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*** Official Barack Obama FBG campaign headquarters *** (2 Viewers)

Article I stumbled upon written by a friend of Obama's father. Frustrating read but has some interesting insight into his father's life.

Link

Monday, November 1, 2004

From Home Squared to the US Senate: How Barack Obama Was Lost and Found

By PHILIP OCHIENG

When Barack Obama Junior first visited "Home Squared" – Barack Senior's native village in Alego in the early 1990s – they confronted him with the perplexing accusation: "You're lost!" The words are English. Yet Barack Junior had never heard them in that context. For the idea they express is totally Luo.

It is a literal translation of the phrase ilal – from the intransitive verb lal, to disappear or to be away for a long time without an explanation, and the transitive verb lalo, to lose something. In Chicago's South Side, Barack Junior's adopted home, they have a homely way of expressing ilal: "Long time no see!"

But lal has a number of figurative meanings – to lose a line of thought, to deviate from the norm, to discard tradition. Simply by being born and growing up in America, Barack Junior had never been a Luo: He had lal.

And yet – because ours is a fiercely patriarchal community – Barack Junior is a Luo by the sheer fact that Barack Senior was a Luo. Barack Junior was thus doubly "lost." For, in important of ways, Barack Senior himself had for a long time "lost the way."

First, through classroom tutelage, he had imbibed the white man's culture. It was in this sense that Abong'o (as Roy now prefers to be known) and Auma – Barack Senior's children by his original (Luo) wife – had also "gone astray."

Educated in Germany and now a University of Nairobi lecturer, Auma was living in a relatively comfortable suburban home in Nairobi when Barack Junior came to Kenya. It was for this reason that she considered her Alego home to be "Home Squared. As we learned in the S.M. Otieno case, the Luo elite consider their urban residences to be mere "houses.

Their real homes are in the countryside, where they or their parents were born. Which is why whenever one takes a vacation, one pronounces with great pride: "Adhi dala!" – "I am going home!" Auma preferred to give the two places equal significance. To which Abong'o quipped that, in that case, for Barack Obama Junior, Alego was "Home Cubed."

Finally, Barack Senior had lost his way by marrying a white woman – Barack Junior's mother. This is the fate that he shares with James McBride, the black American autobiographer.

McBride’s book, The Colour of Water, is subtitled A Black Man's Tribute to His White Mother. Barack Obama Junior's book is titled Dreams from My Father. If he had inserted the word "black" in the title, the parallel would have been more striking.

But, even inside the covers, the community of themes is stark. No matter where he is, a black person always lives in two worlds. Obama Junior shares with my daughter Juliette Akinyi the fact that they are Americans with Kenyan fathers whom they never really knew.

Obama Senior left Anne – Junior's mother – almost as soon as Junior was born. Junior met Senior only once. When he was 12, Senior visited him in Honolulu, Hawaii, where Junior was growing up under the care of his white grandfather and grandmother. They never saw each other again.

Because I recognise myself in it, this is the most moving theme in Barack Obama’s book – the scar that this fact left in Junior's mind, the enduring crisis of identity that will not go away.



Like Obama Senior, I too went to the US on the famous Tom Mboya Airlift of 1959 [when hundreds of Kenyan students were given scholarships to American universities]. I first met Obama Senior in Tom Mboya's Nairobi office [Mboya was then the secretary general of the Kenya Federation of Labour]. Obama and I met up again on returning to Nairobi and remained drinking buddies for many years.

Back in the US, Nova Diane and I had left each other as soon as Akinyi was born in Chicago. Akinyi is now in her early 40s and yet we have never seen each other. We never even communicated until three years ago, when she finally traced me by e-mail.

Barack Obama Junior's book only serves to remind me of the agony that has oppressed Akinyi's mind all these years. The only consolation, if it is one, is that all black people – no matter where they are – really live in two worlds and, therefore, have an identity crisis.

One might even say that they live in no world. Even in our native Africa, walal ("we are lost"). When, by agency of Christian missionaries, European imperialism drove our forefathers’ communal spirit away from the land, we stopped being African. We started trying to think like Europeans. But we never became Europeans either. We became ghosts flitting into and out of European imagination.

Our own Ngugi wa Thiong'o has been telling us for decades – what we have refused to hear – that as long as we continue to worship European gods, European ideas on governance and European paradigms of development, all our endowments – labour, natural resources and markets – will continue to belong to Europe for the fleecing.

By seeking to enter white America's centre of power, Barack Obama Junior, who is almost certain to become a US Senator in this week’s elections, may himself be accused of surrender to a "democracy" that is in essence an "elective tyranny," the white liberal's political prescription for perpetuating an economic-intellectual system that dehumanises the black person.

But we must also reject simplistic solutions, such as the all-or-nothingism that posits – like Ngugi's own position on the English language – that nothing at all can be gained through the institutions of the oppressor. There is much that a would-be liberator can glean from the inside.

Barack Obama Junior's grassroots activities among the oppressed of Chicago's South Side show that he is keenly aware of his people's suffering and needs. They prove that he has not gone over to the white man's world.

Mention in his book of certain Chicago locations – like Cottage Grove, 95th Street, Hyde Park, Michigan Avenue, Buckingham Fountain, the Lakeside Drive, the Gold Coast – rekindle fond memories of when I was an undergraduate in the Loop. Having spent four formative years in the "Windy City", I easily identify myself with them and with him.

I know that, elected to the Senate, he will not forget his people in Hawaii and Home Squared. Indeed, throughout the black world. Nay, throughout the whole world because – as Mwalimu Julius Nyerere used to say – all oppressed people of all colours ni Waswahili.

This was perhaps why marrying a white woman didn't bother Barack Senior. And there is much to be said for that woman's own mental and moral courage that she was willing to join a black man whose world was as far away as the moon and in a country where such a marriage could prove opprobrious.

