RB Rhamondre Stevenson, NE (2 Viewers)

[Hot Sauce Guy]

There is no universe where you can call it safe. Nor successful.

It was not intercepted, and it was completed to Meyers. it was both safe & successful.

Note: I did not say it was a smart thing to do, nor did I absolve Stevenson of blame.

 

[billmatic]

After Stevenson's bad decision, the Pats had possession of the ball at the Raiders' 30ish yard line. After Meyers' bad decision the Raiders had the ball in the endzone. Seems like a toss up.

 

[Marauder]

Reading the back and forth here is kind of funny.

Can't we all just agree that it was a bonehead decision by the coaching staff to run a draw play there, a bigger bonehead decision by RS to lateral to Jacobi, and the biggest bonehead decision by Jacobi to throw it wildly across the field. None of those decisions had any chance of of success.

** By success, I mean scoring a TD, which is the only reason not to just have the QB take a knee.

 

[menobrown]

You all have made some really strange statements here. If you want to assign more blame to Jakobi, that's fine, but calling what Rhamondre did as safe is beyond incompetent analysis.

He safely put the ball in Meyers hands. Whether he should have attempted it or not did not matter because he executed it without a hitch. He was not responsible for Meyer's bonehead mistake after the fact. Seems pretty cut and dry to me who is at 100% at fault.

 

[Judge Smails]

You all have made some really strange statements here. If you want to assign more blame to Jakobi, that's fine, but calling what Rhamondre did as safe is beyond incompetent analysis.

He safely put the ball in Meyers hands. Whether he should have attempted it or not did not matter because he executed it without a hitch. He was not responsible for Meyer's bonehead mistake after the fact. Seems pretty cut and dry to me who is at 100% at fault.

I give the blame as follows:
70% Jakobi
25% coaching staff
5% Rhamondre

Rhamondre is a very smart football player. Ask BB. If that was a 5 yard run no way he does that. When he had a huge gain that went deeper in Raider’s territory he tried to make a winning play. Hey - we’ve seen the one lateral work at times where a guy takes it to the house. Not often - but it happens. He improvised based on the situation. Nowhere did the coaching staff say - Rhamondre - bust one deep then take a knee. That didn’t happen. What Jakobi did though was unimaginable.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

Stevenson has been their best offensive player this season (and Meyers their best WR) - obviously I can't say with certainty Belichick wouldn't punish either player, but it doesn't seem likely imo.

 

[Dickies]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

Stevenson has been their best offensive player this season (and Meyers their best WR) - obviously I can't say with certainty Belichick wouldn't punish either player, but it doesn't seem likely imo.

I have nothing to really back this up, but punishing them over this seems like something Belicheck would do.

 

[Judge Smails]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

c'mon MoP. You can't be serious. Again - BB loves Rhamondre. May be his favorite player on the team. I can guarantee he is not going to reprimand a player who has been pretty much mistake free the entire year. He runs hard, catches everything, picks up every blitz. Model citizen. Then he goes out and plays hurt and racks up 172 yards - pretty much carrying them. He busts a play for 30+ yards and gets deep in Raider territory. Makes a 2 yard lateral to a player trying to win the game. BB retaliation will 100% not be a factor. If you are afraid of that - put him on your bench in the semi's and championship. Then watch him go off.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

BB isn’t benching RS. Why? Because Rhamondre fell on his sword and took the blame for the coaching staff. I highly doubt the narrative that the play design didn’t call for a lateral. BB is a paid liar. Can’t trust a word he says.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

Stevenson has been their best offensive player this season (and Meyers their best WR) - obviously I can't say with certainty Belichick wouldn't punish either player, but it doesn't seem likely imo.

I have nothing to really back this up, but punishing them over this seems like something Belicheck would do.

It's surely not impossible.

 

[Judge Smails]

He's got 2 offensive weapons on his team. Rhamondre and Jakobi. That's it. Yeah - he's going to punish em both and bench em. That'll show 'em. Makes perfect sense.

 

[Rubi]

If Darth punishes players over this one play he should punish his coaching staff for multiple transgressions

 

[popeye]

Poor decision on Stevenson's part - hope my league mates see him as utterly unreliable so I can draft this gem in the 5th next year.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Reading the back and forth here is kind of funny.

Can't we all just agree that it was a bonehead decision by the coaching staff to run a draw play there, a bigger bonehead decision by RS to lateral to Jacobi, and the biggest bonehead decision by Jacobi to throw it wildly across the field. None of those decisions had any chance of of success.

