2023 NFL MVP race (1 Viewer)

[jobarules]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

19tds vs 7ints are pretty terrible stats for a QB whether you include his rushing totals or not. He is playing behind the 2nd best line in the NFL (Stafford average at best). The rams were written off at the start of the year because of the lack of talent. It's only his spectacular season that has made them a team nobody wants to face in the playoffs

I'm not saying it should be stafford only that stafford is way more valuable to a team with zero talent on it (outside Kupp who has been injured almost all year)

Your first paragraph makes no sense. It’s 2023. Rushing stats for a qb matter you can’t just pretend they don’t exist. Also Stafford has 23 tds to 9 picks, that’s not any better and he contributes nothing on the ground. I love watching Stafford play and I also expected the Rams to be a decent at best team this year. They’ve far exceeded that which is great. But a team scraping for a wildcard berth isn’t going to produce a MVP unless that guy is having a monster year. Team record does matter in this and as much as you want to ignore total stats and just focus on passing number’s Lamar’s are good enough in the context of his team having the best record in football for him to the rightful favorite IMO.

We’ve seen the Ravens without Lamar so the argument that Stafford has more value to his team if you take him off it doesn’t carry much weight either. Also you forget about Puka?

Yes Puka is a 5th round pick that nobody thought was very good that Stafford turned into a super star. he's not a super star if he gets drafted by the ravens.

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Herbert, Rodgers, Richardson, geno smith, stafford (missed a game), cousins, Stroud, Jones, Burrow, kyler

 

[jobarules]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Stafford missed 1.5 games as well quite frankly...

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

 

[-OZ-]

Yes Puka is a 5th round pick that nobody thought was very good that Stafford turned into a super star. he's not a super star if he gets drafted by the ravens.

While I agree he probably wouldn’t be great on the ravens, I do think he would be very good on many teams who actually know how to use his skill set.
He just isn’t especially fast.

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Herbert, Rodgers, Richardson, geno smith, stafford (missed a game), cousins, Stroud, Jones, Burrow, kyler

Lol. Most of those guys don’t matter.

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Herbert, Rodgers, Richardson, geno smith, stafford (missed a game), cousins, Stroud, Jones, Burrow, kyler

Lol. Most of those guys don’t matter.

Minus Richardson and Geno your 'haha' is incredibly naive if you think the rest of them 'don't matter'

Edit to add that Daniel Jones had an extremely similar statistical season to LJ's season this year last year

 

[kface]

Yes Puka is a 5th round pick that nobody thought was very good that Stafford turned into a super star. he's not a super star if he gets drafted by the ravens.

While I agree he probably wouldn’t be great on the ravens, I do think he would be very good on many teams who actually know how to use his skill set.
He just isn’t especially fast.

Probably true for sure. But stafford made him a top wr in this league

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

This isn’t remotely true I suggest you look up his stats

 

[jobarules]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Herbert, Rodgers, Richardson, geno smith, stafford (missed a game), cousins, Stroud, Jones, Burrow, kyler

Lol. Most of those guys don’t matter.

Minus Richardson and Geno your 'haha' is incredibly naive if you think the rest of them 'don't matter'

Edit to add that Daniel Jones had an extremely similar statistical season to LJ's season this year last year

Daniel Jones doesn’t matter in an MVP discussion. 40 YO Rodgers doesn’t either. Kyler we knew was going to miss half the year. Honestly don’t really even know what you’re arguing anymore. Lamar’s total yards are right up there with the top qbs so the argument that his stats are mediocre isn’t factual.

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

This isn’t remotely true I suggest you look up his stats

67 for 709 in 12 games which works out to 90 and 945 (and one of those games was only a 1/4 long). His best stats on the ravens was 91 for 1005. So yes i feel pretty good saying he would have beat his ravens stats

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Herbert, Rodgers, Richardson, geno smith, stafford (missed a game), cousins, Stroud, Jones, Burrow, kyler

Lol. Most of those guys don’t matter.

Minus Richardson and Geno your 'haha' is incredibly naive if you think the rest of them 'don't matter'

Edit to add that Daniel Jones had an extremely similar statistical season to LJ's season this year last year

Daniel Jones doesn’t matter in an MVP discussion. 40 YO Rodgers doesn’t either. Kyler we knew was going to miss half the year. Honestly don’t really even know what you’re arguing anymore. Lamar’s total yards are right up there with the top qbs so the argument that his stats are mediocre isn’t factual.

