Advanced Auction Tactics Article (1 Viewer)

[Daywalker]

"While you should always get the most value out of your money, trickery, sabotage, and a big mouth are not advisable. For example, when rookie RB Julius Jones was nominated in our dynasty auction, one owner blurted out, "He was just named the starter. Parcells just said it yesterday on ESPN." Why this owner chose to say that is unknown. But regardless of his intentions, this shouldn't happen in a professional league. If you leak this type of info in a draft, you are sabotaging the owners that did their homework. Any owner that was relying solely on a fantasy magazine at that draft wouldn't have known Jones was the starter. Blurting out fresh player info will remove any edge that the more savvy owners worked hard to attain."

You leak positive information on players you don't want to drive the price up. Nothing unprofessional about that. In fact I'd call it an advanced tactic.

 

[Mooks77]

"While you should always get the most value out of your money, trickery, sabotage, and a big mouth are not advisable. For example, when rookie RB Julius Jones was nominated in our dynasty auction, one owner blurted out, "He was just named the starter. Parcells just said it yesterday on ESPN." Why this owner chose to say that is unknown. But regardless of his intentions, this shouldn't happen in a professional league. If you leak this type of info in a draft, you are sabotaging the owners that did their homework. Any owner that was relying solely on a fantasy magazine at that draft wouldn't have known Jones was the starter. Blurting out fresh player info will remove any edge that the more savvy owners worked hard to attain."You leak positive information on players you don't want to drive the price up. Nothing unprofessional about that. In fact I'd call it an advanced tactic.

Maybe that owner didn't want Julius Jones and was using an advanced tactic?

 

[beto]

I agree with the daywalker, say whatever the hell you want to during the auction. Sure a smart guy generally keeps him mouth shut but nothing wrong with talking smack.

What do you care about other owners during an auction?

 

[Chadstroma]

"While you should always get the most value out of your money, trickery, sabotage, and a big mouth are not advisable. For example, when rookie RB Julius Jones was nominated in our dynasty auction, one owner blurted out, "He was just named the starter. Parcells just said it yesterday on ESPN." Why this owner chose to say that is unknown. But regardless of his intentions, this shouldn't happen in a professional league. If you leak this type of info in a draft, you are sabotaging the owners that did their homework. Any owner that was relying solely on a fantasy magazine at that draft wouldn't have known Jones was the starter. Blurting out fresh player info will remove any edge that the more savvy owners worked hard to attain."You leak positive information on players you don't want to drive the price up. Nothing unprofessional about that. In fact I'd call it an advanced tactic.

I disagree in general but the part that tickled me was 'professional league'. I did not know we had the pro leagues going on! All this time I been messing around with amatuers who do not make their livings on playing fantasy league sports. Stupid me.

 

[Tillmanisahero]

I personally think it is rude and can start bad blood that will comeback to haunt you later. What goes around comes around. Most people who do that are nearly as slick as they think they are.

 

[Headbutts]

I found this article almost useless. I know this a football forum, but I gotta say that ~20 years of baseball auctions have taught me a *lot* more than the "advanced" techniques mentioned. If you're having an auction for your football season I highly recommend doing some research on some of the baseball sites on auction strategies.

 

[jdoggydogg]

I found this article almost useless. I know this a football forum, but I gotta say that ~20 years of baseball auctions have taught me a *lot* more than the "advanced" techniques mentioned. If you're having an auction for your football season I highly recommend doing some research on some of the baseball sites on auction strategies.

Sounds like you should write a freelance article next year

 

[jdoggydogg]

"While you should always get the most value out of your money, trickery, sabotage, and a big mouth are not advisable. For example, when rookie RB Julius Jones was nominated in our dynasty auction, one owner blurted out, "He was just named the starter. Parcells just said it yesterday on ESPN." Why this owner chose to say that is unknown. But regardless of his intentions, this shouldn't happen in a professional league. If you leak this type of info in a draft, you are sabotaging the owners that did their homework. Any owner that was relying solely on a fantasy magazine at that draft wouldn't have known Jones was the starter. Blurting out fresh player info will remove any edge that the more savvy owners worked hard to attain."You leak positive information on players you don't want to drive the price up. Nothing unprofessional about that. In fact I'd call it an advanced tactic.

I wrote the article, so I'm willing to debate this. I believe that there needs to be a certain amount of good will in leagues, and I am not saying that because I think it's amoral to use trickery. My contention is that trickery will come back to haunt you. If your league allows trading, there has to be a certain amount of trust involved. If an owner remembers that you are a trickster, why would that owner trust you? You are just another guy trying to pull a fast one in a lopsided trade.

