2009 Sleepers & breakout players (1 Viewer)

[travdogg]

Some deep sleepers I like for depth purposes are:

Brent Celek-Potential is off the charts in that offense, he could easily go for 600-5 and he's being drafted as low as TE20 in some drafts.

Johnnie Lee Higgins-He's an explosive player and very quietly during the last 7 weeks he had as many TD's as ANY WR in the NFL. If DHB is slow to develop, it's not out of the question that Higgins could be the top deep threat as well as possession WR. Really I don't see much of a difference between Higgins and a guy like Devin Hester, especially when you can get Higgins at the end of your draft as a WR5. I could see him being a solid WR3, maybe higher in leagues that count return yardage.

Justin Gage-Was a top-15 WR last year on a per start basis. He's being drafted as a WR4 in most leagues. If he can stay healthy and the Titans do have to open up their offense more this year, he could be a real steal.

Kerry Collins-Much like Gage, if the Titans pass more, then Collins could be a top-15 QB. He's still got a very good arm and seems less mistake prone than he once was, although that may have been a function of the Titans offense last year. If Chris Johnson improves as a pass catcher out of the backfield then Collins could be a very good QB2 and he's going undrafted in some leagues.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Some deep sleepers I like for depth purposes are:Brent Celek-Potential is off the charts in that offense, he could easily go for 600-5 and he's being drafted as low as TE20 in some drafts.

I like Celek, but is he really getting drafted that low?I'd be pretty surprised if he went off the board as TE20 --- well, he wouldn't in my draft, 'cuz I'd take him before thenI was under the impression he was more exposed, but maybe not.

Johnnie Lee Higgins-He's an explosive player and very quietly during the last 7 weeks he had as many TD's as ANY WR in the NFL. If DHB is slow to develop, it's not out of the question that Higgins could be the top deep threat as well as possession WR. Really I don't see much of a difference between Higgins and a guy like Devin Hester,

The difference is Cutler >>>>>>> Russell

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Ok, here are the Maroney/Faulk stats that some guy was so excited to have posted, and it should be apparent why Yudkin has been so reluctant to post them, rather posting a hamfisted 2 year average during which Maroney missed about 18 games, Morris 13, and Faulk 1.

It's not really a surprise that Faulk should do well on a 2 year snap count --- like I said before, if that's the case you're building, that Maroney will miss most of the season, that's fine and I can't refute it w/o a crystal ball, just make it clear that that is the case you're making.

To set the stage for those who don't follow the Pats, we roll into 2007 minus Dillon, but adding Morris, with Maroney coming off some kind of off season surgery for a shoulder subluxation, I believe.

That makes the depth chart: Maroney, Morris, Faulk, Eckel, Evans (counting FBs).

I'm gettin' stats from:

http://www.profootballfocus.com/by_team.ph...ts=&gameid=

wk1 @NYJ total snaps - 65

maroney 31 snaps (20 carries)

morris 19

faulk 10

wk2 SD 71 snaps

maroney 23 snaps (15 carries)

morris 18

faulk 3

wk3 BUF 70 snaps

maroney 29 snaps (19 carries)

morris 16

faulk 4

Unfortunately, here is where we lose Maroney for a few weeks, but I'll also post the next couple games.

wk4 @CIN 71 snaps

morris 33 snaps (21 carries)

faulk 3 snaps

wk5 CLE 74 snaps

morris 31 snaps (21 carries)

faulk 3 snaps

The following week is where we lose Morris for the year.



Week 1-5 summary:

Faulk has played 6.5% of 351 snaps.

That is a VERY far cry from Yudkin's 40%.

Maroney has averaged 18 carries in the 3 games he played.

Week 7-14 summary:

Maroney struggles back from injury, sustains some mysterious foot injury, is rumored to be in the doghouse, and loses a couple games due to opponent specific scheme.

