2021 Buffalo Bills - Same as it ever was*** (1 Viewer)

[ConnSKINS26]

In not surprising news, Bills players are already tweeting their excitement. Gilmore, Watkins and Wood have all expressed their happiness with the hire.

as opposed to what?

Do you ever consider leaving a thread for good if no one responds to you?

 

[Steve Tasker]

I'm pleased with the hire. Honestly, for all of the names being tossed around, Ryan was probably my favorite candidate other than Josh McDaniels. Ryan's overall record was middling with the Jets, but he took some teams deep into the playoffs that had no business doing so. I've always liked his fire, his personality, and he strikes me as being "real", as opposed to past Bills coaches who've worn out the tired cliches of the sport in the last 15 years.

I know everyone is questioning why they've hired a defensive coach, given that Schwartz is still on staff, but I don't put a ton of stock in that. The head coach is responsible for strategy, but ultimately the coordinators and position coaches are the ones who truly develop the players on an individual basis, IMO. The Bills had no QB coach when Manuel was a rookie - that was a mistake. They haven't had a pedigreed Offensive Coordinator in years. Nate Hackett was a Marrone disciple and Syracuse holdover who has been a bust so far. Curtis Modkins was a Gailey disciple who followed him for his entire career, and Gailey called the plays. Alex Van Pelt was in over his head as the last-minute interim OC after Turk Schonert was fired. Turk Schonert himself has never been an OC either before or after his one-year stint with the Bills (though he was a head coach in the UFL). You have to go back to Steve Fairchild in 2006-2007 to find an OC with extensive OC experience at either the NFL or D-1 level (10 seasons - 3 at New Mexico, 4 at Colorado State, and 3 with the St. Louis Rams). The head coaches bear the brunt of the criticism, and sometimes rightfully so, but I think the appointment of assistants is just so crucial. The Bills have had hilariously poor offensive coaching in the past few years, not to mention their lack of offensive talent. It's time to bring in someone who has a pedigree and a proven record of winning at either the NFL or major college level and has shown the ability to call plays. I would've liked someone with an offensive mindset at the head coaching position, yes, but I'm not gonna write Rex off entirely because he's a defensive coach and this team is in desperate need of offensive help that he can't provide.

Ultimately, I think Rex's career in Buffalo will have the same fate as any other incoming coach. This team has no quarterback. The defense will be fine. Can they either (1) develop EJ Manuel or (2) get a viable starting QB somewhere else, trade, FA, draft and make a run at it while the defense is still great? Can Rex put the right assistants in place to make it happen, and can Whaley and the front office make the right moves? Maybe they can, maybe they can't, but I have to imagine this was discussed in the interview process.

 

[OC Zed]

Well now the speculation begins of a reunion of Rex and Sanchez. Also hearing some idle banter about possibly having CB Darrell Revis leaving New England to reunite with Rex.

The chatter of Sanchez seems possible if Rex has any juice with the Buffalo front office.

Oh god.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I'm pleased with the hire. Honestly, for all of the names being tossed around, Ryan was probably my favorite candidate other than Josh McDaniels. Ryan's overall record was middling with the Jets, but he took some teams deep into the playoffs that had no business doing so. I've always liked his fire, his personality, and he strikes me as being "real", as opposed to past Bills coaches who've worn out the tired cliches of the sport in the last 15 years.

I know everyone is questioning why they've hired a defensive coach, given that Schwartz is still on staff, but I don't put a ton of stock in that. The head coach is responsible for strategy, but ultimately the coordinators and position coaches are the ones who truly develop the players on an individual basis, IMO. The Bills had no QB coach when Manuel was a rookie - that was a mistake. They haven't had a pedigreed Offensive Coordinator in years. Nate Hackett was a Marrone disciple and Syracuse holdover who has been a bust so far. Curtis Modkins was a Gailey disciple who followed him for his entire career, and Gailey called the plays. Alex Van Pelt was in over his head as the last-minute interim OC after Turk Schonert was fired. Turk Schonert himself has never been an OC either before or after his one-year stint with the Bills (though he was a head coach in the UFL). You have to go back to Steve Fairchild in 2006-2007 to find an OC with extensive OC experience at either the NFL or D-1 level (10 seasons - 3 at New Mexico, 4 at Colorado State, and 3 with the St. Louis Rams). The head coaches bear the brunt of the criticism, and sometimes rightfully so, but I think the appointment of assistants is just so crucial. The Bills have had hilariously poor offensive coaching in the past few years, not to mention their lack of offensive talent. It's time to bring in someone who has a pedigree and a proven record of winning at either the NFL or major college level and has shown the ability to call plays. I would've liked someone with an offensive mindset at the head coaching position, yes, but I'm not gonna write Rex off entirely because he's a defensive coach and this team is in desperate need of offensive help that he can't provide.

