Funny how he can change that, but yet he lackd enough knowledge to open the board up to us. Neil we know you can run the website inside out,,SUCH A LOSER !!!!!
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AFFL: FINANCIAL ISSUES AND CONCERNS (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter aerolaw
- Start date
SIDA!
Footballguy
Food for thought, but I suspect that the majority of players did not win and thus, most do not even know about the sites troubles. Sometimes I think we overestimate the fantasy playing audiences' participation on message boards.
buck naked
Footballguy
First off, I am totally on the side of the players who have been wronged.
OK, with that said, I don't know why Neil bothers to say anything to you guys. You all want him to say something, and then when he does, he is ripped for everything. There is absolutely nothing he can say right now without being blasted from all sides.
OK, with that said, I don't know why Neil bothers to say anything to you guys. You all want him to say something, and then when he does, he is ripped for everything. There is absolutely nothing he can say right now without being blasted from all sides.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Plenty of stuff he could say that would be constructive and received well here. I'm not sure if you've been keeping track, but he's minimized the problems people have, he's misrepresented his software valuation, he's whined about how difficult his situation is...and, he has not even remotely empathized with any conviction the situation that people are in with regards to their money being held in the Giant Neil Vacuum. Plus, he has been inconsistent in reporting back to us. The convenient messageboard shutdown over at affl doesn't lend him much credibility when he talks about transparency and openness. The deleted messages over there serve the same perception.Put it all together, and this guy is a complete fraud and hoping to hit the lottery here. No way he's going to roll in $1M from investors to buyout this company. He's screwed himself and, as such, all those who threw their money down that software toilet of his are also screwed, as well.He deserves no latitude here. If you want to give it to him, fine. But, he's earned none of it, so it would be charity on your part.FantasyTrader
Footballguy
So cobalt, you disagree that every time AFFL has come here and posted an update that he's been pelted with snarky comments? I'm not so sure YOU'VE been keeping track. I agree that Neil has deserved everything he's received in this thread, but he hasn't been given latitude by any stretch of imagination.
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cobalt_27
Footballguy
What I think has happened is that Neil has made the worst of the opportunity. Showing up inconsistently and trying to deflect criticism away from what is going on does little, in my estimation, to cultivate a forgiving environment. He's been pelted with snarky comments, not because he's shown his face, but because he has delivered mostly incomplete and bizarre updates.
Cobalt,,,, You said it all....... That is just how he has been... Thanks for speaking out against him and not letting up. KirkWhat I think has happened is that Neil has made the worst of the opportunity. Showing up inconsistently and trying to deflect criticism away from what is going on does little, in my estimation, to cultivate a forgiving environment. He's been pelted with snarky comments, not because he's shown his face, but because he has delivered mostly incomplete and bizarre updates.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
umm...ok.Cobalt,,,, You said it all....... That is just how he has been... Thanks for speaking out against him and not letting up. KirkWhat I think has happened is that Neil has made the worst of the opportunity. Showing up inconsistently and trying to deflect criticism away from what is going on does little, in my estimation, to cultivate a forgiving environment. He's been pelted with snarky comments, not because he's shown his face, but because he has delivered mostly incomplete and bizarre updates.
buck naked
Footballguy
I am completely aware of the entire situation and this thread. I've read every one of your posts hammering the guy. You've repeated yourself over and over. If you want to repeatedly hammer everything he says, that is your choice. You certainly have done it for pages. Guess what - we get your position. If fact, we got it eight pages ago.I've given him no latitude for what he did. Nor was I asking you to give him latitude for his actions. I'd be as mad as anyone for getting stiffed if it happened to me. Like Aerolaw, I am a lawyer. I also have read every one of Aerolaw's posts, and he is right on with his legal assessment. So you can keep your thumbs down smiley just because I did not agree with or placate your need to repeatedly hammer Neil.Plenty of stuff he could say that would be constructive and received well here. I'm not sure if you've been keeping track, but he's minimized the problems people have, he's misrepresented his software valuation, he's whined about how difficult his situation is...and, he has not even remotely empathized with any conviction the situation that people are in with regards to their money being held in the Giant Neil Vacuum. Plus, he has been inconsistent in reporting back to us. The convenient messageboard shutdown over at affl doesn't lend him much credibility when he talks about transparency and openness. The deleted messages over there serve the same perception.Put it all together, and this guy is a complete fraud and hoping to hit the lottery here. No way he's going to roll in $1M from investors to buyout this company. He's screwed himself and, as such, all those who threw their money down that software toilet of his are also screwed, as well.He deserves no latitude here. If you want to give it to him, fine. But, he's earned none of it, so it would be charity on your part.