Basically, a mish mosh of excuses where he logs highs of 13, 14, and 15 carries, but also lows of 6, 6, and 8.

wk15 NYJ in rain -- the assumption here is that Maroney is finally healthy, logging 26 carries -- total snaps 69.

maroney 36 snaps (26 carries)

faulk 14 snaps

wk16 MIA total snaps 64

maroney 29s (14c)

faulk 19

wk17 @NYG 73 snaps

maroney 31s (19c)

faulk 10s

playoffs:

JAX 59 snaps

maroney 32s (22c)

faulk 27s

SD 67 snaps

maroney 39s (25c)

faulk 28s

NYG 73 snaps

maroney 38s (14c)

faulk 35s

Last 6 game summary:

Maroney plays 50% of 405 snaps, while averaging 20 carries, which is fairly similar to his first few weeks (18 carries).

Faulk logs 33% of snaps, which is still lower than Yudkins 40+% figure, but substantially up from the first few weeks of the year when Morris was playing.

Now, if somebody wants to look at this and explain to me how Faulk is a big threat to cripple Maroney's production, I'd consider myself enlightened.

edit: I think I'll edit this in, for whatever it's worth.

Of the final 6 games, Faulk only collected 43 snaps (21% of 3 game total snaps) in the 3 regular season games, while more than doubling that at 92 snaps (46%) in the 3 playoff games.

 

[gregjcross]

Bit of a homer pick, but I like Shonn Greene as a potential sleeper - although perhaps well later in the season.He's the guy that Rex Ryan seemingly brought into the fold to be his eventual lead back. While Jones is coming off a big year, he's getting up there in age and workload, and he hasn't exactly ingratiated himself with Rex. We've seen how Rex is not hesitant to push the incumbent proven guy aside (see: McGahee, Willis). While Leon Washington remains there, I think he'll remain the PR/KR/3rd down back.If not this year, then Greene is the guy to have next year and beyond IMO.

The Shonn Greene /Rex Ryan story sounds good, but he seems raw and not explosive enough to be succesful esp. considering who he has to push aside for playing time. I would not pick him up generally.

 

[Buffaloes]

Keep an eye on Jabar Gaffney. Not an exciting name but he has been taking the reps opposite Eddie Royal while Brandon Marshall has been out. He figures to be the #3 WR if Marshall decides to come back and ends up playing this year. Either way, his familiarity with the offense and the fact that Orton has no game history with any of the rostered WRs not named Brandon Lloyd makes Gaffney a guy worth watching.

 

[Bears0492]

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Reggie Bush just breaks out one of these years for over 2000 all purpose yards

I'm totally in agreement with you. I just wish he can stay healthy, because I have him in a keeper league.

Until Bush becomes a better runner between the tackles he will never come close to 2000 all purpose yds. Let's face it, he doesn't like the contact.

Yeah, thats always been his weak point, but I think if he stays healthy and gets a little bigger, he'll be able to do it.

 

[David Yudkin]

Ok, here are the Maroney/Faulk stats that some guy was so excited to have posted, and it should be apparent why Yudkin has been so reluctant to post them, rather posting a hamfisted 2 year average during which Maroney missed about 18 games, Morris 13, and Faulk 1.

It's not really a surprise that Faulk should do well on a 2 year snap count --- like I said before, if that's the case you're building, that Maroney will miss most of the season, that's fine and I can't refute it w/o a crystal ball, just make it clear that that is the case you're making.

To set the stage for those who don't follow the Pats, we roll into 2007 minus Dillon, but adding Morris, with Maroney coming off some kind of off season surgery for a shoulder subluxation, I believe.

That makes the depth chart: Maroney, Morris, Faulk, Eckel, Evans (counting FBs).

