49ers WR/TE Situation (1 Viewer)

[Max Power]

When you think Martz, you think passing...

I want to get thoughts on the situation in SF.

Bryant Johnson, Arnaz Battle, Issac Bruce, Vernon Davis, Ashley Lelie, and Jason Hill are all potential fantasy options in most leagues this year.

What is going on here? Will Johnson be a true #1? can Bruce keep up a solid WR2-3 pace? Will Martz even use the best TE he has ever had in Davis?

Granted the QB position is still a semi-question, but there is plenty of room to grow this season in the 49ers O. Both Battle and Lelie have shown glimpses of being a solid NFL player. Hill is a 2nd year guy often mentioned in Dynasty circles.

Personally, I have a hard time thinking V.Davis won't be a featured receiving option....but you never know.

Again, people with insight, please chime in. The Pool would love to hear what you think. There is a lot of potential to be had at a great ADP...

(Bonus question) Is a 49ers QB the one to own this season?

 

[EBF]

Johnson - Starting, but he's only on a one year deal. A little bit overrated in dynasty, though you never know...

Bruce - Starting. Best pick in a redraft. Decent 1-2 year rental in a dynasty.

Battle - Probably the WR3. He is what he is.

Hill - Could be the WR4 and is the best value in a dynasty draft. Could be starting as soon as 2009.

Lelie - Could get on the field as a deep threat, but I doubt he'll make much noise.

I don't know what to make of Davis. Martz offenses haven't historically yielded a top TE, but Davis is a better athlete than anyone Martz has ever had at the position. He has some upside, but I wouldn't project him much beyond last year's numbers. He is a better athlete than football player.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Johnson - Starting, but he's only on a one year deal. A little bit overrated in dynasty, though you never know...Bruce - Starting. Best pick in a redraft. Decent 1-2 year rental in a dynasty.Battle - Probably the WR3. He is what he is. Hill - Could be the WR4 and is the best value in a dynasty draft. Could be starting as soon as 2009. Lelie - Could get on the field as a deep threat, but I doubt he'll make much noise. I don't know what to make of Davis. Martz offenses haven't historically yielded a top TE, but Davis is a better athlete than anyone Martz has ever had at the position. He has some upside, but I wouldn't project him much beyond last year's numbers. He is a better athlete than football player.

I hate to make projections but let me take the handoff from EBF and run a little here...Johnson-Should make 70-80 catches fairly easily in this offense.Bruce-I like him as the safety valve and I see him in a 3.5-4 catch per game situation which translate to 56-64 balls. Now the WR3 and WR4 slots really produced in Detroit with 80 balls to McDonald and 60 to Furry...my problem is Furry already had 100 balls from the year before and McDonald knew the offense...plus Roy Williams was injured(shocker), all that added up to a lot of passes to them. Oh yeah and Calvin Johnson was not 100% most of the year. So I think you have to use a little but of restrain on the next few guys.Arnaz Battle: Probably somewhere in the 40-50 catch range IMO.Jason Hill: I'm all over the map with this guy. He should see some action...Bruce is no youngster, Bryant Johnson has not bee overly durable nor asked to receive the bulk of the passes hardly ever in his career. I can make a case where Hill could end up the WR2 in this offense.Ashlie Lelie: I could also see him running a lot of fly patterns.The key will be the production and leadership form the QB spot. I expect to see a lot of Shaun Hill this year.

 

[sfl49er]

Jason Hill will be my sleeper. He has great eyes on the field, 4.32 speed. He should get a little tougher though and get some reps this season at being aggressive at yac. He hasn't gotten too many NFL hits and thats his downside. He does know how to turn on the jets and find the endzone (32 tds receiving) in college. I dont know if any of the quarterbacks are ready for these receivers. Battle is going to help this team.

 

[SF409ers]

Johnson - Starting, but he's only on a one year deal. A little bit overrated in dynasty, though you never know...Bruce - Starting. Best pick in a redraft. Decent 1-2 year rental in a dynasty.Battle - Probably the WR3. He is what he is. Hill - Could be the WR4 and is the best value in a dynasty draft. Could be starting as soon as 2009. Lelie - Could get on the field as a deep threat, but I doubt he'll make much noise. I don't know what to make of Davis. Martz offenses haven't historically yielded a top TE, but Davis is a better athlete than anyone Martz has ever had at the position. He has some upside, but I wouldn't project him much beyond last year's numbers. He is a better athlete than football player.