The point, as jobarules points out, that his ypg in fact are not up there with the others. YPG he is 15th in the nfl

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

He's 15th

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

This isn’t remotely true I suggest you look up his stats

67 for 709 in 12 games which works out to 90 and 945 (and one of those games was only a 1/4 long). His best stats on the ravens was 91 for 1005. So yes i feel pretty good saying he would have beat his ravens stats

You extrapolate his stats (slightly incorrectly but I’ll let it go) and they are still worse than his best year with the Ravens. How do you feel good that they would be better?

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

This isn’t remotely true I suggest you look up his stats

67 for 709 in 12 games which works out to 90 and 945 (and one of those games was only a 1/4 long). His best stats on the ravens was 91 for 1005. So yes i feel pretty good saying he would have beat his ravens stats

You extrapolate his stats (slightly incorrectly but I’ll let it go) and they are still worse than his best year with the Ravens. How do you feel good that they would be better?

I don't want to pollute this thread going back and forth but if you can't see that it's on you

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

He's 15th

I think that’s passing yards. Not total yards.

 

[Cobbler1]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

This isn’t remotely true I suggest you look up his stats

67 for 709 in 12 games which works out to 90 and 945 (and one of those games was only a 1/4 long). His best stats on the ravens was 91 for 1005. So yes i feel pretty good saying he would have beat his ravens stats

You extrapolate his stats (slightly incorrectly but I’ll let it go) and they are still worse than his best year with the Ravens. How do you feel good that they would be better?

I don't want to pollute this thread going back and forth but if you can't see that it's on you

Uh huh. You being proven wrong a few times in a row is probably a good enough time to let it go so I will.

 

[kface]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

Way less talent than LJ? You must be looking beyond the skill position players of which Kupp is still better than anything the ravens have and Nacua probably #2 RoY.

Here is the question though. Is Nacua Nacua on the ravens or is the offense and stafford making him what he is? I lean the latter of that equation 100%. He's a 5th round draft pick. Kupp has been injured almost all year and Stafford has been out there with a 5th round rookie, tutu atwell, demarcus robinson and a little tyler Higbee. He has a very average online in front of him (again Baltimore is 1-2 best online in the league). 5th round rb as well. Stafford makes that offense go. There isn't a lot of talent on that team. Throw half these guys on Carolina and they are nobodies

And before you say that the Rams just struck gold. The Ravens have drafted WRs for LJ pretty much every year. Sure they didn't work out...but again who's fault is that? A great QB makes those around them great

Right Hollywood really below up post Lamar. Bateman been hurt half his career. Zay looks good.

He played 12 games last year and would have easily beat his ravens stats with a far worse qb so...

This isn’t remotely true I suggest you look up his stats

67 for 709 in 12 games which works out to 90 and 945 (and one of those games was only a 1/4 long). His best stats on the ravens was 91 for 1005. So yes i feel pretty good saying he would have beat his ravens stats

You extrapolate his stats (slightly incorrectly but I’ll let it go) and they are still worse than his best year with the Ravens. How do you feel good that they would be better?

I don't want to pollute this thread going back and forth but if you can't see that it's on you

Uh huh. You being proven wrong a few times in a row is probably a good enough time to let it go so I will.

Again if you think any of this is 'wrong' that's on you. You love LJ - we all get it. But I'll leave it there because this back and forth ruins threads

 

[jobarules]

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

 

[Uruk-Hai]

I follow Baltimore. You would have a hard time convincing me that a player is more valuable to his team than Lamar Jackson is to the Ravens. I've seen what happens to them when he doesn't play.

That said, I'd vote for Tyreek Hill if the season ended today.

 

[Cobbler1]

So we’re gonna gi

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

So we’re gonna give MVP to the player with the best cumulative stats that’s the only metric we care about? Mahomes leads the league in YPG for an underachieving Chiefs team. Him getting 20 more yards per game makes him more valuable than Lamar without looking at any context? Heck Mahomes got like 140 yards chasing the Raiders down 2 scores in the 4th last game alone because he was awful the whole game. Context matters, come on.