 

[jdoggydogg]

I disagree in general but the part that tickled me was 'professional league'. I did not know we had the pro leagues going on! All this time I been messing around with amatuers who do not make their livings on playing fantasy league sports. Stupid me.

Poor choice of words, maybe?I just wanted to differentiate between a free league where owners pay little attention to their teams and a 15 year old $100 entry league where things are much more serious.

 

[Topes]

Didn't read the article in question. Can't tell from the OP whether he quoted from the article or just pasted everything from the article or if he did both.

Generally, though, I'm of the feeling there shouldn't be such talk during a draft, except in jest. That is, nobody knows if you're lying.

In a couple auctions I attend, this is generally the going culture. In each, however, folks will say stuff after bidding is completed on a player. For instance, Julius breaks his leg going to the bathroom at 4:00 in the morning, and one owner mentions it after he has been drafted for $42. I don't even care for that, as the other owners get their Marion Barber Thinking Tuke on.

Oh well. Ya can't police it.

I talk about players during breaks in the auction. But I never talk about my true intentions, and I BS in such sessions, as well. I do learn from others, though.

 

[Musesboy]

I enjoyed the article, but I have never played in an auction league.

 

[Tillmanisahero]

What I meant by "coming back to haunt you" is that if you sabotage somebodies plans by pimping a player they are interested in so others bid on it more; that team will dislike you and he will share his opinions of you to others. He might also do the same to your intended late round buys.

Casual talk or talk after the bidding players is over is ok but to intentionally "f" somebody auction up is rude.

On your article....I really liked it and love the idea of FBGs having more auction articles is a great idea

 

[Daywalker]

I just don't really see it as poor sportsmanship to hype up a player as there is bidding going on. You don't want other owners to get bargains. It's part of the competition. The nature of an auction in general is to hype up the item.

 

[gman8343]

I enjoyed the article, but I have never played in an auction league.

Good info here.

 

[Tillmanisahero]

Even if you do think it is ok, use is sparingly or others will start to look at you as nothing more than hype pimp. Also be ready to face the treatment.

I am in a league and two years ago we had a guy drink too much and he was hyping guys too much. A couple of brother in the league (different teams) started quietly bidding him up on everyone he wanted to to mess with him.

I think in the end game, he was hurt more than helped by his tactics.

Other players getting deals, if the guys is going to cheap? Bid on him, its all about getting deals. The market determines value.

 

[voldawg]

I don't think its a good idea to talk about players and situations regarding there stock however its a reality and i dont think you can really get rid of it alltogether because guys want to talk football and i dont really see where you could draw the line. i ve even done it by accident.

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. If you are indeed ONLY drafting for value and thats all i could agree. However i dont know anyone who doesnt target at least a few studs. For example I am targeting Alexander($55-60) or Tomlinson ($60-65)this year in my main league($160cap,10 teams),well what i spend on them is going to directly going to affect whether or not i can go after Torry Holt ($35-42)or a Chris Chambers type ($22-27) as my #1 reciever. If i know what i am going to spend on #1RB then I can spend freely on my other positions for value. If i have to overbid on #1 WR and then #1 RB are going for premium ($65-75) then i'm screwed.

So i say find your high-value targets get them out there cause decent owners with other #1 RB's are gonna bring the other studs up anyway you might as well know what you are going to spend as soon as you can.

Now with anyone other than P.Manning,the big three RB's,Gates, and top4-5WR's I say let 'em slide.

What do you all think?

 

[Headbutts]

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. If you are indeed ONLY drafting for value and thats all i could agree. However i dont know anyone who doesnt target at least a few studs. For example I am targeting Alexander($55-60) or Tomlinson ($60-65)this year in my main league($160cap,10 teams),well what i spend on them is going to directly going to affect whether or not i can go after Torry Holt ($35-42)or a Chris Chambers type ($22-27) as my #1 reciever. If i know what i am going to spend on #1RB then I can spend freely on my other positions for value. If i have to overbid on #1 WR and then #1 RB are going for premium ($65-75) then i'm screwed.

There's a school of thought that says if you're willing to go top dollar for a stud throw him out there at your top bid. If somebody's willing to pay more, well make them do it. I did this successfully in a baseball auction this year. Had three top guys on my list, knew I wanted one of them, so opened the bidding when it was my turn to throw out a name at full price. Crickets chirped, I got my guy. If somebody would have outbid me so be it, I would've waited for one of the other two names and immediately raised the bid to my max.There's also been some research on the psychological aspects of auction bidding. There are certain values that some argue are "barriers" to additional bidding. Values ending in nine, for example. Bidders are reluctant to take $29 to $30.Finally, the key to successful auction results is to be unpredictable. In my long-term baseball league I keep notes of each owners' tendencies, i.e., Bill always throws out guys he wants, Dave doesn't. You'd be surprised how consistent some guys are from year to year. Others have changed things up, making them harder to predict. You want to be that way, too.