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
True storyI am completely aware of the entire situation and this thread. I've read every one of your posts hammering the guy. You've repeated yourself over and over. If you want to repeatedly hammer everything he says, that is your choice. You certainly have done it for pages. Guess what - we get your position. If fact, we got it eight pages ago.I've given him no latitude for what he did. Nor was I asking you to give him latitude for his actions. I'd be as mad as anyone for getting stiffed if it happened to me. Like Aerolaw, I am a lawyer. I also have read every one of Aerolaw's posts, and he is right on with his legal assessment. So you can keep your thumbs down smiley just because I did not agree with or placate your need to repeatedly hammer Neil.Plenty of stuff he could say that would be constructive and received well here. I'm not sure if you've been keeping track, but he's minimized the problems people have, he's misrepresented his software valuation, he's whined about how difficult his situation is...and, he has not even remotely empathized with any conviction the situation that people are in with regards to their money being held in the Giant Neil Vacuum. Plus, he has been inconsistent in reporting back to us. The convenient messageboard shutdown over at affl doesn't lend him much credibility when he talks about transparency and openness. The deleted messages over there serve the same perception.Put it all together, and this guy is a complete fraud and hoping to hit the lottery here. No way he's going to roll in $1M from investors to buyout this company. He's screwed himself and, as such, all those who threw their money down that software toilet of his are also screwed, as well.He deserves no latitude here. If you want to give it to him, fine. But, he's earned none of it, so it would be charity on your part.
did i ever say i was a lawyer? actually, i just stayed at a holiday inn express last nightI am completely aware of the entire situation and this thread. I've read every one of your posts hammering the guy. You've repeated yourself over and over. If you want to repeatedly hammer everything he says, that is your choice. You certainly have done it for pages. Guess what - we get your position. If fact, we got it eight pages ago.I've given him no latitude for what he did. Nor was I asking you to give him latitude for his actions. I'd be as mad as anyone for getting stiffed if it happened to me. Like Aerolaw, I am a lawyer. I also have read every one of Aerolaw's posts, and he is right on with his legal assessment. So you can keep your thumbs down smiley just because I did not agree with or placate your need to repeatedly hammer Neil.Plenty of stuff he could say that would be constructive and received well here. I'm not sure if you've been keeping track, but he's minimized the problems people have, he's misrepresented his software valuation, he's whined about how difficult his situation is...and, he has not even remotely empathized with any conviction the situation that people are in with regards to their money being held in the Giant Neil Vacuum. Plus, he has been inconsistent in reporting back to us. The convenient messageboard shutdown over at affl doesn't lend him much credibility when he talks about transparency and openness. The deleted messages over there serve the same perception.Put it all together, and this guy is a complete fraud and hoping to hit the lottery here. No way he's going to roll in $1M from investors to buyout this company. He's screwed himself and, as such, all those who threw their money down that software toilet of his are also screwed, as well.He deserves no latitude here. If you want to give it to him, fine. But, he's earned none of it, so it would be charity on your part.
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Best line of the thread
Btw, message board still appears frozen in time. I have to say that tearing into each other probably won't help things one way or the other.-QG
Leroy's Aces
Footballguy
Good posting buck.
The AFFL fiasco and other issues like the economy could really impact high stakes fantasy this year. This could be the year that the NFFC and the WCOFF have a drop in entrants. The loss of confidence in some high stakes events may be a factor, too. AFFL was part of the FSTA as are NFFC and WCOFF, so being part of the industry trade association means you paid your $99 dues. I guess I do not see any association out there protecting the high stakes fantasy players. Good friends of mine like 3 intboy (lou of bfdfantasyfootball.com) and Team Legacy (Scott) are out well over $10,000. I know the NFFC is part of some huge publishing corporation, so they are supposed to be safe to play in, but that is a whole different issue, payouts in the 70-75% range. This will be an interesting year indeed.
