Any Dealership Guys? Question about buying a trade-in. (1 Viewer)

[Lehigh98]

General question, how badly do new car dealerships want to get rid of older cars that came in via trade?

We're shopping around for a first used car for my 16 yo son. I found a 2015 Honda Civic SE (90,000 mi) at a Subaru dealership that they received as a trade in. They've had it sitting in their lot for almost 2 months. I'm guessing the reason is that it's a little banged up visually but seems to be ok otherwise. Probably fine for my son who isn't picky and probably going to put his own dings in it anyway. The dealership has done some work (11/18) to make it more attractive to buyers including: new tires, alignment, balancing, new battery, new serpentine belt, new spark plugs, new inspection.

I'm going to borrow it today to have my mechanic take a look at it. They listed it on 11/8 for $15,060 the dropped it to $14,799 on 11/30 the dropped again to $13,999 on 12/20. When we looked at it yesterday and were leaving, the younger sales rep told me if we're interested at all they'd be willing to make a deal because they want to move it.

Comps in the area for 2015 Honda Civics are:
95k miles for $11,000
80k miles for $14,300
87k miles for $13,300

I'm going to take it to my mechanic and a detail guy today to get some thoughts on condition and cost to fix up some dings / scratches.
If it checks out, what would you look to pay for something like this? What would you send as your first offer?

TIA!

 

[ChiefD]

General question, how badly do new car dealerships want to get rid of older cars that came in via trade?

We're shopping around for a first used car for my 16 yo son. I found a 2015 Honda Civic SE (90,000 mi) at a Subaru dealership that they received as a trade in. They've had it sitting in their lot for almost 2 months. I'm guessing the reason is that it's a little banged up visually but seems to be ok otherwise. Probably fine for my son who isn't picky and probably going to put his own dings in it anyway. The dealership has done some work (11/18) to make it more attractive to buyers including: new tires, alignment, balancing, new battery, new serpentine belt, new spark plugs, new inspection.

I'm going to borrow it today to have my mechanic take a look at it. They listed it on 11/8 for $15,060 the dropped it to $14,799 on 11/30 the dropped again to $13,999 on 12/20. When we looked at it yesterday and were leaving, the younger sales rep told me if we're interested at all they'd be willing to make a deal because they want to move it.

Comps in the area for 2015 Honda Civics are:
95k miles for $11,000
80k miles for $14,300
87k miles for $13,300

I'm going to take it to my mechanic and a detail guy today to get some thoughts on condition and cost to fix up some dings / scratches.
If it checks out, what would you look to pay for something like this? What would you send as your first offer?

TIA!

Offer them $12,500.

 

[belljr]

16,000!!!

 

[ghostguy123]

They overprice them because they preferably want to sell the new cars.

 

[belljr]

In all seriousness - without know the condition and area this could vary a 2015 SE in my zip code in fair condition is valued at 12K on KBB high end

I'd offer them 10k and see where they go

 

[ghostguy123]

The body issues alone should knock it down 2 grand.
However, this is a weird time to buy vehicles. Perhaps the normal rules don't apply.

 

[belljr]

so a trade in - in my area in fair condition is ~ 9K for that vehicle.

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

So lets assume a 50% markup (it usually probably normally ~30 - but not in a normal environment obviously

So if they have 10k in at a 50% markup they are in that 15K price.

I wouldnt pay more than 12K probably pending on condition that I can't see

 

[ghostguy123]

If you are paying cash, go find a private seller.
If you have to finance, well, that's how they getcha

 

[Doug B]

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

True ... but a new serpentine belt on a car with 90k miles is a very nice add-in. That Honda engine block itself likely has another 150,000 - 200,000 miles in it, so having several of the peripherals handled is worth something IMHO.

Lehigh, ask your mechanic specifically to check on five things:

1) Any appreciable fluid leaks? Chiefly oil and transmission fluid.
2) The condition of the starter? Broken flywheel teeth, solenoid OK, etc.
3) The condition of the alternator?
4) Any signs whatsoever of a crack in the radiator and/or engine block? Unlikely, but you want to know this with certainty before purchase.
5) Estimate of lifespan left in the brakes -- needs a brake job soon, or brakes look good for a while yet?

