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2025 Cleveland Browns - JOK Out for the Season (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter amnesiac
- Start date
MAC_32
Footballguy
Ben & Jerry's
Footballguy
Getting a vet QB for 2.6M is compelling, but don't think he was worth a 5th. He may in fact end up bring THE bridge QB.
amnesiac
beer is good
Do you view Pickett as an NFL quality backup and/or developmental QB?
fatness
Footballguy
Having watched him in Washington for several years, Cornelius Lucas isn't a bad player, but he's not a good player either. He's susceptible to faster defensive players getting around him while he's trying to adjust his position, which he doesn't do quickly. He's "adequate". I don't know the Browns roster and don't know who he'd be replacing, so perhaps that's an improvement.
MAC_32
Footballguy
I didn't watch much of him, the little I did left me underwhelmed, but I also think he was not put in a position to be successful in Pittsburgh. My lack of reaction to this is simply because he's not our week 1 starter and I don't think he'll be the only backup in the room with meaningful capital committed to him.
MAC_32
Footballguy
It's a significant improvement. Knowing a player's weaknesses, good coaching can work around them. The problem with the bum he is replacing, Jed Wills, is no coaching can work around his weaknesses of taking plays off with no notice and his training regimen of weed / video games.
MAC_32
Footballguy
I don't think the Browns are serious about signing Wilson, he was flown in to get Atlanta's attention re Kirk Cousins.
amnesiac
beer is good
I think he’s a waste of space.
I didn't watch much of him, the little I did left me underwhelmed, but I also think he was not put in a position to be successful in Pittsburgh. My lack of reaction to this is simply because he's not our week 1 starter and I don't think he'll be the only backup in the room with meaningful capital committed to him.
Peak
Footballguy
Heard about a potential Aiyuk trade, but didn't know Teller would be involved. I was wondering about this Jenkins signing as he's more of a starter than a back up. But the WR trade market isn't all that bad. Why not send them a 5th and move forward? A pick and Teller seems a little overkill to me.
I don't really want anything to do with Cousins right now. I was fine when it was potentially the vet minimum. But now having to trade for him and discuss contracts? No thanks. Grab a QB off the trash heap (Flacco, Wentz) and let's keep it moving. I'm also more in the boat of drafting Carter if we stay in the 2nd pick, then grab a QB at the top of the 2nd or trade into the bottom of the first. Then maybe Henderson in the 3rd, if he's there. Not a fan of Sanders and I think Ward will be #1 pick.
I don't really want anything to do with Cousins right now. I was fine when it was potentially the vet minimum. But now having to trade for him and discuss contracts? No thanks. Grab a QB off the trash heap (Flacco, Wentz) and let's keep it moving. I'm also more in the boat of drafting Carter if we stay in the 2nd pick, then grab a QB at the top of the 2nd or trade into the bottom of the first. Then maybe Henderson in the 3rd, if he's there. Not a fan of Sanders and I think Ward will be #1 pick.
MAC_32
Footballguy
I haven't heard / read anything recently, but I recall the 9ers sniffing around Teller a year or so ago - just dot connecting. And I think the 9ers would be the one to give additional compensation in this scenario, not the other way around.
In a vacuum I don't disagree with you about Cousins, but I think having him in tow will make it easier to convince Jimmy to do as you suggested - not pick a QB #2. Using Newsome as a vehicle and shedding his $13.4m contract in theory can make (some) $ committed to Cousins palatable.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
We already have one washed QB on the roster, even THIS owner knwos better
daveR
Footballguy
Then why are they talking to Russ? Same same.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Spotrac
Aaron Rodgers signed a 3 year, $112,500,000 contract with the New York Jets, including $75,000,000 guaranteed, and an average annual salary of $37,500,000. In 2025, Rodgers will earn, while carrying a cap hit of $23,500,000 and a dead cap value of $49,000,000.
Spotrac
Russell Wilson signed a 1 year, $1,210,000 contract with the Pittsburgh Steelers, including an average annual salary of $1,210,000.
daveR
Footballguy
Cap hit on the NYJ, not us.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Atlanta would need to eat a significant chunk of it if he were moved.
daveR
Footballguy
I'm pretty sure it still goes on our cap aside from signing bonus.
