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Otis

When do we go in and wipe out ISIS?

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Third on-camera beheading today, this time of a British aid worker. So much for the Brits sitting on the sidelines and rolling their eyes at those melodramatic Americans...

If a bully takes your lunch money three times, at what point do you step up? We pretty much have to step in now, with a European coalition, and clean house, no?

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I'm certain there are guys in here who will say it's a mistake and will be hard to do. I'm also certain that, as with any problem, there is a way to go about this that will work. I don't have that answer, but I suspect someone who studies military strategy, politics, and Middle East affairs will probably have some decent ideas.

Oh and I can't wait until they find this one masked schlub who has been doing the beheadings. That'll be time for great shtick.

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Are you familiar with our President?

Yeah. Black guy, right? The old white rich guys can't stand him.

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And the British are kinda distracted by the Scottish Independence Movement right now.

FREEDOM!

Wallace! Wallace! Wallace!

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The third? I bet more than 3 people die if we engage in military action.

I bet way, way more than 3, you're right. So let's go do this.

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The third? I bet more than 3 people die if we engage in military action.

I bet way, way more than 3, you're right. So let's go do this.

Let's? You're volunteering your services?

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According to several of my ME friends, the US is an impotent shell of its former self and should just leave ISIS to Iraq, Iran and Syria because they are more than capable of handling the situation.

Edited by Christo

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According to several of my ME friends, the US is an impotent shell of its former self and should just leave ISIS to Iraq, Iran and Syria because they are more than capable of handling the situation.

And that's not even counting Otis.

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It's a risk. A big risk. Not saying we shouldn't do it, but be aware:

1. We can't do it without boots on the ground. There was some talk that the Kurds could do it with our air support, but I doubt that's truly viable.

2. We've been in Afghanistan for 13 years and we still haven't eliminated the Taliban. Granted the terrain is different; they have tunnels to hide in. But we might not succeed.

3. Right now most of the Arab world does not support ISIS outside of idealistic youths. If we attack, they WILL gain much more support.

4. After we wipe out ISIS, what then? We would have a chaos inside Iraq just like 2004 all over again. Are we better prepared this time for the consequences?

5. Iran would be made more powerful.

Again, I am not saying we shouldn't do it. But there's a lot of stuff to talk about, even beyond the points I mentioned here.

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According to several of my ME friends, the US is an impotent shell of its former self and should just leave ISIS to Iraq, Iran and Syria because they are more than capable of handling the situation.

And that's not even counting Otis.

They didn't mention "fat."

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Third on-camera beheading today, this time of a British aid worker. So much for the Brits sitting on the sidelines and rolling their eyes at those melodramatic Americans...

If a bully takes your lunch money three times, at what point do you step up? We pretty much have to step in now, with a European coalition, and clean house, no?

And when will civilians stop going over to that area to render aid? Don't know why anyone would want to step foot anywhere near the middle east.

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It's a risk. A big risk. Not saying we shouldn't do it, but be aware:

1. We can't do it without boots on the ground. There was some talk that the Kurds could do it with our air support, but I doubt that's truly viable.

2. We've been in Afghanistan for 13 years and we still haven't eliminated the Taliban. Granted the terrain is different; they have tunnels to hide in. But we might not succeed.

3. Right now most of the Arab world does not support ISIS outside of idealistic youths. If we attack, they WILL gain much more support.

4. After we wipe out ISIS, what then? We would have a chaos inside Iraq just like 2004 all over again. Are we better prepared this time for the consequences?

5. Iran would be made more powerful.

Again, I am not saying we shouldn't do it. But there's a lot of stuff to talk about, even beyond the points I mentioned here.

Do you have your mail forwarded to the FFA?

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These cockroaches need exterminated. Every single one of them. If you don't wipe out the whole nest, they just pack up and move and then grow again.

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It's a risk. A big risk. Not saying we shouldn't do it, but be aware:

1. We can't do it without boots on the ground. There was some talk that the Kurds could do it with our air support, but I doubt that's truly viable.

2. We've been in Afghanistan for 13 years and we still haven't eliminated the Taliban. Granted the terrain is different; they have tunnels to hide in. But we might not succeed.

3. Right now most of the Arab world does not support ISIS outside of idealistic youths. If we attack, they WILL gain much more support.

4. After we wipe out ISIS, what then? We would have a chaos inside Iraq just like 2004 all over again. Are we better prepared this time for the consequences?

