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4th of July parade shooting in Chicago suburb (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Galileo
- Start date
Capella
Footballguy
That Feinstein quote is 27 years old. I mean come on already. Also, banning a new class of guns is substantially different than rounding up and taking all your guns. Just total fear-mongering nonsense.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
The hypocrisy (on both sides) in politics is absurd. Some seem to think only one side is "evil" when both parties are more interested in dividing than uniting.
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
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Insoxicated
I have said repeatedly that any attempts to confiscate or register (To set up for confiscation) is a non starter. It's not compromise its outright infringement.
The mentality of "We've only infringed a little.... and because we've done that we have precedent to infringe more" is EXACTLY the mindset that drives the refusal to give an inch.
That is the very definition of the "Slippery Slope" that anti-gun folks gaslight 2A advocates on every day.
I'll be happy to engage further in the Gun Control thread.
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Insoxicated
Oh...so you think her stance has changed?
Cmon dude. Also, If the below quote from my post didn't make it clear.... my points apply to confiscating any class of currently legal firearms.
It's not fear mongering... it's happening. Anyone claiming other wise is either ignorant or disingenuous. Either renders their opinions worthless in a good-faith discussion on the topic. Need I post a list of all the legislators who've co-signed gun banning/confiscation legislation in the past 5 years?
Happy to discuss actual viable solutions further in the Gun Control thread. That said... We all know this is the point where Ant- crowd uses inflammatory language attacking the masculinity/"fears"/mental health of the 2A crowd.... coming in 3...2....
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AAABatteries
Footballguy
The longer things go without something being done is the closer we get to having things sway towards outright confiscation.
I'm the wrong person to have a debate on this as I'm fine if we did confiscate guns - I'd have no issue with it. But I'm in favor of doing something and when folks on either side of the debate dig their heels in it will just make the outcome worse, IMO.
How quickly would things change if the next mass shooting happens to congressmen? They need to act now and do something.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
What about the softball or baseball game a few years ago?
But come on - how can multiple horrific shootings at ELEMENTARY SCHOOLS not move the needle for these people?
ETA: I see Dr. Oc pointed out the game situation too.
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Insoxicated
"Doing Something" includes a LARGE spectrum of solutions. I agree we need to do more. Have shared my suggestions in the gun control thread. I reject the notion that "Doing something" has to include infringing on the rights of law abiding citizens.
Capella
Footballguy
I mean it’s one senator who is like 500 years old saying something 30 years ago. If you had 35 other senators saying something similar I’d agree with you but this is grasping at straws. Most Dems from what I’ve seen just one common-sense reform, starting with making it harder for kids and nut jobs to buy these things. Nobody is seriously trying to take guns away. The Murphy guy from Connecticut even said that when getting the new gun laws passed last month.Oh...so you think her stance has changed?
Also, If the below quote from my post didn't make it clear.... my points apply to confiscating any class of currently legal firearms.
I’ll even grant you the Beto quote but he’s just running for Governor in a state where there is 0% chance of that happening.
This is just a total straw man argument.
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gruecd
Footballguy
I've got an 18-month-old little girl at home. She's my everything. The thought of her wandering around the street confused and crying, looking for Mommy and Daddy while they lie dead in the street makes me wanna
AAABatteries
Footballguy
I thought of that when I posted but my recollection was there were no deaths. I honestly don't know how the school shootings doesn't make each and every one of them get in a room until some changes are made. I consider most of them cowards.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
They are. Look at the abuse Manchin takes when he crosses party lines by the Democrats and CNN. He's doing what he should do - take into account what his constituents want - and he's called a traitor. None of these spineless Republicans want Sean Hannity calling them soft every night on FOX.
This is not supposed to be the way politics work, and it hasn't always been that way.
ChiefD
Footballguy
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Insoxicated
Because I only showed 3 quick quotes doesn't mean that's the entirety of politicians either vocally backing confiscation/banning or pushing legislation that does it (which is the same thing).
