A Longer School Day/Year for Students (1 Viewer)

[MCguidance]

Do you think this is a good or bad idea? Should our kids be in school longer and continue into the summer?

http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/01/gov_christie_to_seek_longer_school_days_and_school_years.html

With his State of the State address today, Gov. Chris Christie will dive into the national debate over whether more class time is better for students.

The Republican governor tried to make education a centerpiece of his first term and will continue the trend into his second term with a call for longer school days and shorter vacations.

"Despite the improvements we are seeing in Newark and Camden, I believe we need to take bigger and broader steps to adjust our approach to K-12 education to address the new competitive world we live in," according to an excerpt from the speech obtained by The Star-Ledger.

"Our school calendar is antiquated both educationally and culturally. Life in 2014 demands something more for our students. It is time to lengthen both the school day and school year in New Jersey."

The speech will provide no details about the plan so it is unclear how much Christie wants to add to the school day, or the 180-day school calendar.

Working with Democrats, Christie enacted tenure reform, merit pay in Newark schools and the Urban Hope Act, which gave private nonprofits the authority to build "renaissance schools" in Newark, Camden and Trenton. Democrats stymied his efforts to pass a voucher plan that would give students in low-performing schools money for tuition in private schools.

"If student achievement is lagging at the exact moment when we need improvement more than ever in order to compete in the world economy, should we not take these steps — every possible step — to boost student achievement?" Christie’s speech will say.

"Of course we should. And one key step is to lengthen the school day and the school year. So, working with (Education) Commissioner Cerf, I will present to you shortly a proposal to increase the length of both the school day and the school year in New Jersey. This is a key step to improve student outcomes, and boost our competitiveness. We should do it now."

Proponents of longer school days say more instruction time for core subjects like math and reading as well as enrichment subjects can improve achievement, particularly for low-income students. Critics say longer school days can place too much burden on teachers, and students need schools with more resources more than more time for instruction.

In Chicago, Mayor Rahm Emanuel’s initiative for longer school days faced intense opposition from the city’s teacher’s union and some parents, and eventually became an issue during a district-wide teacher’s strike in 2012. The city implemented a longer day, but also agreed to give teachers additional support.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I think the school year should be longer. The school day is already pretty long, I guess it depends what the kids would be doing with the extra time. I wouldn't want them sitting at desks any longer each day.

 

[Jobber]

"Our school calendar is antiquated both educationally and culturally. Life in 2014 demands something more for our students. It is time to lengthen both the school day and school year in New Jersey."

IMO, a 7 hour school day is long enough for children. Lengthening it to what purpose? To make our kids grind it out like many of us adults do? Yeah, this is the quickest way to sour education on kids and make them hate school.

I voted no on lengthening the school year as well. I know a lot of voters want year round, likely having to do with wanting to save on daycare costs. Kids need a summer break. I can't imagine not having summers off as a kid. That would be teh suck.

 

[Mr. Ected]

Gonna put on my old foggie hat here for a minute...

Way back when I was in HS, we started at 7:30 and were done at 2. That allowed us to do this crazy thing after school. Work. I had jobs after school in a couple of places, warehouse (Large Womens shoes - story for another time), grass care company telemarketing, ice cream shop, etc. And I made some $$$ for myself. I also had time for after school activities, sports, etc.

I don't understand this thing that older kids need more sleep. In my county, the younger kids go to school first, then middle school, then HS. This screws everything up. By the time they get finished with their after school activities, it's like 5 o'clock. BS. If they have to start school later, they will just stay up later. Same amount of sleep, or less!

 

[MattFancy]

I'd be okay with making the school year a little longer. Or maybe not even making it longer, but stop with the random days of for parent teach conferences and such.

Most kids are in school for 6 hours a day. I feel like that is plenty of time.

 

[omahawildcat25]

So does that mean the government will waste even more money on education?

 

[MCguidance]

So does that mean the government will waste even more money on education?

Expect the teachers to get paid less, if anything.

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Long-time teacher, first-time answerer:

School day should stay the same.

School year should be longer.

 

[Slapdash]

Absolutely no to both.

 

[Mr. Ected]

I'd be okay with making the school year a little longer. Or maybe not even making it longer, but stop with the random days of for parent teach conferences and such.

Most kids are in school for 6 hours a day. I feel like that is plenty of time.

Not sure about your area, but ours the "random days off" are at the end of quarters, and give the teachers a day to work on the kids grades and prepare for the new quarter. Nice for them.

 

[dozer]

So does that mean the government will waste even more money on education?

Expect the teachers to get paid less, if anything.

Teacher contracts will be longer, so they will make more money. They won't just say "sorry, you'll be working four more weeks for the same money".

 

[irish eyes]

In my area i wish they would give them winters off and make them go to school in summer. If the forecast even hints of snow flurries the whole county goes into lock down, it's quite pathetic. But then again i'm sure they are worried about lawsuits from all of the ##### bag parents that exist today.