5. Iran would be made more powerful.

Again, I am not saying we shouldn't do it. But there's a lot of stuff to talk about, even beyond the points I mentioned here.

Do you have your mail forwarded to the FFA?

No, because then all of you would be able to read it.

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It's a risk. A big risk. Not saying we shouldn't do it, but be aware:

1. We can't do it without boots on the ground. There was some talk that the Kurds could do it with our air support, but I doubt that's truly viable.

2. We've been in Afghanistan for 13 years and we still haven't eliminated the Taliban. Granted the terrain is different; they have tunnels to hide in. But we might not succeed.

3. Right now most of the Arab world does not support ISIS outside of idealistic youths. If we attack, they WILL gain much more support.

4. After we wipe out ISIS, what then? We would have a chaos inside Iraq just like 2004 all over again. Are we better prepared this time for the consequences?

5. Iran would be made more powerful.

Again, I am not saying we shouldn't do it. But there's a lot of stuff to talk about, even beyond the points I mentioned here.

Do you have your mail forwarded to the FFA?

No, because then all of you would be able to read it.

Yeah, that's true.

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Obama is the most brilliant man ever. Whatever he decides I will give him an A+++ and Obama will go down as the greatest leader ever. .

Fixed for what you are really thinking

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Are you familiar with our President?

My God.

The guy who ramped up Afghanistan, took about four years to finally withdraw from Iraq, helped overthrow Qaddafi with US military actions, killed Bin Laden, has bombed Yemen, Pakistan and God knows where the hell else, killed Ahmed Godane in Somalia, and has just announced an extensive bombing campaign inside of Iraq and Syria isn’t enough of a warmonger for you?

What the hell do you want?

Edited by Fennis
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Head cockroach:

Who is al-Baghdadi?
He's an Islamic scholar, poet, and Sunni extremist who is as much as an enigma to his followers as he is to his enemies. Born Awwad Ibrahim Ali al-Badri al-Samarrai in the central Iraqi city of Samarra, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, 43, is believed to have started his career as a preacher of Salafism, a hard-line form of Sunni Islam, and to have a degree in history and a doctorate in sharia law. After the U.S. invaded Iraq in 2003, he led a Sunni militant group that fought against American troops. Captured by U.S. forces in 2005, he was held for four years at Camp Bucca, a U.S. military prison. There, he met several al Qaeda commanders. In 2009, the U.S. turned al-Baghdadi over to Iraqi authorities as part of a Bush administration agreement with the Iraqis. Col. Ken King, who oversaw Camp Bucca, recalls al-Baghdadi taunting his American captors at the time, "I'll see you guys in New York." He was quickly released by the Iraqis and used his prison contacts to take over an al Qaeda–aligned militant group, the Islamic State of Iraq. Shortly after, he began an offensive to seize territory.

Looks like both parties are totally inept. This guy should have simply 'disappeared'.

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According to several of my ME friends, the US is an impotent shell of its former self and should just leave ISIS to Iraq, Iran and Syria because they are more than capable of handling the situation.

I say Saudi Arabia should take care on cleaning up their own backyard.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-29004253

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/islamic-state-saudi-arabias-oil-wells-are-the-ultimate-goal-for-isis-30579087.html

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Head cockroach:

Who is al-Baghdadi?

He's an Islamic scholar, poet, and Sunni extremist who is as much as an enigma to his followers as he is to his enemies. Born Awwad Ibrahim Ali al-Badri al-Samarrai in the central Iraqi city of Samarra, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, 43, is believed to have started his career as a preacher of Salafism, a hard-line form of Sunni Islam, and to have a degree in history and a doctorate in sharia law. After the U.S. invaded Iraq in 2003, he led a Sunni militant group that fought against American troops. Captured by U.S. forces in 2005, he was held for four years at Camp Bucca, a U.S. military prison. There, he met several al Qaeda commanders. In 2009, the U.S. turned al-Baghdadi over to Iraqi authorities as part of a Bush administration agreement with the Iraqis. Col. Ken King, who oversaw Camp Bucca, recalls al-Baghdadi taunting his American captors at the time, "I'll see you guys in New York." He was quickly released by the Iraqis and used his prison contacts to take over an al Qaeda–aligned militant group, the Islamic State of Iraq. Shortly after, he began an offensive to seize territory.

Looks like both parties are totally inept. This guy should have simply 'disappeared'.

why are you blaming political parties? This has nothing to do with political parties.