I think as of right now this is a pretty fair assessment of the WR situation. Hill is a guy to keep an eye on in in dynasty leagues. I am not yet sold on Johnson being a true #1 WR and as stated above he is only signed for the one year. If he does have a decent season this year I could see him leaving for "overrated FA WR" money next year. Battle could very well wind up being the most productive WR of the bunch this year.Davis is tough to figure out. I have to think Martz get's him involved somehow but I could easily see him having another very mediocre season. As far as QB goes I honestly believe this ship will sink or swim with Smith this year. If he is healthy I don't think he comes off the field. If he fails than he is gone next year. I think the 49ers will give him more than enough rope to hang himself this year so they will finally be able to cut him lose without second guessing it. This team has far more questions than answers.

 

[radballs]

I honestly think for 2008 that Bryant Johnson is a bit overrated. I really think Bruce will get the majority of the targets, but Battle's experience is getting discounted too far. I think this year that Bruce will easily be the one you want and some will reach for Johnson, but I see Battle as the true WR2 value play.

 

[sfl49er]

Josh Morgan is a beast. If you get a chance check his credentials. Reminds me of Anquan Boldin. Big, very strong. He played against Vernon Davis in high school, so he could be mentored real soon.

 

[Tecmo]

SF opinions:

I'm still pretty high on Jason Hill, he has a legit shot at being a #1 receiver in Martz system. This team still doesn't have that #1 talent. He runs great routes and was a red-zone beast in college. He can be drafted real late and has the potential for huge #s. Keep an eye on him in camp. Definitely watch his playing time at the end of 08.

#1 - Bruce looks like their #1 receiver as it stands now. He's capable of putting up 1100 yds, 5 TDs as he knows the system. He's been putting up #s for a decade, no reason to think he still can't do it. He can easily be pushed to #2 if someone like Hill steps up too.

#2a - Not sold on Bryant Johnson, he never did anything when he got his starting opportunities in ARZ. I don't think SF inks him for 1-yr if they think so highly of him.

#3 - Arnaz Battle is the guy all SF fans praise as their best receiver. I would peg him as the slot guy which has value in Martz's system (Az Hakim, Furrey, Shaun McDonald). BUT, I question if TE Vernon Davis will clean up underneath stuff moreso, VD seems to have success running short crosses n screens. I can see Vernon digging into Arnaz's receptions big time. No way a talent like this comes off the field constantly. He's not your typical TE asked to block, he's an athletic freak who poses a threat to score.

#2b - Lelie is the dark horse that deserves a flyer. He has the speed to work those deep slants. Lelie and Bryant are the 2 speed guys to work the deeper stuff, at least 1 of them will be seeing the field regularly if not sharing time. I wouldn't assume Johnson is a lock over Lelie. That's a camp battle

 

[Blue-Kun]

Thoughts on the WR set:

Isaac Bruce: Will see the most work most likely simply from his previous experience and lack of big time weapons. 60-70/800/5 seems reasonable if he's the target leader and healthy.

Arnaz Battle: Last year he was the only guy on the team that could catch a ball when it mattered. He gets no credit and doesn't look pretty on the stat-book, but he had some value as a top 50 WR in larger PPR leagues where he could be picked up for nothing. I expect him to get his in a Martz style offense. Last year he put up 50/600/5 with some of the worst QB play in the league. I think if he sees 80ish targets he can put up something like 50-60/600/4 with the possibility of more. If Mike Furrey and Shaun McDonald could come out of nowhere and become FF relevant, Battle definitely could excel.

Bryant Johnson: He's never impressed me really. Johnson has put up mediocre numbers even with 70-80 targets in his last couple of seasons and two huge receiving threats in front of him. To put it in perspective, he has yet to outscore Arnaz Battle last 2 seasons in FF despite being in a better situation. You could point purely to targets last season, but realistically I just think Johnson isn't a good WR even as a role player.

Ashley Lelie: One trick pony who really was never that good.

Jason Hill: The great unknown, has the physical skills to succeed, we'll see if he can pick up the system and how much PT he actually gets.

I said last year Arnaz Battle could be our #1 WR when all is said and done. He ended up being the best SF WR last year FF-wise and this year he has the chance to do so again, but I definitely give credit to Isaac Bruce and wouldn't discount him considering the number of productive seasons he's had.

I'd target Bruce and Battle if you have faith that the QB situation gets 'resolved' and maybe a flier on Jason Hill if reports from camp are good.

