Brady vs. Manning in the playoffs -- Round 4 (1 Viewer)

[Popinski]

So if DEN wins (looking pretty likely) but then loses the SB . . . then what for Peyton? Would all of the Brady/Manning talk this week mostly just fade into obscurity?

In terms of his legacy as viewed by football fans in general (not necessarily accurate), I would have thought a loss to the Pats would hurt his legacy, winning the SB would obviously help it, and losing in the SB would probably not have a significant impact either way.

 

[Shanahanigans]

So if DEN wins (looking pretty likely) but then loses the SB . . . then what for Peyton? Would all of the Brady/Manning talk this week mostly just fade into obscurity?

In terms of his legacy as viewed by football fans in general (not necessarily accurate), I would have thought a loss to the Pats would hurt his legacy, winning the SB would obviously help it, and losing in the SB would probably not have a significant impact either way.

I agree with this. I feel like Manning's legacy is so intertwined with Brady's, at least in public opinion, that this game meant more to Manning's legacy than actually winning another Super Bowl.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Agreed. Manning HAD to win the game today, somehow, someway. Had the Broncos lost, the overwhelming public opinion would have been that Peyton had a huge advantage at the skill positions over Brady and still couldn't beat him in a playoff game. His rep would have taken a beating. Fortunately, for him and Broncos fans, they won.

Now, obviously winning a 2nd Super Bowl would do wonders for his rep in the court of public opinion as well, but going against the number 1 defense in the league in what will probably be very cold weather is a very daunting task. Should be interesting...

 

[Bills_Fan11]

In playoff games decided by a kicker, Peyton Manning is 0-5. Each and every time Manning put his team in position to win the game with a FG in the final minutes or OT, his kicker has missed. conversely, each and every time Manning's opponent put themselves in position to win with a FG in the final minutes or OT, they convert. Each and every time. Mannings composite passer rating in these games: 91.1.

The guy many think of as more clutch, Tom Brady, is 6-0 in similar situations. In these 6 wins, he had a passer rating of 73.8.

To put a little more perspective: If Brady had equal luck with playoff kicking game as Manning, he would have a 9-9 record with one SB win (2004), one SB loss (2007), and no other championship game appearances.

The difference in playoff game perception between Manning and Brady was written by Mike Vanderjagt, Nate Kaeding, Adam Vinateri, Nick Folk, Stephen Gotskowski, Justin Tucker, and Billy Cundiff.

Granted, some of the facts are a little off there (for example, Vinatieri hit the FG to give the Colts the lead in the 2010 playoff loss after Manning led them down the field, but then the Jets kicker beat them at the end), but all in all, it demonstrates pretty clearly the difference between the two when it comes to luck with kickers in playoff games.

As far as the Vinatieri in NE stuff goes, I'm not sure I buy into things as the original post suggests. For example, Vinatieri's 3 SB winning kicks were in tie games. So even if he missed, the Pats could still have won the game in overtime.Certainly the same argument could be used (or attempted to be used) about all other facets of the game. If the defense had one more stop, if ONLY ONE PLAY a game went the other way, etc.

In Brady's case, Reche Caldwell dropped a pass that would have most likely given the Pats a win against IND in the 2006 AFCC (and they stood an excellent chance of beating the Bears). NE was two circus catches away from potentially beating the Giants twice in the SB. If we want to play things out using that logic, a case could be made that Brady could have won 6 SBs by now (and someone on talk radio was trying to make that argument the other day).

I am not saying that, as the only thing that matters is what went down in the scorebook. In Manning's case, we could analyze the rest of those games with a fine tooth comb. Maybe he had a pick in the red zone that cost the Colts points. Maybe they had to settle for a FG earlier in the game instead of a TD from inside the 2 yard line. Bottom line, it's easy to point fingers at a kicker when Manning could quite easily had a role in the outcome (even if seemingly the outcome hinged on a kick). To play devil's advocate here, had the Colts offense scored two more TDs in those games, the kicker would not have needed to make a kick at the end of the game.

Also, I love how many people will forever and a day try to pin games on JUST the QBs. There's offense, defense, special teams, coaching, etc. that factor into things, yet somehow it's the QBs fault in losses or he's the hero in victories.

Playing out things with Brady the opposite direction, had Vinatieri missed his kicks and the Pats went on to lose the coin tosses and the defense allowed FGs on the first drives in OT for each of those games, Brady could be 0-5 in Super Bowls WHEN HE DID NOT SNAP THE BALL EVEN ONE MORE TIME. So Brady's role and production would not change at all, yet his legacy would be COMPLETLEY different.

NE's offense scored fewer than 20pts in three of the five Super Bowls. If you can get 3 rings out of that you take it and do not pass go or ask any questions. I'm so sick of Bill Simmons bringing up that '06 Colts game. He never mentions that NE was dominated the week before in another defensive struggle vs a very green Phil Rivers and the Chargers DB fumbled away an apparent game winning int.