I guess you could argue its a military or intelligence failure, but even that seems like a stretch to me, but at last there logic behind it.

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Head cockroach:

Who is al-Baghdadi?

He's an Islamic scholar, poet, and Sunni extremist who is as much as an enigma to his followers as he is to his enemies. Born Awwad Ibrahim Ali al-Badri al-Samarrai in the central Iraqi city of Samarra, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, 43, is believed to have started his career as a preacher of Salafism, a hard-line form of Sunni Islam, and to have a degree in history and a doctorate in sharia law. After the U.S. invaded Iraq in 2003, he led a Sunni militant group that fought against American troops. Captured by U.S. forces in 2005, he was held for four years at Camp Bucca, a U.S. military prison. There, he met several al Qaeda commanders. In 2009, the U.S. turned al-Baghdadi over to Iraqi authorities as part of a Bush administration agreement with the Iraqis. Col. Ken King, who oversaw Camp Bucca, recalls al-Baghdadi taunting his American captors at the time, "I'll see you guys in New York." He was quickly released by the Iraqis and used his prison contacts to take over an al Qaeda–aligned militant group, the Islamic State of Iraq. Shortly after, he began an offensive to seize territory.

Looks like both parties are totally inept. This guy should have simply 'disappeared'.

why are you blaming political parties? This has nothing to do with political parties.

I guess you could argue its a military or intelligence failure, but even that seems like a stretch to me, but at last there logic behind it.

I guess I should have quoted PatsWillWin. My mistake.

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Are you familiar with our President?

Yeah. Black guy, right? The old white rich guys can't stand him.

Right. ISIS is probably a pretty big fan though.

ISIS did Obama a favor. Oil prices had gone down after their resurgence, when they started more oil production.

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

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The third? I bet more than 3 people die if we engage in military action.

I bet way, way more than 3, you're right. So let's go do this.

Let's? You're volunteering your services?

Oh lord no. I wouldn't last a week.

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Third on-camera beheading today, this time of a British aid worker. So much for the Brits sitting on the sidelines and rolling their eyes at those melodramatic Americans...

If a bully takes your lunch money three times, at what point do you step up? We pretty much have to step in now, with a European coalition, and clean house, no?

And when will civilians stop going over to that area to render aid? Don't know why anyone would want to step foot anywhere near the middle east.

Yeah there are a handful of things out there that strike me as unequivocally stupid things to do, and going to Syria for any purpose is probably one of them. Especially if you don't have to. But hell, the guy was trying to do some good in the world, so while it may have been a foolish risk, you have to admire him.

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

Yes. Like al-Qaeda, ISIS emerged from the ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, the worlds first Islamist group formed in Egypt in 1928. ISIS also follows an extreme anti-Western interpretation of Islam. It has over $2B in its piggy bank. It is dangerous because it has a big fan club and is financially self-sustaining. What is Obama's game plan again? Edited by Rohn Jambo

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

Yes. Like al-Qaeda, ISIS emerged from the ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, the worlds first Islamist group formed in Egypt in 1928. ISIS also follows an extreme anti-Western interpretation of Islam. It has over $2B in its piggy bank. It is dangerous because it has a big fan club and is financially self-sustaining. What is Obama's game plan again?

Obama was pretty clear. Maybe you missed his speech?

My fellow Americans – tonight, I want to speak to you about what the United States will do with our friends and allies to degrade and ultimately destroy the terrorist group known as ISIL.

As Commander-in-Chief, my highest priority is the security of the American people. Over the last several years, we have consistently taken the fight to terrorists who threaten our country. We took out Osama bin Laden and much of al Qaeda’s leadership in Afghanistan and Pakistan. We’ve targeted al Qaeda’s affiliate in Yemen, and recently eliminated the top commander of its affiliate in Somalia. We’ve done so while bringing more than 140,000 American troops home from Iraq, and drawing down our forces in Afghanistan, where our combat mission will end later this year. Thanks to our military and counterterrorism professionals, America is safer.

Still, we continue to face a terrorist threat. We cannot erase every trace of evil from the world, and small groups of killers have the capacity to do great harm. That was the case before 9/11, and that remains true today. That’s why we must remain vigilant as threats emerge. At this moment, the greatest threats come from the Middle East and North Africa, where radical groups exploit grievances for their own gain. And one of those groups is ISIL – which calls itself the “Islamic State.”

