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2021-22 NBA Thread: Bill Simmons furiously recording 2.5 hour long pod about how Boston is still better than Golden State (1 Viewer)

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jvdesigns2002 said:
Okay—lets be honest. NOBODY put Luka in the first team due to defense.  He is not a great defender—and the only reason why maybe his defensive metrics appear to be better than Trae is because he has the luxury of playing with a team of defensive minded players. Powell, Finney smith, and others are defensive specialists.  Secondly—winning has a lot to do with the quality of teammates. Steph plays on a team with Poole, Klay, Wiggins, and Draymond.   Last night just showed that Luka’s supporting team is a lot better than people give them credit for.   Both Brunson and Dinwiddiie could easily be 20-25 point a game scorers as starting guards on teams without Luka.  Look at what Porzingis was doing in Washington post trade.   You take Trae off of the Hawks—and you think that Gallinari is a threat to go for 25-30 consistently?  I’m not saying Trae is better than Curry or Luka at their peaks—but he objectively had better seasons than both of them this year.  That’s just a fact.  On top of that—maybe I’m old school—but I want star players that don’t miss a lot of games.   The gap in games played trumps any defensive gaps in my opinion. 
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Sorry - objectively?  Or just your opinion?  You wrote both.  Just trying to be clear on which it is.

 
As much as it pains me to say, the Nugs need to keep MPJ and Murray in the wings, understand this isn't your year and get everyone healthy for a run next year. I don't know even if they came back, if they could beat this GSW team. I threw down money on GSW to win it all. I don't know if there is a more complete/hot team right now--especially since they are healthy at the right time.

I feel terrible for Joker--he has done his best to drag this team along, but it just isn't meant to be.   :(

 
Jayrod said:
Meh, Jokic drug a JV team to where they are at and they are facing one of the top 4 teams in the league.

Embiid has a former MVP with him and a young phenom in Maxey.  Jokic has Will Barton, Aaron Gordon and Bones Hyland as his next best teammates.
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Jokic team is a lottery pick without him. Embiid out and the Sixers even before Harden either are one of the play in teams of one of the final teams in the playoff seeding. I think something like that should have more weight to voters in any sport the MVP is voted on then they really do. 

In any close race if the players are neck and neck I would look at who each player has on their squad and defer to the guy with the lesser squad for my vote. Because in a lot of sports to put up MVP numbers on a worse team is a lot more impressive to me then the guy who is on a super team or has a few all stars to their credit with them already 

 
Simmons is allegedly getting close to a return, won't play game 2. I can't imagine they bother to rush him back at all if Nets fall to 0-2.

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
Yea, but he has been doing it all year.  Regardless of who was in the lineup or not practicing.  The whole Simmons thing could have been a huge distraction or put extra pressure on him, but he just went out and balled all season without as many body maintenance days either it seemed.
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I think people put too much on the Simmons thing. The minute Joel called him out last year after the game and Doc wasn't sure about Ben's future I knew Ben played his last ever game in Philly and it sounded like everyone was finally read to move on and the 76ers were going to stop acting like Ben's errand boys. Losing Simmons isn't like Losing Embiid. Subtracting Simmons did a lot more good then bad. even when he was still technically on the team. 

 
mr. furley said:
Embiid barking at Nick Nurse for complaining about fouls is rich with irony
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He should've been barking at Harden after the 1st half ended. Harden was embarrassing the end of that half. I thought I was watching a soccer match from South America with all his flopping. He tried to get too cute at the shot before the buzzard and got off an embarrassingly awful shot and acted like he was fouled. Then he was in the refs face. I'd have T'd him up right there for that. 

I will say overall it's funny watching fans complain about players flopping but when it's their guys and one is one of the most notorious in the league for it they act like people are just going after their guys for no reason. I've said for yrs I love Embiid and most fans didn't even want him at first in Philly. I said my biggest issues with Embiid was immaturity and his constant flopping. He's worked on the immaturity issues. 

This isn't just the 76ers with Embiid/Harden but a league wide issue. Id say the flopping worse in the NBA then it is in soccer these days and makes the games almost unwatchable at times. 