Dave
Leroy's Aces
The AFFL fiasco and other issues like the economy could really impact high stakes fantasy this year. This could be the year that the NFFC and the WCOFF have a drop in entrants. The loss of confidence in some high stakes events may be a factor, too. AFFL was part of the FSTA as are NFFC and WCOFF, so being part of the industry trade association means you paid your $99 dues. I guess I do not see any association out there protecting the high stakes fantasy players. Good friends of mine like 3 intboy (lou of bfdfantasyfootball.com) and Team Legacy (Scott) are out well over $10,000. I know the NFFC is part of some huge publishing corporation, so they are supposed to be safe to play in, but that is a whole different issue, payouts in the 70-75% range. This will be an interesting year indeed.
Dave
Leroy's Aces
JCrusher
Footballguy
After browsing through nine pages of posts, I didn't see any mention of someone who spoke with Neil by phone lately. Obviously he shut the message board down so the only way to get updates from him is via telephone. So......has anyone tried and if so, does he answer? I suspect not but I've got to ask.
I'm also curious what's the prevailing opinion as how to proceed from here? As one of many that is out some coin from this venture, I've waited patiently for a positive resolution. What now? Do you at least try to get your entry fee refunded from PayPal or the credit card company? Do you get a lawyer? Do you call the COPS???? Rather than mounds of babble as how much a thief this Neil person is, a well thought out plan or constructive answer on how we may at least recoup some of our loss would be appreciated.
I'm also curious what's the prevailing opinion as how to proceed from here? As one of many that is out some coin from this venture, I've waited patiently for a positive resolution. What now? Do you at least try to get your entry fee refunded from PayPal or the credit card company? Do you get a lawyer? Do you call the COPS???? Rather than mounds of babble as how much a thief this Neil person is, a well thought out plan or constructive answer on how we may at least recoup some of our loss would be appreciated.
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Dave, I do not see this hurting WCOFF or NFFC. Both are live events with "sponsors" that have more at stake in the form of their "other businesses" (magazines, advice site , etc). They cannot afford to drop the ball since it would have disastrous affects on their other bottom lines. I do think it will limit growth at both but each will do just as good as last year IMHO. They just will not grow fast this year. In fact, maybe this will drive more to those events as individuals will opt to go to the biggest live events versus playing High Stakes online but without a secured prize. This may be what offsets the economy dow turn affect.As AFFL and Turf War finally shake out I think it will push most of these leagues to go to some form of Bond to guarantee the prize money. I seriusly dont think the escrow account works since some of that money is needed to work other things. You may be tieing the hands of the company too much. A better deal for those running the games maybe some form of insurance or posting a bond guarantee.Then again I could be wrong. I did predict a sucessful Maiden Voyage of the Titanic too.Here is a second vote for best comment seen to date...."stayed at a Holiday Inn express last night" .........That was prefect.Everyone needs to focus on the best way to get paid. Not bashing each other.
Leroy's Aces
Footballguy
hi slam, I enjoyed your book. You make some good points. Not to hijack the thread, but do you think everything is ok with WCOFF? I do not. The event and the culture has changed or for lack of a better word, evaporated. It seems a lot more "corporate". Not to mention the late payouts on some leagues coupled with having people prepay for a discounted 2nd team in 2008. Many high stakes players are not happy wth the current state of affairs in the high stakes arena.
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FantasyTrader
Footballguy
We'll agree to disagree. You say he made the worst of the opportunity. I don't think there was any way for him to make the best of the opportunity. I think that no matter how delicate or placating he is, it's irrelivent. Either the winners have been paid or they haven't. "pelted with snarky comments, not because he's shown his face, but because he has delivered mostly incomplete and bizarre updates." Initially he was here pretty regularly. I can pull up responses where he admits this is all his fault. I don't blame anyone for attacking him - but at this point he's just being masocistic (sp?) to come back here before he's able to say - where do I send the checks?What I think has happened is that Neil has made the worst of the opportunity. Showing up inconsistently and trying to deflect criticism away from what is going on does little, in my estimation, to cultivate a forgiving environment. He's been pelted with snarky comments, not because he's shown his face, but because he has delivered mostly incomplete and bizarre updates.
