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Andy Dalton's Upside (1 Viewer)

MountainMan0726

Footballguy
It seems as though I'm always reading/hearing about the talent and future upside of another Bengals skill position player, yet the source of that hypothetical production never seems to flow up to Dalton as it would ultimately have to.

AJ Green - A stud #1 for a long, long time.

Mohamed Sanu - Brief flashes of red zone talent (if not yardage), prior to injury.

Andrew Hawkins - Seems like a prototypcial slot guy, with big play potential on any catch.

Marvin Jones - Positive reports on his talent level, should battle Sanu for #2 in camp.

Jermaine Gresham - Very athletic TE, a regular name on breakout candidate lists.

Cedric Peerman - If he gets healthy & involved, scouting reports reflect good hands (caught 44 passes his Sr. year @ Virginia).

Obviously there's risk here, but should this group come together as they all COULD wouldn't Dalton be a worthwhile upside stash? Or does Dalton represent the glass ceiling that these guys would eventually hit?

 
Rotoworld:

A.J. Green doesn't believe 2013 is a "make-or-break" year for Andy Dalton.
"He's still the quarterback of the future because he has every intangible to be a great one," Green said of his teammate. "He works hard, he has great leadership. I think he'll be fine." Pressure is mounting on Dalton to take a step forward after his play bottomed out down the stretch last season, culminating in a pathetic Wild Card performance. We'd guess Dalton will still be the Bengals' quarterback in 2014 no matter what, but another static year could ignite the search for his successor.

Related: A.J. Green

Source: bengals.com
The Bengals are working on quickening the time Andy Dalton drops back in the pocket, as well as his ability to throw the deep ball.

"We got it where we need to get it," said QBs coach Ken Zampese. "It’s better than it was and we just have to get used to the timing of live guys running. With the OTAs we get more chances to keep working on it." Football Outsiders pinned Dalton with 17 coverage sacks last season, and he posted the fourth-lowest QB rating among AFC passers on passes over 20 yards in the air. It's a make or break year for the third-year quarterback.

May 22 - 12:19 PM

Source: Cincinnati Enquirer
Football Outsiders charted Andy Dalton with taking 17 coverage sacks last season.

That was the highest total in the league. The Bengals' line "allowed" 46 sacks last season, which was the seventh-most, but Dalton's propensity to hold onto the ball contributed greatly to that. The Bengals have a strong group of blockers, and our own Evan Silva ranked them ninth in his offensive line rankings.

May 16 - 11:21 PM

Source: Tom Gower on Twitter
Speaking in a Tuesday radio interview, Bengals OC Jay Gruden conceded Andy Dalton has "a long way to go."

"He’s done some great things for a second-year quarterback. ... But we feel like he has not come close to his potential," Gruden said. "That’s our job to get it out of him. And he knows he’s gotta play better." Gruden specifically mentioned Dalton's touch and deep-ball accuracy as things he must improve. Dalton's weak arm makes the latter unlikely to get better.

Mar 5 - 5:17 PM

Source: ESPN.com
Bengals OC Jay Gruden brushed off concerns over Andy Dalton's late-season fade, expressing confidence in him as the quarterback of the future.
"I think Andy is the guy. If you compare his two-year stats to Drew Brees and the other great quarterbacks now, I think you'd be surprised what he's done his first two years," Gruden said. "Obviously he has shown some flaws he has to work on, but every other quarterback in their first two years in the league has shown that." While Dalton entered the league with doubts about his physical limitations, it's a growing concern that he's grown more hesitant and regressed mentally.


Source: bengals.com

Jan 8 - 5:56 PM
 
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'Jaws' disappointed in Andy Dalton's play

Joe Reedy

Excerpt:

When he did his QB rankings last year, ESPN’S Ron Jaworski expected big things from Andy Dalton and said "I would not be surprised if a year from now Dalton is approaching my top 10. He has a chance to make that kind of jump in one season."

Needless to say you could see the disappointment from Jaworski in assessing Dalton this year. For the second straight year, Jaworski has Dalton ranked 19th among NFL starting quarterbacks.

“I truly believed he would make a significant jump, but despite solid numbers in many categories, he played too tentative at times and left far too many plays on the field," said Jaworski in his recent assessment of Dalton.

What disappointed Jaworski the most was Dalton's play in the red zone. Even though Dalton has 30 touchdown passes and no interceptions in the red zone in his two years in the league, Jaworski saw too many times when Dalton was tentative and had too many poor reads or took a sack.

“This will be a critical year for Dalton. He’s a rock-solid NFL starting quarterback, but there’s too much inconsistency in his overall play," Jaworski added. "Is he at a bit of a crossroads? It might be too early to say that, but I need to see improvement."
 