 

[MattFancy]

I'd be okay with making the school year a little longer. Or maybe not even making it longer, but stop with the random days of for parent teach conferences and such.

Most kids are in school for 6 hours a day. I feel like that is plenty of time.

Not sure about your area, but ours the "random days off" are at the end of quarters, and give the teachers a day to work on the kids grades and prepare for the new quarter. Nice for them.

Little different in MD. Yes, they do have those days towards the end of quarter/semester, but then they also seemingly have them once a month or so.

 

[Scoresman]

summer vacations are the best. why do we want to take that away from our kids?

 

[danielmclark]

No to longer day, yes to longer year - but not by eliminating summer. There are ample ways to extend the year - cut the winter break short by half, eliminate spring break, and cut a week on either side of summer. That gives students an extra full month while still retaining the majority of their summer and winter break. Spring break is ######ed. Always has been, always will be. It's completely unnecessary.

Then give the teachers a 40% raise. They're underpaid as it is.

 

[AcerFC]

I was just saying we should be on a permanent 2 hour delay schedule. Come in at 10, leave at 2

 

[Slapdash]

Gonna put on my old foggie hat here for a minute...

Way back when I was in HS, we started at 7:30 and were done at 2. That allowed us to do this crazy thing after school. Work. I had jobs after school in a couple of places, warehouse (Large Womens shoes - story for another time), grass care company telemarketing, ice cream shop, etc. And I made some $$$ for myself. I also had time for after school activities, sports, etc.

I don't understand this thing that older kids need more sleep. In my county, the younger kids go to school first, then middle school, then HS. This screws everything up. By the time they get finished with their after school activities, it's like 5 o'clock. BS. If they have to start school later, they will just stay up later. Same amount of sleep, or less!

Or playing outside. What a novel concept that was.

Maybe Christie thinks kids just aren't fat enough these days and need to spend more time sitting down and eating terrible meals at school.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

summer vacations are the best. why do we want to take that away from our kids?

Summer vacations are great for some kids. Other kids not as much.

 

[lod01]

Both should be longer because punks today are so stupid. It takes them longer to learn anything if they can learn at all.

On the other hand, I did get the correct change at the drive thru today. $8.54, gave him $20.04, he typed it in and I got my $11.50 back with just a slight pause.

 

[AcerFC]

Then give the teachers a 40% raise. They're underpaid as it is.

This. I would make close to $200,000 at the top of my scale

 

[FreeBaGeL]

So does that mean the government will waste even more money on education?

Expect the teachers to get paid less, if anything.

Teacher contracts will be longer, so they will make more money. They won't just say "sorry, you'll be working four more weeks for the same money".

At a salaried job? I'm sure they'll try.

When a job tells a salaried employee that they're going to have to work the next 4 weekends because they have a big deadline coming up, does it come with a raise?

 

[MCguidance]

So does that mean the government will waste even more money on education?

Expect the teachers to get paid less, if anything.

Teacher contracts will be longer, so they will make more money. They won't just say "sorry, you'll be working four more weeks for the same money".

No way. Expect collective bargaining to go next.

 

[17seconds]

There should be more days of school. Too many holidays. Ours just got back from a 2 week winter break and now they get this Friday and Monday off. WTF?

 

[Bull Dozier]

No to a longer school day, yes to a longer school year.

Kids lose so much over the summer, at least a month in the fall is remediation work. It's a rediculous waste of time.

My proposal would be one month off for summer, one week off in early summer to help the kids with their day dreaming of the warm weather. July off (saves on cooling costs for most schools), and one week off in late summer.

 

[Slapdash]

There should be more days of school. Too many holidays. Ours just got back from a 2 week winter break and now they get this Friday and Monday off. WTF?

Damn kids have it too easy. Need to start preparing them for to work 40 hours a week 50 weeks a year earlier.

 

[joffer]

noyes

 

[Scoresman]

lotta grumpy old people in this thread.

"back in my day...."

 

[Mr. Ected]

I'd be okay with making the school year a little longer. Or maybe not even making it longer, but stop with the random days of for parent teach conferences and such.

Most kids are in school for 6 hours a day. I feel like that is plenty of time.

Not sure about your area, but ours the "random days off" are at the end of quarters, and give the teachers a day to work on the kids grades and prepare for the new quarter. Nice for them.

Little different in MD. Yes, they do have those days towards the end of quarter/semester, but then they also seemingly have them once a month or so.

Where in MD, cause I'm in NOVA?

Gonna put on my old foggie hat here for a minute...

Way back when I was in HS, we started at 7:30 and were done at 2. That allowed us to do this crazy thing after school. Work. I had jobs after school in a couple of places, warehouse (Large Womens shoes - story for another time), grass care company telemarketing, ice cream shop, etc. And I made some $$$ for myself. I also had time for after school activities, sports, etc.