Ultimately, I think Rex's career in Buffalo will have the same fate as any other incoming coach. This team has no quarterback. The defense will be fine. Can they either (1) develop EJ Manuel or (2) get a viable starting QB somewhere else, trade, FA, draft and make a run at it while the defense is still great? Can Rex put the right assistants in place to make it happen, and can Whaley and the front office make the right moves? Maybe they can, maybe they can't, but I have to imagine this was discussed in the interview process.

It's pretty short-sighted to worry about whether you're hiring an "offensive coach" or "defensive coach." Your goal in hiring a head coach should be to snag somebody who will be here for the next 10 years, not just next year. If Whaley manages the roster well and we make good hires at the assistant level, the offense will sort itself out regardless of the HC.

 

[OC Zed]

Greg Roman is going to be the offensive coordinator? His offenses at Stafford and San Francisco were known for being ultra conservative and his young QB got worse each season. Rex reaffirming his reputation as not knowing what do the other side of the ball. Awesome.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I like the Ryan hire. Buf has an outstanding D but he will elevate it to SB quality.

the defense is already great, any upgrades if any will be marginal at best. It isn't broke, so why fix it? Buffalo's offense is broken and Rex has shown he cannot lead an effective offense.Don't see how this hire makes them better.

I never said it was broken.

then how will this make Buffalo better?

If you genuinely don't see how some of us view Rex as an overall upgrade over Doug Marrone, I don't know what to tell you. Two weeks ago we had an overrated college coach running our team. Today we have a guy who isn't in the same class as Belichick but is probably one of the top half-dozen or so guys in the league.

I know you're too busy watching your team get trucked by Pittsburgh, Baltimore, and Cincinnati (!) to follow the AFC east closely, but under Ryan the Jets have consistently squeezed out an extra win or two seemingly every year relative to what you'd expect from looking at their roster. The guy got to the AFC championship game twice with teams that had no business being in the playoffs, let alone contending for the super bowl. Hell, this year they overachieved by winning four games.

 

[Fariq]

I'm pleased with the hire. Honestly, for all of the names being tossed around, Ryan was probably my favorite candidate other than Josh McDaniels. Ryan's overall record was middling with the Jets, but he took some teams deep into the playoffs that had no business doing so.

I completely disagree with you. The 2009 and 2010 Jets teams had high quality talent all over the roster. Eric Mangini had put together a legitimately good team and then Ryan and Tannenbaum added a few more good pieces in 2009 and 2010. Those teams absolutely had business being in the playoffs.

 

[MAC_32]

I like the Ryan hire. Buf has an outstanding D but he will elevate it to SB quality.

the defense is already great, any upgrades if any will be marginal at best. It isn't broke, so why fix it? Buffalo's offense is broken and Rex has shown he cannot lead an effective offense.Don't see how this hire makes them better.

I never said it was broken.

then how will this make Buffalo better?I don't see it. The defense is near maximum efficiency already. How does Rex positively impact that? The offense needs fixed if this team is going to be any good and...well, his history speaks for itself in that regard.

Did you even read the post you quoted? Not sure how to explain it better.

you like the Rex hire, I'm trying to understand why.

 

[MAC_32]

I like the Ryan hire. Buf has an outstanding D but he will elevate it to SB quality.

the defense is already great, any upgrades if any will be marginal at best. It isn't broke, so why fix it? Buffalo's offense is broken and Rex has shown he cannot lead an effective offense.Don't see how this hire makes them better.

I never said it was broken.

then how will this make Buffalo better?I don't see it. The defense is near maximum efficiency already. How does Rex positively impact that? The offense needs fixed if this team is going to be any good and...well, his history speaks for itself in that regard.

Well, Rex made the AFC Championship game with Sanchez as a rookie and as a 2nd year player. Offensive genius Chip Kelly didn't even make the playoffs in a weak NFC with Sanchez as his veteran QB.

he gonna bring Sanchez with him to Buffalo?

 

[Steve Tasker]

I'm pleased with the hire. Honestly, for all of the names being tossed around, Ryan was probably my favorite candidate other than Josh McDaniels. Ryan's overall record was middling with the Jets, but he took some teams deep into the playoffs that had no business doing so.