I'm gettin' stats from:

http://www.profootballfocus.com/by_team.ph...ts=&gameid=

wk1 @NYJ total snaps - 65

maroney 31 snaps (20 carries)

morris 19

faulk 10

wk2 SD 71 snaps

maroney 23 snaps (15 carries)

morris 18

faulk 3

wk3 BUF 70 snaps

maroney 29 snaps (19 carries)

morris 16

faulk 4

Unfortunately, here is where we lose Maroney for a few weeks, but I'll also post the next couple games.

wk4 @CIN 71 snaps

morris 33 snaps (21 carries)

faulk 3 snaps

wk5 CLE 74 snaps

morris 31 snaps (21 carries)

faulk 3 snaps

The following week is where we lose Morris for the year.



Week 1-5 summary:

Faulk has played 6.5% of 351 snaps.

That is a VERY far cry from Yudkin's 40%.

Maroney has averaged 18 carries in the 3 games he played.

Week 7-14 summary:

Maroney struggles back from injury, sustains some mysterious foot injury, is rumored to be in the doghouse, and loses a couple games due to opponent specific scheme.

Basically, a mish mosh of excuses where he logs highs of 13, 14, and 15 carries, but also lows of 6, 6, and 8.

wk15 NYJ in rain -- the assumption here is that Maroney is finally healthy, logging 26 carries -- total snaps 69.

maroney 36 snaps (26 carries)

faulk 14 snaps

wk16 MIA total snaps 64

maroney 29s (14c)

faulk 19

wk17 @NYG 73 snaps

maroney 31s (19c)

faulk 10s

playoffs:

JAX 59 snaps

maroney 32s (22c)

faulk 27s

SD 67 snaps

maroney 39s (25c)

faulk 28s

NYG 73 snaps

maroney 38s (14c)

faulk 35s

Last 6 game summary:

Maroney plays 50% of 405 snaps, while averaging 20 carries, which is fairly similar to his first few weeks (18 carries).

Faulk logs 33% of snaps, which is still lower than Yudkins 40+% figure, but substantially up from the first few weeks of the year when Morris was playing.

Now, if somebody wants to look at this and explain to me how Faulk is a big threat to cripple Maroney's production, I'd consider myself enlightened.

edit: I think I'll edit this in, for whatever it's worth.

Of the final 6 games, Faulk only collected 43 snaps (21% of 3 game total snaps) in the 3 regular season games, while more than doubling that at 92 snaps (46%) in the 3 playoff games.

I don't have the time nor the desire to look at individual game snap counts from two years ago. I also have no idea if these snap counts are accurate are not. In any event, these are stats from a handful of games from TWO SEASONS AGO.If we look at 2008, Maroney merited 28 carries in the three games he played. I have not seen you comment on any of the other stats I posted about Maroney in other threads concerning NE RB production . . .

YPC over the past 3 years in New England:

Kevin Faulk 5.26

Sammy Morris 4.61

LaMont Jordan 4.54

Laurence Maroney 4.31

(Fred Taylor in JAX 4.86)

Touches per TD over the past 3 years in New England:

Ben Jarvis Green Ellis 15.4

Corey Dillon 16.3

Kyle Eckel 17.0

LaMont Jordan 20.0

Heath Evans 21.5

Sammy Morris 26.4

Kevin Faulk 31.8

Lawrence Maroney 31.8

(Fred Taylor in JAX 53.8)

HEADING INTO 2009 (which is what people should care about, not two seasons ago), Maroney is the fourth RB on the depth chart, still struggles to stay healthy and stay in the lineup, and needs to regain the confidence of the coaching staff. He's been back to practicing kick returns (normally not the sign of a guy pegged to be a stud RB).

He's only caught a pass in 2 of his last 16 regular season games played. He's only scored a TD in 11 of 30 games played. He doesn't see a lot of work at the goal line, and he rarely plays on passing downs (and hardly ever sees passes thrown his way).

So sure, Maroney did well at the end of the 2007 season for a few games. No one is saying he didn't. But that was then and this is now, and he's unlikely to see that sort of role this season.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I don't have the time nor the desire to look at individual game snap counts from two years ago. I also have no idea if these snap counts are accurate are not. In any event, these are stats from a handful of games from TWO SEASONS AGO.If we look at 2008, Maroney merited 28 carries in the three games he played. I have not seen you comment on any of the other stats I posted about Maroney in other threads concerning NE RB production . . .