There was, however, another white woman. That was why, when I first heard of Obama Junior, I assumed that he was Ruth's son. Ruth was the wife I knew after Obama Senior came back from America and worked for Tom Mboya in the Ministry of Economic Planning.

After Obama Senior had left Anne in Honolulu, he studied at Harvard, where he met and befriended Ruth. She afterwards followed him all the way to Home Squared. I assumed that Junior was either David or Mark, Ruth's two sons whose names I no longer remembered.

What I remember, however – and much of it emerges from Obama Junior's book – was that Obama Senior's marriage to Ruth was not a happy one. Like his father, although charming, generous and extraordinarily clever, Obama Senior was also imperious, cruel and given to boasting about his brain and his wealth.

It was this kind of boasting that proved his undoing in the Kenyatta system – although, as he said, there was tribalism in it –and left him without a job, plunged him into prolonged poverty and dangerously wounded his ego.

Like me, he was excessively fond of Scotch. In his later years, he had fallen into the habit of going home drunk every night. This was what forced Ruth to sue for a divorce to marry another friend of mine, a Tanzanian.

Scotch, indeed, was what proved to be Obama Senior's final undoing. Driving a car always excited him excessively.

Obama Senior had had many extremely serious accidents. In time, both his legs had to be amputated and replaced with iron. But his pride was such that he could not tolerate "crawling like an insect" on the road. I was not surprised when I learned how he had finally died.

I was more surprised when Obama Junior emerged, as if from the blue. I knew that Home Squared, Luoland, Kenya and Africa might soon be represented in the world's most powerful council.

In this way, Barack Obama Junior was not lost.

Philip Ochieng is an editor with the Nation Media Group
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
This could ruin Bills legacy if people take the campaigns attacks the wrong way.
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
This could ruin Bills legacy if people take the campaigns attacks the wrong way.
The Clintons have already shown that they don't care about that; they just want to win.
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
This could ruin Bills legacy if people take the campaigns attacks the wrong way.
The Clintons have already shown that they don't care about that; they just want to win.
I disagree. I believe there is a limit - they will only do "so much".
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770

A drunk and a bigot - what the US Presidental hopeful HASN'T said about his father...

By SHARON CHURCHER

Last updated at 22:51pm on 27th January 2007

It is a classic story of the American dream made real: an impoverished Kenyan goatherd rising to become a brilliant Harvard-educated economist.

On the way he fights racial prejudice at home and corruption at work, survives the heartbreak of a broken relationship and, despite it all, leads the fight to rid Africa of its colonial legacy.

This extraordinary story is told by US Presidential hopeful Barack Obama as he recalls the life of the man who inspired him to political success - his father.

Mr Obama's book, Dreams From My Father, is flying off the shelves of US book stores, exciting and astonishing readers in equal measure. It is a bestseller, and no wonder - because the story just gets better and better.

Mr Obama is already Democratic Senator for Illinois. Now he is in the running to be the first black President in the country's history.

"My story is part of the larger American story," he declared in the electrifying speech that won him his Senate seat just two years ago. "In no other country on Earth is my story even possible."

Many believe Mr Obama is a serious threat to Hillary Clinton's hopes of becoming the Democrats' choice for their next Presidential candidate - and his lovingly written account of the debt he owes his father, also called Barack Obama, will do no harm at all to his Presidential hopes.

Indeed, by offering up a conveniently potted account of his personal history in this way, he might even have made a pre-emptive strike on those sure to pose the awkward questions that inevitably face a serious contender for the White House.

Yet an investigation by The Mail on Sunday has revealed that, for all Mr Obama's reputation for straight talking and the compelling narrative of his recollections, they are largely myth.

We have discovered that his father was not just a deeply flawed individual but an abusive bigamist and an egomaniac, whose life was ruined not by racism or corruption but his own weaknesses.

And, devastatingly, the testimony has come from Mr Obama's own relatives and family friends.

Charismatic and with movie-star looks, Barack Obama Jnr has managed to steal some of Hillary Clinton's most influential supporters in the two weeks since he entered the US Presidential race.

The 45-year-old lawyer depicts himself as a fresh voice for voters tired of the divisive rhetoric and self-serving ambition of established politicians on each side of the Democrat-Republican divide.

His campaign to become the first black President is inspired, he says, by his love of the country that allowed his father to triumph against astonishing odds.

Barack Obama Snr started life with the advantage of being able to read and write, but he also felt a profound sense of injustice. His father was a cook for British settlers in Kenya, who demeaningly called him their 'personal boy'.

Grandfather Obama sent his son to a missionary school but after completing his education, the youth could find little work except goatherding in his remote village of Nyangoma Kogela, in the roadless hills of Western Kenya.

At 18, he married a girl called Kezia. But Obama Snr was more interested in politics and economics than his family and his political leanings had been brought to the notice of leaders of the Kenyan Independence movement.

He was put forward for an American-sponsored scholarship in economics, with the idea being that he would eventually use his Western-honed skills in the new Kenya. At the age of 23 he headed for university in Hawaii, leaving behind the pregnant Kezia and their baby son.

Relatives say he was already a slick womaniser and, once in Honolulu, he promptly persuaded a fellow student called Ann - a naive 18-year-old white girl - to marry him. Barack Jnr was born in August, 1961.

Two years later, Obama Snr was on the move again. He was accepted at Harvard, and left his little boy and wife behind when he moved to the exclusive east coast university.

At the time, Ann explained to their son that his father had gone because his meagre stipend would not support the family if they lived together. But finance was the least of her worries.

Mr Obama Jnr claims that racism on both sides of the family destroyed the marriage between his mother and father.

In his book, he says that Ann's mother, who went by the nickname Tut, did not want a black son-in-law, and Obama Snr's father 'didn't want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman'.

In fact Ann divorced her husband after she discovered his bigamous double life. She remarried and moved to Indonesia with young Barack and her new husband, an oil company manager.