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Ted's Cracked Head
Footballguy
I do not think this situation negatively affects the NFFC and WCOFF. On the contrary, I think the folks who are seeking the higher end games will look to these two challenges this year because they are solidly established entities and trusted. They are not some one man shows hanging by a thread.
If anything, the economy will affect the high stakes events more than a couple of sites who have not paid out their prizes. I know I am cutting way back this year on my FF expenditures.
If anything, the economy will affect the high stakes events more than a couple of sites who have not paid out their prizes. I know I am cutting way back this year on my FF expenditures.
FF Forever
Footballguy
I, too, am one of Neil's victims at close to $3K. I had forgotten about the Ebay sale until Scott brought it up. I drafted a Platinum team and a Gold team. In one of them (I don't recall which) there was a team that was drafted by Affl personnel to be auctioned off after the draft. The thing that stuck in my mind is that that team had the first pick. Now, as you recall, going into the 2007 FF season, the #1 pick was perceived to be gold. At the time, I thought, man, the Affl got lucky with that pick cuz it'll be so much easier (and more profitable) to auction off a team with LT2 on it. In the back of my mind, I may have had an inkling of "could the draft slots have been fixed?" but I ignored it and gave the Affl the benefit of the doubt.But now, in light of all of Neil's actions - some call it idiotic (bad business decisions) and others call it fraud - I really have to question that issue as well. I remember that there were around 20 teams (Platinum, Gold, and Silver) that were auctioned on Ebay. I wonder how many of them had LT2 (i.e., had the #1 pick) on them. I never bothered to check out those Ebay teams cuz for me, about 50% of the enjoyment of the FF season is in the draft itself. But if anyone bought any of those teams and checked out the Ebay list, I'll be interested in knowing the % of LT2 teams on Ebay.
hi Dave,Glad you enjoyed my book. If you get a chance please drop a reveiw at amazon or BN.com or both. Good reveiws really do sell books!
To the casual observer it may appear that you are trying to piss off everyone this year. First you comment on Greg and NFFC and now WCOFF. LOL. I am just kidding. Your comments in both cases were honest, heartfelt and close to the mark.As for WCOFF...I too am concerned about the later payouts this year in some leagues and the prepay discounted team scheme. Although to be fair I tried to get a few friends to take me up on that one ( unsucessfully). I would have jumped at a chance to play for $1000 this year. It is not the same when Lenny and Emil (and Chris) did everything on their own and nothing dropped through the cracks.To be fair I think many of the differences between 2006 and 2007 were favorable (Prize money increases; MB being the exception to the rule). Yes the event has a more corporate feel, but if that gets us good food and drink and show girls than call me a "company man".Bumping the big prize to $300K and league prizes to $7000 were positive, but beleive it or not that scares me the most. I feel it was too much too fast. That scares me more when entrants did not increase enough to compensate for the higher payouts. Bottom line: Cautiously optimisticPS Had to edit as my Cambridge dictionary led me astray spelling wise.
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Leroy's Aces
Footballguy
You are right Slam, WCOFF did make some nice moves too. The message board thing is pretty minor and only represents a few players. Besides, they needed to calm down the non-community chat and they did a good job of that. They still got a few more entrants after a hefty entry fee increase and really ramped up the satellite leagues.
NFFC does do a fine job in a lot of ways. Greg and his group are passionate and active, more power to them. Maybe I will steer some more entry fee money their way this year. They have a small, yet loyal following.
I am hopeful for high stakes fantasy in 2008. I have a feeling I will be steering more funds to high stakes fantasy events than usual, as business has been good for me actually and I feel like I can make some money in it.
Anyway, doesn't anyone else find it strange that AFFL Neil values his software/ business at precisely the value of his liabilities? How convenient.
