Albert Breer alleges VJax and Mankins stand strong on 10 million! (1 Viewer)

[Holy Schneikes]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=jc-cole_nfl_players_own_worst_enemies_072011

As usual Jason Cole tries to be provocative rather than insightful. His premise fails because that lawsuit was, from the very start, the brainchild not of the plaintiffs but by the NFLPA. It was a device FOR THE GOOD OF THE WHOLE, and those named plaintiffs may deserve credit for adding their names to the case, but never once had any legal experts suggested that by doing so they were taking on legitimate personal risks. It was always understood, by all sides (players, owners, and fans) that that lawsuit was a means to getting a resolution for the entirety of the player population. So now that we have that in sight, to somehow make the case that they DESERVE some kind of special kicker? Ridiculous, and flies in the face of the spirit of why they did it in the first place.Do those guys deserve kudos from their fellow players for being on the front lines? ABSOLUTELY.

But should they get extra rewards that could very well have mucked up the solution for the entirety of the player pool? Of course not.

I think you presume a great deal of knowledge you don't have. Were you in the meetings when the lawsuit was filed? Do you know what may or may not have been presented to these guys BY the NFLPA as possible outcomes (other than the obvious "You might win the lawsuit.")?You as a fan may have "understood" that the lawsuit was strictly for show, but you didn't lose multiple millions of dollars last year because of the way the previous CBA played out.

Just as my previous post indicated, it looks a bit like the guys that actually LOST money in this deal, are not all that happy with just being used for their names/situations by the NFLPA without any real involvement with the negotiations. For the good of the whole sounds great, but what did most players lose last year because the owners and the NFLPA BETWEEN THEM couldn't get a deal done? Nothing. What did the RFA guys lose? A bunch. Why would it possibly be ridiculous that the ONLY guys to really lose anything through this mess actually get something back?

Repeating what I said before, if they are to "get something back", why should the owners be the ones to have to provide them with that? If the NFLPA chose not to come to an agreement on a CBA to avoid those terms, why aren't they the ones supplying them their $10 million? The players were the ones behind the last CBA extension that was a bad deal for the owners and led to the opt out and the terms that caused VJax/Mankins to miss free agency.

And repeating what I said before, I don't think it IS all on the owners to make sure that happens. There's a big pot of money these guys are trying to figure out what to do with. I'm just saying it's not unreasonable to think that something from that pot should go to to the only only guys who have thus far actually lost money. You don't have to think about it as coming from one side or the other if you don't want to. I'm not saying 10M is the right number even if it is a legit report. But SOMETHING is not at all crazy to ask for considering the circumstances and the size of the pot.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Lets not forget... They signed the last contract they and their agent negotiated, they didn't have to sign those deals.They felt entitled so they held out, they knew the league rules when the joined the NFL, they are nothing special.Their demands are selfish, disrespectful to the other players in the league, and arrogant. If anything, they should be the ones not even barking, they held out and dishonored the deal.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Neither one held out, both played out their deals, and were held up as restricted free agents because the owners opted out of the CBA. They both were cost the opportunity to be free agents, resulting in both playing for below-market contracts, that cost them millions. That they will never get back.

No response. Typical. These guys have lost millions due to the greed of the owners and they should be good little soldiers now. Bull####.

If they were that worried about missing on unrestricted FA they should have kept this in mind prior to negotiating their contract.

What contract are you talking about? Their rookie contracts? They were supposed to predict this would happen back in 2005? And what exactly would they have done to prevent the situation even if they could have predicted it? There is NOTHING Jackson/Mankins could have done then that would have prevented them getting screwed last year. Jackson signed a typical 5 year rookie deal. He played the whole way through it, and was drastically underpaid compared to his peers over the life of it. Then he got the extra little bonus of being hosed by the expiring CBA/his GM.The NFLPA told him he was on his own last year, and then asked him to sign up to the lawsuit against the league (because he was obviously F'd over) to help them out. Then they abandoned him again. Everyone's #####ing about the only guys in this mess who did nothing to create the problem and were the only ones to suffer from it. It's mind-boggling really.

 

[Liquid Tension]

Vjax has the same agents as Revis... Not sure about Mankins..

These guys had the Jets brass going insane with their demands and we all saw what Vjax did last year. Same with Roddy White.

I know their job is to get the most $$$$$ possible - But, if I were a player I'd value where I played, who I played for and how much money my team had to spend on others as well because #1 I would want to Win.

There's only so much of the Salary cap pie to take...

You should go into work today, kiss/hug and of your colleges, march into the bosses office and tell him you'll work for 1 10th of what you're worth..V-jax did nothing wrong last year.. Have no clue what you're talking about. If your boss wanted to pay you 1/10th of your worth, you'd do what you had to do to protect your future... Not sure about the Revis situation, that's closer to you, and I don't remember the story, but don't get the 2 confused. V-Jax got screwed over royally last year..