Obama Snr was forced to return to Kenya, where he fathered two more children by Kezia. He was eventually hired as a top civil servant in the fledgling government of Jomo Kenyatta - and married yet again.

Now prosperous with a flashy car and good salary, his third wife was an American-born teacher called Ruth, whom he had met at Harvard while still legally married to both Kezia and Ann, and who followed him to Africa.

A relative of Mr Obama says: "We told him[barack] how his father would still go to Kezia and it was during these visits that she became pregnant with two more children. He also had two children with Ruth."

It is alleged that Ruth finally left him after he repeatedly flew into whisky-fuelled rages, beating her brutally.

Friends say drinking blighted his life - he lost both his legs while driving under the influence and also lost his job.

However, this was no bar to his womanising: he sired a son, his eighth child, by yet another woman and continued to come home drunk.

He was about to marry her when he finally died in yet another drunken crash when Obama was 21.

Mr Obama's 40-year-old cousin Said Hussein Obama told The Mail on Sunday: "Clearly, Barack has been very deeply affected by what he has learned about his father, who was my father's older brother.

"You have to remember that his father was an African and in Africa, polygamy is part of life.

"We have assured Barack that his father was a loving person but at times it must be difficult for him to reconcile this with his father's drinking and simultaneous marriages."

Said adds: "His father was a human being and as such you can't say that he was 100 per cent perfect.

"My cousin found it difficult when he came here to learn of his half-brothers and sisters born to four different mothers.

"But just as Africans find the Western world strange so Americans coming here will find Africa strange."

Far from being an inspiration, the father whom Mr Obama was coming to know seemed like a total stranger.

In his book, he attempts to put the best face on it. His father, he writes, lost his civil service job after campaigning against corrupt African politicians who had 'taken the place of the white colonials'.

One of Obama Snr's former drinking partners, Kenyan writer Philip Ochieng Ochieng says, however, that his friend's downfall was his weak character.

"Although charming, generous and extraordinarily clever, Obama Snr was also imperious, cruel and given to boasting about his brain and his wealth," he said.

"He was excessively fond of Scotch. He had fallen into the habit of going home drunk every night. His boasting proved his undoing and left him without a job, plunged him into prolonged poverty and dangerously wounded his ego."

Ochieng recalls how, after sitting up all night drinking Black Label whisky at Nairobi's famous Stanley Hotel, Obama Snr would fly into rages if Ruth asked where he had been.

Ochieng remonstrated with his friend, saying: "You bring a woman from far away and you reduce her to pulp. That is not our way."

But it was to no avail. Ruth sued for divorce after her husband administered brutal beatings.

In fact he was a menace to life, said Ochieng. "He had many extremely serious accidents. Both his legs had to be amputated. They were replaced with crude false limbs made from iron.

"He was just like Mr Toad [from Wind In The Willows], very arrogant on the road, especially when he had whisky inside. I was not surprised when I learned how he died."

Ruth refused to comment on the abuse charges when we tracked her down to the Kenyan school where she now works.

She said: "I was married to Barack's father for seven years so, yes, you could say Barack is my stepson.

"Barack's father was a very difficult man. Although I was married to him the longest of any of his wives he wasn't an easy person to be around."

Mr Obama has acknowledged that his father grappled with a drinking problem. But with a gift for words that makes Mrs Clinton's utterances seem stiff and stale, he has turned it into another component of the myth.

Drink, he says, like drugs, are one of "the traps that seem laid in a black man's soul".

Mr Obama claims that he, too, has been racially abused, even during his campaign for the White House.

His mother, Ann, decided that he should get an American education and sent him back from Indonesia to Hawaii, where he was admitted to a £7,000-a-year prep school, Punahau Academy, and lived with his maternal grandparents.

And while there, says Mr Obama, he was tortured by fellow pupils - who let out monkey hoots - and turned into a disenchanted teenage rebel, experimenting with cocaine and marijuana.

Even his grandparents were troubled by dark skin, he says in his book, recalling how once his grandmother complained about being pestered by a beggar.

"You know why she's so scared?" he recalls his grandfather saying. "She told me the fella was black."

Mr Obama says his soaring 'dream' of a better America grew out of his 'hurt and pain'.

Friends, however, remember his time at school rather differently. He was a spoiled high-achiever, they recall, who seemed as fond of his grandparents as they were of him.

He affectionately signed a school photo of himself to them, using their pet names, Tut and Gramps.

The caption says: "Thanks... for all the good times." He worked on the school's literary magazine and wore a white suit, of the style popular with New York writers at the time.

One of his former classmates, Alan Lum, said: "Hawaii is such a melting pot that it didn't occur to me when we were growing up that he might have problems about being one of the few African-Americans at the school. Us kids didn't see colour. He was easy-going and well-liked."

Lon Wysard, who also attended the academy, said the budding politician was in fact idolised for his keen sportsmanship.

"He was the star basketball player and always had a ball in his hand wherever he was," Wysard recalled.

Mr Obama was later admitted to read politics and international relations at New York's prestigious Columbia University where, his book claims, "no matter how many times the administration tried to paint them over, the walls remained scratched with blunt correspondence (about) ######s."

But one of his classmates, Joe Zwicker, 45, now a lawyer in Boston, said yesterday: "That surprises me. Columbia was a pretty tolerant place. There were African American students in my classes and I never saw any evidence of racism at all."

Family members and acquaintances believe that the real cloud over Mr Obama's life has been the discovery that his father was far from the romantic figure that his mother tried to portray.

A family friend said: "He is haunted by his father's failures. He grew up thinking of his father as a brilliant intellectual and pioneer of African independence only to learn that in Western terms he was basically a drunken lecher."

This ugly truth, say friends, has made Mr Obama ruthlessly determined to use every weapon that he has to succeed, including the glossily edited version of his father's story.

