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HBO - Song of Ice&Fire Series -Varsity Thread - no TV only whiners (1 Viewer)

There is so much that I forgot after my first read through. I'm already forgetting stuff in my second (should finish clash of kings today).

Grrm really is brilliant.

 
It's also interesting to read each POV straight through books 4 and 5. Brienne's story is a lot more interesting if if you take it for what it is and just read it, rather than looking at it as an interruption from the stuff you'd really rather be reading.

 
Maik Jeaunz said:
Leeroy Jenkins said:
Then she sees:

a blue-eyed king with a red sword in his hand who casts no shadow;[6]

a cloth dragon amidst a cheering crowd;

a great stone beast flying from a smoking tower, breathing shadow fire;

They then say "slayer of lies" which I take to mean she exposes 3 false kings of Westeros. The first image is stannis and the second aegon I think. But who is the great stone beast spewing shadow fire?
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maybe Littlefinger? he's in charge of the Vale ("stone") and technically still the lord of Harrenhal I think ("smoking tower"). and because he makes all of his moves from the "shadows"?
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Read a good argument on the internet that this is a character/house we have only heard mention of which is House Hightower in Oldtown. The High Tower is a huge tower/beacon and Lord & Lady Hightower have not been seen in ages as they have locked themselves in the top tower consulting "spellbooks." The Hightowers are also descended from the first men like the Starks and one of the King's of old. Fits in with the Citadel and Maesters taking more prominent roles in the last two books.Maester Marwyn is almost certainly the "perfumed sensachal" spoken of in the prophecy. He's an interesting character that we've gotten very small tidbits about all the way back to the first book.

 
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Uruk-Hai said:
Maelstrom said:
Thunderlips said:
timschochet said:
Been reading my way through this series because the tv show is so good. I really enjoyed the first 3 books. But the 4th book...is incredibly dull. I'm really having trouble getting through it. Is it worth it to continue?
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Yes.
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To expand on that, the 4th and 5th book were originally a single book, but were split up in such a way that some (of the most popular) PoV characters don't get any chapters until book 5. This continues through about the first half of book 5, and then it's pretty obvious from there that the "split" is over and it's back on track for the series again (at least, that is how it seemed to me). Regardless, I enjoyed book 5 quite a bit more than 4, but likely because a lot of the PoV characters I liked were not in book 4 at all.
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Here is a recommended combined reading order for the two books that seems to be liked by a lot of readers.

http://boiledleather.com/post/25902554148/a-new-readerfriendly-combined-reading-order-for-a

I haven't tried it myself and am not sure how useful it is for first-time readers, but at least you wouldn't have to slog through 1,000 pages before catching up with certain characters.
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I may give this a go, finished the first book a few weeks ago on a reread that I'm hoping will take me right into both the next book and season. Assuming the book comes out before the season still. We'll see. But that reading order seems like a nice way to add a little extra interest to the reread.

 
timschochet said:
Been reading my way through this series because the tv show is so good. I really enjoyed the first 3 books. But the 4th book...is incredibly dull. I'm really having trouble getting through it. Is it worth it to continue?
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Unless book 6 is a massive improvement (if/when it comes out), no.

 
Gave up on my re-read, 500 pages into Clash of Kings. I can't get through 2 pages without falling asleep.

 
Abrantes said:
timschochet said:
Been reading my way through this series because the tv show is so good. I really enjoyed the first 3 books. But the 4th book...is incredibly dull. I'm really having trouble getting through it. Is it worth it to continue?
Click to expand...
Unless book 6 is a massive improvement (if/when it comes out), no.
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I am torn. I was really disappointed in the 4th and 5th books. I think a lot of that is because book 3 was one of the best books I have read in awhile in any genre. That said, I have tried to read other series in an attempt to fill my GoT fix, and I can't stand anything else I have tried in the genre either, so I start to think that books 4 and 5 weren't that bad. Stuff still happens, but it is a lot more spread out in the last 2 books. I think it was a huge misstep for them to release book 4 as it is (without a lot of the main characters that people love). I am all for introducing new characters, but to go without Jon, Tyrion, etc.. was just horrible.