'Hard Knocks' increases pressure on Andy Dalton, Marvin Lewis

By Adam Schein

Columnist, NFL.com

I love the fact that the Cincinnati Bengals are going to be featured on "Hard Knocks" this year. NFL Films and HBO do an amazing job with the series, providing viewers with behind-the-scenes access, compelling drama and sensational stories.

But when your team is under the spotlight -- and the curtain is pulled back on your operation -- the pressure increases. And the pressure, most certainly, is on Andy Dalton and Marvin Lewis. These two must prove that they comprise the kind of QB/coach combination that will allow the Bengals to take that next step as a team.

Yes, seriously.

In the NFL, you either have a franchise quarterback or you don't. Andy Dalton has been a successful winner over his first two years in the NFL. I can't take that away from him. I won't even try to minimize it. Dalton has guided the Bengals to the playoffs twice in two seasons (both times via a wild-card berth). He's 19-13 as a starter in the regular season. That's good. Dalton made Carson Palmer -- and Palmer's self-serving, team-hurting holdout -- a distant memory. That's important.

Now, ask yourself this: Is Cincinnati a team that currently has a franchise quarterback?

Take out a sheet of paper. Rank the quarterbacks in the NFL. Where do you have Dalton on your list? I have him as the 22nd-best quarterback in football.

One NFL executive told me on Monday night the ranking was "spot-on," while another wondered why he was "that high on the list."

Meanwhile, another executive from a playoff team said he would rank Dalton higher than I did, putting him "in the 17-20" range. I responded to that exec by asking him if Dalton was a franchise quarterback. His answer? "You can win with him if you have a great offensive coach and a strong defense."

Andy Dalton does not have a strong arm. He doesn't have great accuracy. He doesn't put fear in the opposition.

And Andy Dalton has performed poorly in the playoffs.

In the 2011 wild-card round, Dalton threw three picks and zero touchdown passes against the Houston Texans. In a related story, the Texans blew the doors off of Cincy, 31-10. And this was a Houston team playing with its third-string quarterback.

In the 2012 wild-card round, Dalton was dreadful, completing just 46.7 percent of his passes (14-for-30) for a paltry 127 yards. Houston beat Cincy again, 19-13. Despite Dalton's subpar play, the Bengals still had a chance to win the game. On a third-and-11 with three minutes left, A.J. Green somehow got behind the defense, giving Dalton plenty of space to hit his star receiver in the end zone. Dalton overthrew him. The Bengals lost.

In the 2011 wild-card game, Dalton averaged just 6.12 yards per pass attempt. That number shrank even lower in 2012's postseason contest, down to a miniscule 4.23.

Meanwhile, Marvin Lewis has been through a ton of zaniness in his time with the Bengals, from Chad Johnson becoming Chad Ochocinco to numerous player arrests to Palmer's rise ... then playoff knee injury ... then "retirement." And somehow, he's kept his wits about him.

Lewis is 79-80-1 as the Bengals' coach. As Bill Parcells once said, "You are what your record says you are." And yes, while it's true that Palmer's injury changed the fortunes of that 2005 playoff game against the Pittsburgh Steelers, it's also true that Lewis is winless in the playoffs with Cincy (0-4).

Take out a pen. Write down the names of the head coaches in the NFL. Where would you rank Marvin Lewis?

Now, think about the last two playoff losses against Houston. How would you characterize his game management? His challenges were flawed and counterproductive in both contests.

I would argue that defensive coordinator Mike Zimmer and offensive coordinator Jay Gruden both have the potential to be better head coaches than Lewis. It's a crime that Zimmer hasn't received a crack, given his defensive success and track record. He is the reason that the Bengals' defense gels and overachieves.

As one NFL executive phrased it, "Dalton and Lewis are fortunate they have one of the best coordinator tandems in the NFL."

Congrats to the Bengals on receiving their second "Hard Knocks" assignment (following their 2009 debut on the show). I can't wait to watch.

But this will only increase the intensity of an already bright spotlight on the quarterback and head coach.

Follow Adam Schein on Twitter @AdamSchein.
 
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I've been noodling with the idea of drafting Dalton as part of my QBBC with the hopes that he and the other pick would earn their way into being an every-week start.

What concerns me is that Dalton was 15th in attempts last year with 529 while the Law Firm was 8th in rushing attempts with 278. This seems to point to a more balanced offense rather than a pass happy one.

Even if Dalton becomes more bold will he have enough opportunities to push some pretty incredible QB talent out of the Top 10? And even if he does manage to crack the seal can you see him being much better than QB8?

That said, I think Dalton represents great value as a high-floor guy who is being drafted late because of his unsexy-ness. (His abyssmal showing during the playoff game against Houston certaintly didn't help his image.)