"At the end of the day Barack wants the story to help his political cause, so perhaps he couldn't afford to be too honest," said Ochieng.

Significantly, it was only four years after his father's death that Mr Obama travelled to his father's ancestral Kenyan village. There he learned the full story of his father's life and met some of his relatives.

One of his half-sisters, Auma, is now a council worker in southern England, but some of his other relatives are still living in huts in the village, without plumbing or electricity, farming a few scrawny goats and chicken and growing fruit and maize.

They speak the tribal Luo language and depend on handouts from family members who have emigrated to the UK and the United States for their few luxuries, notably the transistor radios that they use to follow Mr Obama's rocketing political fortunes.

He has positioned himself as a devout Christian (having found God, he says, after years as an atheist) and in a new book The Audacity Of Hope, timed to coincide with his campaign, he concentrates on his manifesto for 'reclaiming the American dream'.

This tome contains one telling paragraph, in a section in which he fumbles to try to justify his abrupt leap into the national political arena: he is, he says, chronically 'restless'.

"Someone once said that every man is trying to either live up to his father's expectations or make up for his father's mistakes, and I suppose that may explain my particular malady."

Additional reporting: Rob Crilly in Nairobi and Gill Pringle in Honolulu.
 
After watching the results show on CNN last night, I have a question. Do you guys think it's wise for Obama to be ripping on the "status quo" of our government? While I agree absolutely with what he is saying about the "same old same old", it's becoming clear to me that this could end up a situation where super delegates decide this thing. The people would vote for one person and the super delegates the other etc. Will those super delegates automatically side with Hillary because they are part of the "status quo" or will they actually stand up and do what is right and vote for the person the people are voting for? This is a bit of a concern for me.

 
After watching the results show on CNN last night, I have a question. Do you guys think it's wise for Obama to be ripping on the "status quo" of our government? While I agree absolutely with what he is saying about the "same old same old", it's becoming clear to me that this could end up a situation where super delegates decide this thing. The people would vote for one person and the super delegates the other etc. Will those super delegates automatically side with Hillary because they are part of the "status quo" or will they actually stand up and do what is right and vote for the person the people are voting for? This is a bit of a concern for me.
I think most of the undecided Super Delegates will back who they think is the winning horse in the race. They want to win in November, first and foremost.
 
After watching the results show on CNN last night, I have a question. Do you guys think it's wise for Obama to be ripping on the "status quo" of our government? While I agree absolutely with what he is saying about the "same old same old", it's becoming clear to me that this could end up a situation where super delegates decide this thing. The people would vote for one person and the super delegates the other etc. Will those super delegates automatically side with Hillary because they are part of the "status quo" or will they actually stand up and do what is right and vote for the person the people are voting for? This is a bit of a concern for me.
I think most of the undecided Super Delegates will back who they think is the winning horse in the race. They want to win in November, first and foremost.
This is what i am hopeful of, but I don't underestimate the power of "the good ole boy" network in Washington and it has me a bit on edge.
 
Hillary mentioned in her speech that she's spending the next 3 weeks in Texas. Based on the post about how delegates are allocated in Texas, isn't that a terrible idea? If Obama spends more time in Ohio than Hillary, he can make enough in-roads there to keep it close, and just needs to keep it close in Texas to win about half the delegates there. Then Hillary would STILL be behind by over 100 pledged delegates AFTER Texas and Ohio.

 
After watching the results show on CNN last night, I have a question. Do you guys think it's wise for Obama to be ripping on the "status quo" of our government? While I agree absolutely with what he is saying about the "same old same old", it's becoming clear to me that this could end up a situation where super delegates decide this thing. The people would vote for one person and the super delegates the other etc. Will those super delegates automatically side with Hillary because they are part of the "status quo" or will they actually stand up and do what is right and vote for the person the people are voting for? This is a bit of a concern for me.
I think most of the undecided Super Delegates will back who they think is the winning horse in the race. They want to win in November, first and foremost.
This is what i am hopeful of, but I don't underestimate the power of "the good ole boy" network in Washington and it has me a bit on edge.
Never underestimate the power of self-preservation in politics. They see what is happening right now. The Virginia results are staggering - no Clinton spin can gloss over the results from that state.
 
My problem with Obama is the same thing that other people like about him:he brings new voters into the electorate.We are constantly told this is a good thing- for decades every announcer on TV and radio have urged new people to vote ("Rock the vote") and everyone seems excited that there's much more people voting in this election.Not me. I am very interested in politics, but I know that most people don't share that interest. Therefore, I think it can be safely said that the less people that vote in this country, the better off we're doing. It's only in times of crisis and discontent that lots of new people vote. I don't like living in crisis; therefore, this trend disturbs me.Worse, I have serious doubts that these new energized voters are very well informed on the issues. That means politicians will be urged to seek simplistic solutions to make the masses happy (for instance, pulling the troops out of Iraq and some form of universal health care- both staple positions of Obama's). Usually these simplistic solutions are worse than the problems. That's why I don't like populists in general because they usually end up pandering too much. Obama is a populist.Does anyone share these concerns?
To be honest, that just sounds like a statement from someone who is afraid of losing their current position of power or authority due to a upswell of ground level enthusiasm and subsequent change.
That's kind of what it sounds like to me, too.How can more people being engaged in the political process be a bad thing? Democracy works best when everyone has a say.You can sit on your intellectual high horse all you want, but maybe some of these new voters have insight you don't have. I analogize it to a jury. Once I started doing trial practice, I realized how awesome trial by jury is. Some scoff about how uneducated jurors can be, etc. But jurors are America. They are average people, they have jobs and kids and bills to pay, they are quick to sort through the bulls##t and get to the nutt of the matter. Maybe some of these new voters he despises are doing the same thing.
 