MAC_32
Footballguy
The Browns would not be trading for the current contract as is in this hypothetical.
daveR
Footballguy
Then, he would have to agree to a buyout ahead of time. So, ATL would take the cap hit and pay the buyout $$$, then he would be free. I suppose he could tell them he'd take less than the contract they gave him, but that would be awfully gracious to treat them like that.
MAC_32
Footballguy
This is not the only scenario.
daveR
Footballguy
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
We kept Myles
Many mocks have us taking this guy:
Browns Pass On Quarterback In New Three-Round Mock Draft
Penn State defensive lineman Abdul Carter
The other part of this mock intrigues me.
ROUND 1, PICK 29 – QB Shedeur Sanders, Colorado
As it turned out, the Browns didn't have to wait long to find their signal caller. Sanders fell deep into the first round and general manager Andrew Berry saw an opportunity to trade back up into the first round from pick 33 and snag him, guaranteeing the team will control him for five years.I have my doubts about whether or not Sanders will fall this far...
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Wouldn't count on it but anything is possible and if events folded something along this way... it is intriguing because we would add talent AND not reach for a rookie QB.
Oh, and local OSU honks would love the 3rd round selection, click the link. It's a quick read.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Kenny Pickett and reaching for a rookie QB who isn't ready is a laughable QB room.r1 p29
we're almost certainly taking him at 2. 29 would be a dream wrapped in a fantasy wrapped in a cloud of fairy dust.
Read what former teammate of Kenny had to say about the awful offense in Pittsburgh.
Et tu, Najee? Running Back Rips Steelers After Chargers Signing
“I think the veteran guy on that team was like a two, three-year vet,” Harris said. “He’s still learning himself. I’m coming in and I’m just trying to look for people to pick their brain, and it was just defensive guys,” Harris said. “I’d go to the defensive guys and talk to them, but there wouldn’t be too much they could tell me about an offensive thing. Through my years, I learned a lot that I only learned first-hand.
“We just didn’t know anything on offense, really. We didn’t have any identity. We had a young guy coming in at quarterback. I really didn’t have nobody to almost learn from, on the offensive side.”
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Right now, Kenny is THEE experienced QB in the room. Who is a rookie going to learn from?
My issue is taking a rookie QB at 2. It is a stupid move IMHO. We need to add real talent, and we can add real talent and then roll the dice AFTER we add real talent.
Falling that far is doubtful, but a fall is highly probable if we don't reach for him.
One thing you may not be aware of... I'm a CU grad. I worked security on the sidelines during the 90-91 National Championship years. I would LOVE to land a CU QB to turn things around, but we should not bypass real blue-chip talent for a bag of beans QB pick high in the draft.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Kenny Pickett and reaching for a rookie QB who isn't ready is a laughable QB room.r1 p29
we're almost certainly taking him at 2. 29 would be a dream wrapped in a fantasy wrapped in a cloud of fairy dust.
Read what former teammate of Kenny had to say about the awful offense in Pittsburgh.
Et tu, Najee? Running Back Rips Steelers After Chargers Signing
“I think the veteran guy on that team was like a two, three-year vet,” Harris said. “He’s still learning himself. I’m coming in and I’m just trying to look for people to pick their brain, and it was just defensive guys,” Harris said. “I’d go to the defensive guys and talk to them, but there wouldn’t be too much they could tell me about an offensive thing. Through my years, I learned a lot that I only learned first-hand.
“We just didn’t know anything on offense, really. We didn’t have any identity. We had a young guy coming in at quarterback. I really didn’t have nobody to almost learn from, on the offensive side.”
-------------------------
Right now, Kenny is THEE experienced QB in the room. Who is a rookie going to learn from?
My issue is taking a rookie QB at 2. It is a stupid move IMHO. We need to add real talent, and we can add real talent and then roll the dice AFTER we add real talent.
Falling that far is doubtful, but a fall is highly probable if we don't reach for him.
One thing you may not be aware of... I'm a CU grad. I worked security on the sidelines during the 90-91 National Championship years. I would LOVE to land a CU QB to turn things around, but we should not bypass real blue-chip talent for a bag of beans QB pick high in the draft.
I should be clear that I am not a fan of Shadeur at all, nor do I want him as our QB.
I just think it's inevitable.