Yeah, the raw game data is not for everyone, which is why I included bolded summaries for busier people like yourself --- I find it hard to believe you didn't have the 10 seconds it'd take to read them, although I fully believe the lack of inclination part.....Sorry, I had neither the time nor desire to read your stats. You know, for a guy who just wants to look forward to project performance, you certainly throw around a lot of historical data....Just sayin'./discussionpsHope that one guy who was askin' for them at least had the time to read them.

 

[Instinctive]

I did have time to read them...well what I could. I'm currently just goin to have to trust the summaries, because you used too many abbreviations for me that didn't make sense (although it is really late, so I may have to look again tomorrow and it could make perfect sense).

 

[Verbal Kint]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

 

[Vikes03]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

Shhhhhh... keep this quiet, I draft in 2 weeks, I'm afraid he's gonna start climbing.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

He'll be better than top 10?

 

[Michael Fox Fan]

Ok, here are the Maroney/Faulk stats that some guy was so excited to have posted, and it should be apparent why Yudkin has been so reluctant to post them, rather posting a hamfisted 2 year average during which Maroney missed about 18 games, Morris 13, and Faulk 1.

It's not really a surprise that Faulk should do well on a 2 year snap count --- like I said before, if that's the case you're building, that Maroney will miss most of the season, that's fine and I can't refute it w/o a crystal ball, just make it clear that that is the case you're making.

To set the stage for those who don't follow the Pats, we roll into 2007 minus Dillon, but adding Morris, with Maroney coming off some kind of off season surgery for a shoulder subluxation, I believe.

That makes the depth chart: Maroney, Morris, Faulk, Eckel, Evans (counting FBs).

I'm gettin' stats from:

http://www.profootballfocus.com/by_team.ph...ts=&gameid=

wk1 @NYJ total snaps - 65

maroney 31 snaps (20 carries)

morris 19

faulk 10

wk2 SD 71 snaps

maroney 23 snaps (15 carries)

morris 18

faulk 3

wk3 BUF 70 snaps

maroney 29 snaps (19 carries)

morris 16

faulk 4

Unfortunately, here is where we lose Maroney for a few weeks, but I'll also post the next couple games.

wk4 @CIN 71 snaps

morris 33 snaps (21 carries)

faulk 3 snaps

wk5 CLE 74 snaps

morris 31 snaps (21 carries)

faulk 3 snaps

The following week is where we lose Morris for the year.



Week 1-5 summary:

Faulk has played 6.5% of 351 snaps.

That is a VERY far cry from Yudkin's 40%.

Maroney has averaged 18 carries in the 3 games he played.

Week 7-14 summary:

Maroney struggles back from injury, sustains some mysterious foot injury, is rumored to be in the doghouse, and loses a couple games due to opponent specific scheme.

Basically, a mish mosh of excuses where he logs highs of 13, 14, and 15 carries, but also lows of 6, 6, and 8.

wk15 NYJ in rain -- the assumption here is that Maroney is finally healthy, logging 26 carries -- total snaps 69.

maroney 36 snaps (26 carries)

faulk 14 snaps

wk16 MIA total snaps 64

maroney 29s (14c)

faulk 19

wk17 @NYG 73 snaps

maroney 31s (19c)

faulk 10s

playoffs:

JAX 59 snaps

maroney 32s (22c)

faulk 27s

SD 67 snaps

maroney 39s (25c)

faulk 28s

NYG 73 snaps

maroney 38s (14c)

faulk 35s

Last 6 game summary:

Maroney plays 50% of 405 snaps, while averaging 20 carries, which is fairly similar to his first few weeks (18 carries).

Faulk logs 33% of snaps, which is still lower than Yudkins 40+% figure, but substantially up from the first few weeks of the year when Morris was playing.

