***** ALL-TIME NBA/ABA DRAFT ***** (Scoobus is Champion!) (2 Viewers)

[Doug B]

6th time going one way or the other. Only one more time back and we’ll finally be done with it. 

Out of curiosity ... which way do you all take? Starting on I-30 going through Little Rock & Memphis? Or starting on I-35 and going through Oklahoma City and St. Louis?

The OKC-STL route looks longer by eye, but seems to have more flat unpopulated terrain — and maybe higher speed limits(?).

 

[Instinctive]

Out of curiosity ... which way do you all take? Starting on I-30 going through Little Rock & Memphis? Or starting on I-35 and going through Oklahoma City and St. Louis?

The OKC-STL route looks longer by eye, but seems to have more flat unpopulated terrain — and maybe higher speed limits(?).

Since we live in Dallas proper, I35 is definitely not the fastest. 
 

The Texarkana Memphis route has been in our experience the fastest and smoothest. We’ve also done STL through Tulsa and down 75, and the OK. Route you mentioned since we have friends in both Oklahoma cities from college. So when coming back to TX we tend to do dinner in one of those places. 

 

[Frostillicus]

higgins' 2000's squad

I didn't put too much focus on this decade but, based upon the draft capital I used, I'm happy with the way things turned out from a "team"-perspective.

Are you sure?

 

[Kev4029]

Kev's 2000s

PG - Steve Nash - Two Time MVP - the only other player on the 00s decade teams to win multiple MVPs is Duncan, five time assist champ, 7 time all NBA, 8 time all-star, HOF. Unequivocally the best PG of the decade, he helped revolutionize NBA offenses with the 7 seconds or less Suns. In his first 4 years with the Suns, he averaged 17.5 PPG / 11.2 APG /3.6 RPG with .634 TS% and 45.1% on threes! During those 4 years, had the highest TS%, highest 3pt%, the most assists by over 700, those two MVPs and 4 All-NBA (3 1st team, 1 2nd). It’s also forgotten that he was very close to getting a third straight MVP - he finished a close second to Dirk. There was no better driver of efficient offense in the league.

SG - Gilbert Arenas - He’s a little out of position defensively, but 1. He wasn’t great on that end anyway and 2. He’s probably better defensively against an average sized SG rather than a quick PG. So what does Arenas bring? He was the precursor to guys Dame, Curry, and even Harden before they were drafted. He was a high usage heliocentric guard that could step into 30 foot threes with ease but could also defer the offense to Hughes/Butler and attack off ball. Before he was hurt, he had a 3 year stretch where he averaged 27.7PPG/ 4.3RPG/ 5.7APG/ 1.9SPG on .570 TS% (league average was about .535)  while shooting 7.2 threes per game at 36.1% (slightly above league average).

SF - Metta World Peace - Inarguably the best perimeter defender of the decade and the only perimeter player to win Defensive Player of the year between Gary Payton in 95-96 and Kawhi Leonard in 14-15. And he wasn’t some one-directional dude like Bruce Bowen that they would hide in the corner to shoot two wide open threes a game - MWP had a 7 year stretch where he averaged 18 PPG, 3.4 APG, and 2.7 Stocks with roughly league average TS% (and shot 4 threes a game at 35.3%).

PF - Rashard Lewis - The prototypical stretch 4 that really defined that position in the 2000s and early 2010s. He had a fantastic face up game and both an accurate and quick shot from outside (39% for his career on 4600 attempts = 1787 made - #2 all time for a big man behind Dirk). He was a plus athlete, especially at the 4, that could beat opposing 3s with his size and opposing 4s with his quickness. He’s pure outside game will neutralize the two best defenders in the decade (Duncan and Garnett) because he’ll pull them away from their defensive sweet spots (putting Howard or Shaq on Lewis is a nonstarter). 

C - Andrew Bogut - Bogut is a fantastic backstop for the team and will pick up some of the rebounding slack. He isn’t the same vertical spacer that Amare was, and he isn’t the kind of shooter that Dirk was, but he sets hard screens and will make the right play on the short roll (he is a fantastic passer for a big man) - kind of a better version of old Nash teammate Marcin Gortat offensively, and better defensively than any center that Nash ever had. I think people remember Bogut for a short peak - but I would disagree, he was an all around stud in the Bucks days making an all-nba team and winning the block title one year, but he adapted his game to play with a team of studs with GSW, making the all-defense team as the starting C on their first title team.

We are bringing 2020 to the 2000s - Nash, Arenas, and Lewis might be the three most prolific shooters from the decade behind Ray Allen.  Lewis made the second most threes (1546) in the decade, Nash made the 7th most and at a higher % (.437) than anybody else in the top 93, Arenas finished 1st, 2nd, and 5th in 3s made in his last three healthy years in Washington plus MWP averaged at least one three pointer made per game ever season in the decade other than 00-01. We are going to ####### bomb it - and bomb it efficiently. Looking at the BBREF link above - we are going to be shooting 30.1 threes per 100 possessions (nobody had hit that mark until Houston in 14-15) at 39.1%. We have unmatched balance, shooting, and playmaking for the decade - I think this is the most efficient and prolific offensive team of the 00s and nobody has the backcourt defenders to slow us down.

Defensively, Metta World Peace is going to have a lot of work to do covering for Nash and Arenas, but there aren’t a lot of two headed perimeter attacks that are going to kill us. Bogut was a stud defensively as well, but he was overshadowed by some of the best defensive bigs of all time (Garnett, Howard, Duncan). He’s got the heft to compete with the low post guys, and the backline ability to meet perimeter players at the hoop. I don’t think this is a great all around defense, but MWP and Bogut are plenty good enough to allow the offense shine through.

