2016-17 NBA Thread: Finals are over, please go away (3 Viewers)

[Capella]

Remember when LeBron, Bosh, and Wade lost to Dirk, the Matrix, and JJ Barea in the finals?  Hey, but LeBron got another finals appearance*!

*from the Eastern conference 

Come on man, you've had an entire year to work on this. 

 

[RokNRole]

There is more to it then their records from the year before. 

This was basically how I was going to respond.

 

[Anarchy99]

Why?

Cause I don't think that LeBron, KD, and Leonard are friends and/or aren't buddy buddy off the court. IMO, this type of competition will cause guys that know each other to play together and not really reach out to acquaintances or guys on other teams that are their prime competition. 

 

[Capella]

KD, Westbrook and Harden imo 

 

[bananafish]

Steph, Seth and Dell.

 

[thecatch]

Do you think SA is going to sign 32 year-old Chris Paul to a 4 year max contract? Maybe.

I don't think he or Blake are leaving the Clippers. They can't afford to be irrelevant and can offer the most $.

Yes, absolutely to your first question. That's still a tradeable contract. You are probably right on the second point. 

 

[wikkidpissah]

KD, Westbrook and Harden imo 

 

[scoobus]

Cause I don't think that LeBron, KD, and Leonard are friends and/or aren't buddy buddy off the court. IMO, this type of competition will cause guys that know each other to play together and not really reach out to acquaintances or guys on other teams that are their prime competition. 

Assuming each country only gets 1 entry, I think the U.S. is going to put together the best team possible, and whoever they select will be more than happy to play with whoever.

Now if it's more than one entry per country then you could definitely be right. Hopefully it is because that would lead to some pretty awesome matchups.

 

[Synthesizer]

Remember when LeBron, Bosh, and Wade lost to Dirk, the Matrix, and JJ Barea in the finals?  Hey, but LeBron got another finals appearance*!

*from the Eastern conference 

I do remember watching those finals.  I had the same view as Durant, Westbrook, Curry, Kobe, and every other player in the NBA who was sitting on their couch watching the finals also.

 

[Anarchy99]

Assuming each country only gets 1 entry, I think the U.S. is going to put together the best team possible, and whoever they select will be more than happy to play with whoever.

Now if it's more than one entry per country then you could definitely be right. Hopefully it is because that would lead to some pretty awesome matchups.

If it is only one entry per country, I want to see the U.S. qualifying tournament. 

 

[Anarchy99]

I guess it depends how they set up who gets into the Olympics. If it's like ice skating where the top 16 qualifiers get in no matter what country they are from (or whatever the number is), then maybe they would allow multiple teams from the same country. It should be interesting how they set this up. 

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

Honestly, I've thought about this well before the last two years. The math on the current three point line is such that offensive play is going to get less and less diverse as people realize that even a well-guarded look at a three is often better than a clean look from 15 feet.

It's not the worst thing in the world, as defenses have and will continue to adjust and then offenses will presumably counter those adjustments - eg I think the Spurs % of FG attempts from three have actually gone down in the last two years after being at the vanguard of the corner three revolution. But it's worth monitoring and even considering since it will take a lot of work to figure out if they decide to move it.

BINGO. 

Except for thinking the Warriors could beat the Bulls, you have never been wrong. 

 

[Joe T]

Come on man, you've had an entire year to work on this. 

Not really, I spent about 15 minutes over lunch.

Try this one:

The refs will definitely give the game to the Cavs tonight to try to stretch one more game out of this embarrassment.

(note:  this is B+ schtick at its finest)

 

[Zigg]

Is there a bench, or simply 3 man rosters?  I think a 1 man bench is good.

 

[Weebs210]

Not really, I spent about 15 minutes over lunch.

Try this one:

The refs will definitely give the game to the Cavs tonight to try to stretch one more game out of this embarrassment.

(note:  this is B+ schtick at its finest)

Eh not sure your trolling is even worth a C TBH.

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

Speaking of 3 on 3, I heard today that 3 on 3 basketball has been added as an Olympic sport. If pros are allowed to participate, what combination of three players would have the greatest chance of winning?

To flesh this out a little, Olympic 3x3 is teams of four (3 starters and 1 substitute, can sub out after any dead ball).  

Play to 21: inside the arc and free throws are worth one, outside the arc is worth 2.

12-second shot clock.

Possession changes after a made basket (no "make it, take it")

All held balls awarded to defense.

After a defensive rebound or steal, team has to take the ball outside the arc before scoring.

 

[Short Corner]

They know it's over but nobody wants to get swept. There's always a good chance a team playing for pride can pull one off.