I would say that 3 >>>> 1>2>>>>>>4>5. Mostly my hatred of 5 has to do with where a couple the main characters end up at the end of the book.

 
shuke said:
Gave up on my re-read, 500 pages into Clash of Kings. I can't get through 2 pages without falling asleep.
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Come on Shuke! I'm 30 pages from finishing it. It's worth going through just for the house of the undying and black water. There's a lot there that makes more sense now in the second read.
 
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.

 
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
Reading them again with that type of investigation in mind, do you think reading them as written or the combined reading recommended above will be more effective?

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
Reading them again with that type of investigation in mind, do you think reading them as written or the combined reading recommended above will be more effective?
Click to expand...
I'm going to read them in the "Dorne Reveal" variant order that combines the two books (someone posted it above) next time around.

Keep in mind, I've spent quite bit of time sorting through fan theories on boards too. Lots of bad reasoning there, but also some pretty inspired sleuthing that will prove to be pretty close to right. I'd have never figured out most of that stuff on my own.

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
Reading them again with that type of investigation in mind, do you think reading them as written or the combined reading recommended above will be more effective?
Click to expand...
Read as written. Splitting up chapters is a waste of time.

 
sn0mm1s said:
Leeroy Jenkins said:
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
Reading them again with that type of investigation in mind, do you think reading them as written or the combined reading recommended above will be more effective?
Click to expand...
Read as written. Splitting up chapters is a waste of time.
Click to expand...
You do realize that is what my link is doing, right? Reading them as they were written.

He wrote books 4 and 5 as one book, but was forced to split them apart due to the publisher.

 
Harry Manback said:
sn0mm1s said:
Leeroy Jenkins said:
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
Reading them again with that type of investigation in mind, do you think reading them as written or the combined reading recommended above will be more effective?
Click to expand...
Read as written. Splitting up chapters is a waste of time.
Click to expand...
You do realize that is what my link is doing, right? Reading them as they were written.

He wrote books 4 and 5 as one book, but was forced to split them apart due to the publisher.
Click to expand...
Actually, only about 25-30% of ADWD was written by the time AFFC was published. If you want to get this pedantic the last chapter of ASOS would've been the Red Wedding. Point being, it buys you next to nothing to read the chapters in a different order than they were published.

 
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
My problem is way more with the structure due to waiting on the books than it is with the writing itself. I read book 3 not long after it was published and didn't get another Jon or Dany or Tyrion chapter for 10 years. That isn't nearly the problem now for someone who's reading straight through (well, not until they're also waiting for unpublished books like the rest of us have) but, depending on the amount of time set aside to read, it still can be quite a gap (in "reading time").

I do think some fat could have been trimmed out of the last two books, but I agree that the writing itself is as good (if not better) in those two than the earlier three.

 
Have you guys read the Dunc and Egg short stories and the various other "histories" (authorized or otherwise) of Westros and the Seven Kingdoms?

 
Uruk-Hai said:
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
My problem is way more with the structure due to waiting on the books than it is with the writing itself. I read book 3 not long after it was published and didn't get another Jon or Dany or Tyrion chapter for 10 years. That isn't nearly the problem now for someone who's reading straight through (well, not until they're also waiting for unpublished books like the rest of us have) but, depending on the amount of time set aside to read, it still can be quite a gap (in "reading time").

I do think some fat could have been trimmed out of the last two books, but I agree that the writing itself is as good (if not better) in those two than the earlier three.
Click to expand...
While I understand your point and agree with it......I think is the way people are going to have to judge it; whether or not it holds up and is coherent on a straight thru read. After all, thats how it's going to be for the ages.

 
Back in the olden days, all books were written and published in serial form. Of course it was only a week between chapters, not 5 years, but the point is the same...