I completely disagree with you. The 2009 and 2010 Jets teams had high quality talent all over the roster. Eric Mangini had put together a legitimately good team and then Ryan and Tannenbaum added a few more good pieces in 2009 and 2010. Those teams absolutely had business being in the playoffs.

They certainly had playoff talent, but they had rookie and 2nd-year Mark Sanchez and went to back-to-back AFC Championships. That's impressive to me. They're the first team in NFL history to win back-to-back road playoff games in 2 straight seasons, and they did it with a QB who's not much better than EJ Manuel. That's what I was really getting at.

 

[MAC_32]

I like the Ryan hire. Buf has an outstanding D but he will elevate it to SB quality.

the defense is already great, any upgrades if any will be marginal at best. It isn't broke, so why fix it? Buffalo's offense is broken and Rex has shown he cannot lead an effective offense.Don't see how this hire makes them better.

I never said it was broken.

then how will this make Buffalo better?

If you genuinely don't see how some of us view Rex as an overall upgrade over Doug Marrone, I don't know what to tell you. Two weeks ago we had an overrated college coach running our team. Today we have a guy who isn't in the same class as Belichick but is probably one of the top half-dozen or so guys in the league.

I know you're too busy watching your team get trucked by Pittsburgh, Baltimore, and Cincinnati (!) to follow the AFC east closely, but under Ryan the Jets have consistently squeezed out an extra win or two seemingly every year relative to what you'd expect from looking at their roster. The guy got to the AFC championship game twice with teams that had no business being in the playoffs, let alone contending for the super bowl. Hell, this year they overachieved by winning four games.

He is certainly an upgrade to Marrone, but if you think this gets you over the hump then I think you're crazy. Buffalo's current deficiency is what has been plaguing Rex his entire head coaching career.

 

[Gandalf]

I like the Ryan hire. Buf has an outstanding D but he will elevate it to SB quality.

the defense is already great, any upgrades if any will be marginal at best. It isn't broke, so why fix it? Buffalo's offense is broken and Rex has shown he cannot lead an effective offense.Don't see how this hire makes them better.

I never said it was broken.

then how will this make Buffalo better?I don't see it. The defense is near maximum efficiency already. How does Rex positively impact that? The offense needs fixed if this team is going to be any good and...well, his history speaks for itself in that regard.

At the very least they get Kiko Alonzo back so they could be even better

 

[GroveDiesel]

Greg Roman is going to be the offensive coordinator? His offenses at Stafford and San Francisco were known for being ultra conservative and his young QB got worse each season. Rex reaffirming his reputation as not knowing what do the other side of the ball. Awesome.

Kaepernick was looked at as a major project that would take years to ever be starter material. Roman made him into a guy that got a huge contract in about a year and a half. Yeah, the polish is off the apple a bit there now, but for all the talk of how bad Kaepernick was, his stats really aren't all that terrible. They're not great, but they're not terrible.

Andrew Luck's numbers got better both years under Roman.

And Alex Smith went from being a gigantic bust to an actual NFL QB under Roman.

 

[Boston]

Interesting hire...I think Buffalo's D is going to be real nasty...Rex is one of the top minds in the game on that side of the ball and now has some nice pieces to work with...the question is on the other side of the ball (he is Buddy's son)...Buffalo doesn't have a legit QB or a first round pick so they are going to have to figure something out unless they feel Manual can be revitalized which on the surface doesn't seem to be up Rex's alley...the NFL is a QB's league and what Rex and company do with that position will ultimately decide how successful he will be...overall I really thought it would do Rex a lot of good to take a year off and see the game from another angle...that being said there was no doubt he was going to get offers the second the Jets let him go...IMO Rex's future comes down to being a good Coach on both sides of the ball...if he figures out the offensive side he will take the next step and be that much more of an asset to the Bills...I don't blame Bills fans for being excited but if the plan is to bring in a QB like Sanchez expectations should be tempered because that's only going to take you so far...

 

[humpback]

I like the Ryan hire. Buf has an outstanding D but he will elevate it to SB quality.

the defense is already great, any upgrades if any will be marginal at best. It isn't broke, so why fix it? Buffalo's offense is broken and Rex has shown he cannot lead an effective offense.Don't see how this hire makes them better.

I never said it was broken.

then how will this make Buffalo better?

If you genuinely don't see how some of us view Rex as an overall upgrade over Doug Marrone, I don't know what to tell you. Two weeks ago we had an overrated college coach running our team. Today we have a guy who isn't in the same class as Belichick but is probably one of the top half-dozen or so guys in the league.