Playing for pride and the opportunity to take another four and a half hour cross country flight to watch GSW celebrate on their home floor.

 

[RokNRole]

Playing for pride and the opportunity to take another four and a half hour cross country flight to watch GSW celebrate on their home floor.

Hey I've never played in an NBA finals. What do I know?

 

[Short Corner]

Speaking of 3 on 3, I heard today that 3 on 3 basketball has been added as an Olympic sport. If pros are allowed to participate, what combination of three players would have the greatest chance of winning?

They play with 14 second shot clocks and shorter resets.  It's pretty up tempo compared to normal 3v3

 

[Jayrod]

To flesh this out a little, Olympic 3x3 is teams of four (3 starters and 1 substitute, can sub out after any dead ball).  

Play to 21: inside the arc and free throws are worth one, outside the arc is worth 2.

12-second shot clock.

Possession changes after a made basket (no "make it, take it")

All held balls awarded to defense.

After a defensive rebound or steal, team has to take the ball outside the arc before scoring.

That sounds awesome and can be more exhausting than a game of full court 5 on 5.

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

I guess it depends how they set up who gets into the Olympics. If it's like ice skating where the top 16 qualifiers get in no matter what country they are from (or whatever the number is), then maybe they would allow multiple teams from the same country. It should be interesting how they set this up. 

Recent FIBA 3x3 events have been one team per country. 

So far, USA Basketball has treated 3x3 as a separate entity from the five-on-five version of the game.  Team USA at the FIBA 2017 3x3 World Cup is four guys who would be generously described as "little name recognition".  

But all that might change by the 2020 Olympics.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

This was basically how I was going to respond.

Did you murder Koya or what?

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

That sounds awesome and can be more exhausting than a game of full court 5 on 5.

Short Corner probably knows a lot more about it.  This style of organized 3x3 is a lot more popular in Europe than in the States.

 

[butcher boy]

Not really, I spent about 15 minutes over lunch.

Try this one:

The refs will definitely give the game to the Cavs tonight to try to stretch one more game out of this embarrassment.

(note:  this is B+ schtick at its finest)

The refs tried to give game 3 to the Cavs and the Warriors ended up beating both the Cavs and the refs.  That's gotta make the refs back off a bit because the Warriors proved that it would take such an enormous amount of ref bias to beat them, that it wont be worth the risk of getting their intentions caught.  The refs will let the Warriors take it and just go back to steering games their way in future years.

 

[Jayrod]

Short Corner probably knows a lot more about it.  This style of organized 3x3 is a lot more popular in Europe than in the States.

Aside from the shot clock, the rules sound almost identical to the Hoop-It-Up tournaments we used to play in in the early 2000's.  The transitions from offense-defense-offense can be intense and rely on a ton of lateral quickness and change of direction as opposed to straight line speed.  Also, with the spacing available, the ability to go around or stay in front of a guy is as valuable as height.

 

[RokNRole]

Did you murder Koya or what?

I plead the 5th

 

[Weebs210]

The refs tried to give game 3 to the Cavs and the Warriors ended up beating both the Cavs and the refs.  That's gotta make the refs back off a bit because the Warriors proved that it would take such an enormous amount of ref bias to beat them, that it wont be worth the risk of getting their intentions caught.  The refs will let the Warriors take it and just go back to steering games their way in future years.

Lol. If the refs were trying to give the game to Cavs they would have called fouls in the last couple minutes of the game 

 

[butcher boy]

Lol. If the refs were trying to give the game to Cavs they would have called fouls in the last couple minutes of the game 

They have to be careful not to be too blatant about their biases though and they were already pushing it that game.  Most normal teams would've lost game 3 to the refs and Cavs.  It turns out it takes a greater amount of ref bias to beat the Warriors this year and this is problematic for the refs.  

 

[Weebs210]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19581798/zach-lowe-golden-state-warriors-forgiving-draymond-green-2017-nba-finals

How pathetic is this?

Dray called KD and the warriors gm an hour after game 7 last year.

 

[Weebs210]

They have to be careful not to be too blatant about their biases though and they were already pushing it that game.  Most normal teams would've lost game 3 to the refs and Cavs.  It turns out it takes a greater amount of ref bias to beat the Warriors this year and this is problematic for the refs.  

Yawn.

 

[tjnc09]

If the Cavs won tonight, I doubt it, it would put a little pressure on the warriors to win at home in game 5.

James and Irving looked demoralized after game 3.  Especially Irving - he was physically shaking.  Really nothing else they could have done and they still lost. 