 
DCThunder said:
Have you guys read the Dunc and Egg short stories and the various other "histories" (authorized or otherwise) of Westros and the Seven Kingdoms?
Click to expand...
The Dunk & Egg stories are a ton of fun, IMO. They also color the "current" story in several ways I won't mention. I think the first 3 are coming out in their own volume this fall. Might want to wait until then. Previously, they were scattered across different anthologies.The two "Dance Of Dragons" stories recently released are, as far as I know, only available in anthologies as well. They're set well before the Dunk & Egg stuff. They're ok, but they feel abbreviated to me (like Martin's holding something back).

You can get the gist of those two stories in The World Of Ice & Fire, along with the rest of the known history of Westeros (& some across the pond). That's a fairly expensive book in paper form, though - and I wouldn't waste the money for an e-book version of it. I think the artwork makes it worth the price if you're into Martin's world. But there's a #### load of backstory, too, including some that run right up to Robert's Rebellion.

 
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Thunderlips said:
Uruk-Hai said:
wdcrob said:
I couldn't disagree more re: books 4 and 5. They're different than the first three, but reward close reading. No one's actually got it all figured out yet IMO, but the amount of stuff he buried in there that could be figured out takes some serious chops. The guy is just a phenomenal writer.
Click to expand...
My problem is way more with the structure due to waiting on the books than it is with the writing itself. I read book 3 not long after it was published and didn't get another Jon or Dany or Tyrion chapter for 10 years. That isn't nearly the problem now for someone who's reading straight through (well, not until they're also waiting for unpublished books like the rest of us have) but, depending on the amount of time set aside to read, it still can be quite a gap (in "reading time"). I do think some fat could have been trimmed out of the last two books, but I agree that the writing itself is as good (if not better) in those two than the earlier three.
Click to expand...
While I understand your point and agree with it......I think is the way people are going to have to judge it; whether or not it holds up and is coherent on a straight thru read. After all, thats how it's going to be for the ages.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure how right your last sentence will prove to be. At the risk of "timming", I'll address this more at a later time when I have more of it.

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
shuke said:
Gave up on my re-read, 500 pages into Clash of Kings. I can't get through 2 pages without falling asleep.
Click to expand...
Come on Shuke! I'm 30 pages from finishing it. It's worth going through just for the house of the undying and black water. There's a lot there that makes more sense now in the second read.
Click to expand...
I'll pick it back up at some point. I'm just kind of bored with it right now.

 
Uruk-Hai said:
DCThunder said:
Have you guys read the Dunc and Egg short stories and the various other "histories" (authorized or otherwise) of Westros and the Seven Kingdoms?
Click to expand...
The Dunk & Egg stories are a ton of fun, IMO. They also color the "current" story in several ways I won't mention. I think the first 3 are coming out in their own volume this fall. Might want to wait until then. Previously, they were scattered across different anthologies.The two "Dance Of Dragons" stories recently released are, as far as I know, only available in anthologies as well. They're set well before the Dunk & Egg stuff. They're ok, but they feel abbreviated to me (like Martin's holding something back).

You can get the gist of those two stories in The World Of Ice & Fire, along with the rest of the known history of Westeros (& some across the pond). That's a fairly expensive book in paper form, though - and I wouldn't waste the money for an e-book version of it. I think the artwork makes it worth the price if you're into Martin's world. But there's a #### load of backstory, too, including some that run right up to Robert's Rebellion.
Click to expand...
I read all the D&E stories and know the theory of how they may/may not affect the current story. I also bought all those anthologies you referred to as well as TWOIF (all as ebooks).I really liked the back story, although keeping all the participants in the various battles of the different sides of the Targaryen family straight was difficult. But some of the stuff about how difficult it was to become a dragon rider fits very neatly into the present story.