But ya Brady deserves 6 rings. Lol talk radio hacks.

 

[Raider Nation]

http://imageshack.com/a/img11/9487/8twn.gif

 

[PatsFanCT]

I think this might be the last time we see Brady in the playoffs. No shtick.

The better team definitely won, but if they stay healthy, there's no reason to think they can't be back in the Championship game again next year.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

In playoff games decided by a kicker, Peyton Manning is 0-5. Each and every time Manning put his team in position to win the game with a FG in the final minutes or OT, his kicker has missed. conversely, each and every time Manning's opponent put themselves in position to win with a FG in the final minutes or OT, they convert. Each and every time. Mannings composite passer rating in these games: 91.1.

The guy many think of as more clutch, Tom Brady, is 6-0 in similar situations. In these 6 wins, he had a passer rating of 73.8.

To put a little more perspective: If Brady had equal luck with playoff kicking game as Manning, he would have a 9-9 record with one SB win (2004), one SB loss (2007), and no other championship game appearances.

The difference in playoff game perception between Manning and Brady was written by Mike Vanderjagt, Nate Kaeding, Adam Vinateri, Nick Folk, Stephen Gotskowski, Justin Tucker, and Billy Cundiff.

Granted, some of the facts are a little off there (for example, Vinatieri hit the FG to give the Colts the lead in the 2010 playoff loss after Manning led them down the field, but then the Jets kicker beat them at the end), but all in all, it demonstrates pretty clearly the difference between the two when it comes to luck with kickers in playoff games.

As far as the Vinatieri in NE stuff goes, I'm not sure I buy into things as the original post suggests. For example, Vinatieri's 3 SB winning kicks were in tie games. So even if he missed, the Pats could still have won the game in overtime.Certainly the same argument could be used (or attempted to be used) about all other facets of the game. If the defense had one more stop, if ONLY ONE PLAY a game went the other way, etc.

In Brady's case, Reche Caldwell dropped a pass that would have most likely given the Pats a win against IND in the 2006 AFCC (and they stood an excellent chance of beating the Bears). NE was two circus catches away from potentially beating the Giants twice in the SB. If we want to play things out using that logic, a case could be made that Brady could have won 6 SBs by now (and someone on talk radio was trying to make that argument the other day).

I am not saying that, as the only thing that matters is what went down in the scorebook. In Manning's case, we could analyze the rest of those games with a fine tooth comb. Maybe he had a pick in the red zone that cost the Colts points. Maybe they had to settle for a FG earlier in the game instead of a TD from inside the 2 yard line. Bottom line, it's easy to point fingers at a kicker when Manning could quite easily had a role in the outcome (even if seemingly the outcome hinged on a kick). To play devil's advocate here, had the Colts offense scored two more TDs in those games, the kicker would not have needed to make a kick at the end of the game.

Also, I love how many people will forever and a day try to pin games on JUST the QBs. There's offense, defense, special teams, coaching, etc. that factor into things, yet somehow it's the QBs fault in losses or he's the hero in victories.

Playing out things with Brady the opposite direction, had Vinatieri missed his kicks and the Pats went on to lose the coin tosses and the defense allowed FGs on the first drives in OT for each of those games, Brady could be 0-5 in Super Bowls WHEN HE DID NOT SNAP THE BALL EVEN ONE MORE TIME. So Brady's role and production would not change at all, yet his legacy would be COMPLETLEY different.

NE's offense scored fewer than 20pts in three of the five Super Bowls. If you can get 3 rings out of that you take it and do not pass go or ask any questions.I'm so sick of Bill Simmons bringing up that '06 Colts game. He never mentions that NE was dominated the week before in another defensive struggle vs a very green Phil Rivers and the Chargers DB fumbled away an apparent game winning int.

But ya Brady deserves 6 rings. Lol talk radio hacks.

stupid DB, #######IT

 

[kegger]

Manning played a terrific game, and the better team won it there..

If you want to nit pik and only compare QB's, Brady was outplayed...

(not saying Brady was horrible, just Manning was really really good)

There both great QB's that on any given day could be the best we see.....

 

[kyoun1e]

Manning played a terrific game, and the better team won it there..

If you want to nit pik and only compare QB's, Brady was outplayed...

(not saying Brady was horrible, just Manning was really really good)

There both great QB's that on any given day could be the best we see.....

Brady was definitely outplayed, and while you didn't think he played horrible it was damn close.

I expect this guy to rise to the occasion in the AFC Championship game. He didn't. And I while the defense had something to do with it, he missed three deep throws and a couple others that he should make if he's on top of his game.

He didn't get it done. Period.

I'm not giving him a pass.

I didn't expect the Boston media to give him one either, but they are letting him off easy.