Now, if somebody wants to look at this and explain to me how Faulk is a big threat to cripple Maroney's production, I'd consider myself enlightened.

edit: I think I'll edit this in, for whatever it's worth.

Of the final 6 games, Faulk only collected 43 snaps (21% of 3 game total snaps) in the 3 regular season games, while more than doubling that at 92 snaps (46%) in the 3 playoff games.

Wow, fantastic post! Not sure why DY couldn't be bothered to read such a thorough, enlightening post. We can all debate how valid data from 2 years ago is, but it is still quite interesting.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Wow, fantastic post! Not sure why DY couldn't be bothered to read such a thorough, enlightening post. We can all debate how valid data from 2 years ago is, but it is still quite interesting.

Haha....don't kid yourself --- he read it.Which is why he immediately changed the subject to some ypc listing, and started harping on a couple broken shoulder games from last year.Anyway, that discussion we were having was only about a very specific facet of the Maroney situation --- whether Faulk, in particular, leeches his production.The greater Maroney debate of his draft value still rages on.

 

[RBM]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

Agree with this

 

[BigJim®]

I'm keeping an eye on Ramses Barden, who by all accounts is turning heads in Giants camp. Here's a cool link to fan snapshots of a nice catch: Catch

Also keeping an eye on LeSean McCoy as his blocking is getting good reports in camp, and typically blocking is one thing that impedes rookie RBs from seeing action.

 

[bcr8f]

The Green Bay Press-Gazette, is reporting that after a week and a half of practice, James Jones has erased all doubts and looks like a clear-cut favorite to again be the team's all-important third receiver. He regularly has lined up ahead of Jordy Nelson in the "zebra" or three-receiver set and has been catching just about everything thrown his way. "He's having a very good camp," offensive coordinator Joe Philbin said this week. "He's catching the ball well; he's making some plays down the field; he's competing well for the football down the field. Talking to some of our defensive backs, they say his blocking --- you know a guy his size, it's critical in our running game that the receivers do the job down the field --- has been good. So I think in all those categories he's been doing well."

 

[Native]

Domenik Hixon could start at WR for the Giants and has superb quickness. He could be a viable breakout player and WR2.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I was very interested in Hixon last year when Burress was out, but he was kind of underwhelming.

Do you expect better?

 

[gonzobill5]

Justin Gage-Was a top-15 WR last year on a per start basis.

Would you mind clarifying this statement?

 

[Stryker]

Chaz Schillens

Vishante Shiancoe..had 7 TDs last year btw..

Chris Cooley...No way he repeats his crappy TD total from last season

Shonn Greene

Miles Austin?? Or Crayton??

 

[Carver]

Anyone throw Kevin Boss out there yet? he is in store for big things this season. Tremendous late round value.

 

[gregjcross]

Wow, fantastic post! Not sure why DY couldn't be bothered to read such a thorough, enlightening post. We can all debate how valid data from 2 years ago is, but it is still quite interesting.

Haha....don't kid yourself --- he read it.Which is why he immediately changed the subject to some ypc listing, and started harping on a couple broken shoulder games from last year.Anyway, that discussion we were having was only about a very specific facet of the Maroney situation --- whether Faulk, in particular, leeches his production.The greater Maroney debate of his draft value still rages on.

I dont disagree aboutt the points you were making way above; but now that Fred Taylor is in town for NE, I think Maroney is essentially been reduced to dark horse status. That doesn't mean Maroney wouldnt be a half decent prospect in the event of a big injury to Taylor or other types of injuries, but, for redrafts, i am not even considering him unless Jamal Charles or Darren Sproles types are already gone.

 

[doubletrouble]

Anyone throw Kevin Boss out there yet? he is in store for big things this season. Tremendous late round value.

 

[Knobs]

Anyone throw Kevin Boss out there yet? he is in store for big things this season. Tremendous late round value.

I'm missing the funny part.

