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Titans IDPs

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Finch is going to try and tough it out. Skip one week and play in week 17. Psycho playing with that...and yet I kind of like it from a rook

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Vrabel restated that he does want a D that can play 3-4 and 4-3.

Since they played so much nickel, he was asked about 4 DL being best and...paused...and brushed it off.

I think that may be when a team switches to 4-3. Frustration, what's best for the talent etc. Without Casey, with Rak and Morgan on the line so much....they really teased it a ton this year.

Finch graded best of all LBs. There's some debate if he'd be a DE in a 4-3. His techniques are fantastic and he just needs to bulk up.

As you know, this talk is always wrong til it isn't but...wanted to share that it seems like a hmmm now. 

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Wake and Vrabel have discussed Landry learning moves but his "fear" of going away from the speed rush; how he's not using them in practice and how he has to. Reports are that he started to and looked real good but then didn't once he lost Vrabel's focus. 

Finch worked on speed and hips this offseason. He had an interesting bit about how he wasn't asked to run as much as a DE and had some issues last year.  

Notice the practice videos shared. Vrabel tells this guy where to put his hands, then that guy to do that, then....Finch comes up, does it perfect, and Vrabel is silent. For Wake and Finch, it's obvious they are both so well trained.

Landry looks far improved in coverage and worked on that during his time off.

It stills appears Finch is better than Landry but the team wants Landry so badly to hit his potential. 

3rd or key downs should be Landry and Wake at OLB, but I suspect Finch by a certain week.

Finch has been at DE in nickel sets while Landry hasn't much.

 

DeAndre Walker has been awesome and awful. We need to see him level off and where he fits in in camp. 

 

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With OTA and minicamp reports out, Amani Hooker has been "right there" with the starters. He has no spot (has played CB and S) and yet he is mixing in very well. Vaccaro and Butler have had bad games and he's good insurance now. I'd watch for him in camp though. He's in a real good spot to steal a job and I'd predict Vaccaro's.

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Hooker did so well in the spring he may start camp ahead of Vaccaro or "neck n neck" with him. IDPers gotta watch this. I see my post above, he's got a real buzz to him.

Titans played two deep last year and many think they don't want to and that Byard is best as a true FS. Statistically, teams don't throw much at Byard and love to throw at Vaccaro. Hooker has some moxy to him. Some hits, some cockiness/arrogance. 

Vaccaro got some money in a time where safeties are probably overpaid. This is the biggest offseason ever for safeties and I'm not sure he belongs. Ryan is a free agent next year and some had him moving to safety when he gets older. If Hooker plays as well with pads on, I could see a Vaccaro cut. They've worked out safeties before camp and I think they just might be leaving that option out there. The ideal scenario is of course for Vaccaro to do well and they stay as is, but they have Henry and Mariota and Conklin becoming free agents. If 2 of 3 do well and command some $, they could sure use Vaccaro's $ next year against the cap.

Deep positional stats, Byard is tops in the NFL and Vaccaro is 31st in yards allowed. This IS a questionable stat because not every team plays two deep and subs and all, but it does shine a light anyway.

With the Titans finally having talented WRs, there should be enough of a test to hash things out. Tannehill is still Tannehill, but as a veteran he should help testing the secondary too. I don't think (for practice) there should be too big a drop for the second team so that'll give the defensive staff more snaps to play around with lineups and see what works best

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A friend pencils Vaccaro in as a super sub and predicts Hooker starting. He pointed to Vaccaro playing Byard's spot with 2nd team and nickel corner (as he has much of his career). 

I'm leery of pouncing right away here. Vaccaro has time to see the rookie trying to take his spot and work on his craft and nail the spot down for himself. 

 

Bledsoe catching everyone's eye and he should. He's a former 4 star recruit to OU that had a battle with the NCAA that greatly hindered his development missing practice, games, can't go to facility...his college career was a nightmare for a kid to develop within. The Titans liked that he played intramural hoops and baseball showing he's a good athlete for a DL. Need time to see him produce and not just look athletic.