 

[Tanner9919]

this is a team with Alex Smith at QB, right?

I don't get all the love for this offense..Larry Allen retired, there's a new offensive philosophy in place with a lousy, incapable QB who can't hit the ocean with a beach ball, and some 50 year old WR named Bruce is in town to make some cash on his way to retirement..Frank Gore is a potato chip RB and his backup, D. Foster, is a never-has-been..

I just don't see how Alex Smith can handle a new offense when its do-or-die time for him. Either he begins to show progress or finds his way to the bench and becomes the next overrated,overhyped QB who failed in the NFL , ala Heath Shuler, Browning Nagle, et al..

the 2007 Niners were one of the worst teams in NFL history..just absolutely pathetic..

dead last in PTS, Yards, 1st downs, Pass Yards, NY/A passing

31st in team rushing, 27th in attempts..

defensively they were 29th in INTs, 30th against the rush..

if ever there was a semi-pro team, it's the 2007 SF Niners

Mike Martz isn't going to help much, IMO..

Vernon Davis should be,but won't be utilized in Martz's system the way most of us would like to see, he's a lousy fit in a Martz offense..Bryant Johnson is a solid WR who should get a few chances to shine in this offense, but again, a lot depends on Alex Smith...

I wouldn't want any SF WR at this point, it just seems to me that people are jumping on the team because Martz is the OC, thinking there's a lot of value

and potential for a couple WRs to catch 80+ balls each..If NOT Alex Smith at QB, you're stuck with Shaun HIll ?

 

[KellysHeroes]

Hill will be named QB.. AS seems to be a bust.

Johnson will be decent.. about 60 or so catched w/ 6 TDs

Bruce is going to get hurt at some pt... I say about 50 Rec w/ 5 TDs

WR3 should be good for 50+ Rec with a higher Yardage Total

VD... ehhh; no way he gets more than 40 Recs

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I honestly think for 2008 that Bryant Johnson is a bit overrated. I really think Bruce will get the majority of the targets, but Battle's experience is getting discounted too far. I think this year that Bruce will easily be the one you want and some will reach for Johnson, but I see Battle as the true WR2 value play.

Radballs,What do you see as a reach for Bryant Johnson? Are you simply saying that taking him over Battle is wrong? Johnson had around 40+ catches last year for AZ behind Fitz and Boldin...also logged some time when 1 of them was out. I have to think in a Mike Martz offense he is capable of hitting 60-80 catches. Remember he turned down more money and a longer contract because he believes he will post big numbers in this offense and cash in during the off season. He is on a 1 year deal. I hear what you are saying about Battle but at the same time where do you see him going? I like him as the WR3.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

this is a team with Alex Smith at QB, right? I don't get all the love for this offense..Larry Allen retired, there's a new offensive philosophy in place with a lousy, incapable QB who can't hit the ocean with a beach ball, and some 50 year old WR named Bruce is in town to make some cash on his way to retirement..Frank Gore is a potato chip RB and his backup, D. Foster, is a never-has-been..I just don't see how Alex Smith can handle a new offense when its do-or-die time for him. Either he begins to show progress or finds his way to the bench and becomes the next overrated,overhyped QB who failed in the NFL , ala Heath Shuler, Browning Nagle, et al.. the 2007 Niners were one of the worst teams in NFL history..just absolutely pathetic..dead last in PTS, Yards, 1st downs, Pass Yards, NY/A passing31st in team rushing, 27th in attempts..defensively they were 29th in INTs, 30th against the rush..if ever there was a semi-pro team, it's the 2007 SF Niners Mike Martz isn't going to help much, IMO..Vernon Davis should be,but won't be utilized in Martz's system the way most of us would like to see, he's a lousy fit in a Martz offense..Bryant Johnson is a solid WR who should get a few chances to shine in this offense, but again, a lot depends on Alex Smith...I wouldn't want any SF WR at this point, it just seems to me that people are jumping on the team because Martz is the OC, thinking there's a lot of valueand potential for a couple WRs to catch 80+ balls each..If NOT Alex Smith at QB, you're stuck with Shaun HIll ?

What if Shaun Hill becomes the starter? Would you like it better if there is a capable QB?

 

[radballs]

Radballs,What do you see as a reach for Bryant Johnson? Are you simply saying that taking him over Battle is wrong?