Golden State is a different monster at home - does Cleveland have two road wins still left in them?  The climb to come back this year is a million times harder than last year.

 

[Weebs210]

James and Irving looked demoralized after game 3.  Especially Irving - he was physically shaking.  Really nothing else they could have done and they still lost. 

Golden State is a different monster at home - does Cleveland have two road wins still left in them?  The climb to come back this year is a million times harder than last year.

Lol gsw narrative. He just got out of an ice bath you imbecile.

 

[DJackson10]

What about when he blatantly kicks AI in the nuts?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIUIjASojkE

Right through the uprights. lebron might have a job as an NFL kicker when he retires. 

 

[DJackson10]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2714466-lebron-james-rumored-to-potentially-join-lakers-clippers-in-2018-free-agency

Would be a dumb move by him. West has always had the tougher road to the finals with teams. I remember for a while there were teams missing the playoffs in the west 3-4 teams that could've easily slotted anywhere in the East from the #3-8 seeds in the East. Wouldn't get this move at all and it'd really depend on the guys there. 

 

[DJackson10]

As long as GS is willing to spend the $$$ to keep this group together the NBA is a forgone conclusion (barring injury or injuries).

Maybe some people want to watch 1 team just roll to a Championship every year, but I'd rather see some doubt in the outcome.

The NBA probably couldn't get a hard cap through the PA, so take the max salary limit off hoping to spread out the top talent more?

I think a few of the best NBA changes would be figuring out a draft process that works. I think the most fair is let HS players in or they go to college for at least 3 yrs the Mold Baseball works in drafting players. Guys who don't want to go to college can go pro. I'd also maybe make changes to the D League to help develop guys more as well who maybe didn't get drafted and other things. I would like to see every franchise at some point own a D league team or at least 2 teams sharing a league and having rights to certain guys they assign to those teams. 

Next make it easier for smaller market teams to keep their young superstar. I don't know how you'd do that and theres a lot of different scenarios there. 

Next I'd put in a really hard cap both for Floor and high cap. Teams will then be forced to make changes. Put teams together to win and not tank as well as a harder time putting super teams together and if they do end up like this years Cavs with zero bench. 

Next I'd get rid of the lottery and protected picks. I think teams who trade a 1st and have lottery protected, top 5 protected etc enables teams to want to tank. The lottery I don't think helps the tanking either and only encourages it more knowing more then 1 team might have a shot to acquire a top pick. 

However I agree with you I think the NBA tried to put a hard cap in but the PA wouldn't agree to it. Either way my ideas for now are just ideas thrown up on a white board and obviously need more details worked out in them but I think they are good starting points. Don't get me started on what on court rules I'd like to see changed I have a huge list for that. 

 

[Weebs210]

Anyone else completely just skip all of Djackson's posts?

 

[DJackson10]

Cavs might want to invest in a real coach but I doubt LeBron would like that

He got his only real coach fired. I'm not even sure how good Eric Spoelstra was. Was he another Mike Shanahan type who road the coattails of some great players or is he a good coach. Lue isn't much of a coach and I laughed when they hired him. There's blame to go around everywhere in the Cavs org from the Real GM to Gilbert to LeBron himself. Unfortunately and what drives me nuts the most is a lot of lebron Defenders will blame everyone else and non of it is his fault. If I stand correct Wasn't LeBron the real reason Blatt got fired last year? 

So... Different angle.  Where does Steve Kerr fit in the history of the NBA?  He made an iconic shot, played for a couple championship teams, and coached the best record in the history of the NBA. 

I love the guy. 

Are we talking player or coach? Coach wise I thought he's pretty good and looks way better do to the team he has but he made IMHO a better overall shooter given Curry isn't taking some bad shots anymore. As a player if Kerr played today he'd be a Steph Curry of the league IMHO. The league caters to shooters like Kerr today. 

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Lol gsw narrative. He just got out of an ice bath you imbecile.

you are such a peach.....

 

[tjnc09]

Here's my observations from the game last night:

• Kyrie and LeBron seem to be unstoppable off the dribble.  Not sure why they don't commit to that as more of their offense until it stops working.  Just let them take turns, mix it up with pick and roll, whatever...but they HAVE to keep attacking.  They stopped attacking and it cost them the game.
  
• The Warriors 3-pt shooting is just stupid. They must spend half of every practice just shooting 3's.  I never even dreamed a team could shoot like that so consistently.
  
• If the Cavs finished that game off, we would have a legit series and I'd give them a great chance to win Friday.  As is, they may get swept.  It all depends on LeBron's mentality.
  
