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Farmer relief (1 Viewer)

Snorkelson

Snorkelson

Footballguy
I was talking with my brother, he has been farming the last few years as his father in law is getting older and “retiring” as much as an old farmer might retire. While he and his wife could simply lease the land to one of their neighbors, they decided to do the work in addition to their regular jobs. The last 2 years they haven’t even broke even despite having good crops. I asked him if the government has helped out- after all, there’s been billions appropriated. He said that he hasn’t seen a dime, that the money is basically a subsidy for crop insurance, which saves some money on insurance but it doesn’t pay for a bad market, and there’s no point in planting and buying insurance to do all the work for no money, and they won’t be planting this year. I’m looking for some info to link, hoping maybe someone here has some information/experience. 
 

He also made a good point about traders influencing the price of a commodity they don’t have in hand which isn’t fair to the farmer, but that’s a whole lot more to get into and I’m not prepared at all for that discussion, but any thoughts on this idea would be of interest to me. 

 
Am I looking at the wrong bills?

None of this helps someone who simply can’t make money farming. This doesn’t help if you simply bought seed and sold grain at the same price and didn’t suffer from a natural disaster or declare bankruptcy. 

 
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More

Article claims farmers were overpaid. I wonder what they claimed in order to receive these payments. Perhaps it varied state to state? Seems like that’s how the money was distributed- block grants to the state? 

 
Relief application

Well here is the likely issue for my brother and his wife- “has to be 75% of your income.” Since they both had full time jobs at the time they probably didn’t qualify. 

 
IvanKaramazov said:
So why not sell and focus on their full-time jobs?
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Work hard and have more money, retire early, the American dream? They could do both if they could sell the crops at a profit.

His wife has a sister that is also involved, and his father in law still works a lot, so it’s a more nuanced situation really. Besides, they shouldn’t be forced to sell their farm because of a stupid trade policy. 

 
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I haven't heard from any farmers in my area that they receive much money for relief.  I also don't ask them either so I just hear from those who bring it up.  Doesn't sound like it benefited many.

I have noticed a good increase in farmers cutting back from the amount of farming they do or just retiring in general.  It's becoming too much work for little or no money.  It's a very stressful job and it's not worth it financially.  Bankruptcies are at a high in the Midwest as well.

 
Snorkelson said:
I was talking with my brother, he has been farming the last few years as his father in law is getting older and “retiring” as much as an old farmer might retire. While he and his wife could simply lease the land to one of their neighbors, they decided to do the work in addition to their regular jobs. The last 2 years they haven’t even broke even despite having good crops. I asked him if the government has helped out- after all, there’s been billions appropriated. He said that he hasn’t seen a dime, that the money is basically a subsidy for crop insurance, which saves some money on insurance but it doesn’t pay for a bad market, and there’s no point in planting and buying insurance to do all the work for no money, and they won’t be planting this year. I’m looking for some info to link, hoping maybe someone here has some information/experience. 
 

He also made a good point about traders influencing the price of a commodity they don’t have in hand which isn’t fair to the farmer, but that’s a whole lot more to get into and I’m not prepared at all for that discussion, but any thoughts on this idea would be of interest to me. 
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In NE WI here, my brother has a small farm 40 acres.  He/we truck farm 5 acres of it and he rents out the rest.  He has 2 farmers that basically fight over who gets to rent it.  Seems there must be something in it for these guys to be fighting over such a small tract of land (the one guy farms over 500 acres, the other I'm not sure what he has).

 
yak651 said:
In NE WI here, my brother has a small farm 40 acres.  He/we truck farm 5 acres of it and he rents out the rest.  He has 2 farmers that basically fight over who gets to rent it.  Seems there must be something in it for these guys to be fighting over such a small tract of land (the one guy farms over 500 acres, the other I'm not sure what he has).
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There seem to be plenty of people willing to rent farmland regardless of how much farmers struggle.  I don't know of any farm land that gets unused regardless if the owner is farming it or not.  My father-in-law just retired from farming a couple years ago and started working for another larger farm.  He rents out his land now.