 
DCThunder said:
Uruk-Hai said:
DCThunder said:
Have you guys read the Dunc and Egg short stories and the various other "histories" (authorized or otherwise) of Westros and the Seven Kingdoms?
Click to expand...
The Dunk & Egg stories are a ton of fun, IMO. They also color the "current" story in several ways I won't mention. I think the first 3 are coming out in their own volume this fall. Might want to wait until then. Previously, they were scattered across different anthologies.The two "Dance Of Dragons" stories recently released are, as far as I know, only available in anthologies as well. They're set well before the Dunk & Egg stuff. They're ok, but they feel abbreviated to me (like Martin's holding something back).

You can get the gist of those two stories in The World Of Ice & Fire, along with the rest of the known history of Westeros (& some across the pond). That's a fairly expensive book in paper form, though - and I wouldn't waste the money for an e-book version of it. I think the artwork makes it worth the price if you're into Martin's world. But there's a #### load of backstory, too, including some that run right up to Robert's Rebellion.
Click to expand...
I read all the D&E stories and know the theory of how they may/may not affect the current story. I also bought all those anthologies you referred to as well as TWOIF (all as ebooks).I really liked the back story, although keeping all the participants in the various battles of the different sides of the Targaryen family straight was difficult. But some of the stuff about how difficult it was to become a dragon rider fits very neatly into the present story.
Click to expand...
My bad, DC. I thought you were looking for a recommendation on if you SHOULD read them.

 
rumor that the actor who played the Hound has been seen around the filming location and staying at the same hotel the cast do... :excited:

 
DCThunder said:
Have you guys read the Dunc and Egg short stories and the various other "histories" (authorized or otherwise) of Westros and the Seven Kingdoms?
Click to expand...
I have read the Dunc and Egg stories and they are very good and help give background on stuff. I have them in pdf so if anyone wants them send me your email by IM and I can send to you.

 
Reading the Catlyn chapters in a Storm or Swords is so painful when you know what all these errors result in.

GRRM does foreshadow a lot if you're paying attention.

 
Kit Harington hinted that he would be returning to Game Of Thrones in some capacity last week, despite the fact his character was killed off in the season five finale.

And on Friday the 28-year-old actor, who plays Jon Snow in the hit HBO series, was spotted on set in Belfast looking very much alive.

Having ditched his blacks, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, was standing tall in Stark clothes with his sword on his hip as they filmed on the remote Northern Ireland hilltop.
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:popcorn:

 
Sinn Fein said:
Kit Harington hinted that he would be returning to Game Of Thrones in some capacity last week, despite the fact his character was killed off in the season five finale.

And on Friday the 28-year-old actor, who plays Jon Snow in the hit HBO series, was spotted on set in Belfast looking very much alive.

Having ditched his blacks, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, was standing tall in Stark clothes with his sword on his hip as they filmed on the remote Northern Ireland hilltop.
Click to expand...
:popcorn:
Click to expand...
:boner:

 
Sinn Fein said:
Kit Harington hinted that he would be returning to Game Of Thrones in some capacity last week, despite the fact his character was killed off in the season five finale.

And on Friday the 28-year-old actor, who plays Jon Snow in the hit HBO series, was spotted on set in Belfast looking very much alive.

Having ditched his blacks, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, was standing tall in Stark clothes with his sword on his hip as they filmed on the remote Northern Ireland hilltop.
Click to expand...
:popcorn:
Click to expand...
Oh look. How unexpected. :grad:

 
Sinn Fein said:
Kit Harington hinted that he would be returning to Game Of Thrones in some capacity last week, despite the fact his character was killed off in the season five finale.

And on Friday the 28-year-old actor, who plays Jon Snow in the hit HBO series, was spotted on set in Belfast looking very much alive.

Having ditched his blacks, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, was standing tall in Stark clothes with his sword on his hip as they filmed on the remote Northern Ireland hilltop.
Click to expand...
:popcorn:
Click to expand...
You do realize this probably means a flashback.

 
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