I agree to an extent, as the above bolded initially...it is easy for us to say what we would/wouldn't do, when we only deal with the "sport" of football.The players/coaches deal with the "business" of football.

I agree with the OP, as a fan, I would take all that into account...as a business, when you see so many of your friends, teammates get kicked to the curb after 2 good years of service because you tore your ACL last year, and are not worth the contract you signed, you probably consider the business end a lot more then you do the sports end.

I do not agree at all with Carolina Hustler. I think most people think they are worth more than they are making. When you compare to what some people make that are not that sharp even more so. However, the main point is that VJ signed a contract and he did not want to honor it. He signed a contract knowing the rules so what is he upset about? What if he played poorly and was paid far more than he was worth (like many people)? You sign your deal and try and get us much as you feel appropriate taking into account that you want to win also...then you shut the heck up and honor it. Just one other note, if someone so far exceeds their contract, it would be fruitful for both parties to work on something, but again a contract is a contract.

Dealing with any labor change rules that impact VJ, that is a different story and to me that changes the agreement in his contract and he does have a legitimate beef

 

[Moniker]

I do not agree at all with Carolina Hustler. I think most people think they are worth more than they are making. When you compare to what some people make that are not that sharp even more so. However, the main point is that VJ signed a contract and he did not want to honor it. He signed a contract knowing the rules so what is he upset about? What if he played poorly and was paid far more than he was worth (like many people)? You sign your deal and try and get us much as you feel appropriate taking into account that you want to win also...then you shut the heck up and honor it.

Just one other note, if someone so far exceeds their contract, it would be fruitful for both parties to work on something, but again a contract is a contract.

Dealing with any labor change rules that impact VJ, that is a different story and to me that changes the agreement in his contract and he does have a legitimate beef

He would have been cut, and no - in the NFL a contract isn't a contract.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Vjax has the same agents as Revis... Not sure about Mankins..

These guys had the Jets brass going insane with their demands and we all saw what Vjax did last year. Same with Roddy White.

I know their job is to get the most $$$$$ possible - But, if I were a player I'd value where I played, who I played for and how much money my team had to spend on others as well because #1 I would want to Win.

There's only so much of the Salary cap pie to take...

You should go into work today, kiss/hug and of your colleges, march into the bosses office and tell him you'll work for 1 10th of what you're worth..V-jax did nothing wrong last year.. Have no clue what you're talking about. If your boss wanted to pay you 1/10th of your worth, you'd do what you had to do to protect your future... Not sure about the Revis situation, that's closer to you, and I don't remember the story, but don't get the 2 confused. V-Jax got screwed over royally last year..

I agree to an extent, as the above bolded initially...it is easy for us to say what we would/wouldn't do, when we only deal with the "sport" of football.The players/coaches deal with the "business" of football.

I agree with the OP, as a fan, I would take all that into account...as a business, when you see so many of your friends, teammates get kicked to the curb after 2 good years of service because you tore your ACL last year, and are not worth the contract you signed, you probably consider the business end a lot more then you do the sports end.

I do not agree at all with Carolina Hustler. I think most people think they are worth more than they are making. When you compare to what some people make that are not that sharp even more so. However, the main point is that VJ signed a contract and he did not want to honor it. He signed a contract knowing the rules so what is he upset about? What if he played poorly and was paid far more than he was worth (like many people)? You sign your deal and try and get us much as you feel appropriate taking into account that you want to win also...then you shut the heck up and honor it. Just one other note, if someone so far exceeds their contract, it would be fruitful for both parties to work on something, but again a contract is a contract.

Dealing with any labor change rules that impact VJ, that is a different story and to me that changes the agreement in his contract and he does have a legitimate beef

Just to emphasize: Neither of those guys was under contract last year. Both played through their ENTIRE contacts. There WAS NO HOLD OUT. They simply weren't offered deal even CLOSE to their UFA market value and didn't want to play under those circumstances. The issue was that while every other player in the modern NFL who had 5+ years of service got to be an unrestricted FA at the end of their deals, those guys were slapped with RFA status and got lowballed by their teams because of it. So they had no contract, but couldn't deal with any other teams in an "open" way. That's why they were on the lawsuit to begin with.Sorry for the tone, but this discussion is exceptionally frustrating. It seems like 3/4 of the opinions are based on a complete misunderstanding of the situation (not that you are necessarily one of them, I'm not exactly sure). I don't mind differing opinions, but it kind of drives me nuts when a lot of them are based on obvious misconceptions (including the OP).