I know you're too busy watching your team get trucked by Pittsburgh, Baltimore, and Cincinnati (!) to follow the AFC east closely, but under Ryan the Jets have consistently squeezed out an extra win or two seemingly every year relative to what you'd expect from looking at their roster. The guy got to the AFC championship game twice with teams that had no business being in the playoffs, let alone contending for the super bowl. Hell, this year they overachieved by winning four games.

Oh come on...

 

[ScottNorwood]

I'd love to see the Bills as the team for HBOs Hard Knocks this year. There's no lack of storylines.

 

[Mr. Peterson]

I'd love to see the Bills as the team for HBOs Hard Knocks this year. There's no lack of storylines.

I feel like Eric Wood and Kyle Williams would be great for that show. Rex would probably try to steal all the camera time though.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

What do the homers think of these coaching moves as it relates to the running game/fantasy impact on Spiller/Jackson/B Brown?

I assume Spiller and Jackson are gone. Could this be a good thing from Brown?...or will they just bring in a new rb?

Jackson not going anywhere. Why would he be gone?

 

[steelerfan1]

What do the homers think of these coaching moves as it relates to the running game/fantasy impact on Spiller/Jackson/B Brown?

I assume Spiller and Jackson are gone. Could this be a good thing from Brown?...or will they just bring in a new rb?

Jackson not going anywhere. Why would he be gone?

I think a lot of people are expecting the wheels to fall off. will he be 34 coming the 2015 season. people have been saying the wheels would fall off a few years now I think, so he could just keep on going...

 

[Bills_Fan11]

Points allowed can be skewed by defensive scores by the other team, turnovers that give them a short field, etc.

Look at the two Bills/Jets game this year.

In the first, the Bill scored 43, in large part thanks to forcing six turnovers. The Bills had scoring drives of 1, -4, 9, -1 and 14 yards in that game. Hard to blame those on the defense.

In the second, the Bills scored 38, thanks to a blocked punt and a TD-scoring drive of 16 yards.

Sure, but yards allowed can be skewed by the same things, and points given up is more important than yards. Plus, what about the takeaways, sacks, 3rd down and red zone efficiency, etc.?

If you dig a little deeper, the Jets only had 1 more giveaway than the Bills last year on offense, and they had more time of possession, meaning their defense was on the field less often.

Obviously personnel comes into play, but all things considered the Jets haven't been a good defense for the last 4 years.

All things considered you're wrong. Why are we pretending like stuff like Football Outsiders doesn't exist in 2015? They parse out all the "skewing" you're arguing about. Their D rankings in six years were 1st, 5th, 2nd, 9th, 12th, 21st. And they never even had a real pass-rusher.

 

[Bills_Fan11]

It's pretty short-sighted to worry about whether you're hiring an "offensive coach" or "defensive coach." Your goal in hiring a head coach should be to snag somebody who will be here for the next 10 years, not just next year.

This x1,000. Why everyone acts like hiring a coach is a 1yr rental is pretty ridiculous.

I must be blind to all these teams with offensive guru HC's fielding good offenses with lousy QBs. Chip Kelly seems to be the only one.

The offense will probably suck until they find a QB. If they hired an offensive coach, the offense would probably suck until they find a QB.

I'm not real excited about Greg Roman though. Am I missing something or did their offense stink with our former WR1 as their 4th option?

 

[flysack]

It's pretty short-sighted to worry about whether you're hiring an "offensive coach" or "defensive coach." Your goal in hiring a head coach should be to snag somebody who will be here for the next 10 years, not just next year.

This x1,000. Why everyone acts like hiring a coach is a 1yr rental is pretty ridiculous.

I must be blind to all these teams with offensive guru HC's fielding good offenses with lousy QBs. Chip Kelly seems to be the only one.

The offense will probably suck until they find a QB. If they hired an offensive coach, the offense would probably suck until they find a QB.

I'm not real excited about Greg Roman though. Am I missing something or did their offense stink with our former WR1 as their 4th option?

I think most believe the entire 49ers organization was a corrosive wreck this season, and it started at the very top, not with the coaches. Most think 2014 was a wash year for San Fran. Their coaches should be judged for previous work (like the Superbowl run, the playoff success, the nuturing of two good young QBs, etc.). After all, the 49ers fired of one of the best younger coaches in the league, who immediately became the highest paid coach in college history.

 

[flysack]

What do the homers think of these coaching moves as it relates to the running game/fantasy impact on Spiller/Jackson/B Brown?

I assume Spiller and Jackson are gone. Could this be a good thing from Brown?...or will they just bring in a new rb?

Jackson not going anywhere. Why would he be gone?

