Being OUT on the NFL injury report (1 Viewer)

[Jefferson the Caregiver]

With Favre going from being OUT to being a starter tonight, first I ask if this has ever happened before. I can't remember hearing of this.

This truly makes the NFL injury report a complete joke. What is stopping every Coach from making important players OUT only to play them anyway.

This screws up every Coach that is trying to prepare for a game.

Is that really what the NFL wants to do or is this a Brett Favre exception?

I'm also hearing some speculation that news could be coming of a Favre suspension later in the week and the only reason Brett wants to play in this is so that he can have his last game but that's a whole other topic.

 

[WildEyedOne]

With Favre going from being OUT to being a starter tonight, first I ask if this has ever happened before. I can't remember hearing of this.This truly makes the NFL injury report a complete joke. What is stopping every Coach from making important players OUT only to play them anyway.This screws up every Coach that is trying to prepare for a game.Is that really what the NFL wants to do or is this a Brett Favre exception?I'm also hearing some speculation that news could be coming of a Favre suspension later in the week and the only reason Brett wants to play in this is so that he can have his last game but that's a whole other topic.

Apparently there are two superhuman QBs in the NFL...Vick and Super Bret (back from the dead)

 

[footballnerd]

maybe they got Favre and ADP mixed up?

 

[snogger]

I don't recall anyone going from out to questionable the day of the game. I heard one report say the Vikings asked for a special exception and got it. Wonder if that Had been someone like Klewue if the same. Exception would have been granted?

 

[Ty_Webb]

I don't recall anyone going from out to questionable the day of the game. I heard one report say the Vikings asked for a special exception and got it. Wonder if that Had been someone like Klewue if the same. Exception would have been granted?

Only 20 of 4,633 players listed as Out on the injury report since 2001 have played that week (0.43%). Favre's number 21.source, football outsiders dot com

 

[whole-show]

I was hoping there was a post for this, but not really an answer yet. I was talking to my buddy about this. How can a team say a player is out and then start them? I thought when they were listed as out they couldn't play. I agree with the person above it makes the injury report a joke if a team can list anyone as out and then start them. To me it makes no sense at all. Does anyone know how or why this is allowed?

 

[RUSF18]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81d0...le=HP_headlines

NFL spokesman Greg Aiello told NFL Network's Albert Breer that the Vikings contacted the Bears before making the announcement, with their trainer's explanation for the shift.

"His status changed. If a player's medical status changes, the team is supposed to change his playing status. That's what happened," Aiello said Monday. "The Vikings put out a statement about it, they felt better about it, he saw the trainer, and therefore it changes. When you put a player down on the injury report, it's an estimation of what it is. That situation changed today.

"Nothing in the policy prevents that, as long as there's a credible explanation. He's going to go out and throw, and see where he is," Aiello said. "The status is before the game, an estimation of where the player is, his status at that time. Then, on Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, if something changes, then it changes."

Aiello responded to questions about Favre leapfrogging a doubtful status for the game.

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"That's just quibbling," Aiello said. "In the judgment of the club and Brett, they didn't feel he'd be able to play. So he's out. Would it look better in retrospect if he was doubtful? Sure. But it's an approximation."

 

[Jefferson the Caregiver]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81d0...le=HP_headlines

NFL spokesman Greg Aiello told NFL Network's Albert Breer that the Vikings contacted the Bears before making the announcement, with their trainer's explanation for the shift.

"His status changed. If a player's medical status changes, the team is supposed to change his playing status. That's what happened," Aiello said Monday. "The Vikings put out a statement about it, they felt better about it, he saw the trainer, and therefore it changes. When you put a player down on the injury report, it's an estimation of what it is. That situation changed today.

"Nothing in the policy prevents that, as long as there's a credible explanation. He's going to go out and throw, and see where he is," Aiello said. "The status is before the game, an estimation of where the player is, his status at that time. Then, on Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, if something changes, then it changes."