 
ShamrockPride said:
Simmons is allegedly getting close to a return, won't play game 2. I can't imagine they bother to rush him back at all if Nets fall to 0-2.
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I don't know if this is just media talk or legit but there's already rumors going around of the Nets trading Simmons this offseason. If it's true that says a lot about Ben right there. 

 
Alex P Keaton said:
Sorry - objectively?  Or just your opinion?  You wrote both.  Just trying to be clear on which it is.
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Objectively the stats show that Trae had better elements to his season.  He scored more, he scored more efficiently, had more assists, and played more games for his team.  The opinion part comes from how much value people choose to place on how many games their team has won (which involves quality of teammates), if some choose not to value games missed as much as I do..etc. The nature of a lot of these awards is that the stats might say something —but at the end of the day—how much people “value” each stat comes down to opinion.The MVP of the league is not always who has the statistically best season. Would you agree with that statement?

 
Look at the Pels taking advantage of an injury and stealing home court. Even for an 8 seed that's a tall task.

With Booker hobbled (or worse, hamstrings are obnoxious), Pels should think about unleashing Zion.

 
identikit said:
How many times are the Suns going to get burned deep?
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Time after time. :lol:  

They'd bring their 5 up for it and Ingram/McCollom would burn (usually Ayton) for sagging under it. Suns gonna have to have someone step up if Booker's out. Probably going to have to be some combo of Paul/Bridges/Cam Johnson. Maybe Ayton will decide to act like he wants to be out there with some effort and be aggressive. Was terrible on both ends tonight.

Right now the Pellies have the 2 best scorers with Booker's injury. Ingram is so fun to watch offensively. So effortless in everything he does.

 
ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?!! 

20-something lead changes! What a game! Of course Booker went down but we were managing fine with him in there since we were actually hitting shots! Chris Paul playing like a mere mortal helped some too.  :lol:  

Great adjustments by Coach Green over the last game. JV was hitting a lot of the chip-ins he was missing last game.

CP3 waving off Alvarado's sneaky defense was funny. 

Also does anyone in the NBA have a more punchable looking face than Deandre Ayton? Youngest looking 70 year old in the league today!

Can't wait for Friday's game in The Blender!

 
Craig_MiamiFL said:
Time after time. :lol:  

They'd bring their 5 up for it and Ingram/McCollom would burn (usually Ayton) for sagging under it. Suns gonna have to have someone step up if Booker's out. Probably going to have to be some combo of Paul/Bridges/Cam Johnson. Maybe Ayton will decide to act like he wants to be out there with some effort and be aggressive. Was terrible on both ends tonight.

Right now the Pellies have the 2 best scorers with Booker's injury. Ingram is so fun to watch offensively. So effortless in everything he does.
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I've been the biggest B.I. critic over the last couple of years. Great scorer but he didn't have much clutch-ness. I 100% believe that Willie Green has instilled that confidence in him now. Last year, he'd score 30 but he'd brick 4 shots in the last 2 minutes of a one-score game. I literally lost count of how many times that happened.  I bet it was a dozen at least. It was frustrating to say the least.

Larry Nance says he tells B.I. every game that he's the best player on the court. I'm not willing to go quite that far, but he has definitely improved since he got to Nola and has improved this year under Willie Green for sure. 

 
Nathan R. Jessep said:
I've been the biggest B.I. critic over the last couple of years. Great scorer but he didn't have much clutch-ness. I 100% believe that Willie Green has instilled that confidence in him now. Last year, he'd score 30 but he'd brick 4 shots in the last 2 minutes of a one-score game. I literally lost count of how many times that happened.  I bet it was a dozen at least. It was frustrating to say the least.

Larry Nance says he tells B.I. every game that he's the best player on the court. I'm not willing to go quite that far, but he has definitely improved since he got to Nola and has improved this year under Willie Green for sure. 
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Interesting.  I don't think I watched a single Pels game this year.  I always saw Ingram as this stick thin, weak shooter.  Sure he can get you some buckets, but he's not going to effect the game a great deal either way.

Love it when guys improve from year to year and I believe it is the tell tale sign of a good coach vs a bad one (or ineffective one anyway).