 

[Flying Elvis]

^ To be fair, from all accounts the Patriots offered a deal that was CLOSE to Mankins' UFA value. The Chargers completely lowballed Jackson from the start and even firebombed him in reported trade offers (Vikings) to boot.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

^ To be fair, from all accounts the Patriots offered a deal that was CLOSE to Mankins' UFA value. The Chargers completely lowballed Jackson from the start and even firebombed him in reported trade offers (Vikings) to boot.

I stand corrected. I was speaking mostly from the Jackson perspective.

 

[BigJim®]

I can't believe anybody is actually siding with these two.

 

[massraider]

^ To be fair, from all accounts the Patriots offered a deal that was CLOSE to Mankins' UFA value. The Chargers completely lowballed Jackson from the start and even firebombed him in reported trade offers (Vikings) to boot.

A very good point. Hey, I am not saying anyone should feel BAD for these guys. But look, take the dollar amounts out of it. Pretend this was a regular career, but one that you would be lucky to have for 10 years. Say you were making 50 grand, a number you were forced to take coming out of college. And in any other year, you could expect to sign a contract anywhere you like. For 200 grand. But due to circumstances beyond your control, you were forced to work at your old job for a minimal salary. Losing over 100 grand, that you cannot make up, would stick in your craw. And now, on top of that, it looks like after losing a year of FA, that they won't be able to be free agents AGAIN? Sorry, but if any of us were running these guy's careers, we wouldn't be happy.People are a lot more cavalier with other people's money, that's for sure.

 

[Our Gang]

Lets not forget... They signed the last contract they and their agent negotiated, they didn't have to sign those deals.

The point is they didn't sign anything. Their free agency was taken away from them by the owners opting out of the CBA (which was the deal negotiated between the players and owners) and implemented new rules which were unfair to 5th year and 6th year players whose contracts had expired.You're thinking as a fan that just wants his football back, not as a human being or business man. Once again going after what you feel you deserve is not being greedy or selfish.

Did they get screwed? Yes. Did they know that their was the possibility of getting screwed? If they had a good agent the should have. Everybody knew there was a great chance of the owners opting out of the CBA. Fair, unfair, whatever...these guys may get their 10 and may not ever get a dime more if that is being reported is true.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Lets not forget... They signed the last contract they and their agent negotiated, they didn't have to sign those deals.They felt entitled so they held out, they knew the league rules when the joined the NFL, they are nothing special.Their demands are selfish, disrespectful to the other players in the league, and arrogant. If anything, they should be the ones not even barking, they held out and dishonored the deal.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Neither one held out, both played out their deals, and were held up as restricted free agents because the owners opted out of the CBA. They both were cost the opportunity to be free agents, resulting in both playing for below-market contracts, that cost them millions. That they will never get back.

No response. Typical. These guys have lost millions due to the greed of the owners and they should be good little soldiers now. Bull####.

If they were that worried about missing on unrestricted FA they should have kept this in mind prior to negotiating their contract.

What contract are you talking about? Their rookie contracts? They were supposed to predict this would happen back in 2005? And what exactly would they have done to prevent the situation even if they could have predicted it? There is NOTHING Jackson/Mankins could have done then that would have prevented them getting screwed last year. Jackson signed a typical 5 year rookie deal. He played the whole way through it, and was drastically underpaid compared to his peers over the life of it. Then he got the extra little bonus of being hosed by the expiring CBA/his GM.The NFLPA told him he was on his own last year, and then asked him to sign up to the lawsuit against the league (because he was obviously F'd over) to help them out. Then they abandoned him again. Everyone's #####ing about the only guys in this mess who did nothing to create the problem and were the only ones to suffer from it. It's mind-boggling really.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Lets not forget... They signed the last contract they and their agent negotiated, they didn't have to sign those deals.

The point is they didn't sign anything. Their free agency was taken away from them by the owners opting out of the CBA (which was the deal negotiated between the players and owners) and implemented new rules which were unfair to 5th year and 6th year players whose contracts had expired.You're thinking as a fan that just wants his football back, not as a human being or business man. Once again going after what you feel you deserve is not being greedy or selfish.

Did they get screwed? Yes. Did they know that their was the possibility of getting screwed? If they had a good agent the should have. Everybody knew there was a great chance of the owners opting out of the CBA. Fair, unfair, whatever...these guys may get their 10 and may not ever get a dime more if that is being reported is true.