I wish land was cheaper to buy.  I've always wanted to own a lot of land but it's always been outrageously priced around me.  Can't even buy undeveloped land with crappy timber and rock on it for less than $4,000 an acre unless it's over 100 acres large.  I've seen land in northern WI go for as cheap as $500 an acre though.  Not sure why.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
I haven't heard from any farmers in my area that they receive much money for relief.  I also don't ask them either so I just hear from those who bring it up.  Doesn't sound like it benefited many.

I have noticed a good increase in farmers cutting back from the amount of farming they do or just retiring in general.  It's becoming too much work for little or no money.  It's a very stressful job and it's not worth it financially.  Bankruptcies are at a high in the Midwest as well.
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i certainly wouldn't be surprised if that money wasn't getting to the people that actually need it.

 
joffer said:
i certainly wouldn't be surprised if that money wasn't getting to the people that actually need it.
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Of course it's not.  It's only getting to the largest farms in America.  The small, family farms are still struggling.  Prices of grain and livestock need to go up, that's what will help them.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
Of course it's not.  It's only getting to the largest farms in America.  The small, family farms are still struggling.  Prices of grain and livestock need to go up, that's what will help them.
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Big question is whether they will vote with or against their financial interest in November

 
msommer said:
Big question is whether they will vote with or against their financial interest in November
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The ones I know still love Trump.  I think most farmers will still vote for him.  I think they care more about party than anything else.

 
I farm as I have stated in the past. If you have your farm signed up in the farm program and grow corn, soybeans and wheat ( other commodities as well) here in Minnesota you will get money what is called a market facilitation payment. The money is quite helpful and my son who only has a small farm also got paid. So not sure why your brother didn’t collect a payment. There are a few commodities that don’t pay or a very small percentage farmers opt not to sign up for the farm program. While it is well known I am no fan of Trump, I know hundreds of farmers and don’t know any who said they did not receive their payment. My nephew is farming just 40 acres of our operation and if there are future payments I am absolutely sure he will get his as well.

 
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lazyike said:
I farm as I have stated in the past. If you have your farm signed up in the farm program and grow corn, soybeans and wheat ( other commodities as well) here in Minnesota you will get money what is called a market facilitation payment. The money is quite helpful and my son who only has a small farm also got paid. So not sure why your brother didn’t collect a payment. There are a few commodities that don’t pay or a very small percentage farmers opt not to sign up for the farm program. While it is well known I am no fan of Trump, I know hundreds of farmers and don’t know any who said they did not receive their payment. My nephew is farming just 40 acres of our operation and if there are future payments I am absolutely sure he will get his as well.
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Farmers are also signing up for the next 5 year farm program and have to opt for ARC-CO ARC-IC or PLC for 2019 and 2020. in a nutshell the options involve choosing relief if you have crop disaster or relief if prices go lower. Depending on what happens many farmers will end up choosing the wrong option. Under PLC if prices stay where they are at and you have a crop disaster you will collect nothing. Under ARC if you have a good crop but prices plummet you will also receive nothing.  It is sad we need this but despite these payments, farm bankruptcies are up 20% in Minnesota this past year.

 
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lazyike said:
I farm as I have stated in the past. If you have your farm signed up in the farm program and grow corn, soybeans and wheat ( other commodities as well) here in Minnesota you will get money what is called a market facilitation payment. The money is quite helpful and my son who only has a small farm also got paid. So not sure why your brother didn’t collect a payment. There are a few commodities that don’t pay or a very small percentage farmers opt not to sign up for the farm program. While it is well known I am no fan of Trump, I know hundreds of farmers and don’t know any who said they did not receive their payment. My nephew is farming just 40 acres of our operation and if there are future payments I am absolutely sure he will get his as well.
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As I stated my brother and his wife also have full time jobs, so I don’t think they met the 75% of income threshold. 
 