Lifelong Republican here - very impressed by what I heard in Obama's speech tonight. Aside from the fact that I want him to trounce Clinton, I voted for him in the NJ primary (my first D vote ever) as I actually get the sense that he's far and away the best one running this election.
:thumbup: Obamicans are definitely welcome here.
Do I get a free t-shirt or button?
We're fresh out. :pickle:But welcome aboard, Obamican.
 
Hillary mentioned in her speech that she's spending the next 3 weeks in Texas. Based on the post about how delegates are allocated in Texas, isn't that a terrible idea? If Obama spends more time in Ohio than Hillary, he can make enough in-roads there to keep it close, and just needs to keep it close in Texas to win about half the delegates there. Then Hillary would STILL be behind by over 100 pledged delegates AFTER Texas and Ohio.
Honestly its a horrible idea, but all she has right now is trying to win the popular votes in both places. She's confortably ahead (or was on the 11th) in Ohio, so I guess she's banking on that holding.I have a feeling this will be over by the 11th, especially when the superdelegates start realizing that it looks like Obama has some serious coattails.
 
Hillary mentioned in her speech that she's spending the next 3 weeks in Texas. Based on the post about how delegates are allocated in Texas, isn't that a terrible idea? If Obama spends more time in Ohio than Hillary, he can make enough in-roads there to keep it close, and just needs to keep it close in Texas to win about half the delegates there. Then Hillary would STILL be behind by over 100 pledged delegates AFTER Texas and Ohio.
Honestly its a horrible idea, but all she has right now is trying to win the popular votes in both places. She's confortably ahead (or was on the 11th) in Ohio, so I guess she's banking on that holding.I have a feeling this will be over by the 11th, especially when the superdelegates start realizing that it looks like Obama has some serious coattails.
From what I recall from that Ohio poll - wasn't it something like Hillary at 38%, Obama at 20%, and most of the rest undecided or undeclared? If I was Hillary, I wouldn't be too comfortable with that.
 
It is kind of interesting seeing the subtle racial bigotry being exposed in some of the "liberal" countries that have looked down on us for so long.

 
I posted earlier that I had led some friends to this thread. I just got an e-mail that none of the links in the first post are working, and I checked and now they are not working for me. Basically the links just act like text, not that they don't work.Anyone know what is going on?
They moved the website that the links were pointing to. I'll try to update them soon with real links, if I can find them again.
 
I watched the election returns come in last night and I watched Hillary talk for a while on CNN, then they went to the analysts, then it showed Obama winning everything handily, then to his speech. I was struck by the emotion in this speech for him, compared to speeches he's given in the past. It wasn't over the top, but it seemed like he was pouring a bit more passion into the middle and end of that speech than I normally see him do. It was great.

He made excellent points about how he'll contrast with McCain. He sold that the issues are personal to him. He did a great job overall, as usual. His crowd was huge, the energy was palpable, his command of the crowd was unmistakable.

Then, cut to John McCain, who to his credit looked younger and full of energy. But his surroundings, a group of older white men on a stage, chuckling when appropriate, showing a room full of older white men standing in a crowd, golf-clapping when he makes his applause comments, it was such a strong contrast between what we saw in Obama. And his points during his speech were pretty horrible, well, most of them, about why he'd be better than Obama. They were all fairly thinly veiled, but if that's what he's going to bring to the table in the general election, this election will not even be close.

Thankfully, if Obama is able to pull this off, for the first time in my life we will have two candidates in the general election that I wouldn't mind seeing in office. It'll be a good year and years to come for america I think.

 
Thankfully, if Obama is able to pull this off, for the first time in my life we will have two candidates in the general election that I wouldn't mind seeing in office. It'll be a good year and years to come for america I think.
:goodposting:
 
On NPR they said that even if he won 60% of all remaining delegates he still would not have enough to guarantee the nomination.

 
If Hillary thinks she's gonna take Texas she better watchout for Oak Cliff and the 9th Ward.

By GROMER JEFFERS Jr. / The Dallas Morning Newsgjeffers@dallasnews.comThousands of North Texans rushed to sign up to see Barack Obama this weekend.The only problem? Mr. Obama won't be there.By 6 p.m. Tuesday, nearly 3,000 people had signed up for a meet-and-greet at the tiny White Rhino Coffee House. But it's just a gathering of supporters; the candidate is not scheduled to attend."My phone has been ringing off the hook," said Edna Pemberton, an Obama supporter who is organizing events in Oak Cliff. "When they thought he would be there, it took a life of its own."Apparently at least one person misread the electronic invitation, and it caught fire online."I am so excited about this that I'm forwarding to everybody!!" one woman wrote. "Please get the word out that Barack is coming to town!"Stoney Jackson, the poor guy who put his home number on the invitation, could not be reached for comment.Between now and the March 4 primary, Obama supporters have "meet-ups" scheduled throughout the area. There was an event Tuesday night at Gilley's in Dallas and a rally and parade planned in Fair Park on Sunday.Obama spokesman Josh Earnest said Tuesday's mix-up was indicative of Mr. Obama's strong support in Texas. And he said the candidate would come to the state before the vote."There will be a chance to see him and hear him speak," Mr. Earnest said.
 
On NPR they said that even if he won 60% of all remaining delegates he still would not have enough to guarantee the nomination.
They went over this on CNN as well, although they were using 55% as the example, at this point it is essentially impossible for either side to get enough pledged delegates. That is counting MI and FL out of the mix though, and they may end up re-voting which would put more delegates back in play.
 