• Tristan Thompson is absolutely killing the Cavs in multiple ways.  He is a complete non-factor.  I can think of only one good play he has made in 3 games.  Unacceptable, especially considering the commitment they made to him financially.  He is there to get 10+ rebounds every game and somewhat defend the paint.  He's doing none of that.
  
• Love has been fine and Kyrie was really great last night until that last possession where he settled for the 3.  Their next best player?  Kyle Korver.  He is a step slow, but at least hustles and knows his role on offense and can give them something consistent.  If he had hit that corner 3 to ice the game, he'd be the hero of the game and the answers to all of Cleveland's prayers.  I really wish it had gone in so we could be talking about what a great series this is.
  

This is a good article before the finals about TT.  He was one of those x factor types I thought would help Cleveland compete more: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19491943/zach-lowe-cleveland-cavaliers-tristan-thompson-becoming-elite-role-player-nba)

But GS has certainly made it a point of emphasis to lock him down.  He was such an integral part of their success against GS.  Zaza doesn't do anything fancy, but he's done a great job locating TT and boxing him out.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2017/06/how_golden_state_warriors_have.html

https://bballbreakdown.com/2017/06/07/cavaliers-warriors-tristan-thompson/

 

[DJackson10]

That's a personal, not a 'Boston' position. There might be some feeling left from his first go-round in Cle, but the Celts fared pretty well there and now there's just a grudging admiration of the guy who's between them and any finals, which Bostonians consider the natural state of Celticity.

Started sports-hating the King when his self-image started to free run. It's become almost Shakespearean the lack of joy his unprecedented level of talent generates.

I agree with that and it'd be nice for a sweep to humble LeBron but I highly doubt it will. Being a Bulls fan and knowing Others MJ is a god like figure to us in the NBA> Seeing LeBron compared to him who is a polarizing figure doesn't sit well with us A few reasons is neither player plays the same style and their physiques are completely different. A lot of us loved the take the bull by the horns win at all cost and stayed in Chicago most of his career even when the Bad Boy pistons eliminated them meanwhile LeBron decided to ditch Cleveland and play with his buddies. Guys in MJ's day wouldn't have done that. I always refer to the why not as remember The Orginal Dream team? Those guys hated one another and couldn't stand being on a same team but they knew they represented a country. What made them unstoppable was everyone one of those guys went out there trying to prove they were better then the rest. Anything Magic or Larry did MJ wanted to show he could do better and it became individual competitions amongst a team game. They coexisted for the games but the practices were very different. I don't hate LeBron like others just because of the Whole Decision thing however i believe it was a move to feed his ego. I didn't like how he lied to Wade and Bosh about going back to Mia and resigning only for them to both go back to Mia and then LeBron bailed for the Cavs again. Why because he knew he was playing with damaged goods in Mia. If Cle is swept lebron deserves a lot of blame because GM LeBron didn't help put a better team together. He basically cried for the Cavs to bring TT back and that contract is terrible looking for them right now. If Lebron bails again when he's an FA again for LA I wouldn't be surprised. Another reason I don't like is well he plays for my favorites team rival. For me as an Eagles fan thats like me having to root for Dez Bryant or Zeke. Not happening 

 

[DJackson10]

Yeah, the special had something to do with it, but it probably had more to do with how spoiled i am with my sports heroes. When you grow up with Mays, Brown, Russell & Ali as your idols, an expectation follows. One was with baseball like Stevie Wonder with music, the others saw how they could lift society with their position in it and did that above & beyond the call. Kinda forgave Jordan his selfishness later on because the money was new and so unprecedented and he got & gave joy with his gift ("We Like Mike" - there shonuff ain't no "Love on LeBron" campaign). That the King gets more miserable with every milestone is tragic and his leadership-into-selfishness has an almost Oprah-level negative impact on the way society is trending.

LeBron to me seems like a prime example of todays diva in athletes. Don't get what i want so I cry about it and have the coach fired or I'm leaving mantra. I'm the sameway however I grew up in the 90s. So I kind of expected players today to not be so entitled and babied like they are now. Society today is more about entitlement rather then earning. It's I want want want instead of what can I do to earn that or get that. If my brothers and I acted the way some of these kids today behave my Dad would have a leather belt to our behinds and my mom would slap us with the wooden spoon she's making gravy with. And we probably wouldn't see the other side of our bedroom doors unless we had school or called for dinner or use the bathroom and bath. 