While objectively we aren't the #1 team of the decade, I think we match up well with the other elite teams. Against Gally/Instinctive/Scoob, Lewis will stretch Garnett and Duncan to the perimeter eliminating their best attributes defensively.  From 04-05 to 10-11 (Lewis's AS season to the end of his ORL career), he outplayed Garnett (20.1 PPG on .597 TS% vs 17 PPG on .543 TS%) and his teams won 12 of 19 games. Against Duncan he more or less held serve (15.2 PPG on .590 TS% vs 18.2 PPG on .581 TS%).

• With Instinctive's team, we'll put Artest on McGrady and see if Battier can corner three us to death off of Billups passes before Nash and Arenas beat up his backcourt offensively.
  
• Otherwise with Gally, we'll test our superior jump shooting ability to keep away from the hoop and Howard and see if Terry/Peja can beat Nash/Arenas in a 3 point contest (as good as their back line defense is, the perimeter D is pretty shaky with Gally).
  
• Versus Scoob, we'll hope Bogut can contain Shaq (he has as good a chance as anybody) with a little help, and hope Kidd and Allen have a bad day. We'll probably lose, but it would be a fun game.
  
• Against EY, we'll plant Artest on Kobe defensively, and run Kobe through pick and rolls (or pops with Lewis) all game if he is covering one of the guards. Brand was a fine defender, but was more of a PF and I'm not scared of his rim protection (AK47, I am afraid of, but he's covering Lewis a mile from the hoop).
  
• With Trader Jake's team, I think we'll have some trouble defensively, but they'll have a lot more - I'm not sure there is an above average defender in the bunch.
  

 

[modogg]

These last two gonna be real fun. Thanks to those above for thoughts. At the risk of offending others, nice to know the folks I most look to learning from all gave my upper 50% of the ranks I got (e.g., not the 1s and 2s which were pretty ridiculous).

00s has maybe the most obvious and clear decade team, and I think the favorite for best in show. Only team I see with both the best frontcourt and best backcourt in its decade.

I'm tinkering now, but think I see a few contenders for #2:

@Instinctive, @EYLive, @Gally, @modogg are all fearsome and somewhat odd teams. Duncan/Dwight is a monster but the backcourt is a sieve (understatement). EY and I have very similar "ok try to score, and my one transcendent buckets guy will take 40 shots" type squads, modogg's got either DWill or AI out of position to get destroyed by the SGs of the era...Jake's got a great "guys who should have been better than they were" team too.

i tried doing the rankings this morning, and i am sure some people will be upset with their numbers. i had guys flying all over the place, and moved a ton. had the top 3 pretty close to locked in, and middle like 10 just kept jumping up and down all over. 

 

[modogg]

Kev's 2000s

• With Instinctive's team, we'll put Artest on McGrady and see if Battier can corner three us to death off of Billups passes before Nash and Arenas beat up his backcourt offensively.
  
• Otherwise with Gally, we'll test our superior jump shooting ability to keep away from the hoop and Howard and see if Terry/Peja can beat Nash/Arenas in a 3 point contest (as good as their back line defense is, the perimeter D is pretty shaky with Gally).
  
• Versus Scoob, we'll hope Bogut can contain Shaq (he has as good a chance as anybody) with a little help, and hope Kidd and Allen have a bad day. We'll probably lose, but it would be a fun game.
  
• Against EY, we'll plant Artest on Kobe defensively, and run Kobe through pick and rolls (or pops with Lewis) all game if he is covering one of the guards. Brand was a fine defender, but was more of a PF and I'm not scared of his rim protection (AK47, I am afraid of, but he's covering Lewis a mile from the hoop).
  
• With Trader Jake's team, I think we'll have some trouble defensively, but they'll have a lot more - I'm not sure there is an above average defender in the bunch.
  

... So you're saying AI can score 45, Bosh and Sheed can chip on on the boards and nail 6-8 3s, and D.Will can run the point and cover Arenas ? 

would be fun to see how A.I. and D.Will would match up against Nash and Arenas? I am sure i am biased on this, but i have to lean AI and D.Will would be better offensively by a slight number, and much better defensively with A.I. and his overwhelming steal numbers.

I like Bosh giving Bogut a run for his money, but think Sheed and Lewis are 2 different guys and wouldn't really effect each other a ton. Danny Granger vs. Meta World Peace is kind of fascinating too... Granger may have to switch to covering the larger Lewis, and i might put Sheed on MWP and have him play closer to the paint. 

Might just go 2-3 zone and make life a little easier for my guys on D too   

 

[Jayrod]

Jayrodsquad of the 2000's

• PG - Andre "the Professor" Miller - consistent as hell and great advanced stats over a long career.  #11 on the all-time assists list and led the league in '01-02.
  
• SG - Tayshaun "the Thin Man" Prince - more of a SF, but he shoots the 3 well (36.7% career with 3 seasons > 40%) and is a great defender (4x all-Defensive).  Won't need the ball in his hands to help the team.
  
• SF - Paul "the Truth" Pierce - primary scorer and all-around great basketball player.  He can defend and rebound and pass in addition to score from all 3 levels.
  
• PF - Carlos "CBooz" Boozer - poor man's Karl Malone.  Similar game, just not as good....but he'll give us 18/10 a night from the post and a second go-to option behind Pierce and wear down anyone that guards him.
  
• C - Brad Miller - 2x All-Star and an effective scorer throughout his 14 year career.  Averaged 14/10/4 during his peak.
  

 

[Gally]

Kev's 2000s

• Otherwise with Gally, we'll test our superior jump shooting ability to keep away from the hoop and Howard and see if Terry/Peja can beat Nash/Arenas in a 3 point contest (as good as their back line defense is, the perimeter D is pretty shaky with Gally)
  

You are missing the point that you will not get any rebounds (even with good shooting there are more misses than makes) or be able to stop my front court on the offensive side of the game.  Even if you drop and pack in the paint Terry and Peja will make you pay.  You may be able to keep up for awhile if you are having the game of your life but with no rebounding or inside game at all you will eventually wear down and get beat.