NFFC does do a fine job in a lot of ways. Greg and his group are passionate and active, more power to them. Maybe I will steer some more entry fee money their way this year. They have a small, yet loyal following.
I am hopeful for high stakes fantasy in 2008. I have a feeling I will be steering more funds to high stakes fantasy events than usual, as business has been good for me actually and I feel like I can make some money in it.
Anyway, doesn't anyone else find it strange that AFFL Neil values his software/ business at precisely the value of his liabilities? How convenient.
Team Legacy
Footballguy
FantasyTrader
Footballguy
Funnies,
I may be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that's what he was getting at.
I may be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that's what he was getting at.
Hey fellas...I've been watching this thing from afar....I am not invested in this situation at all, aside from watching this mess and waiting to see a resolution. I have an idea...I'll throw this out to the people who are owed money and to Neil.
Neil - your business right now has absolutely no value, you are not going to get VC funding...nobody is going to merge/buy you out for the monies you owe. I have bought and sold businesses before...typical asking price on a business is 1-2 years profit + FFE (your software included) - Debt + Inventory (you have none). You have no profit or inventory, in severe debt...and even if your software is worth $800,000..that brings you to zero...so no value. No one will buy...
People who are owed money - you are not going to get cash, that is apparent..the money is gone and nobody is going to give it to Neil, unfortunately.
SOLUTION - Neil, you need to transfer the ownership of this site along with all software along with all records...to the people owed money. There needs to be a meeting with a lawyer who represents this Class and your lawyer. If this was done...
1) People owed money could eventually make more then they are owed. They would get an ownership % based on the money owed....
2) It would save the reputation of the site and allow for this to be a valid product..if the people you shorted money, now own the business..it's a great story and I'm sure they'd all take something over nothing.
3) Neil you'd need to provide monies to pay for site management for a specific amount of time (until profit is reached or 3 years). This would have to be personal money that you'd have to provide before anything is signed.
This is the only solution...Neil, face it my friend..you f'd up. People do it...but the longer you wait, worse it will get...the site and your role in the FF community are both worthless at this point...you just owe money. People that are owed - you won't get cash, try to negotiate for the only thing that Neil has that is worth even a portion of what he owes you....the site.
Just my 2 cents..
BP
Neil - your business right now has absolutely no value, you are not going to get VC funding...nobody is going to merge/buy you out for the monies you owe. I have bought and sold businesses before...typical asking price on a business is 1-2 years profit + FFE (your software included) - Debt + Inventory (you have none). You have no profit or inventory, in severe debt...and even if your software is worth $800,000..that brings you to zero...so no value. No one will buy...
People who are owed money - you are not going to get cash, that is apparent..the money is gone and nobody is going to give it to Neil, unfortunately.
SOLUTION - Neil, you need to transfer the ownership of this site along with all software along with all records...to the people owed money. There needs to be a meeting with a lawyer who represents this Class and your lawyer. If this was done...
1) People owed money could eventually make more then they are owed. They would get an ownership % based on the money owed....
2) It would save the reputation of the site and allow for this to be a valid product..if the people you shorted money, now own the business..it's a great story and I'm sure they'd all take something over nothing.
3) Neil you'd need to provide monies to pay for site management for a specific amount of time (until profit is reached or 3 years). This would have to be personal money that you'd have to provide before anything is signed.
This is the only solution...Neil, face it my friend..you f'd up. People do it...but the longer you wait, worse it will get...the site and your role in the FF community are both worthless at this point...you just owe money. People that are owed - you won't get cash, try to negotiate for the only thing that Neil has that is worth even a portion of what he owes you....the site.
Just my 2 cents..
BP
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Team Legacy
Footballguy
Yeah right. Dream world, otherwise referred to as lala land. AFFL is dead. RIP. Murdered by Neil Wickham. Jury finds him Guilty. Charges TBD.
really is
GoBrowns2008
Footballguy
Does anyone have any insight as to how a dispute with a credit card company would work for something like this? Once the paperwork for the dispute is filled out and submitted, how does the credit card company actually refund the money? Do they go to the merchant and demand for the entry fee ($500 in this case) back, I would assume payment has already been paid to the merchant since the transaction took place 6 months ago? If that happens and Neil is broke, is there any chance of recovering at least the entry fee?