Interesting that one site had him sitting. Don't forget reporters gotta memorize 90 numbers and can make mistakes early

With the Titans UDFA WR being adored and Finch so good last year. It really seems like they need to go over something evaluation wise. Their UDFAs shouldn't consistently be better than the 4th thru 7th rounds

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Finch took most of 1st team snaps. Landry did not. Just as I predicted. Vrabel praised him

One of them is in when Wake sits while the other is full-time. I rrrrreally think Finch is going to be the full timer.

Don't forget Evans and Brown are expected to sub in at OLB at times to mix things up for the opposing offense.

Landry worked on adding moves (he had like two, speed and spin) but (in the spring)Vrabel called him out for not using them because he doesn't have confidence in the new moves. Today could be a message to Landry that he'd better use those moves and two won't cut it. 

It's early so early, but IDPers do not want the guy sharing time with Wake. Gotta watch that. You want the full timer 

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Second day Vrabel singled out Finch.

Bledsoe has a muscle pull, forget, didn't sound serious

Ryan moving well despite recovering from injury, seems fine

Talk of Casey wearing down last year, might not do much in camp this year

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Hooker three INTs in four days, forced a fumble....that train is coming right at Vaccarro

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Landry returned from the day off using moves, probably three. 

Byard playing nickel LB/ third safety/ freelancer in a teaching portion and then they used it. 

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what I wrote in Titans thread, some repeated

Finch's snaps were well ahead of Landry and he appeared to have a noticable edge. Out of nowhere, Landry is running with the ones and Finch became the backup. (Wake opposite) This smells exactly like Antwaun Woods and other times where JRob got involved and made his own sub. Landry IS starting to use more moves than just the speed rush but it's not often enough. Finch is doing so well with the second unit that it looks like this will be short-lived or we have a Pees versus JRob scenario.

The Titans depth DL players are sitting with hang nails and not being the tough sonofa that you'd expect from backup DL. I wouldn't be surprised if there is some coaching influence exerted during the first preseason game. I don't know what, but they probably won't get the lion's share of snaps after not practicing.

Urban has the edge over Austin Johnson. They're flipping he and Casey a lot. Urban is 6-7 with long arms and he may just be annoying enough against the snap N throw offenses. After this game, expect Johnson to push Urban and DaQuan to get his spot back. 

Evans and Brown have subbed in at OLB enough that it is a definite thing. Woodyard is a supersub at this point and not a starter, but if he is on the field then they know they have a good player at that spot which....pushes Evans or Brown to sub in for an OLB.

Casey, the lone DL, is still a thing. Not sure how I feel about this set. JRob gets negative points for lack of improved DL. 

The super rook playing in October sounds like a pipe dream to me. I expect November to be that he could play and then December to be that they'll shut him down til next year- so I don't expect he plays. If injuries happen, well then that would change things. After watching Conklin last year, I'm really not interested in a rookie rushing back from an ACL. If it takes a year, then let it take a year.

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Finch was the only one to consistently apply pressure and that's a little bit of a stretch. When he was near, the QB calmly threw. The DL was awful but I guess him getting penetration was something.

Evans played opposite Finch more than I noticed him at ILB and he looks faster like he's able to show his speed by not playing inside. Landry didn't play but the battle got more uphill for him,

Adoree looks the same. Still a rookie that falls for things, a stud athlete on other plays. They kept him in all half which was odd. Vrabel pointed out that he recovered well from a 75 yard toast but...I'm getting sick of his learning curve. He has all the talent in the world.

Urban was pushed around a lot and pushed back others. Very odd to look at him- not the usual bunch of plays where a DL and OL are tangled up evenly. He either did well or was awful.

Austin Johnson did play like a chip on his shoulder so kudos to him. DaQuan threw Eagles out of the way a couple times. 

Aside from these few plays, the DL was awful and the depth players were owned. The Eagles OC needs to do a better job capitalizing.