 

[Kev4029]

... So you're saying AI can score 45, Bosh and Sheed can chip on on the boards and nail 6-8 3s, and D.Will can run the point and cover Arenas ? 

would be fun to see how A.I. and D.Will would match up against Nash and Arenas? I am sure i am biased on this, but i have to lean AI and D.Will would be better offensively by a slight number, and much better defensively with A.I. and his overwhelming steal numbers.

I like Bosh giving Bogut a run for his money, but think Sheed and Lewis are 2 different guys and wouldn't really effect each other a ton. Danny Granger vs. Meta World Peace is kind of fascinating too... Granger may have to switch to covering the larger Lewis, and i might put Sheed on MWP and have him play closer to the paint. 

Might just go 2-3 zone and make life a little easier for my guys on D too   

DWill and AI may putt up more points, but Arenas and Nash would be more efficient.

That's what I like about Nash/Arenas/Lewis, all were very efficient.

 

[Kev4029]

You are missing the point that you will not get any rebounds (even with good shooting there are more misses than makes) or be able to stop my front court on the offensive side of the game.  Even if you drop and pack in the paint Terry and Peja will make you pay.  You may be able to keep up for awhile if you are having the game of your life but with no rebounding or inside game at all you will eventually wear down and get beat.

We have a decent defensive rebound rate (74.2% - 2005 league average was 72.7%), we're just really bad on the offensive glass (22.9% - league average was 27.3%) - those numbers in 2020 were 77.5/22.5 as the game has moved more to concede rebounds to get back on D. And that's fine because we are a team of efficiency offensively and we'll be looking to get back defensively anyway. Plus, there is always regression to the mean as a team on the defensive glass (less so on the offensive glass, I think). There are only so many rebounds to reasonably get and two elite rebounders will cannibalize rebounds to each other. Just for fun - your team has an 84.7% D reb rate and a 27.7% O reb rate. So, I would expect to get beat on the glass, but it's not like the rebound difference will be 60-30.

 

[modogg]

DWill and AI may putt up more points, but Arenas and Nash would be more efficient.

That's what I like about Nash/Arenas/Lewis, all were very efficient.

A.I. was very efficient too. I was surprised because his number were more efficient then what i remember watching him play on the Sixers. Was happy about that, and why i jumped on A.I. so early because i think that was his only thing i was concerned with. 

Pairing him with Bosh at C is maybe not great defensively, but pairing him with a big man that can score at all 3 levels would have been something crazy to watch. 

 

[wikkidpissah]

wikkid's Team2000

Sebastian Telfair - playground legend of the Century

Jonny Flynn - draft pick of the Century

Adam Morrison - Great White Hope of the Century

Darko Milicic - Euroballer of the Century

Greg Oden - Collapsing Cell Tower of the Century

nufced

 

[Frostillicus]

wikkid's Team2000

Sebastian Telfair - playground legend of the Century

Jonny Flynn - draft pick of the Century

Adam Morrison - Great White Hope of the Century

Darko Milicic - Euroballer of the Century

Greg Oden - Collapsing Cell Tower of the Century

nufced

Three of these guys spent time on the Wolves. 

 

[Yo Mama]

Yo Mama's All-00s Team

PG - Baron Davis

Peak (7 Years) - 20p, 4r, 8a, 2stl, 2 threes

Recognition - 2 all star

SG - Jason Richardson

Peak (6 Years) - 20p, 6r, 3a, 1stl, 2 threes

Recognition - 2 slam dunk champ!

SF - Stephen Jackson

Peak (8 Years) - 19p, 4r, 4a, 2stl, 2 threes

Recognition - 1 champ

PF - David West

Peak (5 Years) - 20p, 8r, 2a, 1stl, 1blk

Recognition - 2 champ, 2 all star

C - Pau Gasol

Peak (15 Years!) - 18p, 10r, 3a, 1stl, 2blk

Recognition - 2 champ, 4 all nba, 6 all star

This isn’t my most decorated team, but it is definitely my most fun.  I start with three key cogs from the We Believe Warriors and team them with a perfect combination of toughness, athleticism, and skill in my frontcourt.  This team is going to run like crazy, dunk in your face, rain threes from all over the court, and hound the ball from all five positions.  There is toughness, attitude, and championship mettle all over the court with this squad - with scoring, shooting, rebounding, defensive tenacity, and speed at all five positions.  This team would be incredibly fun (and occasionally frustrating) to root for and would be well suited to compete in the modern game as well.

 

[Gally]

Now is the time for Gally's Best in Show submission.  I am happiest with this team of all the teams constructed as I think it has the best blend of shooting, inside game, defense and game management of any of my submissions.  In fact, all 5 members have won NBA titles so they know how to win.  I have rebounding champs, block shot champs, a Hall of Famer, MVP's of all kinds (regular season, Finals, and All Star Games), a ROY, Defensive Player of the year and many more.  All told the individual accolades are incredible:

• 12 NBA Titles
  
• 32 All Star Game Appearances
  
• 28 All NBA Team Appearances
  
• 20 All Defensive Team Appearances
  
• 3 Defensive Players of the Year
  
• 4 Finals MVP's
  
• 2 Regular Season MVP's
  
• 2 Three-Point Contest Winners
  
• 1 All Star Game MVP
  
• 1 Rookie of the Year
  
• 1 Hall of Famer
  

Any other team in this era would be hard pressed to match these accolades so the team has that covered.  Now on to the team concepts.  This team has three point shooting (two time 3-pt contest winner Peja and Jason Terry) to stretch the floor for the Big Fundamental to do his thing.  It has a point guard that has shown he can win and do what it takes on the biggest stage (FInals MVP in Parker) and we know works well with his best player.  We have a freak of nature athletic big man that will crash the offensive boards and protect the rim defensively as a 3 time Defensive POY.   In it's prime this team can run the floor or excel at the half court game.  The only inkling of a weakness is the perimeter defense where they are lesser but not bad.  Parker is in the top 70 in NBA history for Defensive Win Shares while Peja had a few peak seasons where he was over 3 per season and Terry could get into the mid 2's when he wanted to.  Regardless, the duo of Duncan and Howard will clean up a lot of messes behind them.  