Now let’s make two things clear: ISIL is not “Islamic.” No religion condones the killing of innocents, and the vast majority of ISIL’s victims have been Muslim. And ISIL is certainly not a state. It was formerly al Qaeda’s affiliate in Iraq, and has taken advantage of sectarian strife and Syria’s civil war to gain territory on both sides of the Iraq-Syrian border. It is recognized by no government, nor the people it subjugates. ISIL is a terrorist organization, pure and simple. And it has no vision other than the slaughter of all who stand in its way.

In a region that has known so much bloodshed, these terrorists are unique in their brutality. They execute captured prisoners. They kill children. They enslave, rape, and force women into marriage. They threatened a religious minority with genocide. In acts of barbarism, they took the lives of two American journalists – Jim Foley and Steven Sotloff.

So ISIL poses a threat to the people of Iraq and Syria, and the broader Middle East – including American citizens, personnel and facilities. If left unchecked, these terrorists could pose a growing threat beyond that region – including to the United States. While we have not yet detected specific plotting against our homeland, ISIL leaders have threatened America and our allies. Our intelligence community believes that thousands of foreigners – including Europeans and some Americans – have joined them in Syria and Iraq. Trained and battle-hardened, these fighters could try to return to their home countries and carry out deadly attacks.

I know many Americans are concerned about these threats. Tonight, I want you to know that the United States of America is meeting them with strength and resolve. Last month, I ordered our military to take targeted action against ISIL to stop its advances. Since then, we have conducted more than 150 successful airstrikes in Iraq. These strikes have protected American personnel and facilities, killed ISIL fighters, destroyed weapons, and given space for Iraqi and Kurdish forces to reclaim key territory. These strikes have helped save the lives of thousands of innocent men, women and children.

But this is not our fight alone. American power can make a decisive difference, but we cannot do for Iraqis what they must do for themselves, nor can we take the place of Arab partners in securing their region. That’s why I’ve insisted that additional U.S. action depended upon Iraqis forming an inclusive government, which they have now done in recent days. So tonight, with a new Iraqi government in place, and following consultations with allies abroad and Congress at home, I can announce that America will lead a broad coalition to roll back this terrorist threat.

Our objective is clear: we will degrade, and ultimately destroy, ISIL through a comprehensive and sustained counter-terrorism strategy.

First, we will conduct a systematic campaign of airstrikes against these terrorists. Working with the Iraqi government, we will expand our efforts beyond protecting our own people and humanitarian missions, so that we’re hitting ISIL targets as Iraqi forces go on offense. Moreover, I have made it clear that we will hunt down terrorists who threaten our country, wherever they are. That means I will not hesitate to take action against ISIL in Syria, as well as Iraq. This is a core principle of my presidency: if you threaten America, you will find no safe haven.

Second, we will increase our support to forces fighting these terrorists on the ground. In June, I deployed several hundred American service members to Iraq to assess how we can best support Iraqi Security Forces. Now that those teams have completed their work – and Iraq has formed a government – we will send an additional 475 service members to Iraq. As I have said before, these American forces will not have a combat mission – we will not get dragged into another ground war in Iraq. But they are needed to support Iraqi and Kurdish forces with training, intelligence and equipment. We will also support Iraq’s efforts to stand up National Guard Units to help Sunni communities secure their own freedom from ISIL control.

Across the border, in Syria, we have ramped up our military assistance to the Syrian opposition. Tonight, I again call on Congress to give us additional authorities and resources to train and equip these fighters. In the fight against ISIL, we cannot rely on an Assad regime that terrorizes its people; a regime that will never regain the legitimacy it has lost. Instead, we must strengthen the opposition as the best counterweight to extremists like ISIL, while pursuing the political solution necessary to solve Syria’s crisis once and for all.

Third, we will continue to draw on our substantial counterterrorism capabilities to prevent ISIL attacks. Working with our partners, we will redouble our efforts to cut off its funding; improve our intelligence; strengthen our defenses; counter its warped ideology; and stem the flow of foreign fighters into – and out of – the Middle East. And in two weeks, I will chair a meeting of the UN Security Council to further mobilize the international community around this effort.

Fourth, we will continue providing humanitarian assistance to innocent civilians who have been displaced by this terrorist organization. This includes Sunni and Shia Muslims who are at grave risk, as well as tens of thousands of Christians and other religious minorities. We cannot allow these communities to be driven from their ancient homelands.