Hawkeye21 said:
There seem to be plenty of people willing to rent farmland regardless of how much farmers struggle.  I don't know of any farm land that gets unused regardless if the owner is farming it or not.  My father-in-law just retired from farming a couple years ago and started working for another larger farm.  He rents out his land now.
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I’m not sure if they’ve explored leasing the land out at this point. I could be mistaken, but that particular program ended in 2019, so if you’re planting in 2020, there isn’t anything in place to guarantee you will be covered if prices are low. @lazyike is your farm program a state program? 

 
Hawkeye21 said:
The ones I know still love Trump.  I think most farmers will still vote for him.  I think they care more about party than anything else.
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I won’t disagree with this statement, but I asked my brother about this too. “Are your neighbors still going to vote for trump this fall?” The answer wasn’t a hard yes. Having grown up in one of the most conservative counties in MI, that answer surprised me. 

 
Snorkelson said:
As I stated my brother and his wife also have full time jobs, so I don’t think they met the 75% of income threshold. 
 

I’m not sure if they’ve explored leasing the land out at this point. I could be mistaken, but that particular program ended in 2019, so if you’re planting in 2020, there isn’t anything in place to guarantee you will be covered if prices are low. @lazyike is your farm program a state program? 
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Both my son and nephew would not meet a 75% of income threshold...I have filled out forms every year regarding income matters. The only question they ask currently is if you make over $900,000 net income. A lot of farmers working off the farm where the off farm jobs are their primary source of income. I don’t need to make a big deal of it but I am very curious why your brother would not have received a payment. If small farmers weren’t getting paid farmers would not be supporting Trump and there would be massive protests.

 
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lazyike said:
Both my son and nephew would not meet a 75% of income threshold...I have filled out forms every year regarding income matters. The only question they ask currently is if you make over $900,000 net income. A lot of farmers working off the farm where the off farm jobs are their primary source of income. I don’t need to make a big deal of it but I am very curious why your brother would not have received a payment. If small farmers weren’t getting paid farmers would not be supporting Trump and there would be massive protests.
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Well I’m curious as well, but they are college educated people so I’m sure they did their homework. I’ll see if I can get some info and maybe pm you. 

 
Hawkeye21 said:
There seem to be plenty of people willing to rent farmland regardless of how much farmers struggle.  I don't know of any farm land that gets unused regardless if the owner is farming it or not.  My father-in-law just retired from farming a couple years ago and started working for another larger farm.  He rents out his land now.

I wish land was cheaper to buy.  I've always wanted to own a lot of land but it's always been outrageously priced around me.  Can't even buy undeveloped land with crappy timber and rock on it for less than $4,000 an acre unless it's over 100 acres large.  I've seen land in northern WI go for as cheap as $500 an acre though.  Not sure why.
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Yes land here is crazy expensive also, anything near a community is around $10k/acre.  I thought it was bad 15 years ago when we paid $5k/acre for our small hobby farm.  Just like the stock market, wish I could go back in time and buy a bunch of land...  The land in northern WI is probably so cheap because it can't be used for anything but hunting.

 
yak651 said:
Yes land here is crazy expensive also, anything near a community is around $10k/acre.  I thought it was bad 15 years ago when we paid $5k/acre for our small hobby farm.  Just like the stock market, wish I could go back in time and buy a bunch of land...  The land in northern WI is probably so cheap because it can't be used for anything but hunting.
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Yeah, most likely hunting/recreation and that's about it.  Maybe build a home or something.  That's all I'd want it for.  I'd love to buy the farmland next to me and put it back into prairie grass.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
Yeah, most likely hunting/recreation and that's about it.  Maybe build a home or something.  That's all I'd want it for.  I'd love to buy the farmland next to me and put it back into prairie grass.
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There are some small spots up there to farm (I've passed a few fields in the Rhinelander area), but not much with all the wetlands, and sandy silty soils.  But it sure it beautiful.