I'm taking Carter or Travis at 2
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
I don't mind taking Shedeur, I think it is stupid to bypass blue-chip talent taking a gamble the 2nd best rookie QB in a weak QB draft class when we have not added young talent due to years of missing top draft picks and desperately need to add young/cheap BLUE-CHIP talent. We've seen that even top QBs are a huge gamble and require supporting talent that we lack in order to succeed.
We agree on that much.
I don't agree that Shedeur is the default pick.
We may not even be making the pick at #2.
I'll add to the "its a real bad idea to take Sanders at #2 over blue chip studs like Hunter and Carter."Kenny Pickett and reaching for a rookie QB who isn't ready is a laughable QB room.r1 p29
we're almost certainly taking him at 2. 29 would be a dream wrapped in a fantasy wrapped in a cloud of fairy dust.
Read what former teammate of Kenny had to say about the awful offense in Pittsburgh.
Et tu, Najee? Running Back Rips Steelers After Chargers Signing
“I think the veteran guy on that team was like a two, three-year vet,” Harris said. “He’s still learning himself. I’m coming in and I’m just trying to look for people to pick their brain, and it was just defensive guys,” Harris said. “I’d go to the defensive guys and talk to them, but there wouldn’t be too much they could tell me about an offensive thing. Through my years, I learned a lot that I only learned first-hand.
“We just didn’t know anything on offense, really. We didn’t have any identity. We had a young guy coming in at quarterback. I really didn’t have nobody to almost learn from, on the offensive side.”
-------------------------
Right now, Kenny is THEE experienced QB in the room. Who is a rookie going to learn from?
My issue is taking a rookie QB at 2. It is a stupid move IMHO. We need to add real talent, and we can add real talent and then roll the dice AFTER we add real talent.
Falling that far is doubtful, but a fall is highly probable if we don't reach for him.
One thing you may not be aware of... I'm a CU grad. I worked security on the sidelines during the 90-91 National Championship years. I would LOVE to land a CU QB to turn things around, but we should not bypass real blue-chip talent for a bag of beans QB pick high in the draft.
I should be clear that I am not a fan of Shadeur at all, nor do I want him as our QB.
I just think it's inevitable.
I'm taking Carter or Travis at 2
I'll also throw out a bit of a hot take, and say, I don't think Kenny Pickett is as bad as people act like he is. I think pretty much any non-elite young QB would have sucked under Matt Canada. There's a reason Canada went from OC to not even in the NFL overnight. Not saying Pickett is gonna suddenly become really good, but I think he's better than what the Browns have trotted out recently. I'd be totally ok giving Pickett 2025 and spending the draft building up elsewhere.
ETA: Really love the idea of having Abdul Carter opposite Myles Garrett for the next 4+ years. Could be the best pass rush in the NFL.
daveR
Footballguy
Works for me! I'm happy sitting at #2. Ward or Carter -- either way I'm happy (preference to Carter). And, it's kinda looking like Sanders could fall out of round 1, so jumping up to get him late in the first isn't farfetched at all! I'm not sure he has the arm talent for NFL GMs.We kept Myles
Many mocks have us taking this guy:
Browns Pass On Quarterback In New Three-Round Mock Draft
Penn State defensive lineman Abdul Carter
The other part of this mock intrigues me.
ROUND 1, PICK 29 – QB Shedeur Sanders, Colorado
As it turned out, the Browns didn't have to wait long to find their signal caller. Sanders fell deep into the first round and general manager Andrew Berry saw an opportunity to trade back up into the first round from pick 33 and snag him, guaranteeing the team will control him for five years.
I have my doubts about whether or not Sanders will fall this far...
--------------------------------------------------------
Wouldn't count on it but anything is possible and if events folded something along this way... it is intriguing because we would add talent AND not reach for a rookie QB.
Oh, and local OSU honks would love the 3rd round selection, click the link. It's a quick read.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
I kinda hope we're not making the pick at 2
Soulfly3
Footballguy
you have the chance at a generational cb (and/or very good wr) and a deadly pass rusher... I'd say we can really use both.
id be pissed if we traded out.
rockaction
Footballguy
No. You want Sanders or one of those two guys. You don't want to be farting around with extra mid-firsts and ****. Those bust at a high rate. Those guys are blue chip. Well, Hunter is. I never am sold on some of these EDGEs that remind everybody of somebody else that wore the jersey they did. That's lazy scouting unless it's backed up with reasons and evidence. I remember Chase Young at OSU (remember him? they guy they took before Herbert?) was compared to Joey and Nick Bosa. Carter is now compared to Parsons. If Carter never stops the run, he's got a head start (oooooooh, did I just say that?). Anyway, I don't think either of them have lived or will live up to the lofty comparisons.