 

[Cobbler1]

I follow Baltimore. You would have a hard time convincing me that a player is more valuable to his team than Lamar Jackson is to the Ravens. I've seen what happens to them when he doesn't play.

That said, I'd vote for Tyreek Hill if the season ended today.

I don’t see it for Tyreek. People hate it but it’s a qb award. It’s the most important position in all of sports. It is what it is! Go Ravens.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

I follow Baltimore. You would have a hard time convincing me that a player is more valuable to his team than Lamar Jackson is to the Ravens. I've seen what happens to them when he doesn't play.

That said, I'd vote for Tyreek Hill if the season ended today.

I don’t see it for Tyreek. People hate it but it’s a qb award. It’s the most important position in all of sports. It is what it is! Go Ravens.

I hear you. I've talked myself in circles on this, so I'll let the smarter folks keep it going.

 

[The Duff Man]

So we’re gonna gi

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

So we’re gonna give MVP to the player with the best cumulative stats that’s the only metric we care about? Mahomes leads the league in YPG for an underachieving Chiefs team. Him getting 20 more yards per game makes him more valuable than Lamar without looking at any context? Heck Mahomes got like 140 yards chasing the Raiders down 2 scores in the 4th last game alone because he was awful the whole game. Context matters, come on.

If context matters then why does it have to go to the QB with the best W-L record? Especially when it is getting more and more understood that W-L is not a QB stat.

Six times with the Bills tied or trailing Allen has scored in the last two minutes of the game, five of those gave them the lead, and once tieing it. Unfortunately they are 3-3 in those games.

His main fault this year is that he scored too quickly and handed a lead back to a defence that couldn’t hold up with under 2 min left.

Some will call up INTs, I can recall at least four that were “arm punts” from midfield on third and long, and one that was an end of first half Hail Mary.

I don’t see a single game this year that Lamar had to win it for his team?

 

[Todem]

This happens to Jalen Hurts a lot "He is good but also, here are a bunch of reasons why he is not good" and it goes like

Well his rushing TDs are just weak.
Well he has SO MANY weapons.
Well his offensive line is so great.
Well ya know put him on X team and he would suck.

I don't recall this stuff happening to Montana back in the day "Well he is only good b/c Jerry Rice and Roger Craig" maybe I'm wrong.

That's every argument against Purdy this season, too. System QB, carried by elite teammates, put him anywhere else and he'd suck, etc. Even with last night's disaster he still leads the NFL in a ton of metrics but it's never enough.

Yeah forget the body of work.

The MVP talk has become a weekly award. It's seriously a joke anyway.

If we are talking body of work:

CMC
Purdy
Hill

Are my top 3

Lamar is of course Baltimores MVP....but his passing numbers are pedestrian.

To be fair: his receiving options are pretty horrible compared to other QBs with similiar records

Ravens have also not lost a game since their best receiving option was lost for the season.

I would not blink if Lamar Jackson won the MVP. He's an outstanding player.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

I don’t see a single game this year that Lamar had to win it for his team?

All of them?

 

[jobarules]

So we’re gonna gi

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

So we’re gonna give MVP to the player with the best cumulative stats that’s the only metric we care about? Mahomes leads the league in YPG for an underachieving Chiefs team. Him getting 20 more yards per game makes him more valuable than Lamar without looking at any context? Heck Mahomes got like 140 yards chasing the Raiders down 2 scores in the 4th last game alone because he was awful the whole game. Context matters, come on.

Stats AND record. CMC has both, tyreek has both. If we're just gonna give it to the QB on the best team regardless of his stats we should do away with the award then.

 

[The Duff Man]

 

[ShamrockPride]

I follow Baltimore. You would have a hard time convincing me that a player is more valuable to his team than Lamar Jackson is to the Ravens. I've seen what happens to them when he doesn't play.

That said, I'd vote for Tyreek Hill if the season ended today.

I don’t see it for Tyreek. People hate it but it’s a qb award. It’s the most important position in all of sports. It is what it is! Go Ravens.

He's also very average against quality teams. Abuser of pretenders.