Aiello responded to questions about Favre leapfrogging a doubtful status for the game.

Unlock HQ Video HQ video delivered by Akamai

"That's just quibbling," Aiello said. "In the judgment of the club and Brett, they didn't feel he'd be able to play. So he's out. Would it look better in retrospect if he was doubtful? Sure. But it's an approximation."

Sorry, but this is BS. This could still get abused. It's in the hands of the team's trainers to make the call? How is that fair, that's not exactly a neutral opinion and why wouldn't someone exploit this to their advantage at some point.

 

[RUSF18]

I'm pretty sure that with the PROB/QUEST/DOUBT designations, it's dependent on how much (or how little) practice time a player misses. The numbers are off, but as an example, if a player misses 75% of the practices that week, he must be declared Doubtful. If a guy is Doubtful and then plays, the NFL can look at the tapes and see how much the guy practiced...if he only missed 25% of the practices, the team can be disciplined.

So along those lines, maybe a player must only be listed as Out if he meets that criteria (missing every practice).

 

[whole-show]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81d0...le=HP_headlines

NFL spokesman Greg Aiello told NFL Network's Albert Breer that the Vikings contacted the Bears before making the announcement, with their trainer's explanation for the shift.

"His status changed. If a player's medical status changes, the team is supposed to change his playing status. That's what happened," Aiello said Monday. "The Vikings put out a statement about it, they felt better about it, he saw the trainer, and therefore it changes. When you put a player down on the injury report, it's an estimation of what it is. That situation changed today.

"Nothing in the policy prevents that, as long as there's a credible explanation. He's going to go out and throw, and see where he is," Aiello said. "The status is before the game, an estimation of where the player is, his status at that time. Then, on Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, if something changes, then it changes."

Aiello responded to questions about Favre leapfrogging a doubtful status for the game.

Unlock HQ Video HQ video delivered by Akamai

"That's just quibbling," Aiello said. "In the judgment of the club and Brett, they didn't feel he'd be able to play. So he's out. Would it look better in retrospect if he was doubtful? Sure. But it's an approximation."

Sorry, but this is BS. This could still get abused. It's in the hands of the team's trainers to make the call? How is that fair, that's not exactly a neutral opinion and why wouldn't someone exploit this to their advantage at some point.

Exactly! I am a Viking fan, but this just completely makes the injurt report a joke anyone can be listed as out and then say oh his status changed he's starting it's ridiculous!

 

[Bri]

I'm pretty sure that with the PROB/QUEST/DOUBT designations, it's dependent on how much (or how little) practice time a player misses. The numbers are off, but as an example, if a player misses 75% of the practices that week, he must be declared Doubtful. If a guy is Doubtful and then plays, the NFL can look at the tapes and see how much the guy practiced...if he only missed 25% of the practices, the team can be disciplined.So along those lines, maybe a player must only be listed as Out if he meets that criteria (missing every practice).

This.Before it was a judgment call and most felt the coaches fibbed. Now it's based on practice time and it seems more accurate. 100% predictability is never going to happen

 

[Bri]

Sorry, but this is BS. This could still get abused. It's in the hands of the team's trainers to make the call? How is that fair, that's not exactly a neutral opinion and why wouldn't someone exploit this to their advantage at some point.

Team doctor (in concert with team trainer here) calls opposing team's doctor and NFL too. I don't see docs abusing this.I mean we all know stories and I'm not going to pretend their won't be new stories but "in a perfect world" this works because the doc has medical knowledge(duh) and is the one responsible if the player gets sent in to play too early.

 

[reprisal]

Sorry, but this is BS. This could still get abused. It's in the hands of the team's trainers to make the call? How is that fair, that's not exactly a neutral opinion and why wouldn't someone exploit this to their advantage at some point.

Team doctor (in concert with team trainer here) calls opposing team's doctor and NFL too. I don't see docs abusing this.I mean we all know stories and I'm not going to pretend their won't be new stories but "in a perfect world" this works because the doc has medical knowledge(duh) and is the one responsible if the player gets sent in to play too early.