For Example: Here's a list of folks who fairly recently co-sponsored a bill that "makes it a crime to knowingly import, sell, manufacture, transfer, or possess a semiautomatic assault weapon (SAW) or large capacity ammunition feeding device (LCAFD)"
Sen. Blumenthal, Richard [D-CT]*03/11/2021
Sen. Murphy, Christopher [D-CT]*03/11/2021
Sen. Schumer, Charles E. [D-NY]*03/11/2021
Sen. Durbin, Richard J. [D-IL]*03/11/2021
Sen. Markey, Edward J. [D-MA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Schatz, Brian [D-HI]*03/11/2021
Sen. Menendez, Robert [D-NJ]*03/11/2021
Sen. Carper, Thomas R. [D-DE]*03/11/2021
Sen. Brown, Sherrod [D-OH]*03/11/2021
Sen. Hassan, Margaret Wood [D-NH]*03/11/2021
Sen. Merkley, Jeff [D-OR]*03/11/2021
Sen. Whitehouse, Sheldon [D-RI]*03/11/2021
Sen. Sanders, Bernard [I-VT]*03/11/2021
Sen. Warren, Elizabeth [D-MA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Casey, Robert P., Jr. [D-PA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Kaine, Tim [D-VA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Reed, Jack [D-RI]*03/11/2021
Sen. Warner, Mark R. [D-VA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Hirono, Mazie K. [D-HI]*03/11/2021
Sen. Wyden, Ron [D-OR]*03/11/2021
Sen. Cardin, Benjamin L. [D-MD]*03/11/2021
Sen. Coons, Christopher A. [D-DE]*03/11/2021
Sen. Smith, Tina [D-MN]*03/11/2021
Sen. Booker, Cory A. [D-NJ]*03/11/2021
Sen. Van Hollen, Chris [D-MD]*03/11/2021
Sen. Rosen, Jacky [D-NV]*03/11/2021
Sen. Duckworth, Tammy [D-IL]*03/11/2021
Sen. Klobuchar, Amy [D-MN]*03/11/2021
Sen. Lujan, Ben Ray [D-NM]*03/11/2021
Sen. Padilla, Alex [D-CA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Murray, Patty [D-WA]*03/11/2021
Sen. Gillibrand, Kirsten E. [D-NY]*03/11/2021
Sen. Shaheen, Jeanne [D-NH]*03/11/2021
Sen. Stabenow, Debbie [D-MI]*03/11/2021
Sen. Hickenlooper, John W. [D-CO]03/22/2021
Sen. Baldwin, Tammy [D-WI]04/14/2021
Sen. Warnock, Raphael G. [D-GA]06/08/2021
Hell.. Here's a direct quote from Biden last month:
"We need to ban assault weapons and high-capacity magazines."
Stop with the gaslighting... there are ABSOLUTELY a cadre of politicians (primarily on the left) who, through their words or actions, are attempting to push a ban on some firearms.
beer 30
Footballguy
That's the rub, everyone says "DO SOMETHING!!!" but no one defines what "something" is. And the ones that do are on the fringe. They are either take them all away or they are everybody should have one as a deterrent. That bi-partisan deal they pushed through a few weeks ago was a start but did it really do anything? And because they did "something" I feel like they are going to say "hey, we did do something, now enforce the rule" and leave it at that.
The NRA pays both sides of the aisle.
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KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I didn't see the bills that got shut down from the GOP so was it:
1. What was being asked for - 21 to purchase, red flags, whatever - tied into the same bill asking for these bans?
or
2. Was it the threat of these bans in the future the reason used for saying no to a bill that didn't include those types of things?
BeTheMatch
Footballguy
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Insoxicated
To be clear, in case it's not to many, a large chunk of pro 2A folks (myself included) are no fans of the NRA... and don't support them.
Groups like GOA and FPC have run much cleaner orgs with far greater impact via taking the fight to the court system. They've already had many big wins at state and federal level and are only getting stronger.
The NRA can #### off and die as far as I'm concerned.
Groups like GOA and FPC have run much cleaner orgs with far greater impact via taking the fight to the court system. They've already had many big wins at state and federal level and are only getting stronger.
The NRA can #### off and die as far as I'm concerned.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
Oh man, I just read that he had thought about a 2nd attack in Madison, decided he hadn't planned enough for that, and was stopped coming back from WI?
This thread is off target. Please take the gun control discussion to the PSF.
https://twitter.com/andy4democracy/status/1544662838219767812?s=21&t=h6QsDxJ3jz1o0ruz08hpVQ
https://twitter.com/andy4democracy/status/1544662838219767812?s=21&t=h6QsDxJ3jz1o0ruz08hpVQ
Galileo
Footballguy
If he intended to get away with it, his plan wasn't too good for Highland Park. What plan includes wearing a disguise but leaving behind the traceable weapon at the scene? If he intended to get caught, why the disguise?