 

[fruity pebbles]

Can’t believe these are going for $14 odd thousand. Brand new the MSRP was $19,900. It’s banged up, 8 years old and has almost 100,000 miles.

 

[Doug B]

Can’t believe these are going for $14 odd thousand. Brand new the MSRP was $19,900. It’s banged up, 8 years old and has almost 100,000 miles.

90,000 miles on a 2015 Civic is not the same as what 90,000 miles was on, say, 1980s Chevy Cavaliers or Oldsmobile Cutlasses. When we were coming up, cars pushing 100,000 miles (especially domestic makes) were considered to be on their last legs.

These days? It's common for a well-maintained 2000s Honda to get a quarter-million miles. Most other makes have closed the reliability gap over the last 25-30 years, too.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Can’t believe these are going for $14 odd thousand. Brand new the MSRP was $19,900. It’s banged up, 8 years old and has almost 100,000 miles.

90,000 miles on a 2015 Civic is not the same as what 90,000 miles was on, say, 1980s Chevy Cavaliers or Oldsmobile Cutlasses. When we were coming up, cars pushing 100,000 miles (especially domestic makes) were considered to be on their last legs.

These days? It's common for a well-maintained 2000s Honda to get a quarter-million miles. Most other makes have closed the reliability gap over the last 25-30 years, too.

I get it but I’m still surprised It’s only dropped six grand over eight years. It doesn’t sound like it’s in the best condition either….average at best.

 

[ghostguy123]

Can’t believe these are going for $14 odd thousand. Brand new the MSRP was $19,900. It’s banged up, 8 years old and has almost 100,000 miles.

90,000 miles on a 2015 Civic is not the same as what 90,000 miles was on, say, 1980s Chevy Cavaliers or Oldsmobile Cutlasses. When we were coming up, cars pushing 100,000 miles (especially domestic makes) were considered to be on their last legs.

These days? It's common for a well-maintained 2000s Honda to get a quarter-million miles. Most other makes have closed the reliability gap over the last 25-30 years, too.

I get it but I’m still surprised It’s only dropped six grand over eight years. It doesn’t sound like it’s in the best condition either….average at best.

Makes buying a new one a smarter move......if you can find one.
Thats the problem unfortunately.

 

[belljr]

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

True ... but a new serpentine belt on a car with 90k miles is a very nice add-in. That Honda engine block itself likely has another 150,000 - 200,000 miles in it, so having several of the peripherals handled is worth something IMHO.

Lehigh, ask your mechanic specifically to check on five things:

1) Any appreciable fluid leaks? Chiefly oil and transmission fluid.
2) The condition of the starter? Broken flywheel teeth, solenoid OK, etc.
3) The condition of the alternator?
4) Any signs whatsoever of a crack in the radiator and/or engine block? Unlikely, but you want to know this with certainty before purchase.
5) Estimate of lifespan left in the brakes -- needs a brake job soon, or brakes look good for a while yet?

that belt is like $200 including labor for the average schmoe lol now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

but agree with your questions

 

[ghostguy123]

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

True ... but a new serpentine belt on a car with 90k miles is a very nice add-in. That Honda engine block itself likely has another 150,000 - 200,000 miles in it, so having several of the peripherals handled is worth something IMHO.

Lehigh, ask your mechanic specifically to check on five things:

1) Any appreciable fluid leaks? Chiefly oil and transmission fluid.
2) The condition of the starter? Broken flywheel teeth, solenoid OK, etc.
3) The condition of the alternator?
4) Any signs whatsoever of a crack in the radiator and/or engine block? Unlikely, but you want to know this with certainty before purchase.
5) Estimate of lifespan left in the brakes -- needs a brake job soon, or brakes look good for a while yet?

that belt is like $200 including labor for the average schmoe lol now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

but agree with your questions

I don't think the newer hondas have timing belts anymore, switched to chains.
Edit....2015 civic might have belt still

 

[belljr]

Can’t believe these are going for $14 odd thousand. Brand new the MSRP was $19,900. It’s banged up, 8 years old and has almost 100,000 miles.

90,000 miles on a 2015 Civic is not the same as what 90,000 miles was on, say, 1980s Chevy Cavaliers or Oldsmobile Cutlasses. When we were coming up, cars pushing 100,000 miles (especially domestic makes) were considered to be on their last legs.