** By success, I mean scoring a TD, which is the only reason not to just have the QB take a knee.

On my football group text, the 1st thing I sent was "there are 3 seconds left. Take a knee, stupid."

This was 100% on the OC, regardless of what Stevenson or Meyers did.

That narrative also seems to gel with @Ministry of Pain's fruit of the poisoned vine theory.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Poor decision on Stevenson's part - hope my league mates see him as utterly unreliable so I can draft this gem in the 5th next year.

Your altruism is admirable. Way to take one for the league.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

You all have made some really strange statements here. If you want to assign more blame to Jakobi, that's fine, but calling what Rhamondre did as safe is beyond incompetent analysis.

He safely put the ball in Meyers hands. Whether he should have attempted it or not did not matter because he executed it without a hitch. He was not responsible for Meyer's bonehead mistake after the fact. Seems pretty cut and dry to me who is at 100% at fault.

That's solid logic, and I am on board with it.

 

[Anarchy99]

BB isn’t benching RS. Why? Because Rhamondre fell on his sword and took the blame for the coaching staff. I highly doubt the narrative that the play design didn’t call for a lateral. BB is a paid liar. Can’t trust a word he says.

Besides the team and coaching staff all saying no lateral was called, the way the NE offense acted on the play also shows no intent to implement any laterals. On a normal planned lateral play, the players space out across the field and there are always players behind them to throw or pitch the ball to. In this case, the OL blocked, Stevenson wiggled free, and the guys behind the play all ran up field. When Meyers pivoted to throw, there was literally no one for him to throw the ball to other than Mac Jones. I know the NE offense is bad, but no way do they want to get the ball to Mac Jones 60 yards away from the end zone, with 22 players to navigate through, and with no one blocking. That would be Zen level insanity to think that might work out.

 

[Anarchy99]

You all have made some really strange statements here. If you want to assign more blame to Jakobi, that's fine, but calling what Rhamondre did as safe is beyond incompetent analysis.

He safely put the ball in Meyers hands. Whether he should have attempted it or not did not matter because he executed it without a hitch. He was not responsible for Meyer's bonehead mistake after the fact. Seems pretty cut and dry to me who is at 100% at fault.

That's solid logic, and I am on board with it.

Just curious, if Meyers figured out that the only person he could throw the ball to was Mac Jones and held onto it instead, Maxx Strong was in the process of trucking Meyers something fierce. If Meyers coughed up the ball for a scoop and score, what would you guys feel about Stevenson's lateral then? Meyers was crushed and was sent sprawling as he was throwing the ball to Jones. Would that change your opinion any?

 

[rockaction]

Yeah, Rhamondre's play wasn't safe. Anybody arguing that has a serious hill to climb. Rhamondre could have turned it over just as easily as not. That was not a designed option.

Anybody arguing a draw play doesn't put a live ball in play also has a serious hill to climb. The coaching staff is indeed to blame. You want to sit on the ball? Take a knee.

Jakobi's lateral compounded an otherwise careless disposition of he football.

I think reasonable minds can disagree, but it seems like one side values results over process, which I don't. Blame all around.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

You all have made some really strange statements here. If you want to assign more blame to Jakobi, that's fine, but calling what Rhamondre did as safe is beyond incompetent analysis.

He safely put the ball in Meyers hands. Whether he should have attempted it or not did not matter because he executed it without a hitch. He was not responsible for Meyer's bonehead mistake after the fact. Seems pretty cut and dry to me who is at 100% at fault.

That's solid logic, and I am on board with it.

Just curious, if Meyers figured out that the only person he could throw the ball to was Mac Jones and held onto it instead, Maxx Strong was in the process of trucking Meyers something fierce. If Meyers coughed up the ball for a scoop and score, what would you guys feel about Stevenson's lateral then? Meyers was crushed and was sent sprawling as he was throwing the ball to Jones. Would that change your opinion any?

It's an interesting hypothetical - if Stevenson lateralled it to Meyeres and he got crushed, coughed it up, and it resulted in a DTD, I would have definitely put more blame on Stevenson.

But that isn't what happened. What happened was he lateralled it to Meyers, who had time to
1. step out of bounds
2. fall down
3. do that incredibly stupid that he actually did do.

So I still put the vast majority of blame on Meyers, and a little of the blame on Stevenson for the "had he not lateralled, this would not have happened" aspect.

There is a significant difference between the lateral that did happen, and the lateral in your hypothetical.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I think reasonable minds can disagree, but it seems like one side values results over process, which I don't. Blame all around.