Galileo
Footballguy
Inside Edition report on some of the victims and some of the chaos of the scene...
WARNING: some graphic content in this. https://www.insideedition.com/highland-park-parade-mass-shooting-families-fled-to-nearby-stores-put-kids-in-dumpster-to-escape
WARNING: some graphic content in this. https://www.insideedition.com/highland-park-parade-mass-shooting-families-fled-to-nearby-stores-put-kids-in-dumpster-to-escape
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Obviously a generalization but it seems like most of these guys aren't usually looking to get away with it - they seem to plan to take out as many as they can and then become a name either by killing themselves, being killed or being caught. Which would seem to align with being seriously mentally ill. People have suggested not showing anything about the shooters to dissuade them - kind of like folks running on the field at sporting events. I have no clue if that would have any impact but I definitely don't like that they become "famous".
culdeus
Footballguy
How do you not publish the person's identity if they don't have them in custody (and are pretty sure they know who it was/is)?
I can't say I know very much about the Uvalde shooter from main stream media sources. They did a decent ish job of keeping him under wraps.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
no clue - but I think most people are talking about after the person is caught. The cycle seems to usually go: event happens, perp is caught quickly or within hours, a flood of media coverage happens for 1-2 days and then lessened for a couple weeks until the next one happens. Like I said, I'm not sure if taking that approach would help but I'm personally at a point that I'm willing to try anything to stop these from happening - rather, we seem to not do anything. But I'll stop there as Aaron already asked us to stay on topic.
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Galileo
Footballguy
I would tend to agree with your generalization. But that still troubles me then with regard to the disguise, but leave the evidence strategy. Perhaps truly a sign of the mental incompetence. As for the "we shouldn't show them" mentality. I get it. The instant notoriety/fame is what may appeal to others, but at the same time, I want to know about them. I want to know what, and how, they think. I would like society to fully understand the psychology behind these perpetrators to better understand how to avoid such occurrences in the future. Catch 22.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
The internet sleuths on Twitter and Reddit would spend hours trying to identify the shooter(s) anyway, so they’d become “famous” on social media even if they didn’t on regular media.
Apparently the gun fell out of his bag as he was running away.
In other words, he's a moron.
nirad3
Footballguy
AAABatteries said:
I'm right there with you. If I didn't have older parents to care for, I would seriously consider moving out of the country. With all this gun chaos and where our government is headed (not trying to go all PSF on y'all), it seems like a pretty smart move if you're capable of doing so.
Was definitely feeling much less patriotic the second half of the 4th after hearing the news.
God bless those affected.
beer 30
Footballguy
The thing that hits different with this whackjob is he had a secondary site, that he drove to and just decided not to do. He'll be an interesting psychological study until they kill him. I agree with jobra below, I think he's a moron but he was a prepared moron.
This
tri-man 47
Footballguy
Chicago Tribune lead article this morning on the dysfunctional parents. Police called to the home numerous times between 2010-2014 (which would be when Crimo was 10-14 years old). Mom cited in 2002 for leaving the 2 year old kid in a locked car at a toy store for 27 minutes on a warm day. She received a DUI in 2012. At some point, the parents separated or divorced. Mom’s house had overgrown grass and windows all covered. Crimo lived on the property of his father, but apparently kept to himself, living in some out-building. There was some weird painting on the side of one of the structures of a person with a smiley face head and holding a rifle. Crimo liked to ride around the neighborhood on an electric scooter while blasting heavy metal music.
The article paints a clear picture of an unstable environment.
The article paints a clear picture of an unstable environment.
beer 30
Footballguy
He made his own tiny house and painted the side of the house himself. Love the name of the car too.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10986199/July-Fourth-shooter-Robert-Crimo-built-tiny-home-backyard-parents-house.html
In other news, I saw the police released a pic of the gun he had in his car when he went off to Madison. A Kel-Tec 2000. It's marketed as a back pack gun or truck gun, comes chambered in 9mm or .40 cal. Much less devastating than the 5.56 caliber bullets he was putting into the crowd in Highland Park. Still had the potential for a mass casualty event but he would have had to be on the ground amoungst the crowd to use that gun effectively.