 

[Tillmanisahero]

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. .What do you all think?

I see your arguement here but it really depends on your group of guys, In our league there three types of guys.a. Guys who what to fill up there roster fast and get good guysb. Guys who what to lay in wait and get lots of bargains laterc. Guys who are looking to sign the biggest names and studs and then fill there roster in with left overs.Because of this, players often go for a lot early then some deals come during the middle time (Gold rush hangover i call it). Then later as the "C" guys panic because there is only one or two studs left they blow their whole proverbial wad ....prices go way up. Then at the end a few Sharks swim in and clean up and get some good deals.

 

[Topes]

I enjoyed the article, but I have never played in an auction league.

Good info here.

Good info here.

 

[jdoggydogg]

Didn't read the article in question. Can't tell from the OP whether he quoted from the article or just pasted everything from the article or if he did both.Generally, though, I'm of the feeling there shouldn't be such talk during a draft, except in jest. That is, nobody knows if you're lying.In a couple auctions I attend, this is generally the going culture. In each, however, folks will say stuff after bidding is completed on a player. For instance, Julius breaks his leg going to the bathroom at 4:00 in the morning, and one owner mentions it after he has been drafted for $42. I don't even care for that, as the other owners get their Marion Barber Thinking Tuke on.Oh well. Ya can't police it.I talk about players during breaks in the auction. But I never talk about my true intentions, and I BS in such sessions, as well. I do learn from others, though.

This is essentially what I was trying to convey.

 

[jdoggydogg]

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. If you are indeed ONLY drafting for value and thats all i could agree. However i dont know anyone who doesnt target at least a few studs. For example I am targeting Alexander($55-60) or Tomlinson ($60-65)this year in my main league($160cap,10 teams),well what i spend on them is going to directly going to affect whether or not i can go after Torry Holt ($35-42)or a Chris Chambers type ($22-27) as my #1 reciever. If i know what i am going to spend on #1RB then I can spend freely on my other positions for value. If i have to overbid on #1 WR and then #1 RB are going for premium ($65-75) then i'm screwed.

Here's why I wrote "never":What do you stand to gain by nominating a player you want?The ultimate goals in an auction format are 1) to get the players you want for a good price.2) facilitate free spending by other owners. Since many owners will have a lot of money early in the draft, you are hoping that the overpriced players (like Peyton, Ladanian, Steve Smith, etc.) will go for more than their realistic value. And they will. It's inevitable. Sure, if you have targeted Peyton in your draft, then you should snag him. But since you want him, how do you benefit from buying him early?

 

[Statorama]

Hmmm, I ALWAYS chirp during an auction draft. I will say anything truthful to get the bidding higher, even if it's one dollar. When I'm in a straight snake draft, I just rag on peoples picks and remind them "you know we're playing for money, right?". In an auction, if two bidders are going at it for TJ Duckett lets say, I will go out of my way to laud Mr TJD. Let's say the biddings stuck at $12, I'll chime in "well, we all know he's getting the goal line carries for Washington this year. If that's all he does, he's a bargain at twice the price, and worth even more if Portis injury is worse than they're letting on"...."are you going to let him bully you like that?"..."ok dude, you've done the homework, you know the guy is going to be a horse for the Skins this year"...

Any dollar I can help squeeze out of an owner is one less dollar I have to bid against for a player I really want.

 

[Disco Stu]

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. If you are indeed ONLY drafting for value and thats all i could agree. However i dont know anyone who doesnt target at least a few studs. For example I am targeting Alexander($55-60) or Tomlinson ($60-65)this year in my main league($160cap,10 teams),well what i spend on them is going to directly going to affect whether or not i can go after Torry Holt ($35-42)or a Chris Chambers type ($22-27) as my #1 reciever. If i know what i am going to spend on #1RB then I can spend freely on my other positions for value. If i have to overbid on #1 WR and then #1 RB are going for premium ($65-75) then i'm screwed.

Here's why I wrote "never":What do you stand to gain by nominating a player you want?The ultimate goals in an auction format are 1) to get the players you want for a good price.2) facilitate free spending by other owners. Since many owners will have a lot of money early in the draft, you are hoping that the overpriced players (like Peyton, Ladanian, Steve Smith, etc.) will go for more than their realistic value. And they will. It's inevitable. Sure, if you have targeted Peyton in your draft, then you should snag him. But since you want him, how do you benefit from buying him early?