 
Jimmy Butler, Ingram, CJ all tearing it up.  Man -- Harden needs to find himself quick or it will just continue to be "what if" in Philly with what could have been different with Simmons being traded instead of Butler leaving or giving up less for CJ or Ingram instead of depleting the roster for Harden.

 
TripItUp said:
gruecd said:
Joke.  He's not even as good as Jrue.
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totally agree, not as good as Bridges either.

the voting for these awards is atrocious and frankly embarrassing.
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Pretty much every metric available has Smart as a better defender than either Bridges or Jrue. Couple that with Smart being the "leader" of the best defense in the NBA, and well, there you go. I would have gone with Gobert or Jackson Jr or Bam if I had a vote though

 
Frostillicus said:
I love Herb Jones. 
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Dude is SO good on defense! We literally have a highlight reel of all the outstanding defensive plays he has made this season. His court awareness is insane, especially for a rookie. And he's on the smaller side frame-wise but he's not afraid to go to the rack with bad intentions.  He will win a DPOY award or two in his career. Mark it down. 

 
the moops said:
Pretty much every metric available has Smart as a better defender than either Bridges or Jrue. Couple that with Smart being the "leader" of the best defense in the NBA, and well, there you go. I would have gone with Gobert or Jackson Jr or Bam if I had a vote though
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best evidence of this is that both the Jays now do the thing Smart stole from watching pass coverage in football, i'm guessing - watching  for pass-anticipation in the eyes of the guys theyre sealing off and sticking a hand in that path for steals

 
wikkidpissah said:
best evidence of this is that both the Jays now do the thing Smart stole from watching pass coverage in football, i'm guessing - watching  for pass-anticipation in the eyes of the guys theyre sealing off and sticking a hand in that path for steals
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Heat homer.  Bam got robbed on DPOY.  He is basically the engine that makes that D run.  I do know I am seeing that with homer eyes however.

 
the moops said:
Pretty much every metric available has Smart as a better defender than either Bridges or Jrue. Couple that with Smart being the "leader" of the best defense in the NBA, and well, there you go. I would have gone with Gobert or Jackson Jr or Bam if I had a vote though
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They have the exact same defensive rating with him off the court as on

 
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Gatorman said:
Heat homer.  Bam got robbed on DPOY.  He is basically the engine that makes that D run.  I do know I am seeing that with homer eyes however.
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i dont care who wins awards, but i'm with you on the Bam train.

just a coupla months ago in this thread, i got heat when we were wondering who would go after the obvious top 7 (Anteaternintendo, Joker, Durant, Embiid, LeBron, Doncic - although someone grabbed Ja before Luka) and i announced Bam as my #8, just ahead of Jimmy Buckets. Bam didnt go til 28th. i'm guessing them folks will be a LOT closer to 8 than 28 before this season is out.

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
Jimmy Butler, Ingram, CJ all tearing it up.  Man -- Harden needs to find himself quick or it will just continue to be "what if" in Philly with what could have been different with Simmons being traded instead of Butler leaving or giving up less for CJ or Ingram instead of depleting the roster for Harden.
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That ship sailed. When Jimmy wanted to stay if we got rid of Ben and the coach, they should have both been gone the next day. We're making up for lost time now. 

 
IMO this Halberstroh retweet actually hints at an interesting math problem if you're a gambler/dork like myself.

The tweet is that the Hawks have not covered the spread in a loss this season- they have lost 41 games and failed to cover the spread every single time time. Everyone seems amazed, and at least one person thought it was pretty clear evidence that they tend to give up on games.

But it doesn't seem that weird to me. First, every team is obviously going to fail to cover the spread if they were favored and lose. So that eliminates 19 of the Hawks' losses, leaving only 22 instances in which they lost and failed to cover the spread.