These days? It's common for a well-maintained 2000s Honda to get a quarter-million miles. Most other makes have closed the reliability gap over the last 25-30 years, too.

I get it but I’m still surprised It’s only dropped six grand over eight years. It doesn’t sound like it’s in the best condition either….average at best.

Top 10 Vehicles with the Lowest Five-Year Depreciation - iSeeCars Study
Rank	Model	Average 5-Year Depreciation	Avg $ Difference from MSRP
1	Jeep Wrangler	7.3%	$2,361
2	Jeep Wrangler Unlimited	8.7%	$3,344
3	Porsche 911	14.6%	$20,634
4	Toyota Tacoma	14.9%	$5,926
5	Honda Civic	16.3%	$4,237
6	Subaru BRZ	18.2%	$5,985
7	Ford Mustang	19.4%	$7,528
8	Toyota Corolla	19.8%	$4,617
9	Nissan Versa	19.9%	$3,183
10	Chevrolet Camaro	20.2%	$7,981
National Average	33.3%	$14,049

 

[belljr]

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

True ... but a new serpentine belt on a car with 90k miles is a very nice add-in. That Honda engine block itself likely has another 150,000 - 200,000 miles in it, so having several of the peripherals handled is worth something IMHO.

Lehigh, ask your mechanic specifically to check on five things:

1) Any appreciable fluid leaks? Chiefly oil and transmission fluid.
2) The condition of the starter? Broken flywheel teeth, solenoid OK, etc.
3) The condition of the alternator?
4) Any signs whatsoever of a crack in the radiator and/or engine block? Unlikely, but you want to know this with certainty before purchase.
5) Estimate of lifespan left in the brakes -- needs a brake job soon, or brakes look good for a while yet?

that belt is like $200 including labor for the average schmoe lol now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

but agree with your questions

I don't think the newer hondas have timing belts anymore, switched to chains

correct - I should have specified that - but my point was a new serpentine belt which should be replaced ~90k is not the great "add-in" Doug was referring. Thats a $30 part

 

[ghostguy123]

Get a new Kia Rio for 20k, lol

 

[ghostguy123]

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

True ... but a new serpentine belt on a car with 90k miles is a very nice add-in. That Honda engine block itself likely has another 150,000 - 200,000 miles in it, so having several of the peripherals handled is worth something IMHO.

Lehigh, ask your mechanic specifically to check on five things:

1) Any appreciable fluid leaks? Chiefly oil and transmission fluid.
2) The condition of the starter? Broken flywheel teeth, solenoid OK, etc.
3) The condition of the alternator?
4) Any signs whatsoever of a crack in the radiator and/or engine block? Unlikely, but you want to know this with certainty before purchase.
5) Estimate of lifespan left in the brakes -- needs a brake job soon, or brakes look good for a while yet?

that belt is like $200 including labor for the average schmoe lol now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

but agree with your questions

I don't think the newer hondas have timing belts anymore, switched to chains

correct - I should have specified that - but my point was a new serpentine belt which should be replaced ~90k is not the great "add-in" Doug was referring. Thats a $30 part

Right. 200 bucks at a mechanic, tops

 

[fruity pebbles]

I mean as far as work. They’ve done about $800 worth of stuff.

 

[Doug B]

... now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

The 2015 Hondas have timing chains -- should still be fine at 90,000k.

 

[ghostguy123]

Here's a quick example of how used cars skyrocketed.
I bought a 2009 rav4 about 4-5 years ago for $8500. It was totaled a year ago, insurance paid $11,000.

 

[ghostguy123]

... now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

The 2015 Hondas have timing chains -- should still be fine at 90,000k.

I would hope so. The chains never need to be replaced. Theoretically

 

[belljr]

... now if it were the timing belt - which it probably needs then yeah thats good

The 2015 Hondas have timing chains -- should still be fine at 90,000k.

yeah i think 150ish is the recommended interval

signed
an accord
a civic
a passport owner

 

[Doug B]

my point was a new serpentine belt which should be replaced ~90k is not the great "add-in" Doug was referring. Thats a $30 part

You're right -- I was thinking "timing belt" and flubbed the post. Still, it's nice to not have, say, the A/C go out because of a belt issue three months after getting the car.