Not to thread jack, but maybe the question is what is his floor? And what are the advantages of taking a QB very, very, very late and building a team around the other positions instead? Just my :2cents:

 
Dalton had 4 rushing TDs last year that boosted his FF value, and it seems unlikely that he will replicate that success on the ground again. Dalton strikes me as a decent redraft option as a solid QB 2 option, but his dynasty value is clouded by the fact that the Bengals could decide to move in another direction in 2014 or 2015 via the draft or free agency.

 
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I think the added weapons of Gio Bernard and Tyler Eifert will take the offense to another level.

The law firm had 22 catches @ 4.7ypc last season. I think Bernard will do close to twice as well so that is about 200 extra yards for Dalton right there. As mentioned above Dalton was sacked too many times in 2012. If he can reduce the sacks from 46(2012) closer to the 24(2011) he gave up as a rookie, that would be another 50-100 yards he would not lose from the sacks and those plays may also lead to completions.

Although Dalton has struggled in the playoffs he performed pretty well in the regular season for a 2nd year QB. He improved his completion % from 58.1% to 62.3% in one season, interceptions increased from 13 to 16 but TD increased from 20 to 27.

Given these things and expected improvement from Dalton in his 3rd year I see him getting over 4k throwing yards and 25-30ish TD passes. For a QB in the 20 range (ADP/NFL rank) those are not bad numbers at all.

 
Dalton curiously gets no love on this board but gets a lot elsewhere. It's odd.

As I mentioned in the other thread-he has lead the most inexperienced offense the last two years and done pretty well doing it.

The Bungles made the playoffs the last two years...the Bungles did. They only made it twice in the previous twenty years.

He has been curiously always in the shadow of someone else-another young QB or Green or even their RBs.

 
'Jaws' disappointed in Andy Dalton's play

Joe Reedy

Excerpt:

What disappointed Jaworski the most was Dalton's play in the red zone. Even though Dalton has 30 touchdown passes and no interceptions in the red zone in his two years in the league, Jaworski saw too many times when Dalton was tentative and had too many poor reads or took a sack.
'Hard Knocks' increases pressure on Andy Dalton, Marvin Lewis

By Adam Schein

Columnist, NFL.com

Lewis is 79-80-1 as the Bengals' coach. As Bill Parcells once said, "You are what your record says you are." And yes, while it's true that Palmer's injury changed the fortunes of that 2005 playoff game against the Pittsburgh Steelers, it's also true that Lewis is winless in the playoffs with Cincy (0-4).
Talk about a tough crowd.

In the 10 years preceeding Marvin Lewis, the Bengals were 47-113 and under Lewis they are on average an 8-8 side with rosters that have generally overachieved. If they replace Lewis what is the bet they look more like the period 93-02, than 03 to now? Lewis has brought credibility back to the Bengals.

He has rebuilt that roster twice and has an excellent chance to take it to the next level this year. Sometimes consistency in coaching pays off.

As for Dalton, put that Red Zone record up against ANY NFL quarterback in their first 2 years and see how it stacks up. Even up against season pro's it is dang near awesome.

His offense is incredibly young, as is he. With 2 high class rookies, this should be a 2 year project to see what the assembled line up can achieve.

Overreacting to any result from 6-10 upwards would be a colossal mistake.

The pressure is obviously on for Lewis/Dalton, but there are far more worthy targets than these 2 overachievers.

 
A top-3 WR in Green, a rising (and hopefully uninjured Sanu), other decent young WRs in Jones and Hawkins. A great target in Gresham (if he stops dropping the ball) and a versatile top TE prospect in Eifert. A good and shifty receiving RB in Bernard.

The addition of two good underneath targets to this west coast offense and a myriad of options has me bullish on Dalton repeating and perhaps improving his numbers. He'll be a steal this year as he'll probably get drafted in the high teens out of QBs and will produce better than that. They've added pieces and subtracted none (though hopefully they'll wise up and start Robinson over Cook - Cook's return the last 6 games is a hidden part of some of Dalton's woes IMO).

Rode him to the final last year and figure to get him back this year after everyone else has taken a QB.

-QG

 
Talk about a tough crowd.


In the 10 years preceeding Marvin Lewis, the Bengals were 47-113 and under Lewis they are on average an 8-8 side with rosters that have generally overachieved. If they replace Lewis what is the bet they look more like the period 93-02, than 03 to now? Lewis has brought credibility back to the Bengals.

He has rebuilt that roster twice and has an excellent chance to take it to the next level this year. Sometimes consistency in coaching pays off.

As for Dalton, put that Red Zone record up against ANY NFL quarterback in their first 2 years and see how it stacks up. Even up against season pro's it is dang near awesome.

His offense is incredibly young, as is he. With 2 high class rookies, this should be a 2 year project to see what the assembled line up can achieve.