I think those putting most of the blame on Stevenson are putting results over process.

There are degrees of mistakes, which I believe reasonable minds can also agree about.

Stevenson made a relatively safe (not "safe" as no play in football is safe - again, degrees) in that 1. his lateral was close, and 2. it did not, in itself, result in disaster. Meyers backwards pass to a Raiders player was decidedly unsafe, by comparison, and had disaster written all over it. And predictably, disaster resulted from it.

One player made a mistake, the other player committed a football-level hate crime.

 

[Anarchy99]

As far as the play call went, I don't think it was all that bad. Have Stevenson run it and hopefully break out of the line. With a huge empty field from the LOS to the goal line, it's not crazy to wonder if Stevenson could have juked one or two guys, get a couple to bump into each other, and make a dive for the end zone. How many times have we seen defenders on passing plays take each other out trying to break up a play or make a tackle, or take the wrong angle and accidentally took their own guy out of a play. It doesn't happen often, but it happens now and again. Not likely to happen, I know. Could have been hauled down by the face mask, and then they can kick a FG to win. I already suggested the best option would have been to throw the ball and hope for a DPI flag (again, getting a FG attempt), but Jones was not having a good day throwing the football.

 

[scothawk]

So excited for this guy next year

 

[billmatic]

It also seems crazy to me that the Pats don't have a QB on the roster who can throw a hail mary from almost midfield but maybe I'm overestimating how many QBs can throw the ball 60 yards

 

[Anarchy99]

It also seems crazy to me that the Pats don't have a QB on the roster who can throw a hail mary from almost midfield but maybe I'm overestimating how many QBs can throw the ball 60 yards

Bill answered this question in a different way a few weeks ago. They were in another late game situation where a Hail Mary seemed like an option, and Bill said the last time they tried that, Mac Jones got hurt and missed 3 games. And IIRC, both Jones and Zappe were victims of strip sacks that were returned for scoop and score TDs. Pass protection has been an issue this season, and Jones was not making accurate throws most of the game. I don't think it had to do with how far Jones can throw the ball.

 

[Judge Smails]

On to next week. Looks like some fun weather.

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

Myers has to get most of the blame, I see no fault in the play call and little fault in RS.

Have to admit I laughed out loud when I saw it and much like the butt fumble this play will live on in infamy for a long, long time.

How do the schedule makers do it? Was it simply fate? A horrendous miscue and now....."we are on to Cincinnati". Amazing........

 

[rockaction]

"we are on to Cincinnati"

If I were Belichick, I would have pulled that meta reference out of my *** and answered all the press conference questions that exact way.

"On to Cincinnati"

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

c'mon MoP. You can't be serious. Again - BB loves Rhamondre. May be his favorite player on the team. I can guarantee he is not going to reprimand a player who has been pretty much mistake free the entire year. He runs hard, catches everything, picks up every blitz. Model citizen. Then he goes out and plays hurt and racks up 172 yards - pretty much carrying them. He busts a play for 30+ yards and gets deep in Raider territory. Makes a 2 yard lateral to a player trying to win the game. BB retaliation will 100% not be a factor. If you are afraid of that - put him on your bench in the semi's and championship. Then watch him go off.

I haven't heard it posted or said like that, thank you JS

 

[Sarlakticacid]

Just as long as he doesn’t miss a meeting this week

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

c'mon MoP. You can't be serious. Again - BB loves Rhamondre. May be his favorite player on the team. I can guarantee he is not going to reprimand a player who has been pretty much mistake free the entire year. He runs hard, catches everything, picks up every blitz. Model citizen. Then he goes out and plays hurt and racks up 172 yards - pretty much carrying them. He busts a play for 30+ yards and gets deep in Raider territory. Makes a 2 yard lateral to a player trying to win the game. BB retaliation will 100% not be a factor. If you are afraid of that - put him on your bench in the semi's and championship. Then watch him go off.

FYI...
Heath over at CBS must take up some serious real estate here because he has RS ranked all the way down at #20 this week
I've seen Rhamondre listed as high as #2 overall this week at home vs CIN
His partners in crime over there have RS 5th or 6th, why would he drop him down to #20?

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

 

[Anarchy99]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

c'mon MoP. You can't be serious. Again - BB loves Rhamondre. May be his favorite player on the team. I can guarantee he is not going to reprimand a player who has been pretty much mistake free the entire year. He runs hard, catches everything, picks up every blitz. Model citizen. Then he goes out and plays hurt and racks up 172 yards - pretty much carrying them. He busts a play for 30+ yards and gets deep in Raider territory. Makes a 2 yard lateral to a player trying to win the game. BB retaliation will 100% not be a factor. If you are afraid of that - put him on your bench in the semi's and championship. Then watch him go off.

