut ties with Sheldon Brown. I went back and checked, they turned Brown and Gocong into Trevard Lindley and Ricky Sapp.I guess one plus of spending a 1st on a LB would be they would actually stick with him instead of swapping in the next 5'11" guy they took in the 6th round who might be almost as good.