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2023 New York Jets (10 Viewers)

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Dr. Octopus said:
I don't think the Jets are in any position to draft for "need" or "by positional value" - they need impact players - PERIOD. If Kyle Hamilton is the best player left at 4, I have no issue with them taking him. Just because Adams wasn't worth the high pick (and there's arguments to be made that he was) doesn't mean drafting Hamilton would be a mistake. 
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Put me in the camp vehemently against Hamilton at 4.  And this has absolutely zero with him to do as a player.  Drafting a non premium position player that high is just asking for trouble when you have a roster as bereft of talent as we currently are.  At 4, we want and need this guy to turn into an absolute stud - and if he does? Well, we will find ourselves in a very similar position we did with Adams - not regarding his attitude, but regarding the fact that we couldn't justify making a non premium position player the highest paid player in the league (at his position) when we have all the other holes that we did at the time/still currently do.  This may seem like a backwards line of thought, but in salary cap world of the NFL I think it needs to be highly considered.  

We're clearly trying to be San Fran East.  How did they get to the NFC Championship?  Domination on the lines.  Get that in place then you can again start spending premium picks on luxury over necessity.  We have 2 top 10 picks: there's 3-4 high end tackles, 2 seemingly elite pass rushers and an apparently generational talent at C.  C may not be a high end position, but if there's one thing our busted franchise knows, it's that our offense and overall success has usually been correlated directly to having a franchise C.  This guy is apparently head and shoulders better than any C prospect in years, and I think it's entirely justifiable to consider him at 10 (I've seen a few mocks putting him at 14 to Bal, go figure.)  I'd like our top 2 picks to be from those 7ish above players (highly unlikely for a few reasons) or snag 1 and then trade down for additional 2023 draft capital.  I'm not writing Zach off at all, but if he takes a step back this year, it won't hurt to have options for next years draft as well.

 
sheerterror said:
Put me in the camp vehemently against Hamilton at 4.  And this has absolutely zero with him to do as a player.  Drafting a non premium position player that high is just asking for trouble when you have a roster as bereft of talent as we currently are.  At 4, we want and need this guy to turn into an absolute stud - and if he does? Well, we will find ourselves in a very similar position we did with Adams - not regarding his attitude, but regarding the fact that we couldn't justify making a non premium position player the highest paid player in the league (at his position) when we have all the other holes that we did at the time/still currently do.  This may seem like a backwards line of thought, but in salary cap world of the NFL I think it needs to be highly considered.  
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I'm not advocating taking Adams at 4 - but at some point you need to add great/impact players. We can't fall into the "Jets are hopeless" mantra - that's been beaten into us all these years.

I sure hope 5 years from now (when Adams contract would become on issue) we don't have "all these [other] holes to fill." If we do, it wasn't because we drafted Adams - it's because of further incompetence.

With that said I hope a few QBs start getting some hype so that one of the edge rushers fall to pick 4. I'm also onboard with Linderbaum at 10. 

 
I'll keep saying it because others seem to keep forgetting. We've seen the " Take the best player regardless of position" movie too many times and we know how it ends. Adams, Williams and Williams just to name 3 recent ones. How did that work out for us? As was mentioned above the best case scenario is that they turn into a stud and then you have to pay this non premium position premium salary. No thanks. If you don't think there is an OT or Edge worthy at 4 you trade down if at all possible. No more wasting top 5 picks. It's a big part of why we keep having them! I will lose my mind if they take a S, WR, DT, or even CB there.  

 
good debate on this - 

I understand the value in positions and if its even close I would advocate the more valuable positions.  But if they cant trade down and its a matter of picking a generational safety over a much lesser roll the dice pass rush/OL then I would get the stud safety.  

Hamilton is a much more all around player than Adams - who was still a great player who improved the defense big time but had a terrible attitude and couldnt handle a rebuild.  Im not advocating BPA - im saying if its a wide gap then BPA.  Anything close and you go higher value position.

Interesting on the center debate - Jets were spoiled for a long time with Mawae and Mangold - they were huge linchpins for the OL for decades.  Its another BPA/value debate but I would be more than ok with a generational center at 10 or trade down.  Jets need playmakers and cant be too picky.  

 
Didnt see any posts on Saleh's cryptic Becton quotes - about him needing to beat out Fant to get the LT job next season.  He is risking being a bustif he doesnt rededicate himself and show up to camp in best shape of his life ready to go - he is one of the most important players after ZW.  If hes healthy and in shape he transforms the OL - if not they may need to spend a high pick on another LT prospect.  