Hooker is spunky and fun to watch. He's a classic rookie safety with burns, big hits, nice tackles and always fired up. Will he mature like Byard or Cyprien? Very curious about him. He has some speed that's not in the predraft 40 stats. He got burned a few times and turned on the jets to recover just fine. I was oddly impressed with this

The Titans DBs all took turns on the Eagles TEs and it was like they had no idea of positioning. Eagles TEs caught the ball with ease

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Pats come to camp this week. Belichick and Co are always good for quotes and team practices usually offer forced matchups too.  This is a very good week to pay attention to any Titan IDPs you're interested in and definitely search twitter for videos and Pats comments

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Which linebacker is wearing the green dot and who is playing three downs is what intrigues me. It’s a situation I will probably avoid completely but still what I’m wondering.

Edited by BigAl21

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On 8/12/2019 at 12:14 AM, BigAl21 said:

Which linebacker is wearing the green dot and who is playing three downs is what intrigues me. It’s a situation I will probably avoid completely but still what I’m wondering.

Evans

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Practice paused. Belichick (clearly aware he knows every move) used Finch to show every move by DL and OL response. Practice continued.

Only good thing by D. Brady lit them up today

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I'm looking at Hooker on my WW. i'll likely pick him up because of Bri and let him sit on my taxi. Vaccarro, as a Saints fan who enjoyed him in NOLA, is yesterday's news.

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14 hours ago, Flying Elvis said:

Finch will be OLB, and hasn't yet secured a starting role, correct?

 

Thanks. Always enjoy reading your posts.

 

He and Landry are. Wake is one of the third down OLB spots replacing one of them. 

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Three safety set didn't work well against Pats. Neither Hooker nor Vaccaro did well as Brady threw their way. Hooker got some hits but he allowed the pass.

All DBs lit up really, the CBs were toast too. Some saying Brady put on a clinic and there ARE videos of him threading a needle and placing the ball perfectly even though the DB is there, but...pretty bad two days for the D.

Brown, Woodyard, Evans D was noted

Finch started at OLB and played second team DL.

The DL is a major problem now. Jones and Johnson seem to have stepped back their play and they weren't but good to start. There is a definite spot for the Titans to sign a DL and him to be a decent IDP pickup. The backup DL is just awful, anyone could be cut. I know DL don't usually do all that much in IDP leagues without sacks n all, but... the Titans gotta address this and I bet they do on cutdown day at the latest.

Urban still same as first game. Either making a play or getting beat. Rarely ever just tangled up

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Amari Bledsoe started as a down backer/DE. 

Mack stood out again.

Finch is always around the QB.

Everything else was predictable

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Landry's been sitting. At this point, I'll be surprised if he ISN'T the guy Wake replaces. It sure seems like Finch won the OLB spot

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Bledsoe and Mack seem to have made it by quotes this week. Dickerson probably makes it and is replaceable if someone pops up on the cut day WW. Although there is some debate if they keep seven DL.

Bledsoe is an interesting guy for IDPers. A high school stud, showed great athleticism and/or fluidity for a DL but he had a stint with the NCAA that carried out through courts. He went undrafted because there were so many Qs but to work his way up to starter (even with Casey out) is significant. I would think that answers the Qs of whether his athleticism can translate. He is still small for the a 3-4 DE. A scouts review showed him using great technique and awful technique. He was clearly thrown to the wolves and learning live. Most important though, he held his ground and didn't lose battles. That's the bare minimum for a 3-4 DE so if he can develop anything further, he becomes interesting. 

I wouldn't have him on an IDP roster but you guys that have these 40-50 man rosters with IDPs....put him at the end of your roster and wait N see. It's a possibility he's special. 

Simmons still looks like a November return (that I hope they push off a year but...who knows). He will instantly be in over anyone but Casey. This won't help Bledsoe. Maybe you pickup Bledsoe in December and hope for next year? I'm just selling a guy that has future potential, very little for 2019

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6 hours ago, Bri said:

Landry's been sitting. At this point, I'll be surprised if he ISN'T the guy Wake replaces. It sure seems like Finch won the OLB spot

woah.

