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Alabama 2020 Senate Race - the undercard is the main attraction (1 Viewer)

S

Sinn Fein

Footballguy
I agree with @Sand - that the Alabama race should not be buried in the Roy Moore thread.

The GOP primary is shaping up to be the main attraction here - with Trump-favorite Roy Moore, running against Trump-whipping boy, Jeff Sessions.*

I have to assume that mainstream GOP would prefer Sessions, while Trump and his base could prefer Moore.

The winner of that battle would go on and face surprise incumbent (D) Doug Jones

*Predicitit has Sessions as an overwhelming favorite to win the race, with Moore a distant, and fading, 5th.  Tommy Tuberville (yes, that Tommy Tuberville) is currently 2nd in the race.

 
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Sessions should win handily I would imagine.  At which point his colleagues who support Trump through all this will have to somehow explain that to him.  That will be interesting. 

 
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Roy Moore is done.  He could make the runoff potentially with the vote being split between so many people.  He's always going to have that core group of supporters.  I don't see that being enough to win a runoff like last time where he had the luxury of running against a lobbyist who was appointed by an unpopular governor to the seat.  The real question to me is can Sessions overcome the rest of the field, especially if Trump were to decide to lean into him.  There's a lot of guys who have had success running for office in the race.

 
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Of the candidates I'd probably prefer Byrne, but I agree Sessions is likely to get back in.  Not a huge surprise, nor a huge blow for Alabama.  The one nice thing about Sessions going back in is that we get back a very senior Senator - the way seniority works AL gets a lot more sway than otherwise.

Sinn Fein said:
I have to assume that mainstream GOP would prefer Sessions, while Trump and his base could prefer Moore.
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:no:  

Tommy, for sure.

 
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Sand said:
Of the candidates I'd probably prefer Byrne, but I agree Sessions is likely to get back in.  Not a huge surprise, nor a huge blow for Alabama.  The one nice thing about Sessions going back in is that we get back a very senior Senator - the way seniority works AL gets a lot more sway than otherwise.

:no:  

Tommy, for sure.
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How many Bama fans are going to vote for Tuberville?

 
Sinn Fein said:
How many Bama fans are going to vote for Tuberville?
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Don't know - I'm a Clemson guy, so everyone hates me here and I'm not included on football talk :P .  Interestingly the three top guys, Sessions, Byrne, and Tuberville are all south Alabama guys and could cannabilize themselves.  If Nick ran right now he'd get the whole norther half of the state. 

BTW, there's a reason Roy is way back in the pack.  The stench lingers on him. I think, finally, people are catching on to him.

 
Sessions’ commercial has got to be the most lickspittle thing I have ever watched. He is basically begging Trump not to diss him. He is promising to be Trump’s slave “nobody will be more for President Trump than me!” 

Seriously so pathetic. All of his Confederate ancestors are turning over in their graves over this servility to a damned Yankee. 

 
As a reminder for any Crimson Tide fans who are looking forward to tomorrow’s game which the President will be attending: Trump said that Sessions had to be stupid because he attended the University of Alabama law school. 

 
Trump just now: I haven’t decided whether to endorse Sessions or not. 

Jeff is cringing under his Confederate flag somewhere...

 
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Oh, Alpha Don is so going to make Keebler boy grovel for his endorsement. It'll be like running over a rabbit's nest with your lawnmower, you're horrified but won't be able to look away.

 
Reportedly Jeff Sessions spent his time in elementary school letting everyone know that he was named, not for Thomas Jefferson but for Jefferson Davis. 

Can you imagine what an annoying kid this must have been? No wonder Stephen Miller was a protege. 

 
timschochet said:
Jeff is cringing under his Confederate flag somewhere...
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You mean the guy who bankrupted the KKK here?  

timschochet said:
Reportedly Jeff Sessions spent his time in elementary school letting everyone know that he was named, not for Thomas Jefferson but for Jefferson Davis. 
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Seriously, grade school?  We going to complain about his coloring outside the lines, too?