 

[acme]

Anyone throw Kevin Boss out there yet? he is in store for big things this season. Tremendous late round value.

Boss has got to be one of Eli's most trusted set of hands right now.The longer he's been in the system, the more they've thrown to him. Especially in the red zone. He's not the fastest guy by any means, but seems to "box-out" well and make the catch.We like Boss this year too.

 

[Avery]

Anyone throw Kevin Boss out there yet? he is in store for big things this season. Tremendous late round value.

I'm missing the funny part.

So am I.Back to Boss, I was a bit down on him with the drafting of Beckum but I think Boss may be a good sleeper for Beckum looks to be very much the rookie in camp thus far and may play more of the H-back role instead of the traditional TE therefore leaving Boss on the field more regardless of how quickly Beckum comeds along.

 

[JohnnyU]

Anyone throw Kevin Boss out there yet? he is in store for big things this season. Tremendous late round value.

:(

No offense, but I believe Joe Bryant posted something earlier this summer about meaningless posts that needed to stop. I truly believe if they would get rid of the emoticons, it would make for a nicer SP.

 

[Max Power]

Crazy as it sounds, I'm actually liking Dennis Northcutt to be a nice WR3 this year. I think the guy has some talent and if Detroit gets him involved in the passing game, He could jump out and have a real nice season considering the Lions need to pass late in game and the double teams Calvin will be facing.

 

[Casting Couch]

I'm keeping an eye on Ramses Barden, who by all accounts is turning heads in Giants camp. Here's a cool link to fan snapshots of a nice catch: Catch

By All accounts ? I actually heard he has been thoroughly underwhelming, and having big problems beating the jam at the LOS.

 

[saintfool]

Crazy as it sounds, I'm actually liking Dennis Northcutt to be a nice WR3 this year. I think the guy has some talent and if Detroit gets him involved in the passing game, He could jump out and have a real nice season considering the Lions need to pass late in game and the double teams Calvin will be facing.

there are a number of #3 WRs out there that may have some value, i think. gaffney, in denver, can produce because of the projected weak denver defense. with royal and marshall getting all the attention, the opportunities should be there. the thing in northcutt's favor is much the same.

 

[travdogg]

Justin Gage-Was a top-15 WR last year on a per start basis.

Would you mind clarifying this statement?

I was off by a few spots. He was actually 18th on a per start basis. He started 11 games. In those 11 games, he averaged more PPG than Berrian, Bowe, Royal and Welker.

 

[David Yudkin]

Justin Gage-Was a top-15 WR last year on a per start basis.

Would you mind clarifying this statement?

I was off by a few spots. He was actually 18th on a per start basis. He started 11 games. In those 11 games, he averaged more PPG than Berrian, Bowe, Royal and Welker.

Gage ranked 25th in ppg in 0 PPR leagues in the 12 games he played. IMO, the other game whether he started or didn't start is a case of semantics.Compared to the guys you mentioned ppg wise across the entire season, Berrian 20thBowe 21stRoyal 18thWelker 24thThings have changed some in TEN though, as Washington was added and they drafted Britt and Cook. That could impact Gage's numbers . . .

 

[bcr8f]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

Hope you are right. In a 1.5PPR dynasty league I have Pierre, Slaton, Ray Rice, Thomas Jones/Shonne Greene and I'm looking forward to the season after a tough year.WR's Jennings, Colston, Driver, Lance Moore.Crabtree

 

[bcr8f]

RB Rashard Jennings (MJD won't stay healthy)

'Cause he's short? Seriously, why would you say this?

More likely...Michael Bush as the 52nd drafted RB. If McFadden is hurt again look out.

 

[gonzobill5]

Justin Gage-Was a top-15 WR last year on a per start basis.

Would you mind clarifying this statement?

I was off by a few spots. He was actually 18th on a per start basis. He started 11 games. In those 11 games, he averaged more PPG than Berrian, Bowe, Royal and Welker.

