Brady discussion can now end (1 Viewer)

[skinsrule05]

Brady is having a great season but in my eyes Vick has locked it up. I have never seen a single player carry a team like he has been doing with the Eagles. Provided they finish out the season in similar fashion.

The only thing I see that can keep him from getting the MVP is opinion on his criminal past. And that may be enough. But from a pure on the field performance he should be a lock.

 

[Eastwood]

And I'm a Skins fan

 

[comfortably numb]

It will be interesting to see.

I personally think the voters will shun Vick, and give it to the golden boy Brady.

 

[two_dollars]

Brady led the Pats to a great comeback last night too. He was an efficient machine, taking no time to get down the field AND he set the NFL record for pass attempts without an interception. If anything, I think Brady locked it up last night.

 

[Clash of the Titans]

Tom will be the 2010 MVP............as well he should be

 

[FUBAR]

Co-MBPs

 

[todisco1]

Both are deserving.

 

[DiStefano]

I would give it to Brady, except for his hairdo.

So I vote Vick.

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

Has anyone won comeback player of the year and MVP the same year before? Vick is going to need a new trophy case in his house.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Bradys carrying the Patriots just as much. Without him they are a .500 team at best.

 

[Workhorse]

Brady has faced 9 of the top 10 defenses this season in terms of ppg allowed, leading the Pats to an 8-1 record and nearly 30 points per game against them. He's the MVP.

 

[Big_Russel]

Brady is the MVP.

 

[dagwood]

Brady is having a great season but in my eyes Vick has locked it up. I have never seen a single player carry a team like he has been doing with the Eagles. Provided they finish out the season in similar fashion.The only thing I see that can keep him from getting the MVP is opinion on his criminal past. And that may be enough. But from a pure on the field performance he should be a lock.

What is the definition of MVP.Brady just led his team to victories of the Jets, the Bears, and the Packers to up their record to 12-2. Someone now has to beat them in Foxborough to keep them from reaching the Super Bowl.Not a NE fan but I can make a pretty good case for Brady as MVP.

 

[dagwood]

Now fantasy footbally MVP would be a different discussion.

 

[Snotbubbles]

Vick missed too much time due to injury to be MVP IMO. If he played every game, I would say without a doubt. But I have to go with Brady.

 

[Tau837]

I personally think the voters will shun Vick, and give it to the golden boy Brady.

Brady led the Pats to a great comeback last night too. He was an efficient machine, taking no time to get down the field AND he set the NFL record for pass attempts without an interception. If anything, I think Brady locked it up last night.

 

[Tau837]

Vick missed too much time due to injury to be MVP IMO.

No player has ever won MVP when missing 3+ games. While there is typically always a first time, the issue is that missing that many games makes it likely that other players have just as compelling or more compelling cases for the award. That is the case here. Brady's case is more compelling.

 

[sho nuff]

Brady led the Pats to a great comeback last night too. He was an efficient machine, taking no time to get down the field AND he set the NFL record for pass attempts without an interception. If anything, I think Brady locked it up last night.

Not sure about a lock...but yeah, I don't think yesterday made it any shoo in for Vick or Brady. Both will go down to the end on this (though, Brady might get some more rest than Vick).As for the INTs...yeah, great streak for sure, though, it should have ended a few times last night.

 

[gollum]

Has anyone won comeback player of the year and MVP the same year before? Vick is going to need a new trophy case in his house.

he needs one anyway, he had to get rid of the last one because it was built from the bones of dogs

 

[gollum]

for a more legit answer,

either one is a great candidate, though the missed time could hurt Vick.

 

[smitty63]

Brady will win cuz he's the white guy.

 

[gollum]

Brady will win cuz he's the white guy.

yeah, it is all that simpleif he wins based on non-football reasons it will be because he has not been in a federal prison in the last 24 months, not anything to do with race

 

[bushdocda]

Vick won't win it. But he should at this point.

 

[switz]

Brady is having a great season but in my eyes Vick has locked it up. I have never seen a single player carry a team like he has been doing with the Eagles. Provided they finish out the season in similar fashion.The only thing I see that can keep him from getting the MVP is opinion on his criminal past. And that may be enough. But from a pure on the field performance he should be a lock.

I agree. Vick is the reason the Eagles are having success this year.

 

[DepthCharts]

2 letters missing from the conversation (ETA - I missed FUBAR's).

"Co"

 

[switz]

Vick missed too much time due to injury to be MVP IMO.