The guy deserves some criticisms, but this ad hominem stuff is a bit low brow.

 
Sand said:
You mean the guy who bankrupted the KKK here?  

Seriously, grade school?  We going to complain about his coloring outside the lines, too?

The guy deserves some criticisms, but this ad hominem stuff is a bit low brow.
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Oh I wouldn’t want to be low brow in my criticism of Jefferson Beauregard Sessions IV.  

 
Sand said:
You mean the guy who bankrupted the KKK here?  

Seriously, grade school?  We going to complain about his coloring outside the lines, too?

The guy deserves some criticisms, but this ad hominem stuff is a bit low brow.
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He has also said the he thought the KKK was OK until he found out that they smoked pot. He has called this a joke, but even if that is his idea of a joke it is still telling. 

 
Drunken Cowboy said:
He has also said the he thought the KKK was OK until he found out that they smoked pot. He has called this a joke, but even if that is his idea of a joke it is still telling. 
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With the natural bias that many in this forum have they will always read into a a conservative's humor what they want to.  His actions speak otherwise and belie some odd interpretation of a sarcastic joke.

If we want to start labeling people racists, let's start with actions.  We can start with Justin Trudeau, Ralph Northam, Joy Behar, etc.

 
Sand said:
If we want to start labeling people racists, let's start with actions.  We can start with Justin Trudeau, Ralph Northam, Joy Behar, etc.
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While these may be instances of racism, it hardly seems prudent to start here

 
Sand said:
You mean the guy who bankrupted the KKK here?  

Seriously, grade school?  We going to complain about his coloring outside the lines, too?

The guy deserves some criticisms, but this ad hominem stuff is a bit low brow.
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I actually know some of his family. They live close to us.  Very nice people. One of his granddaughters was in one of my daughters classes a few years ago but we didn’t even know they were related until after the fact. 

 
Shula-holic said:
I actually know some of his family. They live close to us.  Very nice people. One of his granddaughters was in one of my daughters classes a few years ago but we didn’t even know they were related until after the fact. 
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I’m sure his family is wonderful. Also, for all I know Sessions is a decent, good guy on a personal basis- I’ve certainly never heard anything to the contrary (like we all have with Trump for example.) 

But like Jesse Helms whom he is the ideological heir, Sessions views on racial issues are borderline extreme. He has invited mockery for this over the years so I see nothing wrong about applying it to him. 

 
Henry Ford said:
Sessions should win handily I would imagine.  At which point his colleagues who support Trump through all this will have to somehow explain that to him.  That will be interesting. 
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Sessions reelection ad:  "I was the first to support Donald Trump while the rest of my colleagues hid under their desks".  Puts on MAGA hat.  "I approve this message."

Yeah - runaway winner.

 
Sand said:
With the natural bias that many in this forum have they will always read into a a conservative's humor what they want to.  His actions speak otherwise and belie some odd interpretation of a sarcastic joke.

If we want to start labeling people racists, let's start with actions.  We can start with Justin Trudeau, Ralph Northam, Joy Behar, etc.
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... and end with Stephen Miller.  Care to own or disown?

 
Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump

Tommy Tuberville (@TTuberville) is running for the U.S. Senate from the Great State of Alabama. Tommy was a terrific head football coach at Auburn University. He is a REAL LEADER who will never let MAGA/KAG, or our Country, down! Tommy will protect your Second Amendment....

 
Sinn Fein said:
Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump

Tommy Tuberville (@TTuberville) is running for the U.S. Senate from the Great State of Alabama. Tommy was a terrific head football coach at Auburn University. He is a REAL LEADER who will never let MAGA/KAG, or our Country, down! Tommy will protect your Second Amendment....
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As much as I’d love to believe that Doug Jones can pants the AL GOP yet again, this tweet probably means Tommy Tuberville will be the next senator from Alabama

 
It's over.  Sessions is trying to get Tuberville in for a debate and Tuberville won't do it now.  Polling has him up double digits, he has no reason to do it.  He can run television ads and keep his mouth shut from here on in and he is the new Senator.  Doug Jones was already in bad shape, but the impeachment vote ended any doubt.