Hillary mentioned in her speech that she's spending the next 3 weeks in Texas. Based on the post about how delegates are allocated in Texas, isn't that a terrible idea? If Obama spends more time in Ohio than Hillary, he can make enough in-roads there to keep it close, and just needs to keep it close in Texas to win about half the delegates there. Then Hillary would STILL be behind by over 100 pledged delegates AFTER Texas and Ohio.
Honestly its a horrible idea, but all she has right now is trying to win the popular votes in both places. She's confortably ahead (or was on the 11th) in Ohio, so I guess she's banking on that holding.I have a feeling this will be over by the 11th, especially when the superdelegates start realizing that it looks like Obama has some serious coattails.
She better wrap up her core constituents real tight in Texas. Because when this hombre rides into town, he is going to snatch a hugh chunk of them from her just as he did in Virginia and Maryland.
 
Long, but pretty good read IMO -

Why Obama is Closer to the Nomination Than You'd Think

by dloewe

Tue Feb 12, 2008 at 06:44:42 AM PST

My first blog entry discusses the status of the 2008 race with analysis that would suggest that Barack Obama is a lot closer to getting the nomination than the MSM thinks. Please visit the Loewe Political Report to read more. For now, here's an excerpt from that first posting:

But there are only 1,277 pledged delegates remaining up for grabs. For Obama to get to the 2,025 threshold without using super delegates, he would have to win 1,013 out of 1,277, or 79% of the remaining delegates. For Hillary to do that, she would have to win 1,076 out of 1,277 or 85% of the remaining delegates. That is virtually (make that actually) impossible.

What does that mean? It means that the super delegates get to decide the race. The problem with that, of course, is how shockingly undemocratic it is – party insiders choosing the nominee when we were led to believe that primaries would do that. But what’s worse is that we could have a situation where Obama wins a majority of the pledged delegates and the super delegates decide to hand the nomination to Hillary anyway. This would cause an all out civil war in the party, and would make Hillary one of the weakest nominees in modern Democratic politics, virtually assuring a President John McCain.

Here’s the catch: The party understands this, as do the super delegates. Though the above scenario is possible, it’s exceptionally unlikely. Elaine Kamarck, a senior DNC official and super delegate herself, told me Thursday that it would never happen. "Super delegates are cowards – we would never do that." This, by the way, from a woman who has endorsed Hillary Clinton. Chuck Todd, political director for NBC News said on Saturday that super delegates are likely to follow the pledged delegate winner, especially if that winner is also ahead of McCain in the polls. And because more than half of the super delegates have yet to pledge, it’s likely that this would be more than enough for Obama to maintain his lead, even when super delegates are added to the mix.

So what does that all mean? Counter-intuitively, the fact that, mathematically, the super delegates get to decide the race means they don’t actually matter. If the super delegates are unwilling to throw the race against the public will, then they are just going to support the winner of the pledged delegates. So that should be the only number we care about during the analysis: the number of pledged delegates.

News sources have been giving wildly different delegate counts for a couple of boring reasons. First, some are adding super delegates without knowing exactly who is voting for who; as a result, each network has a different list of the super delegates they think are already committed. Second, many states (as ridiculous as this will sound) actually vote for state delegates, not national delegates, during these primaries and caucuses. Those state delegates then go to a state convention where they vote for national delegates. Even though we know exactly how many national delegates will be pledged to each candidate after that process is over, some networks are refusing to add those delegates into the count until it actually happens. Basically, this means that every news outlet has a different count, and almost none of them are accurate. Bottom line is this: As of right now, in terms of pledged delegates, Obama leads Hillary by 84 (1,030-946).

All of the remaining primary contests in February heavily favor Obama (with the possible exception of Wisconsin), and the few larger-state contests in March favor Hillary. But because delegates are proportionally allocated, it’s difficult for either to pull away from each other, or for Hillary to catch up. Good news if you’re an Obama fan.

Florida and Michigan

The one odd issue remaining is Florida and Michigan. The DNC had rules that dictated that no state could move their primary up before February 5th, with the exception of four states determined by the DNC (Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, and Nevada). Both Michigan and Florida defied this rule and moved their primaries up before February 5th. The DNC threatened to strip them of their delegates if they didn’t comply, and when they still didn’t comply, all of their delegates were stripped. The candidates, including Hillary Clinton, all signed a pledge that they would not campaign in those states. In Michigan, Barack Obama and John Edwards took their names off the ballot. They tried to do the same in Florida, but the deadline had passed.

Hillary Clinton never complained about this earlier in the race. Complaining about it would have pissed off Iowa and New Hampshire and she wasn’t interested in doing that. But now that she recognizes that she’s likely to lose the pledged delegate count, she has been calling for the Florida and Michigan delegations to be counted after all. (It should be noted that in Michigan, she won against her only other opponent "Uncommitted" and that she won in Florida as well.) So despite the fact that no one campaigned in these states, that both campaigns acknowledged that these races didn’t count, and that Barack Obama’s name wasn’t on the Michigan ballot, today, Hillary thinks these delegates should count. One wonders if she would feel the same way had she lost.

How will this be resolved? There are three possibilities: The DNC has been begging Florida and Michigan to revote, by holding caucuses now that February 5th has passed, allowing their delegates to be seated and both candidates to campaign there. Both states, as of now, are resistant to that idea, with some indication that Michigan may eventually come around.

If that doesn’t happen, the question of who gets seated at the convention will be decided by the DNC Credentials Committee. The Credentials Committee is going to be staffed with Hillary loyalists and Obama loyalists and the number of seats they get on the committee will be determined proportionally according to the winner of the pledged delegates. This means that, most likely, if Obama wins the pledged delegates, his loyalists will control the Credentials Committee and not allow Florida and Michigan to be added into the mix. If Hillary wins the pledged delegate count, she will control the Credentials Committee and will allow the Florida and Michigan delegations to be seated. This is a relatively moot point because, essentially, the only way that Michigan and Florida get seated is if Hillary has already won the pledged delegates (and as was said before, the winner of the pledged delegates will end up winning the super delegates and, ultimately, the nomination).