Gage ranked 25th in ppg in 0 PPR leagues in the 12 games he played. IMO, the other game whether he started or didn't start is a case of semantics.Compared to the guys you mentioned ppg wise across the entire season, Berrian 20thBowe 21stRoyal 18thWelker 24thThings have changed some in TEN though, as Washington was added and they drafted Britt and Cook. That could impact Gage's numbers . . .

Thanks, this is what I had too (12 games played/25th overall). I wasn't sure what travdog was implying by "per start" vs. "per game."ETA: Bowe finishing 21st despite 150 targets just got him crossed off my board.

 

[BigJim®]

I'm keeping an eye on Ramses Barden, who by all accounts is turning heads in Giants camp. Here's a cool link to fan snapshots of a nice catch: Catch

By All accounts ? I actually heard he has been thoroughly underwhelming, and having big problems beating the jam at the LOS.

Here are the pieces I've read in the past few days:http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2009/08...eceivers_a.html

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/gia...-zone-1.1363445

The notable quotes I saw were from Manning and Coughlin, which I presume have some merit:

Since then, Barden has continued to impress. Even Eli Manning has noticed. The quarterback was asked if there have been any surprises in camp so far from the receivers, a perfect setup for a ho-hum answer about everybody contributing and improving. But Manning couldn't resist.

"I think Ramses is doing really well," Manning said. "He's a big target, he makes the plays, he seems like he has a pretty good feel for what's going on."

The Giants think he can be successful, too, and are starting to salivate at the possibilities he presents.

"You stand there in the [red] zone and you notice what a difference it is with him," Tom Coughlin said. "Hopefully, we can take advantage of that.

If you have links to unfavorable comments on Barden, by all means post them as I'd like to know if the things you mention are accurate.

 

[tdmills]

Justin Gage-Was a top-15 WR last year on a per start basis.

Would you mind clarifying this statement?

I was off by a few spots. He was actually 18th on a per start basis. He started 11 games. In those 11 games, he averaged more PPG than Berrian, Bowe, Royal and Welker.

Gage ranked 25th in ppg in 0 PPR leagues in the 12 games he played. IMO, the other game whether he started or didn't start is a case of semantics.Compared to the guys you mentioned ppg wise across the entire season, Berrian 20thBowe 21stRoyal 18thWelker 24thThings have changed some in TEN though, as Washington was added and they drafted Britt and Cook. That could impact Gage's numbers . . .

Thanks, this is what I had too (12 games played/25th overall). I wasn't sure what travdog was implying by "per start" vs. "per game."ETA: Bowe finishing 21st despite 150 targets just got him crossed off my board.

I would take into account who was throwing him the football, they weren't all catchable.

 

[Avery]

I'm keeping an eye on Ramses Barden, who by all accounts is turning heads in Giants camp. Here's a cool link to fan snapshots of a nice catch: Catch

By All accounts ? I actually heard he has been thoroughly underwhelming, and having big problems beating the jam at the LOS.

Here are the pieces I've read in the past few days:http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2009/08...eceivers_a.html

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/gia...-zone-1.1363445

The notable quotes I saw were from Manning and Coughlin, which I presume have some merit:

Since then, Barden has continued to impress. Even Eli Manning has noticed. The quarterback was asked if there have been any surprises in camp so far from the receivers, a perfect setup for a ho-hum answer about everybody contributing and improving. But Manning couldn't resist.

"I think Ramses is doing really well," Manning said. "He's a big target, he makes the plays, he seems like he has a pretty good feel for what's going on."

The Giants think he can be successful, too, and are starting to salivate at the possibilities he presents.

"You stand there in the [red] zone and you notice what a difference it is with him," Tom Coughlin said. "Hopefully, we can take advantage of that.

If you have links to unfavorable comments on Barden, by all means post them as I'd like to know if the things you mention are accurate.