 
Sinn Fein said:
Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump

Tommy Tuberville (@TTuberville) is running for the U.S. Senate from the Great State of Alabama. Tommy was a terrific head football coach at Auburn University. He is a REAL LEADER who will never let MAGA/KAG, or our Country, down! Tommy will protect your Second Amendment....
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Sessions helped put Trump in the WH. Now he’s not a Senator or AG. ETTD.

 
Shula-holic said:
It's over.  Sessions is trying to get Tuberville in for a debate and Tuberville won't do it now.  Polling has him up double digits, he has no reason to do it.  He can run television ads and keep his mouth shut from here on in and he is the new Senator.  Doug Jones was already in bad shape, but the impeachment vote ended any doubt.
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He was toast before the impeachment vote. That's why I'm proud of him for doing the right thing.

 
timschochet said:
Poor Jeff’, that’s what you get when you sell your soul. 
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Why would you say that?  He drew Trump's ire for recusing himself from the Russia investigation.  From my recollection that was what everyone on the left thought was the right thing to do at the time.   He's said since then that he felt he did the right thing, just as Jones said he did on impeachment.  They've both said they had to do what felt right regardless of the consequences.  Neither of them is going to be the in the Senate after this term. 

Sessions is likely the one truly paying with his career, Jones was in simply due to the joke that was Roy Moore.  I voted for Doug Jones in that election and I agree he's a good guy.  He also had no real path toward ever winning statewide in Alabama without Roy Moore simply because he's a Democrat.  It's not unlike many states that are pretty much run by one party.  Unless you have an accused pedophile running, or something pretty horrid like that, one side wins.  We have cases all over showing that, see Bob Menendez.

 
Shula-holic said:
Why would you say that?  He drew Trump's ire for recusing himself from the Russia investigation.  From my recollection that was what everyone on the left thought was the right thing to do at the time.   He's said since then that he felt he did the right thing, just as Jones said he did on impeachment.  They've both said they had to do what felt right regardless of the consequences.  Neither of them is going to be the in the Senate after this term. 

Sessions is likely the one truly paying with his career, Jones was in simply due to the joke that was Roy Moore.  I voted for Doug Jones in that election and I agree he's a good guy.  He also had no real path toward ever winning statewide in Alabama without Roy Moore simply because he's a Democrat.  It's not unlike many states that are pretty much run by one party.  Unless you have an accused pedophile running, or something pretty horrid like that, one side wins.  We have cases all over showing that, see Bob Menendez.
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Sessions sold his soul before that decision when he became the first major politician to endorse Trump for President. 

 
timschochet said:
Sessions sold his soul before that decision when he became the first major politician to endorse Trump for President. 
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I'm not carrying water for Sessions.  I was never a huge fan.  I gave up my shot to vote for him or Tuberville in the primary simply to vote against a socialist for President.  In the end there won't be any difference in how Sessions or Tuberville votes.  So I guess I don't really understand all the glee from anti-Trump folks over Sessions losing when he showed some independence and the lesson learned will be for that not to be the case going forward.  It's fine with me if Tommy is the Senator, I really liked him as our football coach.  But he's not going to vote any differently from what Jeff Sessions would have.

 
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Shula-holic said:
I'm not carrying water for Sessions.  I was never a huge fan.  I gave up my shot to vote for him or Tuberville in the primary simply to vote against a socialist for President.  In the end there won't be any difference in how Sessions or Tuberville votes.  So I guess I don't really understand all the glee from anti-Trump folks over Sessions losing when he showed some independence and the lesson learned will be for that not to be the case going forward.  It's fine with me if Tommy is the Senator, I really liked him as our football coach.  But he's not going to vote any differently from what Jeff Sessions would have.
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Honestly I know nothing about Tuberville except as a football coach. Seemed fine and conservative. Ran the ball, good defense right? Nothing flashy on offense. Was he let go because he couldn’t beat Alabama? 

 
timschochet said:
Sessions sold his soul before that decision when he became the first major politician to endorse Trump for President. 
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I don't know if I'd describe that as selling his soul. He (accurately) recognized Trump as the vehicle for his policy preferences, particularly on immigration. 