I think a lot of people are expecting the wheels to fall off. will he be 34 coming the 2015 season. people have been saying the wheels would fall off a few years now I think, so he could just keep on going...

Agree with this. I love Fred and am glad he's still under contract, but you have to plan for 2015 to be the year he's playing a complimentary role in the backfield, while still being an immense leader in the locker room.

I would love it if Rex somehow got Chris Ivory to follow him over to Buffalo. I don't know what his contract is like with the Jets, but he'd be the Marshawn Lynch of a new hard-nosed physical team identity. The guy is about the only thing the Jets had on offense last season. He's criminally underrated.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Love it. Especially with him keeping Schwartz. Add Greg Roman and things are looking good IMO.

He was the best HC candidate available and the Bills reeled him in.

enjoy your circusalthough if he gets trestman that would be a good start but I dont have any clue why any team would want that clown running your show

Because he gets the most out of his players? Because he is a genius at creating a media circus that centers on him and protects his players? Because he is an innovator that is willing to make any changes he needs to make to win? Because he has had tremendous success against the Patriots? Because he's actually mellowed out some over the last 2 years?

It's a great hire for this team. Rex will have that defense playing even better and Buffalo should be relying heavy on their run game anyway with their great defense and poor late season weather.

Tom Brady can't be happy about this hire.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I like Rex, although now it's going to be extremely important that they bring in someone good to handle the offense.

That being said, is anyone else not overly impressed with the Jets defense recently? He has a great reputation, but they haven't been good for a long time.

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Pryor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

We need to get Roman a Carlos Hyde. Brown and Spiller are similar, Freddie is fantastic but not much is in the tank. There will be a lot of good rb's in this draft. One will probably still be available in the later rounds.

Mark Ingram would be a good signing for the team.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

I like Rex, although now it's going to be extremely important that they bring in someone good to handle the offense.

That being said, is anyone else not overly impressed with the Jets defense recently? He has a great reputation, but they haven't been good for a long time.

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Taylor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

Interesting. Not wanting to hijack this into a Jets thread but what happened with your 1st round pick S Calvin Pace? Their was such a buzz on him at the draft and in preseason but then...

Also this upcoming draft is supposed to be RB rich in talent and deep at the position.

But don't forget and Bills GM Doug Waley traded away last year's #4 pick for RB Bryce Brown.

He might be under some heat for trading away his 1st and 4th round picks this year to move-up for WR Sammy Watkins so I don't know if he'd want to make a big splash in free agency on a RB.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I like Rex, although now it's going to be extremely important that they bring in someone good to handle the offense.

That being said, is anyone else not overly impressed with the Jets defense recently? He has a great reputation, but they haven't been good for a long time.

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Taylor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

Interesting. Not wanting to hijack this into a Jets thread but what happened with your 1st round pick S Calvin Pace? Their was such a buzz on him at the draft and in preseason but then...

Sorry I wrote "Taylor" instead of "Pryor". He's a big safety that is more of a banger/run stopper and was misused as a cover guy. He did not have a great rookie season.

 

[humpback]

Points allowed can be skewed by defensive scores by the other team, turnovers that give them a short field, etc.

Look at the two Bills/Jets game this year.

In the first, the Bill scored 43, in large part thanks to forcing six turnovers. The Bills had scoring drives of 1, -4, 9, -1 and 14 yards in that game. Hard to blame those on the defense.

In the second, the Bills scored 38, thanks to a blocked punt and a TD-scoring drive of 16 yards.

Sure, but yards allowed can be skewed by the same things, and points given up is more important than yards. Plus, what about the takeaways, sacks, 3rd down and red zone efficiency, etc.?

If you dig a little deeper, the Jets only had 1 more giveaway than the Bills last year on offense, and they had more time of possession, meaning their defense was on the field less often.

Obviously personnel comes into play, but all things considered the Jets haven't been a good defense for the last 4 years.

All things considered you're wrong. Why are we pretending like stuff like Football Outsiders doesn't exist in 2015? They parse out all the "skewing" you're arguing about. Their D rankings in six years were 1st, 5th, 2nd, 9th, 12th, 21st. And they never even had a real pass-rusher.

I like DVOA, but it isn't perfect either. However, even after their "adjustments", they've been just an okay defense the last 3 years.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Maybe after Manziel gets Pettine fired this year, he can come back to coach the Bills defense.

I like both hires. Just not sure exactly what happens on defense regarding schemes and personnel fits. I think they are better suited to the 4-3 right now.

 

[humpback]

I like Rex, although now it's going to be extremely important that they bring in someone good to handle the offense.