Team Legacy
Footballguy
99% OF ALL CREDIT CARD COMPANIES - have a policy that states you may dispute a transaction within 60 days. Its in their terms of agreement. You, like me... are SOL.
Kirk...Neil answered me via emails. He is working with 3 parties and was encouraged by their interest. I'll ask him to update us via this forum.
Dreamer
Footballguy
cobalt_27
Footballguy
For the record, I don't think you'll get so much as the lint out of Neil's pocket.
FantasyTrader
Footballguy
JohnnyU said:
Time only allows him to pull whatever legal shenanigans he can as far as business restructuring, "relocation", etc. etc.Well, here I am the winner of the AFFL gold league, 75,000+1,350 for winning the championship+the waterford crystal trophy (so basically out over 80,000 dollars). I found this forum a couple of days ago and have since then been watching and wondering if Neil would ever post something to the winners. Neil your probably not ever coming on this site again, but if you do, I just want you to answer my one question. A couple of weeks before the checks were to be mailed YOU (not I EVER) contacted me (around mid January) to tell me that you would be coming to my state so you could take my picture with the trophy. You had no reason in the world to make that phone call because as you have stated you knew at that time there was no money for the winners. I had NEVER tried to contact you before this point, so there was no reason nor any pressure from me for you to even make this call. So my big question is, Why did you make that call ????????
The reason that call was so important to me is because at that point I let my guard down and for the first time since winning the money I believed almost 100% that I would be recieving it. Because as I told my family and friends (who most doubted and thought it was a scam that I could win that much money from fantasy football) that why would Neil go out of his way to contact me if he wasn't intending on paying. Of course we all know the rest of the story and obviously the pictures were never taken and I never met with Neil. I did however get in contact with Neil a couple weeks later because he never followed up with the pictures. He assured me that we would take them soon and that's when I started wondering if I would really ever get paid.
It takes a lot for me to get angry (and to sit and type and write because I suck at it) and I think that started to really happen when I found myself reading this over again last night at 3 am in the morning and here I am again at 2 am the following morning when I should obviously be exausted from last night and should be sleeping. I will probably never win something like this again and because of Neil this has become such a bad experience.
I think Neil believed he may have had a chance to fix this but he did such a bad job in contacting the winners after Feb 8th with updates and possible solutions and that's what most of the people on this site tried to tell him all along. Im not saying that he had to post here but he had an obligation to notify the winners what was going on. Every day probably at least three times a day I would check my Email and the message board hoping to get any kind of an update. The only time he responded with updates to me (and he did respond to me) was the three times I contacted him first. Maybe I'm wrong but for myself him being honest and keeping me updated would have made me a lot more sympathetic towards him. I contacted him this past Monday by email and he told me that he would be talking to somebody about the sale of AFFL that night and would keep me UPDATED. As usual its now Saturday morning and I have not heard from him because I didn't contact him for another update.
This morning I realize I will not be getting my money and my promise to my four girls that we will be going to DisneyWorld will becoming out of my own pocket. We went last year and since I told them we are going this year because Daddy won big LOL were going back. I will NOT break my PROMISE to them like he has to all the AFFL players.You try explaining to Four girls under the age of seven after weeks of planning that Neils not paying so we can't go to Disney. I'm sure other winners went out and spent money they shouldn't have because they trusted him. ( Like MAMA always said don't count youre chickens until the hatch).
Well I'm going to bed as I have said enough. one thing to also mention that I haven't seen posted any where else is he asked for our SS# for tax reasons probably for show just like when he wished us merry XMAS even though he knew there was no money. You will see me in court that is a promise. As stated by so many people on this site and I believe my lawyer also feels the same way that he will be going to jail. It's unfortunate that he has kids unless that was also just lie because they are going to be the biggest losers of all and that will be harder for them than for me to lose 80,000!
Well these are all the things I would say to Neil if he was anywhere to be found and was actually making an effort to keep people informed instead of being a sneak and hiding and lying.