No player has ever won MVP when missing 3+ games. While there is typically always a first time, the issue is that missing that many games makes it likely that other players have just as compelling or more compelling cases for the award. That is the case here. Brady's case is more compelling.

Really? Simply because he played more games?

 

[Eminence]

Brady is doing more with less.

 

[metoo]

Brady is doing more with less.

Not really. Vick would be successful in New England, Brady would get killed with that Philly offensive line.

 

[dwyadog]

This is a tough one and should come down to the final 2 games. Right now I have it as Brady, for what he's done and, as pointed out in this thread, who he has done it against. The patriots offense with Brady as its leader has beaten the best defenses in the league. Number one offense in the league ppg, 12-2 (probably 14-2 but the last two games are division games if i remember correctly, those are always tough), insane interception % and so on.

I wish we could see some stats, in total, for things like defensive passer rating, defensive ppg and so on. If you compared those between Brady's games started and Vicks games started I bet you'd see a stark difference.

 

[CentralPA]

Brady is doing more with less.

Not really. Vick would be successful in New England, Brady would get killed with that Philly offensive line.

Vick has great recievers but his OL is horrible and injury ridden. Tom's line has perrenial Pro Bowlers all across it but his recieving options are no where near as good as what Vick has. So I think it might even itself out in that respect.

 

[ldizzle]

Im on the Vick Bandwagon BUT there are still 2 more games, no?

 

[Tau837]

Vick missed too much time due to injury to be MVP IMO.

No player has ever won MVP when missing 3+ games. While there is typically always a first time, the issue is that missing that many games makes it likely that other players have just as compelling or more compelling cases for the award. That is the case here. Brady's case is more compelling.

Really? Simply because he played more games?

No, it's obviously not that simple. Many other reasons are posted in this thread already. In summary:
[*]Brady has led his team to 12 wins. Vick has led his team to 8 wins.

[*]Brady has done that while dealing with more injuries/turnover to his supporting cast.

[*]Brady has faced a tougher schedule (cumulative opponents' record 99-93) than Vick (cumulative opponents' record 62-63, counting only games both started and finished); of those games, Brady played 6 games vs. teams currently contending for the playoffs, while Vick played only 3.

[*]Meanwhile, Vick's team went 2-1 in the three full games he missed, including an impressive win over Atlanta. Philadelphia is a likely playoff contending team without Vick.

[*]Brady is the top rated passer in the league and has more total yards, more total TDs, fewer turnovers, and fewer sacks than Vick.

[*]Brady is a media favorite and has won the MVP previously, so he entered the season as a preseason contender for the award, which helps.

[*]Meanwhile, Vick's past presumably hurts him with some voters.

Some of these things are examples of why players who miss a few games don't win. It makes it too likely that other players who also have great seasons are able to compile more compelling resumes, given the extra opportunity to compile wins and numbers.

 

[FavreCo]

Brady is doing more with less.

Not really. Vick would be successful in New England, Brady would get killed with that Philly offensive line.

No, he would just dump passes off like he does now. More Woodhead and Welker, less Branch. He's capable of adjusting.Did his stats skyrocket when Mankins came back? If so, Mankins hit the jackpot.

 

[scrumptrulescent]

Bradys carrying the Patriots just as much. Without him they are a .500 team at best.

People said the same thing in 2008.

 

[Bob Henry]

1. Brady

2. Vick

3. Rivers

 

[[icon]]

I would give it to Brady, except for his hairdo.So I vote Vick.

How very heterosexual of you.

 

[Sabertooth]

Has anyone won comeback player of the year and MVP the same year before? Vick is going to need a new trophy case in his house.

Except he was in the NFL and uninjured last year. And he isn't going to win the MVP this year because he's a sicko. Other than that, spot on.

 

[thehornet]

Brady led the Pats to a great comeback last night too. He was an efficient machine, taking no time to get down the field AND he set the NFL record for pass attempts without an interception. If anything, I think Brady locked it up last night.

just stop it man! every thread i come into, it's the same crap with you. don't you have different opinions?

 

[Tau837]

Tom's line has perrenial Pro Bowlers all across it but his recieving options are no where near as good as what Vick has. So I think it might even itself out in that respect.

You are overstating how good the Pats' OL is/has been this year. The Pats have 3 OL who have made the Pro Bowl:Koppen, who made it once, in 2007Mankins, who made it twice, in 2007 and 2009Light, who made it twice, in 2006 and 2007I wouldn't call those guys "perennial" Pro Bowlers. And Mankins missed the first 9 games of the season due to holdout.

 

[Kitrick Taylor]

Brady is doing more with less.

