Both are in good run offenses. Bradshaw has the better QB (at this point in their careers) and passing game around him. Both lose goal line carries. Similar schedules (against run D's) the remainder of the season. But, Bradshaw seems to be running harder and in a slightly better offense (scoring opportunities).
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
A. Bradshaw = to or > than Ray Rice? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Magnum
- Start date
Macdaddy_2004
Footballguy
At this point I can't see how you don't argue that Bradshaw is at least equal to Ray Rice.
He's running better than anyone else in the NFL right now.
He's running better than anyone else in the NFL right now.
remove jacobs and bradshaw is the best RB in FF. (I know... you can say something like this about a few RBs).
Yardage has always been my metric for performance (since TDs bring too much variance to the table). He's sure getting it done. I franchised this guy in the 8th round, and I will be keeping him for a few years.
Yardage has always been my metric for performance (since TDs bring too much variance to the table). He's sure getting it done. I franchised this guy in the 8th round, and I will be keeping him for a few years.
I don't think I would either, but it sure would be tempting (due to Rice previous numbers and draft spot.........obviously dumb reasons to trade, but.....it does play tricks on the brain).
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
No Rice owner would offer you that trade either.
Then everyone's happy.
az_prof
Footballguy
I own both and they are both good; long term, I would rather have Rice because I do worry about some of the nagging injuries Bradshaw has suffered and I think Rice is more likely to be involved in the pass game. Bradshaw is great though and he is running as well as any back in the NFL.
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
I have Bradshaw and would probably give him up for Rice. However, the Rice owner laughs at that offer because Rice has the bigger preseason name recognition.
Yup. But Rice isn't great this year and fantasy season's more than half over. He could turn it around for sure, but to me Bradshaw is the safer bet. Love watching both of these guys run, though.
rjv
Footballguy
+1 I drafted him this season in a keeper league. Will be keeping him for the near future and hope to god he can get his fumble issues under check.
mcintyre1
Footballguy
I could be wrong, but I think Bradshaw is actually the one set to be a FA, whereas Jacobs is sitting on a 2 year deal at $4.5m or so. Consensus is that they resign Bradshaw and Jacobs will be asked to take a pay cut or a roster cut and will tell the Giants to pound sand.
SuperGreen
Footballguy
i have them each of them and it's maddening watching them both get submarined weekly by two less-talented turds.
Last edited by a moderator:
Touchdown There
Footballguy
Called it in March - nice!
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
I own Bradshaw and im trying to move him for Rice to a Giants fan in my league...he has Jacobs and i have McGahee.
Im basing the trade on the playoff schedules more than anything...
Rice has-14-@HOU
15-NO
16-@CLE
Bradshaw has -14-@MIN
15-PHI
16-@GB
Im basing the trade on the playoff schedules more than anything...
Rice has-14-@HOU
15-NO
16-@CLE
Bradshaw has -14-@MIN
15-PHI
16-@GB
I think Bradshaw's "playoff" schedule appears a bit tougher than it actually is. Currently, Minn ranks 11th in ypg allowed, PHI 18th, and GB 23rd (Houston is 13th, NO 16th and CLE 19th). It is important to note that the difference in YPG between MIN at #11 and GB at #23 is a total of 25 ypg.
The Jacket
Footballguy
72 yards and 0 TDs against the worst run D in football while Bradshaw continually tears #### up? Me thinks you're overestimating people's patience. He's one big (and apparently fluke) game against the Broncos away from being the biggest bust in FF.
I tried 2 weeks ago and was turned down by the rice owner. jacobs is killing me
I would trade Rice for Bradshaw in a redraft.
Power Monster
The Midnight Stalker
Common wisdom would say that Hillis > Rice
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
Lot's of reaction to what we've seen so far. Still a lot of season to go and I believe Rice will be the better RB in the end.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
So says the Rice owner...lol
mikel0254
Footballguy
Of course...because anyone who disagrees with the masses must be a Rice owner
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
If you'd bothered to read the whole thread, you may have seen my prior post....
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
The biggest mistake fantasy football owners make is over reacting too quickly.The second biggest mistake fantasy football owners make is waiting to react too long.
We're in week 8. Draft history, past seasons, etc mean squat anymore. Lots of people still don't value guys like McFadden, Bradshaw, etc as top players because that's not where they were drafted. By next year's draft, they'll magically value them as such once they see people drafting them there. That makes guys like Bradshaw and McFadden the buy lows here, not Rice and MJD. There are exceptions, but a slow start through 7 weeks often means a slow finish through the last 9, regardless of the guy's reputation.
6 of last year's top 7 running backs were top 7 running backs through 7 weeks. The only one that wasn't (Gore) only fell outside of that range because he missed several games to injury early on.
9 of last year's top 10 running backs were in the top 15 after 7 weeks. Again, the only one that wasn't was Gore because he missed time early.
Last edited by a moderator:
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
dude i was joking...its what everyone says when they pick one player over another...hahaIf you'd bothered to read the whole thread, you may have seen my prior post....
az_prof
Footballguy
I own both and this is how I see it too. Last season Rice didn't score a lot of TDs early as they used McGahee more early last season. But by the end of the season he was scoring a lot more. I wouldn't trade Rice for Bradshaw in any format and I like both.
the_taint
Footballguy
What he said ...Now THAT is a well written and thought out post. Nice job.
The only thing Rice has over Bradshaw at this point is that Rice has done it before last year, and went through an entire offseason where he was hyped as the next Emmitt Smith. That background gives fantasy football owners more confidence in Rice than they have in Bradshaw, who is more of an enigma as a full-time starter leaking goal-line carries.