And what should they or their agents have done differently back in 2005? They signed standard five year rookie deals and played them out. People keep acting like these guys could have avoided the situation they were put in, but all they did was what everyone else was doing at the same time. The only difference is that MOST of the guys who outperformed their contracts have already held out or just had their deals extended/reworked, and they didn't. That's the only thing they COULD have done to help themselves, held out the year before their contracts expired. But I seriously doubt most of the folks #####ing about them now think that is what they should have done, and it may or may not have worked anyway.And as for never playing/getting paid again, I don't think you could really mean that. If they can play, they will get signed no matter what happens as a result of the CBA/settlement. Teams don't care about a guy's background if he can help the team. Even if they did get blackballed (which I very much doubt), they could easily just sue again.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Vjax has the same agents as Revis... Not sure about Mankins..

These guys had the Jets brass going insane with their demands and we all saw what Vjax did last year. Same with Roddy White.

I know their job is to get the most $$$$$ possible - But, if I were a player I'd value where I played, who I played for and how much money my team had to spend on others as well because #1 I would want to Win.

There's only so much of the Salary cap pie to take...

You should go into work today, kiss/hug and of your colleges, march into the bosses office and tell him you'll work for 1 10th of what you're worth..V-jax did nothing wrong last year.. Have no clue what you're talking about. If your boss wanted to pay you 1/10th of your worth, you'd do what you had to do to protect your future... Not sure about the Revis situation, that's closer to you, and I don't remember the story, but don't get the 2 confused. V-Jax got screwed over royally last year..

I agree to an extent, as the above bolded initially...it is easy for us to say what we would/wouldn't do, when we only deal with the "sport" of football.The players/coaches deal with the "business" of football.

I agree with the OP, as a fan, I would take all that into account...as a business, when you see so many of your friends, teammates get kicked to the curb after 2 good years of service because you tore your ACL last year, and are not worth the contract you signed, you probably consider the business end a lot more then you do the sports end.

I do not agree at all with Carolina Hustler. I think most people think they are worth more than they are making. When you compare to what some people make that are not that sharp even more so. However, the main point is that VJ signed a contract and he did not want to honor it. He signed a contract knowing the rules so what is he upset about? What if he played poorly and was paid far more than he was worth (like many people)? You sign your deal and try and get us much as you feel appropriate taking into account that you want to win also...then you shut the heck up and honor it. Just one other note, if someone so far exceeds their contract, it would be fruitful for both parties to work on something, but again a contract is a contract.

Dealing with any labor change rules that impact VJ, that is a different story and to me that changes the agreement in his contract and he does have a legitimate beef

"Some people think they are worth more than they are getting paid" And if they were getting paid 1/10 (exaggeration...) of their true value, they would be right... He wasn't getting paid 15% under market value, or 25% even... He was getting less than half...If he had paid poorly, and wasn't producing what he was earning, he would have likely been cut.. Right? You're suggesting the Chargers would have been stuck with his contract? Besides, he didn't play poorly..

His contract had already expired, and he was f-ed over by a loophole created by the situation of the OWNERS opting out of the CBA.

So, let me get this straight, he was supposed to assume that even if he out played his rookie contract, that his team would bum-F him and not compensate him with a new contract? Or that the owners would eventually opt out of the CBA, and that there would be no new CBA in place? And he was supposed to run through the gambit of every possible consequence to those potential outcomes? Did he have an option here? To avoid it? I would think most would do the best job they could, play nice, and expect to be treated fairly.. Wouldn't you?

Bottom line, and easy to understand, the guy WAAAY outplayed his rookie contract.. Then was expected to continue to produce for them at an all star level, after his contract had expired, for peanuts, based on some unforeseen, and ridiculous loophole, the OWNERS caused? And he's greedy? For trying to be compensated fairly? After being the good soldier and out playing his rookie contract, for the duration of the contract?... Other players would have tried to force a new contract the final year of the rookie contract..

Guy got boned royal... There is no excuse..

 

[craxie]

However, the main point is that VJ signed a contract and he did not want to honor it.

falsehe fully played out his contract without complaint

 

[craxie]

Did they know that their was the possibility of getting screwed?

What difference does that make?The CBA extension with the possibility of opt-out was done AFTER he signed his rookie contract.At that point, there was nothing he could do.So how does foreknowledge that he could be screwed suddenly make it alright?

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Lets not forget... They signed the last contract they and their agent negotiated, they didn't have to sign those deals.

The point is they didn't sign anything. Their free agency was taken away from them by the owners opting out of the CBA (which was the deal negotiated between the players and owners) and implemented new rules which were unfair to 5th year and 6th year players whose contracts had expired.You're thinking as a fan that just wants his football back, not as a human being or business man. Once again going after what you feel you deserve is not being greedy or selfish.

Did they get screwed? Yes. Did they know that their was the possibility of getting screwed? If they had a good agent the should have. Everybody knew there was a great chance of the owners opting out of the CBA. Fair, unfair, whatever...these guys may get their 10 and may not ever get a dime more if that is being reported is true.