Not really. Vick would be successful in New England, Brady would get killed with that Philly offensive line.

I doubt Brady would be getting killed if he had McCoy, Jackson and Maclin. Both are deserving, but this one is Brady's to lose at this point.

 

[The Flying Elvis]

Bradys carrying the Patriots just as much. Without him they are a .500 team at best.

People said the same thing in 2008.

In 2007 the Patriots went 16-0... In 2008 with roughly the same team they went 11-5. That is a -5 game swing. If the Patriots were a 12-4 team in 2007 then in 2008 without Brady that would equate to 7-9 and then this wouldn't be a discussion at all. The Patriots were a good enough team to go 11-5 without Brady but that is just because they were a close to perfect team with him. In addition, it seems obvious now that Cassel wasn't just some scrub backup, he is a good NFL starter capable of leading a team to the playoffs. This wasn't a dropoff of Peyton Manning to Jim Sorgi. It was a dropoff of a top 2 NFL QB to a top 10 NFL QB talent.

 

[FavreCo]

Tom's line has perrenial Pro Bowlers all across it but his recieving options are no where near as good as what Vick has. So I think it might even itself out in that respect.

You are overstating how good the Pats' OL is/has been this year. The Pats have 3 OL who have made the Pro Bowl:Koppen, who made it once, in 2007

Mankins, who made it twice, in 2007 and 2009

Light, who made it twice, in 2006 and 2007

I wouldn't call those guys "perennial" Pro Bowlers. And Mankins missed the first 9 games of the season due to holdout.

Coincidence? Mankins arrives, stats go throught he roof.

 

[cheese]

Both these guys have had seasons that would win it most years. I'm going Brady just for playing in all the games since both have been ridiculous and are carrying very mediocre teams to byes in the playoffs.

 

[Big_Russel]

Tom's line has perrenial Pro Bowlers all across it but his recieving options are no where near as good as what Vick has. So I think it might even itself out in that respect.

You are overstating how good the Pats' OL is/has been this year. The Pats have 3 OL who have made the Pro Bowl:Koppen, who made it once, in 2007

Mankins, who made it twice, in 2007 and 2009

Light, who made it twice, in 2006 and 2007

I wouldn't call those guys "perennial" Pro Bowlers. And Mankins missed the first 9 games of the season due to holdout.

Coincidence? Mankins arrives, stats go throught he roof.

Mankins helps much more in the run game than in the passing game. Run blocking is his strength.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Brady led the Pats to a great comeback last night too. He was an efficient machine, taking no time to get down the field AND he set the NFL record for pass attempts without an interception. If anything, I think Brady locked it up last night.

I assume this is a parody post where you mock irrational Patriots fans?Brady was 15-24 for 163 yards. His team almost lost at home to a Matt Flynn-led Packers team that lost to the Lions a week prior. Sure he had two TDs ... one was set up by a fluke kickoff return to the 5. His amazing "game-winning drive," which came at the start of the 4th quarter, featured only three passes, none longer than 16 yards. He was fine last night. Adequate is probably a good word for it. But an MVP doesn't need a fourth-quarter drive to beat Matt Flynn at home.

 

[kylechoffman]

Dual MVP if they both lead their teams to two more wins.

 

[nysportsfan]

I think Brady wins it, but Vick is right there.

 

[[icon]]

NFL MVP: Brady

FFL MVP: Vick

Pretty simple really.

 

[scrumptrulescent]

Bradys carrying the Patriots just as much. Without him they are a .500 team at best.

People said the same thing in 2008.

In 2007 the Patriots went 16-0... In 2008 with roughly the same team they went 11-5. That is a -5 game swing. If the Patriots were a 12-4 team in 2007 then in 2008 without Brady that would equate to 7-9 and then this wouldn't be a discussion at all. The Patriots were a good enough team to go 11-5 without Brady but that is just because they were a close to perfect team with him. In addition, it seems obvious now that Cassel wasn't just some scrub backup, he is a good NFL starter capable of leading a team to the playoffs. This wasn't a dropoff of Peyton Manning to Jim Sorgi. It was a dropoff of a top 2 NFL QB to a top 10 NFL QB talent.

Not sure what all that hypothetical if this, then that is worth. Cassel was just some scrub, the Pats won in spite of him. He was awful in 2009. He's gotten better in 2010.

 

[parrot]

Bradys carrying the Patriots just as much. Without him they are a .500 team at best.

People said the same thing in 2008.

And if the Patriots had played a schedule in 2008 anything like they have played this year (or like they did in 07) they would have been.