 

[kface]

So we’re gonna gi

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

So we’re gonna give MVP to the player with the best cumulative stats that’s the only metric we care about? Mahomes leads the league in YPG for an underachieving Chiefs team. Him getting 20 more yards per game makes him more valuable than Lamar without looking at any context? Heck Mahomes got like 140 yards chasing the Raiders down 2 scores in the 4th last game alone because he was awful the whole game. Context matters, come on.

If context matters then why does it have to go to the QB with the best W-L record? Especially when it is getting more and more understood that W-L is not a QB stat.

Six times with the Bills tied or trailing Allen has scored in the last two minutes of the game, five of those gave them the lead, and once tieing it. Unfortunately they are 3-3 in those games.

His main fault this year is that he scored too quickly and handed a lead back to a defence that couldn’t hold up with under 2 min left.

Some will call up INTs, I can recall at least four that were “arm punts” from midfield on third and long, and one that was an end of first half Hail Mary.

I don’t see a single game this year that Lamar had to win it for his team?

I would vote allen before LJ 100%. The guy has the entire team on his shoulders

 

[bostonfred]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

 

[kface]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

You touched on it but Goff and the lions have had the softest schedule any team could have possibly had. They barely beat the vikings and their literal C team last week and that is pretty consistent against bad teams.

I understand why the odds are what they are for him. Allen >>>> Goff for example.

 

[Terpman22]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

This is an excellent post. Literally agree with every single word.

 

[Terpman22]

This happens to Jalen Hurts a lot "He is good but also, here are a bunch of reasons why he is not good" and it goes like

Well his rushing TDs are just weak.
Well he has SO MANY weapons.
Well his offensive line is so great.
Well ya know put him on X team and he would suck.

I don't recall this stuff happening to Montana back in the day "Well he is only good b/c Jerry Rice and Roger Craig" maybe I'm wrong.

That's every argument against Purdy this season, too. System QB, carried by elite teammates, put him anywhere else and he'd suck, etc. Even with last night's disaster he still leads the NFL in a ton of metrics but it's never enough.

Yeah forget the body of work.

The MVP talk has become a weekly award. It's seriously a joke anyway.

If we are talking body of work:

CMC
Purdy
Hill

Are my top 3

Lamar is of course Baltimores MVP....but his passing numbers are pedestrian.

To be fair: his receiving options are pretty horrible compared to other QBs with similiar records

Ravens have also not lost a game since their best receiving option was lost for the season.

I would not blink if Lamar Jackson won the MVP. He's an outstanding player.

I feel ya there. He has been an outstanding player most of his career. But I think the question is "Is this season of his worthy of the MVP" and to be honest, stat wise, for an MVP they are kind of pedestrian. The team has a great record with a great defense and they ARE winning games with a Rookie WR, another season where their All Pro TE is gone for half of the season+, a bunch of JAGS at RB and Odell Beckham who obviously is just not that same guy or even close so I do get it from that angle. I just feel the ole "Best Team's QB is MVP" kinda vibe from it and it just doesn't sit right with me when there are other QBs that have far superior numbers in most passing categories.

But like you said, at the same time if he does win it and hes got like 30+ passing TDs, 850+ rushing yards and 6-8 TDs on the ground and the Ravens are the 1 seed, to me if he reaches those thresholds, I would be more like "well ok thats pretty good"

 

[Cobbler1]

So we’re gonna gi

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

So we’re gonna give MVP to the player with the best cumulative stats that’s the only metric we care about? Mahomes leads the league in YPG for an underachieving Chiefs team. Him getting 20 more yards per game makes him more valuable than Lamar without looking at any context? Heck Mahomes got like 140 yards chasing the Raiders down 2 scores in the 4th last game alone because he was awful the whole game. Context matters, come on.

If context matters then why does it have to go to the QB with the best W-L record? Especially when it is getting more and more understood that W-L is not a QB stat.

Six times with the Bills tied or trailing Allen has scored in the last two minutes of the game, five of those gave them the lead, and once tieing it. Unfortunately they are 3-3 in those games.

His main fault this year is that he scored too quickly and handed a lead back to a defence that couldn’t hold up with under 2 min left.

Some will call up INTs, I can recall at least four that were “arm punts” from midfield on third and long, and one that was an end of first half Hail Mary.

I don’t see a single game this year that Lamar had to win it for his team?