I don't understand this thing that older kids need more sleep. In my county, the younger kids go to school first, then middle school, then HS. This screws everything up. By the time they get finished with their after school activities, it's like 5 o'clock. BS. If they have to start school later, they will just stay up later. Same amount of sleep, or less!

Or playing outside. What a novel concept that was.

Maybe Christie thinks kids just aren't fat enough these days and need to spend more time sitting down and eating terrible meals at school.

Yeah, playing outside for the the younger ones! Of course the trick would be getting the kids off their stinking electronic games and outside, but that is a separate argument!

 

[Mile High]

Who's going to pay to put AC into all those schools?

 

[Slapdash]

I'd be okay with making the school year a little longer. Or maybe not even making it longer, but stop with the random days of for parent teach conferences and such.

Most kids are in school for 6 hours a day. I feel like that is plenty of time.

Not sure about your area, but ours the "random days off" are at the end of quarters, and give the teachers a day to work on the kids grades and prepare for the new quarter. Nice for them.

Little different in MD. Yes, they do have those days towards the end of quarter/semester, but then they also seemingly have them once a month or so.

Where in MD, cause I'm in NOVA?

Gonna put on my old foggie hat here for a minute...

Way back when I was in HS, we started at 7:30 and were done at 2. That allowed us to do this crazy thing after school. Work. I had jobs after school in a couple of places, warehouse (Large Womens shoes - story for another time), grass care company telemarketing, ice cream shop, etc. And I made some $$$ for myself. I also had time for after school activities, sports, etc.

I don't understand this thing that older kids need more sleep. In my county, the younger kids go to school first, then middle school, then HS. This screws everything up. By the time they get finished with their after school activities, it's like 5 o'clock. BS. If they have to start school later, they will just stay up later. Same amount of sleep, or less!

Or playing outside. What a novel concept that was.

Maybe Christie thinks kids just aren't fat enough these days and need to spend more time sitting down and eating terrible meals at school.

Yeah, playing outside for the the younger ones! Of course the trick would be getting the kids off their stinking electronic games and outside, but that is a separate argument!

Another good reason to keep summer break.

 

[MattFancy]

I'd be okay with making the school year a little longer. Or maybe not even making it longer, but stop with the random days of for parent teach conferences and such.

Most kids are in school for 6 hours a day. I feel like that is plenty of time.

Not sure about your area, but ours the "random days off" are at the end of quarters, and give the teachers a day to work on the kids grades and prepare for the new quarter. Nice for them.

Little different in MD. Yes, they do have those days towards the end of quarter/semester, but then they also seemingly have them once a month or so.

Where in MD, cause I'm in NOVA?

Southern MD

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Who's going to pay to put AC into all those schools?

How many schools do you think don't have AC?

 

[omahawildcat25]

Who's going to pay to put AC into all those schools?

How many schools do you think don't have AC?

More than you think. There are usually at least a couple days every year that is canceled in Omaha due to heat. If only one school in a district that doesn't have AC and needs to cancel, the whole district is canceled.

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Who's going to pay to put AC into all those schools?

How many schools do you think don't have AC?

More than you think. There are usually at least a couple days every year that is canceled in Omaha due to heat. If only one school in a district that doesn't have AC and needs to cancel, the whole district is canceled.

Well I think that there are only 4 schools in the entire country that have AC.

 

[Mr. Ected]

Who's going to pay to put AC into all those schools?

How many schools do you think don't have AC?

More than you think. There are usually at least a couple days every year that is canceled in Omaha due to heat. If only one school in a district that doesn't have AC and needs to cancel, the whole district is canceled.

Well I think that there are only 4 schools in the entire country that have AC.

Ours do, NOVA. Gets real warm here in spring and early part of fall.

Actually, if they had make the year longer, I'd have them start school sometime in August. By then the kids are done with summer. Stretching late into June wouldn't work. The kids aren't paying attention, they are just waiting to get out.

 

[MCguidance]

No to a longer school day, yes to a longer school year.

Kids lose so much over the summer, at least a month in the fall is remediation work. It's a rediculous waste of time.

My proposal would be one month off for summer, one week off in early summer to help the kids with their day dreaming of the warm weather. July off (saves on cooling costs for most schools), and one week off in late summer.

Can't argue with this.

 

[MCguidance]

Who's going to pay to put AC into all those schools?

How many schools do you think don't have AC?

Ours doesn't.

 

[NIU Kicker]

I think more of a year round approach would be better for all involved. Give them 6 weeks in the summer three weeks around the holidays a week or two in the spring and Fall, but run it all year long.

The hours are really for the benefit of the 9-5 working majority so I don't think it realistic to change the 8-2 schedule.