Personally, I think that barring injury Bradshaw will outscore Rice this year. But it will be close - it's already fairly close between these two. I'd be just as happy trading Bradshaw to a nervous Rice owner for an upgrade at another position as I would trading Rice to a nervous Bradshaw owner for an upgrade at another position. The difference between these guys (barring injury) is not going to make or break your season IMO.
Personally, I think that barring injury Bradshaw will outscore Rice this year. But it will be close - it's already fairly close between these two. I'd be just as happy trading Bradshaw to a nervous Rice owner for an upgrade at another position as I would trading Rice to a nervous Bradshaw owner for an upgrade at another position. The difference between these guys (barring injury) is not going to make or break your season IMO.
My counter to this argument is that, to the best of my knowledge, there weren't players with the talent level of Rice or MJD residing outside of the top 7 or top 15 last year. There may have been highly touted players that performed the previous year due to situation that were struggling (Forte) or players that were expected to perform based on higher than average touchdown totals (Jacobs), but I can't think of a single elite RB that started slowly last season. There are very good reasons both Rice and MJD have struggled this year and I don't believe any of those reasons have to do with the talent level of the players. Most of it comes down to situation and poor game calling. In the end, talent to the degree that Rice and MJD have it ALWAYS wins out and will overcome situation. You can argue that talent is not winning out with Lee Evans, but he isn't talented on the same scale that Rice and MJD are. As the season progresses (and mind you, we still aren't even halfway through the season), I would be SHOCKED if both of these players didn't end up in the top 15 and/or top 10. That means there are an awful lot of big games ahead for them, making Rice a better fantasy football asset over the 2nd hald of the season than Bradshaw, at least in my opinion.It's very important to determine WHY a player is struggling before giving up on him. You are correct it is a mistake to be too slow to react, but there needs to be a reason why you are reacting. Using last year, it was clear that Forte and Jacobs were struggling because they simply were not that good. If an owner kept playing them because they were highly touted and drafted highly, that would have been an extreme mistake. It was very evident through 7 games that these players were going to continue to struggle for the rest of the season. However, Rice is NOTHING like those players. His struggles have nothing to do with talent, and as such 7 games is not nearly a long enough sample size to really begin downgrading him any.FreeBaGeL said:
Last edited by a moderator:
the_taint
Footballguy
Forte is the 6th best RB in my scoring league this year, ahead of both Bradshaw and Rice. So was he less talented last year than he is this year, or was 2 years ago? Did he just lose his talent for a year? Forte struggled last year because of the team around him, the system, game play, coaching, QB play, etc. As you mention, there are probably 100 reasons that combine for that. So despite Ray Rice's talent (since likewise, I doubt it his is just taking a year off), there are multiple other factors that could quite possibly attribute to him having a down year despite the talent he has. And 7 games is nearly half the fantasy season, what is a relevant sample size if not 7?
Last edited by a moderator:
urbanhack
Fight The Power!
What else should we base our reactions on?
the_taint
Footballguy
Absolutely not- he is the same average to above average talent that he was last year. The difference is that he has had a couple long TD runs (which are an anomoly for him- he is not Peterson or Chris Johnson) and game situation has dictated that he score a few short goal line TD's. Forte stuggled because of the team around him, the system, game play, coaching, and QB play...BUT ALSO BECAUSE HE IS NOT AN ELITE TALENT. The last reason is far and away the most important. His yardage totals have been HORRIBLE this year. To expect him to maintain his pace from a fantasy points standpoint is the EXACT mindset I would warn you against, as I believe there is overwhelming evidence that he will not. There are players that are worth examining and placing in the "do not start" or "undervalued player x is better than overvalued player y" catagory and someone like Forte is a prime exampe of that. In these situations, I think it is ABSOLUTELY crucial to evaluate what has happened thus far and adjust your actions accordingly. When you lack elite talent, you are bound to the situation around you and slow starts should be factored in to a much higher degree. However, when you do possess elite talent, which I think Rice does, you are quite often able to overcome subpar situations and/or less than ideal game situations, making slow starts less of a concern.As I said and you seconded, there are lots of reasons causing Rice to start "slowly" this season, none of which are talent related. My entire premise is that talent, to the degree Rice has it, will overcome most, if not all, of those issues. People are acting like Rice is suddenly a bust, which couldn't be further from the truth. As a poster above mentioned, he actually is relatively close to Bradshaw in terms of production. What has happened is that people are looking at Rice's ADP -vs- Bradshaw's and using that against Rice. It's not that people are overrating Rice because of where he was drafted, in fact quite the opposite is occuring. People are underrating him, becaue Bradshaw was drafted so much later and has thus far slightly outproduced him. Rice is still the more talented player, in my opinion and still the safer bet to produce. One big game suddenly changes everything and would have Rice ahead of Bradshaw. I feel MUCH more comfortable with Rice's ability to have that big game than I do Bradshaw's, hence my statement that Rice is the player to own over the rest of the season.
Last edited by a moderator:
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Bradshaw is a hot commodity in redrafts, but as an owner I think I'd swap him straight up for Rice in dynasty.
the_taint
Footballguy
Actually one big game is all that Rice has had this year. It is just my opinion that this could be a situation where you look back at the end of the year and will be able to find circumstances that held Rice back. I'm not saying that Rice is not talented, although there have been reports he's looked tentative and slow to hit the hole this year. For the record, I also do not think that the very talented MJD will overcome his circumstances this year, and will finish with a down year. Again, 7 weeks there and only 1 good one for him too. Half of a season is enough for me. Steven Jackson is extremely talented too but has been in fantasy hell in Saint Louis wasting his talent over the past handful of years. Talent doesn't always win out.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
I suppose you can react in a couple ways. Assume Bradshaw will be the better back, or assume Rice will. Based on what I know and have seen in the past from the two, from what I know of their current situations, and from what I believe will happen, I'll choose the latter.This is one of the reasons I'd choose Rice between the 2....