This is our strategy. And in each of these four parts of our strategy, America will be joined by a broad coalition of partners. Already, allies are flying planes with us over Iraq; sending arms and assistance to Iraqi Security Forces and the Syrian opposition; sharing intelligence; and providing billions of dollars in humanitarian aid. Secretary Kerry was in Iraq today meeting with the new government and supporting their efforts to promote unity, and in the coming days he will travel across the Middle East and Europe to enlist more partners in this fight, especially Arab nations who can help mobilize Sunni communities in Iraq and Syria to drive these terrorists from their lands. This is American leadership at its best: we stand with people who fight for their own freedom; and we rally other nations on behalf of our common security and common humanity.

My Administration has also secured bipartisan support for this approach here at home. I have the authority to address the threat from ISIL. But I believe we are strongest as a nation when the President and Congress work together. So I welcome congressional support for this effort in order to show the world that Americans are united in confronting this danger.

Now, it will take time to eradicate a cancer like ISIL. And any time we take military action, there are risks involved – especially to the servicemen and women who carry out these missions. But I want the American people to understand how this effort will be different from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. It will not involve American combat troops fighting on foreign soil. This counter-terrorism campaign will be waged through a steady, relentless effort to take out ISIL wherever they exist, using our air power and our support for partner forces on the ground. This strategy of taking out terrorists who threaten us, while supporting partners on the front lines, is one that we have successfully pursued in Yemen and Somalia for years. And it is consistent with the approach I outlined earlier this year: to use force against anyone who threatens America’s core interests, but to mobilize partners wherever possible to address broader challenges to international order.

My fellow Americans, we live in a time of great change. Tomorrow marks 13 years since our country was attacked. Next week marks 6 years since our economy suffered its worst setback since the Great Depression. Yet despite these shocks; through the pain we have felt and the grueling work required to bounce back – America is better positioned today to seize the future than any other nation on Earth.

Our technology companies and universities are unmatched; our manufacturing and auto industries are thriving. Energy independence is closer than it’s been in decades. For all the work that remains, our businesses are in the longest uninterrupted stretch of job creation in our history. Despite all the divisions and discord within our democracy, I see the grit and determination and common goodness of the American people every single day – and that makes me more confident than ever about our country’s future.

Abroad, American leadership is the one constant in an uncertain world. It is America that has the capacity and the will to mobilize the world against terrorists. It is America that has rallied the world against Russian aggression, and in support of the Ukrainian peoples’ right to determine their own destiny. It is America – our scientists, our doctors, our know-how – that can help contain and cure the outbreak of Ebola. It is America that helped remove and destroy Syria’s declared chemical weapons so they cannot pose a threat to the Syrian people – or the world – again. And it is America that is helping Muslim communities around the world not just in the fight against terrorism, but in the fight for opportunity, tolerance, and a more hopeful future.

America, our endless blessings bestow an enduring burden. But as Americans, we welcome our responsibility to lead. From Europe to Asia – from the far reaches of Africa to war-torn capitals of the Middle East – we stand for freedom, for justice, for dignity. These are values that have guided our nation since its founding. Tonight, I ask for your support in carrying that leadership forward. I do so as a Commander-in-Chief who could not be prouder of our men and women in uniform – pilots who bravely fly in the face of danger above the Middle East, and service members who support our partners on the ground.

When we helped prevent the massacre of civilians trapped on a distant mountain, here’s what one of them said: “We owe our American friends our lives. Our children will always remember that there was someone who felt our struggle and made a long journey to protect innocent people.”

That is the difference we make in the world. And our own safety – our own security – depends upon our willingness to do what it takes to defend this nation, and uphold the values that we stand for – timeless ideals that will endure long after those who offer only hate and destruction have been vanquished from the Earth.

May God bless our troops, and may God bless the United States of America.

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I'm certain there are guys in here who will say it's a mistake and will be hard to do. I'm also certain that, as with any problem, there is a way to go about this that will work. I don't have that answer, but I suspect someone who studies military strategy, politics, and Middle East affairs will probably have some decent ideas.

Oh and I can't wait until they find this one masked schlub who has been doing the beheadings. That'll be time for great shtick.

What is important is not exactly who is Jihadi John but the fact the Islamic State (their new name as of Aug) has recruited in the UK the US, and many other Western countries. I am sure we are investigating this recruitment network.