Overreacting to any result from 6-10 upwards would be a colossal mistake.

The pressure is obviously on for Lewis/Dalton, but there are far more worthy targets than these 2 overachievers.
Lewis was as much to blame as anyone. They signed these awesome young players that were known troublemakers and that spread to other teammates and...the Bungles had a lot of arrests when lewis was starting. Further, very few of those troublemakers even panned out.

At some point, we all know even if it's not on public record, Lewis said he could handle em' and he flat out couldn't.

That roster was rebuilt a 2nd time because they goofed. I don't agree you praising him for the roster being rebuilt, it feels "off". Credit for the second go around? Sure, but let's not ignore the first set on his roster if we're going to discuss his career.

Lewis was an awesome DC and oh my was he so impressive. I haven't seen that in Cincy and it's peculiar. I give him a ton of credit because he adjusted and I was concerned about the O when he came to Cincy, but it's been a long time and I'd like to be reminded how awesome a DC he was with a top notch Cincy D

ETA Cincy had the smallest scouting/personnel dept in the NFL and was still operating off the concept that Paul Brown (yes him) preferred to scout players himself and have his coaches do so. Changing this was one of Lewis' demands when signing with Cincy. He very likely had a larger stake in drafting those troublemakers than most NFL HCs have in drafting players. So revamping personnel dept, getting them to change an ancient system-huge kudos to Lewis, but he's gotta take some flack for those first few drafts too.

 
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That's pretty much why I picked him as the comparison. Dalton is very competent and has looked solid in his first 32 + 2, but I don't know that I see him having the tools to be a transcendent fantasy passer, or even annually above-average like Romo year-in, year-out. To me, that's the story of Eli Manning.

 
Rotoworld:

After attending the first week of Bengals camp, ESPN's Jamison Hensley observed Andy Dalton "remains a streaky passer" who appeared to have an initial rhythm before "forcing throws into coverage" the next few practices.
The Bengals have surrounded Dalton with an impressive array of weapons in hopes the playmakers help him compensate for his own talent deficiencies. In each of his first two seasons, Dalton has started hot before fading dramatically down the stretch. Often unwilling to pull the trigger on tight-window throws, he doesn't seem to trust his arm. Dalton is a back-end QB2 in fantasy football.


Source: ESPN.com
 
A top-3 WR in Green, a rising (and hopefully uninjured Sanu), other decent young WRs in Jones and Hawkins. A great target in Gresham (if he stops dropping the ball) and a versatile top TE prospect in Eifert. A good and shifty receiving RB in Bernard.

The addition of two good underneath targets to this west coast offense and a myriad of options has me bullish on Dalton repeating and perhaps improving his numbers. He'll be a steal this year as he'll probably get drafted in the high teens out of QBs and will produce better than that. They've added pieces and subtracted none (though hopefully they'll wise up and start Robinson over Cook - Cook's return the last 6 games is a hidden part of some of Dalton's woes IMO).

Rode him to the final last year and figure to get him back this year after everyone else has taken a QB.

-QG
:goodposting:

Came to make a similar post.

I love the way the Bengals look going into this season. The defense looks great, which should give the offense plenty of time on the field.

The added weapons have to help, and I especially like the possibility of having two TEs who are legit receiving threats. Gresham may be overlooked in drafts with people thinking Eifert is going to replace his numbers. I think Eifert will help Gresham and A J Green. If Gio turns out to be anything like what is expected, then Dalton's numbers have to improve.

As to whether Dalton repeats his 4 rushing TDs, Put me in the camp that just likes the fact that he looks for the opportunity, and is obviously willing to take it when its there. Maybe he only gets 1 or 2, or maybe he gets 5 or 6.

That said, is anyone other than A J Green(who you have to pay for) and Dalton (as a cheap low end QB1 for a QB2 price) going to help your fantasy team this year?

For me, after many mock drafts from different positions, Dalton keeps landing as my QB2 and Gresham as TE2. Nothing overly exciting, but I feel better waiting for QB1 and TE1 knowing these guys should be there late to fall back on and they should be solid enough to help save your season if you lose to injury or whiff on a late QB1 or TE1. I whiffed on QB1 last year and used Dalton to get me enough to still win my league. He's still going in the 10th to 12th rounds. A nice crutch to fall back on.

 
Given his weapons his upside is enormous but he must play significantly better than last season, especially late. Still quality qb2, but keep expectations in check until proven otherwise.

 
Given his weapons his upside is enormous but he must play significantly better than last season, especially late. Still quality qb2, but keep expectations in check until proven otherwise.
His skill-set is the bottleneck here.... doesn't matter how great those players around him are. Look at Denver last year versus the year previous for example.

 

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