There are at least three situations where it can be beneficial to nominate the guy you want...1. Some auctions start slow. The very first guy nominated can go for less than he should as some owners aren't ready to hit the ground running.2. If you have a guy you want plus a fallback guy. It sucks if the fallback guy gets nominated before your main option, and you can easily be left with neither.3. Reverse psychology. Everyone has read not to nominate the players they want, so they'll assume you don't really want the guy. Even if you're bidding, they'll be wondering if you're just trying to "bid him up" in which case they may stop bidding early in an effort to "stick you" with him.

 

[voldawg]

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. If you are indeed ONLY drafting for value and thats all i could agree. However i dont know anyone who doesnt target at least a few studs. For example I am targeting Alexander($55-60) or Tomlinson ($60-65)this year in my main league($160cap,10 teams),well what i spend on them is going to directly going to affect whether or not i can go after Torry Holt ($35-42)or a Chris Chambers type ($22-27) as my #1 reciever. If i know what i am going to spend on #1RB then I can spend freely on my other positions for value. If i have to overbid on #1 WR and then #1 RB are going for premium ($65-75) then i'm screwed.

Here's why I wrote "never":What do you stand to gain by nominating a player you want?The ultimate goals in an auction format are 1) to get the players you want for a good price.2) facilitate free spending by other owners. Since many owners will have a lot of money early in the draft, you are hoping that the overpriced players (like Peyton, Ladanian, Steve Smith, etc.) will go for more than their realistic value. And they will. It's inevitable. Sure, if you have targeted Peyton in your draft, then you should snag him. But since you want him, how do you benefit from buying him early?

First i want to say that it was a good article. However, that it the one thing i Could disagree with you on and should have stated this better.I should have given an example of tiers of players instead of specicfic ones. For example if you want one of the big three and no one brings them up for whatever reason for the 1st 15-20 picks. And say you have picked up some other players it can put you in a situation where you have to settle for a second tier rb if suddenly LJ and LT have gone for say around $60 there is 4 guys who still need a stud rb and alexander is only bonafide stud there. even tho no one (in therory) values alexander as much as lt or lj he COULD go for more say $65-70 cause 4 owners know if they dont get him they re settling for second tier.So i would just say dont count on drafting a guy last in his tier of plyers,especially at RB and WR it can cost you. With the big three-maybe let the first one slide if someone overbids but on the second one i would overbid slightly.The reason why i bring them up is because then after that then i KNOW what i can spend on these other positions and not be guessing. Before you draft your studs i think you are taking a big risk that if the cards fall right you can be shut out of the top guys you want.Of course this is just my opinion but its happened to me in different leagues-hence my strategy

 

[jdoggydogg]

There are at least three situations where it can be beneficial to nominate the guy you want...1. Some auctions start slow. The very first guy nominated can go for less than he should as some owners aren't ready to hit the ground running.2. If you have a guy you want plus a fallback guy. It sucks if the fallback guy gets nominated before your main option, and you can easily be left with neither.3. Reverse psychology. Everyone has read not to nominate the players they want, so they'll assume you don't really want the guy. Even if you're bidding, they'll be wondering if you're just trying to "bid him up" in which case they may stop bidding early in an effort to "stick you" with him.

To answer: 1) How does #1 relate to why you should (or shouldn't) nominate a plery you want?2) If you own Foster and want Deangelo, haven't you formulated how much you want to pay for him?3) I agree

 

[jdoggydogg]

One issue i had with tthat article(and by the way i have been playing successfully it auction fantasy leagues for over twenty years)was where he said to NEVER bring up a player you want. I dont agree. If you are indeed ONLY drafting for value and thats all i could agree. However i dont know anyone who doesnt target at least a few studs. For example I am targeting Alexander($55-60) or Tomlinson ($60-65)this year in my main league($160cap,10 teams),well what i spend on them is going to directly going to affect whether or not i can go after Torry Holt ($35-42)or a Chris Chambers type ($22-27) as my #1 reciever. If i know what i am going to spend on #1RB then I can spend freely on my other positions for value. If i have to overbid on #1 WR and then #1 RB are going for premium ($65-75) then i'm screwed.

Here's why I wrote "never":What do you stand to gain by nominating a player you want?The ultimate goals in an auction format are 1) to get the players you want for a good price.2) facilitate free spending by other owners. Since many owners will have a lot of money early in the draft, you are hoping that the overpriced players (like Peyton, Ladanian, Steve Smith, etc.) will go for more than their realistic value. And they will. It's inevitable. Sure, if you have targeted Peyton in your draft, then you should snag him. But since you want him, how do you benefit from buying him early?