Just saying that I think Battle is just as likely, if not more so, to get targets than BJ. And Johnson is a bit more expensive. This picture will become a lot clearer during camp, but there's not a huge receiving pie to divide there anyway.

 

[49erBamBam52]

this is a team with Alex Smith at QB, right? perhaps not... Shaun Hill came in last year and showed Smith that he isnt the only QB on the roster, and IMHO he should be the starter come '08 season... he fits the martz system well.

I don't get all the love for this offense..Larry Allen retired over the hill last year anyway, didnt play that well, there's a new offensive philosophy in place one that can actually score involving a proven OC not a first timer like last year with a lousy, incapable QB see first response who can't hit the ocean with a beach ball, and some 50 year old WR named Bruce who put up prety decent #'s last year on a team that did worse than the niners is in town to make some cash on his way to retirement..Frank Gore is a potato chip RB so NFC rushing leader means nothing two years ago (BTW he had decent #'s last year)??? what the F is a potato chip RB anyway??? and his backup, D. Foster, is a never-has-been agreed, didnt like this pickup..

I just don't see how Alex Smith can handle a new offense when its do-or-die time for him enter Shaun Hill. Either he begins to show progress or finds his way to the bench and becomes the next overrated,overhyped QB who failed in the NFL , ala Heath Shuler, Browning Nagle, et al..

the 2007 Niners were one of the worst teams in NFL history..just absolutely pathetic mostly due to a first timer OC who had no clue what he was doing, a QB who was play8ing injured, who was backed up by the worst QB to ever win a Super Bowl..dead last in PTS, Yards, 1st downs, Pass Yards, NY/A passing see OC named Hostler for the fault... im suprised we one ANY gmaes with that guy calling the plays

31st in team rushing, 27th in attempts..

defensively they were 29th in INTs, 30th against the rush cant have good D numbers when you are on the field for 90% of the game, once again, fault goes to HOSTLER..

if ever there was a semi-pro team, it's the 2007 SF Niners just a silly comment here that does not deserve a response

Mike Martz isn't going to help much, IMO why not??? please explain your insightfull deduction..

Vernon Davis should be,but won't be utilized in Martz's system the way most of us would like to see, he's a lousy fit in a Martz offense offenses cant be tweaked to utilze star players..Bryant Johnson is a solid WR who should get a few chances to shine in this offense, but again, a lot depends on Alex Smith or Shaun Hill...

I wouldn't want any SF WR at this point, it just seems to me that people are jumping on the team because Martz is the OC jumping on the team???? this is the first posting i have seen about the niners or ANY of its players in a VERY VERY long time... not to mention that noone in here so far has said any rediculous numbers for any of the WR's, thinking there's a lot of value

and potential for a couple WRs to catch 80+ balls each..If NOT Alex Smith at QB, you're stuck with Shaun HIll who came in last season as the #3 QB and finally won some games, threw for decent yds and a few TD's... with a broken pinky finger?

bottom line is noone knows how good the offense will be next year, but i have yet to see a "bandwaggon"... noone here has entered any unrealistic #'s, in fact, most numbers that have been entered for any of thses WR's have been predicted as less that the players got LAST year with the worst offense in the NFL... is it that hard to believe that if they go from 32nd in total offense to 28th, that the receivers MAY have a few more yds???good gosh man open your eyes...

BAM

 

[KellysHeroes]

I just did a 16 team Start up...

Took ByJ @ 14.03 (211th player) as my WR3. I backed him w/ JHill @ 20.14

 

[J-Rock]

Alex smith is far from establishing himself as an elite QB but I really think people are writing him off as a bust to quickly. I wouldn't expect great numbers from him again this season but I really think it's unfair to expect significant year over year improvement when the guy has never played in the same offensive system 2 years in a row. This is his 4th offense in 4 years and he just turned 24.

From a fantasy perspective I think Gore is the only week in week out starter. I picked up Bruce for depth in one of my dynasty leagues but at most I expect him to be a bye week or injury sub, not a consistent starting option.

 

[AnonymousBob]

Mike Martz will find somebody to run his offense. Alex Smith, Shaun Hill or someone else.

 

[Bonfire]

Mike Martz will find somebody to run his offense. Alex Smith, Shaun Hill or someone else.

