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Uh, he's not going to take on the NFL and win.He'll get slapped down, one way or another.He's a great buy low, just like Vick. However long the NFL wants to suspend him, he'll get suspended.
... would be an awesone fantasy team name.
First time I've laughed out loud at anything in the Pool in a long time!
Not even my best work. My best line of the night was in the deleted "Fight, Travis" thread.First time I've laughed out loud at anything in the Pool in a long time!
Care to repost it?Not even my best work. My best line of the night was in the deleted "Fight, Travis" thread.First time I've laughed out loud at anything in the Pool in a long time!
Or send a PM?Care to repost it?Not even my best work. My best line of the night was in the deleted "Fight, Travis" thread.First time I've laughed out loud at anything in the Pool in a long time!
the line of the night that I read was upon sending the link with henry's picture to a friend, i received a reply asking if he could leave his vehicle in henrys 2 car garage. Took about 5 minutes to get it. then i hit the floor laughingCare to repost it?Not even my best work. My best line of the night was in the deleted "Fight, Travis" thread.First time I've laughed out loud at anything in the Pool in a long time!
And this is the part that is killing me. If he's going to get suspended I wish it would be immediate. I can still pickup Young in one of the leagues I am in but due to limited roster space the only guy I can drop for Young is Henry. Obviously I don't want to do that premature...
I doubt he can beat the NFL's drug use policy, but he's going to try we see that.If he loses the case!He will be out 1 year from the violation date plus 60 day wait (NFL policy rule). Be back around week 12-14 of the 2008 season, not worth it.
This is not true. Suspended players MUST apply for reinstatement, but that can be done up to 60 days BEFORE the end of their suspension. So if Henry's appeal is denied quickly (say by week 6), he should be eligible to return week 6 of the 2008 season.hellz_fireflies said:
So you can keep him on your roster through this week, where he is a game-time decision due to injury, and his bye week before he is gone for the season? I don't see him having a lot of value before the appeal is decided. I'd also guess that Shanahan is pissed off at him and will probably deactive him anyway.Chaka said:
I respectfully disagree with all your suppositions here.I wouldn't know how to check, but in my two leagues, neither Henry owner owns Selvin Young. Roster restrictions, league format, roster composition, owner philosophy and waiver process can make it no more likely that Selvin Young will end up on any one owners roster than another, regardless of who owns Henry.Also, I disagree that a package of Henry/Young will necessarily be the Denver RB. I've watched Shanahan pull shenanigans with his RBs for too many years to think that I know what he'll do and Young has not shown to be anything more than a change of pace back as of yet.Shiggy Shaol said:
Hey, I hear what you're saying about the "shenanigans" and that's exactly why I picked up Sapp in one of my leagues and Mike Bell in another. I'm trying to cover all the bases here, just in case. But I would be surprised to hear that Selvin Young was on the wire in a 12 team league or more. In a 10 team league or less, I certainly can see that.
Yeah, the NFL did follow the rules as noted in the post above - Henry was allowed to have an expert present, but the expert couldn't be affiliated with a laboratory. Henry's was. The league gave him a list of names but Henry hasn't used them. Far as I can see the league did everything by the book.
There is no reason to think Shanny will deactivate Henry for anything other than injury.From today's Denver post:
LinkI think it is more like that Shanny runs Henry until he breaks in two. Might as well get everything out of the guy before he is suspended. They are likely the last carries of Henry's Broncos tenure.
This says different:http://forums.denverbroncos.com/showthread.php?t=103209
Would this as I posted above, if fact, matter at all in your opinion?Now although the Suffolk Court [suffolk County Supreme Court] granted Henry a restraining order against the league until a future hearing, to my knowledge the league went ahead and tested the B sample anyways.Here are the facts recently posted to the main thread:(1) He is allowed to bring an expert, so long as the expert is not biased (i.e. employed by a competing lab)2) Henry brought a lab expert who works for a competing lab
That may be unless the addiction is not merely a physical one. People get hooked on thigns that are not physically addicting to the point of injury to themselves and others - video games, gambling and fantasy football just to name a few.Not saying that given he was one strike short of a time out he wasn't foolish if he indeed fired up a blunt.
Yeah...you present obvious good points.He is weak in the mind. That about sums it up when it comes to a mental addiction.
I doubt it."Mr. Williams welcome to the mile high city, could you please leave your 'zags by the door"
I think I remember reading somewhere that Henry DID succeed in getting a court order saying the NFL COULD NOT test the B sample. They went ahead and did so anyway, and then later got an appeals court to overide the first courts decision. Now, I'm not a lawyer, but even though the first court's decision was overturned, it would seem that the NFL violated that ruling anyway, IF they tested the B sample BEFORE the decision was overturned. It would seem that this would be a problem, legally, for the NFL.
IF this is true, then Henry could temporarily wiggle out of the suspension.This is like the stories we hear of evidence obtained illegally being thrown out of court.
Are we sure that 3 happened after 2? Because if it's reversed I can see him having a case. Let's say they gave him a sample list of 10 approved experts (assuming that the list is not all inclusive), he decides on someone not on the list (whether he knew they weren't eligible or not is a different question) they say no they can't be your expert, please pee in the cup now. I think it comes down to timing, when was he told his expert was ineligible, and was he given time to find another?