 
Kiddnets said:
Didnt see any posts on Saleh's cryptic Becton quotes - about him needing to beat out Fant to get the LT job next season.  He is risking being a bustif he doesnt rededicate himself and show up to camp in best shape of his life ready to go - he is one of the most important players after ZW.  If hes healthy and in shape he transforms the OL - if not they may need to spend a high pick on another LT prospect.  
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I can't help but think back to when Saleh created a buzz by saying there was a chance White could keep the starting QB job when Wilson was healthy. Seems to me he's not one to shy away from the idea that you have to play well to keep your job regardless of where you were drafted or what you are getting paid. I don't even think this is as much a ploy to motivate Becton, I just think that Saleh believes it so he said it. 

I am hopeful Becton comes back and lights the world on fire, but i'm glad the Jets don't seem to be willing to put all their eggs in that basket. 

 
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Kiddnets said:
Didnt see any posts on Saleh's cryptic Becton quotes - about him needing to beat out Fant to get the LT job next season.  He is risking being a bustif he doesnt rededicate himself and show up to camp in best shape of his life ready to go - he is one of the most important players after ZW.  If hes healthy and in shape he transforms the OL - if not they may need to spend a high pick on another LT prospect.  
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I think that’s more of an acknowledgment of the good work Fant did filling in and also a “starting jobs will be based on merit and not draft position” thing.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
I think that’s more of an acknowledgment of the good work Fant did filling in and also a “starting jobs will be based on merit and not draft position” thing.
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especially when the 1st rd pick has been out of shape, injured his rookie year, lit up in training camp, and missed an entire season with what was supposed to be a 6-8 week injury.....Becton simply cant be counted on.  

 
Please let this happen!  love the comments lol

NFL Network's Mike Giardi reports Adam Gase's name "keeps popping up" among NFL sources discussing the Patriots' offensive coordinator vacancy. 

The guy whose offense was dead last -- or near dead last -- in every meaningful category as head coach of the Jets is apparently in the running to replace Josh McDaniels as New England's offensive coordinator. Giardi said there remains hope that the next Patriots OC will come from within the organization, but Gase is a possible outside hire who could inexplicably get another chance to sink an NFL offense. A master of alienating players and creating stale, predictable offensive schemes, Gase would be a curious choice for Bill Belichick and the Pats. His hiring would raise serious questions about the development of Mac Jones as a franchise quarterback. 

 
Grigs Allmoon said:
Regarding the headline of the thread, there's an even easier solution. You could have simply drafted Josh Allen in stead of Darnold.  :lmao:
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Zero chance Josh Allen would be the QB he is today if drafted by the Jets and had to develop under Todd Bowles and Adam Gase.  

 
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Kiddnets said:
Zero chance Josh Allen would be the QB he is today if drafted by the Jets and had to develop under Todd Bowles and Adam Gase.  
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It would have been difficult, that's for sure. Adam Gase was the death knell of any chance Sam ever had of making it with the Jets. Wilson at least has been given a fighting chance here. He just hasn't really run with it (not that I expect him to in year one. But his historical comps don't look good). 

 
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EDGE, OT, WR, QB, CB. 

These are the positions you draft in the first. Interior line (unless offensive and later in the round), safety, linebackers, and running backs should be nowhere near it. 

NOWHERE

 
rockaction said:
EDGE, OT, WR, QB, CB. 

These are the positions you draft in the first. Interior line (unless offensive and later in the round), safety, linebackers, and running backs should be nowhere near it. 

NOWHERE
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Im definitely up with Edge, OT, WR, CB - but again the question is what if a safety or LB has a much higher grade than the "premium" positions - I would take Micah Parsons over just about all of the defensive players drafted last year.  Jets cant be too picky with "premium positions" when they are so devoid of talent. If its anywhere close I agree with you completely - but if there is a big gap thats when I reconsider - especially if there isnt a good trade down option.   

 
rockaction said:
EDGE, OT, WR, QB, CB. 

These are the positions you draft in the first. Interior line (unless offensive and later in the round), safety, linebackers, and running backs should be nowhere near it. 

NOWHERE
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Agree. Especially in this draft deep in EDGE & OT & CB. If Kyle Hamilton is the next Sean Taylor, then it could be a good pick. Taylor was a physical specimen like Hamilton, but Taylor had great football instincts to go along with his athletic ability, see what Bobby Bowden had to say. I'm not sure about Hamilton but not everyone has great coverage instincts. With a QB or 2 rising,  the Jets might be able to trade down, or have their players fall to them. 