Jeff George!?! :makesdynastypickup:

 

[sfl49er]

this is a team with Alex Smith at QB, right? I don't get all the love for this offense..Larry Allen retired, there's a new offensive philosophy in place with a lousy, incapable QB who can't hit the ocean with a beach ball, and some 50 year old WR named Bruce is in town to make some cash on his way to retirement..Frank Gore is a potato chip RB and his backup, D. Foster, is a never-has-been..I just don't see how Alex Smith can handle a new offense when its do-or-die time for him. Either he begins to show progress or finds his way to the bench and becomes the next overrated,overhyped QB who failed in the NFL , ala Heath Shuler, Browning Nagle, et al.. the 2007 Niners were one of the worst teams in NFL history..just absolutely pathetic..dead last in PTS, Yards, 1st downs, Pass Yards, NY/A passing31st in team rushing, 27th in attempts..defensively they were 29th in INTs, 30th against the rush..if ever there was a semi-pro team, it's the 2007 SF Niners Mike Martz isn't going to help much, IMO..Vernon Davis should be,but won't be utilized in Martz's system the way most of us would like to see, he's a lousy fit in a Martz offense..Bryant Johnson is a solid WR who should get a few chances to shine in this offense, but again, a lot depends on Alex Smith...I wouldn't want any SF WR at this point, it just seems to me that people are jumping on the team because Martz is the OC, thinking there's a lot of valueand potential for a couple WRs to catch 80+ balls each..If NOT Alex Smith at QB, you're stuck with Shaun HIll ?

You cant see beyond the "incapable qb" to see the circumstances man. He doesnt have time to throw the ball, dont you get it. I have studied through your material and you havent shown both sides of the story. You should state all the facts and maybe your thread would be cleared of contradictions. 1. AS is sorry, you say. But AS was productive at 21,22,23 on his own. If you have seen him play, then you would have respect for the 'kid'. He had to run for his life and still won games, not many, but still won. 2. So you're saying Larry Allen retired. You think he was the brawn on that line? What are you saying, LA was productive all year? That means nothing what you said when the line as a whole was very sub-par. You make it sound like LA will save us. He wont, but getting younger could. 3. Bruce is old. You have no credibility in that. Hes working at becoming the starter, which is true. If you were right, then someone else would step up and start- we have enough to choose from. 4. Gore is a potato chip. You forgot to say that this chip- in "one of the worst teams in NFL history" ran for a 1100 yards, with 4.2avg. Wow he probably would have gotten 2800 on Dallas. 5. Defense. Why cant you state it all; that the defense had to carry the team with time on the field, more than anyone else. We tied for fourth in the LEAGUE in rushing yards per attempt. 6. Shawn Hill, eek. Hey, check out Hills first 28 pass attempts to start his career, check out his completion % and see where he lands on the list of the history of every NFL qb to EVER play this game. I know what it is, by all your negativity, you just dont like this team. Make a statement as to why they're not gonna be good, not just grasping at straws. And then if you're so confident , then we should compare 'your' team and my semi-pro team this coming year. Please dont belittle this team. They're still an NFL team

 

[49erBamBam52]

this is a team with Alex Smith at QB, right? I don't get all the love for this offense..Larry Allen retired, there's a new offensive philosophy in place with a lousy, incapable QB who can't hit the ocean with a beach ball, and some 50 year old WR named Bruce is in town to make some cash on his way to retirement..Frank Gore is a potato chip RB and his backup, D. Foster, is a never-has-been..I just don't see how Alex Smith can handle a new offense when its do-or-die time for him. Either he begins to show progress or finds his way to the bench and becomes the next overrated,overhyped QB who failed in the NFL , ala Heath Shuler, Browning Nagle, et al.. the 2007 Niners were one of the worst teams in NFL history..just absolutely pathetic..dead last in PTS, Yards, 1st downs, Pass Yards, NY/A passing31st in team rushing, 27th in attempts..defensively they were 29th in INTs, 30th against the rush..if ever there was a semi-pro team, it's the 2007 SF Niners Mike Martz isn't going to help much, IMO..Vernon Davis should be,but won't be utilized in Martz's system the way most of us would like to see, he's a lousy fit in a Martz offense..Bryant Johnson is a solid WR who should get a few chances to shine in this offense, but again, a lot depends on Alex Smith...I wouldn't want any SF WR at this point, it just seems to me that people are jumping on the team because Martz is the OC, thinking there's a lot of valueand potential for a couple WRs to catch 80+ balls each..If NOT Alex Smith at QB, you're stuck with Shaun HIll ?