Would a good agent have told Vincent Jackson to come out of college a year earlier or a year later? This was his rookie deal he was playing under - there was no choice.

 

[Truman]

The lockout would be over by now if AJ Smith wasn't such an #######.

 

[J-Dawg]

The lockout would be over by now if AJ Smith wasn't such an #######.

Wrong. I don't agree with everything that AJ Smith has ever done, but if Vincent Jackson hadn't had so many off-field issues then Smith wouldn't be so hesitant to sign him to a long-term deal. V-Jax's knucklehead factor is a huge reason why he hasn't got paid yet. Take those away and the GM will take care of him so the blame falls squarely on Jackson's shoulders. If I'm a GM, I'm not investing tons of money into a guy I don't trust to keep his nose clean.

 

[JuSt CuZ]

The lockout would be over by now if AJ Smith wasn't such an #######.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

 

[craxie]

but if Vincent Jackson hadn't had so many off-field issues then Smith wouldn't be so hesitant to sign him to a long-term deal.

Just like he didn't hesitate to sign Floyd or McNeill.Oh wait . . .

 

[Holy Schneikes]

The lockout would be over by now if AJ Smith wasn't such an #######.

Wrong. I don't agree with everything that AJ Smith has ever done, but if Vincent Jackson hadn't had so many off-field issues then Smith wouldn't be so hesitant to sign him to a long-term deal. V-Jax's knucklehead factor is a huge reason why he hasn't got paid yet. Take those away and the GM will take care of him so the blame falls squarely on Jackson's shoulders. If I'm a GM, I'm not investing tons of money into a guy I don't trust to keep his nose clean.

I don't think this is all AJs fault. But yet another common misconception is that he had to either sign Vjax to a long term deal or do what he did. His very reasonable OTHER alternative was to sign him for a remotely reasonable ONE year deal. That may not have forestalled the current situation, but it wouldn't have hurt.

 

[thayman]

Vjax has the same agents as Revis... Not sure about Mankins..

These guys had the Jets brass going insane with their demands and we all saw what Vjax did last year. Same with Roddy White.

I know their job is to get the most $$$$$ possible - But, if I were a player I'd value where I played, who I played for and how much money my team had to spend on others as well because #1 I would want to Win.

There's only so much of the Salary cap pie to take...

You should go into work today, kiss/hug and of your colleges, march into the bosses office and tell him you'll work for 1 10th of what you're worth..V-jax did nothing wrong last year.. Have no clue what you're talking about. If your boss wanted to pay you 1/10th of your worth, you'd do what you had to do to protect your future... Not sure about the Revis situation, that's closer to you, and I don't remember the story, but don't get the 2 confused. V-Jax got screwed over royally last year..

I agree to an extent, as the above bolded initially...it is easy for us to say what we would/wouldn't do, when we only deal with the "sport" of football.The players/coaches deal with the "business" of football.

I agree with the OP, as a fan, I would take all that into account...as a business, when you see so many of your friends, teammates get kicked to the curb after 2 good years of service because you tore your ACL last year, and are not worth the contract you signed, you probably consider the business end a lot more then you do the sports end.

I do not agree at all with Carolina Hustler. I think most people think they are worth more than they are making. When you compare to what some people make that are not that sharp even more so. However, the main point is that VJ signed a contract and he did not want to honor it. He signed a contract knowing the rules so what is he upset about? What if he played poorly and was paid far more than he was worth (like many people)? You sign your deal and try and get us much as you feel appropriate taking into account that you want to win also...then you shut the heck up and honor it. Just one other note, if someone so far exceeds their contract, it would be fruitful for both parties to work on something, but again a contract is a contract.

Dealing with any labor change rules that impact VJ, that is a different story and to me that changes the agreement in his contract and he does have a legitimate beef

"Some people think they are worth more than they are getting paid" And if they were getting paid 1/10 (exaggeration...) of their true value, they would be right... He wasn't getting paid 15% under market value, or 25% even... He was getting less than half...If he had paid poorly, and wasn't producing what he was earning, he would have likely been cut.. Right? You're suggesting the Chargers would have been stuck with his contract? Besides, he didn't play poorly..

His contract had already expired, and he was f-ed over by a loophole created by the situation of the OWNERS opting out of the CBA.

So, let me get this straight, he was supposed to assume that even if he out played his rookie contract, that his team would bum-F him and not compensate him with a new contract? Or that the owners would eventually opt out of the CBA, and that there would be no new CBA in place? And he was supposed to run through the gambit of every possible consequence to those potential outcomes? Did he have an option here? To avoid it? I would think most would do the best job they could, play nice, and expect to be treated fairly.. Wouldn't you?