Now on to the individuals:

PG - Tony Parker (Pick 10.07):  15.5/2.7/5.6 career averages with a PER of 18.2 and WS of 111.3.  His best single season numbers for each category are 22.0/3.7/7.7 and 1.2 steals/game.  Parker is the perfect point guard for this squad.  As we know he knows how to win and he knows how to work with Tim Duncan.  That right there is a huge advantage over every other squad in this category.  Two guys that know each other so well they can take over games on that alone.  Parker also plays biggest in the biggest games and there is no bigger tournament than the Yo Mama Tournament.  He will control the game, score when needed and get the team into it's offense.  He can play acceptable defense and be good enough with the big guys behind him.  A perfect PG for this team.

SG - Jason Terry (Pick 19.10):  13.4/2.3/3.8 career averages with a PER of 16.2 and WS of 102.0.  His best single season numbers for each category are 19.7/4.1/7.4 and 1.8 steals/game.  An elite shooter, Terry has made the seventh-most career three-pointers in NBA history (at the time of this posting).   He fits great for this squad as he can play off the ball and be an outside specialist with plenty of room with the defense collapsing on Duncan.  He can also handle the ball well enough to run the offense and get them out and running.  One of just 13 players in NBA history with at least 18,000 points, 5,000 assists and 1,500 steals.  Has one of the greatest superstitions ever as he must sleep in the shorts of his opponent the night before a game

SF - Peja Stojakovic (Pick 12.10):  17.0/4.7/1.8 career averages with a PER of 17.1 and WS of 82.6.  His best single season numbers for each category are 24.2/6.3/2.5 and 1.3 steals/game.  He won the NBA Three-Point Contest two times, and was the first European-born player to win one of the All-Star Weekend competitions. Stojaković made 1,760 three-point field goals in his career which ranked 10th all-time at the point of his retirement.  This is exactly what I drafted him for with this squad.  A 3 point assassin.  A career 40% 3-pt shooter with a season best of 44%.  Peja will really spread the floor coupled with JET leaving Duncan clear to work or vice versa.    

PF - Tim Duncan (Pick 1.10):  19.0/10.8/3.0 career averages with a PER of 24.2 and WS of 206.4. His best single season numbers for each category are 25.5/12.9/3.9 and 2.9 blocks/game.  Obviously the Big Fundamental is the cornerstone of this squad.  In his prime he was a premier defender (15 All NBA Defensive Teams).  Duncan is the only player to be selected to both the All-NBA and All-Defensive Teams for 13 consecutive seasons.  This defensive prowess allows for the backcourt to gamble and make plays without worrying about getting beaten to the basket.  A great team defender gets even better when paired with the Center for this squad.  Duncan has gained a reputation as a clutch player, as evidenced by his three NBA Finals MVP awards and his playoff career averages being higher than his regular season statistics. Bill Russell further compliments Duncan on his passing ability, and rates him as one of the most efficient players of his generation, a view shared by Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. Because of his versatility and success, basketball experts widely consider Duncan to be the greatest power forward in NBA history,

C - Dwight Howard (Pick 4.07):  16.3/12.1/1.4 career averages with a PER of 21.4 and WS of 136.8. His best single season numbers for each category are 22.9/14.5/1.9 and 2.9 blocks/game.  The beauty of Howard's fit on this squad is that he can just play defense, run the court, and hit the offensive glass.  He doesn't need the offense to run through him and will excel in this role with his athleticism.  Being the Defensive POY three times he will make up for any perceived defensive deficiency this squad my have.  He also fits very complimentary to Duncan in the frontcourt.  Howard's abilities and powerful physique have drawn attention from fellow NBA All-Stars. Tim Duncan once remarked in 2007: "[Howard] is so developed... He has so much promise and I am glad that I will be out of the league when he is peaking."  Kevin Garnett echoed those sentiments: "[Howard] is a freak of nature, man... I was nowhere near that physically talented. I wasn't that gifted, as far as body and physical presence."  Subsequent to a game in the 2009 NBA Playoffs, Philadelphia 76ers swingman Andre Iguodala said: "It's like he can guard two guys at once. He can guard his guy and the guy coming off the pick-and-roll, which is almost impossible to do... If he gets any more athletic or jumps any higher, they're going to have to change the rules."  That's some pretty hefty praise from his direct competition in this thing.  

This is my best squad and probably best complimentary team I assembled.  There really isn't a weakness as the only perceived weakness is covered by the strength of Duncan and Howard defensively.  This team can score inside and outside and should compete for the best overall spot in this decade.  I have been fairly conservative for my team expectations thus far and have been right on with my rankings and I don't see a team that is obviously better in this decade.  I would have this team in the top spot but it shouldn't be lower than top 2.      

 

[scoobus]

Wish I could’ve had some of y’all do all my team write ups. Some really good writing and analysis.

 

[Gally]

Wish I could’ve had some of y’all do all my team write ups. Some really good writing and analysis.

I can try and do one for you but you probably won't like it....hahahah

 

[Ilov80s]

No judging for me this round, too busy these couple day.

 

[Jayrod]

No judging for me this round, too busy these couple day.

Oh just throw some guesses out there.  It is all compiled anyway.

Here, I'll help get you started:

1. Jayrod - 16 pts
   

There you go, just fill in 15 more names and send it in.