You cant see beyond the "incapable qb" to see the circumstances man. He doesnt have time to throw the ball, dont you get it. I have studied through your material and you havent shown both sides of the story. You should state all the facts and maybe your thread would be cleared of contradictions. 1. AS is sorry, you say. But AS was productive at 21,22,23 on his own. If you have seen him play, then you would have respect for the 'kid'. He had to run for his life and still won games, not many, but still won. 2. So you're saying Larry Allen retired. You think he was the brawn on that line? What are you saying, LA was productive all year? That means nothing what you said when the line as a whole was very sub-par. You make it sound like LA will save us. He wont, but getting younger could. 3. Bruce is old. You have no credibility in that. Hes working at becoming the starter, which is true. If you were right, then someone else would step up and start- we have enough to choose from. 4. Gore is a potato chip. You forgot to say that this chip- in "one of the worst teams in NFL history" ran for a 1100 yards, with 4.2avg. Wow he probably would have gotten 2800 on Dallas. 5. Defense. Why cant you state it all; that the defense had to carry the team with time on the field, more than anyone else. We tied for fourth in the LEAGUE in rushing yards per attempt. 6. Shawn Hill, eek. Hey, check out Hills first 28 pass attempts to start his career, check out his completion % and see where he lands on the list of the history of every NFL qb to EVER play this game. I know what it is, by all your negativity, you just dont like this team. Make a statement as to why they're not gonna be good, not just grasping at straws. And then if you're so confident , then we should compare 'your' team and my semi-pro team this coming year. Please dont belittle this team. They're still an NFL team

AMEN brutha, you came up with somewhat different but entirely legitimate reasons to debunk the ninerhater AKA "tanner9919"

 

[Man who'd fire the Yorks]

I gotta believe if the O-line plays better the opportunity for Alex Smith to play better will be there. The Niners O-line has allowed the QB to be sacked almost 140 times(138 exact) over the last 3 years. You can't make plays if the line doesn't protect the QB. I'm not giving up on Smith yet though it's been hard not too at times simply because you want your team to win. I'm giving him 2 years to get a handle on Martz' system. I gotta believe as well that 'Mad' Mike wants another head coaching job too. If he can somehow get this offense to perform he could eventually be the Niners head coach.He's got some talent to work with but he's got his work cut out for himself too. I believe he can turn this offense around but I don't think it's going to magically happen this year. I know Bruce is gonna get a fair amount of targets but I'm hoping he's really going to be a mentor and teacher in helping these guys transition and learn Martz' system. I think that could be his most valuable asset to the team. San Fran's a relative young team trying to growand get better. The whole team roster, offense and defense, has 23 guys with more than 5 yrs. experience and only 11 of those guys with more than 7 yrs. experience. They can't keep changing OC's every year as well and expect to be successful. They need consistency and stability with the coaching staff. Yeah we haven't been a very good football team of late but we're a young team and I believe we're headed in the right direction. Martz is NOT the saviour but he's gonna help this team and I'm certain we ARE going to be better and we ARE gonna get back to winning football games. It's not gonna happen with a snap of the fingers but it IS going to happen.

 

[sfl49er]

I gotta believe if the O-line plays better the opportunity for Alex Smith to play better will be there. The Niners O-line has allowed the QB to be sacked almost 140 times(138 exact) over the last 3 years. You can't make plays if the line doesn't protect the QB. I'm not giving up on Smith yet though it's been hard not too at times simply because you want your team to win. I'm giving him 2 years to get a handle on Martz' system. I gotta believe as well that 'Mad' Mike wants another head coaching job too. If he can somehow get this offense to perform he could eventually be the Niners head coach.He's got some talent to work with but he's got his work cut out for himself too. I believe he can turn this offense around but I don't think it's going to magically happen this year. I know Bruce is gonna get a fair amount of targets but I'm hoping he's really going to be a mentor and teacher in helping these guys transition and learn Martz' system. I think that could be his most valuable asset to the team. San Fran's a relative young team trying to growand get better. The whole team roster, offense and defense, has 23 guys with more than 5 yrs. experience and only 11 of those guys with more than 7 yrs. experience. They can't keep changing OC's every year as well and expect to be successful. They need consistency and stability with the coaching staff. Yeah we haven't been a very good football team of late but we're a young team and I believe we're headed in the right direction. Martz is NOT the saviour but he's gonna help this team and I'm certain we ARE going to be better and we ARE gonna get back to winning football games. It's not gonna happen with a snap of the fingers but it IS going to happen.