There is, however, one possible circumstance where this wouldn’t happen. It’s possible that the delegate counts will be so close that the Credentials Committee will be evenly divided between Obama and Clinton loyalists. This means that neither would have control over the committee. But, keep in mind, the current status quo is that Florida and Michigan don’t count. If the vote on the Credentials Committee is a tie, the vote loses and we keep the status quo.

All that is a long way of saying, it’s likely that, though you’ll hear a lot about Florida and Michigan, they are probably not going to end up mattering in any significant way. It’s possible, but unlikely.
I wanted to re-post the above quote. I think it makes a lot of sense.
 
I was at the Kohl Center in Madison last night for the rally, and it was jammed. The place seats 17000, plus about 2000 on the floor, plus every, and I mean every single one of the tunnels to get into the arena was jammed with people standing. There were folks sitting in the aisles, and there was an overflow seating area setup somewhere else in the building. I would guess there were about 25,000 people there.

The speach was good, more detailed than some of his other stump speaches. It sounded a lot quieter on TV when I re-watched it then it was in person. I can't imagine any other canidate drawing a crowd like that. The size and the involvement was amazing. My favorite part of the evening was the students giving him the "O" Chant from the student section at football games. I should have expected that, but it took me by surprise.

 
I was at the Kohl Center in Madison last night for the rally, and it was jammed. The place seats 17000, plus about 2000 on the floor, plus every, and I mean every single one of the tunnels to get into the arena was jammed with people standing. There were folks sitting in the aisles, and there was an overflow seating area setup somewhere else in the building. I would guess there were about 25,000 people there.

The speach was good, more detailed than some of his other stump speaches. It sounded a lot quieter on TV when I re-watched it then it was in person. I can't imagine any other canidate drawing a crowd like that. The size and the involvement was amazing. My favorite part of the evening was the students giving him the "O" Chant from the student section at football games. I should have expected that, but it took me by surprise.
you clearly haven't seen a Ron Paul event. it's like spring break in daytona circa 1985, dude. mardi freakin gras!
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
This could ruin Bills legacy if people take the campaigns attacks the wrong way.
The Clintons have already shown that they don't care about that; they just want to win.
I disagree. I believe there is a limit - they will only do "so much".
You're thinking of Gore and Kerry. Clintons will go scorched earth, win-at-all costs.
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
This could ruin Bills legacy if people take the campaigns attacks the wrong way.
The Clintons have already shown that they don't care about that; they just want to win.
I disagree. I believe there is a limit - they will only do "so much".
You're thinking of Gore and Kerry. Clintons will go scorched earth, win-at-all costs.
Do you mean to imply they'll burn #### down?
 
I was at the Kohl Center in Madison last night for the rally, and it was jammed. The place seats 17000, plus about 2000 on the floor, plus every, and I mean every single one of the tunnels to get into the arena was jammed with people standing. There were folks sitting in the aisles, and there was an overflow seating area setup somewhere else in the building. I would guess there were about 25,000 people there.

The speach was good, more detailed than some of his other stump speaches. It sounded a lot quieter on TV when I re-watched it then it was in person. I can't imagine any other canidate drawing a crowd like that. The size and the involvement was amazing. My favorite part of the evening was the students giving him the "O" Chant from the student section at football games. I should have expected that, but it took me by surprise.
you clearly haven't seen a Ron Paul event. it's like spring break in daytona circa 1985, dude. mardi freakin gras!
Unfortunately for Ron, that's his entire base of support, not a segment.
 
People always use the phrase "now the gloves come off" but I think now that she's clearly behind it may finally be true. We'll start seeing all kinds of ugliness towards Barack from questions about his drug use to issues with anyone and everyone he's associated with: pastors, donors, lobbyists, whoever.
I agree. Hillary has two weeks to salvage her shot at the nomination. If she has anything on Obama, anything at all, expect to see it in the coming days.
This could ruin Bills legacy if people take the campaigns attacks the wrong way.
The Clintons have already shown that they don't care about that; they just want to win.
I disagree. I believe there is a limit - they will only do "so much".
You're thinking of Gore and Kerry. Clintons will go scorched earth, win-at-all costs.
Do you mean to imply they'll burn #### down?
:goodposting: :thumbdown: :lmao: Shtick stealers!!!

 
Caught a little bit of McCain's speech from last night.

The stage behind him was basically a caricature of what the Republican Party looks like. I'm surprised Monty Burns and Darth Vader weren't up there with him.

The general election will be a blast. Obama will roll him in a carpet and throw him off a bridge...metaphorically, of course.

 
Caught a little bit of McCain's speech from last night.The stage behind him was basically a caricature of what the Republican Party looks like. I'm surprised Monty Burns and Darth Vader weren't up there with him.The general election will be a blast. Obama will roll him in a carpet and throw him off a bridge...metaphorically, of course.
:bye:"My friends, please don't throw me off the bridge. My friends . . . MY FRIEEEEEEEEEEENDSSSSS . . . ."
 
Caught a little bit of McCain's speech from last night.The stage behind him was basically a caricature of what the Republican Party looks like. I'm surprised Monty Burns and Darth Vader weren't up there with him.The general election will be a blast. Obama will roll him in a carpet and throw him off a bridge...metaphorically, of course.
:bye:"My friends, please don't throw me off the bridge. My friends . . . MY FRIEEEEEEEEEEENDSSSSS . . . ."
:confused: :lmao: :lmao:
 
Also in the McCain criticism category, can someone please get this guy to the dentist for a teeth-whitening treatment? :bye: I saw him give a big grin the other day and I think he might be a British spy.

 
Caught a little bit of McCain's speech from last night.The stage behind him was basically a caricature of what the Republican Party looks like. I'm surprised Monty Burns and Darth Vader weren't up there with him.The general election will be a blast. Obama will roll him in a carpet and throw him off a bridge...metaphorically, of course.
Don't be so sure of this. An Obama/McCain matchup will be VERY close. I'm not convinced Obama will win. Right now it's a 50-50 proposition.
 