The reason that call was so important to me is because at that point I let my guard down and for the first time since winning the money I believed almost 100% that I would be recieving it. Because as I told my family and friends (who most doubted and thought it was a scam that I could win that much money from fantasy football) that why would Neil go out of his way to contact me if he wasn't intending on paying. Of course we all know the rest of the story and obviously the pictures were never taken and I never met with Neil. I did however get in contact with Neil a couple weeks later because he never followed up with the pictures. He assured me that we would take them soon and that's when I started wondering if I would really ever get paid.
It takes a lot for me to get angry (and to sit and type and write because I suck at it) and I think that started to really happen when I found myself reading this over again last night at 3 am in the morning and here I am again at 2 am the following morning when I should obviously be exausted from last night and should be sleeping. I will probably never win something like this again and because of Neil this has become such a bad experience.
I think Neil believed he may have had a chance to fix this but he did such a bad job in contacting the winners after Feb 8th with updates and possible solutions and that's what most of the people on this site tried to tell him all along. Im not saying that he had to post here but he had an obligation to notify the winners what was going on. Every day probably at least three times a day I would check my Email and the message board hoping to get any kind of an update. The only time he responded with updates to me (and he did respond to me) was the three times I contacted him first. Maybe I'm wrong but for myself him being honest and keeping me updated would have made me a lot more sympathetic towards him. I contacted him this past Monday by email and he told me that he would be talking to somebody about the sale of AFFL that night and would keep me UPDATED. As usual its now Saturday morning and I have not heard from him because I didn't contact him for another update.
This morning I realize I will not be getting my money and my promise to my four girls that we will be going to DisneyWorld will becoming out of my own pocket. We went last year and since I told them we are going this year because Daddy won big LOL were going back. I will NOT break my PROMISE to them like he has to all the AFFL players.You try explaining to Four girls under the age of seven after weeks of planning that Neils not paying so we can't go to Disney. I'm sure other winners went out and spent money they shouldn't have because they trusted him. ( Like MAMA always said don't count youre chickens until the hatch).
Well I'm going to bed as I have said enough. one thing to also mention that I haven't seen posted any where else is he asked for our SS# for tax reasons probably for show just like when he wished us merry XMAS even though he knew there was no money. You will see me in court that is a promise. As stated by so many people on this site and I believe my lawyer also feels the same way that he will be going to jail. It's unfortunate that he has kids unless that was also just lie because they are going to be the biggest losers of all and that will be harder for them than for me to lose 80,000!
Well these are all the things I would say to Neil if he was anywhere to be found and was actually making an effort to keep people informed instead of being a sneak and hiding and lying.
King of Queens
Footballguy
I think this just about says it all. If any of you still have any sympathy for Neil, please re-read the above post. Absolutely sickening.
crazy gadget
Footballguy
Incredibly good post! I am rooting for everyone in this situation to get what is coming to them (Neil included :handcuffs
When you go to Disney World, don't even give Neil a minute of your thoughts. Just enjoy taking pictures with Mickey and Minnie and cherishing the smiles on the faces of your four daughters. That is what matters most in the end anyways. Good luck to all of you that have been affected by AFFL.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
This guy Neil is pond scum - not for what happened but by the way he has (mis)handled this from the start - good luck Bosco - That is a ton of money to be screwed out of - Neil should be ashamed after reading that post. If I were you Bosco I would skip the atty and call the police at this point. Let's see if Neil has enough money left over for a good defense lawyer. BTW - This is more of an example of the dangers of these high stakes leagues - this thread should not be buried here IMO!I have had several meetings with perspective buyers this week. I know some people on this forum think that AFFL is worthless, but I can tell you that several people are interested in purchasing it. We are close to a deal on several fronts.
Steven,
The phone call was standard procedure to congratulate the winners. I was still feverishly trying to have an investor by the payday, and had reason to be optimistic that we would get one by that time. Some posts on the board are correct, in that I had drastically overvalued AFFL and the software at that time, but I think that we are much more realistic now, and have the interested buyers to show.
I cannot monitor this board constantly, even though I wish I could. I know that our board has not been working since I brought it online, and with limited resources I have not been able to fix this issue. I have tried to respond to all of the emails and voicemails that come in.