But why havent we signed a premier right tackle? We have had the time, finances and incentives to get protection. That is our most inferior position and believe the sacks wont rest until we have that position locked up.

 

[Man who'd fire the Yorks]

I gotta believe if the O-line plays better the opportunity for Alex Smith to play better will be there. The Niners O-line has allowed the QB to be sacked almost 140 times(138 exact) over the last 3 years. You can't make plays if the line doesn't protect the QB. I'm not giving up on Smith yet though it's been hard not too at times simply because you want your team to win. I'm giving him 2 years to get a handle on Martz' system. I gotta believe as well that 'Mad' Mike wants another head coaching job too. If he can somehow get this offense to perform he could eventually be the Niners head coach.He's got some talent to work with but he's got his work cut out for himself too. I believe he can turn this offense around but I don't think it's going to magically happen this year. I know Bruce is gonna get a fair amount of targets but I'm hoping he's really going to be a mentor and teacher in helping these guys transition and learn Martz' system. I think that could be his most valuable asset to the team. San Fran's a relative young team trying to growand get better. The whole team roster, offense and defense, has 23 guys with more than 5 yrs. experience and only 11 of those guys with more than 7 yrs. experience. They can't keep changing OC's every year as well and expect to be successful. They need consistency and stability with the coaching staff. Yeah we haven't been a very good football team of late but we're a young team and I believe we're headed in the right direction. Martz is NOT the saviour but he's gonna help this team and I'm certain we ARE going to be better and we ARE gonna get back to winning football games. It's not gonna happen with a snap of the fingers but it IS going to happen.

But why havent we signed a premier right tackle? We have had the time, finances and incentives to get protection. That is our most inferior position and believe the sacks wont rest until we have that position locked up.

They only drafted 2 OL this year,Chilo Rachal and Cody Wallace. Smith's a big investment being a #1 pick and they should understand they need quality guys to protect that investment. Hopefully their brains will unfreeze and address the issue before the #1 investment becomes a sideline spectator.

 

[CaGamblers]

Bottom-line this is a make or break year for ASmith - Last year the team was 2-1 when he got injured in the Seahawk game. Prior to that he had a promising 2006 season. This is his 3rd OC in 4yrs - WTF! If Martz can make something out of John Kitna the statue he can definitely work a minor miracle with ASmith. Regarding the WRs, If Martz can make Shaun McDonald and Mike Furrey viable options in Detriot with the crappy O-Line he should have no problem getting Veron, Bryant, Issac and Arnaz up to decent FF numbers plus the 9ers actually have a great all-around back to work with that can run and catch.

 

[The Man with the Plan]

Bottom-line this is a make or break year for ASmith - Last year the team was 2-1 when he got injured in the Seahawk game. Prior to that he had a promising 2006 season. This is his 3rd OC in 4yrs - WTF! If Martz can make something out of John Kitna the statue he can definitely work a minor miracle with ASmith. Regarding the WRs, If Martz can make Shaun McDonald and Mike Furrey viable options in Detriot with the crappy O-Line he should have no problem getting Veron, Bryant, Issac and Arnaz up to decent FF numbers plus the 9ers actually have a great all-around back to work with that can run and catch.

Jon Kitna was a good qb before he went to the Lions. That's the main problem I have with the belief that the 49ers can become a team that passes for many yards. The talent just isn't there. Martz has had guys like Warner, Bulger, and Kitna to work his system. Alex Smith doesn't really come to to any of those guys in terms of ability.

 

[KellysHeroes]

Smith is going to pound every week

 

[RustyFA]

Bottom-line this is a make or break year for ASmith - Last year the team was 2-1 when he got injured in the Seahawk game. Prior to that he had a promising 2006 season. This is his 3rd OC in 4yrs - WTF! If Martz can make something out of John Kitna the statue he can definitely work a minor miracle with ASmith. Regarding the WRs, If Martz can make Shaun McDonald and Mike Furrey viable options in Detriot with the crappy O-Line he should have no problem getting Veron, Bryant, Issac and Arnaz up to decent FF numbers plus the 9ers actually have a great all-around back to work with that can run and catch.

Jon Kitna was a good qb before he went to the Lions. That's the main problem I have with the belief that the 49ers can become a team that passes for many yards. The talent just isn't there. Martz has had guys like Warner, Bulger, and Kitna to work his system. Alex Smith doesn't really come to to any of those guys in terms of ability.