FYI...
Heath over at CBS must take up some serious real estate here because he has RS ranked all the way down at #20 this week
I've seen Rhamondre listed as high as #2 overall this week at home vs CIN
His partners in crime over there have RS 5th or 6th, why would he drop him down to #20?

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

No offense, but you are off your rocker. BB is not going to "retaliate" or "discipline" his best player in an actual game. How many times did Brady do something stupid? How many times did Bill sit him? If he does anything to punish RS, it will be something like working him extra in practice or making him run laps.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

Agree with @Anarchy99 - you're off your rocker. The other minds thinking this are just the voices in your head. lol

 

[Alex P Keaton]

BB isn’t benching RS. Why? Because Rhamondre fell on his sword and took the blame for the coaching staff. I highly doubt the narrative that the play design didn’t call for a lateral. BB is a paid liar. Can’t trust a word he says.

Besides the team and coaching staff all saying no lateral was called, the way the NE offense acted on the play also shows no intent to implement any laterals. On a normal planned lateral play, the players space out across the field and there are always players behind them to throw or pitch the ball to. In this case, the OL blocked, Stevenson wiggled free, and the guys behind the play all ran up field. When Meyers pivoted to throw, there was literally no one for him to throw the ball to other than Mac Jones. I know the NE offense is bad, but no way do they want to get the ball to Mac Jones 60 yards away from the end zone, with 22 players to navigate through, and with no one blocking. That would be Zen level insanity to think that might work out.

Appreciate your view. Since you are a Pats guy, I defer to your take on this.

 

[Mag1234]

Its a real stretch to blame RS for his successful lateral because Meyers did something stupid after receiving it. Blaming RS would be almost (not quite, but almost) like blaming the QB if he had thrown a pass to Meyers, and then Meyers did his stupid thing. BB would have to be insane to punish RS and lower the team's chances to beat Cincy because of this. RS is his offensive best player.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

c'mon MoP. You can't be serious. Again - BB loves Rhamondre. May be his favorite player on the team. I can guarantee he is not going to reprimand a player who has been pretty much mistake free the entire year. He runs hard, catches everything, picks up every blitz. Model citizen. Then he goes out and plays hurt and racks up 172 yards - pretty much carrying them. He busts a play for 30+ yards and gets deep in Raider territory. Makes a 2 yard lateral to a player trying to win the game. BB retaliation will 100% not be a factor. If you are afraid of that - put him on your bench in the semi's and championship. Then watch him go off.

FYI...
Heath over at CBS must take up some serious real estate here because he has RS ranked all the way down at #20 this week
I've seen Rhamondre listed as high as #2 overall this week at home vs CIN
His partners in crime over there have RS 5th or 6th, why would he drop him down to #20?

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

No offense, but you are off your rocker. BB is not going to "retaliate" or "discipline" his best player in an actual game. How many times did Brady do something stupid? How many times did Bill sit him? If he does anything to punish RS, it will be something like working him extra in practice or making him run laps.

I referenced a well paid writer, tell him he's off his rocker
I'm relaying things I am reading and watching, that's it.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

Agree with @Anarchy99 - you're off your rocker. The other minds thinking this are just the voices in your head. lol

I referenced Heath Cummings, a paid writer at CBS, circle back and read it again
You all make it so personal, relax

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Why would Heath Cummings have Rhamondre ranked 20th this week at home vs Cincinnati?
Let's not make it about MoP
Why would a National FF writer do that this week?

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Report: Malcolm Butler's Super Bowl benching stemmed from argument with Matt Patricia

This helps explain Malcolm Butler’s benching in Super Bowl

patriotswire.usatoday.com

Exhibit "A"

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

Agree with @Anarchy99 - you're off your rocker. The other minds thinking this are just the voices in your head. lol

I referenced Heath Cummings, a paid writer at CBS, circle back and read it again
You all make it so personal, relax

lol - not making it personal - just making a joke based on your own statement.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Why would Heath Cummings have Rhamondre ranked 20th this week at home vs Cincinnati?
Let's not make it about MoP
Why would a National FF writer do that this week?

Because he loves the clicks that help pay his salary?