That being said, is anyone else not overly impressed with the Jets defense recently? He has a great reputation, but they haven't been good for a long time.

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Pryor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

Didn't Rex have a pretty big say in the draft and personnel decisions?

Yes, Geno sucked, but other teams had bad situations too- I think the Rams had more than twice as many DST TDs scored against them as the Jets, for example. They were just average in giveaways. They were 25th in average starting field position against, which isn't good, but it isn't like they were so much worse off than everyone else there. Other things like 3rd down and red zone percentages, takeaways, etc. is much more about the defense than the offense, and the Jets were very poor in those metrics.

I'm not saying that Rex is a bad defensive coach by any stretch, and I know there are a lot of factors at play, but I don't see how anyone can think that the Jets defense was very good last year.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I like Rex, although now it's going to be extremely important that they bring in someone good to handle the offense.

That being said, is anyone else not overly impressed with the Jets defense recently? He has a great reputation, but they haven't been good for a long time.

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Pryor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

Didn't Rex have a pretty big say in the draft and personnel decisions?

I'm not saying that Rex is a bad defensive coach by any stretch, and I know there are a lot of factors at play, but I don't see how anyone can think that the Jets defense was very good last year.

No (he openly petitioned for more help at CB) and they were very good given the circumstances that I presented to you. If you want to ignore them or point a few other teams that turned the ball over more than them, I can't help you.

Maybe ask Tom Brady if the Jets' defense wasn't any good?

 

[Bills_Fan11]

Points allowed can be skewed by defensive scores by the other team, turnovers that give them a short field, etc.

Look at the two Bills/Jets game this year.

In the first, the Bill scored 43, in large part thanks to forcing six turnovers. The Bills had scoring drives of 1, -4, 9, -1 and 14 yards in that game. Hard to blame those on the defense.

In the second, the Bills scored 38, thanks to a blocked punt and a TD-scoring drive of 16 yards.

Sure, but yards allowed can be skewed by the same things, and points given up is more important than yards. Plus, what about the takeaways, sacks, 3rd down and red zone efficiency, etc.?

If you dig a little deeper, the Jets only had 1 more giveaway than the Bills last year on offense, and they had more time of possession, meaning their defense was on the field less often.

Obviously personnel comes into play, but all things considered the Jets haven't been a good defense for the last 4 years.

All things considered you're wrong. Why are we pretending like stuff like Football Outsiders doesn't exist in 2015? They parse out all the "skewing" you're arguing about. Their D rankings in six years were 1st, 5th, 2nd, 9th, 12th, 21st. And they never even had a real pass-rusher.

I like DVOA, but it isn't perfect either. However, even after their "adjustments", they've been just an okay defense the last 3 years.

"Perfect"...idk, close enough. Feel free to suggest a ranking system that's better.

It's certainly preferable to bias-prone "eye tests" from some random who doesn't watch all 32 teams.

 

[Bills_Fan11]

It's pretty short-sighted to worry about whether you're hiring an "offensive coach" or "defensive coach." Your goal in hiring a head coach should be to snag somebody who will be here for the next 10 years, not just next year.

This x1,000. Why everyone acts like hiring a coach is a 1yr rental is pretty ridiculous.

I must be blind to all these teams with offensive guru HC's fielding good offenses with lousy QBs. Chip Kelly seems to be the only one.

The offense will probably suck until they find a QB. If they hired an offensive coach, the offense would probably suck until they find a QB.

I'm not real excited about Greg Roman though. Am I missing something or did their offense stink with our former WR1 as their 4th option?

I think most believe the entire 49ers organization was a corrosive wreck this season, and it started at the very top, not with the coaches. Most think 2014 was a wash year for San Fran. Their coaches should be judged for previous work (like the Superbowl run, the playoff success, the nuturing of two good young QBs, etc.). After all, the 49ers fired of one of the best younger coaches in the league, who immediately became the highest paid coach in college history.

Understood, but it's not like their defense saw the writing on the wall and just said "F--- it, this is a lost year". Their problems were all on offense, even with the personnel losses on D.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Well now the speculation begins of a reunion of Rex and Sanchez. Also hearing some idle banter about possibly having CB Darrell Revis leaving New England to reunite with Rex.

The chatter of Sanchez seems possible if Rex has any juice with the Buffalo front office.

Oh god.

Sanchez as a stop gap until the next year or two when they can get a QB isn't the worst thing in the world. Seriously look at the QBs that are out there on the market. Roman could be a good development for Manuel though based on what they achieved with Kaepernick.