First i want to say that it was a good article. However, that it the one thing i Could disagree with you on and should have stated this better.I should have given an example of tiers of players instead of specicfic ones. For example if you want one of the big three and no one brings them up for whatever reason for the 1st 15-20 picks. And say you have picked up some other players it can put you in a situation where you have to settle for a second tier rb if suddenly LJ and LT have gone for say around $60 there is 4 guys who still need a stud rb and alexander is only bonafide stud there. even tho no one (in therory) values alexander as much as lt or lj he COULD go for more say $65-70 cause 4 owners know if they dont get him they re settling for second tier.So i would just say dont count on drafting a guy last in his tier of plyers,especially at RB and WR it can cost you. With the big three-maybe let the first one slide if someone overbids but on the second one i would overbid slightly.The reason why i bring them up is because then after that then i KNOW what i can spend on these other positions and not be guessing. Before you draft your studs i think you are taking a big risk that if the cards fall right you can be shut out of the top guys you want.Of course this is just my opinion but its happened to me in different leagues-hence my strategy

That's all well said, and I see your point. But aren't you pre-deciding how much you want to spend on all your target players? If you think Ben Watson is a good dark horse pick, isn't he worth saving 10% of your cap space regardless of the other players being picked?

 

[Disco Stu]

There are at least three situations where it can be beneficial to nominate the guy you want...1. Some auctions start slow. The very first guy nominated can go for less than he should as some owners aren't ready to hit the ground running.2. If you have a guy you want plus a fallback guy. It sucks if the fallback guy gets nominated before your main option, and you can easily be left with neither.3. Reverse psychology. Everyone has read not to nominate the players they want, so they'll assume you don't really want the guy. Even if you're bidding, they'll be wondering if you're just trying to "bid him up" in which case they may stop bidding early in an effort to "stick you" with him.

To answer: 1) How does #1 relate to why you should (or shouldn't) nominate a plery you want?2) If you own Foster and want Deangelo, haven't you formulated how much you want to pay for him?3) I agree

1. If you are on the clock to start the auction, nominate the #1 player on your board. This is especially true this year, IMO. With many owners hoping to get "any one of the Big 3 RBs", it's good if the one you want is nominated first. Others may hold back thinking maybe one of the others will be cheaper.2. I think you misunderstood what I meant by "fallback". I don't want my main guy AND my fallback. I want my main guy, but if I don't get him then I'll settle for my fallback. For example, say I want Parker; and McGahee is my fallback. If McGahee gets nominated before Parker, I'd be hesitant as the bidding approached my target price... thinking "I'll be kicking myself if Parker goes for the same amount or less". So I let McGahee go, then In my experience no highly ranked player is going to completely slip through the cracks, so it's not a bad idea to get your guy out there before he becomes the last player in his tier.That said, I'll spend most of the auction nominating players who I consider overrated.

 

[Wilbur Wood]

There are at least three situations where it can be beneficial to nominate the guy you want...1. Some auctions start slow. The very first guy nominated can go for less than he should as some owners aren't ready to hit the ground running.2. If you have a guy you want plus a fallback guy. It sucks if the fallback guy gets nominated before your main option, and you can easily be left with neither.3. Reverse psychology. Everyone has read not to nominate the players they want, so they'll assume you don't really want the guy. Even if you're bidding, they'll be wondering if you're just trying to "bid him up" in which case they may stop bidding early in an effort to "stick you" with him.

To answer: 1) How does #1 relate to why you should (or shouldn't) nominate a plery you want?2) If you own Foster and want Deangelo, haven't you formulated how much you want to pay for him?3) I agree

I "stole" Clinton Portis in an auction last year in an experienced league. Portis' stock was somewhat down given his 2004 season, but he still should have gone for mid $50's in this league. I led off the action and instead of tossing out the obvious pick of LT or Alexander, I threw out Portis for $30 and ended up owning him for $35. Prices hadn't yet been established (although everyone knew that the top RBs would go for ~ $80+) and no one was that excited about spending real money on a less sexy RB without knowing if they were going to be in the running for some guys that they really wanted.

 

[CalBear]

There's also been some research on the psychological aspects of auction bidding. There are certain values that some argue are "barriers" to additional bidding. Values ending in nine, for example. Bidders are reluctant to take $29 to $30.

I did some analysis of my league's previous years of drafting: it's a $100 league with 25-cent bidding intervals, and I found that auctions were rarely won "on the quarters" at $x.25 or $x.75. I've been able to use that information to bid up players I didn't want (by bidding on the quarters, where the other guy is more likely to overbid), and to save myself money by jumping straight to whole numbers on players who I do want.