 

[ghostguy123]

Bought a 2012 Ford Escape with 90k miles like 8 months ago. $7,500.
Since then the rear window fell off (one of those hatch windows, dumb, only cost me like 100 to replace myself, thanks junk yard).
The muffler was toast and broke, unfortunately along with catalytic converter, cost 800.
Just got new tires, 450.

I'm still happy with the purchase given the landscape of used vehicles.

 

[gianmarco]

FWIW, from what I've seen/read/heard, inventories and prices are starting to normalize again. It's not back at where it was pre-Covid and before all this nonsense, but it's much, much better. I would NOT overpay for that kind of used car. If you're able to be patient, you could/should be able to find a deal that is better that you feel comfortable with.

Assuming the car checks out ok with your mechanic, I'd pick a price that you wouldn't regret even if something better comes along later on. My gut is ~$10K.

 

[belljr]

Bought a 2012 Ford Escape with 90k miles like 8 months ago. $7,500.
Since then the rear window fell off (one of those hatch windows, dumb, only cost me like 100 to replace myself, thanks junk yard).
The muffler was toast and broke, unfortunately along with catalytic converter, cost 800.
Just got new tires, 450.

I'm still happy with the purchase given the landscape of used vehicles.

so when i got rid of my accord for now my daughters 2016 civic we did not plan ahead.

I'm now bouncing around in a 2009 Traverse. My wife drives the new Passport. It needs 5K in repairs. It only has 135K miles on it but the 13 years is taking its toll. I need new catalytic converter, o2 sensors, timing chain and something else.

I need to find some cheap tires to just throw on it for the time being

 

[ghostguy123]

One other thing I will probably look to do next time I need a new car.......I live near Cleveland, and the weather here is hard on vehicles.
If I buy a used car again, I will probably look to buy from a more southern state and maybe even fly down to pick it up.
Well worth the avoidance of several years of the harsh conditions, salt............

 

[MTskibum]

Used car prices are tanking fast. I would low-ball them.


One of my hobbies is buying a car every other year or so to try to minimize cost of driving. Now is not the time to buy new or used unless necessary. Many car lots are upside down on their used cars and right now they are afraid to sell them at a loss. That will change shortly though.

What Do Falling Used Car Prices Actually Mean for You?

After years of increases, the auto industry has seen falling used car prices over the past several months. But is now a good time to buy a used car?

www.automoblog.net

 

[snellman]

General question, how badly do new car dealerships want to get rid of older cars that came in via trade?

We're shopping around for a first used car for my 16 yo son. I found a 2015 Honda Civic SE (90,000 mi) at a Subaru dealership that they received as a trade in. They've had it sitting in their lot for almost 2 months. I'm guessing the reason is that it's a little banged up visually but seems to be ok otherwise. Probably fine for my son who isn't picky and probably going to put his own dings in it anyway. The dealership has done some work (11/18) to make it more attractive to buyers including: new tires, alignment, balancing, new battery, new serpentine belt, new spark plugs, new inspection.

I'm going to borrow it today to have my mechanic take a look at it. They listed it on 11/8 for $15,060 the dropped it to $14,799 on 11/30 the dropped again to $13,999 on 12/20. When we looked at it yesterday and were leaving, the younger sales rep told me if we're interested at all they'd be willing to make a deal because they want to move it.

Comps in the area for 2015 Honda Civics are:
95k miles for $11,000
80k miles for $14,300
87k miles for $13,300

I'm going to take it to my mechanic and a detail guy today to get some thoughts on condition and cost to fix up some dings / scratches.
If it checks out, what would you look to pay for something like this? What would you send as your first offer?

TIA!

If we keep and sell or wholesale cheap used vehicles depend a lot on condition of vehicle and mileage. If it needs too much work or has too many miles, it will go directly to the auction. We are eliminating part of the market by having less "cheap" vehicles on the lot, but a lot of times they end up being more headaches than they are worth because they buyer wants a "NEW" type vehicle at still a cheap price.

so a trade in - in my area in fair condition is ~ 9K for that vehicle.

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

So lets assume a 50% markup (it usually probably normally ~30 - but not in a normal environment obviously

So if they have 10k in at a 50% markup they are in that 15K price.

I wouldnt pay more than 12K probably pending on condition that I can't see

The service department will mark parts up the same amount for the sales department as it does for a normal customer in most dealerships. Think of it as 3-4 separate businesses (Sales, F&I, Service, Parts, possibly Body Shop) under one roof. Each department is basically its own business.