 
SoBeDad said:
Agree. Especially in this draft deep in EDGE & OT & CB. If Kyle Hamilton is the next Sean Taylor, then it could be a good pick. Taylor was a physical specimen like Hamilton, but Taylor had great football instincts to go along with his athletic ability, see what Bobby Bowden had to say. I'm not sure about Hamilton but not everyone has great coverage instincts. With a QB or 2 rising,  the Jets might be able to trade down, or have their players fall to them. 
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QBs rising would be huge - could result in a nice trade down opportunity or push a more elite prospect down a few slots.  There usually is one or 2 that vaults up the board - especially with so many QB desperate teams.  

 
Jets WR Braxton Berrios is seeking a $9 million per year contract.

The Jets want to re-sign Berrios but aren't expected to go that high. 26-year-old Berrios had a strong finish to 2021, scoring four touchdowns in the final three games, but there are questions whether he can hold up as a full-time receiver. Berrios, who had 43 career receptions going into the season, averaged six catches and 50 yards per game in the five weeks he played at least 50% of snaps. With Berrios unlikely to give a Jets discount, there's a good chance the All-Pro returner reaches free agency this offseason.
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I really want to bring this guy back. $9MM seems a bit steep but that's basically what they were paying Crowder and Berrios has also shown to be a good special teams player/returner.

 
TLEF316 said:
That would make him the #30 WR in the league in terms of average contract value

https://overthecap.com/position/wide-receiver/

Obviously flawed because there are a bunch of top 15-20 WR's still on rookie deals (Chase, Jefferson, Ridley, AJ Brown and some others) but still....

Just seems crazy to me.
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Yes but “odd” things like that happen in each passing class of free agents, because they’re the players on the open market. I don’t love that potential contract but it’s far from crippling, and I know it’s a small sample size but he looked like a guy that can make an offense better with what he adds. I think he’s great for Wilson’s short game.

With that said if he goes out there and gets overpaid - the team will survive.

 
rockaction said:
Then I'm all for saving about ten million in cap space by cutting Crowder and letting Berrios play slot.
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Yep. Just gonna quote myself here. They could have used that ten million elsewhere. But they didn't do that and now they're going to pay Crowder rates for Berrios. Sounds about right. I'm not lamenting what the Jets did (the only thing they could have done was extended Berrios early) so I'm just sort of stupefied about what to do with him now. He should earn about $8-9M. The Patriots or somebody looking for a slot receiver will pay him if we don't. 

I think we should. I know that TLEF might balk at the sticker price, but that's the deal on the lot, fellas. 

 
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Dr. Octopus said:
QB hype-train starting already. This can only be good for the Jets.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-insider-notes-kenny-pickett-a-likely-panthers-pick-at-no-6-and-more-draft-insight-from-scouts-and-execs/
 

Come on up to 4 Carolina! If you’re really nice about it we’ll even take Sammy back as our backup QB.
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The Commanders at #11 are likely to pick a QB, Corral or even Willis if he keeps rising. The NYJ #10 pick could come into play for a QB hungry team like NO or PITT.

 
Interesting debate on Reddit Jets forum about #4 pick if the DL are gone.  Most dont want to spend the #4 on a safety again but there just doesnt seem to be consensus value at #4 except OL - one of Evan Neal, Ekwonu would be there in that event.  

Pro argument - its the best value for #4 - adding one of these studs would cement the OL as a top tier and provide max protection for Wilson to develop and help the running game.  Fant/Becton(if healthy) at tackles, AVT/Ekwonu at guards is a beastly OL - also protects if Becton busts and if Fant asks for $20M yr next season.  

Against - many arguments that its a luxury they cant afford - if Becton is healthy it would basically be drafting a guard at #4 and not sure Neal could even play guard well - Ekwonu could.   I know the Colts hit gold drafting similar but are they in the same league?  Many people think using 3 consecutive 1sts on OL is overkill and JD should draft one later and develop as is the usual course.  

Im a big fan of building the OL for a young QB and surround him with weapons.  If both DL are gone then I would rather go OL and build that wall.  The last time the Jets had a lefgit O was Brick, Mangold with a high price FA in Faneca.  Im more than ok with replicating as the Jamal picks give them the luxury.  No downside to having a dominant OL - helps Wilson and if he doesnt develop its much easier to add in another QB.  Its an offensive league and it starts in the trenches.  Drafting Ekwonu and then a WR at #10 then a TE in FA or 2d rd would go a long way to making this team competitive.  Focus on Defense with rest of picks and next yr- have to give Wilson every chance to succeed.  I can live with losing 35-31.  