Apparently Arthur Blank's mother passed away at 99 earlier in the week - so it's likely that slowed down their coaching search - and that Rex didn't want to wait when he had an offer in hand. I find it interesting that in other places I've seen people saying this was a bad decision by Rex that he should have waited but clearly the Atlanta job wasn't a guarantee and with the playoffs continuing there are more coaching candidates out there able to be interviewed. Coming off a 4-12 season you take that big contract offer that's in front of you.

I find it humorous that people are saying Rex is going to the "same" situation - that's a superficial comparison as the talent on the Bills is much better than the Jets. QB is a big worry (and Rex is not exactly known for his prowess with QBs) but he's got stuff to work with.

If nothing else this has made you guys more interesting

-QG

 

[QuizGuy66]

Rex will also benefit from having a GM who will try to give him talent rather than submarine him so he could get his own guy in there.

-QG

 

[QuizGuy66]

As for RBs. RBs can always be had.

-QG

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I find it humorous that people are saying Rex is going to the "same" situation - that's a superficial comparison as the talent on the Bills is much better than the Jets. QB is a big worry (and Rex is not exactly known for his prowess with QBs) but he's got stuff to work with.

I take this as just the latest installment of the standard narrative that "Those poor Bills just can't do anything right." (The continued #####ing about the Watkins trade is another example). That's the narrative that takes hold when your team is in the wilderness year after year. A few winning season will make all sorts of decisions look much smarter.

Edit: Agreed on RBs. They're easily acquirable and that position doesn't have me concerned at all despite some impending turnover.

 

[humpback]

I like Rex, although now it's going to be extremely important that they bring in someone good to handle the offense.

That being said, is anyone else not overly impressed with the Jets defense recently? He has a great reputation, but they haven't been good for a long time.

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Pryor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

Didn't Rex have a pretty big say in the draft and personnel decisions?

I'm not saying that Rex is a bad defensive coach by any stretch, and I know there are a lot of factors at play, but I don't see how anyone can think that the Jets defense was very good last year.

No (he openly petitioned for more help at CB) and they were very good given the circumstances that I presented to you. If you want to ignore them or point a few other teams that turned the ball over more than them, I can't help you.

Maybe ask Tom Brady if the Jets' defense wasn't any good?

Why does everything have to be so confrontational? You brought up Geno, I just pointed out those things to show that other teams were impacted by that as well, some even more so.

To counter your silly last point with an equally silly point, maybe ask Kyle Orton if the Jets defense was any good?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Bills were Rex's 3rd choice but made him feel wanted

 

[ScottNorwood]

Roman hire is official as per Rotoworld FWIW

 

[humpback]

Points allowed can be skewed by defensive scores by the other team, turnovers that give them a short field, etc.

Look at the two Bills/Jets game this year.

In the first, the Bill scored 43, in large part thanks to forcing six turnovers. The Bills had scoring drives of 1, -4, 9, -1 and 14 yards in that game. Hard to blame those on the defense.

In the second, the Bills scored 38, thanks to a blocked punt and a TD-scoring drive of 16 yards.

Sure, but yards allowed can be skewed by the same things, and points given up is more important than yards. Plus, what about the takeaways, sacks, 3rd down and red zone efficiency, etc.?

If you dig a little deeper, the Jets only had 1 more giveaway than the Bills last year on offense, and they had more time of possession, meaning their defense was on the field less often.

Obviously personnel comes into play, but all things considered the Jets haven't been a good defense for the last 4 years.

All things considered you're wrong. Why are we pretending like stuff like Football Outsiders doesn't exist in 2015? They parse out all the "skewing" you're arguing about. Their D rankings in six years were 1st, 5th, 2nd, 9th, 12th, 21st. And they never even had a real pass-rusher.

I like DVOA, but it isn't perfect either. However, even after their "adjustments", they've been just an okay defense the last 3 years.

"Perfect"...idk, close enough. Feel free to suggest a ranking system that's better.

It's certainly preferable to bias-prone "eye tests" from some random who doesn't watch all 32 teams.

It wasn't meant to discredit DVOA (I said I like it), but there is no "perfect" measure.

That being said, on what planet is +3.6 and 21st "very good"? By their definition, it's below average.

 

[pantherclub]

Bills were Rex's 3rd choice but made him feel wanted

I cannot put my finger on it but there is something about Ryan that makes me just despise him. Maybe its his insistence to trying to come off as a mans man, or just the general way he conducts himself but there is just something off about him.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Maybe after Manziel gets Pettine fired this year, he can come back to coach the Bills defense.

I like both hires. Just not sure exactly what happens on defense regarding schemes and personnel fits. I think they are better suited to the 4-3 right now.