 

[Doug B]

Doug B's 2000s squad

PG Sam Cassell (6'3", 185): 1X All-NBA, 1X All-Star, 3X NBA Champion, 39th career assists, 45th career FT%

Cassell was the plucky second-unit PG for the Rockets' title squads as a young player. He left Houston to become a starter in New Jersey for a season, and then a solid 4-season run in Milwaukee where he bloomed into a steady 19-4-7 guy. Later made the All-Star team with the Timberwolves at age 34. 5-Year Peak (1999-2004): 19.2 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 7.3 apg, 1.2 spg, 47.2% shooting, 35.1% from 3, 86.6% from the stripe.

SG Michael Redd (6'6", 220): 1X All-NBA, 1X All-Star

Needed a reliable wing scorer that can put up points in bunches, so I'll take the man that made Ray Allen expendable in Milwaukee. Redd still holds the Bucks' single-game scoring record of 57 pts. A 25-ppg guy during his peak with a reliable three-ball (38% career, best two seasons over 43%). 5-Year Peak (2003-08): 23.7 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 2.6 apg, 1.0 spg, 44.7% shooting, 85.1% from the stripe.

SF Gerald Wallace (6'7", 215): 1X All-NBA, 1X All-Defense, 1X steals leader

Super-active forward who was highly disruptive on the defensive end. Good for about 18 ppg and 7-8 rpg in his Charlotte Bobcats prime. Had kind of a flukey 2005-06 season on defense, where he averaged 2.5 steals and 2.1 blocks per game. He didn't maintain that average with the blocks, but he did wrangle 2+ steals per game over three consecutive seasons (2005-2008). All-Defensive selection in 2009-10. 5-Year Peak (2005-10): 17.6 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 2.5 apg, 1.9 spg, 1.2 bpg, 48.7% from the floor.

PF Shareef Abdur-Rahim (6'9", 225): 1X All-Star, 1997 All-Rookie team

Not the prototypical power forward of previous decades, Abdur-Rahim's game upon entering the league was built less on bodying up and more on 'outquicking' bigger defenders and playing them face-up from mid-range. He had the handle to log significant minutes at the 3, and did so frequently with an expansion Grizzlies team short on talent. As his career progressed, Abdur-Rahim developed a capable post game and settled in as more of a traditional 4 for the Hawks in the 2000s. 5-Year Peak (1997-2002): 21.4 ppg, 8.6 rpg, 3.1 apg, 1.2 spg, 1.0 bpg, 46.5% from the floor, 81.2% from the stripe.

C Marcus Camby (6'11", 220): 4X All-Defense, 1997 All-Rookie, 2007 DPOY, 4X blocks leader, 52nd career rebounds, 13th career blocks and bpg

Cribbing this writeup from Kev4029: "... the NBA didn't really figure out the center position in the 00s, still playing big stiffs when there was no reason, Camby was one of the players that brought in the new NBA centers. He could get up on the pick and roll and chase smaller guys around a bit, and protected the rim with the best of them (although he did chase blocks and rebounds in spite of the team, sometimes). In the five years after the Nuggets draft Melo, Camby had 24 defensive win shares and had a 3.5 DBPM. For comparison, Gobert's last five years have been 22 and 4.2. The Nuggets were consistently a top half defense through his entire Nuggets career with a lot of relatively bad defensive talent around him." 5-Year Peak (2003-08): 10.3 ppg, 11.4 rpg, 2.6 apg, 1.2 spg, 3.2 bpg, 46.6% from the floor.

 

[Yo Mama]

Hey everyone, for the Best in Show judging do we want to rank them like we’ve been doing the decades or should we do it tournament style?

Option A - Do the same 1-16 rankings with consolidated results that we’ve been doing

Option B - Do a head to head tournament with  polls in the basketball forum

Thoughts?

 

[Ilov80s]

Hey everyone, for the Best in Show judging do we want to rank them like we’ve been doing the decades or should we do it tournament style?

Option A - Do the same 1-16 rankings with consolidated results that we’ve been doing

Option B - Do a head to head tournament with  polls in the basketball forum

Thoughts

How would we determine the seeding? 

 

[Gally]

Hey everyone, for the Best in Show judging do we want to rank them like we’ve been doing the decades or should we do it tournament style?

Option A - Do the same 1-16 rankings with consolidated results that we’ve been doing

Option B - Do a head to head tournament with  polls in the basketball forum

Thoughts?

I think we should do the normal ranking system for our purposes and use that for seeding.  Then put the tourney up there in a pole just for ####s and giggles.

ETA:  we can do the same for the pantheon teams as well.

 

[Yo Mama]

How would we determine the seeding? 

I was thinking I could use their average scores from the decades rankings. 

 

[Yo Mama]

I think we should do the normal ranking system for our purposes and use that for seeding.  Then put the tourney up there in a pole just for ####s and giggles.

ETA:  we can do the same for the pantheon teams as well.

I like this idea. 

 

[modogg]

Hey everyone, for the Best in Show judging do we want to rank them like we’ve been doing the decades or should we do it tournament style?

Option A - Do the same 1-16 rankings with consolidated results that we’ve been doing

Option B - Do a head to head tournament with  polls in the basketball forum

Thoughts?

hmm, i like B. sounds more fun. Maybe each day is time for analysis for the round

 

[Ilov80s]

I like this idea. 

Ok that is fun

 

[Jayrod]

I'm for whatever helps me win.

:killerinstinct:

 

[modogg]

Since we haven't talked about D-Wade enough today (because clearly some people think he is not worthy of being considered great), I'm going to explain why he is #1 SG in the era. 