Interested in thoughts here as its a long way to FA/draft

 
Carolina likely to give away Robbie Anderson to cut costs - amazing how much his value dropped in 1 season - IMO mainly due to Darnold being terrible.  IF my reading of the numbers are correct he would only be $8M....Id still rather go for a better WR in FA or draft but $8M and a late rd pick seems pretty good value for him.  I know JD said losing him was a mistake - wondering if there is interest.  

 
Yeah, not sure how I feel about that. Certainly no hard feelings about him leaving the first time. And he does provide the ability to stretch the field that I think could really help the offense (allowing Moore to focus on the intermediate stuff) but he's not the #1 they need. Now, does having 3 #2 types (with complimentary skill sets) eliminate the need for a true "go to" guy....maybe.

If he wants to come back for a bargain deal...sure. If we're spending $8M on a WR, I'd certainly choose Anderson over Berrios.

I have no faith that the Jets were ever going to sign Dalton Schultz, so I was sort of hoping that Njouko might be a back-up option that they could get cheap. Of course, the Browns franchise tag him....LOL.

Really starting to like the idea of drafting Sauce Gardner. He's big and checked out athletically. He's been insanely productive. I dont want to take him at 4 but I dont think he makes it to 10.  I just have a hunch he's going to step in right away and be REALLY good.

We're a week away from the legal tampering period. Hopefully that will give us a little more insight as to where they MIGHT go with the draft picks. I'm still on board with trading one of the #2's for Ridley if the opportunity presents itself. Lots of people talking about Cooper now (and that would obviously come with the added benefit of not having to give up a pick) but I think Ridley (if he's there mentally) is the better player.  Would I rather have Cooper and a 2nd over Ridley? Yeah...probably. 

Just so many interesting things on the horizon.

 
Apparently people are still talking about a safety at four. Football Perspective and Chase Stuart, who knows more about the game than I will have ever forgotten, says it might not be so bad. 

So it might not be, I guess. PFF also ran their WAR and found that safeties are an impact position. So...

who knows. 

As for Anderson, I don't think brining him back is the greatest idea, but he is a field stretcher. The thing is, the kids ran so blazingly fast at the combine that they're all field stretchers. The question is: Are they ball trackers? I don't know about that. I'd rather see the Jets go OL/CB in the first, but that's me. Don't draft for need, anyway, because you need so many players at so many positions. 

Ridley I don't care for. His workout metrics are average at best, and I think he benefitted from Julio Jones's WR1 presence in Atlanta. 

 
I see zero reason to bring Robbie Anderson back at the cost of a draft pick and a decent cap hit - I'd rather draft a rookie deep threat.

I really think the whole "safety isn't a premium position" talk is a bit over-exaggerated. We're not talking about a strictly box-safety like Adams. Hamilton can cover as well -when was the last time we had a safety that could cover TEs? I'm not advocating for Hamilton but he'll make more of an impact than the groupthink suggests. Did people forget that we got 2 first round picks back for Adams so why are we pretending he was some kind of a bust? 

 
FA class is getting leaner - especially at TE - Fins just tagged Gesicki who I really liked.  Thats why a team cant build through FA - you drool at a Fa class and then a fraction actually make it to FA - and they get massively overpaid. So far Schultz is not tagged but being the best TE in the class hes going to get a massive contract.  Probably best to spend a 2d rder on one of the top TEs in the draft. 

I also agree on Adams - despite being a complete jackass - he was their best 1st rd draft pick in a decade.  He produced on the field and had big value in a trade.  I understand the value positions in draft - but if Hamilton is projected to be even better than Adams I am ok drafting him...Id prefer at #10.  His slower than expected 40 may have dropped him a tad.  

 
Kiddnets said:
His slower than expected 40 may have dropped him a tad.  
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It should have dropped him a ton. I wasn't aware of his forty time when I wrote that it's okay to take a safety at #4. It's not okay if he runs a 4.6. There are faster linebackers in the draft. 

 
We might see Ahmad "Sauce" Gardner at four. That wouldn't be so bad. A tall corner who can fly. Sounds good. Then go OL at ten and let the EDGEs and WRs fall to the second. There's value there. 

 
rockaction said:
It should have dropped him a ton. I wasn't aware of his forty time when I wrote that it's okay to take a safety at #4. It's not okay if he runs a 4.6. There are faster linebackers in the draft. 
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From what I have heard from GMs - they are not so concerned about it as his tape shows he has faster range and closing speed than 40 times.  Realistically though you cant take a non premium positions with a slow 40....he should be in play at #10 at the earliest

 
rockaction said:
We might see Ahmad "Sauce" Gardner at four. That wouldn't be so bad. A tall corner who can fly. Sounds good. Then go OL at ten and let the EDGEs and WRs fall to the second. There's value there. 
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Ive seen Sauce all over mock drafts.  He seems to be settling in as the top corner.  Im still a bit burned by the Millner disaster and think the 49er type Defense doesnt need premiere CBs.  