Of those 22, you would assume a good number of them are narrow spreads, where it is unlikely that a team could lose and still cover. And you'd think the Hawks would especially have a lot of these, as a league-average sorta team. There are going to be very few instances in which the team is favored by more than 4 or 5 points over them- probably only road games at 10 or so opponents- and very few if any home games where that's the case absent injuries. So there really aren't a lot of opportunities to lose + cover for a team like Atlanta. Any loss/cover combo would be an unlikely surprise, fitting in a fairly narrow scoring margin.

 
the moops said:
Pretty much every metric available has Smart as a better defender than either Bridges or Jrue. Couple that with Smart being the "leader" of the best defense in the NBA, and well, there you go. 
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But I would venture to guess that 90% of GM's rate Jru higher defensively...the defensive "metrics" are spotty at best.

Do you believe Smart is a better defender than Jrue?

 
TripItUp said:
But I would venture to guess that 90% of GM's rate Jru higher defensively...the defensive "metrics" are spotty at best.

Do you believe Smart is a better defender than Jrue?
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The problem was a metrics driven analysis with Smart is he can cover all 5 positions, is very disruptive, and gets offensives off their game. Is there a way to quantify that? He draws charges, forces turnovers, gets deflections, and gets teams out of rhythm to have to bring the ball back out and reset their offense. He also makes big plays when it matters most.

He's been like that since he came in the league. Was he better this year than other years? Maybe a smidge. Essentially, the voters gave him credit for changing the culture in Boston to get everyone to play defense.

Personally, I don't think Smart is even the best defensive player on the Celtics (let alone the entire league). He ranked fourth on the team in defensive rating and defensive win shares (and barely beat out Jaylen Brown). Rob Williams completely changed how teams play and IMO was the one that reshaped the defense (and ranked #1 in the league in defensive rating). Al Horford got a couple of DPOY votes. Tatum led the league in defensive win shares. It was a collective effort.

I've watched plenty of games with Smart over the years. IMO, his defensive play was about the same as his first 6 seasons (he wasn't as good last year). The rest of the starters are the ones that really picked things up. I think Smart won the award as being the most notable defensive player of an ensemble cast.

 
Anarchy99 said:
The rest of the starters are the ones that really picked things up. I think Smart won the award as being the most notable defensive player of an ensemble cast.
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could  not agree more, which wouldn't be my definition of DPOY.

Jrue, Bam and several others would have got my vote before Smart.

 
Nathan R. Jessep said:
I've been the biggest B.I. critic over the last couple of years. Great scorer but he didn't have much clutch-ness. I 100% believe that Willie Green has instilled that confidence in him now. Last year, he'd score 30 but he'd brick 4 shots in the last 2 minutes of a one-score game. I literally lost count of how many times that happened.  I bet it was a dozen at least. It was frustrating to say the least.

Larry Nance says he tells B.I. every game that he's the best player on the court. I'm not willing to go quite that far, but he has definitely improved since he got to Nola and has improved this year under Willie Green for sure. 
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I only caught the 4th quarter of G2 but man was that fun to watch.   Not sure anyone can stop him when he's hitting those jumpers.  So effortless.  

 
Raptors came to play and less calls so far. As expected. Sixers just need to settle down and stop beating themselves. 8 turnovers that quarter. 

 
Insein said:
That ship sailed. When Jimmy wanted to stay if we got rid of Ben and the coach, they should have both been gone the next day. We're making up for lost time now. 
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 i think those rumors were mostly Spike Eskin driven. LIstening to JJ Reddick and some others from the team, Jimmy always wanted to go to Miami. there wasn't much going to change that, luckily he didn't talk Embiid into trying to get his way there too

 
ShamrockPride said:
Keep clanking 3s Celtics, that'll learn em!

Hate when they start doing this...
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i really couldn't be more anti-Celtics, but the games Al Horford is putting up in these playoffs is really impressive. Hard to figure out if it was more Horford or something with the Celtics, but he has been a key piece to that team all year, and is really the reason why they are in this game at all in game 2. 

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
Jimmy Butler, Ingram, CJ all tearing it up.  Man -- Harden needs to find himself quick or it will just continue to be "what if" in Philly with what could have been different with Simmons being traded instead of Butler leaving or giving up less for CJ or Ingram instead of depleting the roster for Harden.
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All of this wouldn't be an issue if they had just drafted Ingram in the first place 

 
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