Getting an MD doesn't imbue one with an unquestionable ethical standard, nor does it remove the ability of the owner/GM/whoever it may be from finding someone qualified whose willing to do "whats best for the team." Have they stated any medical reason for the improvement other than "he felt better" or maybe "we got the swelling down?" If I wanted to play conspiracy theorist I'd say the Vikings knew Brett was Questionable/Doubtful on Sunday and AP was Doubtful. Then instead of releasing the information they pulled the switch as late as possible to gain a competitive edge. I don't necessarily believe that, but I think you'll have a hard time making a sound logical argument that it wasn't the case or couldn't be the case in the future.

 

[by_the_sea_wannabe]

lots of over reacting up in here. They thought he wouldn't play. Found out Monday - hey you know what it isn't quite as bad as we thought. Nobody in this thread ever got healthier faster than expected? Simma down now

 

[Joe Bryant]

Sure this gets abused. Shanahan lists players as questionable when they're sure starters. Jeff Fisher is legendary for mocking the report.

Players move all the time. Up and down. Yes, it's super rare to move from out to questionable but there's nothing that says a player can't move.

J

 

[Bri]

Sorry, but this is BS. This could still get abused. It's in the hands of the team's trainers to make the call? How is that fair, that's not exactly a neutral opinion and why wouldn't someone exploit this to their advantage at some point.

Team doctor (in concert with team trainer here) calls opposing team's doctor and NFL too. I don't see docs abusing this.I mean we all know stories and I'm not going to pretend their won't be new stories but "in a perfect world" this works because the doc has medical knowledge(duh) and is the one responsible if the player gets sent in to play too early.

Getting an MD doesn't imbue one with an unquestionable ethical standard, nor does it remove the ability of the owner/GM/whoever it may be from finding someone qualified whose willing to do "whats best for the team." Have they stated any medical reason for the improvement other than "he felt better" or maybe "we got the swelling down?" If I wanted to play conspiracy theorist I'd say the Vikings knew Brett was Questionable/Doubtful on Sunday and AP was Doubtful. Then instead of releasing the information they pulled the switch as late as possible to gain a competitive edge. I don't necessarily believe that, but I think you'll have a hard time making a sound logical argument that it wasn't the case or couldn't be the case in the future.

I don't think we disagree so much here.Re-Vikes, doubtful to out is not surprising at all. I don't get that part of your post. You have to have seen that 100 times. The Brett going from out to starting, I totally understand that. One thing maybe folks don't realize or remember which was praised here in a thread (and beaten down) was that the NFL has hired people to monitor and watch these types of fictitious reports.If you break your finger today and doc tells you four weeks in a cast/splint. If three weeks you rip it off (not supposed to but just because some of us do stuff like that) and your finger moves OK. Was the doc wrong? Could you have healed a little faster than the average? NFL team docs have an unusual ability to deal with pain with different medications often administered by injections. The unusual part is the players often request it and desire it to go and risk further injury. One book compared it to the military patching people up to put them back on the front line. I don't know if I'd go that far, but I don't see what to compare it to in society. This stuff leaves alot of room for people to interpret it as fudging and it also creates it where teams are actually fudging. Just think how many times a simple shot makes it appear like a player is OK or good enough to play. Saying teams can abuse this, will abuse this etc. Isn't this the first time we know of it happening? Out to playing? Nothing with Favre surprises me anymore, it's just been laid on so thick the last so many years I just....eh you know what I mean. Assuming it wasn't Favre, it would still just be one time.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Sure this gets abused. Shanahan lists players as questionable when they're sure starters. Jeff Fisher is legendary for mocking the report.Players move all the time. Up and down. Yes, it's super rare to move from out to questionable but there's nothing that says a player can't move. J

FWIW when I did a article on this for FBG in 2005, Jeff Fisher was by far the worst at listing players at Questionable or Doubtful that would go on to play that week.