Let's look at the other SG's (so far) in the 2010's:

1. Monta Ellis - zero rings, zero awards
   
2. James Harden - MVP, 7x all-NBA, 9x All-star, no all-D teams (known as a turnstile)...better scorer, worse defender, no rings
   
3. Bradley Beal - 3x all-star, having a nice scoring year, but 1/2 year on a losing team....no defensive accolades
   
4. Devin Booker - 2x all-star, good scorer, poor defender
   
5. Joe Johnson - 7x all star, 1x all-NBA, no rings, no defensive accolades
   
6. Khris Middleton - 2x all-star, good scorer, decent defender...not great at anything.
   
7. Donovan Mitchell - 2x all-star, great scorer, decent defender...most like Wade, but has played 3.5 seasons TOTAL so far
   
8. DeMar Derozan - 4x all star, 2x all-NBA...known commodity and not as good as Wade at anything (maybe 3 pt shooting)
   
9. Kyle Korver - 1x all-star.  Has only started 1/3 of his career games.  Great shooter, but a one-dimensional role player.
   
10. Danny Green - 3x NBA champ (the first guy on this list with any rings).  Good role player, but no ASG's or All-NBAs.
    
11. JJ Redick - Great shooter.  No rings, no individual awards, started 1/2 of his games.
    
12. Klay Thompson - 5x all-star, 3 rings, 1 all-D, 2x All-NBA.  Great player, but he's never been better than #3 on his own team.
    

So after looking at all of that, you have 1 guy with the potential to reach Wade's status (Harden), 2 guys with an outside chance (Klay & Mitchell) and the rest range from good to below average. 

Make no mistake, D-Wade is one of the top 4 greatest SGs of ALL-TIME. #3 #4 #3 #3 #3  He is a 2-way threat, did it as an alpha and a #2 and had both peak excellence and longevity.

The disrespect is embarrassing for anyone that thinks he isn't the best SG among the list above.

just looking through some of this thread, and had to respond here. Chiming in to give more accolades to A.I. If we are judging like Jayrod has then we are all doomed and this draft was silly because you just bank on championships  If i knew this was how people would look at the judging, i would have drafted Chalmers or Barbosa for his rings on the Warriors. You are killing Monta Ellis because he never got a championship? You act like D Wade would have had a championship because of himself, and completely neglect to mention that he had a Lebron in his prime and Bosh who was criminally under-rated for that Heat team. 

Not saying Wade wasn't a quality player, but way over-valuing him without factoring who else was on that team. Look at who Monta Ellis had with him on the court, and compare to D Wade. 

 

[Yo Mama]

just looking through some of this thread, and had to respond here. Chiming in to give more accolades to A.I. If we are judging like Jayrod has then we are all doomed and this draft was silly because you just bank on championships  If i knew this was how people would look at the judging, i would have drafted Chalmers or Barbosa for his rings on the Warriors. You are killing Monta Ellis because he never got a championship? You act like D Wade would have had a championship because of himself, and completely neglect to mention that he had a Lebron in his prime and Bosh who was criminally under-rated for that Heat team. 

Not saying Wade wasn't a quality player, but way over-valuing him without factoring who else was on that team. Look at who Monta Ellis had with him on the court, and compare to D Wade. 

Wade carried the Heat to their first championship with fat Shaq pre-LeBron . He’s easily one of the top SGs all time. 

 

[modogg]

Wade carried the Heat to their first championship with fat Shaq pre-LeBron . He’s easily one of the top SGs all time. 

yeah, my post wasn't intending on dumping on Wade, just simply stating you give A.I. any of the support some of these guys had and A.I. would have won 6-7 championships. 

 

[scoobus]

It's late and most of you are better writers, but here we go.  Thought I should at least try to have somewhat of a decent write-up for my best team.

00s

PG Jason Kidd
One of the greatest passing and all-around point guards in NBA history, we'll look to Kidd to run the offense and lead a nasty defense. Lead the league in assists 5 times (2nd career all-time) while averaging around an impressive 7 boards a game during his prime.  9x all-defense (4x 1st team) and 6x all-NBA (5x 1st team). Also developed in the latter part of his career into a pretty solid 3 point shooter, shooting a combined 38% from '05-'10 and being currently 10th in all time makes.

SG Ray Allen
Perfect SG for a format like this and especially with how this team is set up. Ray Allen is still (for now) the career NBA leader for 3 pointers made, making exactly 40% of his career attempts from beyond the arc.  And this was on many teams where he was the alpha scorer and shot maker/creator, which he won't necessarily need to be on this team. The only weak link on my defense, where I don't think he was horrible or anything, solid.

SF Bruce Bowen
If not for Bowen the hardware for this team would be even more ridiculous, but in building a team of superstars who are used to having the ball in their hands, I thought he fit perfectly.  8 time all-defense (5x first team all-defense), just a complete menace and arguably (or not arguably) dirty player who did whatever it took to gain an advantage. On offense, a perfect fit for this collection of hall of famers who somehow have to share the ball, go stand in the corner and get out of the way, if they leave you, knock it down. Bowen shot over 40% from three 6 out of the 10 seasons in the 00s.

PF Kevin Garnett
A league MVP and all-time great, and yet I feel a guy like KG wouldn't be too proud to do the some of the dirty work on a superteam like this, whether it was setting screens for Ray Allen to come open, to running the court, to playing pick and roll with Jason Kidd, to just dominating when he finally did get the ball in his hands. KG embodies whatever it takes to win. Something I didn't know is that KG actually had 4 straight rebounding titles in a row in the early 00s, on top of his incredible defense (12x all defense, 9x 1st team).

C Shaq
A healthy and motivated, fully in-shape Shaquille O'Neal is the most dominant basketball player I've personally ever seen, and that's what you're getting here. Don't really have a lot to say, his dominance at his peak speaks for itself.  I will add though that Shaq was no slouch on the defensive end either, earning 3 all-defensive team nods and doing pretty well in defensive win shares as well(not that I'm the biggest fan of defensive win shares).