Bottom line, and easy to understand, the guy WAAAY outplayed his rookie contract.. Then was expected to continue to produce for them at an all star level, after his contract had expired, for peanuts, based on some unforeseen, and ridiculous loophole, the OWNERS caused? And he's greedy? For trying to be compensated fairly? After being the good soldier and out playing his rookie contract, for the duration of the contract?... Other players would have tried to force a new contract the final year of the rookie contract..

Guy got boned royal... There is no excuse..

I've read more into this, it does seem they got slighted a bit. I wouldn't say The OWNERS screwed him, I would say the OWNER of the Patriots and the Chargers screwed them. I don't recall Roddy White or Aaron Rodgers having similar issues.

 

[Phantom Knight]

Lets not forget... They signed the last contract they and their agent negotiated, they didn't have to sign those deals.

This is the bottom line. You sign a contract. You honor it. Period. If you think you have proved you deserve more, you ask management to tear up the contract and offer a new one. If they say no... honor your word. Then move on when the contract you signed expires.ETA: I spoke without knowing completely the contract status of the two. I stand by my original comment generally speaking, but it seems that it does not apply to Jackson and Mankins.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

The lockout would be over by now if AJ Smith wasn't such an #######.

Wrong. I don't agree with everything that AJ Smith has ever done, but if Vincent Jackson hadn't had so many off-field issues then Smith wouldn't be so hesitant to sign him to a long-term deal. V-Jax's knucklehead factor is a huge reason why he hasn't got paid yet. Take those away and the GM will take care of him so the blame falls squarely on Jackson's shoulders. If I'm a GM, I'm not investing tons of money into a guy I don't trust to keep his nose clean.

Nonsense... He had 2 DUI's... that's not nearly even in the ballpark when teams start deciding whether or not a guy is a character risk. V-Jax is actually know to be a good attitude, good character guy.. You're pulling this "knucklehead" thing out of your rear-end..

 

[cobalt_27]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year. I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year. I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

 

[cobalt_27]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So you're saying he shouldn't even make an ATTEMPT to re-gain that money for fear of holding this thing up another day.. cause jeeze 1 more day is going to be the end all... Wow.. not sure what logic some of you are using..

 

[cobalt_27]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

 

[AmosMoses]

Some of you guys are crazy. Vincent Jackson is no Curt Flood. He's a dude that is shaking down his union brothers.

 

[fatness]

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

Like the owners did when they locked the players out?

 

[KellysHeroes]

I thought the franchise tag could use on any player in the previous yrs

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Some of you guys are crazy. Vincent Jackson is no Curt Flood. He's a dude that is shaking down his union brothers.

Where were his union brothers last year when he was taking it in the bum? Oh that's right, they said, sorry brother, nothing we can do for you - you are on your own. We couldn't get a deal done, so you are the one left holding the bag. We know where his brothers were when they had their hands out asking him to help them. They were easy to find then. But the funny thing is, immediately after that, they disappeared again. But hey, I'm sure they were looking out for him. Oh wait, all the guys who DIDN'T get the bum F are coming out smelling like a rose, but those guys? Suck it up brother, take one for the team. It's ALWAYS easy to tell some other schmo to take one for the team. But if you happen to be that schmo, I'll bet your position isn't quite so clear.Like someone else said, this is just another piece of the negotiation puzzle. Everything else was worked out, and this one was swept under the rug by all parties - including the ones that were supposed to be in their corner. This COULD have been the first item on the docket if they wanted it to be, or anywhere in between then and now. But they pushed it to the back of the line and now everyone is pissed that it is "holding up" a deal. I'll bet Jackson and Mankins would have been very pleased to have this issue dealt with earlier.Brotherhood is a two way street my friend.

 

[cobalt_27]

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

Like the owners did when they locked the players out?

No.

 

[cobalt_27]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Depends on the circumstances. I'm sorry VJax feels he got screwed* here, but the reality is, he suffered a little bit of bad luck, got really pissy about it, and has been up to this point ready to hold up the whole show so that he can get his. Of course by now he has dropped that demand, so it sounds from schefter. In his circumstance I suspect I would not have chosen his strategy. But if I felt I had been defrauded, which is not what happened to VJax, and out of that I lost 50%, hell yeah I'd fight it. But that's not what happened here.

ETA: Apologies for unintentional, but derogatory, choice of words earlier

 

[JuSt CuZ]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

Walked on? VJax plays in the NFL, he is hardly walked on.Can we stop treating these guys like they are hard honest working people....they are not, they are selfish, arrogant people, who think they are entitled. VJax is now my most hated player in the NFL. I hope owners collude against him and dont sign him to any team. Lets see how much his drunk driving ### is worth then.