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15 hours ago, Choke said:

woah.

Yeah that needs a bit more detail, please.

Landry starts and wake spells him? Or wake replaces Landry as the starter?

Thanks 

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55 minutes ago, Flying Elvis said:

Yeah that needs a bit more detail, please.

Landry starts and wake spells him? Or wake replaces Landry as the starter?

Thanks 

Its one of the few topics I've repeatedly posted about. Please scroll up

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Bledsoe working with the LBs this week and Pees/Vrabel both commented along the lines that they think he's athletic enough to contribute at end and OLB. 

Titans writer thinks he's being prepared to backup Casey and also Finch in nickel situations. Finch will play on the line like a DE in nickel, but if XYZ happens presnap, he has to drop. I think that's what he is talking about.

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On 8/15/2019 at 7:37 AM, Bri said:

He and Landry are. Wake is one of the third down OLB spots replacing one of them. 

Yep, I kind of thought you meant Wake would spell Landry bit didnt think that post was totally clear. 

For IDP the 3 down LB is the holy grail. So Wake replacing Landry means Landry has no chance at 3DLB. 

Your last post basically says Finch will be a 3 down LB, playing olb on regular downs then DE slot in nickel. 

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20 hours ago, Flying Elvis said:

Yep, I kind of thought you meant Wake would spell Landry bit didnt think that post was totally clear. 

For IDP the 3 down LB is the holy grail. So Wake replacing Landry means Landry has no chance at 3DLB. 

Your last post basically says Finch will be a 3 down LB, playing olb on regular downs then DE slot in nickel. 

Landry's issues come down to only using the speed rush and that NFL linemen can block that. His speed move also leaves him in a bad position to stop the run if he read the play wrong. Occasionally he will get through and he looks like a gem of a speedy defender when he does, but this ignores all the other downs.

The Titans worked with him an absolute ton last year and this year. Vrabel called him out to the press (he almost never does that) pointing out that he must get comfy with the other moves and use them. Using them in practice means little if he won't use them in a game. 

Finch is not supposed to be there and not supposed to be this good. A year ago, no one would have predicted that a DE from Temple would have one of the highest LB ratings by PFF for the second half of the year. Most predicted the Titans would have LB issues with Morgan and Rak retiring. Some probably thought Woodyard (or Wake) would retire by now. Brown had struggled to stop the run throughout college and his rookie year and suddenly last year he's got a nose for it and is a solid ILB. It's surprising or shocking for them to be in such good shape at LB. Finch rocks though and everyone that reviews him (including BB) praises the guy.

Any coach worth his salt should be able to get a player to learn new techniques. Camp pics show Landry working with just about every coach, including the OL coach. They have definitely coached him up. I would guess that now it comes down to if he's hard-headed and if he can, not just learn the new techniques but, use the new techniques well. 

I would bet that things click for Landry at some point and they have to decide again whether Finch or Landry should be the 3 down OLB.  When is that? Week four? eight? Finch is a tough smart sonofa. He is not the elite athlete Landry is. Finch has better production. Do you go with production or potential?

Also, and this is no small thing, Evans IS playing OLB some this year and Brown has been seen doing so too in camp- granted Evans has done it a ton and Brown just in spots. The Titans love Woodyard, Brown, and Evans. With only two starting ILB spots, there's a desire to get the other on the field. This may cost Landry or Finch some stats.

The Pats hybrid 4-3 3-4 D and Lebeau's 5-3 are both being used.  Lebeau's has been used since before he got there. I think Evans and Brown play OLB in this 5-3 and only then- I've got nothing to go on but my experience watching. I don't understand the 4-3 3-4 hybrid. This is new this year and something Pees and Vrabel know well and were trying to get the team used to last year. This D looks too weak to me on the weakside. If I were a QB, I'd audible and attack that and to me this shouldn't work, yet BB has done it well for a long time. Tip of hat to BB, I'm not sure Vrabel or Pees can pull it off. Regardless, the weakside LB would have to be the most sure tackler and best coverage guy they have and that'd be Evans. 