The distinction of 4-3 versus 3-4 doesn't really mean a whole lot in today's NFL IMO. There's tons of variations in both. It's not like in the last where if you had a 3-4 the nose tackle lined up directly over the center and that was that. Now you might have a 3-4 DT in the A gap, or further out than that even.

And despite running a 4-3 last year, Jerry Hughes actually lined up in a 2 point stance a vast majority of the time.

The real difference is that Rex's defenses typically blitz a ton while Schwartz's rarely blitz. That's a pretty big difference in philosophy

 

[Mr. Peterson]

We need to get Roman a Carlos Hyde. Brown and Spiller are similar, Freddie is fantastic but not much is in the tank. There will be a lot of good rb's in this draft. One will probably still be available in the later rounds.

Mark Ingram would be a good signing for the team.

I almost wrote down that Ingram would be a very good pick up if he wasn't too expensive, but it almost seemed like it would be too good to be true. It doesn't seem like a move the Bills FO would make.

 

[msommer]

Roman hire is official as per Rotoworld FWIW

What happened to Trestman? Did he get leprosy?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Maybe after Manziel gets Pettine fired this year, he can come back to coach the Bills defense.

I like both hires. Just not sure exactly what happens on defense regarding schemes and personnel fits. I think they are better suited to the 4-3 right now.

The distinction of 4-3 versus 3-4 doesn't really mean a whole lot in today's NFL IMO. There's tons of variations in both. It's not like in the last where if you had a 3-4 the nose tackle lined up directly over the center and that was that. Now you might have a 3-4 DT in the A gap, or further out than that even.

And despite running a 4-3 last year, Jerry Hughes actually lined up in a 2 point stance a vast majority of the time.

The real difference is that Rex's defenses typically blitz a ton while Schwartz's rarely blitz. That's a pretty big difference in philosophy

disagree.

it matters.

what do you plan to do with Preston Brown, NIgel Bradham, and Kiko Alonso in a 3-4? You can easily start all 3 in a 4-3, but I don't love any of them as a traditional 3-4 rush OLB. If they lose Hughes in free agency, that leaves a pretty big hole at one OLB spot opposite Mario Williams. Playing Mario as a 3-4 DE is a pretty bad idea too.

Guys like Kyle Williams and Marcell Dareus are also better fits in a one-gap role. I think they will be fine either way, but liked having them shooting gaps and disrupting plays in the backfield.

If you bring Schwartz back, I'm just a little worried about some conflicts of him wanting to run things one way and Rex preferring something else.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Roman hire is official as per Rotoworld FWIW

What happened to Trestman? Did he get leprosy?

terrible fit with EJ imo

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Rex was left hung out to dry by his GM - the team had no one, and I mean absolutely no one, to play cornerback - especially after Milner (who hasn't been very good anyway) was lost for the season. It got so bad the team had to move their only safety that can play in coverage, Allen, out to cornerback, leaving them with two safeties, Taylor Pryor and Landry, that were far better suited to play up close to the line in run support.

However, even as an undermanned unit, the jets defense was still very good. Don't forget how Geno Smith gave up a ton of points on pick sixes and put their defense in bad field position.

Interesting. Not wanting to hijack this into a Jets thread but what happened with your 1st round pick S Calvin Pace Pryor? Their was such a buzz on him at the draft and in preseason but then...

Sorry I wrote "Taylor" instead of "Pryor". He's a big safety that is more of a banger/run stopper and was misused as a cover guy. He did not have a great rookie season.

Well I wrote "Pace" instead of 'Pryor'. Something not all that memorable about his name.

How did he look at corner? I am interested in what happened with him because their was a pretty good buzz in the IDP community about him and I kept waiting on him hoping to pick him up but heard he got benched and then I lost track.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Bills were Rex's 3rd choice but made him feel wanted

I cannot put my finger on it but there is something about Ryan that makes me just despise him. Maybe its his insistence to trying to come off as a mans man, or just the general way he conducts himself but there is just something off about him.

He seems like an arrogant jerk. But here's the thing, he also seems completely genuine. Nobody thinks he's doing any pretending. 50% of a coach's job is getting his players to buy in and play hard. There's only a few coaches in the league that can do that and he's one of them. His players love him and go all out for him. The few that haven't were malcontents everywhere else and washed out of the league.

If players all buy in to the coach's vision and all worm hard together, it makes everything else much easier.

So while fans and media may be rolling their eyes, his players are cheering and getting pumped up. They know that he believes in them and that he has their back. And for a coach, the latter matters a lot and the former not at all.