Blah Blah blah, he only got 575 thow last year....whah whah, maybe he should invest instead of buying a ton of cars to drive under the influence.

 

[fatness]

Can we stop treating these guys like they are hard honest working people....they are not, they are selfish, arrogant people, who think they are entitled.

Owners or players?

 

[JuSt CuZ]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Why would Cobalt or anyone answer these questions? They are dumb as heck, no offense. How can you compare the NFL contracts to anything an average person deals with?Also, remember these arrogant players do not HAVE to play football, they CHOOSE to.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Depends on the circumstances. I'm sorry VJax feels he got jipped here, but the reality is, he suffered a little bit of bad luck, got really pissy about it, and has been up to this point ready to hold up the whole show so that he can get his. Of course by now he has dropped that demand, so it sounds from schefter. In his circumstance I suspect I would not have chosen his strategy. But if I felt I had been defrauded, which is not what happened to VJax, and out of that I lost 50%, hell yeah I'd fight it. But that's not what happened here.

Getting 30% at best of your $11M worth on the open market (which you should have been part of) through ZERO fault of your own, AFTER playing out your full, extremely underpaying rookie deal, is not "a little bit of bad luck". It's a full blown hose-job. One that when the NFLPA wanted leverage, was a serious enough hose-job that it was featured in a law suit against the league. How bout we set you up to get ridiculously underpaid for the next five years while watching guys with a TENTH of your production and skill make five times more than you at your same company in your same position. Then when your first real pay day is supposed to come, and your true value is supposed to kick in for the first time, we just tell, sorry, we are going to offer you 30% of your value for the SIXTH year (that no other similar employee has ever had to do until now). Then we tell you you aren't allowed to seek a job elsewhere, take it or leave it. Yup, just a little bad luck, don't worry about it.So it's not fraud. I'm not sure anyone ever said that it was, and I'm not sure what it has to do with anything. But they got ROYALLY hosed, and it doesn't matter much WHO you blame it on. The only guys you can't blame it on, are the guys who paid the price for it. You want to blame it on the NFLPA, fine. Those particular owners, fine. The league as a whole, fine. But not the guys everybody WANTS to blame it on, the RFAs and their agents.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Depends on the circumstances. I'm sorry VJax feels he got jipped here, but the reality is, he suffered a little bit of bad luck, got really pissy about it, and has been up to this point ready to hold up the whole show so that he can get his. Of course by now he has dropped that demand, so it sounds from schefter. In his circumstance I suspect I would not have chosen his strategy. But if I felt I had been defrauded, which is not what happened to VJax, and out of that I lost 50%, hell yeah I'd fight it. But that's not what happened here.

So it seems that you think what happened to V-jax is ok?

Every individual issue threatens to hold up the negotiation, not only this one, so it's not V-jax holding things up. And to this point, there is no proof that he has, will, was willing to, or intended on holding anything up..

Getting paid less than 50% of what should be your yearly income is a lot worse than "little bit of bad luck".

You still avoid the questions... What would you have done? And why do you keep insisting he's willing to hold up the process, it could be handled easily, give the guy a little reparation. And if the process was held up, what difference would it make if the process was held up another couple days anyways? You act as if, he's going to stop the entire 2011 season from happening. You're waaay over dramatizing your position.

 

[JuSt CuZ]

Can we stop treating these guys like they are hard honest working people....they are not, they are selfish, arrogant people, who think they are entitled.

Owners or players?

Both really, but the Players have no leg on this! lolThe owners have earned their money, by paying for the franchise....hence OWNERS! Why is anyone even attacking the owners, they are the ones trying to give us football, you claim the players should be trying to make every dime they can, but the owners are not allowed?PEOPLE DEFENDING VJAX AND PLAYERS, WITH THIS ANGLE, ARE HYPOCRITES.Also for people saying "What if your Job did this" type questions, trying to compare the NFL to real life... Go to your boss and ask for 10 million or you want to be a FA, see what he says to you.

 

[fatness]

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

Like the owners did when they locked the players out?

No.

"It's different when the other guys do it."

 

[fatness]

Why is anyone even attacking the owners, they are the ones trying to give us football

Please tell me the players locked out the owners. Please.

 

[JuSt CuZ]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Depends on the circumstances. I'm sorry VJax feels he got jipped here, but the reality is, he suffered a little bit of bad luck, got really pissy about it, and has been up to this point ready to hold up the whole show so that he can get his. Of course by now he has dropped that demand, so it sounds from schefter. In his circumstance I suspect I would not have chosen his strategy. But if I felt I had been defrauded, which is not what happened to VJax, and out of that I lost 50%, hell yeah I'd fight it. But that's not what happened here.

So it seems that you think what happened to V-jax is ok?