 
And now Schultz is getting tagged. Certainly not a shock, but disappointing.  Hopefully they draft someone and the 2nd tier free agent options are somewhat reasonably priced

 
TLEF316 said:
And now Schultz is getting tagged. Certainly not a shock, but disappointing.  Hopefully they draft someone and the 2nd tier free agent options are somewhat reasonably priced
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I kind of like the 2d tier TEs - Uzomah, Max Williams, Engram, OJ Howard - probably looking at $5-8M range - one of those along with a 2d rd pick is a big upgrade on the garbage they put out for a decade

 
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Kiddnets said:
I kind of like the 2d tier TEs - Uzomah, Max Williams, Engram, OJ Howard - probably looking at $5-8M range - one of those along with a 2d rd pick is a big upgrade on the garbage they put out for a decade
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I'd take any of those guys on a cheap enough contract - Howard is kind of intriguing.

 
So imagine if you're Seattle and you give up 2 first round picks for Jamal Adams, and then sign him to be the highest paid safety in the league and then decide to rebuild. D'oh!

 
IF Seattle is interested in Malik Willis, the NYJ at 1.04 could be in play. No body thought Lance would go at 1.03 in 2021. 

 
Dr. Octopus said:
So imagine if you're Seattle and you give up 2 first round picks for Jamal Adams, and then sign him to be the highest paid safety in the league and then decide to rebuild. D'oh!
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Also I love that when you put it together JD pulled off a similar haul for dealing Jamal Adams and Sam Darnold that Seattle got for Wilson

Wilson return - Lock, Fant, 2 1sts and 2 2ds

Adams and Darnold return - 2 1sts, 1 2d,  3rd and a 4th

 
Kiddnets said:
Also I love that when you put it together JD pulled off a similar haul for dealing Jamal Adams and Sam Darnold that Seattle got for Wilson

Wilson return - Lock, Fant, 2 1sts and 2 2ds

Adams and Darnold return - 2 1sts, 1 2d,  3rd and a 4th
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Seattle also got a couple of good players. But the return on Adams & Darnold is highway robbery.

 
SoBeDad said:
IF Seattle is interested in Malik Willis, the NYJ at 1.04 could be in play. No body thought Lance would go at 1.03 in 2021. 
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I definitely see the #4 in play if Willis continues his rise - lots of teams need a QB and Seattle just landed in front of most.  

Car #6, Atlanta #8, Sea #9, Wash #11, Minn #12 - would love to deal down to one of those teams, pick up a future #1 and a 2d this yr.  Houston could fall in love and swipe him a spot before the Jets but then another premium player slides down.  

 
SoBeDad said:
Seattle also got a couple of good players. But the return on Adams & Darnold is highway robbery.
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I hear you - they did get players but Lock stinks and Fant is a FA after this season so they'll have to pay big $ to keep him but I def give a small edge to Sea for dealing a franchise QB vs Adams and Darnold lol

 
Whoever rises to No 1 QB Draft status, for today let's say Matt Corral from Mississippi. The Jets at No 4 should try and get a team or two to trade up with them and add more picks to help them fill all their needs. 

There are 2-3 really strong Tackles for the OL but I don't see that listed as a big need for you all. Again you have Ekwonu, Cross and perhaps the best in Evan Neal that could all be staring at you and again you have teams you can dance with. Maybe Seattle would like to move up from 9 to 4 and make sure they get a QB they want. 

Kyle Hamilton is considered a HR at Safety, wouldn't let a 40 time at the combine deter you. But since I am a Miami fan, please don't draft that guy. 

The No 10 pick is again a spot you might be able to cash in on and slide back a few spots if somebody wants to give a nice sum to move up.

The money in the 1st this year IMHO is along the DL and OL, lot of what seems to be sure fire hits up and down. Secondary feels deeper than some years. What isn't deep is WR but you all got a terrific one last year. QB isn't elite this year but you already got one of those. RBs also underwhelm most. Skill position players are not in plentiful supply, it's the year to beef up both sides of the lines IMO. 

If you all need Safety and Cornerbacks, 4 and 10 you could walk out of there with a totally revamped Secondary. 

 
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