Hunter is generational as a two-way athlete, and a lot of guys are moving him up their board as the #1 WR. Teams are starting to say—football guys and old coaches—that they'd make him a receiver. He apparently has innate skills at the position. Jay Gruden was quoted as saying he'd use him as a receiver and put him in some DB packages and that DB packages weren't altogether difficult. Hunter is smart, by all accounts.
There's my lobbying for the guy. Take him and you'll be happy. I sort of want to see him fall to the Giants and you guys take Sanders because he and Nabers would be dynamite lined up out wide on each side of the field.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
The Dak rumors are totally incredulous but people should be looking it up just because the memes are hilarious.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
It is not the high floor (i.e. he's not THAT BAD) it is the low ceiling where he's only had one game of throwing more than one TD and only one game where he's thrown for more than 300 yards in his entire NFL career even when he didn't have Matt Canada as his OC.
Last year Jameis was able to easily throw for yards and multiple TDs but lost games due to turning the ball over. Going with a conservative ball control offense revolving around the run game and a rookie QB makes sense so Pickett makes sense as a backup.
Jameis had shown who he is, we can't expect Pickett to suddenly start putting up numbers. He has a role and a purpose and doesn't cost much so I'm fine with my expectations, but I don't expect much.
Galileo
Footballguy
Cousins in Westlake (Cleveland suburb) today at the Chipotle…. https://x.com/dwntwnbwn1/status/1905350605859647774?s=46&t=mVgKZVyu5p_E5yRJAlEvTA
MAC_32
Footballguy
The thought process to doing this hypothetical is not to pick a comparable talent later rd 1 while collecting extra picks, it would be to re-coup a future #1 because there is not a QB worth that pick, the team is not a QB away from competing, and this gives them the ammo to go get who they want in the future. The problem is I'm highly skeptical anybody worthwhile will consider giving a future #1 to move up to #2.
MAC_32
Footballguy
I was told he's not in play.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
Forget Cousins that Chipolte employee next to him looks like he is an absolute road grader. I think the Browns need to bring him in for a tryout.
fatness
Footballguy
I don't think Washington would make that trade for 1.29.We kept Myles
Many mocks have us taking this guy:
Browns Pass On Quarterback In New Three-Round Mock Draft
Penn State defensive lineman Abdul Carter
The other part of this mock intrigues me.
ROUND 1, PICK 29 – QB Shedeur Sanders, Colorado
As it turned out, the Browns didn't have to wait long to find their signal caller. Sanders fell deep into the first round and general manager Andrew Berry saw an opportunity to trade back up into the first round from pick 33 and snag him, guaranteeing the team will control him for five years.
I have my doubts about whether or not Sanders will fall this far...
--------------------------------------------------------
Wouldn't count on it but anything is possible and if events folded something along this way... it is intriguing because we would add talent AND not reach for a rookie QB.
Oh, and local OSU honks would love the 3rd round selection, click the link. It's a quick read.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Moving down 4 spots from pick 29 in the 1st round to the top pick 33 in the 2nd round for only a 6th round pick doesn't add up. The actual value from the NFL draft calculator is the 21st pick of the 4th round pick 117 so you are right, but I don't think Sedeur would fall that far let alone that it would ever go down for a 6th round pick #179.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
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Nothing Personal - Sampson discussing the Browns and Haslam
City of Cleveland offered Half a Billion to help the Browns but wasn't good enough
amnesiac
beer is good
OK, i know i'm a few days late (was out of town), but which one??
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Just looking at detailed info on the top two Buffaloes. I went to CU and love both of these guys.
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Matt Harmon@MattHarmon_BYB
NEW Travis Hunter's #ReceptionPerception is now up on the Highlights:
Simply put, while I'm not foolish enough to say for sure where he ends up playing between CB and WR, Hunter is an elite wide receiver prospect.