Every individual issue threatens to hold up the negotiation, not only this one, so it's not V-jax holding things up. And to this point, there is no proof that he has, will, was willing to, or intended on holding anything up..

Getting paid less than 50% of what should be your yearly income is a lot worse than "little bit of bad luck".

You still avoid the questions... What would you have done? And why do you keep insisting he's willing to hold up the process, it could be handled easily, give the guy a little reparation. And if the process was held up, what difference would it make if the process was held up another couple days anyways? You act as if, he's going to stop the entire 2011 season from happening. You're waaay over dramatizing your position.

Are you kidding me? so someone just made this up? Its clear someone from the camp is using his "name" as a bargaining chip.

 

[JuSt CuZ]

Why is anyone even attacking the owners, they are the ones trying to give us football

Please tell me the players locked out the owners. Please.

No, but please tell me that you have any valid point besides just trying to be the guy with those schtik one liners?This is the Owners league, the players just playing in it, who are they to say what goes on...they are getting paid for their services.Que an unfunny one-liner from Fatness Please.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Why would Cobalt or anyone answer these questions? They are dumb as heck, no offense. How can you compare the NFL contracts to anything an average person deals with?Also, remember these arrogant players do not HAVE to play football, they CHOOSE to.

Your expenses match your status in life, just because you live on far less, doesn't mean he should have to.. Stop insisting that since he makes far more than you, that he should just be happy with what he gets... There are people who make far less than you as well, should you be happy with a fraction of your income, just because there are other people who do with far less?

He's worth a lot more, he got hosed, he's in no way out of line for asking to be compensated. Your position on this is completely ridiculous..

You guys act as if he's burning your houses down.. He'd be stupid if he had not asked to be compensated.

 

[JuSt CuZ]

VJax was underpaid by at least 70% last year. Unless you seriously want to argue that he's somehow worth $11m this year, and wasn't last year.

I'd do the same thing he's doing if someone screwed me for no good reason except they saw the opportunity. Back at you - first chance I get.

That's because you're a winner in life.

I'd say so, because only a loser would get f'd over and walked on, and not do or say anything about it..

Yeah, I understand there are some folks here who totally support holding everybody else hostage to your demands because you feel you got effed over and walked on.

What if it were you? You willing to throw away 50-70% of your salary for a year because some yahoo on a message board wants to watch pre-season games?

So, you advocate that, because you feel you didn't get a fair shake, you should sabotage everyone else--owners, other players, message board yahoos--until your personal demands are met? Got it.Not to mention, he's not even being honest about it. Man up. If that's what you're doing, at least don't try to back pedal and say that's not what you're doing when that's exactly what you're doing.

At least Logan Mankins gets what you, wdcrob, and Vincent Jackson don't seem to have figured out.

"Sabotage"... LOL, why are you being so dramatic? Every demand, every issue on the table, has the ability to be negotiated. Would be pretty stupid for him to not ask for it, seems like the right time to ask to me.

Why don't you explain how you think he should be handling it.

If your employer pinched 50% of your income for the year, would you just shut up and take it on the chin?

You don't seem to like to answer these questions...

Why would Cobalt or anyone answer these questions? They are dumb as heck, no offense. How can you compare the NFL contracts to anything an average person deals with?Also, remember these arrogant players do not HAVE to play football, they CHOOSE to.

Your expenses match your status in life, just because you live on far less, doesn't mean he should have to.. Stop insisting that since he makes far more than you, that he should just be happy with what he gets... There are people who make far less than you as well, should you be happy with a fraction of your income, just because there are other people who do with far less?

He's worth a lot more, he got hosed, he's in no way out of line for asking to be compensated. Your position on this is completely ridiculous..

You guys act as if he's burning your houses down.. He'd be stupid if he had not asked to be compensated.

Fixed.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Can we stop treating these guys like they are hard honest working people....they are not, they are selfish, arrogant people, who think they are entitled.

Owners or players?

Both really, but the Players have no leg on this! lolThe owners have earned their money, by paying for the franchise....hence OWNERS! Why is anyone even attacking the owners, they are the ones trying to give us football, you claim the players should be trying to make every dime they can, but the owners are not allowed?PEOPLE DEFENDING VJAX AND PLAYERS, WITH THIS ANGLE, ARE HYPOCRITES.Also for people saying "What if your Job did this" type questions, trying to compare the NFL to real life... Go to your boss and ask for 10 million or you want to be a FA, see what he says to you.

So the players haven't earned their money? lol wow, Most players put their entire lives into perfecting this craft. Most owners have other avenues to make money, and in general are wealthy through no fault of their own. Sure some people are self made millionaires, but really, are you going to try saying the owners put fourth more effort towards the sport than the players?