You have got to be kidding. Warner was undrafted, Bulger was a 6th rounder and Kitna was a late pick also. Not sure on Kitna. Smith was the #1 pick overall. Ability is there.

 

[The Man with the Plan]

Bottom-line this is a make or break year for ASmith - Last year the team was 2-1 when he got injured in the Seahawk game. Prior to that he had a promising 2006 season. This is his 3rd OC in 4yrs - WTF! If Martz can make something out of John Kitna the statue he can definitely work a minor miracle with ASmith. Regarding the WRs, If Martz can make Shaun McDonald and Mike Furrey viable options in Detriot with the crappy O-Line he should have no problem getting Veron, Bryant, Issac and Arnaz up to decent FF numbers plus the 9ers actually have a great all-around back to work with that can run and catch.

Jon Kitna was a good qb before he went to the Lions. That's the main problem I have with the belief that the 49ers can become a team that passes for many yards. The talent just isn't there. Martz has had guys like Warner, Bulger, and Kitna to work his system. Alex Smith doesn't really come to to any of those guys in terms of ability.

You have got to be kidding. Warner was undrafted, Bulger was a 6th rounder and Kitna was a late pick also. Not sure on Kitna. Smith was the #1 pick overall. Ability is there.

What's your point? Since when did someone's draft position determine whether someone could play or not?

 

[RustyFA]

Bottom-line this is a make or break year for ASmith - Last year the team was 2-1 when he got injured in the Seahawk game. Prior to that he had a promising 2006 season. This is his 3rd OC in 4yrs - WTF! If Martz can make something out of John Kitna the statue he can definitely work a minor miracle with ASmith. Regarding the WRs, If Martz can make Shaun McDonald and Mike Furrey viable options in Detriot with the crappy O-Line he should have no problem getting Veron, Bryant, Issac and Arnaz up to decent FF numbers plus the 9ers actually have a great all-around back to work with that can run and catch.

Jon Kitna was a good qb before he went to the Lions. That's the main problem I have with the belief that the 49ers can become a team that passes for many yards. The talent just isn't there. Martz has had guys like Warner, Bulger, and Kitna to work his system. Alex Smith doesn't really come to to any of those guys in terms of ability.

You have got to be kidding. Warner was undrafted, Bulger was a 6th rounder and Kitna was a late pick also. Not sure on Kitna. Smith was the #1 pick overall. Ability is there.

What's your point? Since when did someone's draft position determine whether someone could play or not?

Ability was the point. Being the 1st pick means that you have the physical ability to get something done. Smith was decent 2 years ago and is in a high octane offensive system now. And even though 1st rounders bust half of the time the rate is much much much higher for later picks. So basically draft position does matter for the whole. Not in every individual case but as the whole then yes, draft position does matter.

 

[Tecmo]

Bottom-line this is a make or break year for ASmith - Last year the team was 2-1 when he got injured in the Seahawk game. Prior to that he had a promising 2006 season. This is his 3rd OC in 4yrs - WTF! If Martz can make something out of John Kitna the statue he can definitely work a minor miracle with ASmith. Regarding the WRs, If Martz can make Shaun McDonald and Mike Furrey viable options in Detriot with the crappy O-Line he should have no problem getting Veron, Bryant, Issac and Arnaz up to decent FF numbers plus the 9ers actually have a great all-around back to work with that can run and catch.

Jon Kitna was a good qb before he went to the Lions. That's the main problem I have with the belief that the 49ers can become a team that passes for many yards. The talent just isn't there. Martz has had guys like Warner, Bulger, and Kitna to work his system. Alex Smith doesn't really come to to any of those guys in terms of ability.

It's a good point that the SF qb situation might lack in talent compared to these other Martz teams. Still though, you have to admit that Martz offenses aren't very balanced. His QBs reach 4000 yds passing because of aggresive play-calling and not much running. He really pushes the ball downfield and leaves lots of underneath options to work with. Historically, his passing #s are among the league leaders. If Ryan Fitzpatrick was a viable fantasy option as a rookie, I'm sure Smith, Hill, or even O'Sullivan will step up for very good production. Someone is going to benefit greatly

 

[Blue-Kun]

Smith was decent 2 years ago

You have a really loose definition of decent in regards to Smith. He hasn't shown very much since he's been starting for us and I'd be surprised if Shaun Hill wasn't our full-time starter by week 6.