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

Yes. Like al-Qaeda, ISIS emerged from the ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, the worlds first Islamist group formed in Egypt in 1928. ISIS also follows an extreme anti-Western interpretation of Islam. It has over $2B in its piggy bank. It is dangerous because it has a big fan club and is financially self-sustaining. What is Obama's game plan again?

Obama was pretty clear. Maybe you missed his speech?

Just like Obama, I was on vacation (but somewhere else than Martha's Vineyard :hot:). Let me take a look...

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

Yes. Like al-Qaeda, ISIS emerged from the ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, the worlds first Islamist group formed in Egypt in 1928. ISIS also follows an extreme anti-Western interpretation of Islam. It has over $2B in its piggy bank. It is dangerous because it has a big fan club and is financially self-sustaining.

I'm no longer in this world so I think I missed this news. $2 billion?

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Everybody so caught up in the red vs blue politics of this country that they forget the president (any pres, pub or dem) is just a puppet of the corporations. Make no mistake, every major industry vital to this nation profits from war.

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Third on-camera beheading today, this time of a British aid worker. So much for the Brits sitting on the sidelines and rolling their eyes at those melodramatic Americans...

If a bully takes your lunch money three times, at what point do you step up? We pretty much have to step in now, with a European coalition, and clean house, no?

And when will civilians stop going over to that area to render aid? Don't know why anyone would want to step foot anywhere near the middle east.

Yeah there are a handful of things out there that strike me as unequivocally stupid things to do, and going to Syria for any purpose is probably one of them. Especially if you don't have to. But hell, the guy was trying to do some good in the world, so while it may have been a foolish risk, you have to admire him.

They wanted to get the news out. In a way they touched on what I think is the only solution. We can "kill" these extremists groups when we eliminate the need for their existence. Like with ending communism, that happens when you improve the lives of people in that region. Edited by Rohn Jambo

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

Yes. Like al-Qaeda, ISIS emerged from the ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, the worlds first Islamist group formed in Egypt in 1928. ISIS also follows an extreme anti-Western interpretation of Islam. It has over $2B in its piggy bank. It is dangerous because it has a big fan club and is financially self-sustaining.

I'm no longer in this world so I think I missed this news. $2 billion?

At least, probably more now.

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And the British are kinda distracted by the Scottish Independence Movement right now.

FREEDOM!Wallace! Wallace! Wallace!

Yeah, Mark & Spencer took charge of hanging Alex Salmond, and the 5 big banks will draw and quarter him.

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Seems like we should have hit them when they were still just a JV squad.

Tough to do when there primary objective was to topple an unfriendly government to the U.S.

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Seems like we should have hit them when they were still just a JV squad.

Bush did that by invading Iraq but they pop up like dandelions on Otis's lawn after the US troop withdrawal and the uprising in Syria.

Edited by Rohn Jambo

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You can't eliminate a mindset. What ISIL is doing is what guys like Qutb and al-Mawdudi were calling for five decades ago.

I tell you my fellow Muslims, democracy stands in contradiction with your belief. There can be no reconciliation between democracy and Islam. -Mawdudi

After the decay of democracy, to the extent of bankruptcy, the West has nothing to give to humanity. The leadership of Western Man has vanished, it is time for Islam to take over and lead.

-Qutb

This is what happens when you create countries on a map that didn't exist before you created them. The violence and unrest has persisted in Africa for a century without much notice, now the same brutality is drawing interest from people who know nothing about the history, because of the religious implications.

Eliminating ISIL won't work, it is more of a grass roots movement than the Taliban and it has fighters from 80+ countries. This is what happens when you think you're right in toppling Arab dictators thinking some sort of democratic movement will spread. Now what? Bomb them all?

:goodposting:

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If we didn't do it with 1.7 trillion spent and 130,000+ troops on the ground for six years when they were known as 'Al Qaeda in Iraq' what makes you think we can do it now?

Are we supposed to put 500,000 troops in Iraq/Syria and leave them there forever?

Edited by wdcrob
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If we didn't do it with 1.7 trillion spent and 130,000+ troops on the ground for six years when they were known as 'Al Qaeda in Iraq' what makes you think we can do it now?

Are we supposed to put 500,000 troops in Iraq/Syria and leave them there forever?

We pretty much wiped out Al-Qaeda Iraq as an operational enemy. Then a new war broke out and they were back up again doing what they do. They are like pirate radio, only with throwing people off cliffs and such.

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