 
Snorkelson said:
As I stated my brother and his wife also have full time jobs, so I don’t think they met the 75% of income threshold. 
 

I’m not sure if they’ve explored leasing the land out at this point. I could be mistaken, but that particular program ended in 2019, so if you’re planting in 2020, there isn’t anything in place to guarantee you will be covered if prices are low. @lazyike is your farm program a state program? 
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No the PLC option under the USDA program will cover you in 2020 if the national average corn prices drops below 3.70 bushel. They expect the national average for 2019 to be about 3.85 so no payment likely coming this year. Latest USDA prediction because of a large increase in corn acres for 2020 to about 95 million this year has USDA predicting a national average corn price of 3.40 a bushel which could mean a .30 a bushel payment which would come in Sept of 2021. Many farmers here signing up for the PLC option on corn. Have to be signed up by March 16th.

 
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beef said:
There are some small spots up there to farm (I've passed a few fields in the Rhinelander area), but not much with all the wetlands, and sandy silty soils.  But it sure it beautiful.
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I love northern WI.  I'm heading to Rhinelander at the end of May to go fishing.  Stayed on Big St. Germain a couple years ago.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
I love northern WI.  I'm heading to Rhinelander at the end of May to go fishing.  Stayed on Big St. Germain a couple years ago.
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:thumbup:    Good time.  Musky opener!  Caught a decent mid 40's Musky on Big Saint last year - Eastern/NE shore weedline, between 10-15' of water straight out from the really long resort piers and beach area.  First time I fished that lake.  Going back the week after 4th of July.

 
beef said:
:thumbup:    Good time.  Musky opener!  Caught a decent mid 40's Musky on Big Saint last year - Eastern/NE shore weedline, between 10-15' of water straight out from the really long resort piers and beach area.  First time I fished that lake.  Going back the week after 4th of July.
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We'll be focusing on bass.  We're not use to the deep, clear water up there so we're trying to get use to it.  We really struggled two years ago and that's why we're heading up there again.  I want to catch some nice smallmouth.

 
beef said:
:thumbup:    Good time.  Musky opener!  Caught a decent mid 40's Musky on Big Saint last year - Eastern/NE shore weedline, between 10-15' of water straight out from the really long resort piers and beach area.  First time I fished that lake.  Going back the week after 4th of July.
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Hawkeye21 said:
We'll be focusing on bass.  We're not use to the deep, clear water up there so we're trying to get use to it.  We really struggled two years ago and that's why we're heading up there again.  I want to catch some nice smallmouth.
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Love fishing in Wisconsin. I go up every year in August to the Wausau area and fish the Wisconsin River with my uncle.

We basically float all day and anchor in deep pools and jig nightcrawlers. We'll catch 15" - 21" smallies all day that way. We also will catch a sucker or two and throw them under a bobber for muskie.

Good times.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
We'll be focusing on bass.  We're not use to the deep, clear water up there so we're trying to get use to it.  We really struggled two years ago and that's why we're heading up there again.  I want to catch some nice smallmouth.
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Best smallie fishing I've ever found is on the Flambeau River starting just south of the flowage dam (north of Park Falls).  River has a lot of shallow spots, boat damaging rocks and has some rapids, but packed with smallies.  Caught a few 5+ pounders and have a 22" on the wall.  Hit most of them on smaller musky topwater lures while going for musky.  BIL caught a 62" sturgeon there, seen some decent walleye pulled out too.  It's my favorite spot, the river and flowage, to fish in the state!    

Sorry for the hijacks, Snorkleson.  We should get a FFA Fresh water fishing thread going (if there isn't one).  

 
msommer said:
Who knew Farmer relief = recreational fishing
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Most people who farm or are in the farming industry are also outdoorsmen.  I guess it's more enjoyable to talk fishing than how depressing the ag economy is right now. 🤷‍♂️

Farmers seem to have full trust in Trump so I guess we just have to wait and see how things turn out.

 
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