Same reason a lot of sports writers do that stuff.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Its a real stretch to blame RS for his successful lateral because Meyers did something stupid after receiving it. Blaming RS would be almost (not quite, but almost) like blaming the QB if he had thrown a pass to Meyers, and then Meyers did his stupid thing. BB would have to be insane to punish RS and lower the team's chances to beat Cincy because of this. RS is his offensive best player.

100% this.

If it were week 2, I could see maybe giving them both some extra practice reps.

But with the season on the line? They’ll both be suited up for this game.

 

[Anarchy99]

I think Stevenson deserves some of the blame. While his lateral was “safe” Meyers had nowhere to go and there was nothing to gain from it. I just hope it doesn’t affect his playing time in the next two weeks

This is what I am afraid of...BB retaliation

c'mon MoP. You can't be serious. Again - BB loves Rhamondre. May be his favorite player on the team. I can guarantee he is not going to reprimand a player who has been pretty much mistake free the entire year. He runs hard, catches everything, picks up every blitz. Model citizen. Then he goes out and plays hurt and racks up 172 yards - pretty much carrying them. He busts a play for 30+ yards and gets deep in Raider territory. Makes a 2 yard lateral to a player trying to win the game. BB retaliation will 100% not be a factor. If you are afraid of that - put him on your bench in the semi's and championship. Then watch him go off.

FYI...
Heath over at CBS must take up some serious real estate here because he has RS ranked all the way down at #20 this week
I've seen Rhamondre listed as high as #2 overall this week at home vs CIN
His partners in crime over there have RS 5th or 6th, why would he drop him down to #20?

Retaliation is in more minds than just my own, just saying JS, I'm not completely off my rocker

No offense, but you are off your rocker. BB is not going to "retaliate" or "discipline" his best player in an actual game. How many times did Brady do something stupid? How many times did Bill sit him? If he does anything to punish RS, it will be something like working him extra in practice or making him run laps.

I referenced a well paid writer, tell him he's off his rocker
I'm relaying things I am reading and watching, that's it.

You were the one that mentioned being off your rocker for suggesting potential discipline for RS. I can't speak for Heath, you'd have to ask him why he ranked Stevenson 20th. Unless he specifically mentioned RS getting disciplined for last week as his rationale, then I am not sure that's why he has Stevenson at 20, though.

Maybe it's because CIN allows the 8th fewest fantasy points to RB. Maybe he thinks DHarris will be back. Maybe he thinks the other Harris and Strong have played well and have earned more touches. Maybe he thinks Mac Jones will complete more than 40% of his passes and throw for more than 112 yards this week. Maybe he thinks RS won't get 21 touches again on a bad ankle. Maybe he thinks there will be bad weather.

The point being, Heath may not be wrong that RS could rank as RB20 this week . . . but thinking BB will sit RS for his play in the LV game likely isn't much of a reason to come to that conclusion. If people actually felt that way, then people shouldn't have Stevenson ranked at all this week.

As for the reasoning behind why Butler sat in the SB, there are 1,001 theories about it . . . but one of them wasn't from him making a poor decision on a single play on the field. And Butler certainly was not the best player on the team (or even on the defense). There are different rules that apply to different players. BB is not going to sit his best player (and risk losing a game because of it).

Since you mentioned Butler, from what I remember, his play had slipped over the last few games of the regular season and in the playoffs. He was also sick between the AFCCG and the SB and didn't practice (and spent time in the hospital). There was also talk that even being sick and unable to practice that Butler was seen out late at a night club and / or missed curfew. I also heard the story that he got into a screaming match with Patricia. In any event, it seemed like there were off the field reasons why Butler didn't play . . .

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

o RB. Maybe he thinks DHarris will be back.

That was my gut feel from it.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Stevenson expected to play, and seriously now - what the heck could Harris thigh injury be that’s kept him out for a month?

 

[[icon]]

Friendly reminder to ignore the Miami fan MOP and listen to the locked in NE fan in Anarchy on all matters New England

 

[Anarchy99]

RS should be good to go today. Harris is still considered a GTD. They will see how he looks before the game. Given who they may want available at other positions against CIN, they might make DH inactive anyway.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Friendly reminder to ignore the Miami fan MOP and listen to the locked in NE fan in Anarchy on all matters New England

I have RS in multiple leagues and want him to kick butt today
Also have Jow Burrow, low scoring game, might have to switch him for Fields

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

RS should be good to go today. Harris is still considered a GTD. They will see how he looks before the game. Given who they may want available at other positions against CIN, they might make DH inactive anyway.

I just read that Stevenson is ok & Harris is the GTD.