Ok, first the caveat: I'm just a banking attorney and this is obviously a tricky area of law. With that out of the way, As I understand, Henry initially filed for and was granted a temporary restraining order. In most jurisdictions, what a court would have looked at in deciding whether or not to grant a TRO is: (1) Henry's likelihood of success on the merits; (2) irreparable harm to Henry if the TRO was not granted; (3) that less harm will result to the defendant if the TRO issues than to the plaintiffs if the TRO does not issue; and (4) that the public interest, if any, weighs in favor of Henry. Based on those elements, the initial court granted Henry a TRO.We do know that the NFL appealed the TRO, which they are allowed to do, and the appellate court vacated the lower court decision. It's a very high standard on appeal, but in all likelihood the appellate judge determined the lower court had abused its discretion as there was a clear failure of element #1: Not only was Henry not likely to win his underlying claim, it was arguably impossible for him to do so at any venue other than that stated in the CBA for CBA interpretation. Apparently, Henry was in the wrong court to make his arguments, as they required interpretation of the CBA, and this court was not authorized to interpret so Henry was not going to win his suit in that court. Now, timing may or may not matter here. I have a hard time believing the NFL would defy a court order rather than awaiting an appeal unless there is some valid reason. To me it makes far more sense that the NFL proceeded after getting the TRO vacated than before. However, on the possibility that the NFL violated a valid temporary restraining order, and its impact on a drug test, I don't know the answer to that. It could be a violation of the CBA under which Henry can get damages, but not the relief he's looking for (i.e. disregard of the test itself merely on that basis alone, if ultimately the court decides he was given every opportunity to get an independent lab witness). Typically, violating a TRO would subject a party to repercussions, depending on the violation. For example, if I leave a company and the company gets a TRO to stop me from stealing its clients and taking them with me, and I continue to defy the order and steal its clients, I'll probably be ordered to pay monetarily damages for that violation. In addition, there would be a strong possibility of legal penalty (i.e. being found in contempt of court). This is primarily why I find it unlikely the NFL defied a TRO. However, I have no knowledge of any theory of law that would say "because you violated a TRO, your findings as to a drug test are invalidated"- particularly when the TRO was vacated. Ok, lawyers who actually do this subject matter for a living may now call me stupid.
As a Henry owner, not what I wanted to hear, but thanks for the input. From what I read, this seemed like his only real chance, if it in fact was a chance. Doesn't look good at all.
Good stuff Jim! Thank you!Question: if the Suffolk County court doesn't have jurisdiction (not sure if that's the correct term) to interpret the CBA, does that invalidate the TRO?
The problem with that idea is that the least valuable player on your roster is, typically, no better than the best players available in the free agent pool. No Travis Henry owner will make that trade.I offered Ahman Green for T.Henry this morning and was turned down.strong said:
referring to travis henry as a junkie seems a little excessive.
I haven't read anything that indicates that the test happened after the restraining order was issued.That wouldn't make any sense, anyway. The motion was for a restraining order preventing the use of the sample to suspend Henry -- not preventing the testing of the sample itself. If they hadn't tested the sample yet, then they would have sought a restraining order preventing the testing itself.Bayhawks said:
Yeah! How 'bout you just call him Smokey the Bronco!?
There's a ton of info here, and a big legal mess to sort out. Anyone know how quickly can these things reach a resolution, and what happens while it's being processed?If jurisdiction lies exclusively in the federal courts, which I believe it does, then yes, any orders entered by a court lacking subject matter jurisdiction would be null. It isn't clear to me where the legal proceedings are headed. First, Henry filed suit in state court, seeking a TRO. He somewhat surprisingly got it, but then had it reversed by an appellate court. I'm not sure if Henry has any redress available with respect to the reversal of the TRO; depending on NY's court system, there may be a court of last resort to which he could appeal the appellate court's decision. He might also be able to file a motion for reconsideration with the court that reversed him. From there, the NFL's lawyers removed the case to federal court. Removal is a process whereby a lawyer tells a federal court that a case filed in state court should be heard by a federal court, due to the nature of the allegations contained in the suit. However, Henry has the right to contest the removal; he may file a Motion to Remand the case to state court, and argue to the federal judge that the federal court system lacks jurisdiction over his claims. I think he will lose that argument, but he certainly has a right to be heard.The key in all of this is that, as far as I can tell, there are absolutely no orders in effect, either in state or federal court, which would prevent the NFL from doing whatever it wants to Henry. The TRO he had has vanished, and unless he can get a TRO or other injunction somehow, the NFL could slap a suspension on him right away. Now, the NFL's own internal procedures may take a certain amount of time to take place, and Henry may have appeals within the system.BeachBums said:
Even if the NFL tests Henry again at this point, he is past the October 1 date which means that he is beyond his one year window and a positive test would result in a four game suspension (I think). Additiionally, if this original test was a random test then I think Henry could argue that a test now would be selective prosecution in the form of a witch hunt against Henry. I've probably taken this way too far though since I don't even know if the drug program has random tests for violators inside the one year window or if they're scheduled. Here's my next question which hasn't been answered yet. If the NFL does in fact re-test, is it the original B test that is retested or a new sample from Henry right now?