The only unfavorable stuff I remember was some comments about him in OTAs being very raw.Every report I've read from training camp has been with Barden showing better routes and better hands then expected.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

Hope you are right. In a 1.5PPR dynasty league I have Pierre, Slaton, Ray Rice, Thomas Jones/Shonne Greene and I'm looking forward to the season after a tough year.WR's Jennings, Colston, Driver, Lance Moore.Crabtree

Hopefully they'll include this in the FBG newsletter.

 

[tribecalledjeff]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

Hope you are right. In a 1.5PPR dynasty league I have Pierre, Slaton, Ray Rice, Thomas Jones/Shonne Greene and I'm looking forward to the season after a tough year.WR's Jennings, Colston, Driver, Lance Moore.Crabtree

Hopefully they'll include this in the FBG newsletter.

 

[smackdaddies]

jermichael finley - top 10 TE this year

and for those in leagues with deep rosters or just have to take a flyer on your last pick

...Travis Beckum

 

[runner06]

jermichael finley - top 10 TE this yearand for those in leagues with deep rosters or just have to take a flyer on your last pick...Travis Beckum

Haven't heard much about Finley. I would be interested in hearing some reasoning behind it.

 

[simey]

Pierre Thomas > top 10. Book it.

Hope you are right. In a 1.5PPR dynasty league I have Pierre, Slaton, Ray Rice, Thomas Jones/Shonne Greene and I'm looking forward to the season after a tough year.WR's Jennings, Colston, Driver, Lance Moore.Crabtree

4 of those WR's are on the same bye.

 

[anakin]

jermichael finley - top 10 TE this yearand for those in leagues with deep rosters or just have to take a flyer on your last pick...Travis Beckum

Haven't heard much about Finley. I would be interested in hearing some reasoning behind it.

There is already a thread on him. Use the search function.

 

[ceo3west]

 

[Liquid Tension]

The #1 seed in the NFC? Because they added a TE? They play the NFC East and the AFC East this year (the two strongest divisions) instead of the NFC North and the AFC West (two of the weakest divisions). I could see them struggling to win 8 games this year.

I'd argue that the AFC South is stronger than the East.

I think the AFC South is the best division in football, even better than the NFC East. I'm confident that the two super bowl teams will come out of these two divisions.Looking at the schedule, I kind of think all AFC South players may be undervalued, its almost unfair that players the caliber of Manning, MJD, CJ3, AJ, Wayne and Clark draw the NFC West.

Not to hijack but Colts < EaglesTitans < GiantsTexans < CowboysJags = or < Redskins

The Eagles and Giants are better than anyone in the AFC South

 

[runner06]

jermichael finley - top 10 TE this yearand for those in leagues with deep rosters or just have to take a flyer on your last pick...Travis Beckum

Haven't heard much about Finley. I would be interested in hearing some reasoning behind it.

There is already a thread on him. Use the search function.

Found it. Thanks.

 

[Moonlight_Graham]

The #1 seed in the NFC? Because they added a TE? They play the NFC East and the AFC East this year (the two strongest divisions) instead of the NFC North and the AFC West (two of the weakest divisions). I could see them struggling to win 8 games this year.

I'd argue that the AFC South is stronger than the East.

I think the AFC South is the best division in football, even better than the NFC East. I'm confident that the two super bowl teams will come out of these two divisions.Looking at the schedule, I kind of think all AFC South players may be undervalued, its almost unfair that players the caliber of Manning, MJD, CJ3, AJ, Wayne and Clark draw the NFC West.

Not to hijack but Colts < EaglesTitans < GiantsTexans < CowboysJags = or < Redskins

The Eagles and Giants are better than anyone in the AFC South

really? I would think there's at least two teams in the AFC South better than the Eagles.

 

[Heatman]

Chaz Schillens

Vishante Shiancoe..had 7 TDs last year btw..

Chris Cooley...No way he repeats his crappy TD total from last season

Shonn Greene



Miles Austin?? Or Crayton?? Sam Hurd

Fixed