It doesn’t have to go to the qb of the team with the best record. But team record/performance is a factor. And it’s not like Lamar is some game manager- he is the offense of the team with the best record in football, the team with the 4th most ppg in football, second best point differential. If Allen had his numbers and his team was 12-3 it would easily be him. But team performance is a factor. If Lamar didn’t have his defense he would be required to throw for more yards and score more points against the teams the Ravens absolutely blew out and he’d have better cumulative stats. Yeah Allen’s ints will be held against him hopefully with some recognition of the context. Lamar has had a couple fumbles lost on poor exchanges that were the RBs fault and a couple miscommunication picks. It happens.

Lamar hasn’t had to chase many games this year. He had to and failed against the Steelers- a game where a million dropped passes allowed it to even be a game. He gave the Ravens the lead with under 2 left against the Rams but the defense blew it. The Ravens have had early control most games in large part because of Lamar- Lions, Seahawks, Browns, Niners, Bengals, Texans come to mind easily. That should be rewarded just as much if not more than having to come back. This isn’t just some random team leading the conference- they are 4th all-time in DVOA through 15 games. They have beaten 7 winning teams by 14+ points, only team in history to do that. Lamar is the most valuable player on one of the historically best performing teams to this point in the year. Of course that warrants heavy MVP consideration.

 

[Cobbler1]

So we’re gonna gi

Obviously knocking Lamar’s passing stats without mentioning his rushing stats is disingenuous to the argument as his rushing stats are a huge part of his value. His total yards are right up there with the other top qbs and he hasn’t had the benefit of chasing many games late (Ravens have led at or under the 2 minute warning in every game). Of course that may help his efficiency some, not having to take chances chasing games late, but it hurts his overall counting stats which again are right up there with the other top qbs for total yards.

He’s also pretty much shut it down in the second half several times- Browns, Lions, Seahawks, 49ers, Cardinals to some degree off the top of my head since they were blowouts or in the Cards case the run game couldn’t be stopped. That’s a credit to him and to the defense. The defense that helps the Ravens to the best record in the league also helps keep his stats down yet I’ve seen both the stats and defense used against him. Can’t have it both ways.

His value also will never be totally reflected by the stats. His movement in the pocket helps the offensive line and his scrambling ability affects the way a defense can rush. His threat as a runner takes away a defender from defending the running back and forces a spy or lots of zone helping his average at best wrs.

Ravens are 4th in the league in points per game with far fewer weapons than the other top scoring teams. That’s because of Lamar. Fortunately the betting sites seem to agree that the voters will recognize this. If the Ravens beat Miami and he has a good game it will lock it up for him. He probably still wins it if the Ravens lose and he has a huge game like last year.

I don't know about that...you shouldn't have to make excuses as to why the MVPs stats are mediocre

I would give it to stafford before LJ. Stafford is the best QB in the league this year and that team would be trash without him. He also has way less talent than LJ

How are his stats mediocre? He’s 6th in the league in total yards. More than Stafford. More tds as well.

With all the Qb injuries being 6th is nothing to write home about

Who do you think matters who got hurt? Cousins? Stroud would be up there.

Burrow. Cousins, Stroud, Herbert

Burrow is a good one. Herbert is 800 yards back in 2 fewer games.

I didn't do a YPG comparison. Point was he'd be lower than 6th on a YPG basis. Those aren't MVP stats

He’d still be within the range of the top qbs. The ones who aren’t the best player on the best team in football. That’s going to matter.

We're talking MVP. Within range isn't enough

So we’re gonna give MVP to the player with the best cumulative stats that’s the only metric we care about? Mahomes leads the league in YPG for an underachieving Chiefs team. Him getting 20 more yards per game makes him more valuable than Lamar without looking at any context? Heck Mahomes got like 140 yards chasing the Raiders down 2 scores in the 4th last game alone because he was awful the whole game. Context matters, come on.

Stats AND record. CMC has both, tyreek has both. If we're just gonna give it to the QB on the best team regardless of his stats we should do away with the award then.

Qbs matter far far more. Hate it all you want but it’s a qb league and the salaries prove it.

 

[Cobbler1]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

Seems far fetched IMO. You’d have to account for Tua jumping up if they beat the Ravens.

 

[Todem]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

Seems far fetched IMO. You’d have to account for Tua jumping up if they beat the Ravens.