I mean as far as work. They’ve done about $800 worth of stuff.

Tires alone are probably over 800, Alignment is another 100, Spark plugs approximately $250, Battery $250, balancing part of Tires, belt $200. When a used vehicle goes through our shop, it already has $300 against just in inspection before we do any additional work.

 

[fruity pebbles]

FWIW, from what I've seen/read/heard, inventories and prices are starting to normalize again. It's not back at where it was pre-Covid and before all this nonsense, but it's much, much better. I would NOT overpay for that kind of used car. If you're able to be patient, you could/should be able to find a deal that is better that you feel comfortable with.

Assuming the car checks out ok with your mechanic, I'd pick a price that you wouldn't regret even if something better comes along later on. My gut is ~$10K.

General question, how badly do new car dealerships want to get rid of older cars that came in via trade?

We're shopping around for a first used car for my 16 yo son. I found a 2015 Honda Civic SE (90,000 mi) at a Subaru dealership that they received as a trade in. They've had it sitting in their lot for almost 2 months. I'm guessing the reason is that it's a little banged up visually but seems to be ok otherwise. Probably fine for my son who isn't picky and probably going to put his own dings in it anyway. The dealership has done some work (11/18) to make it more attractive to buyers including: new tires, alignment, balancing, new battery, new serpentine belt, new spark plugs, new inspection.

I'm going to borrow it today to have my mechanic take a look at it. They listed it on 11/8 for $15,060 the dropped it to $14,799 on 11/30 the dropped again to $13,999 on 12/20. When we looked at it yesterday and were leaving, the younger sales rep told me if we're interested at all they'd be willing to make a deal because they want to move it.

Comps in the area for 2015 Honda Civics are:
95k miles for $11,000
80k miles for $14,300
87k miles for $13,300

I'm going to take it to my mechanic and a detail guy today to get some thoughts on condition and cost to fix up some dings / scratches.
If it checks out, what would you look to pay for something like this? What would you send as your first offer?

TIA!

If we keep and sell or wholesale cheap used vehicles depend a lot on condition of vehicle and mileage. If it needs too much work or has too many miles, it will go directly to the auction. We are eliminating part of the market by having less "cheap" vehicles on the lot, but a lot of times they end up being more headaches than they are worth because they buyer wants a "NEW" type vehicle at still a cheap price.

so a trade in - in my area in fair condition is ~ 9K for that vehicle.

The stuff they did to the car is probably 1K worth of stuff since they won't have the parts marked up and the work is all internal.

So lets assume a 50% markup (it usually probably normally ~30 - but not in a normal environment obviously

So if they have 10k in at a 50% markup they are in that 15K price.

I wouldnt pay more than 12K probably pending on condition that I can't see

The service department will mark parts up the same amount for the sales department as it does for a normal customer in most dealerships. Think of it as 3-4 separate businesses (Sales, F&I, Service, Parts, possibly Body Shop) under one roof. Each department is basically its own business.

I mean as far as work. They’ve done about $800 worth of stuff.

Tires alone are probably over 800, Alignment is another 100, Spark plugs approximately $250, Battery $250, balancing part of Tires, belt $200. When a used vehicle goes through our shop, it already has $300 against just in inspection before we do any additional work.

Those are some pretty steep prices.

 

[massraider]

Can’t believe these are going for $14 odd thousand. Brand new the MSRP was $19,900. It’s banged up, 8 years old and has almost 100,000 miles.

Craziness

 

[New Binky the Doormat]

Used car prices are tanking fast. I would low-ball them.


One of my hobbies is buying a car every other year or so to try to minimize cost of driving. Now is not the time to buy new or used unless necessary. Many car lots are upside down on their used cars and right now they are afraid to sell them at a loss. That will change shortly though.

What Do Falling Used Car Prices Actually Mean for You?

After years of increases, the auto industry has seen falling used car prices over the past several months. But is now a good time to buy a used car?

www.automoblog.net

just started to follow this guy on twitter - really like the stuff he puts out

https://twitter.com/GuyDealership

 

[Lehigh98]

So, I spent a couple hours taking the car around today. My mechanic went through the Carfax and the full report from the last inspection (PA) and then took a look at the car. Brakes have about 50% left by the way. He said that although they did some cleaning and detailing, he could tell it had some rough miles on it. Carfax said the car had been in a "minor" accident on the from left and the panel still wasn't lined up exactly right. He said mechanically it looked pretty good with standard corrosion around these parts. He said he wouldn't pay more than $12,000-$12,500 but said I'd probably be better off finding a better car.