The Titans backups showed these Ds and the Eagles made one pump fake or a fake handoff and threw to the TE with ease. The Titans changed to a 3 safety look and while it was well covered, their safeties couldn't stop Goedert. In the practice videos, Brady just snaps n throws and they can't do a thing. The weakside LB can't be up enough as he's on an island. In the 5-3, the 3 are back too far too. 

Lebeau used the 5-3 to throw the kitchen sink at a D. It was good luck passing before our DL gets to the QB. It was an obvious 3rd down defense. I'm really questioning whether these two Ds are going to work during any other downs.

The three safety look the Titans used for years but didn't last year. Hooker is a classic rookie safety. He might get burned but he's gonna smack ya if he does. Otherwise, he's pretty solid and looks to be a future good player. The goal is really to let Byard be the play maker he can be. We saw it a couple years ago under Lebeau and if Byard can have Polomalu like freedom, he can get to spots where he can make a game changing play. The issue then was he's not Polomalu and gets badly burned sometimes too. Byard's a stud and I think it's worth a try again and using it in spots is probably the right move to make

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Bledsoe was cut which is garbage since he started two weeks in preseason. He may be a PS candidate but with his well-known athleticism, I'm not sure he makes it back. 

The rest was pretty predictable. The DL and the whole D really needs Casey to return as the beast he has been. The Titans are stacked in the back 7 but if the DL won't hold up, it changes the game.

Roberson was a good UDFA that did well against the 3s and 4s. The Titans traded for Gilbert (a 7th? backer) despite Roberson closing preseason with two sacks. Roberson was practicing with ST and trying to do whatever to make it. Gilbert doesn't play ST. I think this was a mistake. It doesn't matter much as it's a 7th and depth LB spot, but I think it matters with team morale.

Durden was cut and the Titans just have too much CB depth. He is a scrappy CB that is always trying to make a play. IDP folks, I'd put a postit note on my PC to check on where he goes and see if he plays midseason. Ya gotta like a DB that slaps at the ball, tries to force fumbles, tries to catch anything etc. Wherever he's picked up, he just might be decent stat wise, late in the season as a pickup. 

Landry returned to practice and COULD be ready to go. I don't like the word could there. Further, I don't like that Vrabel added Finch, Wake, and Evans comments after. I'm very confident in my earlier prediction that Finch, not Landry, is the 3 down LB

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4 hours ago, Hankmoody said:

Hooker isn't showing on Fantasy Sharks depth chart, what gives there?

There wasn't enough time between the draft and the start of the season to get this done. 

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7 hours ago, Hankmoody said:

Hooker isn't showing on Fantasy Sharks depth chart, what gives there?

He's still predicted the same. Key backup, going to be in a ton and they WILL run 3 safety sets.

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Landry has been a full participant and the in-season depth chart shows him as the one NOT sharing with Wake.

No one I know believes this. Everyone I know believes it's Finch

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On 9/3/2019 at 2:45 PM, Hankmoody said:

Hooker isn't showing on Fantasy Sharks depth chart, what gives there?

Vaccaro was 30th last year in yards allowed to his side while Byard was tops. Odell (and new add Taylor) could possibly give them a real push to starting Hooker over Vaccaro. Butler was the worst CB at allowing deep plays til like week 6 or so, then he got it together. Last year, there was an easy clear spot for defenses to attack. That can't happen again.

Hooker will play but I think he'll start if there's a bad game. I think it's that close

 

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Good to hear, he was FA in a couple leagues so I took the flier on him.  I had him nicely ranked on my draft sheet but I don't actually draft DB's so of course he went way before I would have taken him and I was surprised to see him hit final cuts.