Full profile: https://receptionperception.com/travis-hunter-2025-prospect-profile/
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Shedeur Sanders' profile is live at @RecepPerception.
He's insanely accurate. And what gets lost in the shuffle of the high volume of short-game discourse that we have is that he also threw 15% of his throws over 20 yards, more than Ward.
full profile here: https://receptionperception.com/shedeur-sanders-2025-prospect-profile/
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I'm completely sold on Travis Hunter should we take him. Body control, ball tracking, runs precise routes, insane my-baller catch ability, chews up and spits out man coverage. He's the real deal at WR. Add anything we'd get in terms of cornerback use... Fuhgeddaboudit.
Shedeur: Fantastic footwork, if his primary is open, he's starting to get the ball out BEFORE he his back foot plants to make the 1-2-3 boom easy completion. Has a 'feel' for coverage and can throw-low into a small window. Keeps his eyes UP and looking downfield. Moves effectively in the pocket to reset his feet so he naturally extends plays. Played in an NFL offense with RPOs. Good eyes, reads coverage doesn't get fooled even when facing complex coverages and has ability to move the safety. He is accurate. Unquestioned toughness with natural leadership type of poise and confidence.
Good 'nuff athlete. Didn't have the best offensive line or running game but had Travis and some other 'decent' college WRs.
He's not flat out terrible at anything but...
He's got a hitch and an extended slow release going deep or deep in his reads. Not a 'great' runner but able. Eh arm strength where he floats/arch's the damn ball on every deep throw, not sure that cuts it with NFL safeties. He gets the ball out in the face of pressure but doesn't get rid of it fast enough, so he takes too many sacks.
If we take Hunter, we lack a QB but he's a blue-chip prospect IMHO.
If we take Shedeur we lack a #2 WR and our O-Line is old and frequently injured, and our running game isn't the greatest. The big downside in taking a QB at #2 IMHO is opportunity cost because I see Travis Hunter as a slam dunk.
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Matt Harmon@MattHarmon_BYB
NEW Travis Hunter's #ReceptionPerception is now up on the Highlights:
- - 92nd percentile success rate vs. man
- - 97th percentile success rate vs. zone
- - 97th percentile success rate vs. press
- - Rare catching ability
- - Frequently makes the first defenders miss after the catch
Simply put, while I'm not foolish enough to say for sure where he ends up playing between CB and WR, Hunter is an elite wide receiver prospect.
Full profile: https://receptionperception.com/travis-hunter-2025-prospect-profile/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Shedeur Sanders' profile is live at @RecepPerception.
He's insanely accurate. And what gets lost in the shuffle of the high volume of short-game discourse that we have is that he also threw 15% of his throws over 20 yards, more than Ward.
full profile here: https://receptionperception.com/shedeur-sanders-2025-prospect-profile/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm completely sold on Travis Hunter should we take him. Body control, ball tracking, runs precise routes, insane my-baller catch ability, chews up and spits out man coverage. He's the real deal at WR. Add anything we'd get in terms of cornerback use... Fuhgeddaboudit.
Shedeur: Fantastic footwork, if his primary is open, he's starting to get the ball out BEFORE he his back foot plants to make the 1-2-3 boom easy completion. Has a 'feel' for coverage and can throw-low into a small window. Keeps his eyes UP and looking downfield. Moves effectively in the pocket to reset his feet so he naturally extends plays. Played in an NFL offense with RPOs. Good eyes, reads coverage doesn't get fooled even when facing complex coverages and has ability to move the safety. He is accurate. Unquestioned toughness with natural leadership type of poise and confidence.
Good 'nuff athlete. Didn't have the best offensive line or running game but had Travis and some other 'decent' college WRs.
He's not flat out terrible at anything but...
He's got a hitch and an extended slow release going deep or deep in his reads. Not a 'great' runner but able. Eh arm strength where he floats/arch's the damn ball on every deep throw, not sure that cuts it with NFL safeties. He gets the ball out in the face of pressure but doesn't get rid of it fast enough, so he takes too many sacks.
If we take Hunter, we lack a QB but he's a blue-chip prospect IMHO.
If we take Shedeur we lack a #2 WR and our O-Line is old and frequently injured, and our running game isn't the greatest. The big downside in taking a QB at #2 IMHO is opportunity cost because I see Travis Hunter as a slam dunk.
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