I am very sorry that we are in this situation, and I want more then anything to find the fastest resolution to it.
Steven,
The phone call was standard procedure to congratulate the winners. I was still feverishly trying to have an investor by the payday, and had reason to be optimistic that we would get one by that time. Some posts on the board are correct, in that I had drastically overvalued AFFL and the software at that time, but I think that we are much more realistic now, and have the interested buyers to show.
I cannot monitor this board constantly, even though I wish I could. I know that our board has not been working since I brought it online, and with limited resources I have not been able to fix this issue. I have tried to respond to all of the emails and voicemails that come in.
I am very sorry that we are in this situation, and I want more then anything to find the fastest resolution to it.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Typical stalling on everything. Funny how the message board doesn't work. Who actually believes any of this ####?
King of Queens
Footballguy
Time to bump up this quote.
King of Queens
Footballguy
Update: you are now 32 days late. And counting.Thanks for updating us on the investor front.
This is what it says on the AFFL homepage....
2008 Entry Fees and Grand Prizes
Platinum Entry - $1200 through June 1st, then $1350
Grand Prize $100,000 or more
Gold Entry - $500 through June 1st, then $600; Grand Prize $75,000
Silver Entry - $150 through June 1st, then $185; Grand Prize $40,000
Bronze Entry - $100 through June 1st, then $125; Grand Prize $25,000
Copper Entry - $35; Grand Prize $10,000
AFFLAC Entry - $10; Prizes TBD
Eliminator Entry - $10; Prizes TBD
My favorite is "$100,000 or more".
I am owed a little over $1,000, have not received or heard ONE PERSONAL update on my prize $$ status (just the generic one he has sent to everyone), yet he is already promoting $100,000 OR MORE (along with the other grand prizes). Glad to know your CURRENT customers who you owe money to, aren't as important as the "potential suckers" out there looking for a high stakes contest!
Neil better be paying out soon, as his "deception" isn't going to play out very well in court. It is going to pretty difficult to prove this isn't fraud with all the things (see above, calling grand prize winners when you KNEW there was a very good chance you couldn't pay, and everything else we have yet to know about).
For your sake, I hope you START paying people VERY soon
2008 Entry Fees and Grand Prizes
Platinum Entry - $1200 through June 1st, then $1350
Grand Prize $100,000 or more
Gold Entry - $500 through June 1st, then $600; Grand Prize $75,000
Silver Entry - $150 through June 1st, then $185; Grand Prize $40,000
Bronze Entry - $100 through June 1st, then $125; Grand Prize $25,000
Copper Entry - $35; Grand Prize $10,000
AFFLAC Entry - $10; Prizes TBD
Eliminator Entry - $10; Prizes TBD
My favorite is "$100,000 or more".
I am owed a little over $1,000, have not received or heard ONE PERSONAL update on my prize $$ status (just the generic one he has sent to everyone), yet he is already promoting $100,000 OR MORE (along with the other grand prizes). Glad to know your CURRENT customers who you owe money to, aren't as important as the "potential suckers" out there looking for a high stakes contest!
Neil better be paying out soon, as his "deception" isn't going to play out very well in court. It is going to pretty difficult to prove this isn't fraud with all the things (see above, calling grand prize winners when you KNEW there was a very good chance you couldn't pay, and everything else we have yet to know about).
For your sake, I hope you START paying people VERY soon
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Team Legacy
Footballguy
Who wants to bet that he IS in fact collecting dues already from players unaware of the situation???
Leroy's Aces
Footballguy
Hey Bosco, Your post made me literally sick to my stomach. I am really sorry for what has happened to you and the other AFFL Victims. I wish you the best in the future and I really hope that you and all of these players can get some sort of compensation from what has occurred. I really hope Neil can get SOME money and compensate people at least part of their winnings. My family and I just got back from Disney this week. I have 2 daughters, ages 4 and 3 and we had a blast. I am sure you will have a great time with your family. I hope you do not give up on high stakes fantasy. You never know what 2008 will bring and I am hopeful for the future of high stakes fantasy football...Dave Leroy's Aces
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