It was when he came crawling back to Trump a few months ago that he sold it.

 
timschochet said:
Honestly I know nothing about Tuberville except as a football coach. Seemed fine and conservative. Ran the ball, good defense right? Nothing flashy on offense. Was he let go because he couldn’t beat Alabama? 
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He beat Alabama 6 straight times from 2002-2007.  He was let go after 2008 because Nick Saban became the coach at Alabama in 2007 and it was evident by 2008 that a wide chasm was opening.  To compete, the recruiting had to be at another level.  Tuberville was a good guy and a good football coach, he was never the hardcore recruiting type.

 
Shula-holic said:
He beat Alabama 6 straight times from 2002-2007.  He was let go after 2008 because Nick Saban became the coach at Alabama in 2007 and it was evident by 2008 that a wide chasm was opening.  To compete, the recruiting had to be at another level.  Tuberville was a good guy and a good football coach, he was never the hardcore recruiting type.
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Really? I didn’t realize he beat them that many times. Seems a little unfair then; they should at least have given him a longer shot to compete with Saban. 

 
Shula-holic said:
Why would you say that?  He drew Trump's ire for recusing himself from the Russia investigation.  From my recollection that was what everyone on the left thought was the right thing to do at the time.   He's said since then that he felt he did the right thing, just as Jones said he did on impeachment.  They've both said they had to do what felt right regardless of the consequences.  Neither of them is going to be the in the Senate after this term. 

Sessions is likely the one truly paying with his career, Jones was in simply due to the joke that was Roy Moore.  I voted for Doug Jones in that election and I agree he's a good guy.  He also had no real path toward ever winning statewide in Alabama without Roy Moore simply because he's a Democrat.  It's not unlike many states that are pretty much run by one party.  Unless you have an accused pedophile running, or something pretty horrid like that, one side wins.  We have cases all over showing that, see Bob Menendez.
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:goodposting:

Jones was always renting that seat for a couple years no matter what he did.

I am proud of Sessions for doing the right thing by recusing himself, and you're right that we liberals should recognize that fact. I'm not saying that we need to be erecting statues to him in downtown Burlington, but I think it's pretty clear that the last few months would have played out differently if he were still in charge of DOJ.

That said -- and this is by no means Sessions' fault -- it's a sad commentary on where we are as a nation that we have to praise people for simply following the recommendation of in-house ethics advisers and following departmental policy.

 
timschochet said:
Really? I didn’t realize he beat them that many times. Seems a little unfair then; they should at least have given him a longer shot to compete with Saban. 
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Saban coming to the SEC was a shock to the system.  It was a completely different game at that point.  It took a sea change to try and compete at all.  Even what Urban Meyer had done at Florida up until that point couldn't withstand it.  When recruiting day rolled around and Alabama had 25 guys who were all 5-star and 4-star guys, you simply couldn't expect to compete with a few 4-stars and a bunch of 3-star and 2-stars.  Nick Saban is an excellent developer of talent, but he also has always worked more than anyone to get the elite talent to begin with.  From a game management perspective I see a lot of flaws in Saban's style, but when you have the talent he does and develop it the way that he does, it's very rare that game management ever comes into play.  The burn out rate of coaches is extremely fast now too.  Not many people can do it like Saban does for the length of time he has.  Tuberville was at Auburn for 10 years I think it was, it was simply time.  As bad as Gene Chizik finished, 2010 and that National Championship never happens for Auburn without that change being made.

 
timschochet said:
Too bad if true. Extremely impressive guy. And how could any reasonable person NOT vote to impeach? 
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He was a dead man walking as soon as he was elected.  No way he served more than until the next election.

Decent guy.  Wrong state.

 
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