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11 hours ago, Bri said:

Vaccaro was 30th last year in yards allowed to his side while Byard was tops. Odell (and new add Taylor) could possibly give them a real push to starting Hooker over Vaccaro. Butler was the worst CB at allowing deep plays til like week 6 or so, then he got it together. Last year, there was an easy clear spot for defenses to attack. That can't happen again.

Hooker will play but I think he'll start if there's a bad game. I think it's that close

 

Kenny's under contract for another 4 years though. His best chance for release won't happen until after *next* year, if Spotrac is to be belived.. Hooker could step in early, I guess, but seems unlikely unless Kenny is a dumpster fire.

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9 hours ago, RushHour said:

Anyone know what happened to Jayon Brown yesterday? Invisible on the stat sheet.

I think it was more the Browns offense not doing much, he graded well.

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The Titans were able to get awesome pressure from the OLBs so they sat Evans and Brown down in zone. I don't like it because it's reactionary, but they flew all over the field. They were regularly near the WR by the time the ball got there. The Browns lost two tackles (ejection and demotion) so they were going to have to be creative and do things quickly. It was probably the right call by Pees but...yeah they didn't do much stat wise

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On 9/8/2019 at 11:35 AM, Hankmoody said:

Good to hear, he was FA in a couple leagues so I took the flier on him.  I had him nicely ranked on my draft sheet but I don't actually draft DB's so of course he went way before I would have taken him and I was surprised to see him hit final cuts.

They played 3 safety set 40 percent of the time. Woodyard (who they love and is a captain) barely played.

I think they showed their confidence in him. They looked like one of the best Ds in the NFL week one. No need to overreact or anything, but they handled a talented Browns team very well

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Isaiah Mack got a lot of action while Austin Johnson had like 10 snaps. If he and Casey can be unmovable objects, that'll change a lot for this D. They're loaded with the back 8/7 but the DL has been a big weakness. The Browns tried to double Mack and Casey hoping to move someone but whomever they focused on, it rarely worked. The Colts have a much better line that's way better coached. We'll see next week but Mack showed awesome toughness and fight for a first NFL game. 

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On 9/8/2019 at 11:24 PM, saintfool said:

Kenny's under contract for another 4 years though. His best chance for release won't happen until after *next* year, if Spotrac is to be belived.. Hooker could step in early, I guess, but seems unlikely unless Kenny is a dumpster fire.

If they cut him after this year they'll still save $1.75M.  I hate Spotrac's "potential out" BS because that's frequently misleading like this.

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18 hours ago, BigAl21 said:

How did Evans look for those that watched? I saw 4-1 after the first drive and then only 1 tackle the remainder of the game.

He looked green the first drive, reacting and reacting late, to everything. Then he settled in real well. 

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One scout clipping plays and calling out PFF ratings. He diagrams tons of perfect execution and yet most Titans defender got bad (50-60) scores

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Landry posted a nice stat line Sunday; 4 T, 2 A, 1.0 SK, 1 FR. Anyone have insight as to where he's at now in the pecking order and if not if the same can be expected?

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On 9/17/2019 at 10:47 AM, Hoodoo said:

Landry posted a nice stat line Sunday; 4 T, 2 A, 1.0 SK, 1 FR. Anyone have insight as to where he's at now in the pecking order and if not if the same can be expected?

Sorry late reply

He and Finch are playing a ton and people keep expecting Wake to play more and it's getting maddening that he isn't playing more after a two sack week one.

Landry was gifted that sack as the QB had the ball slip.

He has added a quick rip to his speed move and the scouts I read point out that that is not what he was supposed to do. He should have six moves by now. 

The Titans have faced weak tackles thus far and it's about to change for them. 

Last night, after Minishew ran well, we saw Finch get past his man and stand there looking like a basketball player in his defensive stance. Sometimes Mack (NT) just stayed pat and didn't rush but was there in case Minishew decided to run. Correa shared with Landry at this point which gave me the impression that they don't believe he's disciplined enough

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