Still though...wasn't Obama in high school when the iraq war started? Lol.

Seriously, most people you ask what has Obama done that he deserves to be President can't name a single thing outside maybe opposing the Iraq war. That's not good enough.
So don't vote for him.
good advice you talked me into voting for McCain
Because we all know you were this close to voting for Obama. Damn, I can't believe we lost you! :bye:

 
If Obama wins the Democratic primary, he will be the next president. If Hilary somehow pulls it out, McCain will be the next president.
It seems like everyone is saying this, but I don't agree with it. If Clinton can somehow defeat Obama, why can't she beat McCain? Obama has run a practically flawless campaign, so if she could beat him, I don't see why she couldn't beat McCain. And I am someone who will vote for almost anyone over her, but the Clintons know how to win. If she somehow edges out Obama for the Democratic nomination, I like her chances against McCain.
 
Whenever I see these rallys with chants of "Obama" it reminds me of the Muhammad Ali documentary "When We Were Kings" when the Zairians chanted "Ali, boma ye!" (Ali, kill him!).

 
Ghost Rider said:
If Obama wins the Democratic primary, he will be the next president. If Hilary somehow pulls it out, McCain will be the next president.
It seems like everyone is saying this, but I don't agree with it. If Clinton can somehow defeat Obama, why can't she beat McCain? Obama has run a practically flawless campaign, so if she could beat him, I don't see why she couldn't beat McCain. And I am someone who will vote for almost anyone over her, but the Clintons know how to win. If she somehow edges out Obama for the Democratic nomination, I like her chances against McCain.
The argument is that she would:1) energize an otherwise apathetic conservative Republican base, who would vote just keep another Clinton out of the White House2) lose Independents in huge numbers to McCain, whereas Obama would at least split or possibly winOf course, everything is specualtion at this point. I just hope we never get to the point of having to find out if those arguments hold up.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Ghost Rider said:
If Obama wins the Democratic primary, he will be the next president. If Hilary somehow pulls it out, McCain will be the next president.
It seems like everyone is saying this, but I don't agree with it. If Clinton can somehow defeat Obama, why can't she beat McCain? Obama has run a practically flawless campaign, so if she could beat him, I don't see why she couldn't beat McCain. And I am someone who will vote for almost anyone over her, but the Clintons know how to win. If she somehow edges out Obama for the Democratic nomination, I like her chances against McCain.
I think it depends on how she wins the nomination. If she rallies and beats Obama straight up, I think she has a decent chance in the general election. If she pulls strings to get through on Super delagates and by whining about Florida and Michigan, or slings too much mud at Obama, then the backlash is going to cost her (not to mention damage the party as a whole).
 
Ghost Rider said:
If Obama wins the Democratic primary, he will be the next president. If Hilary somehow pulls it out, McCain will be the next president.
It seems like everyone is saying this, but I don't agree with it. If Clinton can somehow defeat Obama, why can't she beat McCain? Obama has run a practically flawless campaign, so if she could beat him, I don't see why she couldn't beat McCain. And I am someone who will vote for almost anyone over her, but the Clintons know how to win. If she somehow edges out Obama for the Democratic nomination, I like her chances against McCain.
I think it depends on how she wins the nomination. If she rallies and beats Obama straight up, I think she has a decent chance in the general election. If she pulls strings to get through on Super delagates and by whining about Florida and Michigan, or slings too much mud at Obama, then the backlash is going to cost her (not to mention damage the party nearby buildings as a whole).
Fixed.
 
Homer J Simpson said:
Gopher State said:
Still though...wasn't Obama in high school when the iraq war started? Lol.

Seriously, most people you ask what has Obama done that he deserves to be President can't name a single thing outside maybe opposing the Iraq war. That's not good enough.
So don't vote for him.
good advice you talked me into voting for McCain
Because we all know you were this close to voting for Obama. Damn, I can't believe we lost you! :kicksrock:
Speaking of which, how are things over at the Clinton '08 FBG campaign headquarters GS? :goodposting:

 
A reader of Andrew Sullivan from Israel writes him and says:

Recently I was with an Indian-American friend of mine in the Old City of Jerusalem, eating at a falafel joint run by a Muslim Palestinian in the Christian Quarter. He was a very kind man, speaking to us passionately about how all Palestinians need to stick together, regardless of religion. This was in January, two days before Bush came to Israel. Security was very tight. We talked about Bush for a moment (he said he might have to close his restaurant for a day or two because of security surrounding the visit), and then talk suddenly shifted. "You might have a new one in charge." he said, "Obama!" He seemed fairly enthusiastic, but when I told him that Obama's full name was Barack Hussein Obama, the man's face lit up. He couldn't believe it and starting shouting ecstatically to one of his employees, "Barack Hussein Obama!" I told him that Obama wasn't a Muslim but had lived in Indonesia. In any case, this didn't matter to the man. He was so excited that a man with this name might be president of the United States. It was clear that he would tell many people he knew about Obama's name and that to them, this means something important and even profound.
I've had similar things happen to while I was in Spain. I had a few people comment to me that "America will never elect a black man" and "America is too stupid to elect a man with the name 'Hussein'". I told them not to be so sure. I'd love to see Obama elected so I can write an email to those close-minded people. I think electing either HRC or Obama will send a message, although Obama's election will be much more profound.
 
(Assuming Obama keeps gaining momentum and gets the nomination) What are the chances that Obama extends the olive branch to Hillary and gives her a V.P. offer? Think she'd take it?

Are there any other names that seem to be lead candidates for V.P.?

 
(Assuming Obama keeps gaining momentum and gets the nomination) What are the chances that Obama extends the olive branch to Hillary and gives her a V.P. offer? Think she'd take it?

Are there any other names that seem to be lead candidates for V.P.?
no chance in hell on either account.
 

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