Tua simply does not carry teams.

If the Dolphins win Sunday it will be because of how well the defense has played.

Tua is nothing without Hill not vice a versa.

Hill is this teams MVP bar none.

 

[Cobbler1]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

Seems far fetched IMO. You’d have to account for Tua jumping up if they beat the Ravens.

Tua simply does not carry teams.

If the Dolphins win Sunday it will be because of how well the defense has played.

Tua is nothing without Hill not vice a versa.

Hill is this teams MVP bar none.

Regardless Tua is higher in the current odds and the likelihood the Dolphins win in Baltimore with Tua struggling so much that Goff would jump him seem slim.

 

[bostonfred]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

Seems far fetched IMO. You’d have to account for Tua jumping up if they beat the Ravens.

Tua simply does not carry teams.

If the Dolphins win Sunday it will be because of how well the defense has played.

Tua is nothing without Hill not vice a versa.

Hill is this teams MVP bar none.

Regardless Tua is higher in the current odds and the likelihood the Dolphins win in Baltimore with Tua struggling so much that Goff would jump him seem slim.

Good call. I'll throw down a unit on tua too. I agree with @Todem about tyreek but who knows

 

[theglorydays]

Lamar is winning because of his defense and his stats aren't that great. The same argument kept Brady out of mvp.

hurts was the clear number one and still has an 11-3 record but they lost 3 in a row. His stats are arguably the best - 35 total touchdowns leads the NFL.

Purdy is surrounded by so much talent that people questioned whether it was him or them. He was starting to get credit then had the 4 turnover game vs Baltimore

dak looked to be roaring back into the race after beating hurts and the eagles then they lost back to back games against Miami and Buffalo

tyreek looked like he had a chance to break 2000 yards but he'd need a gimmick like that to win mvp over a quarterback.

McCaffrey deserves a ton of credit for how he's played but he suffersfrom the so much talent argument had Purdy does

With so many contenders having late season swoons, I don't think the voters have cast a single early ballot among them. They will wait and see.

One name i haven't seen much is Goff. They're tied for first in the nfc. They play Dallas this week with a chance to move into first. They finish with the commanders which should be an easy win and a chance to pad his stats.

He's third in passing yards with 3984. First is tua with 4200, second is Brock with 4050. He only has 10 interceptions, better than Purdy (11) but worse than dak (7). He's tied for third in passing touchdowns with 27. Dak has 30, Purdy has 29. Allen and Jordan love also have 27 and mahomes 26. Hurts has 20 but it's the 15 rushing touchdowns that put him up top.

If Goff wins this week it would be a signature late season win for a team that announced its presence by beating the chiefs on the NFL opener and would be going into the playoffs on a 4 game win streak.

The 49ers finish the season vs the red hot Rams and division games can easily go sideways.

Meanwhile if the Ravens lose to the dolphins this week or the steelers next week, they'd be tied with the lions for record.

Goff is currently +15000 on fanduel sports book. It's basically a 4 game parlay where you get 150x your money if the lions beat the cowboys and commanders, the Rams beat the 49ers and the dolphins beat the Ravens. I Might put one unit on Goff and 3 on hurts and bet the money lines on the Ravens beating the dolphins and the cowboys beating the lions as a hedge. If they both lose then the 49ers Rams game could give Purdy or McCaffrey the lead so I'd consider hedging that too I guess.

But 150x odds... that's got to be worth a look right? And 40x for hurts?

Josh Allen leads the nfl in total touchdowns with 40, not hurts with 35.

Hurts also has 11 tush push touchdowns, I think that definitely should play a factor.

To Lamar, he's not top 5 in any advanced metrics I've seen. Epa qbr etc

His candidacy is based on his team's record which is silly.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Barry Sanders weighs in.

"This award is going to a QB

I rushed for 2000 yards in 97 and they made me co-MVP with @BrettFavre - I do think there is a shot Christian (McCaffrey) will split it with (Insert QB here)."

https://twitter.com/BarrySanders/status/1739665398780629448?t=RIi1urlzltsmwyq3n_ZRGA&s=19

I like how Barry failed to point out how a RB the following season (Terrell Davis in 1998) ran for 2,000 yards and won the MVP alone.