Took it to the detail guy next and he said that he could repair paint, dents, dings for about $500. But he also said he could tell it had some rough miles on it and pointed out a service visit in NY on the Carfax and said he'd be careful with a car with NY miles on it. He said that he wouldn't pay more that $10k-$12k for it but suggested getting something else.

I took it back to the dealer and said I wasn't interested in this one and he was cool with it but wanted to know what the guys said so I filled him in. He said he'd keep my info and let me know if he had anything else in better shape come in. I was running other errands all day and before I even got home, they reduced the online price again to $12,999.

Here's the car

Back to the online searches...

 

[belljr]

10k

 

[Da Guru]

So, I spent a couple hours taking the car around today. My mechanic went through the Carfax and the full report from the last inspection (PA) and then took a look at the car. Brakes have about 50% left by the way. He said that although they did some cleaning and detailing, he could tell it had some rough miles on it. Carfax said the car had been in a "minor" accident on the from left and the panel still wasn't lined up exactly right. He said mechanically it looked pretty good with standard corrosion around these parts. He said he wouldn't pay more than $12,000-$12,500 but said I'd probably be better off finding a better car.

Took it to the detail guy next and he said that he could repair paint, dents, dings for about $500. But he also said he could tell it had some rough miles on it and pointed out a service visit in NY on the Carfax and said he'd be careful with a car with NY miles on it. He said that he wouldn't pay more that $10k-$12k for it but suggested getting something else.

I took it back to the dealer and said I wasn't interested in this one and he was cool with it but wanted to know what the guys said so I filled him in. He said he'd keep my info and let me know if he had anything else in better shape come in. I was running other errands all day and before I even got home, they reduced the online price again to $12,999.

Here's the car

Back to the online searches...

Don`t worry about what the dealer is asking. What do you want to pay for that car? It is obvious it is not worth to you what they are asking. If 11K is your price point then just shoot them an email saying if you want to move the car and use that term, I will take it today for 11K, that is the best I can do.

Dealers want to move cars like this is they are still making a few bucks.

 

[Judge Smails]

FWIW, from what I've seen/read/heard, inventories and prices are starting to normalize again. It's not back at where it was pre-Covid and before all this nonsense, but it's much, much better. I would NOT overpay for that kind of used car. If you're able to be patient, you could/should be able to find a deal that is better that you feel comfortable with.

Assuming the car checks out ok with your mechanic, I'd pick a price that you wouldn't regret even if something better comes along later on. My gut is ~$10K.

They are going down. I put my Cadillac CTS out there and got nothing but lowball offers from dealers. Told them to pound sand

 

[CletiusMaximus]

just started to follow this guy on twitter - really like the stuff he puts out

https://twitter.com/GuyDealership

This guy is excellent. Been on fire since you posted this.

 

[pollardsvision]

So, I spent a couple hours taking the car around today. My mechanic went through the Carfax and the full report from the last inspection (PA) and then took a look at the car. Brakes have about 50% left by the way. He said that although they did some cleaning and detailing, he could tell it had some rough miles on it. Carfax said the car had been in a "minor" accident on the from left and the panel still wasn't lined up exactly right. He said mechanically it looked pretty good with standard corrosion around these parts. He said he wouldn't pay more than $12,000-$12,500 but said I'd probably be better off finding a better car.

Took it to the detail guy next and he said that he could repair paint, dents, dings for about $500. But he also said he could tell it had some rough miles on it and pointed out a service visit in NY on the Carfax and said he'd be careful with a car with NY miles on it. He said that he wouldn't pay more that $10k-$12k for it but suggested getting something else.

I took it back to the dealer and said I wasn't interested in this one and he was cool with it but wanted to know what the guys said so I filled him in. He said he'd keep my info and let me know if he had anything else in better shape come in. I was running other errands all day and before I even got home, they reduced the online price again to $12,999.

Here's the car

Back to the online searches...

Down to $11,999 now.