After suffering through decades of less than stellar teams, I think I finally have a good one here. Offensively we'll obviously run through Shaq plenty, where he is nearly unstoppable.  He's surrounded with 4 guys who can space the floor for him and knock down a long J if he gets doubled, or pass to the more open guy who can. Kidd and KG form a pretty devastating pick and roll or pick and pop, KG could do whatever.  And wherever the defense shifts you're leaving someone open, whether it's Bowen in the corner to annoyingly knock down another 3, or Ray Allen from anywhere with just an inch of space. It might at first glance not look like a great transition team, but with Jason Kidd leading the break I feel like KG would thrive here, coupled in with Allen coming in for some trailing 3s. Defensively it's quite nasty everywhere and as a whole.  Ray Allen basically takes the worst option of your 1/2/3, and from there you've somehow got to try to deal with Kidd, Bowen, KG, and Shaq locking you up. I think this would be a tough team to beat, from any era.

Stats compiled after reading Gally's well put together stuff
11 NBA Titles
50 All Star Game Appearances
31 All NBA Team Appearances (17 1st team)
32 All Defensive Team Appearances (18 1st team)
1 Defensive Player of the Year
3 Finals MVPs
2 Regular Season MVPs
1 Three-Point Contest Winners
4 All Star Game MVPs
2 Rookies of the Year
4 Hall of Famers

Stats compiled after reading some of Kev's stuff
OREB % 28.8
DREB % 85.3
Usage rate 108.6 (Beautiful!)

 

[Gally]

I like this idea. 

Heck, you can even start the tournament pole's for the 60's thru 90's right now because we already have the seeding....

 

[Doug B]

It's late and most of you are better writers, but here we go.  Thought I should at least try to have somewhat of a decent write-up for my best team.

All you had to write was:

"Kidd, Ray Allen, Bruce Bowen, KG, and Shaq show up and incinerate all y'all's teams. The end.  "

 

[Jayrod]

All you had to write was:

"Kidd, Ray Allen, Bruce Bowen, KG, and Shaq show up and incinerate all y'all's teams. The end.  "

Yeah, when you have 3 guys in the same decade that are top 5 at their position all-time, not a lot needs to be said.

 

[wikkidpissah]

It's late and most of you are better writers, but here we go.  Thought I should at least try to have somewhat of a decent write-up for my best team.

00s

PG Jason Kidd
One of the greatest passing and all-around point guards in NBA history, we'll look to Kidd to run the offense and lead a nasty defense. Lead the league in assists 5 times (2nd career all-time) while averaging around an impressive 7 boards a game during his prime.  9x all-defense (4x 1st team) and 6x all-NBA (5x 1st team). Also developed in the latter part of his career into a pretty solid 3 point shooter, shooting a combined 38% from '05-'10 and being currently 10th in all time makes.

SG Ray Allen
Perfect SG for a format like this and especially with how this team is set up. Ray Allen is still (for now) the career NBA leader for 3 pointers made, making exactly 40% of his career attempts from beyond the arc.  And this was on many teams where he was the alpha scorer and shot maker/creator, which he won't necessarily need to be on this team. The only weak link on my defense, where I don't think he was horrible or anything, solid.

SF Bruce Bowen
If not for Bowen the hardware for this team would be even more ridiculous, but in building a team of superstars who are used to having the ball in their hands, I thought he fit perfectly.  8 time all-defense (5x first team all-defense), just a complete menace and arguably (or not arguably) dirty player who did whatever it took to gain an advantage. On offense, a perfect fit for this collection of hall of famers who somehow have to share the ball, go stand in the corner and get out of the way, if they leave you, knock it down. Bowen shot over 40% from three 6 out of the 10 seasons in the 00s.

PF Kevin Garnett
A league MVP and all-time great, and yet I feel a guy like KG wouldn't be too proud to do the some of the dirty work on a superteam like this, whether it was setting screens for Ray Allen to come open, to running the court, to playing pick and roll with Jason Kidd, to just dominating when he finally did get the ball in his hands. KG embodies whatever it takes to win. Something I didn't know is that KG actually had 4 straight rebounding titles in a row in the early 00s, on top of his incredible defense (12x all defense, 9x 1st team).

C Shaq
A healthy and motivated, fully in-shape Shaquille O'Neal is the most dominant basketball player I've personally ever seen, and that's what you're getting here. Don't really have a lot to say, his dominance at his peak speaks for itself.  I will add though that Shaq was no slouch on the defensive end either, earning 3 all-defensive team nods and doing pretty well in defensive win shares as well(not that I'm the biggest fan of defensive win shares).

After suffering through decades of less than stellar teams, I think I finally have a good one here. Offensively we'll obviously run through Shaq plenty, where he is nearly unstoppable.  He's surrounded with 4 guys who can space the floor for him and knock down a long J if he gets doubled, or pass to the more open guy who can. Kidd and KG form a pretty devastating pick and roll or pick and pop, KG could do whatever.  And wherever the defense shifts you're leaving someone open, whether it's Bowen in the corner to annoyingly knock down another 3, or Ray Allen from anywhere with just an inch of space. It might at first glance not look like a great transition team, but with Jason Kidd leading the break I feel like KG would thrive here, coupled in with Allen coming in for some trailing 3s. Defensively it's quite nasty everywhere and as a whole.  Ray Allen basically takes the worst option of your 1/2/3, and from there you've somehow got to try to deal with Kidd, Bowen, KG, and Shaq locking you up. I think this would be a tough team to beat, from any era.