 

[DJackson10]

I miss benching more than any other aspect of the olskool game

ETA: If Brad Stevens wants Gordon Hayward, naked Mormon triplets or Danny Ainge to smoke an exploding cigar at each practice, Danny better do it. There was noise during the Bos/Cle series that the King was doing some mad respecting on the Celts coach and Brad may be the one way the Cavs can get on equal footing with the DubMob

Same here I'm so old school despite being 28 that I'd bench anyone and everyone no matter the offense. I don't care if you are Brady or the last guy on the roster. Don't do what I say to an extent or mess up you are benched. I had zero issues when Andy benched DeSean for not giving his all. Andy came from the Holmgrin Coaching tree and I bet if Favre had PO'd Homer enough he'd had benched him no matter what. I know the argument by some would be well if you lose you're out of a job. Ok well then the owner seems to care more about his wins totals then the coach getting everything he can so the team can win even more games. If fans and media want to blame me I'll just tell them you play on this team you follow the rules and my players know the consequences before they did what got them bench. Want to blame someone for this loss blame the selfishness of said player. heck I'd have the player even publicly apologize to the Fans and media and then in the locker room apologize to the team. I may sound like I'd be a hard### but I'd also give the players respect and let them know they did a good job and such. I won't treat them like children unless a player wants to act like a child. I think of it more as tough love. I love my guys and would protect them if I had to but at the same time they mess up I'm not going to be gentle about discipline either. The main issue with benching guys today is the money teams have involved in these guys. it's why pitchers don't throw over 200plus innings and or back to back complete games and such anymore. 

 

[DJackson10]

So where does Lebron go in 2018? Spurs? Warriors? Or one of the up and comers. Minny? Milwaukee? Philly?

No chance at the last 3. Spurs maybe but one of the LA teams since he lives I believe a mile away from the Staples Center or somewhere very close during the summer. 

 

[DJackson10]

They should allow full contact with no fouls in the nba.

Then LeBron would never be good 

 

[DJackson10]

I have a radical idea...how about just enforce the rules...as they are stated...regardless of player "status" or home court.

Add a couple refs if you need to...

This game is a damn mess to watch nowadays.  It's hard to forget tampering when you see so many missed calls and leeway given depending on who did it and if they were at home or not.

Hence why there's so many accusations of it. That and the league really hasn't said or done anything to stop the accusations either. But yeah let's try enforcing actually rules first especially double dribbles, palming, moving screens and traveling. If anything there's a few rules I'd love that are olympic/Euro rules I wouldn't mind throwing into the nBA. 

 

[DJackson10]

I think Jimmy Butler gained some value this finals.  The dude can guard a wing and score.  Boston should give their pick for him.  ITs a win win.

Bos needs to give up more then that. I think two of Crowder/Smart/Bradley would being going in the deal plus other picks. Of coarse Chi would probably need to add some pieces as well. Rumor was a deal would've been made but Ainge didn't want to give up Crowder/Bradley or the Brooklyn Pick. I wouldn't mind Subbing Bradley for Kelly Olynk though. 

 

[Max Power]

Bos needs to give up more then that. I think two of Crowder/Smart/Bradley would being going in the deal plus other picks. Of coarse Chi would probably need to add some pieces as well. Rumor was a deal would've been made but Ainge didn't want to give up Crowder/Bradley or the Brooklyn Pick. I wouldn't mind Subbing Bradley for Kelly Olynk though. 

Bulter and Lopez for the first and Rozier..  I wont lose sleep over that.

 

[DJackson10]

Can we all agree that LeBron's 7 straight finals appearances stat (or whatever the number is) should have a huge asterisk by it?

Someone tried to argue that with me on another forum about a week ago. I just ignored them. A lot easier to get to the Finals in the East them the west. 

 

[wikkidpissah]

Bos needs to give up more then that. I think two of Crowder/Smart/Bradley would being going in the deal plus other picks. Of coarse Chi would probably need to add some pieces as well. Rumor was a deal would've been made but Ainge didn't want to give up Crowder/Bradley or the Brooklyn Pick. I wouldn't mind Subbing Bradley for Kelly Olynk though. 

Bulls lost dibs on anything but the pick for Butler when they wouldnt deal at the trade deadline

 

[DJackson10]

Assuming each country only gets 1 entry, I think the U.S. is going to put together the best team possible, and whoever they select will be more than happy to play with whoever.

Now if it's more than one entry per country then you could definitely be right. Hopefully it is because that would lead to some pretty awesome matchups.

I could see it similar to Beach Volleyball teams. 2-3 teams per country depending on how good said talent pool is. Also what kind of rules is the 3on3 playing?