 

[MCguidance]

I think more of a year round approach would be better for all involved. Give them 6 weeks in the summer three weeks around the holidays a week or two in the spring and Fall, but run it all year long.

The hours are really for the benefit of the 9-5 working majority so I don't think it realistic to change the 8-2 schedule.

An 8-2 schedule would be sweet, but I'm not sure that exists in NJ. I know CT has something like that, but the earliest I've seen public schools end during a typical day was 2:30 or so. Our school gets out at 2:51.

 

[dutch]

Here's a good comparison of the traditional school calendar vs. a year round calendar:

http://www.nayre.org/calendar_comparison.htm

 

[Wilfredo Ledezma]

Yes. However the costs associated with it are kind of prohibitive, as most school districts aren't exactly bleeding cash these days.

 

[17seconds]

There should be more days of school. Too many holidays. Ours just got back from a 2 week winter break and now they get this Friday and Monday off. WTF?

Damn kids have it too easy. Need to start preparing them for to work 40 hours a week 50 weeks a year earlier.

I'm talking about adding 10-20 days a year. Right now they are in class about 175 days.

 

[igbomb]

The consequence of having summers off is the drop in global performance of our students relative to other nations.

There has been quite a bit of research on the topic (no time to search for links right now) and it is quite clear that the biggest correlation to success in school is days in school.

At a minimum, we need to change the way that the off-days are structured. Having an entire summer off leads to a ridiculous amount of brain drain. If you look at the research on standardized test scores taken in the spring and again in the fall after break, you can see the big drop-off that takes place in the summer, only to have to build it back up again in the fall before teaching new stuff. The charts look like a sawtooth.

And the amount of brain drain is even worse for poorer kids, leading them to fall further and further behind. More affluent kids go to camp or family vacations or other enrichment activiites. Poor kids sit at home watching their siblings while their parents go off to work.

If we simply gave two to three weeks off after each quarter, timed to align to major holidays, instead of giving the entire summer off, we would see instant improvement in kids' performance. Gone are the days where families take month-long vacations to summer resorts. There is no need for the full break. My kids are bored by July as it is.

But I don't like the idea of a longer day. Keep the days manageable, just more of them.

 

[KCitons]

Homeschooled

Our kids had shorter than average school days, but went year round. Some breaks were scheduled (Christmas, Spring, etc) others were decided by the family schedule. (vacation, Boy Scout camp, hunting trips) and still others were set by the kids themselves.

This schedule has allowed them to work at their own pace. May not work for all kids, but mine all are set to finish 9-14 months early.

 

[GoFishTN]

The consequence of having summers off is the drop in global performance of our students relative to other nations.

There has been quite a bit of research on the topic (no time to search for links right now) and it is quite clear that the biggest correlation to success in school is days in school.

I would like to see links to these studies, because the information I've seen is that the biggest indicator for success in school is the economic status of the parents.

Lengthening the school year or the school day isn't going to make poor schools start turning out successful kids all of the sudden.

 

[BoltzNBrew]

I live in a school district that runs from 1st week of August to last week of May. They basically have all of June and July off. Only good thing about this schedule is 2 weeks off for Spring Break which is the last week of March and first week of April and 2 weeks off in the middle of October so we plan vacations and don't have to deal with normal spring break crowds. Other than that it sucks. They take so many "Teacher Development" days it just seems too may breaks to get any momentum going for the kids.

Link to School Calendar

 

[NCCommish]

Long-time teacher, first-time answerer:

School day should stay the same.

School year should be longer.

How I voted, The idea of being off during the summer made sense at one point in America. Now all it does is cause remedial work in Sept. Not saying no break but it seems to me a bunch of smaller breaks makes more sense than one large 2.5 month break.

 

[Vike Me]

day no, year yes

 

[Statcruncher]

Both should be longer because punks today are so stupid. It takes them longer to learn anything if they can learn at all.

On the other hand, I did get the correct change at the drive thru today. $8.54, gave him $20.04, he typed it in and I got my $11.50 back with just a slight pause.

Not trying to derail the conversation here, but if you hate change that much why don't you just hand him the $20 and tell him to put the coins in the donation box or "give a penny take a penny" container. You would come across much less toolish.

 

[sporthenry]

The consequence of having summers off is the drop in global performance of our students relative to other nations.

There has been quite a bit of research on the topic (no time to search for links right now) and it is quite clear that the biggest correlation to success in school is days in school.

I would like to see links to these studies, because the information I've seen is that the biggest indicator for success in school is the economic status of the parents.

Lengthening the school year or the school day isn't going to make poor schools start turning out successful kids all of the sudden.

http://www.summerlearning.org/?page=know_the_facts

I'm not really sure if summer vacation is the biggest correlation and those studies would have to be done across countries. However, part of the economic status is tied into summer vacation b/c more affluent families keep their kids more engaged with summer camps and classes as opposed to poor families.