Stats compiled after reading Gally's well put together stuff
11 NBA Titles
50 All Star Game Appearances
31 All NBA Team Appearances (17 1st team)
32 All Defensive Team Appearances (18 1st team)
1 Defensive Player of the Year
3 Finals MVPs
2 Regular Season MVPs
1 Three-Point Contest Winners
4 All Star Game MVPs
2 Rookies of the Year
4 Hall of Famers

Stats compiled after reading some of Kev's stuff
OREB % 28.8
DREB % 85.3
Usage rate 108.6 (Beautiful!)

i know & respect what you wanted to do there with Bowen, but he would have been a questionable choice in the last round, nm @ #150 overall. a guy who did a beautiful job carving out a niche is all - this aint the place for role players. hell, you could drop him right now, plug in Caron Butler, and get my vote for Best-in-Show. now, i'm not sure i could rate this the best Naughties squad. it plays nice, yeah - coulda played great

 

[Jayrod]

i know & respect what you wanted to do there with Bowen, but he would have been a questionable choice in the last round, nm @ #150 overall. a guy who did a beautiful job carving out a niche is all - this aint the place for role players. hell, you could drop him right now, plug in Caron Butler, and get my vote for Best-in-Show. now, i'm not sure i could rate this the best Naughties squad. it plays nice, yeah - coulda played great

I think Metta World Peace, Shane Battier, Tayshaun Prince or even Doug Christie could have been a better choices for scoobus that were all still available if he was looking for a perimeter defender who could shoot corner threes.

 

[Yo Mama]

Hey everyone,  if you can get your rankings in by 3pm pacific / 6pm eastern today, I can get the results out this evening. 

 

[Gally]

i know & respect what you wanted to do there with Bowen, but he would have been a questionable choice in the last round, nm @ #150 overall. a guy who did a beautiful job carving out a niche is all - this aint the place for role players. hell, you could drop him right now, plug in Caron Butler, and get my vote for Best-in-Show. now, i'm not sure i could rate this the best Naughties squad. it plays nice, yeah - coulda played great

I think Metta World Peace, Shane Battier, Tayshaun Prince or even Doug Christie could have been a better choices for scoobus that were all still available if he was looking for a perimeter defender who could shoot corner threes.

It's why Team Gally is getting the nod as best in the 2000's   

 

[scoobus]

i know & respect what you wanted to do there with Bowen, but he would have been a questionable choice in the last round, nm @ #150 overall. a guy who did a beautiful job carving out a niche is all - this aint the place for role players. hell, you could drop him right now, plug in Caron Butler, and get my vote for Best-in-Show. now, i'm not sure i could rate this the best Naughties squad. it plays nice, yeah - coulda played great

Completely agree with you that Bowen doesn't belong anywhere near an all-time player list, and if we were just drafting the best players of all-time he wouldn't even be in consideration.  For his spot, with the people I had, I knew it would need be a guy on offense who wouldn't/shouldn't be touching the ball very much, and could knock down open shots.  So I went with what I considered the best overall defender of the decade at the guard/wing, although Artest would obviously have a case.  With those two, I leaned Bowen due to his better percentages and consistency from deep, his lack of usage (which actually was a positive here, don't want Metta unnecessarily forcing bad possessions), and ability to on the defensive end (Bowen is more suited to cover 2s and less suited to cover 4s than Artest, which works better for my team with Allen and KG respectively). Basically it was a building the best team issue versus a drafting the best basketball player. 

 

[Kev4029]

I think Metta World Peace, Shane Battier, Tayshaun Prince or even Doug Christie could have been a better choices for scoobus that were all still available if he was looking for a perimeter defender who could shoot corner threes.

Other than MWP, I think Bowen was a significantly better defender than that group.  Like way significantly better. I would have taken MWP over Bowen and the rest, but Bowen would have been the clear #2 of the group.

 

[Jayrod]

Other than MWP, I think Bowen was a significantly better defender than that group.  Like way significantly better. I would have taken MWP over Bowen and the rest, but Bowen would have been the clear #2 of the group.

I don't know about "significantly better defender".  Every single one of them made multiple all-defensive teams but weren't nearly the offensive liability that Bowen was and Bowen was by far the worst rebounder of the bunch. 

If you look at advanced stats, Bowen is dead last in all of the major stats with a negative BPM and single digit PER and VORP and a WS/48 of .086.

You can have a guy that provides very similar defensive stats without being a gaping hole offensively.  Heck, Bowen was even a very poor FT shooter (career 57.5%).

 

[Gally]

I don't know about "significantly better defender".  Every single one of them made multiple all-defensive teams but weren't nearly the offensive liability that Bowen was and Bowen was by far the worst rebounder of the bunch. 

If you look at advanced stats, Bowen is dead last in all of the major stats with a negative BPM and single digit PER and VORP and a WS/48 of .086.

You can have a guy that provides very similar defensive stats without being a gaping hole offensively.  Heck, Bowen was even a very poor FT shooter (career 57.5%).

A vote against Bowen is a vote for Team Gally

 

[Jayrod]

A vote against Bowen is a vote for Team Gally

Well there is the matter of Shaq/Garnett/Kidd/Allen to consider.

 

[Gally]

Well there is the matter of Shaq/Garnett/Kidd/Allen to consider.

No match for Team Gally

 

[Yo Mama]

Anyone else planning on sending 2000s rankings?

 

[Gally]

Anyone else planning on sending 2000s rankings?

Only send it in if you despise Bruce Bowen and have Team Gally in the top spot!

 

[Yo Mama]

Only send it in if you despise Bruce Bowen and have Team Gally in the top spot!

I’m kind of hoping there aren’t any more. There currently aren’t any ties to figure out.  Plus I have my writ ups ready since I’ve got lots of work this afternoon. 

 

[Instinctive]

I’m kind of hoping there aren’t any more. There currently aren’t any ties to figure out.  Plus I have my writ ups ready since I’ve got lots of work this afternoon. 

I'm mostly interested in the 3rd-5th and thoughts from folks. I think Gally's team is so weak on the perimeter defensive angle and has giant loser and horrible chemistry Dwight in it, so there's a lot of reasons to knock it down even if I agree with all the Bowen criticisms...Duncan may actually have his brain broken trying to be a team player and relaxed and hardworking all the time. 

 

[higgins]

Anyone else planning on sending 2000s rankings?

Yeah — be done in a second